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This transcript was created on 2026-05-04 at 12:19:29

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Hello, dear listeners, and welcome back to Flight Through Entirety

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the only Doctor Who podcast who promises you unlimited suet

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pudding.

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I'm Brendan.

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I'm Nathan, and I'm a curious amoeboid with oddly grafted

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features.

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Just what you'd expect to find in 1963 shortage.

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It's remembrance of the Daleks.

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Can I just be Pamela?

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I'd like to start this episode with a correction from a friend of

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the podcast.

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I do apologise.

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I've looked through Twitter and I can't find the original tweet

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but it turns out that Doctor Who last season did not go up against

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Coronation Street.

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It was went out on Mondays in the UK, but this year it is going up

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against Coronation Street.

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Really?

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Yeah, it's against all Lawrence Miles and Tutwood received

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wisdom.

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Yes I know. perish that those 2 would move him. make an error.

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Rock's the faction paradox to its foundation.

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I think it's also a good time to mention Jody Bleeding Whittaker

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gentlemen.

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How exciting.

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I'm terrible excited.

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Is that her middle name?

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I thought it was David.

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Or Davo to her mate.

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Um...

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Yes, Borian Levine.

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I don't think there's a lot to be said, but at the end of the

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day.

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J.D. Whittaker's been gone now and we're done. we've said

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everything My friend Drew, I'm not sure if she listens to the

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podcast, but she put up a wonderful imagined conversation between

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the various doctors, the 1st doctor that just says, what are you

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talking about, change?

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Who are you people?

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Well, I mean, that is exactly the point.

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You know, people keep talking about the doctor being a shape

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shifting alien, which I just think is kind of ridiculous.

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It's just a person who gets recast every year.

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The idea that there's no one's told him.

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There's some sensible in universe reason for it.

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It's just absurd.

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They don't invent regeneration until, you know, well and truly

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into the 1970s after it's kind of happened twice.

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And, uh, it's just a way of getting rid of Bill Hartnell and

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casting Pat Trout and there's nothing sort of really...

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And then a woman, if you're, yes.

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I was going to say Tom Baker, but no, if you're the lovely founder

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of our lovely program, David Williams slash Sydney Newman.

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Yes, that's right.

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I wonder, that's an interesting combination, fiction effort, isn't

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it?

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I'm fiction for Sydney here.

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The funny thing is I...

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She can come back as a woman.

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I think for this podcast, I would block you off that we need to

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celebrate the introduction of Jody, Whitaker, by supposing what

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would other characters be like?

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I would like to recast the nemesis as Brian Blessed.

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And both is lady painful. of my life, fire of my loin.

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I want to say that.

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Have you never wondered who he is?

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I'm 57 and I shag everything.

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You know, he said that too, my llama.

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We've all been discussing it this week.

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I'm 57.

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I can't keep it.

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The statues are alive.

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Look, I'm...

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The thing is, I'm in the...

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I think wonderful situation of I've never seen Jodie Whittaker in

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anything.

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I saw her last night and hardly noticed her.

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She's in Titanic slash Dunkirk.

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Oh, right. whatever.

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She's a Geordie, isn't she?

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she's northern.

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She does a northern accent in a film.

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She is actually northern.

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I've seen her interviewed on a breakfast Prague.

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She's Gracie Fields.

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We're going to be hearing.

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Because that's but just threaten the world or the universe sung

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out there.

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Well, she does that accent in adult life skills, but I watched her

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in Attack the Block last night and I thought, I thought that was

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really fun.

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That might be my pick of the week later.

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And, um, you.

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And she's just doing a sort of standard sort of London accent.

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Nice accent.

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Yeah.

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I'm actually more concerned.

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This is an honest to goodness.

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I am more concerned.

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I'm so bloody relieved at the casting.

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You know, it's 8 years too late.

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We've all, we've all thought it and said it.

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It does feel like a drastic repitch for falling ratings, but it's

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about bloody time.

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But my real concern is what's she going to do with the accent?

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I really am.

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I'm really...

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Russell said it.

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I don't want to hear us rattling around the Midlands.

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Yeah, well, we've had I mean, we've just had a Scottish accent.

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I think probably they'll go traditional.

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I hope so.

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I'm looking to do Lumley. like a super posh accent.

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Well, because, you know, it's Canon now.

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Yeah, the 13th doctor's a woman again.

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Yeah.

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It was a raised eyebrow from radio.

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But, um, I, as I say, I haven't seen her in anything, and I'm

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actually kind of determined not to, because with Matt Smith, I'd

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never...

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Not going to watch you and Ian Levine, you're refusing to.

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I'm going to see the program, but Matt Smith and Christopher

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Eccleston.

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I'd never seen in anything before I watched them in Doctor Who.

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So I came I came to Doctor Who without expectations, whereas Peter

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Capaldi, I was familiar with, for, you know, he did an early

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Poirot.

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He did guest spots in lots of things.

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He did the thick of it. familiar with all that.

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Brendan personally with vile Scottish himself.

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I wish whenever I see him interviewed.

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He just seemed so lovely.

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I think I've told the story where I almost ran it, literally ran

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into him in Coffin Garden when I was living there in lush.

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I know.

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I'm waiting for the euphemism.

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I was right there.

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You didn't even have to pause and draw breath.

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I was bounding down if I was he was coming up and even though I

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almost ran into him.

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He stood off to one side. and he said, oh, I'm so sorry, please.

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Please, would you care to share my bars?

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Given that he was only Malcolm Tucker at the time?

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I fully expected to be given some instructions on how to do

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impossible things to my anatomy in a Scottish accent.

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And he didn't If you have suggestions.

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Anatomy, please do writing on a piece of soap.

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But, you know, I thought to myself, oh, I should go off and watch

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Broadchurch, and I should watch Attack the Block, and I should

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watch all these things she's in, and then I thought, no, wait, and

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have the 1st thing you see, Jodie, were to get in, be Doctor Who.

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So it's it's a matter of, you know, if if Rod Sudley said to me, oh

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I fancy watching Broadchurch, I'd watch it, but I'm not going to

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go out of my way to watch anything Jodie Whittaker.

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I want to come to it completely fresh.

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So a long time to wait, though.

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Bring back the doctor. don't hesitate Have you seen the people on

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Twitter have started writing doctor in address?

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Dr. in a dress?

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He's a doctor, not a doctor.

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Make an address.

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Bring back his cock.

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We won't take lessons.

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Yeah, so should we have a little Delphic bay leaf chewing moment

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oracle moment and say what we feel is going to happen with the

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show?

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Is that correct?

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appropriate thing, do this and that?

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I think my favourite daily match headline has been 1st Doctor Who

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story with Jodie Whittaker will just be men telling her how time

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travel works.

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But no, I think a wonderful way to do it would be if We do say get

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some returning characters maybe Kate and all is good, and if they

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do react differently to the doctor who then uses that as a point

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to make, no, you don't have to react differently because I'm a

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woman.

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I'm still the same person.

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I am still the doctor.

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I think Kate would say you've based yourself on me.

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And well, not only that, but remember, Bill's last words that the

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doctor heard were, you know how I'm into girls and people around

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my own age?

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I'm glad you know that.

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I thought he said, I thought he heard stay.

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I thought you said stay warm.

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That ended on the cutting room floor, didn't it?

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Dirty old mug.

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Because that's the thing.

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I think they are going to address the change in gender. somehow in

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the dialogue and in the narrative. you've hit it right there.

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It's actually built.

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You say that, I just think, will your partner say that?

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Yes, yes.

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Not really.

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I still hear that as William Hartner.

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And he could he could carry it off too.

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Yeah, no, that's why.

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Just I don't mind that there's an excuse.

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There's a reason that he picks up faces and that he picks up

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accents in the same way. the only way to excuse David Tennant.

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Well, I mean, I'm more interested in seeing what Chris Chibnall's

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going to do because I kill it, obviously.

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Yeah, I don't think it's that good a writer, but he's...

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Is it wounds?

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Cyberwoman person, but also the power of three.

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Yeah, the power of 3 is pretty good.

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Yeah, but how much of that was Moffat fingering?

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With his finger of omega.

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Moffat slash.

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You know, it seemed a step above the stuff Moff was doing that

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year, I have to say.

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To say, I'm in like power of three.

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Yeah.

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It was homey again.

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It had people that we liked.

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Actually, that's what I want to see.

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Whoever the companion is, and I think they are going to go from a

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male primary companion.

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They may also bring in a female companion.

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John and Julian, yes.

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Yeah, whoever the companion is, yeah. want them to have a family

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again.

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Really good legs.

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Yeah, bring back a young Jamie type in a...

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He could wear skimpy clothes and be hot and ask dumb questions.

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What's happening, doctor?

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That be awesome.

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Let's bring back Jeff from the 11th hour.

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Yes.

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Yeah, why not?

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The one with the one with the laptop.

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She'll remember that too.

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She'll dash right.

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Didn't they tell you to get a girlfriend, Jeff?

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Jump at my box.

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Well, we're about 3 hours into our...

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Remembrance of the Daleks.

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First story with Ben Aronovich. as a writer.

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Have you read his other stuff?

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I really like his London plodder books. you read those?

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No, like Rippers of London and things.

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There'll be Rivers of London.

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It's a great speech in Parliament by Sir Ian Benerangovic

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Paisley.

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No, they're really good.

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It's kind of like, you know, slight psychic and woo-woo stuff, but

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it's a, so it's a crossover and it's very 270s, 80s TV cop show

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with, with Doctor Who mashed up in it.

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Well, the novelisation was amazingly good.

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I remember that.

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It is, sorry, tear once.

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It is the best target novelisation.

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I think it is.

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Well, it has, I think the new adventures owe a lot to it.

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Yeah, it wouldn't have commented.

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Absolutely.

257
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And also, not that I think it's a direct influence by any means

258
00:11:29.820 --> 00:11:33.000
but if you haven't read, say, the novelisation of Remembrance of

259
00:11:33.000 --> 00:11:35.580
the Daleks, and I should mention, where about the 5th Australian

260
00:11:35.580 --> 00:11:38.039
podcast doing a remembrance of the Daleks episode this month?

261
00:11:38.159 --> 00:11:39.000
No.

262
00:11:39.000 --> 00:11:40.500
Like new to who's done one.

263
00:11:40.559 --> 00:11:43.080
I think Crinoid podcast has done one in the UK.

264
00:11:43.139 --> 00:11:45.720
Just serendipity that all these people are doing those.

265
00:11:45.779 --> 00:11:48.539
But I was going to say that...

266
00:11:48.600 --> 00:11:52.440
But Game of Thrones, the Game of Thrones.

267
00:11:52.440 --> 00:11:56.639
He's doing a podcast on Remembrance of the Daleks because the

268
00:11:56.639 --> 00:11:57.480
books are told.

269
00:11:57.480 --> 00:12:00.720
Each chapter is from the perspective of a different character.

270
00:12:00.779 --> 00:12:03.419
So instead of having chapter one, chapter 2, chapter 3, you've got

271
00:12:03.419 --> 00:12:06.840
Arya one and then a few other people and then Arya 2 and then a

272
00:12:06.840 --> 00:12:07.740
few other people, Arya 3.

273
00:12:07.919 --> 00:12:09.720
I have no idea what he's talking about.

274
00:12:09.779 --> 00:12:13.259
It's the way Christopher Nolan makes films and the new Dunkirk one

275
00:12:13.259 --> 00:12:15.659
is the same thing he's documented before and he talks about it as

276
00:12:15.659 --> 00:12:16.980
time comparisons.

277
00:12:17.039 --> 00:12:19.379
But yes, you reshoot the scene from a different perspective.

278
00:12:19.440 --> 00:12:23.580
It's confusing for a viewer, but as the narrative goes on, you

279
00:12:23.580 --> 00:12:24.659
feel even more drawn in.

280
00:12:24.720 --> 00:12:25.559
Well, that's the idea.

281
00:12:25.620 --> 00:12:27.240
You either do that or you're not off.

282
00:12:27.299 --> 00:12:31.080
Well, that it really works in this novelisation of this story

283
00:12:31.080 --> 00:12:33.600
because we are constantly shifting characters and we're getting

284
00:12:33.600 --> 00:12:37.139
some insight into them, and it just shows how much thought

285
00:12:37.139 --> 00:12:41.940
Beneronovich put into his characters, because as explored, getting

286
00:12:41.940 --> 00:12:46.320
ahead of ourselves, later in the countermeasures spinoff, which

287
00:12:46.320 --> 00:12:50.580
features characters from this, Rachel, Professor Rachel Jensen, is

288
00:12:50.580 --> 00:12:55.139
Jewish, and that comes up in the novel and her feelings 20 years

289
00:12:55.139 --> 00:12:56.940
after the war and what have you.

290
00:12:57.539 --> 00:13:02.279
And also comes up with these spoiler alert racism of Mike Smith.

291
00:13:02.340 --> 00:13:05.039
You know the original character boots in this, don't you?

292
00:13:05.100 --> 00:13:08.759
Well, I can always just 1st off say this is so much better than

293
00:13:08.759 --> 00:13:10.080
unit ever was.

294
00:13:10.139 --> 00:13:11.279
Yeah.

295
00:13:11.340 --> 00:13:15.360
And that's a little bit embarrassment-y to say that, but it really

296
00:13:15.360 --> 00:13:16.500
really, really is.

297
00:13:16.559 --> 00:13:19.200
But before we talk about antecedents, we should really talk about

298
00:13:19.200 --> 00:13:23.039
the characters because Rachel was, of course, written as Dr. Rachel

299
00:13:23.039 --> 00:13:23.820
Israel.

300
00:13:23.940 --> 00:13:26.220
Yeah, yeah, it was really sort of pointed.

301
00:13:26.220 --> 00:13:28.919
Yes, just in case you missed it the 1st time around.

302
00:13:28.980 --> 00:13:31.740
And of course, Ratcliffe was Mr. Gummer.

303
00:13:31.799 --> 00:13:32.820
Do you know who Gumma was?

304
00:13:32.879 --> 00:13:34.620
I had to write it down myself.

305
00:13:34.679 --> 00:13:39.600
Um, but he was, um, Industry secretary, John Selwyn Gummer, and he

306
00:13:39.600 --> 00:13:42.659
loudly and formally resigned from the Church of England when they

307
00:13:42.659 --> 00:13:44.519
ordained Dawn French.

308
00:13:46.559 --> 00:13:51.360
It is amazingly, amazingly good, isn't it?

309
00:13:51.419 --> 00:13:53.879
Like it's a massive, massive jumping quality.

310
00:13:53.940 --> 00:13:57.179
I didn't think season 24 was bad.

311
00:13:57.240 --> 00:13:58.200
But do you remember, Richard?

312
00:13:58.259 --> 00:14:02.399
They actually showed remembrance of the Daleks with season 24.

313
00:14:02.639 --> 00:14:05.460
So we 1st saw it tagged after Dragonfire.

314
00:14:05.519 --> 00:14:06.360
And we didn't expect it.

315
00:14:06.419 --> 00:14:09.960
And it was so good instantly, just so amazing.

316
00:14:10.019 --> 00:14:13.860
And it manages to constantly reference things.

317
00:14:13.919 --> 00:14:17.340
So it, it does unit only well, you know.

318
00:14:17.399 --> 00:14:22.200
And, you know, like I loved unit, unit was, you know, the family

319
00:14:22.200 --> 00:14:26.159
you know, back in the 1970s. it was sort of sweet and fun and it's

320
00:14:26.159 --> 00:14:30.059
comfort food, but it was always a sort of uh sort of incompetent

321
00:14:30.059 --> 00:14:31.019
television army.

322
00:14:31.080 --> 00:14:34.200
Whereas this is it sort of reimagined as something else.

323
00:14:34.259 --> 00:14:37.559
But this is absolutely packed full of references to previous

324
00:14:37.559 --> 00:14:38.580
Doctor Who.

325
00:14:38.639 --> 00:14:43.019
Without, you know, requiring you to have the Doctor Who Monster

326
00:14:43.019 --> 00:14:43.740
book on hand.

327
00:14:43.799 --> 00:14:45.960
Well, that's a bit of a relief, isn't it?

328
00:14:46.019 --> 00:14:50.039
Because it's entirely about It's entirely about contemporary

329
00:14:50.039 --> 00:14:54.960
Britain's take on the present and the past at the same time, just

330
00:14:54.960 --> 00:14:55.980
like Christopher Nolan.

331
00:14:56.039 --> 00:15:00.539
Yeah, like Ben Aronovich said, one of his purposes in setting the

332
00:15:00.539 --> 00:15:03.960
story in 1963 is he didn't want to sugarcoat the past and he

333
00:15:03.960 --> 00:15:08.879
wanted to point out that, okay, yeah, we defeated the Nazis and

334
00:15:08.879 --> 00:15:12.059
one of ideas with the Daleks was Nazism.

335
00:15:12.120 --> 00:15:14.639
We also discussed that communism was an influence way back in

336
00:15:14.639 --> 00:15:15.240
episode one.

337
00:15:15.299 --> 00:15:19.320
But Benoranovich's perspective was, that doesn't mean we defeated

338
00:15:19.320 --> 00:15:22.679
racism, and that still existed in the 1960s, and he said to Andrew

339
00:15:22.679 --> 00:15:25.019
Cartmel, I'm not going to sugarcoat it, and Cartmel said, yep

340
00:15:25.019 --> 00:15:25.440
brilliant.

341
00:15:25.500 --> 00:15:27.779
And we get these dynamics between the characters.

342
00:15:27.840 --> 00:15:32.580
There's a deleted scene between Rachel, Allison and Mike, where

343
00:15:32.580 --> 00:15:35.580
they're waiting for Ace to come out of the boarding house.

344
00:15:35.820 --> 00:15:41.039
Rachel and Alison kind of tease Mike that he fancies Ace and Mike

345
00:15:41.039 --> 00:15:42.059
says, oh, not yet.

346
00:15:42.120 --> 00:15:42.779
Yeah, I know.

347
00:15:42.840 --> 00:15:46.200
But not yet, but I want to know more about her and then say, what

348
00:15:46.200 --> 00:15:46.500
do you mean?

349
00:15:46.559 --> 00:15:48.600
And he says, well, I wouldn't want it to be foreign, would I?

350
00:15:48.899 --> 00:15:51.059
That's cut out though, isn't it?

351
00:15:51.059 --> 00:15:51.779
It's cut out.

352
00:15:51.840 --> 00:15:56.580
And I think it's a good thing it's cut out because it makes his, it

353
00:15:56.580 --> 00:16:01.860
makes his bigotry a bit more nuanced, but at the same time, that

354
00:16:01.860 --> 00:16:05.879
is something someone would have said without, without shame in the

355
00:16:05.879 --> 00:16:06.480
19th.

356
00:16:06.539 --> 00:16:07.019
It is.

357
00:16:07.080 --> 00:16:12.659
And also, and it's nice that Mike's racism is so received from his

358
00:16:12.659 --> 00:16:12.960
mum.

359
00:16:13.019 --> 00:16:16.259
We need to talk about who his mum is too, because she crops up

360
00:16:16.259 --> 00:16:16.740
quite a bit.

361
00:16:16.799 --> 00:16:18.779
She's Mrs. Bigmead.

362
00:16:18.840 --> 00:16:20.399
Kathleen bit me.

363
00:16:20.460 --> 00:16:24.480
No, she may not be our Mrs. B. But she, but bid me did use her.

364
00:16:24.539 --> 00:16:25.799
So said, oh, God.

365
00:16:25.860 --> 00:16:29.159
Aronovich wasn't the only one looking at the early 60s and

366
00:16:29.159 --> 00:16:31.620
certainly around this Bay of Pigs, Kennedy's assassination time

367
00:16:31.679 --> 00:16:34.500
just happened to be 25 years, but a lot of other contemporary

368
00:16:34.500 --> 00:16:35.460
fiction TV shows.

369
00:16:35.580 --> 00:16:39.059
Britain just generally politically socially was looking at this

370
00:16:39.059 --> 00:16:39.360
stuff.

371
00:16:39.419 --> 00:16:42.600
And as we've talked about Judge Dread, and we've talked about Alan

372
00:16:42.600 --> 00:16:45.600
Moore, and we've talked about films of the time, scandal comes out

373
00:16:45.600 --> 00:16:49.980
2 years later about the Profumo affair with Ian McKellen, as John

374
00:16:49.980 --> 00:16:50.580
Profumo.

375
00:16:50.639 --> 00:16:54.240
But not in a gray, a lovely long gray curtain.

376
00:16:54.299 --> 00:16:55.500
We just have the outline around.

377
00:16:55.559 --> 00:17:00.720
British culture was reanalyzing its post-war past, and finally, not

378
00:17:00.720 --> 00:17:04.559
as the golden age that our parents professed it had been, you know

379
00:17:04.559 --> 00:17:08.039
and there were people like Nathan and I who were born a little

380
00:17:08.039 --> 00:17:08.700
while ago.

381
00:17:08.759 --> 00:17:13.559
I think that Mike's final funeral is actually a funeral for the

382
00:17:13.559 --> 00:17:18.299
blanket blinkered optimism of our parents' generation about this

383
00:17:18.299 --> 00:17:18.599
time.

384
00:17:18.660 --> 00:17:22.079
We're reappraising it in a truthful way, and you're seeing it all

385
00:17:22.079 --> 00:17:24.180
across TV and film at the time.

386
00:17:24.240 --> 00:17:30.420
The novel is clearer about that because it deals with the

387
00:17:30.420 --> 00:17:33.119
characters, thoughts about the war.

388
00:17:33.180 --> 00:17:35.339
Like, think about the title, right?

389
00:17:35.400 --> 00:17:40.559
By this point, you have to have blank off the Daleks ever since.

390
00:17:40.559 --> 00:17:44.819
But you have Genesis Destiny, and then it's our word of the Daleks

391
00:17:44.819 --> 00:17:45.599
isn't it, after that?

392
00:17:45.660 --> 00:17:50.940
Yeah, ritual reticule of the Daleks. relocation, rehash of the

393
00:17:50.940 --> 00:17:53.400
Daleks, repetition of the Daleks.

394
00:17:53.460 --> 00:17:55.019
Reticular vector gate.

395
00:17:55.200 --> 00:17:58.380
But, um, Recidivism.

396
00:17:58.440 --> 00:18:02.160
Remembrance is, because it ends with a funeral, it sort of makes

397
00:18:02.160 --> 00:18:05.759
sense. on the in the televis show, it doesn't really make sense as

398
00:18:05.759 --> 00:18:06.420
a title.

399
00:18:06.480 --> 00:18:10.200
Apart from the fact that we're remembering the origins of Doctor

400
00:18:10.200 --> 00:18:11.220
Who as a show.

401
00:18:11.279 --> 00:18:15.059
But in the novel, what we're remembering is the war, like we're

402
00:18:15.059 --> 00:18:16.559
remembering the Second World War.

403
00:18:16.619 --> 00:18:21.180
It's telling, you know, TV of the period is so post-war, isn't

404
00:18:21.180 --> 00:18:21.359
it?

405
00:18:21.420 --> 00:18:25.980
You know, even when you watch Fulty Towers, you know, the war is

406
00:18:25.980 --> 00:18:30.180
still there in people's minds and that's in the early 70s, you

407
00:18:30.180 --> 00:18:30.359
know.

408
00:18:30.420 --> 00:18:34.799
So it's an important thing in the lives of everyone.

409
00:18:34.799 --> 00:18:40.079
And that having the villains literally be Nazis is, or, you know

410
00:18:40.079 --> 00:18:43.200
fascists, British fascists, is fantastic.

411
00:18:43.259 --> 00:18:47.700
And, and for the novel, I think Aronovic invents Manisha, doesn't

412
00:18:47.700 --> 00:18:53.460
yeah, Ace's friend Manisha, who will become a bigger part of her

413
00:18:53.460 --> 00:18:55.500
story next season and through to the new adventures.

414
00:18:55.559 --> 00:18:57.359
Yeah, yeah.

415
00:18:57.420 --> 00:19:01.259
So you've got, you know, like her Asian friend who's flat is fire

416
00:19:01.259 --> 00:19:06.359
bombed by sort of white supremacist by skinheads in the 1980s and

417
00:19:06.359 --> 00:19:12.000
uh, you know, that's why Ace takes that thing so, so seriously.

418
00:19:12.059 --> 00:19:15.180
And I love the scene where she finds the no coloured sign because

419
00:19:15.180 --> 00:19:20.519
it's the kind of thing that Doctor Who hasn't had, you know, Doctor

420
00:19:20.519 --> 00:19:25.559
Who very rarely goes back to the recent past, it very...

421
00:19:25.619 --> 00:19:26.220
No.

422
00:19:26.279 --> 00:19:27.900
That was quite an issue at the time.

423
00:19:27.960 --> 00:19:30.119
You know, that's the scene that GNT wanted to cut out.

424
00:19:30.180 --> 00:19:32.640
Yeah, because it was too political, I imagine.

425
00:19:32.700 --> 00:19:36.720
And yet when they took it to show it to Jonathan Powell, famously

426
00:19:36.720 --> 00:19:40.559
um, Cartmel, tell us a story that Jonathan Powell took a phone

427
00:19:40.559 --> 00:19:43.140
call during the episode and so it was turned away from the screen

428
00:19:43.140 --> 00:19:46.680
when that scene went on and Andrew Cartmel did something that he

429
00:19:46.680 --> 00:19:47.220
found out later.

430
00:19:47.279 --> 00:19:48.240
You just do not know.

431
00:19:48.299 --> 00:19:49.079
You're not allowed to do it, yeah.

432
00:19:49.079 --> 00:19:51.599
He grabbed the remote and said to Jonathan, I'm so sorry.

433
00:19:51.660 --> 00:19:54.299
I think it's very important you see the scene, rewound it and

434
00:19:54.299 --> 00:19:54.660
played it.

435
00:19:54.720 --> 00:19:57.059
And at the end of the episode, Jonathan Powell said, thank you for

436
00:19:57.059 --> 00:19:57.720
rewinding it.

437
00:19:57.720 --> 00:19:59.700
That scene is the point of the episode.

438
00:19:59.759 --> 00:20:01.019
She should have torn the sign up.

439
00:20:01.079 --> 00:20:03.180
And then punched Mrs. Smith in the face.

440
00:20:04.619 --> 00:20:09.720
It is such a powerful moment, especially because, you know, we've

441
00:20:09.720 --> 00:20:14.579
seen with Ace already, just in 2 stories, that she is the kind of

442
00:20:14.579 --> 00:20:19.259
person who will take actions before she considers them, not all

443
00:20:19.259 --> 00:20:19.619
the time.

444
00:20:19.680 --> 00:20:23.220
But the thing is, she goes to challenge Mrs. Smith and then kind

445
00:20:23.220 --> 00:20:25.259
of just goes.

446
00:20:25.319 --> 00:20:28.859
Besides, yeah, what's the point, you know, and I'm going out for

447
00:20:28.859 --> 00:20:31.980
some fresh air, like, no, I can't I can't be here with you.

448
00:20:32.099 --> 00:20:34.500
I would rather go fight a bunch of Daleks.

449
00:20:34.559 --> 00:20:37.740
And I think, which is a proper British or small.

450
00:20:38.759 --> 00:20:41.220
Yeah, it is actually.

451
00:20:41.279 --> 00:20:44.700
There's the thing of taking on the tune. also a very wartime thing

452
00:20:44.700 --> 00:20:50.039
of, you know, there was candour in not in non-disclosure.

453
00:20:50.099 --> 00:20:52.920
So yeah, intimacy was expressed by what you didn't say.

454
00:20:52.980 --> 00:20:55.319
Oh, I shouldn't say, it just me, intimacy.

455
00:20:55.380 --> 00:20:59.940
But understanding and compassion was conveyed by what isn't said.

456
00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:01.619
As a kid watching that?

457
00:21:01.740 --> 00:21:04.920
I didn't know what coloured meant in that sense.

458
00:21:05.039 --> 00:21:07.920
So my parents had to explain it to me.

459
00:21:07.920 --> 00:21:10.859
And I think I said during a live tweet, I think that was my 1st

460
00:21:10.859 --> 00:21:12.240
knowledge of what racism was.

461
00:21:12.539 --> 00:21:17.940
We kind of said last season that Doctor Who is being they're

462
00:21:17.940 --> 00:21:19.680
attempting to make Doctor Who on several levels again.

463
00:21:19.740 --> 00:21:24.660
And here they're more capturing the child teenage and older

464
00:21:24.660 --> 00:21:27.359
audience, I think, in this story than last year.

465
00:21:27.420 --> 00:21:30.720
And I think the whole story sends a really good message about

466
00:21:30.720 --> 00:21:34.259
racism, especially when Mike tries to justify his actions and uses

467
00:21:34.259 --> 00:21:37.140
the words, you know, you've got to keep everyone out to give your

468
00:21:37.140 --> 00:21:39.960
own people a chance and Ace just rounds on him.

469
00:21:40.019 --> 00:21:40.799
Yeah.

470
00:21:40.799 --> 00:21:42.180
And, you know, it makes it clear.

471
00:21:42.180 --> 00:21:46.079
Five of them rapidly. makes it clear that I could have liked you.

472
00:21:46.140 --> 00:21:49.200
We could have been something, but...

473
00:21:49.259 --> 00:21:51.539
It could have been someone, but you just keep rattling on about

474
00:21:51.539 --> 00:21:52.559
Adam Faith.

475
00:21:52.859 --> 00:21:55.140
These pretty blonde hair.

476
00:21:55.259 --> 00:21:56.700
I've got blonde hair.

477
00:21:56.759 --> 00:21:58.140
He freaks out and fake.

478
00:21:58.200 --> 00:22:04.500
But that's what makes this so good is that the Daleks are having a

479
00:22:04.500 --> 00:22:05.279
racial divide.

480
00:22:05.339 --> 00:22:07.140
Rachel Divine.

481
00:22:07.140 --> 00:22:09.599
Rachel Divine. great, isn't it?

482
00:22:09.660 --> 00:22:11.579
Make sure Sue is crisis.

483
00:22:12.180 --> 00:22:14.400
Rachel Panama.

484
00:22:14.460 --> 00:22:15.779
No, we're not going there again.

485
00:22:15.839 --> 00:22:16.740
What do you call it?

486
00:22:16.799 --> 00:22:19.019
What do you call a divisive article in a tabloid?

487
00:22:19.079 --> 00:22:20.279
Miranda Divide.

488
00:22:20.339 --> 00:22:20.519
Okay.

489
00:22:21.180 --> 00:22:24.000
The Daleks have a racial divide.

490
00:22:24.059 --> 00:22:26.519
And you know, we're as humans go, oh, I could see the viewers for

491
00:22:26.519 --> 00:22:27.180
the listener in the UK.

492
00:22:27.240 --> 00:22:27.660
Yeah.

493
00:22:27.720 --> 00:22:29.940
And we go, oh, we're so much better than Daleks.

494
00:22:30.000 --> 00:22:30.539
It's like, really?

495
00:22:30.599 --> 00:22:30.900
Are we?

496
00:22:30.960 --> 00:22:35.759
You know, we've got a boarding house who doesn't allow, quote

497
00:22:35.759 --> 00:22:39.119
unquote, as the episodes as coloured people in there, but we also

498
00:22:39.119 --> 00:22:43.440
have a speaking black character in the form of Joseph Marcel in

499
00:22:43.440 --> 00:22:44.220
the cafe scene.

500
00:22:44.400 --> 00:22:48.539
Which is another beautiful scene where the doctor comes to get his

501
00:22:48.539 --> 00:22:50.640
cup of tea late at night and the whole bit about...

502
00:22:50.759 --> 00:22:51.599
It is a bit good, isn't it?

503
00:22:51.720 --> 00:22:52.019
Sure.

504
00:22:52.079 --> 00:22:55.079
I think that's a little secret name they have for each other

505
00:22:55.140 --> 00:22:57.720
anything to do with what appeared on screen.

506
00:22:57.779 --> 00:23:01.079
Well, I quite like that because it gives the doctor a little bit

507
00:23:01.079 --> 00:23:06.720
of interiority because what does the doctor think about, you know

508
00:23:06.720 --> 00:23:11.220
overthrowing the Daleks or uniting Paradise Towers or doing

509
00:23:11.220 --> 00:23:13.680
whatever the hell it is he does in Dragonfire.

510
00:23:13.740 --> 00:23:16.920
Um, here, he's planning to do.

511
00:23:16.980 --> 00:23:18.599
He's planning to do something.

512
00:23:18.660 --> 00:23:20.099
He's planning to do something big.

513
00:23:20.160 --> 00:23:23.819
You know, he's planning to destroy Skaro and it's all in his mind

514
00:23:23.819 --> 00:23:25.019
from the very beginning.

515
00:23:25.079 --> 00:23:28.200
And so we get a scene where he thinks about whether that's the

516
00:23:28.200 --> 00:23:29.519
right thing to do or not.

517
00:23:29.579 --> 00:23:32.220
And the way that's told.

518
00:23:32.279 --> 00:23:35.579
We don't directly get to see what the doctor's thinking, but we do

519
00:23:35.579 --> 00:23:38.519
get him to have that lovely conversation with the cafe owner.

520
00:23:38.579 --> 00:23:42.420
And I love that the cafe owner, just, not the cafe owner because

521
00:23:42.420 --> 00:23:44.940
he's, um, That's Harry, isn't it?

522
00:23:45.000 --> 00:23:45.960
Yeah, the guy working.

523
00:23:46.019 --> 00:23:50.099
Barry Fowler. you know his 1st film is in 1947, Ewan cry.

524
00:23:50.160 --> 00:23:55.079
And in the 50s, he played paramour to Joan Collins.

525
00:23:56.819 --> 00:23:58.740
I had enough of that.

526
00:23:58.859 --> 00:24:00.599
That's why they called him...

527
00:24:00.599 --> 00:24:01.859
He's had another...

528
00:24:01.920 --> 00:24:05.160
That's why that's why they just called him Harry because she can't

529
00:24:05.160 --> 00:24:06.299
you know, everyone, everyone knew him.

530
00:24:06.359 --> 00:24:07.559
No, there's lots of old faces in this.

531
00:24:07.619 --> 00:24:09.960
But Joseph Marcel plays John.

532
00:24:10.019 --> 00:24:14.220
So I love the fact that he just dismisses the whole angst about

533
00:24:14.220 --> 00:24:14.460
it.

534
00:24:14.519 --> 00:24:17.460
He has no sort of particular philosophy.

535
00:24:17.519 --> 00:24:19.380
It's just best thing is to get on with it.

536
00:24:19.380 --> 00:24:23.880
And you know, all of that agonising gets kind of laughed at and

537
00:24:23.880 --> 00:24:24.660
thrown out the window.

538
00:24:24.779 --> 00:24:25.440
It's very cool.

539
00:24:25.500 --> 00:24:28.680
And another thing I love about that scene is actually where they

540
00:24:28.680 --> 00:24:29.160
cut it.

541
00:24:29.220 --> 00:24:31.319
They cut it after that line of best thing is just to get on with

542
00:24:31.319 --> 00:24:34.140
it, which is the human reaction, and it's showcasing the human

543
00:24:34.140 --> 00:24:36.960
reaction versus the doctor's alien reaction.

544
00:24:37.019 --> 00:24:40.859
The scene as originally shot then goes on that the little girl is

545
00:24:40.859 --> 00:24:44.579
standing outside looking at the doctor, the girly dalek

546
00:24:44.579 --> 00:24:45.059
controller.

547
00:24:45.539 --> 00:24:50.279
And she runs off and the doctor says to John, uh, look, I think

548
00:24:50.279 --> 00:24:51.359
you should get away for a few days.

549
00:24:51.420 --> 00:24:54.000
Things are likely to get nasty around here and John's like, yeah

550
00:24:54.000 --> 00:24:54.420
sure, whatever.

551
00:24:54.480 --> 00:24:56.519
The doctor leaves a pound coin on the bench, goes outside.

552
00:24:56.579 --> 00:25:01.019
John picks up the coin that says 1991 and the doctor's looking at

553
00:25:01.019 --> 00:25:02.819
him through the window and gives him a nod and walks off.

554
00:25:02.880 --> 00:25:05.339
And I'm glad they didn't include that because it changes the

555
00:25:05.339 --> 00:25:06.180
emphasis of the scene.

556
00:25:06.180 --> 00:25:09.480
Because the emphasis of the scene is the doctor's interiority.

557
00:25:09.539 --> 00:25:14.579
But that end of the scene is the doctor doing something quirky for

558
00:25:14.579 --> 00:25:15.779
the sake of being quirky.

559
00:25:15.839 --> 00:25:19.920
You know, when he's when he's just given ace, a bag of proper

560
00:25:19.920 --> 00:25:21.480
currency so she can blend in.

561
00:25:21.539 --> 00:25:25.920
He chucks in a 1991 £one coin and then lectures ace.

562
00:25:25.980 --> 00:25:28.140
Oh, you know, someone had found your tape deck, they could have

563
00:25:28.140 --> 00:25:29.099
reversed engineered it.

564
00:25:29.160 --> 00:25:30.000
Well, what about this?

565
00:25:30.059 --> 00:25:33.119
Yeah, they could have reverse engineered the pound coin and we

566
00:25:33.119 --> 00:25:36.240
would have had pound coins, you know, decades before they ever

567
00:25:36.240 --> 00:25:36.599
existed.

568
00:25:36.660 --> 00:25:38.099
It's post-defin currency.

569
00:25:38.160 --> 00:25:40.740
And then we would have never had that glorious scene.

570
00:25:40.799 --> 00:25:42.839
Carol Anne Ford.

571
00:25:43.019 --> 00:25:45.059
Well, that's a reference.

572
00:25:45.119 --> 00:25:48.779
Again, it's one of these references is the fact that...

573
00:25:48.779 --> 00:25:50.039
Caroline Ford can't add up.

574
00:25:50.160 --> 00:25:53.339
Okay, no, that Ace doesn't know about pre-decimal currents.

575
00:25:54.299 --> 00:25:54.480
Yeah.

576
00:25:54.539 --> 00:25:58.200
And it's full of references, just overflowing with them.

577
00:25:58.259 --> 00:26:01.319
No, we're not just, I think we like Nathan's reference from

578
00:26:01.319 --> 00:26:05.880
wherever it was 300 years ago when we 1st started this, that this

579
00:26:05.880 --> 00:26:09.119
is actually from the universe of the pilot rather than the

580
00:26:09.119 --> 00:26:15.599
broadcast series because of the dust jacket being... revolution.

581
00:26:15.660 --> 00:26:18.720
I'm actually quite one with that one, yes.

582
00:26:18.779 --> 00:26:19.440
Yeah.

583
00:26:19.440 --> 00:26:22.079
Yeah, well, you know, it doesn't look the same.

584
00:26:22.140 --> 00:26:25.019
A friend of the podcast, I believe it was Hooa Pete, but I

585
00:26:25.019 --> 00:26:25.440
apologise.

586
00:26:25.440 --> 00:26:29.220
If it wasn't, and it's someone else pointed out that maybe while

587
00:26:29.220 --> 00:26:33.660
she was travelling through time and space, Clara actually swapped

588
00:26:33.660 --> 00:26:34.440
swapped the books around.

589
00:26:35.819 --> 00:26:40.859
So, Moffatt, he'll always be here because he had to put his grubby

590
00:26:40.859 --> 00:26:43.259
little protuberances into everything, didn't he?

591
00:26:43.319 --> 00:26:47.579
I think that's actually kind of died for me. that's here a time

592
00:26:47.579 --> 00:26:50.220
for me when he just had to he just had to put himself in every

593
00:26:50.220 --> 00:26:53.160
moment of every story that's ever been. couldn't just carry on.

594
00:26:53.220 --> 00:26:54.660
I think that is actually a good point.

595
00:26:54.720 --> 00:26:57.240
Doctor Who dies when it becomes self-referential.

596
00:26:57.299 --> 00:27:01.619
But in this case, it isn't because it's referencing what everybody

597
00:27:01.619 --> 00:27:04.380
else is doing, which is razor glass.

598
00:27:04.440 --> 00:27:05.460
Weve moved on from Germany.

599
00:27:05.519 --> 00:27:06.299
We are in England.

600
00:27:06.359 --> 00:27:08.099
So we're talking about postmodernism.

601
00:27:08.220 --> 00:27:08.940
Hooray!

602
00:27:09.000 --> 00:27:12.539
Or even to the point where we have a sitting down to watch the

603
00:27:12.539 --> 00:27:13.799
show that she's in.

604
00:27:13.859 --> 00:27:14.519
Within the show.

605
00:27:14.579 --> 00:27:14.819
Thank you.

606
00:27:14.880 --> 00:27:16.019
Absolutely there.

607
00:27:16.079 --> 00:27:20.640
And the cornerstone of... thing, which really was what we were

608
00:27:20.640 --> 00:27:21.480
talking about at the time.

609
00:27:21.539 --> 00:27:25.559
It's to analyse and reinvent the past with constant referencing

610
00:27:25.559 --> 00:27:29.940
and deflation of that past and then reinterpretation as to what is

611
00:27:29.940 --> 00:27:30.480
realistic.

612
00:27:30.539 --> 00:27:34.019
But the humour of the 80s came from that deflation from that self

613
00:27:34.019 --> 00:27:34.680
mocking.

614
00:27:34.740 --> 00:27:39.180
There were ads on British TV, in grainy black and white of

615
00:27:39.180 --> 00:27:42.000
products from that time, and then someone would come in in colour

616
00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:45.119
and make a deadly piece steak on it, or do you remember that?

617
00:27:45.180 --> 00:27:48.720
And Ben Elton's entire career, and therefore Rowan Atkinson's, and

618
00:27:48.720 --> 00:27:50.700
therefore the young ones, and therefore, really all the stuff that

619
00:27:50.700 --> 00:27:53.640
we've got, are Sandy Toxic would not exist if it wasn't for

620
00:27:53.640 --> 00:27:54.839
remembrance.

621
00:27:54.900 --> 00:27:59.099
She was in one, you know, when Rachel says, I think I'm going to

622
00:27:59.099 --> 00:27:59.400
be sick.

623
00:27:59.460 --> 00:28:00.359
It was.

624
00:28:00.420 --> 00:28:02.819
Very, very cruel, yeah.

625
00:28:03.359 --> 00:28:06.599
Or to be Susan Coleman now, wouldn't it?

626
00:28:07.859 --> 00:28:08.759
I tweeted her and told her that.

627
00:28:08.819 --> 00:28:09.420
She didn't respond.

628
00:28:09.480 --> 00:28:10.319
So she better look out.

629
00:28:10.380 --> 00:28:12.779
She did mention being cast as the doctor.

630
00:28:12.839 --> 00:28:13.319
A doctor.

631
00:28:13.380 --> 00:28:14.460
Yes, she did, yes.

632
00:28:14.579 --> 00:28:19.319
You know, I have wondered to myself because Ben Aronovich

633
00:28:19.319 --> 00:28:23.339
deliberately decided it was his choice to tie this story in with

634
00:28:23.339 --> 00:28:24.359
an unearthly child.

635
00:28:24.420 --> 00:28:29.400
The 1963 setting in Shoreditch and Andrew Cartmel and John Nathan

636
00:28:29.400 --> 00:28:31.920
Turner were only too happy to because they did want this to be the

637
00:28:31.920 --> 00:28:33.900
you know, this is the 25th anniversary.

638
00:28:33.960 --> 00:28:35.700
Really would think it was a JNT idea, wouldn't you?

639
00:28:35.759 --> 00:28:38.819
No, I mean, he supported it, but it was Aronovich's idea.

640
00:28:38.880 --> 00:28:42.960
But Aronovic then discovered that Attacker the Cyberman had been

641
00:28:42.960 --> 00:28:45.480
back to the junkyard as well.

642
00:28:45.539 --> 00:28:48.059
So he actually toned down some of the references.

643
00:28:48.119 --> 00:28:50.400
But it gets me wondering, in a show.

644
00:28:50.460 --> 00:28:51.960
Yeah, exactly.

645
00:28:52.019 --> 00:28:57.299
In Attack of the Cybermen, in episode two, we have that, oh, like

646
00:28:57.299 --> 00:29:01.140
3 or 4 minute info dump scene where the doctor and Lytton explain

647
00:29:01.140 --> 00:29:05.519
how the Cybermen came from Mondas, but then they went to Telos, and

648
00:29:05.519 --> 00:29:09.359
then they invaded Earth, and then...

649
00:29:09.420 --> 00:29:10.680
And then all the...

650
00:29:10.680 --> 00:29:11.460
I can't remember.

651
00:29:11.519 --> 00:29:12.119
Oh, I've seen it.

652
00:29:12.420 --> 00:29:15.180
And then all the dinosaurs died and turned into oil and then

653
00:29:15.180 --> 00:29:17.880
Charles started wearing all of Lady Dye's dresses. can't believe

654
00:29:17.880 --> 00:29:20.039
it Anyway, that's actually in it.

655
00:29:20.099 --> 00:29:21.119
Yeah.

656
00:29:21.119 --> 00:29:24.299
I must have slipped into a coma at that part of it.

657
00:29:24.359 --> 00:29:27.839
But in this, we do get another info dump scene.

658
00:29:27.900 --> 00:29:31.259
It's where the doctor has explained Ace what the hand of Omega is

659
00:29:31.259 --> 00:29:35.819
and why it came into being and who the 2 factions of Daleks are.

660
00:29:35.880 --> 00:29:39.480
It does sound like a lavatory product, doesn't it?

661
00:29:41.759 --> 00:29:43.859
A remote.

662
00:29:43.859 --> 00:29:48.599
A remote manipulator, indeed.

663
00:29:48.660 --> 00:29:52.559
But I was thinking to myself, what makes the attack of the

664
00:29:52.559 --> 00:29:53.579
cyberman saying, you know what?

665
00:29:53.579 --> 00:29:56.099
I quite like attack of the cyberman, but what makes that scene

666
00:29:56.099 --> 00:29:58.559
quite leaden, but makes this one really electric?

667
00:29:58.680 --> 00:29:59.819
and I think it's 2 things.

668
00:29:59.880 --> 00:30:05.400
First of all, the stuff in remembrance of the Daleks is all new

669
00:30:05.400 --> 00:30:06.000
information.

670
00:30:06.119 --> 00:30:09.480
The only thing that sort of comes back in there is other names

671
00:30:09.480 --> 00:30:12.839
wrestle on and Omega and then the story.

672
00:30:12.839 --> 00:30:15.059
But then the story does new things with them in the post-modern

673
00:30:15.059 --> 00:30:15.299
way.

674
00:30:15.359 --> 00:30:18.359
Whereas Attack of the Siamen is just bringing us up to speed on

675
00:30:18.359 --> 00:30:19.140
something in the park.

676
00:30:19.200 --> 00:30:20.339
You know what this really is.

677
00:30:20.400 --> 00:30:23.880
This was as if David Whittaker, Jody, to his mates had never

678
00:30:24.000 --> 00:30:24.779
retired.

679
00:30:24.839 --> 00:30:27.299
This is the Dalek Whittaker universe.

680
00:30:27.359 --> 00:30:30.660
Did you notice the planet reference fan people?

681
00:30:30.779 --> 00:30:32.519
I had to write it down as well.

682
00:30:32.640 --> 00:30:33.480
Phoebius.

683
00:30:33.539 --> 00:30:39.480
Three ringed planet who were in Scuro's system is in the Daleks

684
00:30:39.480 --> 00:30:40.680
Whitaker strip.

685
00:30:40.740 --> 00:30:43.740
And there's a little corner of it, pink with 3 rings around it.

686
00:30:43.740 --> 00:30:44.880
When Scaro explodes.

687
00:30:44.940 --> 00:30:46.559
Yeah, just in case you missed it.

688
00:30:46.619 --> 00:30:48.000
David Wood owns the universe.

689
00:30:48.059 --> 00:30:53.039
I actually think he has reincarnated as Jody, I think. to find

690
00:30:53.039 --> 00:30:53.220
out.

691
00:30:53.279 --> 00:30:56.880
He's just acquired an extra tea and taken our back to it.

692
00:30:56.940 --> 00:30:58.559
Stop it there.

693
00:30:58.619 --> 00:31:00.839
Gotten rid of his Thunderbird's eyebrows.

694
00:31:00.900 --> 00:31:03.059
I think the Daleks are fantastic in this.

695
00:31:03.119 --> 00:31:04.200
I mean, they're really good.

696
00:31:04.259 --> 00:31:06.180
And I remember rattlingly good, aren't they?

697
00:31:06.240 --> 00:31:11.400
At the time, I remember wondering about the 2 factions because of

698
00:31:11.400 --> 00:31:14.279
course that's introduced in Revelation, which it manages to

699
00:31:14.279 --> 00:31:16.259
reference without being boring.

700
00:31:16.380 --> 00:31:19.680
You see, I didn't have a copy of Revelation as a kid didn't

701
00:31:19.680 --> 00:31:19.799
matter.

702
00:31:19.859 --> 00:31:20.640
I understood this.

703
00:31:20.700 --> 00:31:23.759
Yeah, no, you don't need to, but the reason I've been rattling

704
00:31:23.759 --> 00:31:26.640
around so much in this podcast is that I'm now sporting an extra

705
00:31:26.640 --> 00:31:27.720
inflatable ball.

706
00:31:27.779 --> 00:31:33.660
Well, yes, because, of course, the Daleks on this at Silv is want

707
00:31:33.660 --> 00:31:35.099
to tell anyone who will listen.

708
00:31:35.160 --> 00:31:39.180
He was in the Hobbit, you know, but the Daleks in this, instead of

709
00:31:39.180 --> 00:31:44.400
having wheels, have 3 balls, which is why they sort of, but it was

710
00:31:44.400 --> 00:31:47.099
so they could get over the cobblestones easier, but it does rather

711
00:31:47.099 --> 00:31:48.119
make them look drunk.

712
00:31:48.180 --> 00:31:51.119
Yeah, in the 60s, they used to put down a bit of fibreboard and

713
00:31:51.119 --> 00:31:52.500
just have them...

714
00:31:52.559 --> 00:31:54.299
Well, they couldn't afford it anymore.

715
00:31:55.079 --> 00:31:58.740
I remember the 1st time I watched it thinking that they'd got the

716
00:31:58.740 --> 00:32:02.460
continuity wrong because I had my copy of the Doctor Who Monster

717
00:32:02.460 --> 00:32:03.180
book on hand.

718
00:32:03.359 --> 00:32:06.420
Which is amazing because it doesn't even cover the car.

719
00:32:06.420 --> 00:32:07.500
No, you get that car.

720
00:32:07.559 --> 00:32:14.160
So, Davros was picked up by normal coloured daleks after creating

721
00:32:14.160 --> 00:32:17.099
a race of sort of white and gold.

722
00:32:17.160 --> 00:32:21.420
Yeah, that suited the kind of loveliness.

723
00:32:21.480 --> 00:32:22.019
Yeah.

724
00:32:22.079 --> 00:32:22.920
Have you noticed that?

725
00:32:22.920 --> 00:32:26.160
Can we have a little nerdy tech moment that Dalek tech from now

726
00:32:26.160 --> 00:32:26.400
on?

727
00:32:26.400 --> 00:32:27.539
Is Art Deco?

728
00:32:27.599 --> 00:32:28.740
The trans mat.

729
00:32:28.799 --> 00:32:31.200
Yeah, the game show set, as you mentioned.

730
00:32:31.319 --> 00:32:32.099
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

731
00:32:32.160 --> 00:32:34.319
I think they look fantastic too.

732
00:32:34.380 --> 00:32:37.200
They don't have the light bulbs from a Morris minor anymore and

733
00:32:37.200 --> 00:32:39.059
they don't have a sync plunger.

734
00:32:39.119 --> 00:32:41.400
You know, all of that stuff has been updated.

735
00:32:41.460 --> 00:32:44.220
They look really good and I think the colours look great.

736
00:32:44.400 --> 00:32:48.599
Yeah, and that wasn't a feature of the of those cream coloured

737
00:32:48.599 --> 00:32:49.980
Daleks in Revelation.

738
00:32:50.039 --> 00:32:54.240
But of course, you know, we are led to believe that Davros is

739
00:32:54.240 --> 00:32:58.980
leading the gray daleks from his, from his little motorcycle.

740
00:32:59.039 --> 00:32:59.700
How does that work?

741
00:32:59.759 --> 00:33:00.599
He captured them.

742
00:33:00.660 --> 00:33:01.200
Yeah exactly.

743
00:33:01.259 --> 00:33:04.859
And that the white Daleks, Supreme Daleks are being led by.

744
00:33:04.920 --> 00:33:05.819
But the emperor.

745
00:33:05.880 --> 00:33:07.859
But then shock horror.

746
00:33:08.400 --> 00:33:11.160
The emperor looks terrible, doesn't it?

747
00:33:11.220 --> 00:33:13.440
Like, it's straightly shockingly bad.

748
00:33:13.500 --> 00:33:16.740
Yeah, yeah, someone wants to describe the dessert.

749
00:33:16.799 --> 00:33:19.380
A shrieking airball, I see.

750
00:33:19.380 --> 00:33:24.420
Sophie Aldred's had a glittering career since this, isn't she?

751
00:33:24.480 --> 00:33:24.839
Really?

752
00:33:24.900 --> 00:33:27.900
Putting on makeup and chanel earrings and pouting about being

753
00:33:27.900 --> 00:33:30.059
upper middle class.

754
00:33:30.119 --> 00:33:31.680
Sorry, Soph.

755
00:33:31.740 --> 00:33:34.980
I loved you, but then on all the bloody DVD extra say, well, she

756
00:33:34.980 --> 00:33:36.660
and I were terribly up in middle class.

757
00:33:36.720 --> 00:33:39.000
It was lovely of them to give me a girly chum.

758
00:33:39.059 --> 00:33:40.200
Every story.

759
00:33:40.259 --> 00:33:43.799
My lovely girly chum in this one was Alison Bleep because now one

760
00:33:43.799 --> 00:33:45.779
can fricking remember what she is or watching it.

761
00:33:45.839 --> 00:33:46.680
Who is she in this?

762
00:33:46.740 --> 00:33:50.400
Listen to countermeasures, he still wafts about in a number 2

763
00:33:50.400 --> 00:33:53.880
prisoner scarf. and, you know, looks tries to look useful.

764
00:33:53.940 --> 00:33:55.079
I think she makes the two.

765
00:33:55.200 --> 00:33:57.599
So much feminine. very good actually.

766
00:33:57.660 --> 00:33:59.400
Green Garson. who it is?

767
00:33:59.460 --> 00:34:00.480
Yeah.

768
00:34:00.480 --> 00:34:02.039
Karen Gladhill.

769
00:34:02.099 --> 00:34:03.119
She's charming.

770
00:34:03.180 --> 00:34:04.500
Yeah, yeah. doesn't do anything.

771
00:34:04.559 --> 00:34:09.059
She has she has a couple of great lines and one of them is when

772
00:34:09.059 --> 00:34:13.500
Mike Clobber's that that pretty ginger soldier.

773
00:34:13.500 --> 00:34:15.539
Oh, hello.

774
00:34:15.539 --> 00:34:18.900
And Rachel says to Alison, is he all right?

775
00:34:18.960 --> 00:34:21.659
And Alison responds, I don't know, I'm the physicist.

776
00:34:21.719 --> 00:34:25.199
I think that's a dig at Liz Shaw, who just conveniently becomes a

777
00:34:25.199 --> 00:34:28.739
medical doctor for no reason at some point in info. like to think

778
00:34:28.739 --> 00:34:29.400
they thought that way.

779
00:34:29.460 --> 00:34:32.820
But the brigadier does say that Liz has degrees in half a dozen

780
00:34:32.820 --> 00:34:33.659
other subjects.

781
00:34:33.840 --> 00:34:35.699
We've covered this.

782
00:34:35.760 --> 00:34:36.719
She only looks 28.

783
00:34:37.199 --> 00:34:39.960
Any doctorate takes at least 4 years.

784
00:34:40.019 --> 00:34:43.920
Well, remember, her husband is the master, so he absorbs life

785
00:34:43.920 --> 00:34:45.360
energy and gives it to her.

786
00:34:45.420 --> 00:34:50.039
That'd be an interesting take on breakfast table conversation

787
00:34:50.039 --> 00:34:50.460
wouldn't it?

788
00:34:50.519 --> 00:34:52.860
What have you got for me to absorb sporting date?

789
00:34:52.920 --> 00:34:55.559
Sarah Sutton's career.

790
00:34:58.619 --> 00:35:01.320
God, that's like a value out of torping the doctor's future lives

791
00:35:01.320 --> 00:35:01.739
isn't it?

792
00:35:02.519 --> 00:35:06.480
I think part of what makes this story works so well and what makes

793
00:35:06.480 --> 00:35:09.840
this season works so well. what makes the continuity work so well

794
00:35:09.840 --> 00:35:17.519
is Sylvester's insistence that Sophie's character as ace gets more

795
00:35:17.519 --> 00:35:17.880
to do.

796
00:35:17.940 --> 00:35:20.400
And it was something that Andrew Cartmel was very passionate about

797
00:35:20.400 --> 00:35:23.280
as well, because as much as he thought too much has been revealed

798
00:35:23.280 --> 00:35:23.880
about the doctor.

799
00:35:23.940 --> 00:35:29.579
As much as he thought, the doctor is not a positive influence on

800
00:35:29.579 --> 00:35:31.800
stories, which is something we complained about during Collins

801
00:35:31.800 --> 00:35:32.280
era.

802
00:35:32.340 --> 00:35:36.780
He also thought that the companion, you know, if the doctor is

803
00:35:36.780 --> 00:35:39.360
being pushed down in the order of the story, the companion gets

804
00:35:39.360 --> 00:35:40.139
pushed down with him.

805
00:35:40.199 --> 00:35:42.000
So bring them both up together at the same time.

806
00:35:42.059 --> 00:35:45.840
So in that scene, where the doctor's explaining the hand of Omega

807
00:35:45.840 --> 00:35:48.360
rather than Nate's just saying, what is it, Doctor Who's Omega

808
00:35:48.360 --> 00:35:48.659
Doctor?

809
00:35:48.719 --> 00:35:49.079
Whats this?

810
00:35:49.139 --> 00:35:49.500
WhatsApp?

811
00:35:49.559 --> 00:35:53.460
She asks questions like, so it manipulates starts.

812
00:35:53.519 --> 00:35:57.900
You know, she asks for clarification, using information, and when

813
00:35:57.900 --> 00:36:00.239
the doctor slips up and says, didn't we have trouble with the

814
00:36:00.239 --> 00:36:02.400
prototype, she is immediately on it.

815
00:36:02.460 --> 00:36:07.860
Yes, we and it'll come back again in Silver Nemesis as well.

816
00:36:07.920 --> 00:36:12.780
You know, Sudech is very talkative today. everyone's got something

817
00:36:12.780 --> 00:36:13.559
to say about this story.

818
00:36:13.679 --> 00:36:18.719
I really like that hilarious response where the doctor says it's

819
00:36:18.719 --> 00:36:21.360
called the Hand of Omega because Time Lords have an infinite

820
00:36:21.360 --> 00:36:25.440
capacity for pretention, much like this. much like this podcast.

821
00:36:25.500 --> 00:36:30.119
She just says, yeah, I've noticed that. which I just think is

822
00:36:30.119 --> 00:36:30.480
wonderful.

823
00:36:30.539 --> 00:36:37.199
And you know, she uses the anti-Tank rocket on the Dalek and the

824
00:36:37.199 --> 00:36:38.460
doctor's like, you destroyed it?

825
00:36:38.579 --> 00:36:39.900
She like, I aim for the eye.

826
00:36:41.159 --> 00:36:44.099
Okay, yeah, aim for the eyepiece with a handgun.

827
00:36:44.159 --> 00:36:46.679
It doesn't particularly matter when you use an anti-tank rocket.

828
00:36:46.739 --> 00:36:48.420
That actually is an ATR.

829
00:36:48.480 --> 00:36:52.199
And she was, and that is a powder burn on the back wall.

830
00:36:52.199 --> 00:36:54.300
And she did get the recoil in the shoulder.

831
00:36:54.360 --> 00:36:57.960
You can tell my every little girl of a certain inclination and age

832
00:36:57.960 --> 00:37:00.900
I've done it frame.

833
00:37:00.900 --> 00:37:04.079
I've done that frame by frame and you see the backblast, make the

834
00:37:04.079 --> 00:37:05.760
make the burn mark.

835
00:37:05.820 --> 00:37:08.400
She also did the jump through the window herself.

836
00:37:09.960 --> 00:37:11.820
No, she didn't.

837
00:37:11.880 --> 00:37:15.719
That was tip tipping's wife, but she did all the shots before and

838
00:37:15.719 --> 00:37:15.960
on.

839
00:37:16.019 --> 00:37:18.300
She wanted to, but it was the one thing they would not let.

840
00:37:18.360 --> 00:37:18.659
Oh, okay.

841
00:37:18.719 --> 00:37:19.559
Okay, okay.

842
00:37:19.619 --> 00:37:21.360
Because, oh, that's right.

843
00:37:21.480 --> 00:37:24.000
Yeah, she does, sorry. being a girl, she'll sprain her ankle.

844
00:37:24.059 --> 00:37:26.039
And actually, she does that.

845
00:37:26.099 --> 00:37:28.920
Yeah, so she jumps towards the window.

846
00:37:29.039 --> 00:37:31.860
They use the other shot. with the stuntwoman going through the

847
00:37:31.860 --> 00:37:34.739
window, but she then does crash into the wall, does the running

848
00:37:34.739 --> 00:37:36.480
through the corridor, et cetera, et cetera.

849
00:37:36.539 --> 00:37:40.559
And tip tipping kind of said to her, okay, after that take was

850
00:37:40.559 --> 00:37:40.860
done.

851
00:37:40.920 --> 00:37:44.760
He took her by the arm, took her to a chair, sat her down, and he

852
00:37:44.760 --> 00:37:45.840
said, now you sit here.

853
00:37:45.840 --> 00:37:47.280
And she's like, why?

854
00:37:47.340 --> 00:37:50.400
And he said, you just sit here and she says, you know, a few

855
00:37:50.400 --> 00:37:53.099
minutes later, I was essentially in shock.

856
00:37:53.099 --> 00:37:56.940
And he said, look, that happens even to experience stunt people

857
00:37:56.940 --> 00:37:58.619
and I just, I knew it was going to happen.

858
00:37:58.679 --> 00:38:02.699
Pushy cows like you, they got jobs away from a lot of workers.

859
00:38:02.880 --> 00:38:07.019
Well, that will eventually see the end of tip tipping on the show

860
00:38:07.019 --> 00:38:07.440
won't it?

861
00:38:07.500 --> 00:38:08.460
But we're getting ahead of ourselves.

862
00:38:08.519 --> 00:38:11.579
No, not Sophie Aldred, but a stuntman situation.

863
00:38:11.639 --> 00:38:13.320
Yeah, but you didn't tell Doctor Who.

864
00:38:13.380 --> 00:38:14.400
No, no, no, no.

865
00:38:14.460 --> 00:38:16.079
Just everyone else's career.

866
00:38:16.139 --> 00:38:17.460
Yeah, a couple of years later.

867
00:38:17.519 --> 00:38:18.960
He's bit lovely too.

868
00:38:19.019 --> 00:38:21.780
He's the he's the lad that brings in Mike.

869
00:38:21.780 --> 00:38:22.860
It's Mike.

870
00:38:22.920 --> 00:38:24.420
For a get about Tommy.

871
00:38:24.480 --> 00:38:26.460
He's really got a bit of a Jesus fixation.

872
00:38:26.519 --> 00:38:28.079
He dies 3 or 4 times in this show.

873
00:38:28.139 --> 00:38:32.400
You seem quite clearly in the junkyard. quite clearly corralling

874
00:38:32.400 --> 00:38:32.820
the troops.

875
00:38:32.880 --> 00:38:34.320
Of course, he'd been in the SA yes.

876
00:38:34.380 --> 00:38:36.119
He got all that precision happening.

877
00:38:36.179 --> 00:38:41.940
And the big thing in fan crap at the time was that that extra at

878
00:38:41.940 --> 00:38:44.880
the end was out of sync and they said, no, no, that's an homage to

879
00:38:44.880 --> 00:38:46.260
Clive Dunn in dad's army.

880
00:38:46.320 --> 00:38:47.219
Oh, right.

881
00:38:48.300 --> 00:38:50.639
Was it Luddy fans?

882
00:38:52.139 --> 00:38:56.400
It works because this is the best dialect story in Doctor Who so

883
00:38:56.400 --> 00:38:56.519
far?

884
00:38:56.579 --> 00:38:57.360
No.

885
00:38:57.420 --> 00:39:01.619
I think Power of the Daleks is the best Doctor Who story. the best

886
00:39:01.619 --> 00:39:02.280
Dalek story.

887
00:39:02.340 --> 00:39:03.719
It is very, very good though.

888
00:39:03.780 --> 00:39:07.079
And we haven't had a good Dalek story for, well, maybe since

889
00:39:07.079 --> 00:39:07.679
Genesis.

890
00:39:07.739 --> 00:39:10.440
You're right, because at the time we thought it was, but no one

891
00:39:10.440 --> 00:39:12.000
had seen power since the time.

892
00:39:12.059 --> 00:39:13.260
You know what?

893
00:39:13.320 --> 00:39:15.840
It knocks spots off the other Deveraux stories mainly because

894
00:39:15.840 --> 00:39:19.380
Deveraux's innocent in it so much. in a roll-on.

895
00:39:19.440 --> 00:39:19.800
Yes.

896
00:39:19.860 --> 00:39:21.780
That's not a slight against Terry Malloy.

897
00:39:21.840 --> 00:39:24.000
Terry Malloy is a really...

898
00:39:24.059 --> 00:39:28.320
I'd like a saucy calendar of him floating in a bathtub of rice

899
00:39:28.320 --> 00:39:28.920
pudding.

900
00:39:29.340 --> 00:39:32.699
But I think in the mask, obviously.

901
00:39:32.760 --> 00:39:35.699
Well, you know, we've discussed before that Terry Nation was of

902
00:39:35.699 --> 00:39:38.639
the opinion that he had to create Davros because Daleks can't

903
00:39:38.639 --> 00:39:41.400
deliver dialogue for sustained periods of time.

904
00:39:41.460 --> 00:39:42.059
What?

905
00:39:42.059 --> 00:39:46.260
We've discussed... shown that that's not necessarily the case.

906
00:39:46.380 --> 00:39:47.579
Russell as well.

907
00:39:47.639 --> 00:39:49.980
I mean, it was a long time before Dave Ross was reintroduced.

908
00:39:50.039 --> 00:39:53.519
There are plenty of Dalek stories. and they're fine.

909
00:39:53.639 --> 00:39:55.320
You know, you just have to write for them.

910
00:39:55.320 --> 00:39:56.940
Nick Priggs has the range.

911
00:39:57.000 --> 00:39:58.079
He does.

912
00:39:58.139 --> 00:39:59.340
Well, he does.

913
00:39:59.400 --> 00:40:00.960
No, quite literally has the range.

914
00:40:01.019 --> 00:40:05.159
But the thing is, Terry Terry Nation, of course, still had vetting

915
00:40:05.159 --> 00:40:06.420
rights on scripts at this point.

916
00:40:06.480 --> 00:40:07.079
Yes.

917
00:40:07.079 --> 00:40:10.860
Originally, Ben Aronovich discussed not using Dabros at all, and

918
00:40:10.860 --> 00:40:13.320
JNT said to him, no, he's got to be he has to be in there

919
00:40:13.320 --> 00:40:15.780
somewhere because otherwise we won't get it past tearing.

920
00:40:15.840 --> 00:40:19.079
And even then, when Terry got the scripts that...

921
00:40:19.079 --> 00:40:22.079
Even then when Terry got the scripts and Davros was only revealed

922
00:40:22.079 --> 00:40:23.219
like in the last 10 minutes.

923
00:40:23.280 --> 00:40:25.199
Terry did complain.

924
00:40:25.260 --> 00:40:28.019
He said Davro should be in it more, Deborah, should be in it

925
00:40:28.019 --> 00:40:28.320
more.

926
00:40:28.380 --> 00:40:31.679
And John Nathan Turner pointed out, ah, yes, but you see, this

927
00:40:31.679 --> 00:40:35.400
Dalek controller that we've got on the other side. is going to

928
00:40:35.400 --> 00:40:36.960
look like Davros from behind.

929
00:40:37.019 --> 00:40:39.719
So everyone's going to think Davros is on the side of the black

930
00:40:39.719 --> 00:40:44.159
Daleks until it's revealed to be the little girl and then we

931
00:40:44.159 --> 00:40:45.239
revealed Davros.

932
00:40:45.300 --> 00:40:48.119
And at that point, Terry Nation was happy because Davros would be

933
00:40:48.119 --> 00:40:51.900
felt, as it were, throughout the story, without actually being in

934
00:40:51.900 --> 00:40:52.079
it.

935
00:40:52.139 --> 00:40:55.860
I think this is a good time, though, to talk about Yasmin breaks

936
00:40:55.860 --> 00:40:57.659
as the girl.

937
00:40:57.719 --> 00:41:03.599
One of many little girls in the Sylvester McCoy era of Andrew

938
00:41:03.599 --> 00:41:04.800
Carmel's Little Girls.

939
00:41:04.800 --> 00:41:09.239
The last one, Stella, was not particularly successful.

940
00:41:09.360 --> 00:41:11.880
Yeah, like really terrible and we couldn't work out why she was

941
00:41:11.880 --> 00:41:12.360
even in it.

942
00:41:12.420 --> 00:41:14.639
They owe a lot to the 1962 film.

943
00:41:14.699 --> 00:41:16.380
We've already addressed the bad seed.

944
00:41:16.440 --> 00:41:19.860
Which is John one of John Walter's greatest favourite films of all

945
00:41:19.860 --> 00:41:22.619
time, which has a little girl, exactly, like Jasmine Brakes, who

946
00:41:22.619 --> 00:41:29.039
knocks about in some poor bloke's nicked bike helmet. with a torch

947
00:41:29.039 --> 00:41:29.699
on the end of it.

948
00:41:29.760 --> 00:41:32.400
Yeah, well, you know she's got the bicycle helmet over the

949
00:41:32.400 --> 00:41:33.599
incontinence chair.

950
00:41:33.719 --> 00:41:37.860
We're kind of used to children being in Doctor Who now, but they

951
00:41:37.860 --> 00:41:41.579
weren't really in it very much at all in the classic series.

952
00:41:41.699 --> 00:41:42.420
Good reason.

953
00:41:42.420 --> 00:41:45.420
I mean, yeah, I'm thinking...

954
00:41:45.420 --> 00:41:47.219
Reign of Terror, had a child.

955
00:41:47.280 --> 00:41:47.820
Yeah.

956
00:41:48.239 --> 00:41:49.920
And he's good.

957
00:41:50.039 --> 00:41:51.059
Yeah, probably.

958
00:41:51.119 --> 00:41:54.059
Debbie Watling, lovely our Debbie Watling, played a child.

959
00:41:54.119 --> 00:41:55.440
She was only meant to be a child.

960
00:41:55.500 --> 00:41:57.420
Yeah, and as we record today.

961
00:41:57.480 --> 00:41:59.460
Yeah, Debbie passed away yesterday.

962
00:41:59.519 --> 00:42:02.460
Yeah, which is, which is very sad.

963
00:42:02.579 --> 00:42:04.019
We'd met her at a convention.

964
00:42:04.079 --> 00:42:08.639
Yeah, yeah. was lovely. highly encased in cylinder of smoke, just

965
00:42:08.639 --> 00:42:10.199
like the hand of home.

966
00:42:10.199 --> 00:42:12.179
It was a Nikoner at the right every moment.

967
00:42:12.239 --> 00:42:13.320
Don't forget gin.

968
00:42:13.380 --> 00:42:16.320
But I do like a woman who likes a gin movie suit.

969
00:42:16.380 --> 00:42:20.159
A segue to say, the last time I met Debbie, because of course, met

970
00:42:20.159 --> 00:42:22.260
her in 2005, we had a convention with her.

971
00:42:23.340 --> 00:42:24.539
Yes, and Fraser?

972
00:42:24.599 --> 00:42:25.019
Yeah.

973
00:42:25.079 --> 00:42:28.260
A few years later in the UK, I met her at convention again, and

974
00:42:28.260 --> 00:42:30.119
she said to me in the bar, I know you.

975
00:42:30.179 --> 00:42:33.780
And I said, yes, but I have less hair now.

976
00:42:33.840 --> 00:42:38.159
But then I met her, again, a few years ago at another convention

977
00:42:38.159 --> 00:42:42.300
here where I was dressed like Daphne Ashbrook in the telly movie

978
00:42:42.300 --> 00:42:42.960
if we remember.

979
00:42:44.099 --> 00:42:45.960
We dated.

980
00:42:46.619 --> 00:42:53.340
Um, and Debbie just looked at me and said, What is it you're

981
00:42:53.340 --> 00:42:53.639
wearing?

982
00:42:53.699 --> 00:42:57.059
And I pointed at Daphne and said, oh, well, you see, I like

983
00:42:57.059 --> 00:42:58.980
dressing up as Doctor Who Girl, so I'm dressed up as her.

984
00:42:59.099 --> 00:43:03.539
And so the last words Debbie Watling ever spoke to me were, oh

985
00:43:03.539 --> 00:43:05.639
darling, I thought you were one of the normal ones.

986
00:43:06.119 --> 00:43:09.539
I was hoping she was going to say when are you going to do me?

987
00:43:12.599 --> 00:43:13.440
Yes.

988
00:43:13.500 --> 00:43:17.940
But that is how I shall remember her thinking I was normal.

989
00:43:18.659 --> 00:43:25.079
In such an enclosed petri dish, she would look for a norm.

990
00:43:25.139 --> 00:43:29.760
But but sinister children in the 80s were the bread and butter of

991
00:43:29.760 --> 00:43:33.360
horror films, you know, children doing horrible things.

992
00:43:33.420 --> 00:43:37.199
And, you know, in the 60s, we'd had Village of the Damned children

993
00:43:37.199 --> 00:43:37.800
of the Damned.

994
00:43:37.860 --> 00:43:40.739
Macaulay Culkin.

995
00:43:40.800 --> 00:43:42.300
Yes that's right.

996
00:43:42.360 --> 00:43:46.619
But I think she does an incredible job.

997
00:43:46.679 --> 00:43:49.139
And I think Cody Olson twins.

998
00:43:49.800 --> 00:43:54.000
If I were to criticise Jasmine breaks for something.

999
00:43:54.059 --> 00:43:58.320
It would be, you know, she's given a few lines and they're not

1000
00:43:58.320 --> 00:44:00.480
particularly great, but at the same time, she's dialect

1001
00:44:00.480 --> 00:44:00.840
controlled.

1002
00:44:00.900 --> 00:44:03.239
So things like time controller activated.

1003
00:44:03.360 --> 00:44:08.099
It's just, it's just a little bit, it's just a little bit stagey.

1004
00:44:08.159 --> 00:44:11.340
But when she's silent and just looking around and looking at

1005
00:44:11.340 --> 00:44:13.679
things, she's incredibly sinister.

1006
00:44:13.739 --> 00:44:17.880
Well, I think she's just it. channelling later 18th season, Lal

1007
00:44:17.880 --> 00:44:19.019
Awards, isn't she?

1008
00:44:19.139 --> 00:44:22.139
It's as if Tom Baker is constantly just off camera.

1009
00:44:22.139 --> 00:44:25.800
Because that whole slitch as soon as look at you.

1010
00:44:25.860 --> 00:44:26.940
You know what?

1011
00:44:26.940 --> 00:44:28.739
I kind of wish all of her diary was.

1012
00:44:28.800 --> 00:44:31.800
That's why she was giving him eyes because, you know, women tended

1013
00:44:31.800 --> 00:44:33.539
to do that to Tom at that period of his life.

1014
00:44:33.599 --> 00:44:37.860
I kind of wish all of her dialogue had been in the nursery rhyme

1015
00:44:37.860 --> 00:44:42.119
hopscotch tune that she sings because of course that wouldn't have

1016
00:44:42.119 --> 00:44:42.900
been irritating at all.

1017
00:44:43.019 --> 00:44:46.980
But that had been made sinister at the time by the Freddy Krueger

1018
00:44:46.980 --> 00:44:47.280
films.

1019
00:44:47.340 --> 00:44:48.780
No, it would have been really good.

1020
00:44:48.840 --> 00:44:51.179
And in iambic pentameter, obviously.

1021
00:44:51.539 --> 00:44:56.099
But, you know, that is a minor criticism of a really good use of a

1022
00:44:56.099 --> 00:44:57.179
character.

1023
00:44:57.420 --> 00:44:58.619
She only 12 you bastard.

1024
00:44:59.280 --> 00:45:03.000
I'm a Doctor Who fan. have to find something to criticise.

1025
00:45:03.059 --> 00:45:04.920
We've already criticised the Daleks testicles.

1026
00:45:05.340 --> 00:45:10.980
Well, you may say that I'm finding them extremely comfortable, but

1027
00:45:11.039 --> 00:45:12.119
buoyantly so.

1028
00:45:12.179 --> 00:45:14.579
I think you'd look really good in that.

1029
00:45:14.639 --> 00:45:16.559
She is even cosplaying Lala in France.

1030
00:45:17.639 --> 00:45:19.320
Oh, dear.

1031
00:45:20.219 --> 00:45:23.039
And as Rachel is cosplaying.

1032
00:45:23.099 --> 00:45:24.239
Just take a moment.

1033
00:45:24.300 --> 00:45:25.079
Barbara.

1034
00:45:25.139 --> 00:45:26.099
Yeah, Barbara.

1035
00:45:26.159 --> 00:45:28.019
Oh, that is so deliberate and so wonderful.

1036
00:45:28.079 --> 00:45:29.219
The cardigan.

1037
00:45:29.280 --> 00:45:32.219
You feel like unravelling it or... some great moments.

1038
00:45:32.280 --> 00:45:34.199
She's in the back of the transit van, which, by the way, that

1039
00:45:34.199 --> 00:45:37.980
Bedford van is not a 19623 model for the fanboys out there, is a

1040
00:45:37.980 --> 00:45:38.280
later one.

1041
00:45:38.340 --> 00:45:42.179
The black one with the the red prop on the top. when she says

1042
00:45:42.179 --> 00:45:43.380
group captain, I've got a man.

1043
00:45:48.300 --> 00:45:50.219
Even that's really good.

1044
00:45:50.280 --> 00:45:53.340
You know, fabulous.

1045
00:45:53.400 --> 00:45:54.599
It moves at such a pace.

1046
00:45:54.659 --> 00:45:57.179
Yeah, they're starting to do things on location, which are really

1047
00:45:57.179 --> 00:45:57.420
good.

1048
00:45:57.480 --> 00:45:58.559
There's a lot of stuff on location.

1049
00:45:58.619 --> 00:46:00.719
People look like they're enjoying themselves.

1050
00:46:00.719 --> 00:46:02.579
Yeah.

1051
00:46:02.639 --> 00:46:05.280
And there's action, like there's proper action with stuff

1052
00:46:05.280 --> 00:46:06.539
exploding and things.

1053
00:46:06.659 --> 00:46:08.340
Wordgasm, peril.

1054
00:46:08.400 --> 00:46:09.000
Yes.

1055
00:46:09.000 --> 00:46:10.260
Time Incorporated.

1056
00:46:10.320 --> 00:46:12.900
I think everyone's pretended that never happened.

1057
00:46:12.960 --> 00:46:16.199
Including me and I spent like 2 weeks editing it.

1058
00:46:18.239 --> 00:46:22.440
Even when we do have WordParel, like when the doctor says the

1059
00:46:22.440 --> 00:46:25.559
Daleks have weapons capable of cracking this planet open like an

1060
00:46:25.559 --> 00:46:25.800
egg.

1061
00:46:25.860 --> 00:46:29.280
No, that works because we have seen their firepower.

1062
00:46:29.340 --> 00:46:31.920
And it's 1963 and there's a cold war on.

1063
00:46:31.980 --> 00:46:33.480
Yeah, we just had the Bay of Pigs.

1064
00:46:33.539 --> 00:46:34.440
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1065
00:46:34.440 --> 00:46:37.380
Well, that hence that opening, you know, the cold open, which so

1066
00:46:37.380 --> 00:46:38.760
rarely happens in Doctor Who.

1067
00:46:38.820 --> 00:46:41.460
Is it the 2nd one after Castravalva?

1068
00:46:41.519 --> 00:46:42.300
only the 3rd time.

1069
00:46:42.360 --> 00:46:44.639
Flight doctors had a cold open as well.

1070
00:46:44.699 --> 00:46:44.880
Okay.

1071
00:46:45.000 --> 00:46:45.300
Yeah.

1072
00:46:45.360 --> 00:46:47.159
That's a bit harsh on Billy.

1073
00:46:48.300 --> 00:46:49.380
He was dead.

1074
00:46:49.980 --> 00:46:52.920
Do you know, that was going to be her Madge.

1075
00:46:52.980 --> 00:46:56.460
It was going to be the queen in that thing. and I asked it, and

1076
00:46:56.460 --> 00:46:57.900
they approached the palace.

1077
00:46:57.960 --> 00:47:00.000
You cannot, cannot, do you?

1078
00:47:00.059 --> 00:47:02.760
You cannot sound bite, the queen.

1079
00:47:02.820 --> 00:47:05.340
Majesty, but you can add Prince Pillow.

1080
00:47:06.539 --> 00:47:09.059
That is a bit of Prince Philip in there.

1081
00:47:09.119 --> 00:47:09.599
Yeah, yeah.

1082
00:47:09.659 --> 00:47:12.119
As many a showgirl has attested.

1083
00:47:12.360 --> 00:47:15.960
Yeah, I think that's a bloody wonderful opening shot as well.

1084
00:47:16.019 --> 00:47:18.840
It's weird that it ends in a freeze frame, but the sign from

1085
00:47:18.840 --> 00:47:19.019
that.

1086
00:47:19.079 --> 00:47:22.679
My father was at a party in 1968 with Shirley Bassey, where she

1087
00:47:22.679 --> 00:47:25.199
did something I cannot mention on this podcast, but she was also

1088
00:47:25.199 --> 00:47:28.320
flirting with him because he was attractive in his day and that

1089
00:47:28.320 --> 00:47:30.119
she'd had a fling with Prince Philip.

1090
00:47:30.179 --> 00:47:34.559
She was very strong about suggesting that to the civil gentleman

1091
00:47:34.559 --> 00:47:35.039
at the time.

1092
00:47:35.099 --> 00:47:37.860
She was having a fling with Prince Philip at the time, 68.

1093
00:47:37.980 --> 00:47:40.079
So she's in this and all.

1094
00:47:40.139 --> 00:47:43.559
You're going to be executed for treason.

1095
00:47:43.559 --> 00:47:44.760
Well, I don't think...

1096
00:47:44.880 --> 00:47:46.440
I don't think it's tearing the Lord.

1097
00:47:47.699 --> 00:47:50.039
Prince Philip without makeup.

1098
00:47:50.099 --> 00:47:54.840
That's really bassy, obviously.

1099
00:47:55.800 --> 00:47:58.800
I will teach you the fully of your words.

1100
00:47:59.280 --> 00:48:02.039
Actually, I think that might catch on.

1101
00:48:03.780 --> 00:48:06.719
Jodie Whitaker is the doctor.

1102
00:48:06.780 --> 00:48:08.760
Shirley Bassey is Davros.

1103
00:48:09.059 --> 00:48:12.900
I think every single person in the news show should be a lady

1104
00:48:12.900 --> 00:48:13.800
type.

1105
00:48:13.860 --> 00:48:15.480
Is the future?

1106
00:48:15.480 --> 00:48:15.900
I like it.

1107
00:48:15.960 --> 00:48:16.800
Zion inversion.

1108
00:48:16.860 --> 00:48:17.219
Yeah.

1109
00:48:17.280 --> 00:48:18.480
You know what?

1110
00:48:18.539 --> 00:48:22.139
I like to see Oswald Oswald coming as the companion for a little

1111
00:48:22.139 --> 00:48:22.380
while.

1112
00:48:22.440 --> 00:48:24.780
Charming, but Chipman won't do that because it wasn't his idea.

1113
00:48:24.840 --> 00:48:25.440
No.

1114
00:48:25.559 --> 00:48:28.199
I think it's time to move away from all of the Moffat

1115
00:48:28.199 --> 00:48:29.519
paraphernalia, really.

1116
00:48:29.579 --> 00:48:33.360
Although, I think it would be a great time to bring Ace back.

1117
00:48:33.480 --> 00:48:35.519
School reunion style.

1118
00:48:35.519 --> 00:48:36.480
Just one story?

1119
00:48:36.539 --> 00:48:38.760
She said that on the TVD.

1120
00:48:38.820 --> 00:48:40.199
I'm up a meal car side.

1121
00:48:40.440 --> 00:48:42.840
No, people know that.

1122
00:48:44.039 --> 00:48:47.340
I would I would just like to say one more thing before we go

1123
00:48:47.340 --> 00:48:50.820
because we've mentioned the rest of the primary guest cast.

1124
00:48:50.880 --> 00:48:54.059
We should really mention, we should really mention Simon Williams

1125
00:48:54.059 --> 00:48:55.800
was the brigadier we never had.

1126
00:48:55.860 --> 00:48:56.579
Isn't he a bit lovely?

1127
00:48:56.579 --> 00:48:57.300
Gilmore.

1128
00:48:57.360 --> 00:49:00.179
Were you always downstairs looking at him upstairs or were you

1129
00:49:00.179 --> 00:49:01.559
upstairs looking at him downstairs?

1130
00:49:01.619 --> 00:49:02.519
I never bloody watched it.

1131
00:49:02.579 --> 00:49:03.420
It looks...

1132
00:49:03.420 --> 00:49:06.659
Frizzingly boring, although Lana Ward was in it.

1133
00:49:06.780 --> 00:49:08.340
And of course, Gene Martin.

1134
00:49:08.460 --> 00:49:09.599
Oh no, that's Duchess of Duke Street.

1135
00:49:09.719 --> 00:49:10.920
Yeah, Gene Marsh was.

1136
00:49:10.920 --> 00:49:14.159
Yes, that's right. was actually fingering from the, you know, with

1137
00:49:14.159 --> 00:49:17.460
a Ian McKellen cape on a pointy hat.

1138
00:49:17.519 --> 00:49:21.059
Up upstairs, downstairs at the Duchess of Duke Street with the

1139
00:49:21.059 --> 00:49:22.019
House of Idiot next door.

1140
00:49:22.079 --> 00:49:22.260
Yeah.

1141
00:49:22.320 --> 00:49:23.519
You know that's what this was.

1142
00:49:23.579 --> 00:49:24.960
The House of Idiot.

1143
00:49:25.019 --> 00:49:26.280
No, it was Battlefield.

1144
00:49:26.340 --> 00:49:30.360
Battlefield is the story he pitched, but they went, oh, no, because

1145
00:49:30.360 --> 00:49:32.699
we've actually got a show that's a bit like that.

1146
00:49:32.760 --> 00:49:35.159
So you should do this one, which turns out to be exactly like

1147
00:49:35.159 --> 00:49:37.559
another one called Silver Nemesis that was coming later in the

1148
00:49:37.559 --> 00:49:37.800
season.

1149
00:49:37.860 --> 00:49:40.980
And of course, the working title for this one was Nemesis of the

1150
00:49:40.980 --> 00:49:41.280
Doctor.

1151
00:49:41.340 --> 00:49:45.780
Yeah. which is also a comic strip in the Doctor Who Monthly.

1152
00:49:45.840 --> 00:49:46.920
Well, that's where the title then.

1153
00:49:46.980 --> 00:49:50.099
I think we're going to implode inside our own fandom, like a tiny

1154
00:49:50.099 --> 00:49:51.659
neutron star, aren't we?

1155
00:49:51.719 --> 00:49:55.260
You know earlier where you said that something annoying, yes.

1156
00:49:55.320 --> 00:49:55.920
Yes.

1157
00:49:55.980 --> 00:49:59.219
You said that Moffat had, we'll probably have cut it out.

1158
00:49:59.639 --> 00:50:01.860
I'll do that this.

1159
00:50:01.920 --> 00:50:02.340
Everything.

1160
00:50:02.400 --> 00:50:05.460
I take up an hour and they only need 5 minutes.

1161
00:50:05.519 --> 00:50:09.420
Where you said that Stephen Moffat had sort of colonised the whole

1162
00:50:09.420 --> 00:50:12.119
show by inserting Clara into every scene.

1163
00:50:12.780 --> 00:50:18.300
Aronovich does this to the doctor because when the doctor's in

1164
00:50:18.300 --> 00:50:22.380
London in 1963, he's not a timelord.

1165
00:50:22.440 --> 00:50:24.659
He's not from the planet Galifre.

1166
00:50:24.719 --> 00:50:27.239
He's not hiding the hand of Omega somewhere.

1167
00:50:27.300 --> 00:50:32.460
You know, he's a mysterious old man from a distant planet.

1168
00:50:32.519 --> 00:50:38.039
And this is the show kind of trying to rope him back in and make

1169
00:50:38.039 --> 00:50:40.559
him be what the doctor ended up being.

1170
00:50:40.619 --> 00:50:41.639
Right.

1171
00:50:41.639 --> 00:50:42.960
Is this the rise of the moths?

1172
00:50:43.019 --> 00:50:47.219
This is that this is the seed, the kernel, which should all

1173
00:50:47.219 --> 00:50:47.940
blues.

1174
00:50:48.059 --> 00:50:52.139
It's the show going back and changing its own past.

1175
00:50:52.260 --> 00:50:54.599
In a way that Attack of the Sidemen didn't do at all.

1176
00:50:54.719 --> 00:50:58.679
No, it was just too busy giving David Banks opportunities to write

1177
00:50:58.679 --> 00:51:03.780
sort of lead and you know, compendiums of drawings of various

1178
00:51:03.780 --> 00:51:04.920
cybermen designs.

1179
00:51:05.039 --> 00:51:09.719
I do think it's Episode one is Colin Baker's greatest moment as

1180
00:51:09.719 --> 00:51:10.260
the doctor.

1181
00:51:10.320 --> 00:51:13.199
I think Attack of the Simon episode one is just hilarious with

1182
00:51:13.199 --> 00:51:14.099
full colon.

1183
00:51:14.219 --> 00:51:15.719
Yeah, yeah, running around.

1184
00:51:15.780 --> 00:51:17.579
You asked me to say something nice last time.

1185
00:51:17.639 --> 00:51:19.380
No, but I mean, it really is.

1186
00:51:19.380 --> 00:51:21.480
If it had stayed like that, I wouldn't have minded.

1187
00:51:21.780 --> 00:51:23.880
Yeah, they're lovely together in it.

1188
00:51:23.880 --> 00:51:24.719
Be those policemen.

1189
00:51:24.780 --> 00:51:27.059
Sad lacking of Brian Blessed in the episode.

1190
00:51:27.059 --> 00:51:28.260
Yeah.

1191
00:51:28.320 --> 00:51:29.760
No, I quite like him in that too.

1192
00:51:29.820 --> 00:51:31.800
I think excitement is terrible.

1193
00:51:31.920 --> 00:51:32.639
Terrific.

1194
00:51:32.699 --> 00:51:36.780
Yeah, I mean, I think it's another example of why remembrance

1195
00:51:36.780 --> 00:51:42.960
works better than Attack of the Sidemen because...

1196
00:51:43.019 --> 00:51:49.500
Well, because yes, it does recon, but it recons in a way that

1197
00:51:49.500 --> 00:51:53.340
doesn't necessarily contradict what we knew before.

1198
00:51:53.400 --> 00:51:57.360
So even though you sort of look at the 1st doctor and you go, he's

1199
00:51:57.360 --> 00:51:58.320
not a man with a mission.

1200
00:51:58.380 --> 00:52:01.260
Nobody could be a man with a dangerous machine on board that he's

1201
00:52:01.260 --> 00:52:04.619
trying to keep out of alien hands, especially with his lecture to

1202
00:52:04.619 --> 00:52:07.139
Susan about how these savages will never understand our

1203
00:52:07.139 --> 00:52:07.739
technology.

1204
00:52:07.800 --> 00:52:10.500
So, you know, okay, why bury it in their graveyard?

1205
00:52:10.559 --> 00:52:11.940
But...

1206
00:52:11.940 --> 00:52:13.980
The point is...

1207
00:52:14.940 --> 00:52:20.219
My, my, it's another Jeffrey Beaver's moment to carry is, my

1208
00:52:20.219 --> 00:52:20.639
darling.

1209
00:52:23.039 --> 00:52:25.079
You know why this works?

1210
00:52:25.139 --> 00:52:26.519
All that stuff's just for us.

1211
00:52:26.579 --> 00:52:30.659
It works because it talks about us now and us back then and us at

1212
00:52:30.659 --> 00:52:33.960
whatever age sitting there, when our parents were doing the groove

1213
00:52:33.960 --> 00:52:37.980
in 6263, saying, parents were wrong, they weren't cool.

1214
00:52:38.039 --> 00:52:40.980
They were actually like this, and we all went, yeah.

1215
00:52:41.099 --> 00:52:43.079
And it's got a proper story.

1216
00:52:44.099 --> 00:52:47.280
It's garlic shooting each other. you know, like it's very clear.

1217
00:52:47.340 --> 00:52:50.639
Because every, yeah, because it's got your guns, as you've put it

1218
00:52:50.639 --> 00:52:52.860
it's got your frocks, and it's got a bit of truthiness as well.

1219
00:52:52.920 --> 00:52:54.000
Casual reviewers.

1220
00:52:54.059 --> 00:52:56.820
If the BBC could, and they did promote this and it didn't do that

1221
00:52:56.820 --> 00:52:57.539
badly, did it?

1222
00:52:57.599 --> 00:52:59.760
No, this guy...

1223
00:52:59.760 --> 00:53:02.460
This got 5 million. they're going to get even more later in the

1224
00:53:02.460 --> 00:53:02.699
season.

1225
00:53:02.760 --> 00:53:06.179
If they just chose to promote, they actually ended up doing quite

1226
00:53:06.179 --> 00:53:07.739
well, they just tended to ignore it.

1227
00:53:07.800 --> 00:53:11.099
Yeah, average ratings for this are around 5.45.5.

1228
00:53:11.579 --> 00:53:14.699
Audience appreciation index around the 70s.

1229
00:53:15.179 --> 00:53:16.920
Which is extraordinary.

1230
00:53:16.980 --> 00:53:17.699
We haven't that for a while.

1231
00:53:17.760 --> 00:53:20.820
In fact, I don't think we've had that, gosh, since Revelation.

1232
00:53:20.940 --> 00:53:25.320
And this is around the time it was up against Coronation Street.

1233
00:53:25.380 --> 00:53:27.659
Imagine if they put it on Saturday night.

1234
00:53:27.719 --> 00:53:30.900
Those ratings would have gone up by at least a million, which

1235
00:53:30.900 --> 00:53:34.139
would have been what Peter was getting at the end and Colin was

1236
00:53:34.139 --> 00:53:36.420
getting in his 1st season because Collins ratings in his 1st

1237
00:53:36.420 --> 00:53:37.380
season were respectable.

1238
00:53:37.500 --> 00:53:43.260
So, yeah, the BBC is trying to kill it and JNT and Andrew Cartmel

1239
00:53:43.260 --> 00:53:45.840
are saying, fine, we're going to make the best damn show we can.

1240
00:53:45.900 --> 00:53:50.460
This is the season where everyone cares a lot and it will show.

1241
00:53:50.579 --> 00:53:53.699
Stay tuned to someone used to say.

1242
00:54:09.900 --> 00:54:14.219
Well, dear listener, that's all the time we have for remembrance

1243
00:54:14.219 --> 00:54:18.000
of the Daleks as part of Australia's remembrance of the Daleks

1244
00:54:18.000 --> 00:54:19.019
podcast month.

1245
00:54:19.860 --> 00:54:24.360
Do come back next week for the happiness, patrol.

1246
00:54:24.420 --> 00:54:28.019
In the meantime, in the show notes for this episode, you can vote

1247
00:54:28.019 --> 00:54:32.400
for your choice of a Colin Baker story commentary and we have 4

1248
00:54:32.400 --> 00:54:33.719
stories nominated.

1249
00:54:33.840 --> 00:54:37.019
Todd has nominated the mark of the Rani.

1250
00:54:37.079 --> 00:54:39.960
Richard has nominated Revelation of the Daleks.

1251
00:54:40.019 --> 00:54:43.679
I am nominating the Mysterious Planet, a.k.a.

1252
00:54:43.679 --> 00:54:46.079
Trial of a Time Lord, episodes one to four, and Nathan has

1253
00:54:46.079 --> 00:54:48.239
nominated Terror of the Verboids, a.k.a.

1254
00:54:48.239 --> 00:54:50.039
Trial of a Time Lord, 9 to 12.

1255
00:54:50.340 --> 00:54:54.480
So, sorry, folks, you won't get us to watch Time Lash.

1256
00:54:54.659 --> 00:54:58.920
Meanwhile, over on Bondfinger, we are about to get 3 quarters of

1257
00:54:58.920 --> 00:55:01.260
the way through the Pierce Brosnan era of James Bond.

1258
00:55:01.320 --> 00:55:04.320
Next week we'll be releasing our commentary for the world is not

1259
00:55:04.320 --> 00:55:04.800
enough.

1260
00:55:04.860 --> 00:55:07.679
So do check that out on bondfinger.com.

1261
00:55:07.739 --> 00:55:11.460
Bondfinger on Facebook and Apple Podcasts and at Bondfingercast on

1262
00:55:11.460 --> 00:55:11.820
Twitter.

1263
00:55:11.880 --> 00:55:14.159
We, of course, are flightthrough entiret.sexy.

1264
00:55:14.219 --> 00:55:17.460
Flights are entirety on Facebook and Apple Podcasts and at FTE

1265
00:55:17.460 --> 00:55:18.480
podcast on Twitter.

1266
00:55:18.539 --> 00:55:21.360
Until next time, don't bloody throw us in a lake because you

1267
00:55:21.360 --> 00:55:22.619
better believe there'll be consequences.

1268
00:55:22.679 --> 00:55:24.119
Thank you very much for listening and good night.

1269
00:55:24.179 --> 00:55:25.860
Good night. 3 settings.

1270
00:55:25.920 --> 00:55:26.219
Good night.

1271
00:55:44.280 --> 00:55:47.159
That was Flight Your Entirety with Nathan Bottomley, Brennan Jones

1272
00:55:47.159 --> 00:55:50.579
and Richard Stone, theme arrangement by Cameron Lamb, logo

1273
00:55:50.579 --> 00:55:52.380
designed by Anthony Wells.

1274
00:55:52.440 --> 00:55:56.280
This episode, Daleksa Forever, was recorded on the 22nd of July

1275
00:55:56.280 --> 00:55:56.760
2017.

1276
00:55:57.300 --> 00:56:00.420
Next episode will be released on August 6th.

1277
00:56:04.440 --> 00:56:08.340
We dedicate this episode to the memory of Deborah Watley, who

1278
00:56:08.340 --> 00:56:09.840
played Victoria in Doctor Who.

1279
00:56:09.900 --> 00:56:12.480
She sleeps in our mind, but we won't forget.

1280
00:56:18.900 --> 00:56:22.559
I think I've now officially run out of closing credits jokes.

1281
00:56:23.699 --> 00:56:25.980
Base them on a line from the episode.

1282
00:56:26.039 --> 00:56:26.760
That's what I always do.

1283
00:56:26.880 --> 00:56:27.480
Okay.

1284
00:56:27.480 --> 00:56:30.539
Or just steal them from Steven.

1285
00:56:30.599 --> 00:56:33.900
Since he's stolen our entire ball now.

1286
00:56:34.019 --> 00:56:36.719
And had success.

1287
00:56:37.440 --> 00:56:39.179
Tagline.

1288
00:56:39.300 --> 00:56:42.480
Yeah, no, I hate I hate talented, attractive people.

1289
00:56:42.960 --> 00:56:46.679
If I knew someone, I'd probably be all right with that.

1290
00:56:50.039 --> 00:56:53.159
So you start off by slagging off Stephen Muskovsky.

1291
00:56:53.159 --> 00:56:56.159
And they just slag off all of our listeners, but then you don't

1292
00:56:56.159 --> 00:56:56.940
know any attractive people.

1293
00:56:57.000 --> 00:57:00.360
Hooray We have very attractive listeners, right?