WEBVTT

NOTE
This transcript was created on 2026-06-07 at 14:01:53

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Hello, dear listeners, and welcome back to Flight Through Entirety, the only Doctor Who commentary podcast who is half heterosexual on our grandmother's sides.

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That's not Canon.

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I'm Brendan.

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I'm Nathan.

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I'm Chad.

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Richard for this one.

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And after 3.5 years we have finished the classic series and we jump forward 7 years in time, we're not subjecting you to dimensions in time, although in the show notes for this one, we're going to give you the link for the wonderful Andrew Auton's production notes version of dimensions in time, which has to be read to be believed.

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But today we are giving you a commentary on the telemovie starring Paul McGann, starring Paul McGann being the on-screen title for this movie.

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That comes up immediately after the word.

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So one of the other ones of whom there are many, many.

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Yes.

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Yes, the Magan is the smallest.

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They are actually a babushka doll set, aren't they?

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They're a Russian gossip, but McGain is the one that you opened last.

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Right.

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So we do have our copy of the Telemovie DVD in our DVD player.

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Now, this is the copy from the revisitations box set rather than the original edition, but as I understand, they run at the same speed, so everything should be fine.

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And we will be going slightly longer than the movie as just sort of having a postmortem and anything we didn't get a chance to say during it.

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But yeah.

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Billings, he's got filling.

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Grace was very busy on that operating table.

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We're just watching the little, you know, Did Clayton Hickman do the cards for these?

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No, no, but he did do the cover for this one, which is gorgeous.

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Yeah, yeah, we're just sitting on the menu watching Paul's fillings.

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Less fillings than Pete, though.

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Yeah.

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Mind you, Richard raises an interesting point that he's got fillings immediately after his regeneration, whereas Davison had them in Resurrection of the Dialects after Tegan had been punching him in the face for 3 years.

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Which really hurt.

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It was awesome.

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So your code word, of course, for this film, to press play is is clock.

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Oh, clock.

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Is that going to be my word?

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Don't don't drink.

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Don't do it when Tom says it.

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There are doors and phones in this film, Botox, so you're fine.

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Okay, so are you ready to, listener?

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clock.

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And we're away.

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The planet Scaro, which has lost its rings since, remember, it's the Daleks.

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There's no marbled beef.

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Skyro.

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Yeah, the faster.

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The final frontier.

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Is the 3rd of, he really is TNTNG, isn't it?

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Is this the 3rd or 4th time we've had the doctor?

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Oh, hello?

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No, it's the pet shop.

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The doctor.

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The Time Lord.

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Hang on.

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We're still in survival.

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Gallifrant.

53
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No, it is the old tenant. was right.

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Yeah, it's like in 11 seconds, they introduced up...

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It took 11 years to introduce this stuff in the classic series.

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Now, that was Gordon Tipple who just exploded, who is credited at the end of the Old Master because he was originally doing the opening monologue. the film.

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Oh, Lord, it's Jerry Goldsmith light.

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I hate... just awful.

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I hope.

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Well, you can see exactly what they're up to. can't you?

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This is TNG for the box set viewers at home and, oh, look, it's just like the X-Files only.

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It's not.

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It's a little bit like trick.

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It's a little bit like, hang on, we've already had.

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Oh, yes, it is.

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Starring poem again.

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It really is.

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Can I just say how much I hate the typography here?

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It's truly, truly awesome. is a special guest star.

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Yeah, because he won't be back.

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I was going to be his glittering future career, but I decided that.

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Who's that?

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Which is exactly, which is what every kid sitting at home watching this was saying, yeah.

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But this actually did quite well.

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It was up against, wasn't it a really big episode of Roseanne?

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The finale.

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The final episode of Roseanne.

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We didn't do well at all.

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9.08 million. in the UK, but not in the US.

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Well, to give an idea, the premiere of Enterprise, which was 6 years after this, got 4000000 and that was seen as a great success.

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So this got actually quite a good rating for a TV show, but a very poor rating for a film.

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Or as Fox put it, the lower to average end.

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No, harsh to refer to Sylvester like that when he's spending over.

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That toolbox that we just saw was full of things from the Doctor Who Technical Manual.

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So that just goes to show exactly what sort of fanboy we're looking at here.

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And I think...

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Well, we are.

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And all of that stuff about nearing the end of my 7th life and Galifrey and Daleks and time lords and things, which is all horrifically boring.

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Can I just say, he's a time loan.

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Get it?

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Sorry. don't even need to know that.

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The word does the word timelord appear in in rose?

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No, um, the nesting kind of says it, but it's not front and centre.

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No, you don't need any of that.

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No.

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I mean, that's the problem with this, is that it is for the X-Files, Star Trek, the Next Generation audience, both of which shows by this stage have a sort of massive, Actually, I don't know what point the X-Files is at, but year three.

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Okay, they eventually have this huge mythology, don't they?

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But it's just so wrong.

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Like in the 1st 20 seconds, all this stuff just thrown at the casual viewer.

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I mean, who the hell's going to engage with that?

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And who's this guy?

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Well, exactly.

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He's horrendous.

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I hate that.

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Oh, no. so thrilled at the time.

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Oh, so was I. We had Sylvester, but now I see it as a mistake.

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Yeah, see, at the time. casting my mind back, guys, I'm not going to labour this point too much, but you know how you talk about when you were sort of 10, 11, 12, and watching Doctor Who.

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Just getting a drink for this one.

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This came on when I was 12.

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Okay.

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And Doctor Who had been off the air and my family wanted to watch Adam's family value.

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So I had to tape it.

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That's outrageous.

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I can't believe that that's even true.

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I know, right?

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I know which one I'd choose to watch.

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That was a video easy. have gone up the road and got that.

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Video easy being a video higher store, a video, dear listener. is something.

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But anyway, it is a mad loop box. comes to you in tiny individual plastic boxes.

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Ew.

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Bruce.

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Right in front of my console.

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But I sat up after Adam's family values and rewound the tape and pulled out the sofa bed and watched it by myself.

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And when the credits rolled, I rewound the tape and watched it by myself again, for a fan at the time, this was so exciting.

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But I totally agree that for a casual audience, what the hell is going on?

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Look, where is he?

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Yeah, yeah.

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That is even in a, in, in what's that police box in that?

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Yeah, exactly.

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Like, you've got no idea.

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I don't think what's going on.

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They've totally thrown the major reveal, which they could build an entire...

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Yeah, what's this?

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Where's the junkyard?

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Where's the surprise?

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Well, that's the surprise in the box.

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And it's for a 12-year-old boy watching this.

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That would actually be quite a lot of impact right now, wouldn't it?

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Ew, Brendan, clean your room.

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Your poor mother.

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No wonder she insisted you get some family values.

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Oh, I love this shot.

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This should be where the movie starts.

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Yes.

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Right up the fishhead.

146
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Oh, all that stuff really has had.

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All that stuff we've just had can be a flashback. explaining how he got there.

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So the 1st time we see the doctor is when in a moment the TARDIS arrives and he just steps out.

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Well, except that he steps out to be like completely gunned down.

150
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Exactly.

151
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It's just ridiculous.

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Because he never checks the scanner.

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Like, we can get a screen just then saying scanner malfunction.

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Yeah, yeah.

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You should have said warning, you're in America. everyone has a big gun.

156
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Arch manipulator.

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They're in the flat part of San Francisco.

158
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Vancouver.

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Yes, the little moon.

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It's Vancouver, they call it.

161
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Oh, okay.

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It's the Canadian quarter.

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Now, Yiji So is absolutely lovely and he's worth following on Twitter, isn't he?

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He's terribly sweet.

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He's liked some of our stuff before.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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And he also has a wonderful book out which is sort of his photo diary of working on the film.

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I don't know if he was a fan but he understood that this was something with a big history.

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So he was just thrilled to be involved.

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He's done conventions ever since.

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He gets kicked in the hand, you know.

172
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It's freezing cold.

173
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Certainly Vancouver, isn't it?

174
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Okay, so we just chase them over a fence so that we've got other people just waiting to get them.

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You remember that when this went out on the BBC, a lot of this sort of gunfire was cut because we'd had the Dunblane massacre, just...

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Well, and Pertley's passing.

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So it's really referring to, that's what the plastic bags were so contentious, so there's body bags everywhere, which are also a feature of this film.

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That's actually, there was a week of national mourning in the UK when pert we died in 96. you remember?

179
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Oh, no, it was actually, it was quite intense in the media.

180
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And of course, you know, people were seeing another way for British nostalgia.

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Whooshing.

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So this is something that's new.

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Normally the TARDIS just appears via rollback and mix, but this is something that sticks, isn't it?

184
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We do get wind.

185
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Yeah, we often.

186
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We do.

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And the TARDIS materialising around?

188
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Or is it in front of us?

189
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In front of us. a bit of a shame. apologies.

190
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That's quite good with all them.

191
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It's gorgeous.

192
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Yeah, yeah.

193
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Gunshots.

194
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But now, yeah, like, you know, you don't even check.

195
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He didn't hear that.

196
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Oh, that's, please.

197
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That's awful.

198
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Oh, so you don't do that.

199
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He said like a line of dialogue, you know?

200
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and then boom.

201
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Well, we didn't even get the he didn't even get the opening monologue.

202
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And of course he shouldn't because no one will understand.

203
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It was on the planet Skaro, yes.

204
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And they're not too subtle like promotion of visiting London behind the TARDIS as well.

205
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Well, that's okay though.

206
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I think that's, you know, thoughtful.

207
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See, one thing I always praise this film for is the direction and the visual design.

208
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It does, yes.

209
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Everything's blue and orange, just like everything else in the 90s.

210
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Blue and orange.

211
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Class was all...

212
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That's true, but Lois and Clark was shot like this.

213
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So were X-Files.

214
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So it's actually quite a lot of Deep Space 9.

215
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Oh, Bruce, really.

216
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Stop it.

217
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Stop it.

218
00:11:04.320 --> 00:11:04.740
Yes.

219
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It was a British writer, a British director, both of whom living in America, but Jeffrey Sachs, the director, was one of the few elements that both the BBC and Fox universally agreed on.

220
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They had a list of directors.

221
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Philip Siegel, the executive producer, had a list of directors, and he showed it to Joe Wright, who was the producer for the BBC, and she said, oh, Jeff Sachs, I like him.

222
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And then the executive, they were working with for Fox, was in their office and he came out and said, oh, guys, I've got to go to a meeting, looked at the list, and said, oh, Jeff Sachs, I like him.

223
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So it was pretty much decided then and there.

224
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And here's Eric Roberts.

225
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Hello, Eric.

226
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It's like before we leave, Jeff, because there'll be a lot more of Eric.

227
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Here's the reason that we get these uncanny, um, awesome worlds like shots, like the fish eye dissolving from the, which is actually all coming from the legally Bible, which we'll touch on, I'm sure.

228
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But yeah, the quirkiness of this and the jump cuts and the things that are actually surprising and odd for American audiences is down to Jeffrey Sachs.

229
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And really lovely editing.

230
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Every little moment here.

231
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It's just like watching an episode of the New Avengers, isn't it, Brendan?

232
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And I really like the fact that there's a nod there to John Smith, like that substitute little subtle things like that I think are good.

233
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Well, I mean, I do remember at the time, I think I saw this for the 1st time at a sort of day event or something, you know, Erskineville in the church hall and, uh, and, you know, obviously we're sort of hugely excited and we wanted it to be good.

234
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We so wanted it to be good.

235
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And it does look good, I think.

236
00:12:40.139 --> 00:12:59.700
I mean, you know, it looks like 90s television, but because Doctor Who had looked like sort of 80s videotape kind of, you know, in the studio for so long, this does look really good, the direction does things that the show's never done before, just a pity about the story.

237
00:12:59.759 --> 00:13:07.860
Now, and I just noticed something as the doctor was being wheeled through the reception that I don't think any censorship department has ever noticed.

238
00:13:07.919 --> 00:13:09.000
You looked up your skirt.

239
00:13:09.000 --> 00:13:09.659
I did.

240
00:13:09.720 --> 00:13:15.000
But they say that his heart is going wild, he must have taken something.

241
00:13:15.059 --> 00:13:16.860
I've never picked up.

242
00:13:16.980 --> 00:13:20.100
It's a bloody drug reference in a Doctor Who.

243
00:13:20.580 --> 00:13:24.419
And this was after damaged goods, I believe.

244
00:13:24.779 --> 00:13:27.899
I think the CGI is quite good in this.

245
00:13:27.960 --> 00:13:32.460
For 96 is actually really...

246
00:13:32.519 --> 00:13:33.419
Far off as Odo.

247
00:13:33.480 --> 00:13:34.980
No, Odo is happening.

248
00:13:35.039 --> 00:13:37.860
Yeah, Odo's happening right now from...

249
00:13:38.580 --> 00:13:39.059
Okay.

250
00:13:39.059 --> 00:13:39.299
Yeah.

251
00:13:39.360 --> 00:13:40.679
Same year as the X-Files.

252
00:13:41.519 --> 00:13:45.600
So you can you can really see that Fox is just going through its own.

253
00:13:45.600 --> 00:13:47.220
Yeah, very on top.

254
00:13:47.279 --> 00:13:53.519
And but the thing is, there's so much about this that we're actually seeing on screen that meant it could have actually worked.

255
00:13:53.580 --> 00:14:05.580
I think, is it, we're not going to get there yet, but is it actually the interference of Siegel's fanboyishness and so many nods to the past and also maybe just that Joe Wright had no idea what she was doing.

256
00:14:06.059 --> 00:14:08.399
Well, this is my...

257
00:14:08.399 --> 00:14:16.799
This is the 3rd script, weren't there other scripts with like... the master and the Dr. Beanhart Brothers and all this sort of stuff.

258
00:14:16.860 --> 00:14:18.840
Like, I mean, I think we get out of it pretty good.

259
00:14:18.899 --> 00:14:20.940
It could have been vastly worse.

260
00:14:21.000 --> 00:14:24.240
And it could have been vastly worse if it had gone to series and continued.

261
00:14:24.299 --> 00:14:25.919
Could you imagine some of the mythology stuff?

262
00:14:25.980 --> 00:14:29.940
I don't think it would have necessarily had the new series if this had gone...

263
00:14:30.000 --> 00:14:31.980
Well, you know why Legally wasn't involved in this script.

264
00:14:32.039 --> 00:14:36.360
He was rewriting the gunfighters for the further episodes.

265
00:14:36.419 --> 00:14:38.580
So they were bringing back Dodo.

266
00:14:39.299 --> 00:14:46.860
I actually have I actually have here Leakley's 1st series pitch of the stories he would have written.

267
00:14:46.980 --> 00:14:47.879
Can I just comment about this shot?

268
00:14:48.000 --> 00:14:48.539
wonderful.

269
00:14:48.779 --> 00:14:52.139
Can I just say, hey, we need more frock in it.

270
00:14:52.200 --> 00:14:56.940
I have met Daphne Ashbrook cosplayed in a male version of that outfit in Turkish trousers.

271
00:14:57.000 --> 00:15:01.440
She was not terribly amused, but Paul McGann told me I looked fabulous.

272
00:15:02.580 --> 00:15:05.340
Or the saucy minxy book too.

273
00:15:05.399 --> 00:15:10.860
Well, and also that was when Debbie Watling said to me, I thought you were one of the normal ones.

274
00:15:10.980 --> 00:15:14.580
But, um, so...

275
00:15:14.639 --> 00:15:20.159
The 1st series was going to consist of the pirates, which was a reworking of the smugglers.

276
00:15:20.220 --> 00:15:24.120
A new version of the Talons of Wang Chiang in present-day New York.

277
00:15:24.120 --> 00:15:26.159
With Chinese actors.

278
00:15:26.159 --> 00:15:27.539
With Chinese actors.

279
00:15:27.539 --> 00:15:29.879
Earth Shock.

280
00:15:29.940 --> 00:15:33.659
Horror of Fang Rock set in Nantucket in 1906.

281
00:15:33.840 --> 00:15:34.740
That could have worked.

282
00:15:34.799 --> 00:15:36.720
The Celestial Toy Maker.

283
00:15:36.779 --> 00:15:37.919
No, that's a disaster.

284
00:15:37.919 --> 00:15:40.440
There's not so many Mr. as hits here, are they?

285
00:15:40.500 --> 00:15:44.879
The Gunfighters was going to be retitled Don't Shoot.

286
00:15:44.940 --> 00:15:45.480
I' the doctor.

287
00:15:45.539 --> 00:15:49.019
That just looks like the opening credits of survivors there for a second.

288
00:15:49.080 --> 00:15:51.000
Yeah, I was thinking shit elsewhere.

289
00:15:51.059 --> 00:15:59.759
We're really, in fact, it's fair game because we're not doing, we're not necessarily doing our, whereas this come from thing for this story because it's come from everywhere.

290
00:15:59.820 --> 00:16:01.320
Old Sylv, isn't he lovely?

291
00:16:01.980 --> 00:16:03.600
Clock.

292
00:16:04.259 --> 00:16:07.980
But yeah, this film is all about clocks and eyes.

293
00:16:08.039 --> 00:16:10.259
So, Brendan, those stories.

294
00:16:10.320 --> 00:16:13.559
Are they like part of like telly movies or like 45 minute episodes or what?

295
00:16:13.620 --> 00:16:16.320
The plan was to do 13 one hour episodes.

296
00:16:16.379 --> 00:16:30.240
And how this came about was essentially through a series of misadventures and particularly Spielberg, who was very heavily involved until the legally script turned up and was basically an Indiana Jones ripoff.

297
00:16:30.299 --> 00:16:33.899
And Spielberg went, well, if we're not doing something new, I don't see the point of being involved.

298
00:16:34.139 --> 00:16:39.840
After various attempts, it went to the Fox movie, um, telemovies department.

299
00:16:39.840 --> 00:16:42.120
And the guy there was really keen, but Philip C.

300
00:16:42.120 --> 00:16:43.620
Gle said, look, I want to make a series.

301
00:16:43.740 --> 00:16:47.580
So one of the financiers said, I will finance this as a backdoor pilot.

302
00:16:47.639 --> 00:16:49.919
The guy at Fox agreed, it's a backdoor pilot.

303
00:16:50.039 --> 00:16:52.919
So Fox didn't know that it might have gone to a series.

304
00:16:52.980 --> 00:16:54.840
But that's what this guy would have presented.

305
00:16:54.899 --> 00:16:57.120
He would have said, hey, the ratings were 12 million.

306
00:16:57.179 --> 00:16:58.440
How about we do a series of this?

307
00:16:58.500 --> 00:17:00.480
Oh, here's some treatments we've got.

308
00:17:00.600 --> 00:17:05.339
So it was the idea was 13 one hour episodes after this.

309
00:17:05.400 --> 00:17:26.400
And getting back to something you asked earlier, Richard, I think really the only reason it didn't go to that was the Roseanne finale, because the rating it got was, as I said earlier, the lower end of average, say without Roseanne's audience, which I believe was in the double digits, if a few more 1000000 watched this, say up to, I think they were looking for 8 to 9000000 to go to a series.

310
00:17:26.519 --> 00:17:33.059
I reckon we could have had a series of American Doctor Who, with what we got with Russell and Stephen Moffatt.

311
00:17:33.119 --> 00:17:33.779
I glad we didn't.

312
00:17:33.839 --> 00:17:39.900
But at the time, I remember I was really sad and devastated, especially with how well it did in the UK.

313
00:17:39.960 --> 00:17:41.099
Yeah, no, you know what?

314
00:17:42.900 --> 00:17:43.440
Yeah, same here.

315
00:17:43.500 --> 00:17:44.759
I wanted to go to series.

316
00:17:44.819 --> 00:17:52.319
But I mean, but again, I think there's fundamental mistakes with guest starring Grace, you know, but we'll talk about that.

317
00:17:52.380 --> 00:17:53.099
Well, the chemistry.

318
00:17:53.160 --> 00:17:57.480
I mean, look, there's actually more on the shelf and in the tubes than there is between the 2 leads, isn't there?

319
00:17:57.539 --> 00:18:04.200
I can't help thinking that Anita Sarkesian is up there watching this. one of those people looks very much like her.

320
00:18:04.259 --> 00:18:05.940
Do you know we're all there?

321
00:18:06.059 --> 00:18:06.480
lets kill him.

322
00:18:06.599 --> 00:18:07.140
Yeah.

323
00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:08.400
Oh, this.

324
00:18:08.400 --> 00:18:10.799
No, we've only paid for him for another 3 minutes.

325
00:18:10.859 --> 00:18:11.880
He's got to go.

326
00:18:11.940 --> 00:18:14.339
You know that everyone looks like Eric Roberts.

327
00:18:14.880 --> 00:18:20.940
You know, the continuing saga was all about the search for Ulysses.

328
00:18:21.000 --> 00:18:24.720
Bendon's just perked up a bit because he thinks he's in Ulysses 31 again.

329
00:18:24.779 --> 00:18:28.500
But, oh, but yeah, bye, bye, Silver.

330
00:18:28.559 --> 00:18:30.000
This is really horrific.

331
00:18:30.059 --> 00:18:35.279
But that final moment where he sits up and goes, That as a classic.

332
00:18:35.339 --> 00:18:39.480
That made this scene not so sad for me because that's classic silve, exactly.

333
00:18:39.539 --> 00:18:41.460
And that's Brendan's safe word now.

334
00:18:44.220 --> 00:18:46.440
It's a very subtle difference.

335
00:18:46.740 --> 00:18:49.319
But yeah, you're right, Richard.

336
00:18:49.380 --> 00:19:00.779
The series was going to be about the doctor and his half-brother, the master, who were grandsons of Barusa, who's now, who was almost Peter Toole and the console.

337
00:19:00.839 --> 00:19:07.440
Yeah, yeah, yeah. was a hologram inside the console after he was killed by the master and he and the doctor go off searching for the doctor's father, Ulysses.

338
00:19:07.500 --> 00:19:07.920
Yes.

339
00:19:07.920 --> 00:19:09.779
Who was also K-ops?

340
00:19:09.839 --> 00:19:12.420
He was also Keops. was one of the pharaohs.

341
00:19:13.200 --> 00:19:14.700
And his mother was his mother was humans.

342
00:19:14.700 --> 00:19:17.220
I'm just getting more and more despondent.

343
00:19:17.220 --> 00:19:18.359
The more you talk about that.

344
00:19:18.420 --> 00:19:22.920
Every single story was about his father was also going to be a brigand pirate.

345
00:19:22.980 --> 00:19:25.500
And in one script treatment, Bluebeard.

346
00:19:25.559 --> 00:19:26.099
Yes.

347
00:19:26.099 --> 00:19:31.619
So dad, it's really just, there's a whole lot of that damn bloody awful Joseph Campbell.

348
00:19:31.680 --> 00:19:33.299
Hero has a 1000 faces thing.

349
00:19:33.359 --> 00:19:44.519
And if you want to understand where this is really coming from, every bloody journey treatment in a profiling Oprah Winfrey guest convo is about, is where this script was coming from.

350
00:19:44.579 --> 00:19:45.720
There's got to be a journey.

351
00:19:45.779 --> 00:19:49.440
And there's got to be a parental thing. you know, Star Wars did it really well.

352
00:19:49.500 --> 00:19:56.819
Campbell was right to keep it to that and not get involved with other treatments afterwards, but not after Lucas's success.

353
00:19:56.880 --> 00:19:58.619
The next 20 years was all this same story.

354
00:19:58.740 --> 00:20:00.660
Was Grace going to be in any of this series?

355
00:20:02.220 --> 00:20:13.259
No, the chemistry, they already decided by the time they finished shooting, that there was actually, you can have more fun putting bicarbon lemon juice on it, in a beak and then you'll get from having McGan and grace on stage.

356
00:20:13.380 --> 00:20:15.599
Really, I like their chemistry and I still do.

357
00:20:15.720 --> 00:20:34.559
I think the problem is that it's told from her point of view, and I've heard this said before, and I can't remember whether it was Gary Russell, or who, um, disturbingly little Gary Russell, that, that this looks like the pilot for a show about, it might even have been Paul Cornell, friend of someone.

358
00:20:34.559 --> 00:20:36.180
Paul Cornell, the musical?

359
00:20:36.299 --> 00:20:46.019
No, no, the idea is that, you know, Grace is a surgeon in San Francisco and every week a new alien sort of appears, you know, hospital and she has an adventure with them.

360
00:20:46.140 --> 00:20:47.099
And you know what?

361
00:20:47.160 --> 00:20:49.380
It's kind of surprising they didn't do that show.

362
00:20:52.680 --> 00:20:54.599
He's a poor woman.

363
00:20:54.839 --> 00:20:56.460
I love her.

364
00:20:56.579 --> 00:20:57.000
Now hang on.

365
00:20:57.299 --> 00:20:59.819
Eric Roberts wife is in this.

366
00:20:59.880 --> 00:21:00.779
That's her.

367
00:21:00.839 --> 00:21:01.559
That's the one.

368
00:21:01.619 --> 00:21:03.119
And he's in her and all.

369
00:21:03.180 --> 00:21:03.539
Yes.

370
00:21:03.599 --> 00:21:04.440
We go.

371
00:21:04.500 --> 00:21:05.880
She's lovely, isn't she?

372
00:21:05.940 --> 00:21:10.500
Not only does she have to be married to Bruce, she has to be married to Eric Roberts.

373
00:21:10.559 --> 00:21:11.700
Yeah, contract.

374
00:21:14.039 --> 00:21:16.319
See, again, another interesting shot.

375
00:21:16.440 --> 00:21:16.799
Yeah.

376
00:21:16.859 --> 00:21:20.400
Yeah, really artful, an expensive camera.

377
00:21:20.460 --> 00:21:23.940
We know how hard that was to get on happiness patrol and how they had to book.

378
00:21:24.000 --> 00:21:28.079
I wonder how many times she's told him not to put his uniform just on the bloody chair when he gets home.

379
00:21:28.140 --> 00:21:29.160
You hang it up.

380
00:21:29.220 --> 00:21:31.559
As many times as Rod has told me, I imagine.

381
00:21:31.799 --> 00:21:34.440
Now, these 2 have lovely chemistry.

382
00:21:34.559 --> 00:21:39.000
I mean, the snake and Bruce, but none of the...

383
00:21:39.000 --> 00:21:40.680
Oh, look at that. pretty cool.

384
00:21:40.740 --> 00:21:53.339
Now, I remember one of the earliest pieces of news about this was that the doctor was going to be bitten by a snake that was possessed by the master, stumble back into the TARDIS, pilot his way to earth, and that somehow became this.

385
00:21:53.400 --> 00:21:59.759
Now, the chap in the back here, who is the main mortician is Will Sasso, who has gone on to have a very good career.

386
00:21:59.819 --> 00:22:03.299
So after this, he joined the cast of Mad TV, sketch comedy show.

387
00:22:03.359 --> 00:22:08.400
Um, and uh, yeah, he's a really famous comedian.

388
00:22:08.400 --> 00:22:15.180
Most recently, his biggest role was in the Three Stooges movie with Sean Hayes and he played Curly, the new Curly.

389
00:22:15.240 --> 00:22:17.819
I was about to say that I'd seen him in a number of things.

390
00:22:17.880 --> 00:22:22.319
Like he did a number of, like, television stuff at this time he was doing these sort of little parts.

391
00:22:23.460 --> 00:22:26.819
But what's his character here?

392
00:22:26.880 --> 00:22:27.720
Pete or something?

393
00:22:27.720 --> 00:22:28.079
Pete?

394
00:22:28.079 --> 00:22:30.480
We need to get some foot rot ointment for silver.

395
00:22:30.539 --> 00:22:33.119
I mean, that's starting to get quite...

396
00:22:33.119 --> 00:22:34.799
No, he just needs to have a pedicure.

397
00:22:34.859 --> 00:22:35.940
People are eating at home, you know.

398
00:22:36.000 --> 00:22:36.599
Yeah, yeah.

399
00:22:36.599 --> 00:22:40.980
It's a, you know, it's okay to be a cadaver, but, you know, you still have to groom.

400
00:22:42.299 --> 00:22:49.200
Many moons ago, I did, I knew a lovely, a lovely mortician. and funeral home director.

401
00:22:49.259 --> 00:22:51.599
And he is this going to go?

402
00:22:51.720 --> 00:22:54.059
He's gonna have a little problem in a moment.

403
00:22:54.180 --> 00:22:58.079
Oh, Bruce. pause to reflect.

404
00:22:58.079 --> 00:22:59.519
What is your safety word?

405
00:22:59.579 --> 00:23:00.119
Open wide.

406
00:23:00.180 --> 00:23:01.079
Oh dear.

407
00:23:04.140 --> 00:23:04.980
Richard.

408
00:23:05.220 --> 00:23:07.380
Deep throat the misery.

409
00:23:07.380 --> 00:23:08.519
Oh, she's so impressed.

410
00:23:08.579 --> 00:23:13.740
No, the thing is...

411
00:23:13.799 --> 00:23:15.000
It's working for me.

412
00:23:15.059 --> 00:23:15.480
How about you?

413
00:23:15.539 --> 00:23:23.700
I have to say, if I hear Rod stop breathing in the night and can't listen out for his breathing, my 1st reaction is not, oh, that's better, I can get some sleep.

414
00:23:23.819 --> 00:23:26.759
Oh, I can usually hear him breathing.

415
00:23:26.819 --> 00:23:28.019
Is this something to worry about?

416
00:23:28.079 --> 00:23:30.240
Miranda, you horrible woman.

417
00:23:30.299 --> 00:23:32.220
Is that the character's name?

418
00:23:32.279 --> 00:23:33.119
That's the character's name.

419
00:23:33.180 --> 00:23:34.380
Miranda the horrible woman.

420
00:23:34.440 --> 00:23:35.759
Miranda horror.

421
00:23:35.819 --> 00:23:37.799
Oh, horrible.

422
00:23:37.799 --> 00:23:40.200
James Whale, just in case we missed it the 1st time now.

423
00:23:40.259 --> 00:23:43.319
Which is also, you know, been borrowed before by Doctor Who.

424
00:23:43.380 --> 00:23:45.240
I think this is a bit on the nose, actually.

425
00:23:45.299 --> 00:23:47.160
Yeah, having watched it now.

426
00:23:47.220 --> 00:23:52.740
Like at the time I thought, oh, how clever and, you know, the parallels, but now it's like, yeah, really?

427
00:23:52.799 --> 00:23:54.180
Terribly terribly obvious.

428
00:23:54.240 --> 00:23:56.460
Well, also, this is 1996.

429
00:23:56.640 --> 00:24:01.980
I think this is also somewhat distasteful considering that could well be John Pertwee on the content.

430
00:24:02.039 --> 00:24:05.400
Okay, yeah, we're now 21 minutes into this.

431
00:24:05.519 --> 00:24:08.400
And 21 years, we still have Sylvester McCoy.

432
00:24:08.460 --> 00:24:10.259
And 21 years, yes, yeah.

433
00:24:10.319 --> 00:24:12.119
And that unbalances it.

434
00:24:12.180 --> 00:24:12.779
Do you know what I mean?

435
00:24:12.839 --> 00:24:16.140
Yeah, it's a, it was just a really terrible idea.

436
00:24:16.200 --> 00:24:18.480
So they don't and what is Sylvester doing?

437
00:24:18.539 --> 00:24:20.339
No, no CG here.

438
00:24:20.400 --> 00:24:22.859
That's just Sylvester.

439
00:24:22.920 --> 00:24:23.400
Yeah.

440
00:24:23.460 --> 00:24:32.519
Clayton Hickman raises a good point about this in one of the DVD special features of, you know, Silver's doing full gurning and Paul's kind of doing, oh, do I have to?

441
00:24:33.539 --> 00:24:36.119
So the vision doesn't quite match.

442
00:24:36.180 --> 00:24:39.539
An old friend of mine, Peter Beckett, did say about this scene at the time.

443
00:24:39.599 --> 00:24:46.980
He's like, I get what they were going for, but you do not equate the rebirth of the hero with a rebirth of a monster.

444
00:24:46.980 --> 00:24:53.940
Because the Frank Whale Frankensteins monster, despite the fact, you know, he's kind to the little girl.

445
00:24:54.000 --> 00:24:59.039
He does throw her in the pond and he is classically seen as monstrous rather than pitiful.

446
00:24:59.099 --> 00:25:12.180
But I mean, I guess what we want to do is a sort of comedy scare thing with Pete, where Pete's been watching a monster come alive and then, you know, so, you know, Paul McGann's playing the role of the pig, you're in aliens.

447
00:25:12.180 --> 00:25:14.160
Yeah, that is true.

448
00:25:17.220 --> 00:25:19.559
Which is a much better story than this.

449
00:25:19.920 --> 00:25:23.940
Oh, but again, this is so nicely directed.

450
00:25:24.000 --> 00:25:27.779
It feels a lot like a reboot of Spearhead from Space.

451
00:25:27.900 --> 00:25:30.000
Well, I think we've said this.

452
00:25:30.059 --> 00:25:31.140
Haven't we said this before?

453
00:25:31.200 --> 00:25:41.160
Both like this reboot Spearhead from Space, and we'll get the scene where he gets his costume, which is a direct ripoff of Spearhead from Space.

454
00:25:41.220 --> 00:25:45.420
And then, of course, Moffatt does that when he relaunches the program with Matt Smith.

455
00:25:45.480 --> 00:25:50.039
He completely rips off, rips off spear.

456
00:25:50.099 --> 00:25:50.700
Shroud.

457
00:25:50.759 --> 00:25:53.220
And you could say Russell does. his Jesus.

458
00:25:53.279 --> 00:25:55.920
Yeah, there's a lot of that.

459
00:25:56.339 --> 00:26:00.240
No, well, I think I think Spearhead from Space is the classic reboot.

460
00:26:00.299 --> 00:26:04.859
And whenever we want to reboot the show, we go back and redo some aspect of Sphere.

461
00:26:04.920 --> 00:26:06.900
And right, Rose does as well.

462
00:26:06.960 --> 00:26:08.160
That wig is horrendous.

463
00:26:08.220 --> 00:26:08.940
It is.

464
00:26:09.000 --> 00:26:14.579
Now, the wig came about because when Paul auditioned and his audition footage does exist and you can see it.

465
00:26:14.640 --> 00:26:20.519
When Paul auditioned, he had long hair and then he had to cut it off for another role and the production team didn't realise.

466
00:26:20.640 --> 00:26:22.680
It wasn't aliens, alien three.

467
00:26:22.740 --> 00:26:23.940
I think it was Alien 3.

468
00:26:24.119 --> 00:26:25.980
I mean, he did that before this.

469
00:26:26.039 --> 00:26:28.319
Well, Alien 3 was 1993.

470
00:26:28.500 --> 00:26:44.220
So I think I think it had been, you know, this was already in its second reboot in 92, that Siegel had joined ambulance, had left coast to coast or green light or whatever they were damn calling themselves this week, gone to someone else, and then gone to ambulance.

471
00:26:44.279 --> 00:26:45.119
That's right.

472
00:26:45.180 --> 00:26:48.240
He was originally with Columbia, which is why the BBC was...

473
00:26:48.359 --> 00:26:50.220
But once he had Spielberg on.

474
00:26:50.279 --> 00:26:55.019
Well, Echo, this was never explained, but apparently cunning fucks.

475
00:26:55.079 --> 00:26:55.859
Yeah, exactly.

476
00:26:55.920 --> 00:26:56.759
Yeah.

477
00:26:56.819 --> 00:26:58.619
And yeah, I never I never understood as well.

478
00:26:58.680 --> 00:27:05.339
But in a later scene, Grace's boss says, I have to keep this hospital open because of course, this is the American healthcare system.

479
00:27:05.400 --> 00:27:06.420
Oh, that'd be it.

480
00:27:06.480 --> 00:27:08.819
I thought maybe it had been taken to the moon by the Jadoon.

481
00:27:10.200 --> 00:27:13.019
Yeah, like yeah, totally.

482
00:27:13.079 --> 00:27:17.700
Like, it's like, why are we walking into this dilapidated part of the hospital?

483
00:27:17.759 --> 00:27:18.359
Like, you know?

484
00:27:18.420 --> 00:27:21.180
Yeah, I mean, I'm already loving McGann. my doctor.

485
00:27:21.960 --> 00:27:24.900
No, I really love it. horrifically here.

486
00:27:24.960 --> 00:27:29.460
He manages to save the execrable.

487
00:27:29.519 --> 00:27:31.559
So imagine how good he'd be with good scripts.

488
00:27:31.680 --> 00:27:33.000
There were 7 mirrors there.

489
00:27:33.059 --> 00:27:35.819
That was a deliberate, that was a deliberate choice.

490
00:27:37.680 --> 00:27:39.900
The peak of humulus?

491
00:27:39.900 --> 00:27:40.799
Castravalva.

492
00:27:40.859 --> 00:27:42.480
It's also the fly.

493
00:27:42.539 --> 00:27:43.440
Yeah, you're right.

494
00:27:43.980 --> 00:27:45.960
And now he's Jesus.

495
00:27:45.960 --> 00:27:50.880
Why hast thou forsaken me on this...

496
00:27:50.880 --> 00:27:52.380
I'm sorry that Hoover film set.

497
00:27:52.440 --> 00:27:53.220
That is so painful.

498
00:27:53.279 --> 00:27:54.660
Oh, yeah.

499
00:27:54.720 --> 00:27:56.460
I mean, well, it's it's hokey.

500
00:27:56.519 --> 00:27:58.200
And it's also the 90s.

501
00:27:58.259 --> 00:27:58.680
Oh, Bruce.

502
00:27:58.799 --> 00:27:59.519
Do you need a tearing?

503
00:28:00.000 --> 00:28:02.400
You've got to, you've got to, oh, bruise.

504
00:28:02.460 --> 00:28:04.619
You need an apple, something on your face.

505
00:28:04.680 --> 00:28:05.039
Yeah.

506
00:28:05.039 --> 00:28:10.500
But yeah, um, Siegel had 1st approached the BBC.

507
00:28:10.500 --> 00:28:13.859
A week before Ghostlight aired.

508
00:28:13.920 --> 00:28:19.440
That is how long Siegel had been developing this ever since Doctor Who went off the air.

509
00:28:19.500 --> 00:28:24.599
Do you know he'd actually been writing test scripts in the 70s as a child, he admits?

510
00:28:24.779 --> 00:28:27.420
Do you know who one of the other people who auditioned?

511
00:28:27.480 --> 00:28:28.079
Have we done this yet?

512
00:28:28.140 --> 00:28:30.599
We thought about listening to the other folk audition for the part.

513
00:28:30.660 --> 00:28:32.880
Peter Capel.aldi?

514
00:28:32.940 --> 00:28:33.359
Yes.

515
00:28:33.420 --> 00:28:36.779
John Sessions, who I would have loved, Tony Slattery.

516
00:28:36.839 --> 00:28:39.000
John Sessions has been in Doctor Who, of course.

517
00:28:39.059 --> 00:28:42.960
He was Gus in Mummy on the Island Express.

518
00:28:43.019 --> 00:28:44.519
Oh, please.

519
00:28:44.579 --> 00:28:45.599
I love John Sessions.

520
00:28:45.660 --> 00:28:48.059
Philip Siegel described that as a kiss to the past.

521
00:28:48.119 --> 00:28:48.599
Sorry, go on.

522
00:28:48.599 --> 00:28:50.579
She's to the part, well, more a belch, really.

523
00:28:51.960 --> 00:28:53.579
Yeah, yeah.

524
00:28:53.640 --> 00:28:57.779
Capaldi has been hovering around just like Segal has for years.

525
00:28:57.839 --> 00:28:59.220
Is it my guy yet?

526
00:28:59.279 --> 00:29:00.000
Is it my guy yet?

527
00:29:00.059 --> 00:29:00.779
And a few years.

528
00:29:00.779 --> 00:29:01.500
Oh, nod.

529
00:29:01.559 --> 00:29:06.420
A few years before this, of course, Capaldi auditioned for Captain Cisco we discovered recently.

530
00:29:08.519 --> 00:29:09.180
It didn't go very far.

531
00:29:09.299 --> 00:29:11.700
He was always getting into drag, wasn't he?

532
00:29:11.759 --> 00:29:20.579
Oh, one of the big names that I think when it was at Amblem that they wanted, and apparently was interested, was Donald Sutherland.

533
00:29:20.640 --> 00:29:22.319
Oh, yeah, that was good for.

534
00:29:22.380 --> 00:29:23.640
Yeah, I think I remember that too.

535
00:29:23.700 --> 00:29:24.779
I liked the movie.

536
00:29:24.839 --> 00:29:27.000
And Caroline Monroe.

537
00:29:27.059 --> 00:29:34.980
Before Paul McGann, because as soon as someone suggested Paul McGann, Philip Siegel said, I watched with Nail and I decided, yes, he was perfect.

538
00:29:35.039 --> 00:29:42.119
But before that, um, Philip Siegel, who insisted it had to be a British actor, uh, his favourite...

539
00:29:42.180 --> 00:29:43.680
That was the main BBC thing, yeah.

540
00:29:43.740 --> 00:29:46.079
His favourite for the role was Michael Crawford.

541
00:29:46.140 --> 00:29:48.839
Yes, they did actually try Michael Crawford.

542
00:29:48.900 --> 00:29:50.279
Yeah, he completely shot.

543
00:29:50.339 --> 00:29:53.460
No, he was going it was going to happen, but he completely destroyed his entire career.

544
00:29:53.519 --> 00:29:54.960
It's a reason you haven't seen him for years.

545
00:29:55.019 --> 00:29:57.420
He was very, very naughty and mouthy.

546
00:29:57.480 --> 00:30:01.259
I thought you were going to say like he fell into the set and it all collapsed.

547
00:30:01.319 --> 00:30:02.579
He kind of fell on top of him.

548
00:30:02.640 --> 00:30:09.779
He had a Kevin Rudd meltdown period on Broadway and off and just being, well, there are many others.

549
00:30:09.839 --> 00:30:12.059
Teresa May's leaders falling off the wall, you know.

550
00:30:12.720 --> 00:30:14.759
Amanda's going to be in for a little bit of a shock.

551
00:30:14.819 --> 00:30:15.420
Yeah.

552
00:30:15.480 --> 00:30:24.059
This was another one of the cuts in the UK, not vision, but the audio coming up was heavily muted.

553
00:30:24.119 --> 00:30:26.400
Oh, is there a sort of crunching noise?

554
00:30:26.519 --> 00:30:27.420
crunching noise, yeah.

555
00:30:27.480 --> 00:30:30.839
Oh, he's expertly billed, isn't he, old Eric?

556
00:30:30.900 --> 00:30:35.700
And I would like to say also they're still together and they do lots of charity work together, these two actors.

557
00:30:35.759 --> 00:30:36.299
Lovely.

558
00:30:36.359 --> 00:30:38.579
Well, is that what they call their acting now, charity?

559
00:30:38.640 --> 00:30:51.599
I have to say, the chemistry between these 2 is fantastic and I want to be married, but really, if the 2 leads, already, one of them is actually, although I love Paul is capturing more attention for me, I think Eric Roberts gets this exactly right for an American audience.

560
00:30:51.599 --> 00:31:01.440
There's lots of homage to the 70s, but he's like a lot of the actors who were living in the UK at the time and had watched it, he's not slavishly trying to follow it, and neither is McGann.

561
00:31:01.500 --> 00:31:04.380
Well, I gather that Eric, he was cast very late.

562
00:31:04.440 --> 00:31:07.019
Oh, this is one of my favourite lines in the film.

563
00:31:11.460 --> 00:31:17.220
And Will Sasso has talked about this film and said, you know, it was my big break.

564
00:31:17.279 --> 00:31:18.420
Casting agent saw me.

565
00:31:18.480 --> 00:31:19.140
I got some jokes.

566
00:31:19.200 --> 00:31:20.279
I got to do slapstick.

567
00:31:20.339 --> 00:31:24.720
We should say for that, we should say... drug reference, we should say...

568
00:31:24.839 --> 00:31:28.140
We should say for the listeners listening to this on the train.

569
00:31:28.259 --> 00:31:35.220
Oh, sorry, the line was Grace says, I don't think the 2nd coming happens here to which Pete replies, do you think he's going to go to a better hospital?

570
00:31:35.940 --> 00:31:38.220
Okay, can we talk the costume?

571
00:31:38.279 --> 00:31:40.200
Oh, it's shockingly bad.

572
00:31:40.259 --> 00:31:43.680
I mean, yeah, it's neo-romantic poets.

573
00:31:43.740 --> 00:31:46.380
Actually, although where was pop music going to go at this time?

574
00:31:46.619 --> 00:31:54.420
But I failed to register the costume as terrifically bad because all I see is the hair.

575
00:31:54.480 --> 00:31:55.980
It is bad.

576
00:31:56.099 --> 00:32:03.900
And they justify the costume in the plot because we found out in an earlier scene, there's a costume party coming up at the hospital, which we'll see later.

577
00:32:03.960 --> 00:32:08.940
It's not like pert we just stealing a particularly camp surgeons sort of cape.

578
00:32:08.940 --> 00:32:10.380
Well, he's actually stolen.

579
00:32:10.440 --> 00:32:11.940
The other...

580
00:32:11.940 --> 00:32:15.539
He's stolen the other morgue attendance costume.

581
00:32:15.599 --> 00:32:19.319
Because the other morgue attendant said earlier on, I'm going as Wild Bill Hickock.

582
00:32:19.380 --> 00:32:21.299
It's the Wild Bill Hickock costume.

583
00:32:21.359 --> 00:32:28.079
I got a local costume shop to remake this costume for my year 10 formal.

584
00:32:28.140 --> 00:32:30.839
It wasn't made out of velvet.

585
00:32:30.900 --> 00:32:31.559
That's gorgeous.

586
00:32:31.619 --> 00:32:33.599
It is...

587
00:32:33.599 --> 00:32:34.920
I was going to say that's sad.

588
00:32:34.980 --> 00:32:36.839
But anyway, it's both.

589
00:32:36.900 --> 00:32:38.700
It's yes.

590
00:32:38.700 --> 00:32:39.839
Do you still have it?

591
00:32:39.900 --> 00:32:41.819
No. no, no, no.

592
00:32:41.880 --> 00:32:47.700
They made it on the proviso that they would then be able to rent it out as a riverboat gambler costume.

593
00:32:47.759 --> 00:32:48.299
Okay, okay.

594
00:32:48.299 --> 00:32:48.599
Yeah.

595
00:32:48.660 --> 00:32:52.140
So it didn't cost any more than a normal rental because they got to keep it.

596
00:32:52.200 --> 00:32:54.299
So is this the same night?

597
00:32:54.359 --> 00:32:56.460
So she's gone in the next morning?

598
00:32:56.519 --> 00:32:58.440
It's the next morning, but she's been there all night.

599
00:32:58.500 --> 00:32:59.460
She hasn't been home.

600
00:32:59.519 --> 00:33:00.180
Yeah.

601
00:33:00.180 --> 00:33:05.519
So when she gets home, Bruce has already cleared all of her stuff out of the apartment.

602
00:33:05.940 --> 00:33:10.980
Brian has taken all his Brian and Simon have both. cleared it out.

603
00:33:12.480 --> 00:33:14.099
Oh, dear.

604
00:33:14.099 --> 00:33:22.680
Well, I think that he's probably having an affair behind her back with a removalist or even a whole bunch of removalists.

605
00:33:22.740 --> 00:33:24.180
I picked that up as well.

606
00:33:24.240 --> 00:33:27.359
I think he's the one that keeps insisting on frocking up and going to Paccini.

607
00:33:27.420 --> 00:33:28.980
Yeah, yeah, yeah. for the ride.

608
00:33:29.039 --> 00:33:30.599
Can we go back to that?

609
00:33:30.660 --> 00:33:36.599
I really found that irritating that the Paccini playing in the surgeon scene this time around when I watched it recently.

610
00:33:36.720 --> 00:33:38.220
Again, it's very ER St.

611
00:33:38.220 --> 00:33:38.640
Elsewhere.

612
00:33:38.700 --> 00:33:42.119
I liked it at the time, but again, it's like, I just kind of rolled my eyes.

613
00:33:42.180 --> 00:33:44.759
They're very heavy handed with the, aren't we gorgeous stuff?

614
00:33:44.819 --> 00:33:47.880
Yeah, yeah, they're right. as you might say.

615
00:33:48.000 --> 00:34:00.359
But I think I think it is wonderful to have a production team who clearly care, not just about wanting to make a good show, but they want, they want to bring it back and they want it.

616
00:34:00.359 --> 00:34:03.059
Hey, stop being a creep.

617
00:34:03.119 --> 00:34:14.880
Yeah, they want it not to be the doctor's searching for his father with the ghost of his grandfather in the crystals of the Tartars, appearing like Jorrell to give him his mission at the start of every hour.

618
00:34:14.940 --> 00:34:15.900
No, no.

619
00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:18.480
I mean, it is it could have been much worse, but it's still bad.

620
00:34:18.539 --> 00:34:19.559
It's still too much.

621
00:34:19.619 --> 00:34:24.179
It's actually a comic strip presents remake of an American classic.

622
00:34:24.239 --> 00:34:31.139
Do you remember that one they did the strike with Arthur Skargill as Al Pacino and Jennifer Saunders as Meryl Streep?

623
00:34:31.199 --> 00:34:32.699
That's what we're seeing right.

624
00:34:32.760 --> 00:34:42.360
I've got to get onto a Harley Davidson and rescue and compound it or imploding mindful shaft full of orphan children before I get into the Land Rover.

625
00:34:42.420 --> 00:34:46.079
I'm glad she's got a Land Rover, like Bambera and all of them.

626
00:34:46.139 --> 00:34:48.960
I'm not back to...

627
00:34:49.019 --> 00:34:50.519
That's also said in 1999.

628
00:34:50.699 --> 00:34:51.420
Oh, okay.

629
00:34:51.900 --> 00:34:53.519
I like this.

630
00:34:53.579 --> 00:34:54.179
I do like this.

631
00:34:54.239 --> 00:34:57.840
Is she the Caroline John of this story that we would have had.

632
00:34:57.900 --> 00:35:00.900
I mean, I'm still feeling we're in a unit car park.

633
00:35:00.960 --> 00:35:03.000
I really wanted her to go with him.

634
00:35:03.059 --> 00:35:09.480
Yeah, I think the only reason she didn't was they didn't know whether it would go to a series and...

635
00:35:09.539 --> 00:35:12.239
That's the other end of Cheryl and Finn, isn't it?

636
00:35:12.300 --> 00:35:14.340
After she does that thing with a cherry stork.

637
00:35:15.059 --> 00:35:17.099
I don't know what that means.

638
00:35:17.159 --> 00:35:18.960
Twin Peaks.

639
00:35:19.619 --> 00:35:20.880
Yeah, the twin peaks, mate.

640
00:35:20.940 --> 00:35:21.960
Oh, 2 hearts. here we go.

641
00:35:22.019 --> 00:35:22.619
More information.

642
00:35:22.679 --> 00:35:23.699
Another great line.

643
00:35:23.760 --> 00:35:25.980
You have to get me out of here before they kill me again.

644
00:35:26.039 --> 00:35:32.880
And the thing is, he just delivers it like, you have to get me out of here before they they stub my toe. really inconvenient.

645
00:35:32.940 --> 00:35:35.099
It's a good moment from Paul, then.

646
00:35:35.159 --> 00:35:35.760
Yeah, yeah.

647
00:35:35.820 --> 00:35:40.440
I find that he has like, for me, it's like Nicole Kidman.

648
00:35:40.500 --> 00:35:49.320
She has these moments of like nothing and then he's Nicole Kidman acting moment, and I find that with Paul, he's the Paul McGann acting moment, but whereas I hate her acting moments, I really like his really...

649
00:35:49.380 --> 00:35:53.219
Well, if you've met Nicole, you might want to expand your opinion.

650
00:35:53.219 --> 00:35:55.860
I've had the displeasure of several times.

651
00:35:55.920 --> 00:35:58.079
Lots of stories which aren't for the podcast.

652
00:35:58.139 --> 00:35:59.519
What's her name?

653
00:35:59.579 --> 00:36:01.199
She's good, isn't she?

654
00:36:01.260 --> 00:36:02.820
The character is called Wheeler.

655
00:36:02.880 --> 00:36:04.559
Now this scene...

656
00:36:04.559 --> 00:36:06.480
She's the Joan Sims of this film, isn't she?

657
00:36:06.539 --> 00:36:07.199
Yeah, she is.

658
00:36:07.260 --> 00:36:13.320
This scene, there was in, there was intended to be a cameo from Silv in this scene when...

659
00:36:13.440 --> 00:36:14.099
Oh, yeah.

660
00:36:14.099 --> 00:36:16.980
I never got this as a kid.

661
00:36:17.099 --> 00:36:25.260
Because in the script and in Gary Russell's novelisation, It explains that the human body cannot contain the time lord energy.

662
00:36:25.320 --> 00:36:31.739
So he is a walking corpse and he is rapidly decaying, which is why he's got this urge that I have to steal the doctor's body.

663
00:36:31.860 --> 00:36:33.480
Is that Anthony Amy's career?

664
00:36:33.539 --> 00:36:34.380
Yes, that's right.

665
00:36:34.440 --> 00:36:37.079
But in this scene, um, the Asian child.

666
00:36:37.139 --> 00:36:39.659
I mean, I'm going to lie. love the way he delivers it.

667
00:36:39.780 --> 00:36:42.960
I also like that he's getting used to the idea of talking through this body.

668
00:36:43.019 --> 00:36:44.639
Yeah, yeah, they're cameos.

669
00:36:44.699 --> 00:36:49.980
That's like the brigadier and Joe Grant and flew them all to Vancouver.

670
00:36:50.159 --> 00:36:53.340
It's pretty confident, isn't it?

671
00:36:53.400 --> 00:37:07.860
But yeah, Bruce was going to be stalking this guy through the corridors of the hospital who looked like Sylv and it was, I gather going to be Sylv in a little bit of makeup, but the idea was it wasn't him, but it was to establish that he, this is the doctor's enemy.

672
00:37:07.920 --> 00:37:12.239
But they dropped it because it would have been an extra scene for Sil.

673
00:37:12.300 --> 00:37:13.920
They already had days cut out of the production.

674
00:37:13.980 --> 00:37:15.300
It was meant to be a 30 day production.

675
00:37:15.360 --> 00:37:20.219
It ended up being 28, but they had cut it back to 24, which.

676
00:37:20.280 --> 00:37:27.119
Jeffrey Sax only agreed to do it because it had longer than the usual telly movie to shoot and then they kept cutting gays and he wasn't impressed.

677
00:37:27.179 --> 00:37:29.699
He liked that sofa. didn't like the telemark.

678
00:37:29.760 --> 00:37:31.619
I like everything about this scene together.

679
00:37:31.679 --> 00:37:34.500
This is one of the doctory moments that made me realise I really like him.

680
00:37:34.559 --> 00:37:35.400
Yeah, yeah.

681
00:37:35.400 --> 00:37:41.519
Well, just because he's actually getting to do stuff just straight to camera without lots of idiot effects going off all around him.

682
00:37:41.579 --> 00:37:43.500
But yeah, he has great charm.

683
00:37:43.559 --> 00:37:45.780
Have you noticed how clever the shooting is to make him.

684
00:37:45.840 --> 00:37:47.039
Oh my lord, you know who that is?

685
00:37:47.099 --> 00:37:49.199
Just in case you missed it.

686
00:37:49.260 --> 00:37:49.800
That's St.

687
00:37:49.800 --> 00:37:50.039
Anne.

688
00:37:50.159 --> 00:37:53.400
That's Leonardo's sketch of Mary's mother.

689
00:37:53.460 --> 00:37:56.699
Just in case you're missing the immaculate conception motif.

690
00:37:56.760 --> 00:37:58.559
Oh, my goodness.

691
00:37:58.619 --> 00:38:01.139
They just beat me around the head with a fricken brick.

692
00:38:02.519 --> 00:38:09.900
In especially this scene where she's trying to come up with all sorts of justifications, but eventually has to accept that he does have 2 hearts.

693
00:38:09.960 --> 00:38:11.219
Scully.

694
00:38:11.340 --> 00:38:18.719
It's quite good in this show, even though she's intensely non, but it's a nice thing to have the doctor meeting people who are just not English.

695
00:38:21.059 --> 00:38:22.980
And also independently intelligent.

696
00:38:23.039 --> 00:38:23.940
Yes, yes.

697
00:38:24.000 --> 00:38:26.340
Which is why she's reminding me of Liz Shaw.

698
00:38:26.400 --> 00:38:28.380
And not just that, yeah. in any ways over.

699
00:38:28.440 --> 00:38:29.519
I'm with Todd.

700
00:38:29.639 --> 00:38:31.139
I actually really like these 2 together.

701
00:38:31.199 --> 00:38:32.880
And what's on the mantlepiece?

702
00:38:32.880 --> 00:38:34.079
I think this is great.

703
00:38:34.139 --> 00:38:36.119
And they're getting to exposition.

704
00:38:36.179 --> 00:38:37.320
Oh, Mr. Clark.

705
00:38:37.500 --> 00:38:39.179
Take 2 drinks.

706
00:38:39.360 --> 00:38:41.579
I'm just misemerized by them.

707
00:38:41.639 --> 00:38:42.960
I have 13 lights.

708
00:38:43.019 --> 00:38:45.539
Another bit of information too much for us.

709
00:38:45.599 --> 00:38:49.320
We need that, and we need that episode's down the track, not now.

710
00:38:49.380 --> 00:38:58.320
Well, the 1st season of Doctor Who, and obviously this wasn't planned, the 1st series, rather, of Doctor Who, has a regeneration at the end, but doesn't mention it.

711
00:38:58.320 --> 00:39:02.280
And I think Russell's Bible says let's not mention regeneration.

712
00:39:02.400 --> 00:39:03.780
Let's not have any of that.

713
00:39:03.840 --> 00:39:07.019
Yeah, let's not throw everything in a garden.

714
00:39:07.139 --> 00:39:09.599
I mean Gallifrey's not even mentioned until when.

715
00:39:09.659 --> 00:39:12.360
The Christmas special with Catherine Tann.

716
00:39:12.420 --> 00:39:12.719
The date.

717
00:39:12.719 --> 00:39:14.519
Yeah, so that mentioned the planet's name.

718
00:39:14.579 --> 00:39:16.079
I mean, that sense.

719
00:39:16.139 --> 00:39:16.320
Yeah.

720
00:39:16.380 --> 00:39:25.619
Now, here where he seems to see into Grace's past, that was a conception of the writer, Matthew Jacobs, son of the gunfighters actor Anthony Jacobs.

721
00:39:25.679 --> 00:39:26.519
I like this.

722
00:39:26.579 --> 00:39:28.559
I like it, the fact that he has these moments.

723
00:39:28.559 --> 00:39:30.119
Yeah, it really worked, didn't it?

724
00:39:30.179 --> 00:39:34.019
That's better than Sylvester McCoy's Malapropisms in time of the Rani anyway.

725
00:39:34.079 --> 00:39:35.880
Well, anything's better than that.

726
00:39:35.940 --> 00:39:49.079
Again, I would recommend to anyone seek out a copy of Gary Russell's novelisation because as Gary put it once, you know, I was adapting a very fast paced 100 minute script.

727
00:39:49.139 --> 00:39:51.360
So I included stuff from the character sketches.

728
00:39:51.360 --> 00:39:56.400
And the character sketch for Grace is the reason she became a doctor is her mother passed away from cancer.

729
00:39:56.519 --> 00:40:01.380
So the whole, and that's the doctor looking into her past, saying it's a childish dream.

730
00:40:01.440 --> 00:40:04.019
Yeah, holding back, holding back.

731
00:40:04.079 --> 00:40:07.380
So he gets the companion moment of discovering the Tartars.

732
00:40:07.440 --> 00:40:08.159
Which is fantastic.

733
00:40:08.219 --> 00:40:11.760
I do see Chang Li as a companion in the mould of Turlo.

734
00:40:11.820 --> 00:40:15.599
And if it had gone to a series, it would have been great if he had gone back and picked up Grayson Chang.

735
00:40:15.719 --> 00:40:17.159
Better Turlo than Adrick.

736
00:40:19.320 --> 00:40:22.079
Okay, how are we feeling about this set?

737
00:40:22.139 --> 00:40:23.940
Now we hear, oh, I should say this TARDIS.

738
00:40:24.000 --> 00:40:25.260
I like it.

739
00:40:25.320 --> 00:40:27.360
I actually really liked it at the time.

740
00:40:27.420 --> 00:40:29.099
You know, like, I think it's pretty good.

741
00:40:29.159 --> 00:40:30.719
It's just not a TARDIS.

742
00:40:30.780 --> 00:40:37.619
Well, it's got a kind of steampunk...

743
00:40:37.679 --> 00:40:46.739
I mean, it is, you know, and the time machine, obviously, you know, like Welles's time machine, which he was obviously pictured reading.

744
00:40:47.340 --> 00:40:49.199
Just in case you missed it.

745
00:40:49.260 --> 00:40:49.980
Yeah, yeah.

746
00:40:50.039 --> 00:40:54.360
Yeah, well, in fact, it was the only way of knowing that you were in a time machine, as Todd pointed out.

747
00:40:54.480 --> 00:40:59.639
Yeah, I like the fact that here you've got, like, you says, the TARDIS really likes you, like making the TARDIS sort of a lie.

748
00:40:59.699 --> 00:41:00.539
But do we really need this?

749
00:41:00.599 --> 00:41:02.280
The audiences don't know what the tartis is.

750
00:41:02.340 --> 00:41:02.880
No, exactly.

751
00:41:03.179 --> 00:41:07.199
Everything is inverted in the wrong in a way that isn't pleasurable.

752
00:41:07.260 --> 00:41:13.679
And this would have been a great moment to have the master do the whole time and relative dimension in space.

753
00:41:13.739 --> 00:41:18.659
It's bigger on the inside than the outside, which would have explained to the audience and been a nice thing for fans to have the master do that.

754
00:41:18.719 --> 00:41:26.460
I just want to say earlier on in this scene, Chang Li immediately recognises Bruce by name, he's got a fantastic memory for a paramedic.

755
00:41:26.519 --> 00:41:27.599
Paramedic guy.

756
00:41:27.659 --> 00:41:29.519
He just he just rode with for like 10 minutes.

757
00:41:30.119 --> 00:41:37.619
And I like, I like, the fact that he's sort of mesmerised by the eyes, a nice nod back to hypnotism.

758
00:41:37.679 --> 00:41:39.300
Yeah.

759
00:41:39.300 --> 00:41:40.800
But you have to really know that, really.

760
00:41:40.860 --> 00:41:50.639
Like, well, I think I think, though, with the popularity of the X-Files, people are used to the ideas of hypnotism, he's got funny eyes now, so he can hypnotise people.

761
00:41:50.699 --> 00:42:02.699
Um, So is the best thing about this. this whole thing is that it's an object lesson to Russell T. Davies, about how not to launch the series.

762
00:42:03.059 --> 00:42:04.260
Well, that's how he describes it.

763
00:42:04.260 --> 00:42:05.579
Do any of these things?

764
00:42:05.639 --> 00:42:08.159
Yeah, he actually... listen to the opposite.

765
00:42:08.219 --> 00:42:09.780
Doctor Who, what not today?

766
00:42:10.860 --> 00:42:17.099
Yeah, I think what I think, though, what saves it is, there are lots of lovely scenes and lots of lovely moments.

767
00:42:17.159 --> 00:42:18.960
And the character work is good.

768
00:42:19.019 --> 00:42:20.099
The direction is good.

769
00:42:20.159 --> 00:42:26.099
It's just, they needed to show the script to someone outside the organisation.

770
00:42:26.159 --> 00:42:30.239
They needed to show the script to someone who had no idea what Doctor Who was.

771
00:42:30.300 --> 00:42:31.079
Yes.

772
00:42:31.079 --> 00:42:35.579
This is a great indication of why Baron Putnam, as he is now.

773
00:42:35.639 --> 00:42:48.780
David Putman left Columbia and went on to, you know, he's now, because he simply said that, you know, he made lovely films like local hero starring Peter Capaldi and all of, you know, and was mates with everyone.

774
00:42:48.840 --> 00:42:52.260
He said, there were too many suits writing the scripts behind us.

775
00:42:52.320 --> 00:42:53.940
We just couldn't get over what we wanted.

776
00:42:54.000 --> 00:42:55.920
We're right in the middle of the heat of that.

777
00:42:55.980 --> 00:43:01.320
But you know that Siegel said that this was his least favourite of the 3 scripts.

778
00:43:01.380 --> 00:43:02.880
He wanted the legally script.

779
00:43:02.940 --> 00:43:03.780
Gosh, did he?

780
00:43:03.900 --> 00:43:10.440
And he's the one that insisted keeping the stuff with the eyes, the mother who's, you know, half human.

781
00:43:10.500 --> 00:43:13.380
Oh, so we have, oh, actually, does anyone else notice that?

782
00:43:13.440 --> 00:43:20.099
We have a time travelling half human who's landed back from the future into San Francisco and where are the whales?

783
00:43:20.699 --> 00:43:22.860
Voyage home, isn't it?

784
00:43:22.920 --> 00:43:30.719
Well, and Leonard Nemoy has another connection to this film process, which I'll talk about in a moment.

785
00:43:30.780 --> 00:43:31.860
That's when that's when you know.

786
00:43:31.860 --> 00:43:34.380
That's a really good moment when he...

787
00:43:34.380 --> 00:43:36.300
How you find him as a doctor, Todd?

788
00:43:36.360 --> 00:43:36.960
Sorry, Brendan.

789
00:43:36.960 --> 00:43:38.159
No, that's all right.

790
00:43:38.219 --> 00:43:40.380
But he's not one of my favourites.

791
00:43:40.440 --> 00:43:41.039
Really?

792
00:43:41.099 --> 00:43:43.199
You haven't had a lot to see for him, have you?

793
00:43:43.260 --> 00:43:47.760
No, a human audio, and so I stopped I stopped listening.

794
00:43:47.820 --> 00:43:48.840
Really?

795
00:43:48.840 --> 00:43:52.800
He was my favourite big finish audio doctor for a long time.

796
00:43:52.860 --> 00:43:55.619
I think his voice is not good for audio.

797
00:43:55.619 --> 00:43:59.880
And so I got to the end of the Charlie audios, if you know the audios.

798
00:43:59.880 --> 00:44:02.280
And then I just went, okay, I will now retire.

799
00:44:02.340 --> 00:44:04.139
Wow, I kind of agree.

800
00:44:04.199 --> 00:44:10.079
I get the impression that he's got so little to work with and no one knows how to rise him.

801
00:44:10.139 --> 00:44:15.000
And the new the new adventures obviously only have one 8th doctor novel, don't they?

802
00:44:15.059 --> 00:44:16.019
Like the very last...

803
00:44:16.019 --> 00:44:17.159
Yeah, the dying dying dying days.

804
00:44:17.219 --> 00:44:19.440
And then BBC...

805
00:44:19.500 --> 00:44:21.480
I got no idea what to do.

806
00:44:21.599 --> 00:44:23.519
Like they don't know what to do with him.

807
00:44:24.119 --> 00:44:33.480
I think that their idea is that he kind of flies by the seat of the pants would be there's a reaction against Sylvester. and he's cheerful or something.

808
00:44:33.599 --> 00:44:36.420
There are some good BBC novels.

809
00:44:36.539 --> 00:44:40.380
Lance Parkins ones, Lloyd Rose's books, I would highly recommend.

810
00:44:40.440 --> 00:44:40.619
Yeah.

811
00:44:40.679 --> 00:44:44.460
There's one thing I would have liked to have seen 13 episodes with him to see.

812
00:44:44.519 --> 00:44:47.340
Like, because he's only got, like, how many minutes in this?

813
00:44:47.400 --> 00:44:49.139
It's what 70 odd minutes?

814
00:44:49.199 --> 00:44:50.940
He's not in it very much either.

815
00:44:51.000 --> 00:44:54.480
And then you've got all this taken up with these guys who, I think, are great together.

816
00:44:54.539 --> 00:44:56.760
Yeah, yeah, that would have been a spinoff.

817
00:44:56.820 --> 00:44:58.559
I would have liked to have seen, yeah.

818
00:44:58.920 --> 00:45:01.199
Paul given the chance to delve more into the character.

819
00:45:01.260 --> 00:45:02.340
There's nice little moments in this.

820
00:45:02.400 --> 00:45:12.719
But you've got a much clearer idea of the ninth doctor by the end of Rose, which is, you know, half the length, a much, much better idea of what he's like.

821
00:45:13.079 --> 00:45:19.739
This stuff here in the Taras Tataras is so big, they'd have to be doing bottle shows inside the TARDIS is part of the series, wouldn't they?

822
00:45:19.800 --> 00:45:23.699
Well, here's I think standing set, just, yeah.

823
00:45:23.760 --> 00:45:30.179
So, um, Matthew Jacobs wrote in the Cloister Room as the place where the eye of Harmony is, right?

824
00:45:30.239 --> 00:45:30.900
Great.

825
00:45:30.960 --> 00:45:33.599
Now, he didn't he didn't he didn't describe it.

826
00:45:33.659 --> 00:45:43.739
He didn't describe it much because in a lot of American film scripts apparently, you don't describe the set unless you have to.

827
00:45:43.800 --> 00:45:45.179
That's the job of the set designer.

828
00:45:45.239 --> 00:45:49.260
I think that's actually all going back to Terry Nation's big white room.

829
00:45:49.320 --> 00:45:54.719
But don't we have, don't we sort of have the eye of harmony-esque thing in journey to the centre of the Tatars or something like that?

830
00:45:54.780 --> 00:45:56.400
Isn't there some energy source down the bottom?

831
00:45:56.519 --> 00:45:57.239
I've forgotten.

832
00:45:57.300 --> 00:45:59.039
I blanked that one out.

833
00:45:59.099 --> 00:45:59.820
It was terrible.

834
00:45:59.880 --> 00:46:00.780
But it's a not to this.

835
00:46:00.840 --> 00:46:01.980
They sort of link it to this.

836
00:46:02.039 --> 00:46:08.880
Matthew Jacobs did write this as it's a link to the Eye of Harmony, not the original and in script editing.

837
00:46:09.000 --> 00:46:09.960
They just simplified it.

838
00:46:10.019 --> 00:46:18.119
But the other thing was, he wrote it as the small kind of room we see in Lagopolis because a cloister room is a small room.

839
00:46:18.179 --> 00:46:21.360
Well, it's a room that has a colonnade around it.

840
00:46:21.420 --> 00:46:21.780
Exactly.

841
00:46:21.840 --> 00:46:24.179
Yeah, because the cloister's just your veranda, right?

842
00:46:24.239 --> 00:46:34.320
Yeah, and apparently, I don't know what his original scripted ending was, but the new ending, but his original scripted ending didn't involve the fight we get in the cloister room later.

843
00:46:34.320 --> 00:46:39.780
But I love a slap. didn't you want to see Teagan go full on handbags with Tom in that one, I did.

844
00:46:39.900 --> 00:46:40.860
But that's the thing.

845
00:46:40.920 --> 00:46:46.380
They called him and said, right, we need a fight, a big action fight in the console in the cloister room at the end of the show.

846
00:46:46.440 --> 00:46:55.079
And he said, but how do you have a big action fight in the cloister room, but close to room's tiny, and apparently Jeffrey Sachs just said to him, it's not anymore.

847
00:46:55.619 --> 00:46:59.400
Because they couldn't afford to fly the writer up to Vancouver.

848
00:46:59.460 --> 00:47:00.480
Does this make any sense?

849
00:47:00.599 --> 00:47:05.760
Only if it is Janet Fielding inside that big stone bubble.

850
00:47:05.820 --> 00:47:07.260
Thankfully, um...

851
00:47:07.320 --> 00:47:11.039
As you know, Jenna, was Paul's agent and advised him against doing this wrong.

852
00:47:11.099 --> 00:47:12.480
Exactly where I'm coming from.

853
00:47:12.539 --> 00:47:13.199
Thank you, Todd.

854
00:47:13.260 --> 00:47:14.460
Yeah, good honour.

855
00:47:14.760 --> 00:47:19.380
Oh, a kiss, a kiss, fan voice, a...

856
00:47:19.380 --> 00:47:21.420
After we've seen what's coming out of Bruce's mouth.

857
00:47:21.480 --> 00:47:23.519
And now she's ecstatic.

858
00:47:23.579 --> 00:47:24.840
Obviously Brian didn't do it for her.

859
00:47:25.559 --> 00:47:28.320
Brian was busy with Simon the whole time.

860
00:47:28.380 --> 00:47:29.760
Hi guys.

861
00:47:29.820 --> 00:47:39.840
Now, the thing is, I, okay, you know, as a 12-year-old boy, I had absolutely no problem with those 2 kisses, because the 1st one, the 1st one is he's overcome with emotion.

862
00:47:39.900 --> 00:47:41.760
They were going to talk about the outfit.

863
00:47:41.820 --> 00:47:43.079
Yeah, it's fabulous.

864
00:47:43.079 --> 00:47:44.880
Are they going to do all the doctors in that thing?

865
00:47:44.940 --> 00:47:45.599
Like all of them?

866
00:47:45.659 --> 00:47:47.340
They were going to.

867
00:47:47.340 --> 00:47:48.000
They were going to.

868
00:47:48.000 --> 00:47:51.960
And they could they just couldn't make it work with archive footage to get the 3D effects.

869
00:47:52.019 --> 00:47:54.239
And that's why that's why they didn't do it.

870
00:47:54.300 --> 00:47:56.460
But yeah, Silv's out 1st in this is so much better.

871
00:47:56.519 --> 00:48:00.059
And when Silv agreed to come back, he said to Philip Siegel.

872
00:48:00.119 --> 00:48:04.619
Look, about the costume and Philip Siegel said, look, can we get rid of the question mark, pull over?

873
00:48:04.679 --> 00:48:05.159
I hate.

874
00:48:05.219 --> 00:48:06.599
Okay, here it is.

875
00:48:06.659 --> 00:48:07.260
Yeah.

876
00:48:07.320 --> 00:48:09.119
How does it, why, this doesn't, what?

877
00:48:09.179 --> 00:48:09.900
Why, where, what?

878
00:48:09.960 --> 00:48:12.780
Okay, I have a reconning fan theory about this.

879
00:48:12.840 --> 00:48:15.000
Please do it now. doctor is half human.

880
00:48:15.059 --> 00:48:22.320
The 8th doctor is half human because before he went in for the operation, he was given a blood transfusion. right.

881
00:48:22.380 --> 00:48:23.940
But that's exactly right.

882
00:48:23.940 --> 00:48:38.460
There's a reference to it in the series finale for series one where someone accuses the Daleks of being half human and they reply that is blasphemy and that's a reference to fan reaction to this revelation.

883
00:48:38.519 --> 00:48:46.199
But, but, but Russell also covered that when he said when Chris Eccleston said, I can turn into, you know, there was that line that I can become anything.

884
00:48:46.320 --> 00:48:49.980
I might have 2 eds or no ed or another species.

885
00:48:50.039 --> 00:48:59.460
But the meta crisis at the end of series 4 says that there's never been a half human, the human time Lord hybrid and that makes no sense.

886
00:49:00.300 --> 00:49:02.340
Just have another go.

887
00:49:02.400 --> 00:49:03.480
The German military.

888
00:49:03.480 --> 00:49:04.320
What was Todd going to say?

889
00:49:04.440 --> 00:49:05.280
No, no, no.

890
00:49:05.340 --> 00:49:07.500
We just had a whole lot of info dump in this scene.

891
00:49:08.099 --> 00:49:10.619
Nonfancy be going, what the hell is this?

892
00:49:10.679 --> 00:49:13.920
Yeah, I mean, he's finally exterminated by the Daleks. casual if you're right.

893
00:49:13.980 --> 00:49:14.940
I just keep going back.

894
00:49:15.000 --> 00:49:17.340
This kind of works for the UK because it's a continuation.

895
00:49:17.460 --> 00:49:20.880
Yeah, I don't think it does after sort of 7 years.

896
00:49:20.940 --> 00:49:23.280
You know, like, I don't see why that works in the UK.

897
00:49:23.340 --> 00:49:24.659
It looks pretty.

898
00:49:25.139 --> 00:49:27.780
Well, there's enough fans to know that it knows.

899
00:49:27.840 --> 00:49:41.519
The thing is, though, 1993, we had dimensions in time, which, even though it was only 15 minutes, was very heavily publicised, also 1992 to 1994, Alan Yentob pushed and pushed and pushed and got reruns happening on the ACC 2.

900
00:49:41.639 --> 00:49:46.139
You've got to remember that's now 1987 because of Brendan's...

901
00:49:46.139 --> 00:49:47.280
My unit dating period.

902
00:49:47.460 --> 00:49:47.880
Right.

903
00:49:47.880 --> 00:49:52.920
Because of Su Tech leaving the back door open and all everything rushing back.

904
00:49:53.039 --> 00:49:53.699
A bit of laughter.

905
00:49:53.760 --> 00:49:56.280
There was horrible interlacing in that shot of grace running inside.

906
00:49:56.400 --> 00:49:57.179
I don't know how that happened.

907
00:49:58.380 --> 00:49:59.760
Sorry.

908
00:49:59.880 --> 00:50:01.139
Clock.

909
00:50:02.039 --> 00:50:04.380
It's getting my shit now.

910
00:50:04.440 --> 00:50:07.019
Nothing left, listeners, nothing left.

911
00:50:07.500 --> 00:50:10.920
Stick we've seen before, big, big trouble, little China.

912
00:50:11.159 --> 00:50:13.079
Terminator.

913
00:50:13.199 --> 00:50:15.059
Lordy, here we go.

914
00:50:15.119 --> 00:50:20.039
Oh, but as you've always said, Richard, Doctor Who is at its best when it's doing other things.

915
00:50:20.940 --> 00:50:25.980
Also, yes, but it still needs to have a heart of knowing word and who it is itself.

916
00:50:26.039 --> 00:50:27.000
This isn't Doctor Who.

917
00:50:27.059 --> 00:50:35.760
This is just a lot of other things with the X-Files, and I would also say Scarecrow, Mrs. King. rather than the Avengers, which was a big show.

918
00:50:35.820 --> 00:50:41.400
But it's also borrowing just as the Avengers did, borrowing from Nick and Nora Charles and the Thin Man series.

919
00:50:41.460 --> 00:50:48.179
It's just a lovely the pairing thing, but there's nothing really in this that tells me it's Doctor Who other than slapping me in the face with a wet-eyed fish.

920
00:50:48.300 --> 00:50:49.019
Yeah, yeah.

921
00:50:49.619 --> 00:50:52.980
Why did not Gallifrey, Time Lords, 13 live sort of stuff?

922
00:50:53.099 --> 00:50:54.059
Why midnight?

923
00:50:54.119 --> 00:50:54.960
Yeah, midnight.

924
00:50:55.019 --> 00:50:57.179
Yeah, because it gets saucy then.

925
00:50:57.239 --> 00:50:58.679
Well, dramatic plot purposes.

926
00:50:58.739 --> 00:51:03.059
Not many people know that midnight happens at the same time all around the world.

927
00:51:03.119 --> 00:51:07.019
Hang on, when did Greenwich mean move to San Francisco?

928
00:51:07.079 --> 00:51:08.099
Slash ramp.

929
00:51:08.159 --> 00:51:08.460
Yeah.

930
00:51:08.519 --> 00:51:10.619
We loved that at the time, didn't we?

931
00:51:10.679 --> 00:51:13.019
What about other people are experiencing?

932
00:51:13.079 --> 00:51:26.159
This, for me, this is the moment when I was a 12 years old, where I just went, yep, here's the doctor now. this line coming up that he just delivers it with such utter sincerity.

933
00:51:26.219 --> 00:51:30.599
Brendan does grace his eyebrow beautifully too. still do that.

934
00:51:34.079 --> 00:51:38.159
Doctor, I love you, and we only have 3 hours left to save the earth.

935
00:51:39.840 --> 00:51:50.039
I think that it's a nod to the time scanner in image of the fender, which will destroy the planet in exactly 100 hours after they start operating.

936
00:51:50.219 --> 00:51:50.940
Lip.

937
00:51:50.940 --> 00:51:52.739
Lip.

938
00:51:52.800 --> 00:51:53.400
Oh wait, no.

939
00:51:53.460 --> 00:51:55.079
That's what I weigh.

940
00:51:55.559 --> 00:51:57.659
Again, is very small.

941
00:51:57.719 --> 00:51:59.280
It's got...

942
00:51:59.280 --> 00:52:00.480
That was the other thing I was going to say.

943
00:52:00.539 --> 00:52:04.619
Have you noticed how much time they're spending trying to shoot him to make him look taller?

944
00:52:04.860 --> 00:52:06.659
In every shot.

945
00:52:06.719 --> 00:52:09.119
He's the same height as silve, if not a little shorter.

946
00:52:09.179 --> 00:52:13.679
He, I believe he is 3 foot two. 5 foot eight.

947
00:52:13.739 --> 00:52:14.820
No, he's not.

948
00:52:14.880 --> 00:52:15.059
No.

949
00:52:15.119 --> 00:52:15.420
No?

950
00:52:15.420 --> 00:52:18.719
Like, here's a nod to Russell does as well.

951
00:52:18.780 --> 00:52:21.119
Like, you know, he has the American news readers, you know?

952
00:52:21.119 --> 00:52:22.019
Trinity Wells.

953
00:52:22.079 --> 00:52:22.980
Yeah, love her.

954
00:52:23.579 --> 00:52:32.579
See, you know, in when we get Doctor Who coming back for the new series, in the UK, they use real British newsreaders.

955
00:52:32.579 --> 00:52:37.679
They look too similar in the face.

956
00:52:37.739 --> 00:52:40.679
Oh my God, their brother and sister.

957
00:52:40.920 --> 00:52:43.500
No, well, Star Wars again.

958
00:52:43.559 --> 00:52:45.659
But...

959
00:52:45.659 --> 00:52:46.739
Here's Reba McIntyre.

960
00:52:46.800 --> 00:52:54.599
Because America has so many local and regionalised TV networks, you'd never know if they were real news readers.

961
00:52:54.659 --> 00:52:55.019
There it is.

962
00:52:55.019 --> 00:52:57.599
Oh, hang on.

963
00:52:57.659 --> 00:52:58.199
I was right.

964
00:52:58.260 --> 00:53:00.000
It is meantime in San Francisco.

965
00:53:00.059 --> 00:53:03.000
No, they're switching meantime to San Francisco tonight.

966
00:53:03.059 --> 00:53:05.400
Because it's the America.

967
00:53:06.300 --> 00:53:11.340
Most accurate atomic clock, atomic clock, atomic clock in the world.

968
00:53:11.579 --> 00:53:15.480
And so the doctor has to steal it to make the TARDIS work.

969
00:53:17.159 --> 00:53:19.139
Wasn't it working before?

970
00:53:19.199 --> 00:53:23.039
Well, remember there was the critical timing malfunction because Bruce...

971
00:53:23.039 --> 00:53:26.579
Splooshed all over the console.

972
00:53:26.639 --> 00:53:27.239
Yeah, fair enough.

973
00:53:28.679 --> 00:53:34.019
I guess that's why the doctor hasn't had a teenage male companion.

974
00:53:34.079 --> 00:53:36.780
He's suitably mincy, isn't he?

975
00:53:36.840 --> 00:53:37.619
Our master.

976
00:53:37.739 --> 00:53:38.400
Oh my god.

977
00:53:38.400 --> 00:53:38.940
Our Bruce.

978
00:53:39.000 --> 00:53:43.019
There's a hell of a lot of pork mince in his performance.

979
00:53:43.079 --> 00:53:51.000
He kind of nails it without having really seen the... without having seen the show before, but I mean, the mask is such a thin character.

980
00:53:51.539 --> 00:53:53.340
Yeah, well, yeah.

981
00:53:53.340 --> 00:54:00.420
Yeah, in the in the electronic crest kit interviews for this, Eric Roberts says, I don't know much about the character, but...

982
00:54:00.420 --> 00:54:02.039
I know a lot about Tilly Biogenesis.

983
00:54:02.099 --> 00:54:05.820
But he said, you know, he's the archetypal villain.

984
00:54:05.880 --> 00:54:06.599
He's the bad guy.

985
00:54:06.659 --> 00:54:07.980
He's the guy in the black hat.

986
00:54:08.039 --> 00:54:10.079
So you've just got to play it totally evil.

987
00:54:10.139 --> 00:54:11.639
And keep it.

988
00:54:11.699 --> 00:54:13.500
Yeah, keep it thin and keep it light.

989
00:54:13.559 --> 00:54:20.219
And there's a line coming up here that he suggested, which showed that, you know, that he was taking the script seriously.

990
00:54:20.280 --> 00:54:23.039
His response here tells you.

991
00:54:23.099 --> 00:54:27.119
That was Eric Roberts and his rationale was, this is a British character.

992
00:54:27.179 --> 00:54:31.139
He would correct an American's grammar, even though I'm American.

993
00:54:31.440 --> 00:54:35.579
He's also ended 3 sentences with a preposition before that moment.

994
00:54:35.639 --> 00:54:36.539
Nothing wrongly counting.

995
00:54:36.599 --> 00:54:38.460
Chicken's chicken.

996
00:54:38.519 --> 00:54:39.000
Hang on.

997
00:54:39.000 --> 00:54:40.079
The chickens?

998
00:54:40.139 --> 00:54:42.780
It was a chicken truck that overtook Jagarov.

999
00:54:42.840 --> 00:54:45.780
I'm having to eat the chicken. having a Gary Gillett moment now.

1000
00:54:45.840 --> 00:54:47.219
Oh my god.

1001
00:54:47.280 --> 00:54:48.960
Oh, that's just not good.

1002
00:54:49.019 --> 00:54:51.059
Well we know the answer for that question.

1003
00:54:53.519 --> 00:54:55.079
What is it?

1004
00:54:55.139 --> 00:54:58.019
Alien blood from, well, aliens.

1005
00:54:58.079 --> 00:54:59.639
Blood is a word.

1006
00:54:59.760 --> 00:55:01.380
Oh, I've always wondered.

1007
00:55:01.380 --> 00:55:02.099
I can't be injured.

1008
00:55:02.159 --> 00:55:04.199
I've always wondered what that line was.

1009
00:55:04.260 --> 00:55:06.480
I thought he said I was just beginning to like it.

1010
00:55:06.539 --> 00:55:08.340
Get it off me, get it off me.

1011
00:55:09.239 --> 00:55:15.420
Ah, so what he's saying is because his body's deteriorating, he has to recover quickly.

1012
00:55:15.480 --> 00:55:18.780
That makes sense by eating paper towels, it seems.

1013
00:55:18.840 --> 00:55:19.800
Wow.

1014
00:55:19.800 --> 00:55:22.559
And this seems...

1015
00:55:22.619 --> 00:55:24.239
There's a moment that's about to come up here.

1016
00:55:24.300 --> 00:55:26.820
Well, I actually think Paul McGinn becomes the doctor and I...

1017
00:55:26.820 --> 00:55:28.440
Yeah, I have... though.

1018
00:55:28.500 --> 00:55:31.199
No, I like what he threatens to shoot himself in the hair.

1019
00:55:31.260 --> 00:55:34.139
He's just trying to think, oh, please, no, come on.

1020
00:55:34.199 --> 00:55:36.840
I know we're in America, but it doesn't have to all be gum.

1021
00:55:36.960 --> 00:55:42.059
No, but for an American audience, they would expect the hero to take the take the gun and turn it on the cops.

1022
00:55:42.119 --> 00:55:43.559
So it tells the American audience.

1023
00:55:43.619 --> 00:55:44.940
No, this is a different kind of hero.

1024
00:55:45.000 --> 00:55:47.039
But I agree with you, Todd.

1025
00:55:47.099 --> 00:55:54.000
I think it's a very doctor-ish moment and especially also coming up right now where Grace is arguing with him. excuse me.

1026
00:55:54.119 --> 00:55:54.719
This is a lovely one.

1027
00:55:54.840 --> 00:56:00.000
Importantly, while the gun is producing any of the cop now, which I don't like.

1028
00:56:00.119 --> 00:56:01.260
His finger is off the trigger.

1029
00:56:01.320 --> 00:56:04.139
It's hard to see, but yeah..

1030
00:56:04.199 --> 00:56:06.239
I was just unexpected that he would pull it on himself.

1031
00:56:06.300 --> 00:56:11.940
Like, and I just thought there's a very doctorary thing to do and have this argument with the companion and I felt it was a bit doctor-ish.

1032
00:56:12.000 --> 00:56:12.360
Yeah.

1033
00:56:12.420 --> 00:56:22.079
And there's a cut moment coming up right here where after she shoots it and says, give him the keys, the cop starts arguing again, and the whole crowd goes, give him the keys.

1034
00:56:23.820 --> 00:56:26.219
Oh, yeah, it doesn't work.

1035
00:56:26.280 --> 00:56:30.239
It's totally stupid, but it's very Doctor Who, but it's totally stupid.

1036
00:56:30.300 --> 00:56:31.260
Chickens.

1037
00:56:31.320 --> 00:56:31.679
Yep.

1038
00:56:31.739 --> 00:56:33.059
Delicious chickens.

1039
00:56:33.179 --> 00:56:38.820
There is a line they thankfully cut out here where Changli goes up on the sidewalk.

1040
00:56:38.880 --> 00:56:40.139
I can say that because it's American.

1041
00:56:40.199 --> 00:56:42.840
He says, don't mess with an Asian driver.

1042
00:56:42.900 --> 00:56:44.460
Oh, please.

1043
00:56:44.460 --> 00:56:46.739
And I don't I don't even think that made it to the set.

1044
00:56:46.800 --> 00:56:47.699
Good.

1045
00:56:47.699 --> 00:56:47.940
Yeah.

1046
00:56:48.119 --> 00:56:51.780
And now we have the obligatory chase.

1047
00:56:51.840 --> 00:56:55.079
And look, I mean, Doctor Who has had car chases before.

1048
00:56:55.139 --> 00:57:00.000
They've obviously not been as good as this. just a budget leap from the wheelchair, isn't it?

1049
00:57:00.059 --> 00:57:01.079
Yeah, exactly.

1050
00:57:01.860 --> 00:57:04.320
And the trike and the Ogrons.

1051
00:57:04.380 --> 00:57:05.760
Run a private road now.

1052
00:57:05.820 --> 00:57:07.139
Is that how they do it?

1053
00:57:07.199 --> 00:57:08.280
No, I don't well, I don't know.

1054
00:57:08.340 --> 00:57:09.539
Because there's no one else here.

1055
00:57:09.599 --> 00:57:14.699
I believe it is a closed loop that was built in Vancouver to use for TV shows.

1056
00:57:14.760 --> 00:57:17.880
I think I say breathe in when things like that happen.

1057
00:57:17.940 --> 00:57:23.820
I think that's another one of the, you know, lines from Doctor Who that...

1058
00:57:23.880 --> 00:57:26.280
Yeah, yeah.

1059
00:57:26.340 --> 00:57:26.880
Probably.

1060
00:57:28.139 --> 00:57:29.820
Oh, dear.

1061
00:57:29.820 --> 00:57:33.239
It does look better than Doctor Who's.

1062
00:57:33.300 --> 00:57:33.900
It's gorgeous.

1063
00:57:33.960 --> 00:57:34.920
It's just not Doctor Who.

1064
00:57:34.980 --> 00:57:35.280
No.

1065
00:57:35.280 --> 00:57:37.320
It's sweet.

1066
00:57:37.380 --> 00:57:45.000
I'm having a lot of nostalgia for my slim what was then remainder of my youth in the 90s because everything in the 90s looked like this.

1067
00:57:45.059 --> 00:57:46.619
Every American show.

1068
00:57:46.679 --> 00:57:49.320
That's that's Frasier and Niles.

1069
00:57:49.500 --> 00:57:52.800
I always call it like Dr. Queen Medicine Woman.

1070
00:57:52.920 --> 00:57:55.980
So I go with Doctor Who Magic Man or whatever it happens to be.

1071
00:57:56.039 --> 00:57:57.900
They're the credits that I want for this.

1072
00:57:57.960 --> 00:57:58.619
I don't know.

1073
00:57:58.679 --> 00:58:00.599
Of course, Philip...

1074
00:58:00.599 --> 00:58:01.260
That's so grainy.

1075
00:58:01.320 --> 00:58:02.159
Is that because of the...

1076
00:58:02.159 --> 00:58:03.960
It is shot or shot on film.

1077
00:58:04.019 --> 00:58:12.179
It is all shot on film, but mastered and edited on Digibita, which is why the Blu-ray of this is not a true film conversion.

1078
00:58:12.239 --> 00:58:13.920
It's an upscale.

1079
00:58:13.980 --> 00:58:21.119
And there has been a campaign for years to go back to the original film negatives which do exist, but much like DS9 and Voyager, Blue Room.

1080
00:58:21.780 --> 00:58:24.239
Well, it would just be too expensive to do the digital effects.

1081
00:58:25.079 --> 00:58:27.840
Yeah, not that many people like this.

1082
00:58:27.900 --> 00:58:31.079
Yeah, it's it's and you know, is that dim?

1083
00:58:31.139 --> 00:58:31.559
No.

1084
00:58:32.099 --> 00:58:34.199
It's Terry Walsh.

1085
00:58:34.260 --> 00:58:35.699
I wish.

1086
00:58:35.760 --> 00:58:40.980
And apparently, Grace saying not again was designed as a tribute to Douglas Adams.

1087
00:58:40.980 --> 00:58:45.960
As is the later line from the master, life is wasted on the living.

1088
00:58:46.019 --> 00:58:48.179
I need the right guy and he's from another planet.

1089
00:58:48.300 --> 00:58:52.260
But still, you'll make the choice not to go with him, you silly one.

1090
00:58:52.320 --> 00:58:53.639
He's not the right guy.

1091
00:58:53.699 --> 00:58:55.559
Oh, that is really grainy, isn't it?

1092
00:58:55.619 --> 00:58:56.579
Terrible.

1093
00:58:56.639 --> 00:58:57.900
Yeah, it's not really, yeah.

1094
00:58:57.900 --> 00:59:00.239
And that's cribbed from a Sarah Jane line.

1095
00:59:00.300 --> 00:59:00.659
I sure.

1096
00:59:00.719 --> 00:59:03.480
Sarah at one point says, well, I don't, yeah, I've only got one life.

1097
00:59:03.539 --> 00:59:04.559
So you try and remember that.

1098
00:59:05.460 --> 00:59:07.500
No, that was it.

1099
00:59:07.559 --> 00:59:09.179
I've only got one life and I've had enough already.

1100
00:59:09.239 --> 00:59:11.039
Is it Victor?

1101
00:59:11.039 --> 00:59:13.139
Sorry, Victor.

1102
00:59:14.880 --> 00:59:17.280
Excellent work, Grace.

1103
00:59:18.059 --> 00:59:20.219
Where are the chocolate fame?

1104
00:59:20.280 --> 00:59:21.239
No, only in the 1st minute.

1105
00:59:21.300 --> 00:59:21.900
I want them.

1106
00:59:21.960 --> 00:59:24.239
Only they are again as hats.

1107
00:59:24.360 --> 00:59:27.119
But like there's no monsters.

1108
00:59:27.179 --> 00:59:30.239
You relaunch the series and you decide we're not going to do monsters.

1109
00:59:30.360 --> 00:59:33.000
Grace's jawlines shot at a certain angle.

1110
00:59:33.059 --> 00:59:34.380
It's terrifying, me.

1111
00:59:34.679 --> 00:59:36.420
Oh, the Gareth joke.

1112
00:59:36.480 --> 00:59:40.139
We need to cover over the character of Gareth and why the Gareth joke is so hilarious.

1113
00:59:40.199 --> 00:59:43.260
We're just about to meet Gareth, that ain't Gareth right there.

1114
00:59:43.320 --> 00:59:45.960
Do we all remember in a fix with Santarans?

1115
00:59:46.019 --> 00:59:46.980
Oh, yes, of course.

1116
00:59:47.039 --> 00:59:47.699
Yes.

1117
00:59:47.760 --> 00:59:50.460
Oh, that little Doctor Who skit.

1118
00:59:50.519 --> 00:59:52.619
Yeah, that's Gareth Jenkins, the child.

1119
00:59:52.679 --> 00:59:54.900
This is meant to be Gareth Jenkins coming up right now.

1120
00:59:54.960 --> 00:59:55.500
Really?

1121
00:59:56.039 --> 00:59:57.659
Yep, that's why he's called Gareth.

1122
00:59:57.719 --> 01:00:00.179
And harsh but fair.

1123
01:00:00.300 --> 01:00:09.719
Yeah, on, if, if you haven't already bought the 2 doctors on DVD, you will not find interfix with Santaris on any future editions of it.

1124
01:00:09.780 --> 01:00:12.239
It has been reissued because of Jimmy Savile, yeah.

1125
01:00:12.300 --> 01:00:16.019
Because of John Fielding, she's been completely excised from humanity.

1126
01:00:16.079 --> 01:00:17.699
Yeah, I know her hair.

1127
01:00:17.760 --> 01:00:18.960
I believe that one.

1128
01:00:19.019 --> 01:00:20.280
I believe that...

1129
01:00:20.280 --> 01:00:23.880
Oh, it's very dynasty on a...

1130
01:00:23.940 --> 01:00:25.920
Colby's is very cold.

1131
01:00:25.980 --> 01:00:30.300
Is it worth pointing out that the year 2000 on the thing looks like a coiled snake?

1132
01:00:30.360 --> 01:00:32.880
Oh, the nicely mean there.

1133
01:00:32.940 --> 01:00:34.260
There's the monster.

1134
01:00:35.460 --> 01:00:38.400
Philip Segal famously said at conventions.

1135
01:00:38.460 --> 01:00:44.579
The reason we're not doing monsters is because we would only have the budget to do 2 monster suits and I don't think that's effective.

1136
01:00:44.639 --> 01:00:47.579
Well, that never worked in Doctor Who before, did it?

1137
01:00:47.639 --> 01:01:00.179
That's why in the dying days, which is the only Virgin New Adventures, 8th doctor novel, Lance Parkin, wrote it that only 2 Itharias ever appear in any scene any time.

1138
01:01:00.239 --> 01:01:01.739
Just to prove that it could have worked.

1139
01:01:01.860 --> 01:01:03.239
Is this guy in the opening credits?

1140
01:01:04.320 --> 01:01:06.360
I don't believe so.

1141
01:01:06.420 --> 01:01:09.000
Then who are those last 2 names in the opening credits?

1142
01:01:09.059 --> 01:01:14.579
They were the cardiologists who assist Grace and the head of the hospital, I believe.

1143
01:01:14.699 --> 01:01:15.539
Oh, okay.

1144
01:01:15.599 --> 01:01:17.519
I always thought he got a credit and I thought, why?

1145
01:01:17.579 --> 01:01:18.000
But anyway.

1146
01:01:18.599 --> 01:01:20.460
So...

1147
01:01:20.460 --> 01:01:23.219
Oh, Lord.

1148
01:01:23.280 --> 01:01:25.679
Yeah, Professor Wag, just then, was.

1149
01:01:25.679 --> 01:01:28.559
Dave, um, Hertebees.

1150
01:01:29.699 --> 01:01:38.039
So, yeah, John Novak was Salinger, who was the assistant cardiologist and Michael David Sims was Dr. Swift.

1151
01:01:38.099 --> 01:01:40.199
Was that the head of the hospital?

1152
01:01:40.320 --> 01:01:40.860
The head of the hospital.

1153
01:01:40.980 --> 01:01:43.860
Yeah, nice to see me. seen him do other things before in his TV shows.

1154
01:01:43.920 --> 01:02:05.519
I mean, I can't tell you how incredible this seemed at the time, where we're on in an actual building, like, you know, which we did, you know, maybe twice in the classic series, you know, you know, inside the house in Silver Nemesis or inside the church, in Curse of Fenrich, but basically, if we were in a building, we used to be in a BBC studio.

1155
01:02:05.579 --> 01:02:14.280
And here it's a huge massive building that they've spent stacks of money redressing and it looks great and it looks fabulously futury.

1156
01:02:14.340 --> 01:02:16.500
So here's Gareth Jenkins.

1157
01:02:16.619 --> 01:02:18.659
I do think it looks gorgeous.

1158
01:02:18.780 --> 01:02:28.619
Because, of course, in in a Fix with Son Torrance, we're told that in about 15 years from when this film is set, the Gareth Jenkins will repel us on Tara an invasion.

1159
01:02:28.679 --> 01:02:31.380
I never realised he was meant to be Gareth Jenkins.

1160
01:02:31.440 --> 01:02:35.219
But yeah, the idea is he meets the doctor and goes on to predict earthquake.

1161
01:02:35.280 --> 01:02:38.940
I like his, like, answer the 2nd question, not the 3rd thing.

1162
01:02:39.000 --> 01:02:40.320
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1163
01:02:40.380 --> 01:02:41.760
That is cute.

1164
01:02:41.880 --> 01:02:42.360
Yeah.

1165
01:02:42.420 --> 01:02:44.760
Jelly babies, do we really have to keep bringing them up?

1166
01:02:45.360 --> 01:02:47.639
But gobstoppers.

1167
01:02:47.699 --> 01:02:49.260
Plus, Patrick Trout in love.

1168
01:02:49.320 --> 01:02:51.300
In America, they don't have jelly babies.

1169
01:02:51.360 --> 01:02:53.820
He likes other men's wives.

1170
01:02:54.239 --> 01:02:56.940
They do now, of course, but yeah.

1171
01:02:57.000 --> 01:03:04.139
But, you know, they've mentioned jelly babies a few times in the new series, but it's not really been the thing it is here.

1172
01:03:09.000 --> 01:03:13.380
Now, earlier on, I mentioned an involvement from Leonard Nemoy.

1173
01:03:13.860 --> 01:03:16.440
Now, when...

1174
01:03:16.440 --> 01:03:19.800
How much goo?

1175
01:03:19.860 --> 01:03:21.000
That's I know.

1176
01:03:21.000 --> 01:03:23.159
He must have been saving up for weeks.

1177
01:03:23.219 --> 01:03:24.780
That's a lot of life.

1178
01:03:24.840 --> 01:03:27.059
A lot of love in one moment, isn't it?

1179
01:03:28.260 --> 01:03:31.500
Pretty much, don't touch it, Grace.

1180
01:03:31.559 --> 01:03:32.760
Stop it, Grace.

1181
01:03:33.360 --> 01:03:47.159
One of the things that held up getting this film, getting a new TV series made was a company called Coast Coast, otherwise known as Dawn Trees and Greenlight, had the rights to the film from the BBC.

1182
01:03:47.219 --> 01:03:52.980
They'd paid £750,000 for the rides, but had lots of trouble getting...

1183
01:03:52.980 --> 01:03:58.619
With a crap script about the doctor being the last time lord and there having been a time, well, who'd ever run with that?

1184
01:03:58.679 --> 01:04:01.320
Three scripts written by Johnny Byrne.

1185
01:04:01.440 --> 01:04:03.900
Yeah, TV's Johnny Burns.

1186
01:04:03.960 --> 01:04:07.500
TV Johnny Byrne of the Keeper of Trunk and an Arc of Infinity and Warriors of the Deep.

1187
01:04:09.000 --> 01:04:13.500
Although, the, the, the, the, the, already said, actually as a script idea, really quite clever.

1188
01:04:13.559 --> 01:04:14.219
Yeah, yeah.

1189
01:04:14.280 --> 01:04:26.219
But what happened was, pretty much, Cigar was negotiating for the TV rights, and the BBC's concern was we can't have a separate film and TV series happening at one time.

1190
01:04:26.219 --> 01:04:27.539
Star Trek.

1191
01:04:28.079 --> 01:04:29.880
Who could imagine that?

1192
01:04:30.000 --> 01:04:30.480
Yeah.

1193
01:04:30.539 --> 01:04:33.659
So they had 40 days to go on their contract.

1194
01:04:33.659 --> 01:04:38.039
And their contract merely stated that by the end of that 40 days they had to have started filming.

1195
01:04:38.099 --> 01:04:43.619
So they engaged Leonard Nemoy to start filming 2nd unit.

1196
01:04:43.679 --> 01:04:50.519
Basically, he was going to come up to wherever they were shooting and just shoot location shots and that would count as having started production.

1197
01:04:50.579 --> 01:04:55.500
Philip Segal got wind of this and called Leonard and said, look, this is what they're doing.

1198
01:04:55.559 --> 01:04:57.179
It's purely to keep the contract.

1199
01:04:57.239 --> 01:04:58.619
It's not actually anything creative.

1200
01:04:58.679 --> 01:04:59.579
They don't even have a script.

1201
01:04:59.639 --> 01:05:05.400
And Leonard said, okay, well, I won't do it then because I actually care about, you know, this is a respected property.

1202
01:05:05.460 --> 01:05:06.960
He knew about it.

1203
01:05:07.380 --> 01:05:07.739
Yeah, yeah.

1204
01:05:07.860 --> 01:05:12.420
I don't think he, like, watched loads of it, but he's like, okay, no, I don't want to treat it like that.

1205
01:05:12.420 --> 01:05:13.920
If I'm making a movie, I make a movie.

1206
01:05:13.980 --> 01:05:17.219
And that's how, um, Segal managed to get the rights.

1207
01:05:17.280 --> 01:05:18.360
Cloaking device.

1208
01:05:18.420 --> 01:05:18.900
Yeah.

1209
01:05:18.960 --> 01:05:22.260
Yeah, that no, I lost a layer of enamel to that line.

1210
01:05:22.320 --> 01:05:24.659
No, but I mean, it's reconed in Boomtown.

1211
01:05:24.719 --> 01:05:25.619
Russell addresses it.

1212
01:05:25.679 --> 01:05:27.360
He would, wouldn't he?

1213
01:05:27.420 --> 01:05:29.340
Any effect, Boomtown has a lot in common.

1214
01:05:29.400 --> 01:05:33.239
Like the big climax of Boomtown has a lot in common with the big climax of this.

1215
01:05:33.300 --> 01:05:34.800
I mean, as funny as that can be.

1216
01:05:34.860 --> 01:05:36.179
And it was once.

1217
01:05:36.239 --> 01:05:42.659
Like, you know, there is, there is like all the stuff that we've seen in the title.

1218
01:05:42.719 --> 01:05:46.260
Surely he just goes careering into one of the objects, expect on the steps.

1219
01:05:46.320 --> 01:05:49.320
Actually, the Tartars turned it into a ramp while he was in there.

1220
01:05:49.559 --> 01:05:51.480
This is amazing.

1221
01:05:51.539 --> 01:05:54.960
I don't want to love the set, but I really do.

1222
01:05:55.019 --> 01:05:55.800
I believe too.

1223
01:05:55.800 --> 01:05:57.300
It's fabulous.

1224
01:05:57.360 --> 01:05:58.739
It just needs a hooka.

1225
01:05:58.800 --> 01:06:01.199
Is that related to Beryl Reed?

1226
01:06:01.320 --> 01:06:03.119
It's named after Beryl.

1227
01:06:03.179 --> 01:06:06.239
But the problem is because of all the humidity changes.

1228
01:06:06.300 --> 01:06:11.099
Her hair, his wig just go from go completely different volumes and friziness.

1229
01:06:11.159 --> 01:06:12.960
Do you know that they...

1230
01:06:13.019 --> 01:06:14.219
They may have decay all over again.

1231
01:06:14.280 --> 01:06:15.539
Not on it after Silla Black.

1232
01:06:15.599 --> 01:06:16.139
Did you know that?

1233
01:06:17.159 --> 01:06:19.559
Ixnay on the illusate.

1234
01:06:19.619 --> 01:06:24.719
I love how she's just completely unfa- Like once she has the explanation of how it's bigger inside than out.

1235
01:06:24.780 --> 01:06:25.559
She's like, oh, okay.

1236
01:06:26.400 --> 01:06:28.559
Which is really what you would do.

1237
01:06:28.619 --> 01:06:31.199
Yeah, just batanas need a beroleum clock anyway.

1238
01:06:31.260 --> 01:06:33.360
No, because he'd have a critical timing malfunction.

1239
01:06:33.420 --> 01:06:35.159
Oh, thank you for explaining that.

1240
01:06:35.219 --> 01:06:40.139
Well, it was just explained to me by Brendan a little bit earlier.

1241
01:06:40.199 --> 01:06:43.739
Yeah, it's it's the it's the bit of the film that I was really disappointed with.

1242
01:06:43.800 --> 01:06:49.139
It's repaired the Tartars with a microcassette. 11 minutes. stole it. was so mean.

1243
01:06:49.199 --> 01:06:50.159
I didn't mind that.

1244
01:06:50.219 --> 01:06:51.000
I did like that.

1245
01:06:51.059 --> 01:06:51.780
Yeah, yeah.

1246
01:06:51.840 --> 01:07:00.659
And this is, and it's quite similar to the shot we get in, um, remembrance of the Daleks, except, you know, except 1996.

1247
01:07:00.780 --> 01:07:06.300
It's cheap, isn't it, to have the scanner on the ceiling because then you don't have to, like, compose it around the actors.

1248
01:07:07.019 --> 01:07:09.480
It is rather fabulous, though.

1249
01:07:09.539 --> 01:07:11.579
He's never opened the eye before.

1250
01:07:11.940 --> 01:07:13.800
That's so boring.

1251
01:07:13.860 --> 01:07:16.199
I mean, all of this stuff about the TARDIS as well.

1252
01:07:16.260 --> 01:07:25.440
I mean, Big Finish had to wreck on this, a few years later, in the apocalypse element, where they explained, the eye being opened by a human is a security measure.

1253
01:07:25.500 --> 01:07:27.239
So a timelord can't open it.

1254
01:07:27.300 --> 01:07:34.619
So you would have to go to earth, kidnap like an earthling and then, you know, force him to look into the thing.

1255
01:07:34.679 --> 01:07:35.579
Exactly.

1256
01:07:35.639 --> 01:07:37.619
Another of Gary's character moments.

1257
01:07:37.619 --> 01:07:39.719
Tell him to some gas tags after that, probably.

1258
01:07:39.780 --> 01:07:40.260
Yeah.

1259
01:07:40.320 --> 01:07:42.420
I reckon they should have come to Lakersian.

1260
01:07:42.480 --> 01:07:56.880
Another of Gary's character moments is when the doctor asks Grace if she can reset an alarm clock, Gary's got a paragraph of how Grace could never reset an alarm clock and she and Brian were always late for work because she couldn't set, she could do heart surgery, but she couldn't set an alarm clock.

1261
01:07:56.880 --> 01:08:01.199
At that point, I'm reading it and Gary had already said to me, I had to put in so much character stuff.

1262
01:08:01.260 --> 01:08:04.619
I'm like, okay, Gaz, yeah, you're just trying to finish off this page, aren't you?

1263
01:08:04.679 --> 01:08:06.300
Okay, here we go.

1264
01:08:06.360 --> 01:08:07.980
Oh, that really hurt.

1265
01:08:08.039 --> 01:08:09.420
I got funny eyes now.

1266
01:08:09.539 --> 01:08:11.880
And that's not even the neutron ram.

1267
01:08:11.940 --> 01:08:13.019
No, it's not.

1268
01:08:13.139 --> 01:08:14.760
Do we know what that is?

1269
01:08:14.820 --> 01:08:16.619
It's Paul Darrow's door prop.

1270
01:08:16.680 --> 01:08:18.420
He used to play with it as well in Blake 7.

1271
01:08:18.479 --> 01:08:20.460
I believe that's the moog drone club.

1272
01:08:20.520 --> 01:08:21.539
It is, yes.

1273
01:08:21.779 --> 01:08:24.479
If you've got a moog synthesiser.

1274
01:08:24.539 --> 01:08:26.220
You need one of those drone clips.

1275
01:08:26.279 --> 01:08:30.180
All of those things appeared. early on in Earth shock.

1276
01:08:30.239 --> 01:08:32.220
That's right, yes.

1277
01:08:32.220 --> 01:08:39.899
And also appeared very slightly in vengeance on Varos and the twin dilemma.

1278
01:08:39.960 --> 01:08:40.560
Oh, really?

1279
01:08:40.680 --> 01:08:42.720
The props were still lying around.

1280
01:08:43.680 --> 01:08:46.260
Well, the technical manual was.

1281
01:08:46.319 --> 01:08:49.020
Which no one ever took seriously anyway.

1282
01:08:49.079 --> 01:08:50.220
No, no.

1283
01:08:50.279 --> 01:08:51.840
It was a very weird fanboy.

1284
01:08:51.899 --> 01:08:53.279
Very weird blue and white thing.

1285
01:08:53.340 --> 01:08:55.079
That perspective shot.

1286
01:08:55.140 --> 01:08:59.279
Interested me as a child because, you know, it's quite it's quite blown out.

1287
01:08:59.340 --> 01:09:03.539
So it's like, is that how the doctor sees everything because he's an alien and his eyes are slightly different?

1288
01:09:03.600 --> 01:09:04.800
Oh, but his eyes are meant to be human.

1289
01:09:04.859 --> 01:09:06.659
As a kid, I didn't see that as a mistake.

1290
01:09:06.720 --> 01:09:07.979
I saw that as something intriguing.

1291
01:09:08.039 --> 01:09:09.960
Oh, she keeps doing that, Nathan.

1292
01:09:10.020 --> 01:09:11.399
Yeah, it really hurt.

1293
01:09:11.460 --> 01:09:11.819
Yeah.

1294
01:09:11.819 --> 01:09:15.300
Oh.

1295
01:09:15.359 --> 01:09:17.880
It's as if Brendan was writing the entire script.

1296
01:09:17.939 --> 01:09:19.619
You still got the cowboy boots on, right?

1297
01:09:21.779 --> 01:09:35.760
And the tie back is that the the undersuit of that, the black undersuit is a Nehru suit and what is being worn by Gordon Tipple at the beginning of the film.

1298
01:09:35.819 --> 01:09:37.020
So it is.

1299
01:09:37.020 --> 01:09:39.899
There's some really subtle things in here, listeners, that, you know.

1300
01:09:39.899 --> 01:09:41.460
And the cloak ain't one of them.

1301
01:09:41.520 --> 01:09:43.380
Yeah, just too subtle.

1302
01:09:43.439 --> 01:09:45.899
They don't make it anymore entertaining. or anything.

1303
01:09:45.960 --> 01:09:46.859
No, no, no.

1304
01:09:46.920 --> 01:09:49.859
It's either sledgehammer tactics or it's just too soft.

1305
01:09:49.920 --> 01:09:50.220
Yeah.

1306
01:09:50.279 --> 01:09:54.479
But are we all getting a lot of Timothy Dalton in this performance?

1307
01:09:56.279 --> 01:09:59.159
My, my body, my TARDIS.

1308
01:09:59.279 --> 01:10:03.479
Oh, can I say how much I adore Timothy Dalton this wrestle on?

1309
01:10:03.539 --> 01:10:08.460
He's so superb. is maybe the only really very good thing about the end of time.

1310
01:10:08.520 --> 01:10:09.659
I love that shot.

1311
01:10:09.720 --> 01:10:15.239
It's more Jesus stuff, though. just in case, yeah, that's right.

1312
01:10:15.300 --> 01:10:18.720
And I've never counted them, but apparently there's 13 on there, but I think that's a lie.

1313
01:10:18.840 --> 01:10:19.920
Boom, boom.

1314
01:10:20.039 --> 01:10:22.920
So here's that costume party.

1315
01:10:22.979 --> 01:10:25.140
It's really going off, isn't it?

1316
01:10:25.199 --> 01:10:27.899
And I love this girl who's about to turn around.

1317
01:10:27.960 --> 01:10:31.020
What an amazing mask.

1318
01:10:31.079 --> 01:10:32.640
The moon is fantastic.

1319
01:10:33.060 --> 01:10:39.960
I think that that McGann should have taken the Nixon Mask.

1320
01:10:39.960 --> 01:10:41.640
And nothing else.

1321
01:10:41.699 --> 01:10:47.279
Yeah, no, I was really disappointed that Pertwee stopped wearing that piece of last over his mouth.

1322
01:10:47.340 --> 01:10:48.539
When he says it's getting hard.

1323
01:10:48.600 --> 01:10:51.960
I just think of like planet of the spiders.

1324
01:10:52.020 --> 01:10:54.539
You know, it's probably a tribute to Barry.

1325
01:10:57.600 --> 01:11:06.359
Apparently after the press screening of Rose, Barry did come up to Russell and Z. Now, that's how you do it, and that was so much better than what we got in 1996.

1326
01:11:06.539 --> 01:11:10.380
Well, I mean, they did borrow from Barry's first.

1327
01:11:10.439 --> 01:11:12.060
Well, it's not his first, is it?

1328
01:11:12.119 --> 01:11:12.539
Yeah.

1329
01:11:12.600 --> 01:11:20.100
But as much as, you know, Russell took this as a guide what not to do, I do think there's elements here that inform...

1330
01:11:21.000 --> 01:11:24.180
Yeah, they inform what Russell did beyond just don't do that.

1331
01:11:25.319 --> 01:11:27.000
No, no, no.

1332
01:11:27.060 --> 01:11:36.899
There's nods to this and in things like, you know, that mystical energy that heals them and all that sort of thing is like the regeneration energy, that sort of thing. magic eye lighting.

1333
01:11:37.079 --> 01:11:40.680
There is a kind of through line from survival through this.

1334
01:11:40.800 --> 01:11:45.899
And and and Philip Segal, when he was asked, you know, you've got the set of the doctor in it, is Ace in it.

1335
01:11:45.960 --> 01:11:49.680
He said, no, I think Ace's story has been very well dealt with with the new adventures novels.

1336
01:11:49.739 --> 01:11:51.180
Oh, yeah.

1337
01:11:51.180 --> 01:11:58.319
And again, I don't know if you read them, but he at least, there are early documents when he's planning this.

1338
01:11:58.380 --> 01:12:02.460
There are letters going back and forth of, okay, we've got Silv.

1339
01:12:02.520 --> 01:12:03.479
What about Ace?

1340
01:12:03.539 --> 01:12:04.920
And I think that's how he's informed all.

1341
01:12:04.979 --> 01:12:07.319
She been written out in the novels, but he's like, nope, that works.

1342
01:12:07.380 --> 01:12:13.319
I get really cheased off with this with the half of the face on the screen and half not.

1343
01:12:13.380 --> 01:12:14.039
I don't know why.

1344
01:12:14.279 --> 01:12:16.020
It's too much.

1345
01:12:16.079 --> 01:12:17.939
Yeah, it's too on the nose.

1346
01:12:18.000 --> 01:12:21.720
Well, it's a little too artfully produced.

1347
01:12:21.779 --> 01:12:23.939
There's just a bit too much gorgy.

1348
01:12:24.000 --> 01:12:27.060
Are they trying to inject things into it?

1349
01:12:27.119 --> 01:12:32.039
Try to inject depth, breadth, and interest or sideways interest to something that has no depth in itself.

1350
01:12:32.100 --> 01:12:33.300
The script is meaningless.

1351
01:12:33.479 --> 01:12:35.640
Carter-product, dude.

1352
01:12:37.439 --> 01:12:39.600
In railroads itself.

1353
01:12:39.779 --> 01:12:42.600
It's that loop road in Vancouver.

1354
01:12:42.659 --> 01:12:44.039
Yeah, unlike his performance.

1355
01:12:44.100 --> 01:12:45.239
Which one?

1356
01:12:45.239 --> 01:12:45.600
Yeah.

1357
01:12:45.659 --> 01:12:47.220
I think he does a really good job.

1358
01:12:47.279 --> 01:12:48.659
Eric Roberts or both of them.

1359
01:12:48.720 --> 01:12:49.079
Both of them.

1360
01:12:49.079 --> 01:12:49.319
Yeah.

1361
01:12:49.380 --> 01:12:52.739
Yeah, in fact, really, that's the most romantic moment in the...

1362
01:12:52.800 --> 01:12:53.939
Oh, I don't know.

1363
01:12:54.000 --> 01:12:54.659
We've all been there.

1364
01:12:54.720 --> 01:12:57.960
And I mean, love goes wrong, you know.

1365
01:12:58.020 --> 01:13:01.500
You know, you, you, um, yeah, you, Chang Li.

1366
01:13:01.560 --> 01:13:05.100
That's the thing. not an innocent. you know, he's shooting people at the beginning of the film.

1367
01:13:05.159 --> 01:13:10.079
But at the same time, he's not an evil character.

1368
01:13:10.140 --> 01:13:14.159
And, you know, the master does have a line there where basically he's a victim of circumstance.

1369
01:13:14.220 --> 01:13:16.020
Yeah, yuck.

1370
01:13:16.800 --> 01:13:19.680
Yeah, see that's as creepy as anything.

1371
01:13:19.739 --> 01:13:21.420
When the lights come on at palms.

1372
01:13:23.939 --> 01:13:26.579
You never know what's working around the corner.

1373
01:13:26.640 --> 01:13:29.520
That makes XL for our UK listeners.

1374
01:13:29.579 --> 01:13:31.739
Okay, now we're in the eye.

1375
01:13:31.739 --> 01:13:34.079
We have lots of lights, flashing lights.

1376
01:13:34.079 --> 01:13:35.640
I don't know what's going on.

1377
01:13:35.699 --> 01:13:36.960
Yeah, so he's shaking.

1378
01:13:37.020 --> 01:13:39.479
Pretty much from this point, this is where they went.

1379
01:13:39.479 --> 01:13:40.380
I wish we were too, honey.

1380
01:13:40.439 --> 01:13:44.279
The original ending, which I don't know what it was, isn't working.

1381
01:13:44.340 --> 01:13:45.300
We need a new ending.

1382
01:13:45.359 --> 01:13:50.399
And that's why the ending of the film really is just sound and light to punching people in the face.

1383
01:13:50.460 --> 01:13:58.020
It's like the par wraiths plot at the end of day, Space nine, which just ends up people firing special effects at one another and stops being interesting.

1384
01:13:58.079 --> 01:14:13.260
The original, the original concept of this is, and it was kind of dropped, is that when Changli realises this is a time machine, He realises that his father who was killed by the gangs and why Changli got involved with the gangs, maybe he can see him again.

1385
01:14:13.319 --> 01:14:22.560
And I gather, from what I've been able to find out, the original conclusion actually involved them going inside the eye of harmony, which is a bit like the nexus in Star Trek generations.

1386
01:14:22.619 --> 01:14:26.579
So that's possibly why they dropped that idea because that had just been out the year before.

1387
01:14:26.640 --> 01:14:34.439
But the idea was you can go inside and yeah, you can see everyone who's passed away, but you can never come back out and you can never have a real life.

1388
01:14:34.500 --> 01:14:44.640
So the ending was the doctor, Grace and Chang escaping by choosing to be alive and, you know, deal with the pain of their past rather than get mired.

1389
01:14:44.699 --> 01:14:55.979
Whereas the master just wants to extend his past and his misery and whatnot, which I think would have been better than this ending, but I think cost was a factor as well, because it's very expensive to do that.

1390
01:14:56.039 --> 01:14:59.159
But I mean, this is just classic word peril.

1391
01:14:59.220 --> 01:15:01.260
Is it like what the hell is going on?

1392
01:15:01.319 --> 01:15:03.840
Like, you couldn't look at it.

1393
01:15:03.899 --> 01:15:05.520
It's like Peter Davidson is still alive.

1394
01:15:05.640 --> 01:15:08.039
It's not like people attacking people and stuff.

1395
01:15:08.100 --> 01:15:12.600
It's just a whole bunch of special effects on this set and people shouting about things that are happening.

1396
01:15:12.659 --> 01:15:14.159
Grace getting a sudden purr.

1397
01:15:14.279 --> 01:15:15.539
How does she know how to do this?

1398
01:15:15.600 --> 01:15:21.119
Well, and but also also, you know, the doctor calling out these things, like the rules.

1399
01:15:21.180 --> 01:15:27.420
No, she can't look in the thing because she doesn't have human eyes, no, the thing's pinning him there so he can't move.

1400
01:15:27.479 --> 01:15:28.739
Like none of that's obvious.

1401
01:15:28.800 --> 01:15:31.500
It's all just... no, it was in the last script.

1402
01:15:32.039 --> 01:15:36.960
And, you know, no wonder no wonder Grace is bad at setting alarm clocks.

1403
01:15:37.020 --> 01:15:39.659
If her idea of setting an alarm clock is to rip out all the wires.

1404
01:15:39.779 --> 01:15:41.880
Yeah she does that every morning.

1405
01:15:42.840 --> 01:15:45.720
Brian buys another one on the way home.

1406
01:15:45.720 --> 01:15:50.279
I just said it was a nod back to like Tom Baker doing a lot of ripping.

1407
01:15:50.340 --> 01:15:52.920
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, the real Power of Crawl episode four.

1408
01:15:52.979 --> 01:15:56.220
Yeah, it just makes no sense of your analogy.

1409
01:15:56.279 --> 01:16:00.060
You know, they've just written an alarm clock because an alarm clock is a clock.

1410
01:16:03.239 --> 01:16:04.979
Why is that there?

1411
01:16:05.039 --> 01:16:07.260
The last time this happened, we were in Cardiff.

1412
01:16:07.319 --> 01:16:08.159
Actually, you know what?

1413
01:16:08.220 --> 01:16:12.000
I think I figured out why it seems to be midnight everywhere in the world in a moment.

1414
01:16:12.060 --> 01:16:13.979
Like they cut to...

1415
01:16:14.100 --> 01:16:17.880
Because the screenwriters are not aware of other countries or indeed other time zones.

1416
01:16:17.939 --> 01:16:20.579
No, because it's all the replicas in Vegas.

1417
01:16:20.760 --> 01:16:28.199
Oh, and I believe Vegas is in the same time zone as San Francisco.

1418
01:16:28.260 --> 01:16:29.460
So it's not real different countries.

1419
01:16:29.520 --> 01:16:33.479
No, it's surprised there isn't a shining ancient Egypt. you know what I mean?

1420
01:16:35.460 --> 01:16:37.199
What the hell?

1421
01:16:37.199 --> 01:16:39.659
Meanwhile, Cumanian era.

1422
01:16:39.659 --> 01:16:42.000
Fireworks.

1423
01:16:42.060 --> 01:16:43.079
What is happening?

1424
01:16:43.140 --> 01:16:46.500
I don't know what's happening Some energy thing whooshing.

1425
01:16:47.460 --> 01:16:51.060
Yeah, the ending makes no sense whatsoever.

1426
01:16:51.119 --> 01:16:51.539
What?

1427
01:16:51.539 --> 01:16:53.640
Humanian era, please.

1428
01:16:53.699 --> 01:16:59.520
The other things, the other things on the turney thing said Menusen era and sensorian era.

1429
01:16:59.640 --> 01:17:02.819
I think there's a Wrestleon and a Wrestleonian era, Wrestleon era, yeah.

1430
01:17:02.880 --> 01:17:05.460
Now she's thinking alarm clock after you see...

1431
01:17:05.460 --> 01:17:06.600
But yeah, something...

1432
01:17:06.720 --> 01:17:08.460
Manusa is just the word.

1433
01:17:08.520 --> 01:17:10.439
I think it's the Pali word for humanity.

1434
01:17:10.500 --> 01:17:11.520
Oh right.

1435
01:17:11.579 --> 01:17:12.899
There you go.

1436
01:17:12.960 --> 01:17:13.680
Kids at home.

1437
01:17:13.739 --> 01:17:17.640
And of course, what's a temporal orbit became a thing in fandom for a while?

1438
01:17:17.640 --> 01:17:19.680
Because, yes, indeed, what is a temporal orbit?

1439
01:17:19.800 --> 01:17:32.520
A friend of the podcast, Matthew Rayner, had a fans ink called Temporal Orbit, for about 18 issues that I was a regular writer for when, you know, fanzines were put together by hand and more happy.

1440
01:17:32.579 --> 01:17:33.840
So everyone's dead now.

1441
01:17:33.899 --> 01:17:39.420
Yeah, yeah, everyone's dead and the time vortex isn't happy, which is why we've got this digital shaking effect.

1442
01:17:39.479 --> 01:17:40.739
Oh dear.

1443
01:17:40.800 --> 01:17:44.039
So I imagine here's how I think it's going to go.

1444
01:17:44.100 --> 01:17:46.739
There'll be a lot of talking and then everything will be all right again.

1445
01:17:47.340 --> 01:17:51.060
Everyone's going to sit down to tea and biscuits because we're all British.

1446
01:17:51.119 --> 01:18:01.560
Okay, so the subtitle there for the no was N-O dash 0 dash 0 dash O. Oh, my name's got the idea from.

1447
01:18:01.619 --> 01:18:03.539
The camera's shaking and then it's not shaking.

1448
01:18:03.600 --> 01:18:04.619
Yeah.

1449
01:18:04.619 --> 01:18:10.260
He's going to a lot of effort to get a new hairdo.

1450
01:18:11.699 --> 01:18:14.399
He can literally just take it off his head.

1451
01:18:17.460 --> 01:18:19.260
Watch out, Grace.

1452
01:18:19.319 --> 01:18:21.239
Shaky bannister.com.

1453
01:18:21.300 --> 01:18:22.140
Oh, Lord.

1454
01:18:22.140 --> 01:18:24.180
Oh, we have to do that.

1455
01:18:24.180 --> 01:18:28.800
I could be wrong, but I believe that that stopped was done by Pat Tallman.

1456
01:18:28.920 --> 01:18:30.899
And who's Pat Torman?

1457
01:18:30.960 --> 01:18:39.119
Pat Tallman was a regular stunt actor and background artist on Star Trek the Next Generation, but most famous, I think, to genre fans as Lita Alexander from Babylon 5.

1458
01:18:39.119 --> 01:18:40.199
The Telepack.

1459
01:18:40.260 --> 01:18:41.460
I've never heard of that There you are.

1460
01:18:41.520 --> 01:18:43.319
Neither have I. Watch out.

1461
01:18:43.380 --> 01:18:46.800
But yeah, she's a great actress as well as a great starwoman.

1462
01:18:49.859 --> 01:18:54.899
Now, this, I remember as a kid, I'm like, wow, that is, you know, the master has never punched the doctor.

1463
01:18:54.960 --> 01:18:56.340
Sorry, kicked the doctor in the stomach.

1464
01:18:56.460 --> 01:19:00.479
I think it's appropriate for the film, but, you know, it really got my attention.

1465
01:19:00.600 --> 01:19:06.359
Well, maybe he's compatible with a little of Bruce and maybe there was a bit of tree mass in him previously.

1466
01:19:06.840 --> 01:19:11.880
The master is maybe the worst idea possible for bringing the show back, don't you think?

1467
01:19:11.939 --> 01:19:14.399
It's definitely throwing a whole lot of really, what?

1468
01:19:14.460 --> 01:19:17.399
Yeah, well, I mean, like we had what?

1469
01:19:17.460 --> 01:19:20.399
Seven years of Doctor Who before the Master came in it.

1470
01:19:20.460 --> 01:19:23.880
If the master's the doctor's opposite, we need to know who the doctor is.

1471
01:19:24.359 --> 01:19:25.380
Yeah, and we don't.

1472
01:19:26.880 --> 01:19:29.640
It's like introducing Sherlock with the Reichenbuck for...

1473
01:19:29.699 --> 01:19:32.039
So it should be an unknown alien threat.

1474
01:19:32.100 --> 01:19:32.880
It should be.

1475
01:19:32.880 --> 01:19:35.579
Yeah, it should be the autons in bridal gown.

1476
01:19:35.640 --> 01:19:36.060
Always.

1477
01:19:36.119 --> 01:19:38.819
Actually, you know what it could be?

1478
01:19:38.880 --> 01:19:45.000
Grace's boss. could actually be covering up the doctor being an alien because he's in league with aliens.

1479
01:19:46.020 --> 01:19:47.100
Now, I've got a confession to make.

1480
01:19:47.220 --> 01:19:52.260
I saw a version of this before it actually got released with the green screen of that.

1481
01:19:52.319 --> 01:19:52.920
Oh, really?

1482
01:19:52.920 --> 01:19:56.340
And all the other dialogue, like a few days it got it got leaked.

1483
01:19:56.340 --> 01:19:56.939
The slash print.

1484
01:19:57.000 --> 01:19:57.300
I remember.

1485
01:19:57.359 --> 01:19:58.680
So I saw the slash print.

1486
01:19:58.739 --> 01:19:59.880
And so they had to talk about that.

1487
01:19:59.939 --> 01:20:02.760
Had had him just going rotating around on some green.

1488
01:20:04.979 --> 01:20:07.199
That's how you'll always see it.

1489
01:20:07.319 --> 01:20:08.159
That's how I always see it.

1490
01:20:08.220 --> 01:20:09.600
I've never seen that.

1491
01:20:09.659 --> 01:20:11.819
And I wish I hadn't.

1492
01:20:11.880 --> 01:20:24.359
There's also there's also a bit where when Paul was doing the green screen to appear in the Eye of Harmony, there's a lovely outtake where he's holding his son Joe. Is it Joe, his son?

1493
01:20:24.359 --> 01:20:25.199
Or one of it?

1494
01:20:25.739 --> 01:20:33.600
But his son who later plays Alex in the Alex foreman in the audios, you know, when he's like 2 or 3 years old, he's holding him on the green screen.

1495
01:20:33.659 --> 01:20:39.840
And so in the slash print, that is put in when the doctor appears in the thing, just as a placeholder.

1496
01:20:39.899 --> 01:20:40.500
Yeah.

1497
01:20:40.560 --> 01:20:47.520
See, they had fun making this, but didn't, um, again, say or one of them, con that no one actually knew what was going.

1498
01:20:47.579 --> 01:20:49.439
Where did all those leads come from?

1499
01:20:49.500 --> 01:20:51.000
Like with the nervoids there or something?

1500
01:20:52.140 --> 01:20:54.239
Where did the bats come from?

1501
01:20:54.300 --> 01:21:01.920
Actually, I like to think that Harrison Chase survived and is now just doing pottaging and botanical supervision in the Tartar bowels.

1502
01:21:01.979 --> 01:21:02.460
And what's this?

1503
01:21:02.520 --> 01:21:04.859
Well, that's the...

1504
01:21:04.920 --> 01:21:06.300
Regenerative energy.

1505
01:21:06.659 --> 01:21:10.920
Yeah, actually, I think that's probably why in the new series. the 1st time we've seen it look like that.

1506
01:21:10.979 --> 01:21:13.500
That's right Oh, dear, it comes from this.

1507
01:21:13.560 --> 01:21:14.880
I thought of that before.

1508
01:21:15.000 --> 01:21:16.319
Yeah, that's a good point.

1509
01:21:16.380 --> 01:21:16.680
Yeah.

1510
01:21:16.800 --> 01:21:19.560
And the thing is, I like that the doctor looks surprised by this.

1511
01:21:19.619 --> 01:21:20.880
He's not expecting it to happen.

1512
01:21:20.939 --> 01:21:22.560
He's not a magician making it happen.

1513
01:21:22.619 --> 01:21:24.239
Yeah, exactly.

1514
01:21:25.140 --> 01:21:30.420
I believe also in, it's either Gary Russell's novelisation or the original script.

1515
01:21:32.220 --> 01:21:38.220
Chang Li does have his neck broken and the TARDIS heals him, but Grace is just stunned from the fall.

1516
01:21:38.279 --> 01:21:40.739
I mean, I mean, it doesn't quite work.

1517
01:21:40.800 --> 01:21:44.100
I mean, she doesn't hold back, yeah, if she gets killed and then she gets better.

1518
01:21:44.220 --> 01:21:45.539
She can actually do anything.

1519
01:21:45.600 --> 01:21:48.300
Or he's talking about her holding back his death.

1520
01:21:48.359 --> 01:21:49.140
Maybe.

1521
01:21:49.140 --> 01:21:49.619
Yeah.

1522
01:21:49.680 --> 01:21:51.000
That's how I always took it.

1523
01:21:51.060 --> 01:21:55.199
And I love this shot and this shot convinces me they would have been a great team.

1524
01:21:55.260 --> 01:21:56.579
I think they would have been too.

1525
01:21:56.640 --> 01:21:59.279
And I think if we just dropped the background.

1526
01:21:59.340 --> 01:22:06.659
I think there's nothing wrong with keeping them together at the end because then if they went to series and didn't want them, you can just say, well, I returned to Earth.

1527
01:22:06.779 --> 01:22:07.800
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

1528
01:22:07.800 --> 01:22:09.359
My boyfriend's gone.

1529
01:22:09.420 --> 01:22:13.079
She's lost a job, she's lost a sofa, and yet she's still going to choose not to dress.

1530
01:22:13.079 --> 01:22:15.840
Oh, yes, yes, dress sense as well.

1531
01:22:15.899 --> 01:22:19.140
But it's like, really, like, that's the script.

1532
01:22:19.199 --> 01:22:28.020
See, I think the reason they didn't was, they were so conscious of the fact that the Fox movie department knew this was a backdoor pilot, but the Fox television department didn't.

1533
01:22:28.140 --> 01:22:42.119
So they were very sensitive of not treading on their toes at the risk of the television department, losing it and saying, no, no, where, you know, it's, it's like the original thing of Doctor Who in the 1960s when nobody wanted to take control of it.

1534
01:22:42.180 --> 01:22:46.319
So Lambert said, no, we're a cereal, where part of the drama department, deal with it.

1535
01:22:47.579 --> 01:22:49.680
We can see that really well.

1536
01:22:49.800 --> 01:22:51.000
I...

1537
01:22:51.060 --> 01:22:51.420
There you go.

1538
01:22:51.479 --> 01:22:52.500
250?

1539
01:22:52.560 --> 01:22:53.399
Oh, it's further away now.

1540
01:22:55.079 --> 01:22:57.300
It's just so funny now.

1541
01:22:57.359 --> 01:22:58.800
Blow it up.

1542
01:22:58.859 --> 01:23:11.579
Come on, Russell. get rid of it Oh, actually, Todd, we should mention, of course, that Daphne Ashbrook was a guest star on your favourite Star Trek.

1543
01:23:11.699 --> 01:23:13.439
Oh, Deep Space Nine.

1544
01:23:13.500 --> 01:23:14.340
Deep Space 9, yeah.

1545
01:23:14.399 --> 01:23:16.140
Yeah, she played Men Laura.

1546
01:23:16.199 --> 01:23:22.319
The character from a low gravity planet that in our gravity had to be in a wheelchair.

1547
01:23:22.380 --> 01:23:23.939
I think she did a great job in that.

1548
01:23:24.000 --> 01:23:24.479
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1549
01:23:24.479 --> 01:23:28.140
It's not a well liked episode, but I think she actually thought it wasn't bad.

1550
01:23:28.199 --> 01:23:32.520
And what particular latex disfunction did she have on her forehead?

1551
01:23:32.579 --> 01:23:36.420
She had ridges and then she had this blonde wig. wig.

1552
01:23:36.479 --> 01:23:36.840
Yeah.

1553
01:23:36.840 --> 01:23:39.420
And she had to kiss Alexander Saddig.

1554
01:23:39.479 --> 01:23:40.199
Oh dear.

1555
01:23:40.260 --> 01:23:42.000
It's hard life.

1556
01:23:42.000 --> 01:23:42.960
In a harness.

1557
01:23:43.020 --> 01:23:45.659
Oh, no, we're flying around. that's right.

1558
01:23:45.720 --> 01:23:54.899
But as Melora, she has had a post-life in the Star Trek novels, I believe she's currently on the USS Titan under Captain Riker.

1559
01:23:54.960 --> 01:23:57.000
Oh, if you'll pardon the expression.

1560
01:23:57.060 --> 01:23:59.220
Yeah, frequently under Captain Roger.

1561
01:23:59.279 --> 01:24:01.079
Oh, yes, New Year.

1562
01:24:02.039 --> 01:24:03.779
I love that guy.

1563
01:24:03.840 --> 01:24:05.159
He gets to have a party.

1564
01:24:05.220 --> 01:24:06.180
That seems unfair.

1565
01:24:06.239 --> 01:24:10.199
I think if he wanted to, I think he's perfectly happy not having a party.

1566
01:24:10.260 --> 01:24:11.220
Okay fair enough.

1567
01:24:11.279 --> 01:24:17.340
And and that that young lady gets a gets a whole subplot in the novel.

1568
01:24:17.399 --> 01:24:24.479
She is Professor Wag's daughter and has been eyeing off Gareth all night and just wishes he'd come over and talk to her and the end just goes stuff it.

1569
01:24:24.840 --> 01:24:27.479
The novel just seems better than this.

1570
01:24:27.539 --> 01:24:31.560
Well, the novel was done on the last but one draft.

1571
01:24:31.619 --> 01:24:33.659
Yeah, I haven't seen seen them.

1572
01:24:33.720 --> 01:24:34.199
Yeah.

1573
01:24:34.260 --> 01:24:43.140
And Gary tries to redress the ending a bit and explain it a bit more, which you can do in prose in a way that you can't do in dialogue without even more word peril.

1574
01:24:43.199 --> 01:24:45.119
So had Gary seen the sets or...

1575
01:24:45.119 --> 01:24:46.439
I don't think so.

1576
01:24:46.500 --> 01:24:47.579
I don't think he flew out there.

1577
01:24:47.640 --> 01:24:52.020
I think he saw lots of photographs, but I'm not sure whether they flew him out there or not.

1578
01:24:52.079 --> 01:24:56.460
Mind you, the BBC wanted this to be a big success and did a merchandise bonanza.

1579
01:24:56.520 --> 01:24:57.779
So they may have sent it out there.

1580
01:24:57.840 --> 01:24:59.159
You know, and here we go.

1581
01:24:59.279 --> 01:25:00.420
I can be horrible.

1582
01:25:00.479 --> 01:25:04.739
I can say with the bad guy, but I'm still going to get my reward, which is pots of gold.

1583
01:25:04.859 --> 01:25:11.279
But I think here what's what's happened is that the doctor recognises the good in him.

1584
01:25:11.340 --> 01:25:12.840
Yeah, right?

1585
01:25:12.899 --> 01:25:13.920
Yeah, I think so.

1586
01:25:13.920 --> 01:25:17.760
He's not going to have to be in a gun toting gang if he's got lots of money.

1587
01:25:17.819 --> 01:25:18.779
He'll...

1588
01:25:18.779 --> 01:25:20.520
I'd like him to be in a gun.

1589
01:25:21.359 --> 01:25:23.579
Start up a business and exploit the workers.

1590
01:25:23.640 --> 01:25:24.539
I think...

1591
01:25:24.600 --> 01:25:25.140
Okay, okay.

1592
01:25:25.199 --> 01:25:27.960
Oh, yes.

1593
01:25:27.960 --> 01:25:31.859
And she's had a, she's really learned something today.

1594
01:25:31.920 --> 01:25:32.579
Yeah.

1595
01:25:32.579 --> 01:25:34.619
Yes, but I'm not going to go with you.

1596
01:25:34.680 --> 01:25:36.600
They both have our hair looks so similar right now.

1597
01:25:36.659 --> 01:25:38.699
We can't tell one of them from the back.

1598
01:25:38.760 --> 01:25:40.079
And do you come with me?

1599
01:25:40.140 --> 01:25:41.340
There's no through line with that at all.

1600
01:25:41.460 --> 01:25:45.779
Well, the thing is, I'm sorry, I just really hate this.

1601
01:25:45.840 --> 01:25:53.340
What I got as a key because I wanted her to go with him, but I kind of got her rationale in that, you know, at the beginning of the film.

1602
01:25:53.399 --> 01:25:55.619
She's worrying about what Brian will think.

1603
01:25:55.680 --> 01:26:02.880
And when she's saying, I realised, I realised now who I am, and she says, no, you come with me, she's saying, no, my life is just as important as yours.

1604
01:26:03.239 --> 01:26:05.880
I don't have to sacrifice my life.

1605
01:26:05.939 --> 01:26:07.260
How about you sacrifice you?

1606
01:26:07.319 --> 01:26:09.239
Yes, we've never heard...

1607
01:26:09.300 --> 01:26:09.659
No.

1608
01:26:10.380 --> 01:26:15.960
You really are defending this well, Brendan. you really must love it Um, you know, it's the nostalgia fact.

1609
01:26:16.020 --> 01:26:18.359
I recognise the failings, and I certainly get what you say, Todd.

1610
01:26:18.420 --> 01:26:24.300
Why wouldn't she go with him, but I see that there is an intent to explain why she wouldn't go with him.

1611
01:26:24.359 --> 01:26:25.800
It's not 100% convincing.

1612
01:26:26.579 --> 01:26:37.500
I guess I just get annoyed when I see so many different American movies or telly movies or shows where they have this happy ending with people laughing and, you know, you know, that sort of thing and that's what I get here and it just irritates me a bit.

1613
01:26:37.560 --> 01:26:41.340
But I personally really like her in this and I wish she had continued with him.

1614
01:26:41.399 --> 01:26:41.880
Yeah.

1615
01:26:41.880 --> 01:26:48.359
It's such a shame that Universal won't hardly released the rights for the characters and that's why we've never had Grace in the audios.

1616
01:26:48.420 --> 01:26:50.939
She only comes up in the comics once.

1617
01:26:51.000 --> 01:26:55.920
Panini made a special arrangement for her to appear. for Grace to appear rather.

1618
01:26:55.979 --> 01:26:59.039
But yeah, that's why Daphne has done audios, but not as great.

1619
01:26:59.039 --> 01:27:01.020
And Yi, but not as Chang.

1620
01:27:01.500 --> 01:27:04.319
So this is Lee, I should say.

1621
01:27:04.380 --> 01:27:11.220
This is the doctor hasn't learnt anything at all from his adventure.

1622
01:27:11.279 --> 01:27:16.079
I need to go and sit back in the same chair and read exactly the same book and listen to exactly the same record.

1623
01:27:16.140 --> 01:27:17.340
Reboot once more.

1624
01:27:17.399 --> 01:27:18.239
Yeah, yes.

1625
01:27:18.300 --> 01:27:21.659
But, I mean, they're saying he's the same man, you know.

1626
01:27:21.720 --> 01:27:22.739
I know, I know.

1627
01:27:22.739 --> 01:27:25.199
This is what I was doing this morning, damn it.

1628
01:27:25.260 --> 01:27:26.880
I'm going to finish this book if it kills me.

1629
01:27:26.939 --> 01:27:28.140
Like last time.

1630
01:27:29.939 --> 01:27:32.699
And he's in Tim's chair from the goodies.

1631
01:27:32.760 --> 01:27:33.960
All is right with the...

1632
01:27:34.020 --> 01:27:34.920
No, quite.

1633
01:27:34.979 --> 01:27:38.640
So I guess we'll see him again for the 50th anniversary.

1634
01:27:38.699 --> 01:27:41.220
That tune was written for this.

1635
01:27:41.279 --> 01:27:43.500
It's not an old jazz piece.

1636
01:27:43.800 --> 01:27:53.520
And there was a different tune in the slash print, which was a classic, but I don't think they I don't think they ever intended on using it while it's just a placeholder.

1637
01:27:53.579 --> 01:27:57.960
So if anyone wants to know why I haven't redesigned the website to match these credits.

1638
01:27:58.020 --> 01:28:02.460
I have in the past is because they're bloody horrible.

1639
01:28:02.520 --> 01:28:06.119
So we'd have to look at them for months and months.

1640
01:28:06.180 --> 01:28:09.300
And we're not doing a theme team?

1641
01:28:09.359 --> 01:28:10.800
No, no, no.

1642
01:28:10.859 --> 01:28:12.180
This is a comment.

1643
01:28:12.239 --> 01:28:14.460
I can't afford to. right.

1644
01:28:14.520 --> 01:28:15.840
Love you, Cameron.

1645
01:28:17.100 --> 01:28:18.720
Oh dear.

1646
01:28:18.779 --> 01:28:22.319
Look at the old BBC worldwide logo and universal.

1647
01:28:22.439 --> 01:28:24.720
Yeah, that just shows you how well this really is, doesn't it?

1648
01:28:24.779 --> 01:28:27.060
So do we have closing statements?

1649
01:28:27.119 --> 01:28:30.300
Well, is there anything anyone wanted to say that they didn't get a chance to?

1650
01:28:31.739 --> 01:28:34.920
Surprisingly, this is much, much thinner.

1651
01:28:35.100 --> 01:28:37.439
I feel very thin.

1652
01:28:37.500 --> 01:28:38.399
I feel glum.

1653
01:28:38.520 --> 01:28:39.779
Glum.

1654
01:28:39.779 --> 01:28:40.739
Glum, good word.

1655
01:28:40.800 --> 01:28:48.720
Well, in fact, like this, maybe more than not renewing the show after season 26, this killed it.

1656
01:28:48.779 --> 01:28:49.680
Do you know what I mean?

1657
01:28:49.739 --> 01:28:56.819
Like, I think immediately after this, it seemed much, much less likely that Doctor Who would ever come back because they tried once.

1658
01:28:56.880 --> 01:28:58.560
It didn't work.

1659
01:28:58.619 --> 01:29:03.180
And, you know, like it was a real kind of failure.

1660
01:29:03.239 --> 01:29:15.119
Like, you know, they tried to reinvent it as a cult TV show from the 90s in America and it was exactly the wrong approach to take on every level.

1661
01:29:15.539 --> 01:29:17.220
Yeah, I at the time.

1662
01:29:17.279 --> 01:29:26.159
Oh, in between years, I'm really wanted them to do like 3 tilli movies, like if they were going to do 3 and then make a decision on the series to see how it performed over a few weeks.

1663
01:29:27.659 --> 01:29:33.239
If they did with a previous series in America, the $6000000 man had three telemovies before it went.

1664
01:29:33.359 --> 01:29:36.899
But like, you know, one in the present, one in the past, one in the futures type of thing.

1665
01:29:36.960 --> 01:29:42.479
So you get a feel and don't have all this crap about regeneration, just, you know, she discovers the doctor, right?

1666
01:29:42.539 --> 01:29:43.859
Like what, you know, has gone down.

1667
01:29:43.920 --> 01:29:46.500
You don't need a backstory to be interested in a character.

1668
01:29:46.560 --> 01:29:49.680
Then you can bring the backstory in slowly if you want to go there.

1669
01:29:49.739 --> 01:29:53.039
But, you know, in a way, it's a blessing and a curse.

1670
01:29:53.100 --> 01:29:59.460
Like I'm glad that it's there in some aspects because I, you know, as much as I'm not a big fan of Paul McGann.

1671
01:29:59.520 --> 01:30:07.500
I think there's some lovely moments in there, but I'm also glad that we didn't get the series because I just don't think we would have got what we've had in the last 10 years.

1672
01:30:07.560 --> 01:30:14.880
Yeah, I think had we had a series of this, it would have been mediocre.

1673
01:30:14.939 --> 01:30:33.899
Because despite the fact that the 90s was kind of a Renaissance for TV sci-fi, a lot of it you look back on and Most of it is good, but there's very, there's only a few series that stand out as really amazing stuff.

1674
01:30:33.960 --> 01:30:40.319
You know, even the X-Files, which was so massive at the time, and, you know, which they'd recently brought back for some reason.

1675
01:30:40.380 --> 01:30:46.380
Doesn't seem to have, doesn't seem to have had the lasting impact that you might have expected.

1676
01:30:46.439 --> 01:30:48.239
Don't you think it was huge.

1677
01:30:48.300 --> 01:30:49.319
It was enormous.

1678
01:30:49.380 --> 01:30:53.699
And even towards the end, you know, when David Dakovney was appearing less and less.

1679
01:30:53.760 --> 01:30:56.880
It really lost its impact and it lost its cultural capital.

1680
01:30:56.939 --> 01:30:58.020
I think I stopped watching.

1681
01:30:58.079 --> 01:31:00.600
I mean, they kept making it out of habit, I think.

1682
01:31:00.659 --> 01:31:09.899
The only sort of comparable thing I've seen since something that had such a massive impact and then just faded away was Avatar, the James Cameron film.

1683
01:31:09.960 --> 01:31:14.880
Because in the middle of making no less than 25 sequels to that right now.

1684
01:31:14.939 --> 01:31:26.640
But, you know, for the year after its release, it was everywhere and people were getting in blue makeup to get married and all this crazy stuff and just kept saying...

1685
01:31:26.640 --> 01:31:32.760
He kept, you know, Cameron kept saying that, yeah, I'm going to make a sequel. going make a sequel.

1686
01:31:32.819 --> 01:31:38.399
And now, you know, everyone knows what it was, like with the Matrix, but it doesn't have the lasting impact.

1687
01:31:39.180 --> 01:31:43.979
It didn't work because most dates that start like this don't actually work.

1688
01:31:44.039 --> 01:31:47.100
This was actually so much of its time and that it's a gay dart date.

1689
01:31:47.100 --> 01:31:51.300
Or wet or kind of like inbound in a wheelchair.

1690
01:31:51.359 --> 01:31:59.399
I do think that it was, it was prescient casting to put Daphne Ashbrook having her last SF role being a person in a wheelchair.

1691
01:31:59.399 --> 01:32:15.239
Because that whole thing of someone who just hasn't met that many people in their life, lives mostly through the keyboard, is that I'm going to tell you everything about myself in the 1st 5 minutes because then you'll really like me and we'll have a really meaningful relationship because you're only the 3rd person I've ever gone out on a date with.

1692
01:32:15.479 --> 01:32:19.680
That's what this film is and that's why it was doomed to.

1693
01:32:19.739 --> 01:32:22.140
It's not even going to get into the 2nd cider.

1694
01:32:22.260 --> 01:32:23.220
Yeah, yeah.

1695
01:32:23.279 --> 01:32:26.880
Because you're terrifying the bejesus out of me, Bruce.

1696
01:32:27.000 --> 01:32:29.100
So stop marrying a boy.

1697
01:32:30.659 --> 01:32:33.960
Jeffrey Sachs, Matthew Jacob.

1698
01:32:34.020 --> 01:32:34.739
Oh, harsh.

1699
01:32:34.800 --> 01:32:35.880
Philip Segolf.

1700
01:32:35.939 --> 01:32:38.039
No, I'm avoiding them all.

1701
01:32:38.100 --> 01:32:43.380
No, I think sex is excellent and I want to also say that is it Lissa, Patrick Lucia, the editor.

1702
01:32:43.439 --> 01:32:44.340
Oh, yes, they're both.

1703
01:32:44.399 --> 01:32:45.899
I would snog and marry both of them.

1704
01:32:45.960 --> 01:32:57.840
And I think Jacobs did an amazing thing because, you know, Jacobs script actually stops. about a 3rd of the way through, and then the suits take over and start dumping stuff in.

1705
01:32:57.899 --> 01:33:00.300
So a lot of the info dumping was Siegel.

1706
01:33:00.359 --> 01:33:01.079
It needs to be noted.

1707
01:33:01.199 --> 01:33:03.239
That bloody seagull crappy jet.

1708
01:33:03.300 --> 01:33:10.079
I think that was Philip Siegel who was leaving all that Zhuji stuff all over all the guards and everyone because he's been crapping from a great hide on this script all the way through.

1709
01:33:10.140 --> 01:33:16.439
I will agree with you that the editing and the direction say save a lot. everything.

1710
01:33:16.500 --> 01:33:27.180
It makes it watchable, something that is actually, I haven't, I've got to admit, I haven't read Gary Russell's novel because when I, even at the time seeing this, I thought, yeah, the script is the least interesting thing about this.

1711
01:33:27.479 --> 01:33:33.300
Patrick Lossier has gone on to be an editor in his own writer, very, very respected editor.

1712
01:33:33.539 --> 01:33:39.479
In answer to Todd's question, I would snog Jeffrey Sachs because he's just incredibly talented.

1713
01:33:40.199 --> 01:33:42.479
I haven't said his teeth though.

1714
01:33:43.500 --> 01:33:51.779
I would marry Matthew Jacobs because watching the um, watching the documentary, the 7-year hitch, which is very good.

1715
01:33:52.800 --> 01:34:10.920
Well, it's just that of everyone and everyone's very enthusiastic in the documentary, but his enthusiasm seems kind of the most pure and the most lovely and he's just like, you know, they asked me to write the script and I was so thrilled and I wanted to do a good job and I think in the end we did.

1716
01:34:11.039 --> 01:34:13.739
It wasn't everything I wanted, but et cetera.

1717
01:34:13.800 --> 01:34:17.819
And just his his enthusiasm and his honesty really appealed to me.

1718
01:34:17.880 --> 01:34:21.000
So I would be avoiding Philip Segel.

1719
01:34:21.840 --> 01:34:24.779
It's it's not a hard avoid.

1720
01:34:24.840 --> 01:34:25.800
It's a default avoid.

1721
01:34:25.859 --> 01:34:29.039
We haven't mentioned Seagull DSV, have we?

1722
01:34:29.100 --> 01:34:30.720
Or what's the other thing he did?

1723
01:34:30.779 --> 01:34:33.359
Well, that's how he wooed Alan Yentor.

1724
01:34:33.420 --> 01:34:34.560
What did he do?

1725
01:34:34.619 --> 01:34:36.539
He didn't do... did see Quest yesterday.

1726
01:34:36.659 --> 01:34:37.680
Sequest, yeah.

1727
01:34:37.739 --> 01:34:41.760
Oh my goodness. just thinking about that series.

1728
01:34:41.819 --> 01:34:44.520
But yeah, but everyone who's sort of young enough, wasn't it?

1729
01:34:44.520 --> 01:34:47.399
It was like Star Trek, but in a submarine.

1730
01:34:47.399 --> 01:34:47.939
In a submarine.

1731
01:34:47.939 --> 01:34:49.380
Oh, yeah.

1732
01:34:49.380 --> 01:34:55.739
In a scene with Trek and a whole lot of woo-woo. dolphin kissing thrown in because it was that period.

1733
01:34:55.800 --> 01:34:56.220
Yeah.

1734
01:34:56.279 --> 01:34:59.579
It had some really meaningful, great ideas, but...

1735
01:34:59.579 --> 01:35:01.619
But yeah, Alan Yen...

1736
01:35:01.680 --> 01:35:04.260
Alan Yentob, then controller of BBC 2.

1737
01:35:04.560 --> 01:35:10.439
Okay, came over to America to see the new shows that the UK might buy.

1738
01:35:10.500 --> 01:35:18.180
It was, I believe, Alan Yentob, who brought Star Trek, the Next Generation to the UK in a popular nightly time slot.

1739
01:35:18.239 --> 01:35:25.140
But as Siegel was giving him the tour of the Sequest DSV sets.

1740
01:35:25.199 --> 01:35:29.819
He would just occasionally say, oh, I understand you're doing lots of Doctor Who reruns.

1741
01:35:30.119 --> 01:35:32.340
Which would you talk about?

1742
01:35:32.340 --> 01:35:33.119
Yeah.

1743
01:35:33.180 --> 01:35:44.399
Yeah, I've been thinking about Dr. and the way Alan Yadtop described it is, you know, he was pitching to me all the way through the tour and but he says that is... in my eyes, people.

1744
01:35:44.460 --> 01:35:45.180
I want vomit.

1745
01:35:45.239 --> 01:35:53.159
But yeah, Ali Antorp was like, that enthusiasm. gave me the clout to go back to the BBC and say, we've got someone who wants to do a co-production.

1746
01:35:53.220 --> 01:35:57.779
Let's do this because Alan Yenthob had wanted to bring Doctor Who back, but knew he couldn't do it in general.

1747
01:35:57.840 --> 01:36:01.859
And they needed the guns because, you know, you can't just do it with frock, can you?

1748
01:36:01.920 --> 01:36:04.680
I have got another snob, Mary avoid.

1749
01:36:04.739 --> 01:36:05.159
Yes.

1750
01:36:05.279 --> 01:36:07.079
If you'd like to.

1751
01:36:07.140 --> 01:36:08.159
All right.

1752
01:36:08.220 --> 01:36:11.760
Bruce, Brian, Chang Li.

1753
01:36:11.819 --> 01:36:15.119
Oh, I'd marry Chang Li.

1754
01:36:15.180 --> 01:36:16.260
Yeah, me too. rich.

1755
01:36:17.520 --> 01:36:22.140
But also small window into...

1756
01:36:22.199 --> 01:36:24.720
I was going to say just because Year Year is lovely.

1757
01:36:24.779 --> 01:36:26.640
I'd marry, he's very sweet.

1758
01:36:26.699 --> 01:36:38.699
You know, I'd snog Bruce, obviously, because he's snacked and I'd avoid Brian because he's super absent anyway as a boyfriend, isn't he?

1759
01:36:38.760 --> 01:36:45.779
Yeah, well, the thing is, I would actually snonk Brian because I know he's going to leave anyway, so it's fine. stay on the sofa with him.

1760
01:36:45.840 --> 01:36:48.779
And we'd rather say that dating in the 90s, isn't it?

1761
01:36:48.840 --> 01:36:56.579
And yeah, I, yeah, I'd avoid Bruce because... the, you know, neck cracking thing.

1762
01:36:56.640 --> 01:37:00.359
Well, I was just going to say goop is fine, but not mind control goop, thank you.

1763
01:37:02.279 --> 01:37:06.779
And when I said Patrick Lossier is a respected director.

1764
01:37:06.840 --> 01:37:08.579
He did do Terminator Genesis.

1765
01:37:08.640 --> 01:37:09.899
So...

1766
01:37:09.899 --> 01:37:11.399
His cache is just gone down.

1767
01:37:11.460 --> 01:37:12.600
Actually, though, editing...

1768
01:37:12.600 --> 01:37:14.220
I did have an inflation...

1769
01:37:14.279 --> 01:37:16.859
He did the screen films, which are amazing.

1770
01:37:16.920 --> 01:37:18.060
Sorry, Richard, go on.

1771
01:37:18.180 --> 01:37:19.859
No, I was just going to say, editor, right?

1772
01:37:19.920 --> 01:37:24.779
This is there's so many nods to our favourite periods of cinema in this.

1773
01:37:24.840 --> 01:37:26.819
I'm not going to feed you, Nathan.

1774
01:37:29.100 --> 01:37:33.359
In this, that, yeah, I mean, it's not...

1775
01:37:33.420 --> 01:37:35.340
There's lots of things in this I really, really like.

1776
01:37:35.399 --> 01:37:46.380
And yes, there is even my Lena Dietrich lighting on Paul in these, in these, you can see them on the title cards here, just the moment before that when he takes his hands away from his eyes and he's pure Joseph on Sternberg.

1777
01:37:46.439 --> 01:37:51.180
These boys know their cinema history and were aiming for the absolute height.

1778
01:37:51.239 --> 01:37:53.279
They were trying to do the absolute best job they could.

1779
01:37:53.340 --> 01:38:00.600
Some people just aren't very good at knowing what to put in and what to leave out and some of them just tried too hard, Mr. Siegel.

1780
01:38:00.659 --> 01:38:01.199
Yeah.

1781
01:38:01.199 --> 01:38:05.520
And your fat, fidgety little fingers that just kept pushing into the dough.

1782
01:38:05.579 --> 01:38:13.020
If you're trying to make a lovely cake as this podcast, because we're almost at the end, we should go back to our roots, shouldn't we, as this show was trying to do.

1783
01:38:13.079 --> 01:38:25.859
If you're trying to make a lobby scone, for example, don't be pummelling the dough too much, because your gluten intolerance is going to go through the atmospheric scanner ceiling in it.

1784
01:38:25.979 --> 01:38:27.119
Just too many cooks.

1785
01:38:27.180 --> 01:38:28.079
Yeah.

1786
01:38:28.140 --> 01:38:30.420
I saw what you just did there.

1787
01:38:31.140 --> 01:38:34.439
I'm not using the same episode name twice.

1788
01:38:36.479 --> 01:38:40.260
It's one of our glorious Todd rant episodes, I believe.

1789
01:38:41.880 --> 01:38:44.279
We haven't had a Todd rant yet.

1790
01:38:44.340 --> 01:38:50.279
Oh, there was a pretty serious one, what, a week ago?

1791
01:38:50.460 --> 01:38:53.399
And you all enjoyed it and love me for it?

1792
01:38:53.460 --> 01:38:55.199
I'm editing all that out.

1793
01:38:55.979 --> 01:39:01.859
I'm editing that WhatsApp, but I'm going to cut myself some more cake now that Richard mentioned.

1794
01:39:01.920 --> 01:39:03.060
Yeah, I was just talking about the cake.

1795
01:39:03.119 --> 01:39:03.960
Oh, who would I stock?

1796
01:39:04.020 --> 01:39:06.840
I just like to party with Bruce like it's 1996.

1797
01:39:07.739 --> 01:39:10.020
Six slash nine.

1798
01:39:10.079 --> 01:39:11.819
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1799
01:39:12.479 --> 01:39:14.520
Yeah, I agree with you.

1800
01:39:14.579 --> 01:39:16.319
At the time I was very disappointed.

1801
01:39:16.380 --> 01:39:18.840
It didn't go ahead, but it would have gone ahead on the wrong premise.

1802
01:39:18.899 --> 01:39:20.220
I would have liked McGann.

1803
01:39:20.279 --> 01:39:25.619
I did keep thinking, even, even at the last shot is, oh, couldn't we have just had McGam for a season?

1804
01:39:25.680 --> 01:39:27.720
So that's always been there for me.

1805
01:39:27.779 --> 01:39:43.079
And a lot of my friends who I take very seriously in fandom because they also write, I'm not necessarily going to name them, but you know, folk that some of them listen to the podcast and others don't, but and quite women as well, actually, probably mostly women, now I think about it, really wanted McGain to have a shot.

1806
01:39:43.079 --> 01:39:48.359
And he's the reason that this thing is still given any regard or any light and love.

1807
01:39:48.420 --> 01:39:51.899
Well, obviously he's done the time of the doctor 15th anniversary thing.

1808
01:39:51.960 --> 01:39:53.699
And I think he looks really good in that and does a great job.

1809
01:39:53.760 --> 01:39:55.140
And really nicely.

1810
01:39:55.199 --> 01:40:00.960
And also his dark eyes, quadro lodgy, which is now into, I think it's 8th series.

1811
01:40:01.020 --> 01:40:01.979
How many?

1812
01:40:01.979 --> 01:40:03.539
Because you said it 3 times, Nathan.

1813
01:40:03.600 --> 01:40:05.159
Yeah, but he's aged very well.

1814
01:40:05.220 --> 01:40:07.739
Like, he looks very... really well too.

1815
01:40:07.800 --> 01:40:08.939
He really gets it.

1816
01:40:09.000 --> 01:40:10.560
He's just enough and not too much.

1817
01:40:10.619 --> 01:40:12.359
And Eric Roberts is the same.

1818
01:40:12.420 --> 01:40:13.979
I would have liked a lot of just them.

1819
01:40:14.039 --> 01:40:16.920
That would have been fine, but without all the shtick.

1820
01:40:16.979 --> 01:40:19.560
Just Eric Roberts playing it as he'd like to play it.

1821
01:40:19.619 --> 01:40:24.779
Well, I would have I would have nixed Derek Robinson replaced him with a bunch of Tereleptils, actually.

1822
01:40:24.840 --> 01:40:27.659
Well, I mean, you know, that's always on. always, isn't it?

1823
01:40:30.720 --> 01:40:31.739
Sorry, I'm having some...

1824
01:40:31.739 --> 01:40:32.640
No, you've got a mouthful.

1825
01:40:32.699 --> 01:40:35.340
I think we're...

1826
01:40:36.600 --> 01:40:39.000
Yeah, so I think it's time to move on.

1827
01:40:39.060 --> 01:40:48.779
So we will be back next week, new listeners, for a special retrospective episode on the whole damn thing, what we've done in the last 3 years.

1828
01:40:48.840 --> 01:40:51.060
So do come back for that.

1829
01:40:51.119 --> 01:40:59.819
We will be just to telegraph it early, we will be taking a break after that into early next year before we start the new series.

1830
01:40:59.880 --> 01:41:02.579
We um but I'll talk more about that.

1831
01:41:02.640 --> 01:41:04.199
Next episode.

1832
01:41:05.760 --> 01:41:11.279
Sorry, I will edit this because I just want to do that again because it was very disjointed.

1833
01:41:11.340 --> 01:41:17.520
Um, So that's all the time we have for the telly movie, but do come back.

1834
01:41:17.579 --> 01:41:19.020
Fuck, what is wrong with me?

1835
01:41:19.079 --> 01:41:21.300
Okay. think you should leave all this in.

1836
01:41:23.039 --> 01:41:35.640
Well, that's all the time we have for the telly movie, but we will be back next week for one last very special episode on the whole classic series on what we've done over the last 3 years.

1837
01:41:36.840 --> 01:41:38.880
All your fault, Frank.

1838
01:41:38.939 --> 01:41:39.659
I know, right?

1839
01:41:39.720 --> 01:41:54.000
After that, we will be taking a break of a couple of months before we start the new series, but as previously mentioned, we will have a couple of commentaries dotted here and there, the fan choice commentaries that you, as our dear listeners, have chosen.

1840
01:41:54.060 --> 01:42:02.220
So we haven't forgotten those, are it's just that heading into the end of the year, we have availability issues with ourselves.

1841
01:42:02.279 --> 01:42:08.699
We have Nathan going on galavanting off for months on end and well-deserved.

1842
01:42:09.000 --> 01:42:13.560
So, yeah, that's why those will be a bit later.

1843
01:42:13.680 --> 01:42:22.020
But in the meantime, check out our website on flight through entirety.sexy, flight through entirety on Facebook and Apple Podcasts and at FTE podcasts on Twitter.

1844
01:42:22.079 --> 01:42:24.060
I would like to take this opportunity.

1845
01:42:24.119 --> 01:42:27.960
You may have noticed, dear listeners, that we have moved website hosts.

1846
01:42:28.020 --> 01:42:30.720
Nathan did a very good job in keeping everything looking the same.

1847
01:42:30.779 --> 01:42:32.340
So it wasn't a jarring move.

1848
01:42:32.399 --> 01:42:41.880
But that means for the 1st time we have proper analytics because until about 3 weeks ago, we had no concrete idea of how many people were listening.

1849
01:42:41.939 --> 01:42:51.479
So, you know, generally speaking, in terms of people we interact with on social media on a regular basis, you know, we kind of knew definitely that we had 20 people listening a week.

1850
01:42:51.539 --> 01:43:00.239
And Nathan has been sending us figures that we've got a thousand, 1200, 1300 individual listens or downloads.

1851
01:43:00.300 --> 01:43:05.819
And that's not just about new episodes, but people going back and listening to our old episodes, and that is so immensely gratifying.

1852
01:43:05.880 --> 01:43:10.680
So before I go on to the next bit of housekeeping, I just want to thank everyone out there who is listening.

1853
01:43:10.739 --> 01:43:23.640
It is, it's wonderful to know that something that is a passion project for the 4 of us. is being enjoyed by people and people are coming back and listening to more of it.

1854
01:43:24.119 --> 01:43:28.920
So, yeah, just thank you very, very much.

1855
01:43:28.979 --> 01:43:29.939
Thank you.

1856
01:43:30.000 --> 01:43:30.720
Thank you.

1857
01:43:30.840 --> 01:43:33.239
I don't know how you managed it.

1858
01:43:34.079 --> 01:43:36.300
Over on Bondfinger.

1859
01:43:36.359 --> 01:43:38.340
We have finally returned from a long hiatus.

1860
01:43:38.399 --> 01:43:42.539
I would like to apologise because I just haven't been sending days on the recordings.

1861
01:43:42.600 --> 01:43:44.579
I've just been really, really busy.

1862
01:43:44.699 --> 01:43:52.199
But we have some special bond fingers coming up in the next couple of months once we finish Pierce Brosnan's era.

1863
01:43:52.380 --> 01:43:54.899
So do listen out for those.

1864
01:43:54.960 --> 01:44:00.479
So check out Bondfinger.com, Bondfinger on Facebook and Apple Podcasts on Twitter.

1865
01:44:00.539 --> 01:44:05.100
Look, Bondfinger doesn't have as many listeners as Flight through Entirety.

1866
01:44:05.159 --> 01:44:08.340
It is more of a...

1867
01:44:08.399 --> 01:44:09.420
Drunkenfest.

1868
01:44:09.479 --> 01:44:10.380
It's commentaries.

1869
01:44:10.439 --> 01:44:12.479
So people watch them with the film.

1870
01:44:12.539 --> 01:44:13.439
Some people watch them without.

1871
01:44:13.500 --> 01:44:25.920
But again, if you listen to both of our podcasts, thank you, especially, if you want to give Bondfinger a go, we've got about 20 up there at the moment, we've got a huge bag catalogue to look through, and you can just look for your favourite Bond film.

1872
01:44:26.039 --> 01:44:26.460
Just start with mine.

1873
01:44:26.579 --> 01:44:29.039
Yeah, it's the worst.

1874
01:44:29.100 --> 01:44:35.039
Yeah, actually, I think if you want to get a taste of what Bondfinger is actually like, go for Moonbreaker.

1875
01:44:35.520 --> 01:44:37.619
Take a sedative first.

1876
01:44:38.699 --> 01:44:44.579
But until next time, May, none of your special guest stars cover you in goo.

1877
01:44:44.640 --> 01:44:46.199
Thank you very much for listening and good night.

1878
01:44:46.260 --> 01:44:46.560
Good night.

1879
01:44:46.619 --> 01:44:47.460
See you soon.

1880
01:44:47.520 --> 01:44:48.300
Good night.