WEBVTT

NOTE
This transcript was created on 2026-06-07 at 14:08:54

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Hello and welcome to Flight Through Entirety, the only Doctor Who podcast with the subliminal centre you're trained to see.

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I'm Brendan.

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I'm Nathan.

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I'm a Spangly fly curtain in a dry ice meat free, sir.

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And that can only mean one thing that it is time for season 5 of Doctor Who.

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So, uh, with uh, I'm doing a muted hooray.

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With mixed enthusiasm.

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This whole season.

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Should we go through?

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what is this season?

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We talk about season season five.

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But if you're not a regular viewer, what does season 5 mean on the list of Doctor Who stories?

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What were they?

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Well, it is constantly described as the monster season, isn't it?

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Six out of the 7 stories have a definable monster menace.

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In 2 cases, they are a returning monster, and we even have another 2 stories with the same monster in the same season.

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And interestingly, we'll talk about this more next episode.

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But the one story that doesn't have a monster was for years derided as the most terrible story in Patrick Trown's era.

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And yet now that it's turned up, that would be the enemy of the world.

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Now that it's turned up, people are reassessing it, which is very interesting.

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So there's been a lot of reassessing with this season.

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We're headed into the classic or is it 2 of the side men.

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Two of the side of them was very famously lost for some period of time before a copy of all 4 episodes were discovered in the basement of a Mormon church in Hong Kong, I believe, much to Deborah Watling's surprise.

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I think we're all surprised.

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What would the Mormons be doing with...

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Why are they in Hong Kong?

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It had this mythic status. of how wonderful it was because it didn't exist.

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And then when it turned up, it's still regarded very highly, but a lot of that kind of went away because you get things like the dummy cyber controller.

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You can see the Kirby wires when Togerman's being thrown across the room.

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You know, it...

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But really, all it's done is it's only a fence, if you like, was coming down to the same level as the rest of 1960s Doctor Who, when everyone else had elevated it to being like the mummy movies that so clearly inspired.

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Or in fact, it's like every other series of 1966, 67 TV that is about doing one thing and doing it very, very well to get those overseas sales.

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We've talked before about how the colour Diana Riggs season of the Avengers is the same plot, slightly different face costume, slightly different comedy accents for whatever villain it is each week.

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We've got Batman directly opposite Paddy on the ITV network swamping this show, doing the same plot each season, which will actually end up being the death of that show.

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As it kind of was for the Avengers as well.

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Doctor Who seems to be, we talked about this being a very very programmed and received idea of how to do Doctor Who.

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I think this is actually the most radical season of Doctor Who since the beginning, because it's actually looking, maybe for the 1st time, although I think with Patrick, it was always doing this, at what the TV show doctor who is actually about, and being terribly self-conscious, and very much about going right back to being the TV set inside the TV set inside the TV, it's kind of interesting.

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Okay, a lot of people have said, it's the same story, each with a different head on it.

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But there's a lot of variation and interest within that.

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What did you think of abominable sermon?

41
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It's your story.

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Fairwell living too.

43
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Oh, did I get those too confused?

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I do, but that must be...

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This is...

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I mean, if we're talking about the season as a whole.

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I have to completely confess that I haven't quite reached the end of it and that I have no idea what happens in Fury from the D. Oh, you're gonna love it.

48
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Really?

49
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But it's, is it 5 out of 7 that feature the yeti, the cybermen or the ice warriors in some form?

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Yes.

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Yeah, so you've got 2 sidemen, 2 yeti, and an ice warriors.

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And they're interchangeable.

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They sort of vaguely robot shaped people in stupid costumes. menacing a bunch of people on a base.

54
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And I have to say that I found this a bit of a slog really, like I actually kind of found this sort of hard to get through.

55
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Well, unfortunately, Jennifer, I'm actually going to have to be the one who disagrees with you. as we go forward.

56
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That's going to be very interesting.

57
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So looking at Tomb of the Sidemen, it picks up from the end of evil of the Daleks.

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So we leave Scarrow, we've got the new companion in the shape of Victoria, so Victoria's replaced Polly.

59
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Ben has been replaced by the BBC foam machine, which makes its 1st of many appearances in this story.

60
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And the weird thing is, this story, it is so derivative.

61
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Two of the side minutes, so derivative.

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So many other works.

63
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Yeah, so many other shows.

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Absolutely.

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But it is confidently so.

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It's deliberately derivative.

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It's like what we would eventually get in the field of Hingecliff era about 8 years later.

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You know, it's Doctor Who, being other shows, as you preferred to it already, Richard, but very confidently doing so.

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It's not trying to rip off other shows.

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It's trying to pay homage.

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The weird thing is, Tomb of the Sidemen is so successful, because it is so derivative, and it's this weird tension of, it's actually quite good, but it's only good because you've seen it all before.

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Yeah, it's hard to make television in 66, 67 for and this is the catch. for overseas sales.

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Everyone was trying to jump on the Lou Gray, Jerry Anderson hit of the Saint and the Thunderbirds and all those other shows of making big money with overseas sales.

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Doctor Who was always already doing actually quite well in Australia.

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You know, it didn't get immodest fees.

76
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The Saudis liked it.

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Really?

78
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Yeah, they did.

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It's sold to the South that they picked up on Billy very quickly.

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I'm just segueing for a moment.

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It's amazing how much overseas sales are still so important in television.

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Well, isn't it interesting that this season, I wanted to say, we start with tomb of the side, and then we then go to abominable snowmen.

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We then have...

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The Ice Warrior.

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The ice Warriors and we then, and, you know, other than the James Bond segue with Enemy of the World, we've pretty much got the same story each time.

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We haven't we seen that again with Impossible Astronaut, and that's that season of Matt Smith's block that seems very much a mirror of the way that they were making TV in this season, the way you put ideas, as you were saying, from other shows that have been successful, because that's how people are watching at the moment.

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So this is a really interesting window into what was going on in 1967 on that little box in the room, and therefore maybe in a wider way of just how people were responding to culture at the time.

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So 2 of the Cybermen is a beautiful show because of it, it's got that internal dichotomy that it, as all the ones do, that there are some really great things about it and some others are maybe not so great, but it doesn't look iconic, isn't it?

89
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Isn't it actually the Cyberman story?

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Oh, the go to side of the main story?

91
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Absolutely. sort of in that it's terrible. you know what I mean?

92
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The sidemen are kind of disappointing at the best of times, really, because you kind of just wish it would be the Daleks, you know.

93
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And, you know, since the 10th planet, we've had the moon base, which is sort of terribly generic.

94
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And now we have this, and I just think this is a bit of a mess, really.

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Like, you know, it's got a beautiful set piece.

96
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It has some great stuff, shock films.

97
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You've got a cyber leader that's actually kind of, I know what they all say, it's Michael Kilgariff, but, you know, Stephen Fry's quite a tall chat.

98
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It does sound like he's Lord Melcher, doesn't it, with a boy scotter?

99
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But, you know, I just think it's just too much like everything that is around it.

100
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And maybe we can understand.

101
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We can understand why that is and syndication and things, but it just doesn't make for a terribly entertaining show.

102
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Oh, what about the cast?

103
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Well, except for the cast.

104
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So you've got a bunch of people trying to do American accents, I suppose they're American and one of them's Clive Merrison, who will go on to be the deputy chief caretaker in Paradise Towers.

105
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He was too, wasn't he?

106
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And they're considered the greatest Sherlock Holmes radio version of all time, along with Michael Williams, who was doing Judy Dench's husband as Watson.

107
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And they're on BBC.

108
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And on, um, the one that you quote all the time audible. to download?

109
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Yeah, I've just listened to them a lot on the radio.

110
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They are superb.

111
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So, yeah, Cladmer isn't a fantastic in later career.

112
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But then he's also in this.

113
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That's right.

114
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And then you've got, and then what have you got?

115
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Your Professor Harry, who is yet another sort of slight, you know, middle-aged white guy in charge of the...

116
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No, we're getting to see.

117
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Oh, Cyril Chapley's gone China.

118
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And he is fantastic, obviously.

119
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That's not a reference to his leg of alcoholism, is it?

120
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He's a little bit.

121
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It should be a great cast, but it's really making Thunderbirds sound fantastic, isn't it?

122
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And then you put the villains.

123
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You know what I mean?

124
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And this is this is the famous thing, you know, so you've got Eric Cle, you've got Betty Cathay.

125
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And then you've got our 2nd mute black strongman in a row.

126
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So in as many stories.

127
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Just in case you missed the idea the 1st time, right?

128
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Oh, it's not the idea, is it?

129
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It's more of a trope.

130
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But it's a trope, but it's really sort of lazy, insulting, and kind of racist.

131
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Yeah.

132
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Now, what I'm going to say about the characters, yes.

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First of all, I am just going to say that Toberman's characterisation is unforgivable.

134
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And a lot of people cite that, oh, well, the thing is he was meant to be deaf and that's why he didn't speak.

135
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So it's like, right, so not only was it meant to be a racist caricature, he was also meant to make fun of the sable.

136
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Yeah, that doesn't make it better.

137
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And, you know, at the end, when spoiler alert, Toberman has been semi-converting into a cyberman, Betty Kaftan is dead, the doctor has to explain to him that killing people is bad.

138
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He's also treated like he's got no basic morality, no intelligence whatsoever.

139
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Is that because of his colour or is it just, you know, that that's, look, again, this is going back, and you talked about this being a lot of other shows and other films.

140
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It really, Doctor Who does go back to the heyday of British fantasy fiction, which is late Victorian Edwardian writing, and you've always got a big blokey black fellow who's a bit of a thickie, and when they haven't hung up propensity to hitting.

141
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I'm not saying it's good, but it's almost, it's nostalgic racism.

142
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This is the same kind of thing that we criticise the arc for because it's one thing to say that this is like a past text, but really, most of the time when Doctor Who takes a past text and reimagines it, it will try to make the shortcomings of that text better and that just doesn't happen here.

143
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However, Something I do like about the characters in these stories.

144
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And there is a great deal of discussion as well around the fact that the 2 villains, Betty, Captain, and Eric Kleeg, are both non-British with comedy accents.

145
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With comedy.

146
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Well, apart from George Pastel, who's probably using his own name.

147
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Yes, that is his own act.

148
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You know, they are non-British characters.

149
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They are the other, whereas everyone else is British or American in terms of the and actually equally offensive in both.

150
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Is it?

151
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But that's the thing.

152
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The 2 villains are the only guest characters with any intelligence.

153
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Or motivation. or motivation.

154
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Everyone indeed.

155
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Yeah, actually doing that.

156
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What is the doctor doing in this adventure?

157
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Again, that's not horrible.

158
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He does explain his behaviour, I think, sometime in episode 3 where he says, you know, I was trying to work out what you were doing, Cleave, and see, you know, you know, find out what your plan was.

159
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But it's completely strange in episode one.

160
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So their plan is because they learned on this planet.

161
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But it's just like a lovely big density quarry type affair, which is still surprising and a bit exalting when we see it in this story.

162
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I haven't really seen it that many times before.

163
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I think just the savages, really?

164
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That was it.

165
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Yeah, that's it.

166
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Yeah, it's stunning.

167
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Gorgeous use of library music.

168
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Visually, I think this thing is just great.

169
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There's that lovely opening moment where, again, you've got HR, right at HR, or you've got King Solomon's Minds, and they have to open the great doors of this tomb, which we, the viewers already know something's up because there's a logo on those doors and it is a very happy smiley friendly face, isn't it?

170
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It's got junkies.

171
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Yeah, and of course, the 1st bodies already get the floor before the door is open.

172
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Before the door's even open.

173
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Yeah, it's got a nicer pace to it.

174
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So, if people are saying they don't like it, and the racism thing is the most clacksam like thing in it, because, yeah, it's pretty awful to look at for that.

175
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It's just the inherent dumbness of the character's reactions.

176
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And something that we all know.

177
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We've seen this story many times before.

178
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We know what they should be doing to get it right.

179
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They don't internally know themselves.

180
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They're making shocking mistakes all the way through it, aren't they?

181
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You know, I think this too, and discovering this lost race of side of it.

182
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It's the doctor's behaviour, though.

183
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That's the weirdest, right?

184
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Because they get in there and they actually can't get in.

185
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You know, they can't work out how to do the levers to open the match or anything like that.

186
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And a doctor can't resist showing them all and showing off and, you know, doing the logic puzzles and all of that.

187
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And it is this very strange thing where, um, you know, people go, oh, it's the dark and manipulative trout and he's, you know, anticipating Sylvester McCoy is really trying to.

188
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Yeah, we see it now.

189
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Yeah, yeah.

190
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But really, in fact, it's just something that doesn't make a great deal of sense.

191
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It's more like the meddling monk in the story than he is, the doctor that we've known.

192
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It doesn't.

193
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I just don't think there's a sensible in story reason for it.

194
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And he's so propelling his own narrative.

195
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Well, yeah, it's better about it.

196
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Well, he doesn't want to see one episode.

197
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We can't get in.

198
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All right.

199
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We'll go, have families to support.

200
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See, when I actually think about this one is, you know, he's just done the Daleks in, and I think his thought process is he can now do the same to the Cyberman that he needs to get in there.

201
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Are you getting lots of silver watching this, what, rewatching these seasons?

202
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I'm really seeing a lot of, not just Matt.

203
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I'm surprised how much of Matt is in these, especially obviously this story, because this is the one that Matt Smith saw, apparently, when was his defiant, how he played the doctor.

204
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But the, yeah, the troublemaking hit.

205
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There are many colours and shades to this doctor.

206
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He's a much more interesting doctor than I found he'd previously viewing.

207
00:15:18.059 --> 00:15:20.639
And he even says at the end of the story.

208
00:15:20.700 --> 00:15:23.879
You know, they were just asleep for centuries.

209
00:15:23.940 --> 00:15:25.320
Now it must be forever.

210
00:15:25.379 --> 00:15:36.600
It's the doctor just trying to, in this case, not destroy the cybermen so much, but take them out of the equation and really it doesn't matter who gets hurt in the pro.

211
00:15:36.659 --> 00:15:38.639
He's really great on the collateral, isn't he?

212
00:15:38.700 --> 00:15:39.840
This whole season.

213
00:15:39.899 --> 00:15:40.440
Good luck.

214
00:15:40.500 --> 00:15:41.700
It's the red shirt principle.

215
00:15:41.759 --> 00:15:48.360
If you're wearing a Tommy, if you're carrying a Tommy gun and looking a bit working class, you're not picking for a good story.

216
00:15:48.539 --> 00:15:59.399
But that being said, we also have in their story that part of what has happened previously with the collateral, with the death of Edward Waterfield, that he has taken Victoria under his wing.

217
00:15:59.399 --> 00:16:05.940
And of course, we get that lovely off-quoted scene of him discussing the notion of family Victoria.

218
00:16:06.480 --> 00:16:11.940
Oh, I can remember my family if I really want to, but the rest of the time they sleep in my mind.

219
00:16:12.000 --> 00:16:17.159
Or actually on a bomb site in deserted London in a 100 or something years time.

220
00:16:17.279 --> 00:16:19.559
But, you know, we might worry about that, will we?

221
00:16:19.679 --> 00:16:22.679
Yeah, but I mean, and that leads me to something else.

222
00:16:22.740 --> 00:16:28.440
I wanted to say about the story in that I think, and I'll be discussing this more as the season goes on, the Victoria.

223
00:16:28.440 --> 00:16:31.740
And especially Deborah Watley gets a really short shrift.

224
00:16:31.799 --> 00:16:32.879
I think so too.

225
00:16:32.940 --> 00:16:35.519
But I think that's turning around now with the recently discovered episodes.

226
00:16:35.639 --> 00:16:38.340
No, I think she gets a deservedly short shrift.

227
00:16:38.399 --> 00:16:39.480
Oh, really?

228
00:16:39.539 --> 00:16:43.860
But in this story, you know, for example, yes, there's that lovely moment that we all talk about.

229
00:16:43.980 --> 00:16:47.460
But it's only a few 10 seconds, 30 seconds under the rest of it.

230
00:16:47.519 --> 00:16:52.139
She's as dumb as 6 coats of lead paint on a Victorian facade.

231
00:16:52.200 --> 00:16:53.820
She's given nothing.

232
00:16:53.879 --> 00:16:57.480
She moans, she squirrels, she does dumb things in cupboards.

233
00:16:57.539 --> 00:17:00.840
She takes on, she takes it, she takes on capstan and wins.

234
00:17:00.899 --> 00:17:08.220
She also has like a fun line in teasing the, um, Crimea, like Americans.

235
00:17:08.279 --> 00:17:09.420
Yeah, actually, thank you.

236
00:17:09.420 --> 00:17:10.019
She does do that.

237
00:17:10.079 --> 00:17:12.779
So you're willing to back off a bit on that position.

238
00:17:12.839 --> 00:17:13.500
No, I'm not.

239
00:17:13.559 --> 00:17:16.140
So it's a very sort of strange thing.

240
00:17:16.200 --> 00:17:19.380
We introduced a sort of, you know, and she's the new companion.

241
00:17:19.440 --> 00:17:22.079
She's from the Victorian era.

242
00:17:22.140 --> 00:17:23.640
She's just lost her father.

243
00:17:23.700 --> 00:17:25.019
You know, she's all.

244
00:17:25.019 --> 00:17:25.799
And her entire world.

245
00:17:25.859 --> 00:17:27.059
Yeah, that's interesting.

246
00:17:27.119 --> 00:17:34.140
So the 1st thing she does is pull on a mini skirt for those sort of redly discernable reasons and a very proper pointy bra.

247
00:17:34.259 --> 00:17:37.380
An uplift, cobble, concord was being launched at the time.

248
00:17:37.440 --> 00:17:37.920
You know?

249
00:17:37.920 --> 00:17:43.079
Howard Hughes had already done it for Jane Russell, with the cues on a cut shoving a couple of cues on our walks, done it.

250
00:17:43.140 --> 00:17:49.619
You know, the story that Howard Hughes invented the great, the tip-up wired underwired suspension bra for Jane Russell's.

251
00:17:49.619 --> 00:17:52.200
So, how we thing?

252
00:17:52.259 --> 00:17:55.380
So how would Victoria even know what that was?

253
00:17:55.440 --> 00:17:58.440
Well, the TARDIS has many rooms we've still not seen.

254
00:17:58.500 --> 00:18:01.140
I mean, because that some of them are costume museums.

255
00:18:01.200 --> 00:18:09.119
There must have been somewhere along the paths, there have been doctors who have been all the aspects of the doctor we don't know, and one of them is that he's besties with.

256
00:18:09.119 --> 00:18:15.599
Hell of a lot of people at Victoria and Albert. she's I think he's a bit of a cosplay queen on the TV.

257
00:18:15.660 --> 00:18:17.940
Well, he's certainly got a lot of outfits in that.

258
00:18:18.000 --> 00:18:23.160
He was married to Marilyn Monroe, so she might have lectured in bras, you know, fine for...

259
00:18:23.160 --> 00:18:24.660
Thank you, Stephen Moffatt for doing that again.

260
00:18:24.720 --> 00:18:31.380
You see, I actually think that this is perfectly in keeping with Victoria's character.

261
00:18:31.440 --> 00:18:32.579
She's had a massive shock.

262
00:18:32.640 --> 00:18:39.720
Richard, you and I were discussing this earlier before the podcast and people who do have massive shocks will kind of sort of change everything.

263
00:18:39.779 --> 00:18:41.640
You know, I must change.

264
00:18:41.700 --> 00:18:47.400
I must renew myself. based behaviour and it does take on the appearance of addiction and some of them can be.

265
00:18:47.460 --> 00:18:49.559
Yeah, some can be those huge.

266
00:18:49.619 --> 00:18:53.160
And she does have her moment of doubt, but don't you think this skirt is too short?

267
00:18:53.220 --> 00:18:58.259
She sort of says to the doctor, you know, she's obviously thrown it on and kind of go, oh, okay, this is interesting.

268
00:18:58.319 --> 00:19:03.660
Okay, I'll go out wearing this, but then it's caught up with her and actually was just such a good idea.

269
00:19:03.720 --> 00:19:07.440
Yeah, I like to think that there are like the big finish things.

270
00:19:07.500 --> 00:19:16.619
There are stories in between the stories we see where we get character development because it's the only way to explain the quantum leaps that don't actually make a lot of sense of characters development.

271
00:19:16.680 --> 00:19:24.119
Somehow Jamie's able to read not only the console in later episodes, but read London underground maps, even though he's never seen an underground train before.

272
00:19:24.180 --> 00:19:27.660
And there's a whole, yeah, we just have to read that as being under the story.

273
00:19:27.720 --> 00:19:28.500
You don't.

274
00:19:28.619 --> 00:19:40.319
Well, no, I just think, I think, you know, it is this thing where the characters kind of have an origin story because of the story that they're introduced in, but we're not really particularly interested in that.

275
00:19:40.380 --> 00:19:48.420
And it is kind of, um, you know, essentially Victoria's role isn't to be, you know, a well-rounded, interesting person.

276
00:19:48.480 --> 00:19:50.819
It's to be menaced by monsters for a year.

277
00:19:50.880 --> 00:19:52.200
And she does that very well.

278
00:19:52.259 --> 00:19:56.880
She has lots of screaming and lots of, oh, Chaney, you know, sort of little skirts.

279
00:19:56.940 --> 00:20:02.039
And, and, you know, like this week she's wearing, you know, a shop girl frog.

280
00:20:02.099 --> 00:20:12.720
And then next week she's back in sort of Victorian attire, you know, when she gets to London Underground, she's wearing a sort of hippie frock, it just all doesn't really make any sense, you know, as far as I can see.

281
00:20:12.779 --> 00:20:21.660
See, I disagree because even in evil of the dialects, we saw that Victoria was quite rebellious and independent, especially for a young girl of that time period.

282
00:20:21.779 --> 00:20:24.059
You know, she talks back to the Daleks.

283
00:20:24.119 --> 00:20:28.500
She is friends with a servant and a black servant.

284
00:20:28.740 --> 00:20:30.000
Big black servant.

285
00:20:30.059 --> 00:20:33.359
I think there's a lot of reasons she's wearing a push-up or a little skirt.

286
00:20:33.420 --> 00:20:34.619
You know, she's not a little girl.

287
00:20:34.680 --> 00:20:41.700
No, I just think I think she's, you know, like again, we've met Debbie Waddling at conventions and she's absolutely lovely.

288
00:20:41.759 --> 00:20:42.480
Do you know what I mean?

289
00:20:42.539 --> 00:20:48.779
Like, then the character is just, like, smug cigars and swirl beer, like a soda.

290
00:20:48.839 --> 00:20:49.920
No, well, that's what I meant.

291
00:20:49.980 --> 00:20:50.640
Probably, yeah.

292
00:20:50.700 --> 00:20:52.500
She only a black eye once.

293
00:20:52.559 --> 00:20:54.420
She did too, yeah.

294
00:20:54.480 --> 00:20:55.619
Listen, she did.

295
00:20:55.680 --> 00:20:57.000
Watch it.

296
00:20:57.539 --> 00:21:01.619
Anyway, we meant to duck, you know, it was some playful journey.

297
00:21:01.680 --> 00:21:02.759
Oh, yes, yes, I know.

298
00:21:03.420 --> 00:21:04.500
We have to take the hit.

299
00:21:04.559 --> 00:21:08.160
I secretly wanted to. punched me in the face.

300
00:21:08.220 --> 00:21:09.119
It was flaws.

301
00:21:09.299 --> 00:21:12.779
That's the type of my upcoming autobiography.

302
00:21:12.839 --> 00:21:15.420
So there's lots unaddressed.

303
00:21:15.480 --> 00:21:18.059
We have, but we kind of know it because you know what?

304
00:21:18.119 --> 00:21:22.859
If we've missed the points of the plot, this story, we'll get you within the next one.

305
00:21:22.859 --> 00:21:24.900
And the one after that as well.

306
00:21:24.960 --> 00:21:31.200
So, yeah, we're off on retreat in Tibet with the abominable snowman.

307
00:21:31.259 --> 00:21:32.339
What are those spots that sit out?

308
00:21:38.400 --> 00:21:42.299
Unfortunately, we're now back to stories which are largely missing.

309
00:21:42.660 --> 00:21:54.599
But where we have the benefits of this one of the really good loose cannon reconstruction complete with CGI yetis, which are one of the greatest things.

310
00:21:54.660 --> 00:21:56.339
How do they move?

311
00:21:56.400 --> 00:21:58.619
I'll be the casual listener.

312
00:21:58.680 --> 00:22:00.839
I have a Chambly sort of move..

313
00:22:03.960 --> 00:22:11.039
They move sorted, as you might imagine, someone in that kind of suit moving.

314
00:22:11.099 --> 00:22:17.700
Like, the legs sort of have a circular motion as they they come around. and yak skirts with kamboos.

315
00:22:17.759 --> 00:22:22.079
Georgia State dances after a bit of champagne, I would imagine.

316
00:22:22.200 --> 00:22:24.059
By the way, cheers, dear listen.

317
00:22:24.119 --> 00:22:30.779
They actually got John Levine in to do motion capture like a whole week.

318
00:22:30.839 --> 00:22:36.420
He was in a sort of tracksuit covered in dots and that's how they animated the Essie.

319
00:22:36.480 --> 00:22:43.259
You're looking at me as if, uh, No, I had the same Tibetan primate body movement by John Levine.

320
00:22:43.319 --> 00:22:45.180
Is it John Levine?

321
00:22:45.240 --> 00:22:46.200
Yeah, he is.

322
00:22:46.859 --> 00:22:47.700
Oh, no.

323
00:22:48.779 --> 00:22:54.599
He's in Webber Theatre. as we are getting ahead of ourselves.

324
00:22:54.660 --> 00:22:57.299
He is also the yeti who turns up for a cameo in the war game.

325
00:22:57.359 --> 00:23:03.480
He's the go- he's the go-to 2nd banana for full brigadier in all the 70s series.

326
00:23:03.539 --> 00:23:07.559
I forget that some of the friends listeners actually covered for shows.

327
00:23:07.680 --> 00:23:09.299
So we're getting ahead of us.

328
00:23:09.359 --> 00:23:13.440
Is Martin Jarvis in one of his...

329
00:23:13.440 --> 00:23:14.579
And Rosalind De Winter.

330
00:23:14.640 --> 00:23:16.019
Rosal's doing to see what?

331
00:23:16.019 --> 00:23:16.980
And several Shep.

332
00:23:17.039 --> 00:23:18.720
Michael Sheen, Michael Sheen.

333
00:23:18.839 --> 00:23:21.420
Michael Sheen plays the monastery.

334
00:23:21.539 --> 00:23:24.299
Oddly enough as well.

335
00:23:24.359 --> 00:23:26.819
But this is the American Jackie Lane.

336
00:23:26.819 --> 00:23:28.259
I mean, that episode gets mustered.

337
00:23:28.319 --> 00:23:28.740
Yeah, of course.

338
00:23:28.799 --> 00:23:30.240
Just before we go on with this episode.

339
00:23:31.859 --> 00:23:34.680
I'd like to introduce our baked good for this episode.

340
00:23:34.740 --> 00:23:47.039
I have made a ginger and lime yeti cake, and the recipe will be on the website, and as you will see on the website, it is topped with a yeti made out of crystalised ginger.

341
00:23:47.339 --> 00:23:49.920
And we've already whooped out.

342
00:23:49.980 --> 00:23:51.359
Yeah, so we'd rather enjoying that.

343
00:23:51.420 --> 00:23:55.799
Is it is it the is it the ECSE or the or the weather?

344
00:23:55.859 --> 00:24:03.240
No, no, the well, it was pretty fat yet, although I couldn't resist putting in eyes because I still had some couchos from my teacher cushing treats.

345
00:24:03.900 --> 00:24:05.759
Now, abominable snowmen.

346
00:24:05.819 --> 00:24:07.799
It's quite an interesting story.

347
00:24:07.859 --> 00:24:09.420
It sounds beautiful.

348
00:24:09.480 --> 00:24:10.619
Love this show.

349
00:24:10.680 --> 00:24:11.940
No music, is there?

350
00:24:12.000 --> 00:24:15.180
It's like a tone of it, the voice joke, because yeah, it's a so new.

351
00:24:15.180 --> 00:24:16.920
I know this from the target novel.

352
00:24:16.980 --> 00:24:27.420
Again, it's a ripper, and I think one of the reasons this season is so well fondly remembered is that people of our generation, one generation, grew up with these as target books, they didn't exist in any other form.

353
00:24:27.480 --> 00:24:28.859
This is a scorcher.

354
00:24:29.220 --> 00:24:32.279
It's one of the novels I've read.

355
00:24:32.400 --> 00:24:36.539
I read as child, along with leather fear, which is probably even better, actually.

356
00:24:36.599 --> 00:24:37.440
Yeah, absolutely.

357
00:24:37.500 --> 00:24:40.380
The ending of that novel form was terrifying.

358
00:24:41.339 --> 00:24:45.660
I mean, as you say, Richard, the soundscape in this one is absolutely amazing.

359
00:24:45.720 --> 00:24:52.380
One of the great things is each of the main locations, you pretty much got the mountain, you've got the cave, and you've got the monastery.

360
00:24:52.440 --> 00:24:59.700
Each of those has its own soundscape, the monastery sort of has a bit of an echo, usually has chanting in the background.

361
00:24:59.759 --> 00:25:06.059
The mountain has that sort of ever-present wind and the cave has the thrumming of the yeti spheres.

362
00:25:06.180 --> 00:25:09.960
It is such a texturally rich story in that way.

363
00:25:10.019 --> 00:25:12.000
It's also very rich in terms of character.

364
00:25:12.059 --> 00:25:15.960
You know, after we had the cliche characters of Tomb of the Cybermen.

365
00:25:16.079 --> 00:25:21.420
We have a collection of very complex supporting characters.

366
00:25:21.480 --> 00:25:23.700
For the 1st couple of episodes.

367
00:25:23.759 --> 00:25:30.420
Uh, you know, Creissong and Travellers sort of seem to be uh, taking the role of the villain between them.

368
00:25:30.480 --> 00:25:36.420
But as the story goes on, they're actually given a bit of depth and a bit of motivation to their actions.

369
00:25:36.480 --> 00:25:38.579
Can we can we say who they are?

370
00:25:38.640 --> 00:25:48.240
So Krisong is Norman Jones, who is Major Baker from the Siberia. and also Auronymus. where his goose lays adult eggs.

371
00:25:48.299 --> 00:25:49.380
Yes, from the mask.

372
00:25:49.380 --> 00:25:51.900
He's cock froze 3 times before breakfast.

373
00:25:51.960 --> 00:25:52.859
You get to see him do that.

374
00:25:52.920 --> 00:25:56.640
And of course, Professor Travis, wonderful Professor Travis.

375
00:25:56.700 --> 00:25:58.500
The famous Jack Watling.

376
00:25:58.559 --> 00:25:58.859
Yes.

377
00:25:58.859 --> 00:26:00.180
Also the father.

378
00:26:00.240 --> 00:26:02.039
The grandson of Jeffrey Watling.

379
00:26:02.220 --> 00:26:04.380
It's really good to see.

380
00:26:04.500 --> 00:26:16.980
And it was actually she who suggested him for the part, you know, she was talking to some of the production stuff and there was this role coming up for an explorer and adventurer and she said, well, you know, daddy's not doing anything at the moment.

381
00:26:17.039 --> 00:26:17.880
How about you get him in?

382
00:26:17.940 --> 00:26:20.160
And he was a big coop because he was a big film actor.

383
00:26:20.220 --> 00:26:29.579
And I have to say he's very handsome and swarthy, you know, he feels like the Indiana Jones of the 1960s.

384
00:26:29.640 --> 00:26:37.500
This works because it's a stage production with stage act is actually a lot of Welsh blokes and a few English ones pretending to be Tibetan.

385
00:26:37.559 --> 00:26:45.720
You got Jack doing that whole stagey, India, as you say, um, out of quarter mate from Kicks on Spines.

386
00:26:45.779 --> 00:26:49.019
This story, and I think this Doctor Who is doing that whole thing.

387
00:26:49.079 --> 00:26:59.460
I actually think this whole season of Doctor Who is tapping in in a tiny whining way to Nathan's randomiser and just putting in 3 or 4 ideas, pressing the button, you get 3 or 4 ideas each story.

388
00:26:59.519 --> 00:27:08.400
So we just had Mummy's tombs, cybermen, robots, um, big black, Strong eye and ooh, did you forget your phone last story?

389
00:27:08.460 --> 00:27:10.859
Yes, yes, we got some phone shaving creeks.

390
00:27:10.920 --> 00:27:12.119
That's right.

391
00:27:12.180 --> 00:27:14.099
Oh, no, you get what we go machine.

392
00:27:14.160 --> 00:27:15.119
It was cooked into the soup.

393
00:27:15.539 --> 00:27:18.240
So this story we get default phone.

394
00:27:18.299 --> 00:27:19.619
Yes, we do.

395
00:27:19.680 --> 00:27:21.180
We get...

396
00:27:21.180 --> 00:27:32.160
The abominable snowman, the monster assist, but we also get these lovely things of, like, I like that you mentioned Indiana Jones, because we're going back to what's another great adventure story we could lift off?

397
00:27:32.220 --> 00:27:34.859
It's James Hilton's Lost Horizon from 1933.

398
00:27:35.160 --> 00:27:37.440
Yeah, that's the famous Tibet fan.

399
00:27:37.500 --> 00:27:38.579
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

400
00:27:38.640 --> 00:27:42.119
Listen to a really nice radio version that had actually Stuart Head in it.

401
00:27:42.180 --> 00:27:43.799
Jurassic Dune show.

402
00:27:43.859 --> 00:27:49.920
There's a, well, it's actually all based on a good show story, but he saw it was a good show that works really well like that.

403
00:27:49.980 --> 00:27:56.880
But again, this is this nice thing of I really like this period of 60s TV where you can just throw everything into the oven and see what comes out.

404
00:27:56.940 --> 00:27:59.940
Do you think this is a successful story?

405
00:28:00.000 --> 00:28:10.200
I do actually think it's very successful and part of what makes it successful for me is it manages to play with expected roles.

406
00:28:10.500 --> 00:28:17.700
For various groups of people with really only a very small cast of characters.

407
00:28:17.759 --> 00:28:23.460
You do have a lot of supporting monks who get lines, but really the only ones are croissant and songstand, the Abbot.

408
00:28:23.759 --> 00:28:25.500
Oh, and Tommy.

409
00:28:25.559 --> 00:28:27.359
Oh, and Tommy, of course, Tommy.

410
00:28:27.420 --> 00:28:37.680
For us, I do want to mention, Tommy is the late David Spencer, who passed away last year, life partner of one of the script editors, the Doctor of Time Victor Penderton.

411
00:28:37.740 --> 00:28:38.819
I didn't know any of that.

412
00:28:38.880 --> 00:28:40.380
I think he's terrific in this.

413
00:28:40.440 --> 00:28:42.059
In the only episode we get to see.

414
00:28:42.119 --> 00:28:44.759
This one's directed by Gerald Blake.

415
00:28:44.819 --> 00:28:50.880
Beautifully lit, is directed again, like a great British cafe film of the 30s.

416
00:28:50.940 --> 00:28:52.859
It has a really lovely feel at that period.

417
00:28:52.920 --> 00:29:03.119
And it has enough confidence to say, we can remake this era. reshow you this era of great film tradition and get it and do it right and do it even better.

418
00:29:03.180 --> 00:29:04.859
It's okay to be borrowing.

419
00:29:04.920 --> 00:29:06.599
It's okay to be throwing things in.

420
00:29:06.660 --> 00:29:08.940
The audience didn't mind if they enjoyed it and recognised it.

421
00:29:09.000 --> 00:29:10.500
I'm enjoying it for the same reason.

422
00:29:10.619 --> 00:29:17.160
Well, I got shown a film by a friend of the podcast, Robert. called The Abominable Snowman.

423
00:29:17.220 --> 00:29:20.160
Oh, yeah, and it starts me to Cushing.

424
00:29:20.220 --> 00:29:21.059
We own it.

425
00:29:21.119 --> 00:29:21.660
Yeah, yeah.

426
00:29:21.720 --> 00:29:25.859
And it is Yeti attacking a monastery in Tibet.

427
00:29:25.920 --> 00:29:27.359
And it's from a few years earlier.

428
00:29:27.420 --> 00:29:29.640
I think it's from the sort of late 50s of town.

429
00:29:29.759 --> 00:29:32.579
And so it's clearly, do you know what I mean?

430
00:29:32.700 --> 00:29:35.400
Like, again, it's Doctor Who's fantastic to see that one.

431
00:29:35.460 --> 00:29:40.440
So it is another example of Doctor Who sort of pondering popular culture and stuff and all that's very laudable.

432
00:29:40.500 --> 00:29:42.539
That's exactly what we want the show to do.

433
00:29:42.599 --> 00:29:45.660
But I have to say, again.

434
00:29:45.720 --> 00:29:51.119
I can see the word tiresome heading inexorably towards this part of the podcast.

435
00:29:51.180 --> 00:29:53.519
Look, I mean, I sort of think it's okay.

436
00:29:53.579 --> 00:29:57.900
I think it's laudable to do like a non-European thing for once.

437
00:29:58.019 --> 00:30:01.319
Cree song actually looks like he might be Tibetan.

438
00:30:01.380 --> 00:30:03.900
No one else looks like there's...

439
00:30:03.960 --> 00:30:05.220
Yeah, that's okay.

440
00:30:05.279 --> 00:30:06.660
Yeah, it's a...

441
00:30:06.720 --> 00:30:08.759
You see it more as rep theatre.

442
00:30:08.819 --> 00:30:09.240
Yeah exactly.

443
00:30:09.299 --> 00:30:24.119
You know, thankfully they don't try to say do, if you like yellow face, they put on, they put on a bit, a bit of makeup colour, but you know, they don't try to approach it in a stereotypical.

444
00:30:24.240 --> 00:30:31.140
Not Stan doesn't look like he's been anywhere sort of east of, except maybe Covent Garden, calling a couple of prize marrows.

445
00:30:31.200 --> 00:30:32.819
Yeah, that's what I mean.

446
00:30:32.880 --> 00:30:45.059
It could be like something that Doctor Who does later that's very controversial and actually build up the brow and make narrower eyes to make a Caucasian actor look Asian.

447
00:30:45.119 --> 00:30:46.079
They wouldn't do that, sure.

448
00:30:46.140 --> 00:30:46.980
No, no, no.

449
00:30:47.039 --> 00:30:47.700
That's crazy.

450
00:30:47.759 --> 00:30:53.220
And you see, that's actually why I quite like it because, you know, it does involve the suspension of disbelief.

451
00:30:53.279 --> 00:30:58.680
But also you've got an inversion of gender roles, in my opinion.

452
00:30:58.740 --> 00:31:00.420
Now 1st of all, just on the surface level.

453
00:31:00.480 --> 00:31:06.900
Victoria is wandering around in really quite masculine mountaineering gear, you know.

454
00:31:06.960 --> 00:31:08.940
She's wearing a coat, she's wearing trousers.

455
00:31:09.000 --> 00:31:10.740
Jamie's wearing a skirt and carrying a man bag.

456
00:31:10.799 --> 00:31:13.200
I know, but she's cinched at the waist, you know what I mean?

457
00:31:13.259 --> 00:31:14.339
She's got a little fluffy thing.

458
00:31:14.400 --> 00:31:18.000
She looks very Victorian. like this outfit a lot more. like her in this.

459
00:31:18.059 --> 00:31:19.980
Yeah, she's so proactive.

460
00:31:20.039 --> 00:31:21.059
Again, she is.

461
00:31:21.119 --> 00:31:21.839
I'm strong.

462
00:31:21.960 --> 00:31:22.980
I love this.

463
00:31:23.039 --> 00:31:34.140
She's got that sort of entitled European thing and you get it with Travis as well, where the monks kind of automatically defer to Travers, because he's an Englishman.

464
00:31:34.200 --> 00:31:35.099
Big Whitey.

465
00:31:35.160 --> 00:31:37.559
He's an Englishman and he's trustworthy.

466
00:31:37.619 --> 00:31:48.539
And she, like Victoria's kind of arrogates to herself the high position that as a European, she sort of deserves.

467
00:31:48.599 --> 00:31:52.440
And so like there is a sort of respect to the whole sort of Buddhist thing.

468
00:31:52.500 --> 00:32:04.559
No one, you know, openly makes fun of her or anything, but there is, there is a kind of, a sort of inadvertent, not racism exactly, but sort of Euro-centrism or a Victorian attitude.

469
00:32:04.619 --> 00:32:05.160
Yeah.

470
00:32:05.220 --> 00:32:06.000
Yeah, that's it.

471
00:32:06.000 --> 00:32:07.559
It's a Victorian attitude to the...

472
00:32:07.559 --> 00:32:11.460
But it's also harking back to that stronger writing, that period, right?

473
00:32:11.460 --> 00:32:13.920
This is a period, please, not from the 60s, but from the 30s.

474
00:32:13.980 --> 00:32:17.400
Nathan, I know you're not convinced stressed by the fact that Victoria's wearing trousers.

475
00:32:17.460 --> 00:32:18.599
So I am just going to buy this.

476
00:32:18.779 --> 00:32:20.099
Only you could see his face, listener.

477
00:32:20.160 --> 00:32:22.140
He looks utterly convinced.

478
00:32:22.200 --> 00:32:32.700
The other thing I want to talk about in terms of Victoria. is the fact that she's such a strong driving force in the narrative.

479
00:32:32.759 --> 00:32:38.400
It's Victoria, who is constantly trying to get in to see Pava Samovar and find out what's going on.

480
00:32:38.460 --> 00:32:41.759
Now, the thing is, it is padding because she drives about 3 times, it keeps being driven away.

481
00:32:41.880 --> 00:32:42.900
But she's pushing it.

482
00:32:42.960 --> 00:32:43.980
Yeah, she's pushing it.

483
00:32:44.039 --> 00:32:50.400
But it's actually the monk's dedication to their faith that keeps her out.

484
00:32:50.460 --> 00:32:54.299
So in a way, even though she is trying to go against their traditions.

485
00:32:54.359 --> 00:32:56.759
She does respect them because when she's caught, she's like, okay, I'll back off.

486
00:32:56.819 --> 00:33:01.920
When they think she's revived the yeti, they're ready to sacrifice her.

487
00:33:01.980 --> 00:33:06.420
You know, they're ready to put her out there with the yeti. let them take her.

488
00:33:06.480 --> 00:33:19.619
So, I mean, I don't think it's entirely there's a great white hope colonial. is kind of pulling the rug out from under that because yes, Victoria does kind of back what she owns the place and then almost gets killed because of it.

489
00:33:19.740 --> 00:33:25.740
Victoria does lose some of the initiative in the last 2 episodes when she's hypnotised by Pamba Sambatore.

490
00:33:25.799 --> 00:33:29.579
But the interest is... also quite interesting and threatening it is. pretty good.

491
00:33:29.640 --> 00:33:31.019
Yeah, it's very invasive.

492
00:33:31.079 --> 00:33:38.819
And also, the doctor picks up that something is wrong with her because she's panicking and screaming and the doctor's reaction is like, that's not Victoria.

493
00:33:38.880 --> 00:33:42.960
Well, no, I mean, she repeats the same sentence with the same intonation over and over again.

494
00:33:43.019 --> 00:33:45.000
It's a fairly characteristic sentence.

495
00:33:45.059 --> 00:33:45.779
Do you know what I mean?

496
00:33:45.839 --> 00:33:48.779
It's like, doctor, we must leave, whatever, but she's...

497
00:33:48.839 --> 00:33:53.039
It's a great little note on what the season itself is doing, isn't it?

498
00:33:53.220 --> 00:33:56.819
And Patrick's actually not buying a bar.

499
00:33:56.880 --> 00:33:57.720
I like that.

500
00:33:57.779 --> 00:34:02.700
And the thing is when she sort of wakes up, she doesn't go, oh, it was horrible enough.

501
00:34:02.700 --> 00:34:05.039
She just kind of goes, oh, that was a bit weird.

502
00:34:05.099 --> 00:34:05.759
I'm very tired.

503
00:34:05.819 --> 00:34:12.900
Yeah, I, I am continuing to think Victoria is great here and she has a great relationship with Tommy.

504
00:34:12.960 --> 00:34:16.980
It's actually Jamie, who throughout the whole story, the doctor feels needs supervision.

505
00:34:17.039 --> 00:34:22.619
And he's absolutely Victoria on her own to her own devices, but he has to take Jamie with him.

506
00:34:22.739 --> 00:34:28.380
And it sums up in that line in the existing 2nd episode of Doctor, I've got an idea for dealing with the yeti.

507
00:34:28.440 --> 00:34:30.360
The doctor's responses, come along, Victoria.

508
00:34:30.420 --> 00:34:32.219
Discretion is the better part of ballot.

509
00:34:32.280 --> 00:34:33.300
JB has an idea.

510
00:34:33.360 --> 00:34:34.559
Isn't it a great?

511
00:34:34.619 --> 00:34:45.179
And it's not the only one that I, it's like the complete nettle break, breakdown joke in, to me. apologises.

512
00:34:45.239 --> 00:34:45.539
Yeah.

513
00:34:45.599 --> 00:34:49.079
We haven't mentioned the thing that's really great about this when we talk about sound.

514
00:34:49.139 --> 00:34:50.400
Adam Sandoval.

515
00:34:50.460 --> 00:34:51.599
Oh yes, that voice.

516
00:34:51.659 --> 00:34:53.400
And the way that's lit.

517
00:34:53.460 --> 00:35:01.739
Both voices, of course, because he's always a pen in December, but coming from the one actor, very subtle difference.

518
00:35:01.800 --> 00:35:02.880
It's a beautiful.

519
00:35:02.880 --> 00:35:03.960
It's really trippy.

520
00:35:04.019 --> 00:35:06.360
And that's the other thing I wanted to say about this.

521
00:35:06.420 --> 00:35:09.000
This is the whole Abby Hoffman, Alan Ginsberg.

522
00:35:09.059 --> 00:35:10.199
Woo, woo.

523
00:35:10.260 --> 00:35:15.539
She asked the beginning of Timothy Leary, LSD stuff that's hitting Britain in popular culture.

524
00:35:15.599 --> 00:35:18.420
Tibet was a big hot topic at the time.

525
00:35:18.480 --> 00:35:19.079
Yes.

526
00:35:19.079 --> 00:35:26.880
Not the history of, and because I'm really looking forward to what you want to say about the history of at the time previously in what was going on with Tibet politically.

527
00:35:26.940 --> 00:35:29.820
But the English and the Yaks, and the Australians.

528
00:35:29.880 --> 00:35:38.340
We're looking at this at Tibetan being, you know, the whole cock counterculture period of what it is, consciousness, what it is to be a person in the world, we were looking.

529
00:35:38.340 --> 00:35:43.559
Towards Buddhism as a notion of transcendence.

530
00:35:43.679 --> 00:35:46.380
How amazing is the great intelligence.

531
00:35:46.440 --> 00:35:48.539
And we'll pick this up with web of fear.

532
00:35:48.659 --> 00:35:53.639
It exists in, and it's referred to in the novel and again in the audio, this in the script. it's in the scripts.

533
00:35:53.699 --> 00:35:55.139
It exists in the astral plane.

534
00:35:55.199 --> 00:35:59.820
Padma Samatha encountered the great intelligence on the astral plane where he's meditating.

535
00:35:59.880 --> 00:36:10.079
It's an ancient sage head of the lamasary, and that brings this evil to earth, without realising the consequences, just by meeting this guy, this great mind.

536
00:36:10.139 --> 00:36:12.599
The TARDIS encounters it within the vortex.

537
00:36:12.659 --> 00:36:16.199
The vortex in Doctor Who is the astral plane.

538
00:36:16.260 --> 00:36:19.920
There's a whole lot of really wahippie woo woo great stuff.

539
00:36:19.980 --> 00:36:22.440
Timothy Leary would have been watching this show and loving it.

540
00:36:22.500 --> 00:36:28.320
And it goes back to something you said before about the time I said, it can move through time space in different stages of matter and consciousness.

541
00:36:28.380 --> 00:36:30.420
What is the TARDIS?

542
00:36:30.480 --> 00:36:35.099
Not that nervous song that we get when we start talking about what the TARDIS actually is.

543
00:36:35.820 --> 00:36:38.460
Guilty, not so guilty pleasure.

544
00:36:38.519 --> 00:36:43.619
This is my favourite story of the season because of the sound of lightscaping. from what we can see.

545
00:36:43.679 --> 00:36:50.159
Again, I know it as a title book from that, but just the pace of it, the feel of it, the antecedence of this story that I really love.

546
00:36:50.219 --> 00:36:58.800
I love the 1937 Frank Capra version of Lost Horizon that I would be my pick of the of this podcast.

547
00:36:58.860 --> 00:37:01.920
It's useful, everything that Capra does.

548
00:37:01.980 --> 00:37:06.480
You might know him from, it's a wonderful life that everybody watches every day at Christmas and so he should.

549
00:37:06.539 --> 00:37:11.699
Because it actually makes Christmas sufferable if you're sitting with your family at home.

550
00:37:13.199 --> 00:37:17.519
It's that and it picks up on it beautifully.

551
00:37:17.579 --> 00:37:19.139
And again, little moments.

552
00:37:19.199 --> 00:37:21.420
So this isn't just a plot and characters.

553
00:37:21.480 --> 00:37:22.079
It's lighting.

554
00:37:22.139 --> 00:37:23.880
It sounds as we've said.

555
00:37:23.940 --> 00:37:25.199
It does all those other things.

556
00:37:25.260 --> 00:37:26.219
Thank you, Gerald Blake.

557
00:37:26.280 --> 00:37:27.000
It does it beautifully.

558
00:37:27.059 --> 00:37:28.619
It holds beautifully.

559
00:37:28.679 --> 00:37:30.360
People have a part to play.

560
00:37:30.420 --> 00:37:33.480
And those hats, the performance is so great.

561
00:37:33.539 --> 00:37:37.019
Even those fantastic Mardi Gras, mango slice hats.

562
00:37:37.079 --> 00:37:39.179
How great are the hats in this?

563
00:37:39.360 --> 00:37:42.239
You don't need it, you don't need to get any.

564
00:37:42.300 --> 00:37:44.039
Do you like a bit of an enemy of the world?

565
00:37:44.099 --> 00:37:46.500
Look, I've known it longer.

566
00:37:46.559 --> 00:37:47.639
I like them both.

567
00:37:47.699 --> 00:37:49.079
I like them both for very different reasons.

568
00:37:49.139 --> 00:37:51.719
It's Iamada who wrote Enemy of the World.

569
00:37:51.780 --> 00:37:53.039
As an organisation, yes.

570
00:37:53.039 --> 00:37:53.940
I love that as well.

571
00:37:54.000 --> 00:37:54.840
But I was a little older.

572
00:37:54.900 --> 00:37:58.860
So again, so much of Doctor Who is nostalgia when you 1st came to it for me.

573
00:37:58.920 --> 00:38:03.480
Yeah, actually, because of the antecedents, because of the Capra film, because of what it does so well.

574
00:38:03.539 --> 00:38:06.119
I would actually say it is my favourite of the season.

575
00:38:06.179 --> 00:38:09.360
Is this the 1st pseudo-historical?

576
00:38:09.420 --> 00:38:10.739
Oh I like that.

577
00:38:10.800 --> 00:38:12.119
No, that would be time.

578
00:38:12.179 --> 00:38:12.599
Yeah, yeah.

579
00:38:12.659 --> 00:38:16.980
The time they like, I mean, the time they But yes, because it's really playing with golf.

580
00:38:17.039 --> 00:38:18.840
Well, I think the time it was special.

581
00:38:18.900 --> 00:38:19.619
Do you know what I mean?

582
00:38:19.679 --> 00:38:24.780
It is clearly like a historical that you drop another timeload into and stuff.

583
00:38:24.840 --> 00:38:28.380
But this is just, you know, the 1st time the past has been invaded by aliens.

584
00:38:28.440 --> 00:38:29.820
Normally if we've gone to the past.

585
00:38:29.880 --> 00:38:31.739
We just have people.

586
00:38:31.800 --> 00:38:35.099
But now it's the 1st time that the past is invaded by aliens.

587
00:38:35.159 --> 00:38:36.719
And maybe that's another reason.

588
00:38:36.780 --> 00:38:37.199
Thank you.

589
00:38:37.260 --> 00:38:41.280
Because this is the template of how to do New Doctor Who.

590
00:38:41.340 --> 00:38:43.440
I said, oh, just throwing Queen Victoria.

591
00:38:43.440 --> 00:38:46.739
And you've got, honestly, actually, she would have been a bit long in the tooth by now, wouldn't she?

592
00:38:46.800 --> 00:38:48.239
She's going for...

593
00:38:48.239 --> 00:38:53.460
She's going for... and Edward the 8th. and you've got, and George the 6th.

594
00:38:53.519 --> 00:38:58.019
So you've really, you've pretty much all, just, yeah, you've got the werewolves in the...

595
00:38:58.079 --> 00:39:01.440
Aren't they yeti just incredibly stupid looking?

596
00:39:01.559 --> 00:39:03.539
Are they the worst northern?

597
00:39:03.599 --> 00:39:04.079
Yes or no?

598
00:39:04.199 --> 00:39:06.179
Oh yeah, I don't think that's stupid looking at all.

599
00:39:06.239 --> 00:39:09.719
I think it's more a matter of appearance for line function.

600
00:39:09.780 --> 00:39:10.320
Yeah.

601
00:39:10.380 --> 00:39:13.500
They look cute, but then they do all 4 things.

602
00:39:13.500 --> 00:39:22.619
And I like that it's the whole thing of the reason why in later stories you get children's toys being quite threatening as we really jump into the next level in Doctor Who.

603
00:39:22.679 --> 00:39:23.639
We're still at the stage.

604
00:39:23.699 --> 00:39:26.880
This is the 1st time we see something benign and cubby looking actually being terrifying.

605
00:39:26.940 --> 00:39:29.940
Is it of air shaped and featureless spaces and stuff?

606
00:39:30.000 --> 00:39:32.400
I mean, I notice you're looking at me when you say it.

607
00:39:32.519 --> 00:39:33.360
No, no, no.

608
00:39:33.360 --> 00:39:35.159
I'm a bit pear shaped.

609
00:39:35.219 --> 00:39:35.519
Anyway.

610
00:39:35.579 --> 00:39:37.860
Yeah, it's all going a bit.

611
00:39:39.300 --> 00:39:47.940
I think my big objection to this season as a whole is we just cycle between 3 groups of terrible things.

612
00:39:48.599 --> 00:39:50.039
Yeah, you know what?

613
00:39:50.159 --> 00:39:54.780
I think that may be true, but I think the more important thing is what is done with those ideas.

614
00:39:54.840 --> 00:40:03.900
I just feel that even though we may have variations on a theme this season, the important thing lies in the variations we get.

615
00:40:03.960 --> 00:40:08.639
And that's something I'd like to discuss next, which is the whole setting of this story.

616
00:40:08.699 --> 00:40:13.320
The writers decided to set it into bet, but not to bet in the modern day.

617
00:40:13.380 --> 00:40:15.780
That is only to set it into better 30s.

618
00:40:15.840 --> 00:40:24.000
Those of you don't know, depending on your perspective, Tibet is a part of China or at the very least subject to Chinese rule and jurisdiction.

619
00:40:24.059 --> 00:40:25.139
However...

620
00:40:25.139 --> 00:40:28.500
I don't even stick to the podcasts or whatever. yeah.

621
00:40:28.559 --> 00:40:29.760
At the time.

622
00:40:29.820 --> 00:40:31.139
At the time, this story was set.

623
00:40:31.139 --> 00:40:33.059
We need to support them, though, don't we?

624
00:40:33.119 --> 00:40:37.380
Tibet was in the middle of roughly 50 years of de facto independence.

625
00:40:37.440 --> 00:40:46.139
They weren't exactly a sovereign independence state, but the Chinese government of the time didn't really bother with them.

626
00:40:46.199 --> 00:40:51.719
However, In 1951 China said, no, you are a part of our country.

627
00:40:51.780 --> 00:40:58.199
In 1966, the year before this story, the China underwent the cultural revolution.

628
00:40:58.260 --> 00:41:09.360
And as part of that, not so much Chinese forces into it, but more Tibetan forces, sympathetic to the Chinese rule, started ransacking and attacking the monasteries.

629
00:41:09.420 --> 00:41:14.099
And especially lots of reports of Buddhist statues being walled down.

630
00:41:14.159 --> 00:41:23.340
And of course, what do we see in abominable snowmen, but when the 1st bottle snowman gains access to the monastery.

631
00:41:23.400 --> 00:41:27.840
They pull down the Buddha statue, crushing one of the monks to death.

632
00:41:27.840 --> 00:41:29.519
That's a bit horrible.

633
00:41:29.579 --> 00:41:33.360
It's terrific commentary on what is going on, yeah?

634
00:41:33.420 --> 00:41:35.460
Yeah, I mean, are the writers?

635
00:41:35.519 --> 00:41:40.739
I'm not showing the idea of Chinese communism in the great intelligence.

636
00:41:40.800 --> 00:41:49.019
There was a lot of fear of China mentioned Nigerian Canada before as being the greater threat than Mother Russia at this period.

637
00:41:49.079 --> 00:41:50.280
So yeah, why not?

638
00:41:50.579 --> 00:41:53.400
I think that decision was probably very conscious.

639
00:41:53.460 --> 00:41:56.519
Henry Lincoln, real name are Henry Soskin.

640
00:41:56.579 --> 00:42:00.119
He was a huge researcher into mythologies of various types.

641
00:42:00.179 --> 00:42:07.920
He's actually credited with being one of the authors of a book which Dan Brown based the da Vinci code upon. interesting.

642
00:42:07.980 --> 00:42:13.199
So we get another source of Joseph Campbell, an apotheosis in the story as well.

643
00:42:13.260 --> 00:42:14.519
So you can see a few of those.

644
00:42:14.579 --> 00:42:15.300
That's true.

645
00:42:15.360 --> 00:42:17.400
And just a little bit of trivia.

646
00:42:17.460 --> 00:42:22.380
Henry Lincoln was also an actor as well as a writer, and getting 2 episodes of the Avengers.

647
00:42:22.440 --> 00:42:28.679
He was in an episode called Defella Cunt as the leader of an Arab country.

648
00:42:28.739 --> 00:42:31.320
And he ate everyone else.

649
00:42:31.380 --> 00:42:35.519
He had a wonderful rapport with her on a black moon in that episode.

650
00:42:35.579 --> 00:42:36.900
It's quite a favourite of mine.

651
00:42:36.960 --> 00:42:37.920
So there we are.

652
00:42:37.980 --> 00:42:51.360
So at the very end, it turns out that Padma Sandovar, under the control of great intelligence, has built a giant 60s style, like a science fiction control room.

653
00:42:51.420 --> 00:42:54.659
And this is something that the great intelligence inspires people to do.

654
00:42:54.719 --> 00:43:07.380
And so, you know, the whole end of it is inexplicably, you know, we've been in 1935 in Tibet and then suddenly we jump into this sort of ludicrous modern sort of control.

655
00:43:07.440 --> 00:43:11.400
I mean, the whole thing just seems, but yet he is so thin.

656
00:43:11.460 --> 00:43:13.500
Like, why, why are they robot?

657
00:43:13.559 --> 00:43:24.360
yes It's a great intelligence that can possess, you know, Padma Sambova, um, and there are actual yeti available in, as we discover.

658
00:43:24.420 --> 00:43:25.199
Thank you, though.

659
00:43:25.260 --> 00:43:33.360
The spheres, the yeti control spheres, as we're totally against us, they're about to become and reduced in the next yearly story.

660
00:43:33.420 --> 00:43:39.059
They seem to be containing nothing more than chi, but they don't actually have any things in a mechanism.

661
00:43:39.119 --> 00:43:40.559
Yeah, they're so light.

662
00:43:40.619 --> 00:43:41.639
There can't be anything in it.

663
00:43:41.699 --> 00:43:49.320
I see them as a really interesting link between this corporeality and the vortex and the astral plane.

664
00:43:49.380 --> 00:43:54.539
Because the science-y stuff behind it is totally...

665
00:43:54.539 --> 00:43:56.940
Hey, Ashbury, essay.

666
00:43:57.000 --> 00:44:00.539
I must say, said, I mean, San Francisco.

667
00:44:00.599 --> 00:44:03.539
But I do think it backs off from that.

668
00:44:03.599 --> 00:44:12.239
I think that I think that it doesn't want to be too kind of spiritual and too kind of, like it's it's Doctor Who, so they have to be crap robots.

669
00:44:12.300 --> 00:44:13.619
I think it comes in though.

670
00:44:13.679 --> 00:44:16.380
And I think the control room's the same thing.

671
00:44:16.440 --> 00:44:17.340
Do you know what I mean?

672
00:44:17.400 --> 00:44:26.579
A little, we flirt with pyramids, we flirt with, you know, the control things, but essentially, like it turns into a sort of tiresome science fiction.

673
00:44:27.000 --> 00:44:28.500
James Bondigoo.

674
00:44:28.559 --> 00:44:29.400
Yeah, absolutely.

675
00:44:29.460 --> 00:44:33.659
And like the tube of the cybermen sets were very 10 Adam.

676
00:44:33.719 --> 00:44:35.219
And this is Ken Adam as well.

677
00:44:35.280 --> 00:44:37.739
You know, you've got to have a giant control room to blow up at the end.

678
00:44:37.800 --> 00:44:42.599
And yes, maybe that is tiresome tropes coming into action.

679
00:44:42.659 --> 00:44:44.639
It's also 1967.

680
00:44:44.820 --> 00:44:46.260
I really love 1967.

681
00:44:46.500 --> 00:44:47.940
That's the thing.

682
00:44:48.000 --> 00:44:52.440
It's also a matter of, yeah, you know, it's happiness cliche, but you still enjoy it.

683
00:44:52.500 --> 00:44:56.579
It's a bit like, yeah, I know pizza's bad for me, but I still enjoy it.

684
00:44:56.639 --> 00:44:59.579
An area is doing even more so.

685
00:44:59.639 --> 00:45:01.679
It just that we're too close to it to look at it.

686
00:45:01.739 --> 00:45:02.820
Well, absolutely.

687
00:45:02.880 --> 00:45:10.260
Absolutely You know, everyone kind of said, why aren't there why aren't there commentaries for every episode on the new Doctor Who box sets?

688
00:45:10.320 --> 00:45:18.780
Because the ones they release in 20 years' time when Christopher Eccleston can actually say why he left are going to be far more interesting than anything he would record right now.

689
00:45:18.840 --> 00:45:20.699
You know?

690
00:45:20.760 --> 00:45:23.219
I want to hear Russell say by Christopher Eagleston there.

691
00:45:23.280 --> 00:45:26.099
There are several versions. picked it already.

692
00:45:26.159 --> 00:45:31.139
Just before we move on, there's also something I noticed in this, which is just me being cheating.

693
00:45:31.199 --> 00:45:39.659
We have an insidious and duclicitous abbot turning good people cynical and violent by the use of self manufactured threats.

694
00:45:39.719 --> 00:45:43.019
This really is a story for all times, including our own.

695
00:45:44.760 --> 00:45:47.400
And there's only one woman in the cast.

696
00:45:50.460 --> 00:45:52.320
She sits comfortably on a front bench.

697
00:45:52.380 --> 00:45:57.659
Listen, I would like point out that this is very hollow.

698
00:46:04.860 --> 00:46:13.800
The wailing of the ice there, rather than over us than being in the ice and going whaling can only be, it's time for the ice warriors.

699
00:46:17.099 --> 00:46:23.400
Please do not adjust your sense. right Anyone who has an axolotle with a tank, right?

700
00:46:23.460 --> 00:46:25.860
sitting around on its back right now, wouldn't it?

701
00:46:25.920 --> 00:46:27.599
I'm sorry, we're all just 5 years old.

702
00:46:27.659 --> 00:46:29.760
How good is that opening?

703
00:46:29.820 --> 00:46:31.739
Again, this thing.

704
00:46:31.800 --> 00:46:41.760
Yeah, we're back on a base under siege, a cottage under siege, and it's just that you change the slides and it's going to look completely different and have different plays, but that's the point.

705
00:46:41.820 --> 00:46:45.840
When you get to the details, how whacked is this story?

706
00:46:45.900 --> 00:46:47.579
And thank you, Dudley Simpson.

707
00:46:47.639 --> 00:46:54.840
We just had, oh, it's his play on Vaughan Williams and Antarctic, isn't it, that we just heard then with the sound of the ice, isn't it?

708
00:46:55.679 --> 00:46:58.739
this is the opening, like all the time, but in the opening crest.

709
00:46:58.800 --> 00:47:00.539
Yes, yes. you get you get that.

710
00:47:00.719 --> 00:47:04.980
And Dully's really letting everything out for this again.

711
00:47:05.219 --> 00:47:10.380
There's so much in this, it's like, I like, I like costumes, I like, the look of it.

712
00:47:10.440 --> 00:47:11.219
I love the sound.

713
00:47:11.280 --> 00:47:14.820
Um, actually, the characterisations.

714
00:47:14.880 --> 00:47:17.099
What's going on between the characters and this is amazing.

715
00:47:17.159 --> 00:47:21.780
So what we've got is TARDIS appears, the 1st, is it the 1st time on the side?

716
00:47:21.840 --> 00:47:22.440
Yes.

717
00:47:22.500 --> 00:47:23.519
On that side.

718
00:47:23.579 --> 00:47:24.300
Bang, there you go.

719
00:47:24.360 --> 00:47:29.400
That deal was a was a cider-man falling onto a cake plate.

720
00:47:29.460 --> 00:47:31.980
Because I'm deciding more ginger cake.

721
00:47:32.099 --> 00:47:34.800
So we're playing around with what it does and we're doing it really well.

722
00:47:34.860 --> 00:47:38.219
We're in, um, what appears to be an ice globe.

723
00:47:38.280 --> 00:47:40.619
Turns out to be the far future.

724
00:47:40.679 --> 00:47:42.719
When is it 3000?

725
00:47:42.780 --> 00:47:47.280
Oh, it's always the year two, three, or something, something, something, something, something, something, something, something that, isn't it?

726
00:47:47.340 --> 00:47:47.760
Yeah.

727
00:47:47.820 --> 00:47:49.320
Actually, no, it's not the U 5,000.

728
00:47:49.500 --> 00:47:50.219
Yes, it is.

729
00:47:50.280 --> 00:47:50.880
I think it's 3000.

730
00:47:51.960 --> 00:47:54.480
Yep, yeah, 30th century.

731
00:47:54.539 --> 00:47:59.039
Well, we know we're in the 30th century, not just the sound, but because of the sound.

732
00:47:59.099 --> 00:48:00.840
Not of the frocks.

733
00:48:00.900 --> 00:48:02.340
Look at what everyone's wearing.

734
00:48:02.400 --> 00:48:03.239
Oh, really?

735
00:48:03.239 --> 00:48:04.559
We haven't even got there yet.

736
00:48:04.619 --> 00:48:07.079
We're still on the ice flows and we've got that beautiful sound.

737
00:48:07.139 --> 00:48:08.519
We find a lovely big bubble.

738
00:48:08.579 --> 00:48:15.539
We've got an interesting Georgian house. sitting under a dome and then we realised, hang on, they wouldn't be building those in the Antarctic, will we?

739
00:48:15.599 --> 00:48:19.260
But it's actually more like we haven't got to Zardors yet.

740
00:48:19.320 --> 00:48:22.260
That's Sean Connery's rock in a in a jockstrap.

741
00:48:22.320 --> 00:48:23.219
That's 1972.

742
00:48:23.400 --> 00:48:25.500
That was amazing. that.

743
00:48:25.559 --> 00:48:27.300
That's a go-to.

744
00:48:27.360 --> 00:48:30.000
But we're actually, why are we in a Georgian house?

745
00:48:30.059 --> 00:48:37.860
And why suddenly everybody dressed as, and not even the girls from the moon base in Jerry Anderson's UFO because that's still 3 years off.

746
00:48:37.920 --> 00:48:39.000
We're 9067.

747
00:48:39.179 --> 00:48:40.980
We're in a disco in Paris.

748
00:48:41.039 --> 00:48:56.760
But the costumes apparently, um, Based on printed circuits, is the same. reason that the when we finally get into the ice warrior ship, they've got those little groovy printed circuit layouts, simply because they're using G-claps instead of hand.

749
00:48:56.880 --> 00:48:58.619
So it's all they can play with.

750
00:48:58.679 --> 00:49:06.420
But we're actually hanging out in a Georgian house, as the rock starts at the time did, with Mick Jagger and George Harrison, they both just bought one.

751
00:49:06.480 --> 00:49:09.480
We're good to see Mix House in Pyramid of Mars in years. time.

752
00:49:09.539 --> 00:49:12.659
It's not just this thing is not just Sonic power.

753
00:49:12.719 --> 00:49:13.679
It's supersonic.

754
00:49:13.739 --> 00:49:15.900
This season we get Sonic.

755
00:49:15.960 --> 00:49:18.179
We get Sonic disrupted weapons in this one, don't we?

756
00:49:18.239 --> 00:49:19.079
How fantastic.

757
00:49:19.139 --> 00:49:23.639
And then we get a lovely little fanboy that it's actually, do you know how they made the guns work for the ice Warriors?

758
00:49:23.699 --> 00:49:24.960
It's Miralong.

759
00:49:25.019 --> 00:49:27.360
Yes, it is Miron, which is thin Myla.

760
00:49:27.420 --> 00:49:38.760
The stuff that Warhol had just wrapped his factory in that is and made all those big helium silver balloons for his PC walls, I was like his favourite colour is silver because everything's reflected in it.

761
00:49:38.820 --> 00:49:40.920
It's meaningless and it's completely thin.

762
00:49:41.219 --> 00:49:48.119
You might want to say that's the plotline of each story we're getting this season, but I think that would be unfair.

763
00:49:48.179 --> 00:49:50.699
Well, potentially unfair.

764
00:49:50.760 --> 00:49:54.119
But yeah, a stage hand would gently, very gently stand behind.

765
00:49:54.239 --> 00:50:01.139
The little silver mirror thing and gently brush against the artist's reflection.

766
00:50:01.139 --> 00:50:02.159
No, distorted the list.

767
00:50:02.219 --> 00:50:03.780
Yes, there's a metaphor.

768
00:50:03.840 --> 00:50:05.400
Yeah, it's almost like mercury.

769
00:50:05.460 --> 00:50:18.300
And I actually think, you know, the set that you've alluded to, the reason that we're in a Georgian house and it has like a fantastic sort of candelabra chandelier thing on the on the roof.

770
00:50:18.360 --> 00:50:20.699
And then immediately under it is...

771
00:50:20.760 --> 00:50:22.980
Royce Elson was a giant computer.

772
00:50:23.099 --> 00:50:24.119
It is true.

773
00:50:24.179 --> 00:50:25.860
Roy Skelton's.

774
00:50:25.920 --> 00:50:39.179
And the computer is hugely, hugely important thematically here because and so maybe the contrast between the Georgian house and the computer is sort of thematically important in that.

775
00:50:39.179 --> 00:50:44.820
We're about, you know, the past versus scientific progress.

776
00:50:45.239 --> 00:51:00.900
And so the 3 main characters who are leader clans in a sort of ludicrous outfit of Miss Garrett, in a glamorously ludicrous outfit, and then Penley do is Wallace and Gromis, or just maybe one umbrellas.

777
00:51:00.900 --> 00:51:01.800
And store.

778
00:51:01.860 --> 00:51:02.880
Angus Lenny.

779
00:51:02.940 --> 00:51:05.699
Yeah, to turn up as Angus.

780
00:51:05.760 --> 00:51:09.059
But the even in terror of the cycles, yeah.

781
00:51:09.119 --> 00:51:18.119
And but the 3 characters, you know, those 3 characters were bass personnel and they and yeah, Angus, they all represent sort of different attitudes towards that.

782
00:51:18.179 --> 00:51:23.760
So Miss Garrett and Lita Clinton are will do whatever the computer says.

783
00:51:23.820 --> 00:51:32.099
Poor old Angus is terrified of everything that's got to do with anything to do with technology and all those scientific things.

784
00:51:32.159 --> 00:51:45.239
Um, and then you've got penley who's rejected the computer thing, wants to live like a person, isn't quite as crazy as, as store, uh, and, and it's those people and they, well, acted.

785
00:51:45.300 --> 00:51:46.320
I mean, it's Peter...

786
00:51:46.320 --> 00:51:48.360
Peter Barkworth, Peter Salis.

787
00:51:48.420 --> 00:51:50.760
Peter Salis, a coup on podcast.

788
00:51:50.820 --> 00:51:53.940
They didn't expect to be able to get Buckworth for this.

789
00:51:54.300 --> 00:51:55.320
They asked him and he just turned up.

790
00:51:55.380 --> 00:52:02.219
They didn't expect to be able to get Bernard Breslaw as Varga, but he was able to turn up and do it.

791
00:52:02.280 --> 00:52:04.260
Well, he was a big film star.

792
00:52:04.800 --> 00:52:05.639
He was actually to carry on.

793
00:52:05.760 --> 00:52:11.159
He was in the middle of carry-on doctor while he was doing this, which is the one where he drags up as the nurse.

794
00:52:11.219 --> 00:52:12.900
Have you seen it?

795
00:52:12.960 --> 00:52:15.300
It's also got Peter Gilmour, whom we own.

796
00:52:15.360 --> 00:52:20.940
But Peter Gilmore and Barber Windsor also commit the abominable joke of the century.

797
00:52:21.000 --> 00:52:22.079
I've seen over in that film.

798
00:52:22.139 --> 00:52:23.760
What number of wins are we own?

799
00:52:23.820 --> 00:52:24.420
Have I said that before?

800
00:52:24.480 --> 00:52:25.440
Well, we do.

801
00:52:25.500 --> 00:52:26.699
Yeah, Mark Paul.

802
00:52:26.760 --> 00:52:28.079
Yeah, yeah, I know.

803
00:52:28.139 --> 00:52:32.820
This, to me, is just Christmas I am 67 all over. really is.

804
00:52:32.880 --> 00:52:35.400
Peter Bark was just hams and caps it up.

805
00:52:35.460 --> 00:52:44.639
This story, honestly, I love it, but I really do like it because it's not just about blokes in a suit, Bernard Breslaw's costume is equally way out and hoopy.

806
00:52:44.699 --> 00:52:49.739
And instead of being sent off to see Sandra Reed or Daphne Dare in their cupboard.

807
00:52:49.800 --> 00:52:51.239
He sent off to a shipyard.

808
00:52:51.300 --> 00:52:52.199
Did you know that?

809
00:52:52.260 --> 00:53:05.880
The costume is actually built by boat builders out of timber framing and fibreglass and he's standing in his outfit, fibreglass and leathery, leathery, fluffy bits around his joints, dripping out.

810
00:53:05.940 --> 00:53:10.260
I swear to you, a pint of sweat, an owl.

811
00:53:10.320 --> 00:53:11.400
Can you imagine?

812
00:53:11.460 --> 00:53:13.500
how much that would go for now, though?

813
00:53:13.559 --> 00:53:17.940
searching a Toby job. to show hand, it was coloured lovely and more emerald green.

814
00:53:18.000 --> 00:53:20.039
There were only just a couple of months too early for St.

815
00:53:20.039 --> 00:53:20.639
Patrick's Day.

816
00:53:20.699 --> 00:53:30.780
He's the one who in the in rehearsals came up with the voice and came up with the other mannerisms of them and making them to be like the space lizards.

817
00:53:30.780 --> 00:53:35.039
And the love, that's... which we don't get ever again.

818
00:53:35.099 --> 00:53:36.840
We don't get the weak whacko head turning.

819
00:53:36.900 --> 00:53:53.820
But this thing for me, the reason I like it is he also, with the bloke who was playing Zondal, developed more of genuine characters and genuine identities for these players, this is a show about love triangles, pause for reflection.

820
00:53:53.880 --> 00:54:02.880
These songs, we talk about Russell having introduced the soaps of the ideas of Romance in Doctor Who.

821
00:54:02.940 --> 00:54:03.420
This is it.

822
00:54:03.480 --> 00:54:11.099
You've got Zwaga and Zondal having, I think, kind of difficult post-frozen relationship and sorting that out.

823
00:54:11.159 --> 00:54:20.099
You think I've got the extraordinary love story, love triangle story between Penley, leader clans, or come on, and and when do you give it?

824
00:54:20.159 --> 00:54:23.039
I thought you were going to say Henley leader cleans on the computer.

825
00:54:23.099 --> 00:54:28.019
Well, that's all your aspects of the same thing and the reason the relationships don't work.

826
00:54:28.079 --> 00:54:35.579
But you know, this is the 1st time it's actually hinted at, that when they give this part and so Clint had the past, they did have a relationship.

827
00:54:35.639 --> 00:54:36.119
Yeah.

828
00:54:36.179 --> 00:54:42.599
No, I thought it was Penley and No, no, no, it's a claim to her because she she goes to see Penley.

829
00:54:42.659 --> 00:54:47.099
Remember when he's in the botanical museum and begs him to come back?

830
00:54:47.159 --> 00:54:50.579
Because of her affection and relationship.

831
00:54:50.639 --> 00:54:53.820
Gareth and Clint, Gareth and Clint did have a relationship.

832
00:54:53.820 --> 00:54:55.320
And it's in the script notes.

833
00:54:55.980 --> 00:54:56.639
The normalisation.

834
00:54:57.840 --> 00:54:59.219
Yeah.

835
00:54:59.280 --> 00:55:00.239
Yeah.

836
00:55:01.019 --> 00:55:07.800
And then you've got Penley is the discarded trying to create a whole new life with this.

837
00:55:07.860 --> 00:55:15.960
Oh, no, I'm trying to find someone who's completely different from you, Clint. going to find someone who's natural and real and into the outdoors and needs to start swingy, whiney things.

838
00:55:16.019 --> 00:55:21.900
If he made an old thing, he's smelling of the chewing oil, and of course, he's completely gone off him and comes home in the end.

839
00:55:21.960 --> 00:55:25.139
Yeah, the friend is a dysfunctional gay couple since Bert learning.

840
00:55:25.199 --> 00:55:25.860
Exactly.

841
00:55:25.920 --> 00:55:29.159
In store. you know, it's a rebound relationship.

842
00:55:29.159 --> 00:55:29.760
That's the thing.

843
00:55:29.820 --> 00:55:31.739
It should have been, it should have stuck to what they knew.

844
00:55:31.800 --> 00:55:32.280
I'm sorry.

845
00:55:32.340 --> 00:55:33.300
When do you give it?

846
00:55:33.360 --> 00:55:45.780
I really feel so more sorry for Miss Garrett, because she's the one, but she's the too hot trophy wife in all of these, when you get boys of this level, like Lita Clans, who's completely emotionally unavailable.

847
00:55:45.840 --> 00:55:48.360
I'm sorry, it was her thought for marrying into careers.

848
00:55:48.539 --> 00:55:55.739
Too hot trophy wise left to look long, you know, just looking warmly spectacular where I'm wearing a plastic clipboard over a face.

849
00:55:55.800 --> 00:55:56.880
That is weird.

850
00:55:56.940 --> 00:56:00.780
That's the clickboard over. if dropped You probably feeling a bit...

851
00:56:00.840 --> 00:56:02.159
It was the only thing that's doing the glass.

852
00:56:02.699 --> 00:56:04.380
Yeah, why not?

853
00:56:04.380 --> 00:56:05.159
That's what she's wearing.

854
00:56:05.219 --> 00:56:06.659
See, why not?

855
00:56:06.719 --> 00:56:13.320
See, I actually, I actually think, you know, she had a thing for him, but she's just so over it now because they're both so ridiculous.

856
00:56:13.380 --> 00:56:17.400
You know, both Clint and Penley are just so ridiculous.

857
00:56:18.420 --> 00:56:22.800
She's like the gray spy in the spy versus spy on it.

858
00:56:22.860 --> 00:56:25.679
You know, while the boys are fighting, she'll make off with the plans.

859
00:56:25.800 --> 00:56:27.780
Yeah, she is.

860
00:56:28.619 --> 00:56:30.840
What else can we say about?

861
00:56:30.900 --> 00:56:32.760
Look, you're talking about casual races?

862
00:56:32.820 --> 00:56:34.199
They're good to stick out boxes.

863
00:56:34.260 --> 00:56:35.519
I think instead of anti-Martian?

864
00:56:35.579 --> 00:56:37.079
I think it's really appalling in this one.

865
00:56:37.139 --> 00:56:43.260
No, because Victoria doesn't have much to do and I think I think it's Victoria is a character, probably her weakest story.

866
00:56:43.320 --> 00:56:45.119
Well, and he's wobbled.

867
00:56:45.239 --> 00:56:47.519
She does a lot of being dragged along by this.

868
00:56:47.579 --> 00:56:51.840
Although she drove, although, because Burna Bristol is actually quite short-sighted and couldn't see or hear anything.

869
00:56:51.900 --> 00:56:58.500
She drags him alive, you know, but she's absolutely desperate not to go to Africa, the racist.

870
00:56:58.559 --> 00:56:59.639
Oh, she's not.

871
00:56:59.760 --> 00:57:02.639
Africa. becauses cannibals and do know?

872
00:57:02.699 --> 00:57:03.840
Tipsy flies.

873
00:57:03.900 --> 00:57:05.519
The words we can't say on the BBC.

874
00:57:05.579 --> 00:57:06.599
And it's...

875
00:57:06.599 --> 00:57:07.679
No, we can save them on the BBC.

876
00:57:08.639 --> 00:57:11.280
We don't use, we can't say boys.

877
00:57:11.340 --> 00:57:15.300
She kind of written 1984 unless she's got a copy of it in the TARDIS.

878
00:57:15.360 --> 00:57:19.079
Um, you know, she's just, it's just pretty awful.

879
00:57:19.139 --> 00:57:20.219
And what does Jamie do?

880
00:57:20.519 --> 00:57:22.440
It's not about them.

881
00:57:22.500 --> 00:57:24.000
That's why that's why it's good.

882
00:57:24.119 --> 00:57:28.380
At the time, TV shows that were really hot and successful.

883
00:57:28.440 --> 00:57:35.519
And the reason I think this one is so well remembered and yet looking at it now, it's a bit flat is because at the time this sparkled.

884
00:57:35.579 --> 00:57:44.340
And really good TV drama was people being shouting at each other over high tech banks, in control rooms, doing serious space.

885
00:57:44.400 --> 00:57:46.260
This was, wow, this is real life.

886
00:57:46.320 --> 00:57:56.519
We're getting, we move beyond the entire style of Billy's naturalism, which to us is very stagey, to this new level of compact door, the, you know, the hot slopes of the time.

887
00:57:56.579 --> 00:57:59.699
Oddly enough, you've just described 24 as well.

888
00:57:59.760 --> 00:58:02.699
People shouting over high tech.

889
00:58:02.760 --> 00:58:03.300
Yeah.

890
00:58:03.360 --> 00:58:22.380
Can I just say that one of the things that sets this apart, though, from, say, modern Doctor Who, apart from the fact that it's 400 hours, is, yeah, it is, um, that you've got such a strong theme, uh, among the human beings and with the computer in the middle of the room.

891
00:58:22.440 --> 00:58:24.780
And the characters are really well drawn.

892
00:58:24.840 --> 00:58:25.500
Do you know what I mean?

893
00:58:25.559 --> 00:58:30.960
They're not, like, everyone says, you know, Clint has a printed circuit where his art should be, but he doesn't really.

894
00:58:31.019 --> 00:58:33.719
He's actually, you know, quite human things.

895
00:58:33.780 --> 00:58:34.800
He's very emotional.

896
00:58:34.860 --> 00:58:40.320
Very much afraid of what's going on and playing it by the book because he fears he doesn't have the imagination.

897
00:58:40.320 --> 00:58:44.039
And that's why his relationship with Miss Garrett didn't work out.

898
00:58:44.159 --> 00:58:46.440
I notice it's never, it's always miscarrett.

899
00:58:46.500 --> 00:58:48.480
They really isolate her sexuality in this.

900
00:58:48.539 --> 00:58:52.139
So we've got this strong sort of thematic thing going.

901
00:58:52.260 --> 00:58:56.099
But the monsters and the threat have nothing at all to do with it.

902
00:58:56.219 --> 00:59:00.000
No, it's only it's only who's going through a divorce at the time.

903
00:59:00.119 --> 00:59:01.440
No, no, it doesn't matter what they look like.

904
00:59:01.500 --> 00:59:15.900
I mean, what I mean is that if you've got this thing about sort of computers and you've got this thing about sort of natural life and you've got, you've got, um, yeah, is it the 1st environmentalist Doctor Who story?

905
00:59:15.960 --> 00:59:18.539
No, no, that environmentalism thing is absolute rubbish.

906
00:59:18.599 --> 00:59:19.199
I mean, look at it.

907
00:59:19.260 --> 00:59:30.599
It's like they cut down all the trees, fields, to build, you know, living units for the human beings and mysteriously because we all know that plants produce carbon dioxide.

908
00:59:31.380 --> 00:59:34.619
There's no more carbon dioxide in the thing, so we all...

909
00:59:34.619 --> 00:59:35.940
So they get rid of all the plants.

910
00:59:36.000 --> 00:59:37.260
So they get rid of all the plants.

911
00:59:37.320 --> 00:59:47.639
Instead of that releasing a whole lot of carbon dioxide into the air and causing global warming, It stops there being carbon dioxide and it causes a nice space science.

912
00:59:47.760 --> 00:59:50.639
The monsters need to be cybermen.

913
00:59:50.699 --> 00:59:51.179
Do you know what I mean?

914
00:59:51.239 --> 00:59:53.099
Well, they kind of are.

915
00:59:53.159 --> 00:59:58.380
But do you because it's all about logic versus human instinct?

916
00:59:58.440 --> 01:00:03.420
That the human beings win when they start to ignore the computer and take risks?

917
01:00:03.480 --> 01:00:04.380
Do you know what I mean?

918
01:00:04.440 --> 01:00:09.000
So thematically, it's all about, it's all about sort of logic versus instinct.

919
01:00:09.059 --> 01:00:11.159
It's all about science versus sort of nature.

920
01:00:11.219 --> 01:00:18.300
But then, So the side men are kind of a natural, fit thematically for the story.

921
01:00:18.360 --> 01:00:25.800
And originally in sort of earlier drafts, the Martians were more explicitly sideboard.

922
01:00:25.920 --> 01:00:31.920
And they said, well, that's too much like cybermen, we need to put them in a different sort of stupid fibreglass outfit.

923
01:00:31.920 --> 01:00:34.260
And so we'll put them in sort of lizard things.

924
01:00:34.320 --> 01:00:38.519
But that does seem to sort of destroy the kind of thematic unity of the story.

925
01:00:38.639 --> 01:00:45.659
I still can't help thinking, this is a very well performed and well characterised one.

926
01:00:45.719 --> 01:00:49.980
It's got a sterling cast. an A gray TV cast for the time.

927
01:00:50.039 --> 01:00:57.300
But it's just another base under siege and it is exhausting and the monsters are stupid.

928
01:00:57.360 --> 01:01:02.039
Forgive me, that's kind of beside the point because that's the that's the ruin the headlight scene of this season.

929
01:01:02.099 --> 01:01:03.420
We know that's what it is.

930
01:01:03.480 --> 01:01:14.280
It's what they then do to play around that. and actually make it more interesting within that steady concrete structure that makes it interesting and diverting to watch.

931
01:01:14.340 --> 01:01:16.139
And that's why I find this one interesting.

932
01:01:16.199 --> 01:01:19.980
I would have thought because you're our heart and all guy.

933
01:01:20.039 --> 01:01:21.239
Do you know what I mean?

934
01:01:21.300 --> 01:01:31.260
That you would be, by this point, hugely missing the variety of things that Doctor Who can do, that we saw it do in its 1st 2 years.

935
01:01:31.320 --> 01:01:38.519
And it's like, oh, you know, here's another room full of white people being threatened by aliens in stupid outfits.

936
01:01:38.579 --> 01:01:39.719
But we know that's what it's doing.

937
01:01:39.780 --> 01:01:41.099
What, Brendan, what are you?

938
01:01:41.099 --> 01:01:47.579
See, I've got to agree with Richard, Nathan, because these price, the other thing is not what the threat is.

939
01:01:47.639 --> 01:01:49.860
The important thing is that human reaction to it.

940
01:01:49.920 --> 01:01:57.960
Now, yeah, we could have had a start moving the story and the whole thing would have been about man versus machine, you know, logic versus emotion.

941
01:01:58.019 --> 01:02:01.019
But that is just instead part of the story.

942
01:02:01.079 --> 01:02:07.440
The bigger story here is do we need an alien threat to wipe this out or are we just going to wipe ourselves out?

943
01:02:07.500 --> 01:02:09.599
Because there's 2 threats to overcome in this story.

944
01:02:09.659 --> 01:02:18.420
The 1st threat to overcome is humanity wiping itself out through action or inaction and not knowing what the right thing is, but following your instincts.

945
01:02:18.480 --> 01:02:22.260
And then the other threat is, okay, how do we deal from an external threat?

946
01:02:22.320 --> 01:02:25.619
It's continuing the idea of self-actualisation from the previous story.

947
01:02:25.679 --> 01:02:32.340
Humanity has to grow up in itself and accept its own differences and stop trying to homogenise everything.

948
01:02:32.460 --> 01:02:37.199
Otherwise, we're going to become like these homogenised lizard monsters on the mountain.

949
01:02:37.260 --> 01:02:39.420
Are they homogenised?

950
01:02:39.480 --> 01:02:40.920
They have 2 different sorts of outfits.

951
01:02:40.980 --> 01:02:44.760
Then they have 2 different sorts of outfits, but they acted exactly the same now.

952
01:02:44.820 --> 01:02:46.260
Yeah, it's only...

953
01:02:46.260 --> 01:02:47.699
As the same as men in the Yesi.

954
01:02:47.820 --> 01:03:00.119
I said for Varga and Zondel, and watching it again, I am getting sort of subtleties there, but maybe I'm reading a bit, but there's a nice little mirror of what's going on with the humans between those two.

955
01:03:00.179 --> 01:03:03.599
Yeah, the whole, the whole Viking idea that is on paper.

956
01:03:03.599 --> 01:03:07.260
Which is what, which, yeah, which is what Burna Bristol thought he'd be playing.

957
01:03:07.320 --> 01:03:08.039
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

958
01:03:08.099 --> 01:03:10.559
The thing is, I think it still comes across in the script.

959
01:03:10.619 --> 01:03:13.139
You know, comes crossing his performance, yeah.

960
01:03:13.199 --> 01:03:16.320
Yeah, they are still very sort of pillage based.

961
01:03:16.380 --> 01:03:18.239
They don't...

962
01:03:18.300 --> 01:03:20.400
They have a pillage based economy.

963
01:03:20.519 --> 01:03:24.059
Well, look, you know, they're not like the side.

964
01:03:24.119 --> 01:03:27.900
They don't invade by self and then kind of say you'll be like us.

965
01:03:27.960 --> 01:03:30.599
They just say, we're gonna smash your stuff and take your left.

966
01:03:30.659 --> 01:03:32.400
And that's a very...

967
01:03:32.400 --> 01:03:35.099
Even though the Simon were doing in Moonbase?

968
01:03:35.159 --> 01:03:36.539
But myself.

969
01:03:36.599 --> 01:03:37.260
Yeah.

970
01:03:37.320 --> 01:03:43.139
Whereas the ice you can, you can see. ice worries are up and back in their shit, it's just like, no, we're going to zap it.

971
01:03:43.199 --> 01:03:47.880
You can see Cleans HR team saying, well, you know, look, we managed to get rid of the rape part.

972
01:03:47.940 --> 01:03:48.420
It's great.

973
01:03:48.539 --> 01:03:49.500
We just got the pillage.

974
01:03:49.500 --> 01:03:59.219
And well, as far as being put to the sword, at least to the supersonic woo-woo gun, well, we've kind of not been able to get that, but we have got flea.

975
01:03:59.280 --> 01:04:02.519
So you're actually allowed to flee, flee for your lives.

976
01:04:02.519 --> 01:04:03.960
Now, I do it right now.

977
01:04:04.019 --> 01:04:05.039
Press them up, please.

978
01:04:05.099 --> 01:04:06.239
That's it.

979
01:04:07.139 --> 01:04:08.760
They're great.

980
01:04:08.820 --> 01:04:09.840
There's a reason people love this.

981
01:04:09.900 --> 01:04:16.619
I would like to have seen what Brian hails, and indeed, what Douglas Canfield was pushing at the time.

982
01:04:16.679 --> 01:04:18.360
Did you know the other stories this was going to be?

983
01:04:18.420 --> 01:04:21.900
This was going to be Doctor Who meets Hitler.

984
01:04:21.960 --> 01:04:25.559
That's what Brian Hale's 1st script synopsis was.

985
01:04:25.619 --> 01:04:27.960
Jim Masoon, as the...

986
01:04:28.019 --> 01:04:29.699
Yeah, but the team.

987
01:04:29.760 --> 01:04:33.780
Amazingly, Innis, Lloyd, we've kind of not been very generous to him, have we?

988
01:04:33.780 --> 01:04:38.639
so far on this, but he rejected it because it's, um, he said it's complete.

989
01:04:38.699 --> 01:04:44.099
Well, he said, paraphrasing, completely indulgent, and it odds with the production codes.

990
01:04:45.179 --> 01:04:48.420
Is this the operation werewolf script?

991
01:04:48.480 --> 01:04:50.039
No, that's another one again.

992
01:04:50.099 --> 01:04:50.400
Thank you.

993
01:04:50.460 --> 01:05:00.239
Yeah, Dougie Canfield submitted a World War 2 synopsis, which sounds really interestingly, curse of Fenrick, that was Nazi scientists and teleports.

994
01:05:00.300 --> 01:05:02.639
So hello, seeds of death just a couple of years later.

995
01:05:02.699 --> 01:05:05.880
But also there was some vampire thing underneath it as well.

996
01:05:06.539 --> 01:05:10.380
I hope Big Finish gets around to finding it or doing a right of it.

997
01:05:10.800 --> 01:05:13.320
Yes, so I cannot download it.

998
01:05:13.800 --> 01:05:22.800
I just might say, I love the big finish, love stories, although I am quite the same way the Queen of Time, also by Brian Hales, was lost.

999
01:05:22.860 --> 01:05:24.239
Oh.

1000
01:05:24.239 --> 01:05:27.780
Yeah, so apart from that and just how beautiful it sounds.

1001
01:05:27.840 --> 01:05:30.059
I should really mention that orally.

1002
01:05:30.119 --> 01:05:31.199
It's really great.

1003
01:05:31.260 --> 01:05:32.699
Did you watch it or listen?

1004
01:05:32.760 --> 01:05:34.980
I did watch it this time, but I have it as an audio.

1005
01:05:35.039 --> 01:05:39.900
Again, it's I'm 1st known from the Target book, which I think is actually the best version of this.

1006
01:05:39.960 --> 01:05:42.599
Those episodes weren't discovered till like 88 or something.

1007
01:05:42.659 --> 01:05:44.460
There used to be none of it existence.

1008
01:05:44.519 --> 01:05:45.420
Yeah, quite late.

1009
01:05:45.480 --> 01:05:45.900
Yeah, yeah.

1010
01:05:45.960 --> 01:05:50.159
I actually did a book report on the novelisation when I was in year 8 at school.

1011
01:05:50.940 --> 01:05:52.380
Yeah, it's quite that.

1012
01:05:52.440 --> 01:05:57.780
So I, obviously, caught Quasi Homer, a lot in love triangles, got a big mention.

1013
01:05:57.840 --> 01:06:00.539
Well, as you can see, it's maybe the mouse.

1014
01:06:00.960 --> 01:06:03.360
And Wendy, if it helps...

1015
01:06:03.420 --> 01:06:07.139
Did you notice that there's a victorious theme reprised?

1016
01:06:07.199 --> 01:06:09.300
Remember when Evil of the Daleks, she's got a theme.

1017
01:06:09.360 --> 01:06:11.099
I really like Dudley Simpson.

1018
01:06:11.159 --> 01:06:12.780
He does it here with a Hammond organ.

1019
01:06:12.840 --> 01:06:14.699
I think it's in episode three.

1020
01:06:14.760 --> 01:06:17.639
I've written here episode 3 and he does a surrounder sound.

1021
01:06:17.699 --> 01:06:19.739
This is Shagpile mood lounge.

1022
01:06:19.800 --> 01:06:24.300
Hugh Hefner. as close as we get to being in the would-be Concorde lounge.

1023
01:06:24.360 --> 01:06:25.920
Yeah, the little sound mounts.

1024
01:06:26.039 --> 01:06:26.699
These are beautiful.

1025
01:06:26.760 --> 01:06:27.239
Yeah.

1026
01:06:27.300 --> 01:06:35.039
And I don't think we can finish before we mention the new animation on the DVD. by the Kuros team.

1027
01:06:35.099 --> 01:06:36.480
Yes, it's all...

1028
01:06:36.539 --> 01:06:39.300
Oh, that one's not Australia.

1029
01:06:39.360 --> 01:06:43.679
Australian was Moonbase, 10th Planet, and Rain of Terror.

1030
01:06:43.739 --> 01:06:45.179
This was done by a different group.

1031
01:06:45.239 --> 01:06:49.260
Hence, the different side of the show was better at then.

1032
01:06:49.320 --> 01:06:50.460
But all good.

1033
01:06:50.519 --> 01:06:52.019
I like this one a lot.

1034
01:06:52.079 --> 01:06:53.579
I like this one a lot too.

1035
01:06:53.639 --> 01:06:56.820
I would have, you know, I'd be quite happy to see either style.

1036
01:06:56.880 --> 01:06:58.619
Now this one did look simpler.

1037
01:06:58.679 --> 01:07:04.980
I don't know if it was cheaper. or not, but the odd thing is, start looking simpler for animators.

1038
01:07:05.039 --> 01:07:06.960
Yeah, despite looking simpler.

1039
01:07:07.019 --> 01:07:12.059
I feel this one actually got a lot more detail into the facial expression.

1040
01:07:12.119 --> 01:07:19.199
There's a few times where Patrick just rolls his eyes and it looks like Patrick rolling his eyes, but as a cartoon character.

1041
01:07:19.260 --> 01:07:20.340
It's very well described.

1042
01:07:20.400 --> 01:07:24.780
I think I think, I mean, we'll get to the invasion sort of fairly soon as well.

1043
01:07:24.840 --> 01:07:28.559
But I think this one and the invasion actually are the most successful ones.

1044
01:07:28.619 --> 01:07:29.820
And they are simpler.

1045
01:07:29.880 --> 01:07:32.820
You know, like they don't try and reproduce 3D movement.

1046
01:07:32.880 --> 01:07:35.219
They're much more flat and much more sort of 2 day.

1047
01:07:35.280 --> 01:07:40.260
But I think that's using the medium of animation much more effectively.

1048
01:07:40.320 --> 01:07:41.940
Do you know what I mean?

1049
01:07:42.000 --> 01:07:43.500
It's like archer or something like that.

1050
01:07:43.559 --> 01:07:45.840
It was a relief anyway.

1051
01:07:45.900 --> 01:07:47.820
So have a full 6 episode story to watch.

1052
01:07:47.880 --> 01:07:48.719
Absolutely.

1053
01:07:48.780 --> 01:07:51.239
Yeah, these 2 of them were just animated.

1054
01:08:00.300 --> 01:08:09.900
Well, that release is going to continue, Nathan, because in our next podcast, We have 2 full stories to watch that just 14 months ago.

1055
01:08:09.960 --> 01:08:13.440
We could only see 2 episodes off.

1056
01:08:13.500 --> 01:08:14.760
How amazing is that?

1057
01:08:14.940 --> 01:08:19.020
I just, you know, I still can't believe it.

1058
01:08:19.079 --> 01:08:25.859
And I think I think also next time we have to have a little bit of a discussion about what's happening or not with all the missing episodes.

1059
01:08:25.920 --> 01:08:28.319
Oh, no, let's not do that at all.

1060
01:08:28.380 --> 01:08:31.319
It's not provoked to Philip the god of Philip Morris, like out there.

1061
01:08:31.380 --> 01:08:37.380
Now, also before we go stay, I would like to mention our 1st flight through entirety competition.

1062
01:08:37.439 --> 01:08:38.760
Gosh.

1063
01:08:38.819 --> 01:08:39.359
Yes.

1064
01:08:40.560 --> 01:08:42.060
I didn.

1065
01:08:42.479 --> 01:08:48.060
Friend of the podcast, Tony Galuzo, who is also the president of my wrestling club.

1066
01:08:48.960 --> 01:08:50.699
How often?

1067
01:08:50.699 --> 01:08:53.699
Really, you're asking yourself. people as wrestler.

1068
01:08:53.760 --> 01:09:00.539
I just thought the Turkish wrestling mask you were wearing was interesting not to say Andrew Reed in a career.

1069
01:09:00.600 --> 01:09:03.659
It's actually filled with yeti cake and crumbs.

1070
01:09:03.720 --> 01:09:14.039
No, he came across a box of 1970s target novelisations when he was renovating his house and he sort of said, Brendan, you like Doctor Who.

1071
01:09:14.100 --> 01:09:14.699
Would you like these?

1072
01:09:14.760 --> 01:09:17.100
And I've had a look at them and to be honest, I've got all of them.

1073
01:09:17.159 --> 01:09:23.699
So what we're going to do, every podcast, we're going to give away 3 target novelisations.

1074
01:09:23.760 --> 01:09:27.479
In order to be in the running to win one of these 3 novelisations.

1075
01:09:27.539 --> 01:09:29.039
What we'd like you to do is this.

1076
01:09:29.100 --> 01:09:34.260
First of all, like us on Facebook, if you already have. wonderful. are so glad to have you.

1077
01:09:34.319 --> 01:09:39.180
Secondly, we would like you to share the link to this episode of the podcast.

1078
01:09:39.720 --> 01:09:46.260
And finally, we'd like you to follow that link, go to our website and just leave a comment, tell us what you think.

1079
01:09:46.319 --> 01:09:51.060
Tell us what you would like us to discuss in future episodes as we make our way through.

1080
01:09:51.180 --> 01:10:00.420
Now, for those of you who aren't following us on a flight through entirety on Facebook, if just say you prefer Twitter, you can also find us at FTE podcast.

1081
01:10:00.479 --> 01:10:08.220
So if you follow us on there and retweet the tweet about this podcast, that will count as an entry as well.

1082
01:10:08.279 --> 01:10:16.439
We'll keep track of everyone and we'll announce the winner on our 3rd season 5 episode.

1083
01:10:16.500 --> 01:10:20.520
Now we'll be recording that on the 23rd of November, Doctor Who's anniversary.

1084
01:10:20.579 --> 01:10:23.640
So make sure you are in before then.

1085
01:10:23.699 --> 01:10:26.939
So you'll have a week pretty much from today in order to do that.

1086
01:10:27.000 --> 01:10:30.899
So, to recap, Like, share comment.

1087
01:10:30.960 --> 01:10:35.279
Or on Twitter, follow, retweet, comment.

1088
01:10:35.340 --> 01:10:40.199
If you are one of the winners, we'll let you know what books we have, and you can choose your own, we'll post it out to you.

1089
01:10:40.260 --> 01:10:41.279
Okay.

1090
01:10:41.279 --> 01:10:42.119
Alright.

1091
01:10:42.180 --> 01:10:51.359
So that's all time we have for this episode of flight through entirety, but we will be back next week with the enemy of the world.

1092
01:10:51.840 --> 01:10:54.000
And the web of fear.

1093
01:10:54.060 --> 01:10:56.220
So do come back for that.

1094
01:10:56.279 --> 01:10:56.880
Thank you very much.

1095
01:10:56.939 --> 01:10:57.300
Good night.

1096
01:10:57.359 --> 01:10:58.619
Good night.

1097
01:11:02.399 --> 01:11:07.619
We've been listening to Flight to Entirety with Nathan Bottomley, Brendan Jones, and Richard Stone.

1098
01:11:07.680 --> 01:11:12.479
This episode, hauling a couple of prize marrows, was recorded on Sunday, the 9th of November.

1099
01:11:12.539 --> 01:11:15.239
The next episode will be released on Sunday the 23rd.

1100
01:11:15.300 --> 01:11:21.960
You can find us online at flatthroughentirety.com, flat your entirety on Facebook and iTunes or FTE podcast on Twitter.

1101
01:11:22.020 --> 01:11:24.479
I noticed what those young ladies were wearing too, Jamie.

1102
01:11:24.539 --> 01:11:26.039
I wonder if they have one in my size.

1103
01:11:29.100 --> 01:11:29.760
Let's see.

1104
01:11:35.699 --> 01:11:38.100
I think that's what she's really like.

1105
01:11:38.159 --> 01:11:43.020
Yeah, well, my friend Farrah says that she's like that in green wing that she's...

1106
01:11:43.079 --> 01:11:43.920
Yeah, no, that is her.

1107
01:11:44.220 --> 01:11:46.439
So she's she's classwegian.

1108
01:11:46.500 --> 01:11:47.579
Of course that's who she is.

1109
01:11:47.640 --> 01:11:49.500
Should I keep the accent?

1110
01:11:50.399 --> 01:11:52.199
Are you doing that now?

1111
01:11:52.260 --> 01:11:53.340
Is that what you're doing?

1112
01:11:53.399 --> 01:11:53.880
Are you doing that?

1113
01:11:54.180 --> 01:11:55.020
You're doing this?

1114
01:11:55.079 --> 01:11:55.500
Hello.

1115
01:11:55.560 --> 01:11:56.279
Hello, are you?