Hello, dear listener, and welcome back to Flight Through Entirety
the only Doctor Who podcast where the world ends if we do dance.
I'm Nathan.
I'm Brendan.
And I'm just back from up the butchers where he's really been
extending the mints.
Sausage casing.
So we've spent a week trapped in a dingy hospital wards, surviving
only on becks and back rubs, so it must be time.
I miss Medicare.
It must be time for us to finally get round to confronting this
slowly advancing army of gas mask wearing zombies.
Welcome at last.
To Brexit. to the doctor dances.
Did we get enough left wing jokes in there?
I'm not sure.
Not quite as much left-wing stuff as the actual story gets in
because Tony Ben cited by don't forget the welfare stage.
Yeah, yeah.
So last week, and we didn't mention it, the doctor suggested that
Nancy's little group of street urchins stealing food from the rich
was kind of Marxism in action.
And then this time we get, you know, the great post-war
achievement of Britain, which was the welfare state, the fact that
people in Britain had learned that they were kind of all on the
same side, despite the massive sort of class divides, you know
that plague and continue to plague Britain.
There was a kind of mentality of pulling together and a kind of
understanding that misfortune is not something that happens to you
because you're particularly feckless or wicked or lazy, but just
that you're unlucky.
And so the great post-war project of the welfare state, you get, uh
we've had a little bit of sort of left wingery sneaking its way
into the season so far with this very working class doctor.
But I think Moffat is the one who really kind of makes it explicit
this story.
It's kind of, it's funny saying this, for the time it was written
it's only 13 years ago, but it's before even the UK had gay
marriage.
And it was just after the 1st attempt at it had been defeated here
by both major parties.
So let's not forget.
And absolutely rammed through Parliament. in a very, very fast
measure to put us in our place.
Yeah, still better.
But it takes one of the few straight members of the production
team because, of course, the production team was headed up by 2
gay men and architectural women, you know.
I say that, you know, Mal Young was an executive producer, but
even Mal Young said, you know, my job was to sort of smooth
relations between a BBC in-house production, which we hadn't
really done in a long time and the BBC.
He wasn't a creative force on the show.
It was an administrative force.
But, you know, Russell T. Davies said at the time, we've got me.
We've got Mark Gatis.
We've got Phil Collins, but it's Stephen Moffat who comes in and
puts in all the gay characters.
And I think it's very important that we have someone like Stephen
Moffat, who, you know, he is kind of a definition of someone who
has all the privilege in the world.
You know, he is relatively well off in a country where he can be
successful in a creative role, he is a heterosexual white man.
And he chooses in his texts to put in strong female characters
strong queer characters.
He writes a Scottish character.
We Scottish characters.
You know, he writes in people from societally disadvantaged
backgrounds and gives them power and agency.
I think what's interesting here is too, that none of the movies
that we said that this was referencing would have been able to
have been quite so explicit about the existence of gay people as
this is.
They didn't exist.
Yeah, that's right. weren't there.
And it's the same conversation that we end up having in thin ice
with Bill, about non-white characters in the past.
And it's great that Moffatt does this.
And one of the things, like people, I think, correctly identify
sometimes that Moffatt's writing can be a bit problematic.
But I have absolutely no doubt that his heart is in the right
place.
And you can see during the course of his tenure on Doctor Who, that
he learns in his 1st season of Doctor Who, there aren't any gay
characters.
And then he goes, actually, that's a real oversight.
And here he gets to do a good gay character or a couple of good
gay characters in Algae and Jack, and then the evil Mr. Lloyd, who
has been exchanging, you know, pork for pork.
Or for crackling.
If I may jump in there.
I've had a bit of a journey with this story because when it was
1st on, it was my favourite of the entire season, and it is now my
favourite of the entire season as well.
But over the course of the last 13 years, I did actually go off it
a bit and it was because of the character of Mr. Lloyd and because
Nancy threatens to expose his queerness in order to get what she
wants.
And also that's played for comedy, which I objected to.
But looking at it, it's like, well, no, this is accurate for the
time.
And here's a hypocrite.
And he is a hypocrite. absolutely.
And exceeding his bounds, he's taking more than his fair due.
Yes, yes.
I really think that's the impetus for it, not any form of...
No, absolutely.
And that's that's the conclusion I came to as well.
It's like, well, hold on.
This is both accurate to the time, but also no one threatens algae
in that way.
You know, so it's not, it's not a punishment of queer characters.
It a punishment of an ignoble character.
And also something I didn't pick up until I was watching this this
week.
When he's talking about I pay for the food on this table, the
sweat on my brow, that is.
That's the sweat on my brow.
And I thought, yes, I'm sure it is, even if you're in the cool
room, dear.
Nancy gets a great callback to that because, of course, he's
sweating at the threats and just as she leaves.
She just says, there you go.
There's the sweat on your brow.
Yeah, yeah, beautiful.
I think if we want representation, I think that we have to get to
be villains.
I think that we have to get to be ignoble and cowardly and selfish
in if we're only that, then that's a problem.
Absolutely.
There's been a discussion recently in making video games because
video games are starting to include more queer characters as well
because video games as a storytelling narrative are often behind
film, simply because the story usually takes a backseat too, say
gameplay, you know, and how the game actually plays.
But there's a very famous video game called The Last of Us, which
is about 2 characters, a man and sort of an adopted surrogate
daughter figure in the 1st game in the 2nd game.
This character, Ellie, I believe she's called, is going to be a
stronger lead character.
And also they've introduced that she is a lesbian and she's having
a relationship with another woman.
And that prompted an author on Kataku, the website, to write an
article entitled, Let queer characters and games be happy.
And the author then cites all these examples of queer characters
and games who come to a sticky end.
It's kill your gaze.
Yeah.
Exactly.
And the point she makes towards the end is, of course, queer
characters can die as any character can die because if you have
queer characters being immortal in games, there is no tension of
whether they will survive.
It would just be nice if some did.
And I think that's a very important point.
We need to be able to be villains.
And to have bad things happen to our characters.
So long as that's not the only thing, because when Stephen Moffatt
does eventually introduce 2 gay characters, they're the fat, thin
gay atheists, why would we need names and one of them is killed
and his partner never finds out?
And it's just like, yeah, yeah.
And then he does better later down the line.
Culminating in Bill, obviously.
Yeah, yeah, the last main character that Stephen Moffat introduces
is a lesbian of colour.
He comes full circle.
Yeah.
But yeah, that's kind of been my journey with this story of going
oh, actually, that's a bit horrible to, well, that means that this
character of Mr. Lloyd.
He's got what, 2 or 3 scenes, but we find out so much about him.
Is he actually queer?
Or is he just, you know, doing it for the pork, as it were?
Yeah.
Is this his wartime sacrifice?
That defence always a little trickly a nebulous, really.
Yeah, yeah.
But, you know, it raises mystery about his character.
Whereas we're told in no uncertain terms in the story that algae
exclusively goes for men.
Yeah, so there's that distract the guards moment.
And, of course, Rose, who has watched plenty of genre TV knows
that that's her job and she goes off the...
And of course, Jack says, no, you're really not his type. is off
to distract him.
She has a real moment of this is just not clicking.
The funny thing about Rose's reaction in that is it shows, and I
think it's deliberate.
It shows, despite her intelligence and her resourcefulness, Rose
is quite a naive character.
The idea of bisexuality, shocks and surprises her.
She's quite young.
But she's got this kind of look on her faces, but he was flirting
with me.
How can he now be flirting with her?
And we'll also see next season.
And even later on this season that she finds the idea of the
doctor relating to anyone else, the way he relates to her, she
finds that very confusing and hurtful. as you do when you're
young.
Absolutely.
You know, this is my relationship.
How can that relationship exist elsewhere?
And it's very well played by Billy.
Some people have quoted it as like a character oversight, but it's
like, no, I think that is the character.
This is her first true love.
I think too, that there is a very definite attempt to, uh, like
contrast the 3 time zones that our characters are from in so far
as their kind of sexual mores are concerned.
And it's a little bit like the unearthly child, not the empty
child, an unearthly child, where you have very harsh criticism of
Carol Anne.
Well, she hasn't even had a sandwich.
Take a drink.
You know how you get the Doctor Who's from the far future.
Barbara and Ian who are from the present and then the tribe of gum
who are from, you know, 100,000 BC.
Here you get the people from the 1940s with their sexual ethics.
Then you get Billy, you get Rose, who's from 2005 with her sexual
ethics, and then you get Jack from the 51st century, and it is a
small...
With his Magnus Greel ethics. where he just picks his bints out of
a rotisserie, doesn't he?
Oh my gosh.
Like it turns out Todd was right all along.
Why was Magnus Briel not picking up young men and putting them in
the machine?
He and Jack are from the same century and we've got a much more
sort of enlightened and permissive attitude towards who we're
prepared to dance with.
Well, he was the butcher of Brisbane.
Maybe he's a descendant of Lyle Shelton.
Yeah.
Ooh, Bangtish, which would involve anyone descending with Lyle
Shelton. added great distance.
Is this point where I can get all fanboyish and say, I don't
understand how the sigma particle experiments, which wound up its
own fundamental algae, possibly have anything to do with Jack.
Why were they picking 51st centuries?
Because we could just do another casual nod as longtime viewers?
as in as in insane fanboys, i.e. yeah.
Well, I think we've said before that Russell tries to get out of
the way of Doctor Who continuity by setting everything in the sort
of 2001st century or in the year 5000000000 or whatever, and they
haven't wanted to go quite so far ahead.
And Magnus Grill does talk about time agents.
He does believe the doctor is a time agent.
You're damn right.
But so was was, I'm so sorry to do this to you.
But I know you're itching as much as I am, and it's not just the
dogs on the sofa, of whom we have 2 lovely ones here, and Nathan
and Brendan.
So there's Sigma experiments were going on parallel, but
discreetly from the main, main time, and that maybe Greal was
looking to be another Elon Musk, because that can only go well.
I think that I think that he thought that it was rather day class
A to travel through time with a watch and he wanted to find a way
of travelling through time in our Chinese like a cabinet.
And that took a lot more energy than the watchers did, you see?
So I think it all fits in very nice. beautifully.
Now you've explained it.
I can say, I don't know how I could have been so foolish not to
have seen it, yeah.
I think also, Magnus Greel is based on Earth, whereas Jack implies
several times he's been to other planets and other times.
But in terms of the continuity, they had a very difficult job this
year, in that they had to appease fans by stating, you know, this
is the same series, it is a continuation.
So if they're going to refer back to something, they need to make
damn sure they've got it right.
So if the script includes references to time agents, it doesn't
surprise me at all that someone, whether it was Moffat or whether
it was Russell would say, okay, in that case, then Jack is from
the 51st century and that way we can tie it in.
And it's the kind of continuity reference that we will get, but
the audience won't feel the general audience won't feel that
they've missed something.
No, they won't notice that it's a preference.
Yeah, any more than the sort of stuff about the eyesop galaxy or
venom grubs.
No, exactly.
And yeah, I think it's the same reason that a few weeks ago, we
had a 60s, 70s cyberhead in the museum because it's like, what
kind of cyber stories got the largest amount of viewers.
What do people remember?
And so fans will go, oh, well, that's ahead from the invasion
whereas casual viewers would go, oh, I think I watched that with
my dad.
Yeah, I remember that one.
Yeah.
They had flares.
Yeah, so I think this year they tread very deftly with
continuity.
And I remember being terribly excited when I could spot a
reference, you know, and even all these 13 years later, I still
only just catch the reference to the ISOP galaxy in the long
game.
Oh, yeah, there's one in Bad Wolf as well, but there's one in the
long game on one of the news channels.
Right, right.
The face of Bo is referred to as being from the ISOP Galaxy.
Beautiful.
So, as always, I think we should get back to the topic of sex.
So, the doctor dances, it's obviously an oblique way to talk about
the doctor having sex.
The world doesn't end if the doctor dances.
And this season, we've talked about that show Bible before where
Russell says that he doesn't want the doctor to be that new to
public schoolboy.
So the doctor very clearly, I think, this season sort of comes out
as heterosexual in a more explicit way than he has before, and
perhaps a less explicit way than he will next year, I think, with
Billy.
And we've always had Pat flirting with the female guest stars.
Tom desperately trying to put his hands on Judith Paris. threw up
a row of psychone fencing and it still didn't stop him.
No.
But here we have, you know, like this season we've had people ask
about the, whether the Dr. and Rose have a sexual relationship.
We have the doctor kind of going on a date with Jabe, and here we
do get the question of whether the doctor has sex.
And I think associated with that is. the 1st reference ever to the
doctor shaving as well.
Yes.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Although he had a shaving mirror, as we know.
Yes, that's true.
In the secondary console. which we used between season 10 and 11
when he asked Victoria to travel with him again in one of the
decalogues, I believe it was.
I'm a very passionate person.
You have my entire attention.
What I what I really love and adore about that scene where the Dr
and Rose are trapped in that cupboard waiting for Jack to rescue
them is just the doctor's hurtness and defensiveness that Rose
assumes that he doesn't have desires and passions and loves. know
he has referred to the fact that he's lost everyone.
And so we get the implication here that he may have lost someone
he loves.
And Christopher Eccleston, of course, didn't do as many interviews
as his successors would do about the role.
But one thing he said about his interpretation of the character
that is always stuck with me is he said, the doctor's at Time Lord
and Time Lords have 2 hearts, which means they can both be
broken.
It brings back that melancholy that Sylvester McCoy is so often
brought into the character and, you know, the doctor seems quite
hurt that Rose would just assume that he doesn't have this element
to his life.
Yes.
And it's possible that the reason he presents himself that way.
And I think the doctor's kind of thinking about that. hold on, is
that what I've shown you that I can't love?
And yeah, well, it kind of is, because you've been pushing away
love and affection, like when Jay reaches out to him, he doesn't
say anything.
I think also it's about the doctor not being that sort of matinee
idol hero that Jack is.
So Jack is very definitely presented to someone who dances, you
know, and he is handsome.
He dances on the top of his sheep.
He gives champagne to Rose, you know, all of that.
He's sort of sexy and she's been complaining that the doctor isn't
a proper hero at the very opening of last week's episode.
She talks about how they never leave earth and they nip back for
milk. and there's nothing sort of particularly glamorous or sexy
or techie about the doctor.
He's a little bit sort of ramshackle.
And she says, you know, give me some spark, scan frailian tech, do
something really cool and science fiction-y.
Then Jack comes along and Jack is beating the doctor.
The doctor's kind of being cucked a bit by Jack at this point.
And Jack comes along and he's dashing and he's got a big gun and
he makes fun of the doctor's tiny sonic screw.
And, you know, talks about how stupid it is and the doctor's
visibly embarrassed about this screwdriver.
Yeah, and he struggles to sort of justify the screwdriver.
He's like, haven't you ever been bored or had a lot of cabinets to
put up?
I get the impression there that the doctor suddenly thinks
actually why do I have this?
Why did I choose a screwdriver?
Going all the way back to the very beginning last week when the
doctor says it's like a mauve alert?
And even Rose was like, that's not proper.
It's red alert.
Doctor's like only by your standards, you know?
It's all about, as we've been talking about, it's the different
Marais and customs.
And, you know, the doctor can kind of walk in and observe the
customs of someone else, but he doesn't necessarily take them on
board.
Whereas Jack does nothing to hide his 51st century sensibilities.
You know, when he flirts with algae, algae enjoys it, but he's, you
know, he's very worried and concerned about being found out.
Yeah, he's a little shocked by Jack's full witness.
There's this undercurrent with the sexuality in this story that
it's kind of like, it's a period of war, they don't think they're
going to get out of this.
You know, Nancy even says what future.
Hold on.
If you're a Londoner from the future, how come you sound English?
Why aren't you German?
They don't think that they're going to win this.
So it's like, I've been kind of a good boy all my life.
You can imagine algae thinking, I've been a good boy all my life
and gone for the girls.
Well, I'm going to be dead next week.
So no, I like boys.
I'm like now.
I'm not going to shout it from the rooftops because I feel like I
can't, but I'm going to bloody indulge.
And, you know, Mr. Lloyd, if he is enjoying his trips to the
butchers.
He's going, well, this is the time for it.
Nancy, 5 years ago, as a teenager, has obviously fallen for
someone who said he would be there in the original draft of the
script.
Jamie's father was in the story.
Right.
And pretty much he was this mysterious figure who was helping
Nancy from the periphery.
So, you know, he might scout out the building and call Nancy in.
And that was then streamlined for 2 reasons.
One, it's like, why do you need that character?
Nancy gets to be the one who goes in.
But two, it lends that degree of ambiguity of, okay, did he
abandon Nancy, was he a soldier?
Did he have to go off and fight?
Was he a much older man?
Did he already have a family?
and was this going on?
We're not given any of that information.
I think it is eventually made clear that she was very young.
And like if he'd gone off and been killed, she wouldn't have had
to say that Jamie was her brother.
And the thing that has got us into this mess that has got us into
this whole gas mask zombie mess is the sexual ethics prevalent in
the 1940s.
And if Jamie had known that Nancy was his mother, then the Chula
ambulance thing wouldn't have made the mistakes that it did.
And it's only rectified where she's able to stand up and say, I am
your mother.
This is a kid who has never known who his mother is.
He doesn't know who his mother is.
He's got a big sister, but because it's outrageous and impossible
for her to stand up and say, yes, I wasn't married, but this is my
son.
Just as it would be impossible for Mr. Lloyd to stand up and say
that butch is hot.
I'm leaving Mrs. Lloyd for him or algae can't come out either.
All of this sort of oppressive mid-20th century sexual morality is
the problem here.
And the solution to it is...
It's not the bombs, do you?
The solution is the 51st sexual morality that Jack brings to the
table or the couch or, yeah.
Pop dick.
So for extreme comfort.
Well, I mean, Moffat wrote, joking apart is like a really kind of
slightly embarrassing sex comedy.
It predates coupling, which is slightly less embarrassing sex
comedy.
But, you know, Moffatt, that's where Moffatt made his name in TV.
And it's nice for the 1st time, I think, to have a Doctor Who
story that comments on sexual ethics is a central part of it, sort
of thematic architecture.
Again, it links back to the Sylvester McCoy era.
And the interesting thing was when the series was being publicised
before it came back, Russell T. Davies had said in an interview
when he was talking about the tone of the series, oh, you know
we're looking back to older eras of the show, like the Hinchcliffe
era.
And some tabloids, and I believe I mentioned this back in Rose.
Some tabloids then picked that up as the series is going to carry
on from season 14 and ignore everything that came afterwards, and
it's a semi-reboot.
And Russell then had to come out and give an interview and say, no
no, no, I love all eras of Doctor Who.
And he even cited, for instance, a lot of people think the last 3
years of Doctor Who were terrible was Sylvester McCoy.
But we are building on that a lot.
We have a character who's from London and we, and he even said, we
probably wouldn't be able to do this without the groundwork that
Sylvester McCoy and Sophie Aldred had laid because I remember then
Sophie Aldred said in an interview, they're talking about the
stuff we did and saying it's an antecedent of what they're doing
which is amazing.
We didn't think anyone was watching. you know.
Back in the curse of Fenrick.
It starts introducing Ace's sexuality.
You know, there'd been hints beforehand.
But again, that's the World War 2 setting.
And the whole reason that Ace is able to seduce that guard is
because she acts in a way contrary to how a woman would act.
And of course, we have Kathleen being shocked at the idea that
Audrey might be born out of wedlock.
Yeah, that's the same thing, isn't it?
Where Ace just casually assumes that Kathleen's not married
because she's young and like none of Ace's friends are married
probably.
And then Kathleen's quite shocked by that.
Yeah, shocked and offended.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You know, I'm not I'm not that kind of girl.
And, of course, we've got Mrs. Hardacre saying, you know, any
expression of female sexuality is evil.
Because she was that kind of girl.
Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. yeah subtext there.
Whereas here, people are set free by acknowledging.
Actually, this is a bit stupid.
This is my son.
Yeah.
That scene is so powerfully played because the realisation leading
up to the moment where the doctor figures it all out.
It's mostly played with looks.
The monsters are around saying, are you my mummy, are you my
mummy?
And Nancy says it's all my fault.
And the doctor says, how can it be your, and then it's just
cutting between the zombies and the doctor and Nancy and just
their looks to each other?
And then the doctor spells it all out.
And yeah, we praised her last week.
But yeah, Florence Howath puts in a great job again here.
Now, I don't know exactly which scene it is, but there's one scene
in this episode with Nancy, which was a Philocine, and for ages
that I heard it was the scene with the typewriter, with one of the
kids writing a letter to his dad, and then the child takes control
of the typewriter, and I believe Stephen Moffatt said in
interviews, yes, I had to write that scene quite late, and that's
why it doesn't make much sense because the kid can control
speakers.
Not any machine.
How can he suddenly control a typewriter, but, you know, we had 2
minutes to fill.
It's also the same beat that he does earlier in the episode as
well, where, which I think is fabulous, where they're playing the
recordings of Dr. Tate, talking to Jamie when he 1st arrived in
the hospital. and you hear him speaking, but you can hear this
crackling sound. and it's really well directed because if you're
paying attention, you actually know what's going on.
The tape has reached its end and it's just making that sort of
noise of a reel-to-reel tape going around and the sort of crinkly
bit of tape, hitting it, but the voices are still going, and then
we suddenly realise that in fact the tape has reached its end and
it's actually Jamie approaching, controlling the speaker.
Now we have everyone's talking, the typewriter's still going, and
then it turns out the kid's not typing any longer because it's
Jamie approaching.
So it does dilute that a bit.
But the 1st version of it is so moffety.
So brilliantly moffity and so scary.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. especially Eccleston's reaction, because he
plays it both as like utter fascination with what's happening, but
slowly building terror, because he kind of goes, it's got the
power of a God.
I've sent it to its room.
This is its room.
I think that he realises what's going on too, because Rose nags
him a couple of times about what the sound is, what that crackling
noise is, and he ignores her.
Yeah, yeah.
I think he knows that that's Jamie coming.
And you know, then we've get the whole thing with the banana.
See, I think that's where the doctor starts to win.
I think that had this sort of phase where Jack is the better hero
than the doctor because he's sort of sexier and more techie and
has more Spock going and the doctor seems a little bit
embarrassed.
But then he's sort of surreptitiously stealing Jack's squareness
gun and going back in time to destroy the place that comes from
and replace it with a banana plantation.
And like his sort of much sillier, much less violent approach to
being a hero.
Yeah, he wins because he's not a yank and the British will always
side with their own.
He's the George Formby in this comedy.
If Jack is whomever you want to Paul Hein Reid, whomever you want
to cast, is the glamorous matinee idol.
And of course, the home counties always win.
But, well, that's, yes, we have no bananas.
It's actually referencing that's great.
Which was a wartime here.
Yes, yes.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It can't have been easy to get bananas in London actually.
They weren't around.
They were doing U SATs bananas.
Made out of jackfruit and jack boots.
Donuts.
And all the other bits of jack that weren't necessary.
This precise moment for any other deeds, yes.
Every generation. loves and seems to reboot when they come of age
the period just when they were born.
You know, which is why you tend to get fashion and theatre tropes
and indeed, aesthetics on a wider socialist level. sort of kind of
spinning every 20 years.
The 70s were very 1930s, 40s in, in film references and in clothes
of course, of that generation.
We're seeing a bit of 80s, 90s, redundancy now.
Those kids, as poor children.
That's all they had.
That's all we left to revive.
And we were interested in the mod aspects and well, Doctor Who.
But this now, we also have that other point where that generation
was starting to properly leave us the very last of them.
And there's a real heartburning of the great loss and that have
been in British films a long time, but it was really starting to
come up.
And it's interesting seeing it now.
It's something of our Anzac, our own in Australia.
We have the Anzac memory or the Anzac Memorial, which has become
in both in its physical presence and in its march each year, which
has become something really quite extreme and not at all what it
was when those diggers were still alive, which was, oh, yes, we
honour them, but we don't make a fuss about it.
It's no big thing.
It's actually something, you know, there's a lot of shame in this
on every level.
We'll just acknowledge quietly.
And this was kind of the last beat of that before, I think you'll
start to see.
We mentioned it last week, but you'll start to see with Brexit
coming that you'll be getting, I think, something a little bit
boulderized and perhaps overweening in the 40s nostalgia that's
about to come up.
But this is a lovely point in between the 2 and the films that we
were just talking about and my pick of the week later on.
So, again, there's a lot to be thankful to Moffatt for, to Mr
Stephen Moffatt.
He doesn't like being called Moffat.
Apparently, he's not a brand.
Or, you know, or brute 33, whatever it is.
But he it's a beautiful balancing act.
This 2 powder, and I was terribly excited at the time because I
thought, oh, goody, we're getting back to 4 parties, again, being
a loyal big finish.
I can split this up and pretend it's 4 episodes.
It is 4 episodes only without quite so much standing around
cheaply in corridors.
How true, isn't it?
The thing is, there is still a bit of urgent standing in corridors
and hospital wards.
You know, which, yeah, Stephen Moffatt says Doctor Who is about
urgent standing at corridors.
Actors speaking to each other and reading its theatre.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I have to say one of one of the sort of most heartrending moments
in this for me.
It's the beginning of the redemption of Jack, because the whole
thing is, yeah, okay, Jack is your matinee idol.
He's the hero with the gun.
He's the sexy one.
He's he's Captain Kirk, but the situation starts to get out of
control.
And the situation for Jack gets out of control.
And John Barriman plays it really well.
Again, it's all about looks, is when he approaches Algae and Algae
turns around and says, are you my mummy?
And the look on Jack's face is heartbreaking, because until this
point, you're kind of led to believe that as flirty as Jack is, he
doesn't actually care about anyone, you know, it's all just a
con.
It's, you know, yeah, I go to Pompeii, but I get out before
volcano day, you know, he doesn't care that all those people have
died, but he likes algae and when he sees that happen to algae and
begins to realise that this is his fault.
It's actually a really bittersweet moment, and I think it's the
1st time we see him show kind of genuine emotion that's not just
about the con, and that's where his redemption begins.
And he becomes so desperate to say, this isn't my fault.
This isn't my fault. isn't my fault.
And when the doctor points out, well, actually, it's this.
Again, he's horrified and his only defence is I didn't know.
Didn't stand up in the Hague.
No, but I mean, but that is what prompts his actual redemption.
So he gets kind of the doctor's winning at this point because he
cares more and because he's more fun and more silly than Jack.
And Jack realises that he has to make it rise in order to save
everyone.
So he gets to die heroically, like a sort of proper hero in a way
that sort of immediately subverted.
We get that wonderful Doctor Strange love.
God, yes.
That was another filming reference.
I have heard somewhere that the script reads Jack is sitting on
the bomb and they viewed it, I believe, in the original script.
Russell T Davies sort of saw him as, you know, he's sitting on it
like a park bench.
You know, he's sitting, he's sitting side saddle, as it were.
Well, it is Jack.
But apparently it was John Barriman when he got into the studio, he
just got astride it and they went, actually, there you go.
That also gives us our bad wolf reference for this episode because
the bomb has on the side of it written Schleichter Wolf.
But the problem is the translation's really dodgy and it actually
translates to naughty wolf rather than bad.
It's like rummy wolf.
You chose the wrong German word.
It's like we have a very precise language, you know, it's this or
this.
Also, in that moment, and this is something that James has pointed
out to me in the past, we start getting the strings from the
Doctor Who theme in the incidental music.
And at the time this episode went out, James's partner was a
musician and DJ and wasn't big into Doctor Who, but loved the
music of Doctor Who.
And so James learned a lot about music as well.
And because the Doctor Who theme is not owned by the BBC, it is
licensed from, I believe, Warner Music owned the copyright.
And that's why when this was coming on and also with the telemovie
there was doubt as to whether they would be able to retain the
theme.
So in Murray Gold's theme arrangement, he introduces the strings
as a counter melody, so he can use those in the incidental music.
Whereas using the actual sort of melody of the Doctor Who theme
could incur, you know, an extra usage fee.
He can use the bits he's introduced to the theme to link the
incidental music to the theme and sort of make that, you know, this
is the theme of when the doctor starts to win.
But that's also part of the reason that he will go on to develop
themes for each doctor and each character, because, you know, we
know that that's I am the doctor.
We know that that's am I a good man and that is the music for this
character.
But yeah, it's when Jack is sitting on the bomb and we're getting
the strings that are just lifted from the theme, but it's really
effective because it ties that in.
From another production standpoint, before we get to the ending, I
love the cinematography and the light and the colouring in this
story.
It is so cold.
It feels so cold.
And the whole thing happens at night, you know, which is so rare.
I don't think we've ever had a Doctor Who story with external
filming that's been entirely at night.
I think the closest and it's not external, but things like the
horror, Wing Chiang, horror fang rock happens in one night kind of
thing.
But yeah, there's so much external stuff happening here.
And... happiness patrol.
Something else I picked up on with the cinematography. was last
week.
The 2 phone calls the doctor gets when the phone rings, the shots
are framed in a similar way.
So you've got the phone on one side of the screen.
You've got the doctor on the other side of the screen.
You've got Nancy standing behind in the distance.
And then, so the 1st one, the TARDIS phone is on the right
doctor's on the left. 2nd one, phone is on the left, doctor's on
the right.
And also there's a there's a Batman angle just to make you feel
uneasy and make you feel strange.
And speaking of that whole four-parter thing.
The great thing is, if you were to divide last week's episode into
2 parts.
The cliffhanger is when the doctor opens the door for the child.
And just imagine that as a cliffhanger.
Doctor opens the door.
You don't see what's on the other side of the door, credits, and
then the reprise, and then the solution is, the kid's gone.
It's a great falling action there.
And that's another great moment for Eccleston.
You know, he's he's been the child left out in the cold, which is
a theme Stephen Moffatt will run with.
The more he writes for the character.
So he feels sympathy for this child.
And yeah, it's it's the doctor's sort of detached curiosity that
he always has.
But at the same time, you know, he has to know and he has to save
this child.
And with the ending as we get to it, We've had so much death this
season.
And so much of other characters solving the problem.
Like, um, I remember one story that came in for a lot of criticism
at the time was the long game because basically the doctor is
restrained during the whole denouement and it's, it's all down to
him having inspired someone half an hour ago who then, who then
comes up and solves the problem.
But here, yeah, the doctor gets to do it instead.
I think he inspires 2 people.
He inspires Jack to go back and kind of fix the problem.
And then he inspires Nancy to make her admission and he's right
there doing it.
And he also gets to do some magic.
You know, like he gets to do some...
Well, some very Harry Potter effects.
Yeah, yeah.
And I think that that's very deliberate as well.
You know, the doctor doesn't solve things with guns.
He solves things with magic.
He's the doctor.
It's the Maggie Smith of the production all along.
Yeah.
It's doing the accent.
Like the nano genes are established very clearly and mentioned a
bunch of times in the 1st episode.
Jack has the ability to take control of speakers.
So all of this sort of stuff, because Moffat will create monsters
that are whatever shape is needed for the plot, and people talk
about blink being sort of great, but blink cheat horrifically by
making the monsters be and do whatever. he thinks will look cool
and will serve the plot.
And he brilliantly takes them out of context the following year
and actually uses them for something else.
But you couldn't take the Chula Warship ambulance things out of
context because they're completely dependent on whatever it is
that the plot needs to happen or whatever visual set pieces we
need. you know.
Yeah, hexacromite gas.
Lethal to reptile and marine life.
Yeah, we just have it hanging around.
But it does give us that fantastic moment and it's maybe one of
Eggleston's best moments in the series where, just of excitement
just give me this one, just this once.
Everybody lives. that so many times in the past, haven't we, Mr
Seward?
We have.
And that's actually a whole go-at say, wasn't it?
It's the opposite of resurrection of the time.
You can see Janet Fielding sitting at home saying, I would have
bloody stayed at that time.
Even that woman's leg.
My leg's grown back.
And it wants to go to E's room.
It's saying I've got a really horrible dress.
And this is the greatest comedic throwaway line, which is so
British comedy.
Well, there is a war on.
That scene just made me so, so sad that Eccleston was going.
Because you can see what Russell T. Davies was doing is he's like
we're going to do the Colin Baker thing. going to have a very long
arc to get to know this character, and for God's sake, never say
that.
Never ends well.
It's so true, isn't it?
So, you know, this is obviously we're going to have sort of a year
and towards the end of that year is when he gets better and he
starts being the doctor and being, you know, the sort of happy
figure the doctor should be and we're going to build up to that.
And then, you know, in a few weeks just to finish off.
He is going to wipe out the Daleks once and for all.
He's going to end the time war and, you know, then we'll go on to
him, you know, being all chummy with Queen Victoria and, oh God
now we've lost our lead actor.
And dare I say it, and I may say this in future appearances.
I think that's why losing Eccleston.
It sets the series back because we're not able to finish that idea
of him healing.
And so when he regenerates, David Tennant's doctor has to carry
that and really he has to carry it all through his tenure.
And it's not even until Matt Smith that we're able to start to get
over that guilt.
I mean, it's explicitly got over in day of the doctor.
Exactly.
It takes all that time.
Maybe it was supposed to, but I certainly agree with you.
I'm really pacing myself for season 2 and now we'll be watching it
imagining what would Eccleston have done?
I also think losing Billy at the end of season 2 has a big effect
on what he planned to do as well.
Was she going to stay?
Was that the plan to stay longer?
I thought 2 years was good.
I don't think that his original intention was to change cast every
year, which is what he ends up doing.
And that series Bible says we're not even going to mention
regeneration because it just might not come to that.
And then he discovers that he's going to be doing, you know, what
happened during the Heartnal era where or the Trout era where you
have a change of cast every year.
And I think that the thing that he intended to set up doesn't come
off.
We'll get more of that when we talk about season two.
But yeah, I mean, this is the story that made me miss Eccleston in
advance.
It's like, 0 God, the end is coming and I'm really not ready for
it.
I feel like I've just met you kind of thing.
I'm just getting to know you.
And suddenly the party's over and you're getting on a plane
tomorrow, you know, is how it feels.
And it's like, you know, what might have been?
And what might have been is Eccleston, who feels like he doesn't
get happiness and doesn't get comedy right, is that appropriately
enough for an episode entitled The Doctor Dances, he doesn't set a
foot wrong in this story.
You know, he pictures everything perfectly from the vulnerability
of kind of saying to Rose.
Look, I am capable of that.
I am capable of romance.
I am capable of caring.
Right through to his utter triumph at the end.
And, you know, Rose even comments, look at you beaming away like
your father Christmas, you know, Rose comments, basically.
I've never seen you this happy.
Yeah, it's it's powerful and if we hadn't known that he was going
thank you, BBC publicity department for totally cocking that up, if
we hadn't known that he was going, how happy would we have been?
Because that's the thing, this whole season has that undercurrent
of knowing that he's a Mayfly. going to be gone soon.
How did he get on with James Hawes?
How was all of that working up?
Uh, we don't know, but eventually, I think the plan had been
originally for Graham Harper to do the final recording block, uh
and he said that he wanted Joe Hearn, and he was pretty insistent
that Joe Hearn should do it instead.
I think James Horse does a good job of this. backed for the
Christmas invasion.
He's good, I think.
Yeah.
I think the only director, actually, 2 directors that Eccleston
apparently didn't get on.
Well, we know he didn't get on with Keith Boke.
And I have heard that he also didn't gel well with thumb Brian
Gant, who directed The Long Game.
I haven't heard anything particularly about him and James Hawes
but yeah, there is that whole thing of he pretty much he wanted
Joe Hearn to direct everything.
He got on really well with Joe O Hearn.
And even 5 years ago when he was talking about not doing the
anniversary special.
He said, I might come back if Joe Aherne directs.
And of course, we've heard from other sources that Joe Hearn will
never direct again for Doctor Who because basically his partner
said, it's me or Doctor Who, because just because Eccleston
demanded him back on the show, he was incredibly overworked and
incredibly overstretched.
And, you know, it's a bit like there are certain media companies
that Rod said to me, you're not allowed to work for them again.
You're absolute hell when you're working for them.
It's a matter of if I had to take a job with him, he would
disapprove.
He wouldn't actually react all that badly.
But it is that kind of thing of, you know, jobs can affect you in
that way.
Because you're off in Cardiff doing it as well. presumably away
from home.
That's a long way from Newtown for Brendan.
And especially with the finale being apparently such a tense
environment to nobody really talking to anyone and having to have
your 3 leads shot entirely separately.
Yeah.
I believe it was this episode that was shot at the same time as
the long game, and also, if you look at the long game, entirely
studio bound.
If you look at this, lots of location work.
If you look at the long game, there's lots of scenes without Chris
and Billy, if you look at this in the 1st episode, Chris and Billy
are separated for ages.
So it wasn't as the Dr. Light episodes would be, you know, shot
entirely at the same time, but there was a lot of overlap to allow
for that kind of scheduling.
Boomtown next week will essentially be the Doctor Light episode.
And again, they split everyone into three.
So you can have essentially 13rd of the usual workload for each of
the leads.
And yeah, here, of course, I think it's more, the traditional
Doctor Who structure of doctor and companion get separated, doctor
and companion come back together later in the story and compare
notes.
Yeah.
I think at the time, I knew that Jack was going to become a
regular.
I don't think they were shy about that because the casting of
Barrowman was very heavily announced because, of course, he was
such a name and remained such a name, you know.
And of course, from our perspective, we heard, oh, my God, you
know, we've got an openly gay man playing regular on the poop.
That being said, that final seed is very much shot like, you know
this character is going to make a sacrifice.
And because we've had several sacrificial characters over the
course of this year, you know, we have Pete, we had um, Clive, we
had Harriet Jones, who was willing to sacrifice herself, but she's
fine.
You know, we have Suki.
It's played like, yeah, this is this week's sacrifice.
But the thing is, the doctors already said, no, everyone lives
this time.
So he has to come in.
And that wonderful pullback shot.
I remember watching that thinking and we're just going to see it
explode now and oh, that's so sad.
Then we pull back through the doors and Glenn Miller's playing
again.
And we're in the tart.
We're in the tartars.
And because the doctor's not even hanging out saying, go away, go
away.
No, he's like, no, I'm dancing with Rose.
You can come in if you like, you know.
Do you think, is that mattered?
I think it looks so good that I just want to, in my head, cannon.
They just built the 2 sets next to one another and he just sort of
walks through from one end to the other.
I think it's so great.
It's so well done.
Yeah, yeah.
And again, sort of just moffity and clever.
No, I'm pretty sure they did do that.
They did attach that set to the Tartis Outer Dorks because that
whole Tartis console room was a standing set with the exterior
doors outside.
It's basically the toy that they later released and is out again
Richard.
So if you missed out on getting it last time.
I mean, I like to make my own, but this one is quite fiddly, all
those curves.
Like literally the only reason I haven't bought it is I have the
Matt Smith one and it's been sitting in the garage for 6 years
because I don't have any room for it.
Yes, we don't.
We don't.
Yeah, it's a beautiful shot and a beautiful moment.
But also it sums up the relationship between the 3 characters as
it's developing.
Because, you know, when he steps aboard the Tartars, Rose
immediately wants to dance with him, but with this threat, the
doctor needs to assert himself.
And, you know, he needs to assert himself as I'm the manager, but
he does it by swing dancing around the console room.
You know, he doesn't go, I've got a bigger gun.
He goes, look, yeah, yeah, you can do all that.
Well, I can do what you do too, mate.
And I feel a bit uncomfortable with that, but I think I'm meant to
because the last shot after the doctor takes a rose for a dip is
he looks over at Jack and we end on the doctor looking at Jack and
sort of challenging him.
And again, it's this promise of what could have been if
Christopher Eccleston had stuck around longer.
It's deliberately setting up that there might be a bit of tension
between these two, 4 roses affections and 4 leadership.
You know where that was also going to go.
The red bicycle.
Red bicycle when you were 12.
The next story was going to look at how the doctor had been
manipulating Rose's timeline to make the perfect companion.
This was Paul Abbott's rejected script.
So Paul Abbott, who created Shameless, who was a TV writer in the
UK, sort of comparable to RTD, his sort of influence and stuff, and
they tried to get Paul Abbott to write for the show, but it didn't
pan out.
But he was such a fan of cartmole.
Yes.
I'm glad they didn't.
It was just a bit too silver.
Yes, really.
Yeah.
Or what ends up happening with the Moffatt characters who, you
know, they're all women that the doctor has met when they were
small children. somewhat creepy way.
In a Elon Muskie sort of way.
Yeah, yeah.
And the dilemma of that story was going to be, does Jack tell
Rose?
And I'm really glad they didn't do that as well because it just
feels wrong for the Eccleston Dr. and Rose relationship in that
Eccleston is a Doctor Who's learning to be with other people
again.
And I think that if they had introduced a storyline where he's
manipulating his best friend into what he wants, that is an evil
action.
Well, it's that's a more sort of Moffat thing in RTD's world.
The companions are people that we like and identify with people
who we hope, you know, leave the doctor better.
The trust in happenstance and coincidence.
Actually, RTD has faith in the human condition.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Whereas the Moffatt characters tend to be much more science
fiction-y and much more high concept, much more duty comicky.
Well, a little alienating, I think, for that reason.
They're like kind of the DC universe where everyone's a bit flat
and gray and with lots of dark shadows.
Yeah, it's not really where I want to be going.
But luckily, that hasn't happened.
All right, so it's part two, which means that it's time for picks
of the week.
Hurra.
So my pick of the week.
It is on YouTube, but it's an audio adventure.
It's called Doctor Who, the Ninth Doctor Adventures Cold Open.
And it's a fan-made production with a very, very good Christopher
Eccleston impersonator.
That's Jodie Whitaker.
Yes.
And the idea is it happens just before the 1st series.
They've only released one episode so far called Cold Open, as I
say.
It's 33 minutes long.
And for me, it kind of feels like the audio visuals plays, which I
know I've mentioned before, which were the forerunner to the big
finish plays.
It's very professionally done.
It's quite a simple story.
It's only got a few characters.
But as I say, the Eccleston is very good and I highly recommend
it.
So we'll include a link for that on the website.
Always assuming BBC Enterprises hasn't made them take it down.
Oh, it's been up for 4 months.
It's still there.
I can see it here on my screen.
So we're okay for now. listen to that right now.
Well, my thing's always antecedents.
So I just throw a few at us.
I didn't mention Gri Garson last week in Mrs. Miniver, which is
William Wyler's lovely 1942 piece on how the Brits were coping
with the Blitzes, but it's set in Cornwall in Judy Cornwall.
And it's the film about which Churchill said that was worth more
to us than 100 warships.
He cites this film as the one that brought the Yanks into the war
as much as anything else.
Really, isn't that good?
Well it's Greek arson.
And it's Morgan Milo.
Well, there's some other ones.
There are better films.
There's, um, fires were started, put that light out.
Yes, it's about the AFS.
Oh, the Amateur Boys, but he uses the real boys, and there's some
moments in this at the bomb site that really reminded me of that
film.
So that's Humphrey Jennings from 1943.
Um, There's Next of King, Thorold Dickinson, didn't they have
lovely names, just then, which was all about Kayla's talk costing
lives.
But my favourite.
It's called Their Finest, and it came out only 2 years ago, 2016
and the director was Lonnie Scherfig, and it stars the podcast's
own Gemma Atherton.
Did you see it?
It's about a girl during the war who is sort of on her own and we
don't know exactly why she's on her own or how she's got to be
where she is, but she's terribly clever and competent and she ends
up writing.
Propaganda or writing the scripts, but she also ends up working
within, anyway, I won't spoil it for you.
It's a really lovely piece and even though it comes after this.
I'm thinking, oh, come on, you.
I mean, we can't just cite this show as being an influence on
later films.
However, there's some lovely little tonal moments.
It did really well.
I think I got a BAFTA.
So yes, fresh from her bond fingering podcast.
I just remembered there's something else I wanted to pick of the
week for this story and that is Atta girl.
Oh yes.
Yes.
Yeah, I know.
How could we not?
Yeah.
What were we thinking?
So it's one of the big finish originals.
They come up with 7 original ideas, like not based on any other TV
show or what have you?
So the original concept comes from Louise Jameson, and it's based
on the woman's air transport auxiliary.
So it was the women who were moving planes where they needed to be
in the war, flying without radios.
So they would be shot at by their own people.
So they had to fly under a certain altitude.
So the British army would know, oh, that's probably an ATA girl.
I think it's something like something between one or 3 and 10 of
them died while flying, crashes got shot down, et cetera, et
cetera.
It's for one hour plays, absolutely beautiful and allergic and
heartbreaking, all directed by Louise Jameson, all written by
women such as Helen Goldwin and Jane Slaven, who have done big
finish for years.
Yes, and I think currently available for $25 or $30 on download.
They may do more.
It is labelled as series one.
So there may be more tales.
It's a really cracking.
Yeah, yeah.
What is so amazing about it is they keep the sound design and
music to such a minimum to try and emulate the style of an old war
movie.
And there are men in the plays, but it's mostly the stories of
these women.
Not exactly based on true stories, but based on things that
happened.
And I think Louise actually said there are 2 characters in it who
really existed.
And, you know, we've tried to be as loyal to them, but most of
them, we've we've made up.
We've put together real people, but it's kind of like the things
we're talking about.
All of these things happen to someone.
Yeah, continuing the sort of very the very strong Nancy in this
story.
Go listen to Atagirl.
Oh, well, I feel like mine's going to be a little bit of a
letdown.
Last time we had pics of the week, my peak of the week was
television because...
Give it a try.
It's really good. recommend it.
We've spent a lot of time covering the wilderness years by not
putting out an episode of the podcast for several months.
And while that happened, of course, for new Target books came out
all of which you've probably read by now.
But given that we spent a lot of time expressing what we're
probably fairly minor criticisms of Stephen Moffatt, his
novelisation of the day of the doctor is everything that you would
expect it to be.
It's smug and it's sort of complicated, but it is so wonderfully
funny and so terrifically humane and so tremendously well done
that it's definitely worth a read.
So I think all 4 of them are great.
The 2 of them that are set in series one and 2 are also available
as audiobooks read by Camil Kaduri.
And, you know, definitely worth a listen, but I would really
strongly recommend the day of the doctor. which is probably the
sort of the last Doctor Whoey thing that we'll get from Offett for
a while.
Well, dear, sir, we've saved 1940s London, so we'll be off to
threatened Carterville, 2006.
Like it hasn't got it coming.
And we'll be catching up with some old friends on the way.
We'll see you next week for Boomtown.
In the meantime, you can find us at flightthroughentirety.com
flight through entirety on Facebook and Apple Podcasts and at FTE
podcast on Twitter.
And if you would like us to spend the evening with you sitting on
the couch watching a Bond film, why not grab one of our James Bond
commentary podcast over on Bondfinger?
That's Bondfinger.com, Bondfinger on Facebook and Apple Podcasts
and at Bondfingercast on Twitter.
Can I just say, Moonraker is really good, but probably don't
listen to it while you're drinking anything.
Yeah, drink something beforehand because, yeah, you don't want to
have a mouthful of liquid when we get to the space station.
How many times have I heard people say that?
Gravity.
Until next time, may you find to your surprise and delight that
you have one more leg than you actually thought you had.
Thank you very much for listening and good night.
I love it when that happens.
Yes, no referencing Rolf Harris, couldn't I?
That was Flight through Entirety, starring Nathan Bottomley
Brendan, Jones, and Richard Stone.
Theme arrangement by Cameron Lamb, Strings performance by Jane
Alberg.
This episode, Sofa of Extreme Comfort, was recorded on the 22nd of
July 2018, and released on the 29th of October.
And of course, you can hear more of this sort of nonsense on Jody
interterror. a Doctor Who flash cast in which we chat about each
new episode of Doctor Who series 11 near hours after it airs.
That's Jody Intetera.com and Jody Intetera on Apple Podcasts.
Should we just talk about the final scene with Jack?
Yes.
I've got nothing to say.
Let's try that again.
So let's just talk about, oh, do we have anything to talk about
the ending or not?
I need to think again.
So remember, he's like talking to his computer and ordering a
martini and talking about waking up with his with his
executioners.
Lovely couple stayed in touch.
It's when you realise that Jonathan Frakes could have easily done
the entire piece.
With a beard. with a beard.
You would have been able to sit in chairs, though, the way that
Jack does.
No, this is true.
I think at the time I knew that Jack was going to become a
regular...