WEBVTT

NOTE
This transcript was created on 2026-06-07 at 14:15:32

1
00:00:30.480 --> 00:00:38.759
Hello and welcome back to Flight Through Entirety, the only Doctor Who podcast with the most wonderful and marvellous fans ever to drop out of the skies.

2
00:00:38.820 --> 00:00:39.539
I'm Brendan.

3
00:00:39.600 --> 00:00:42.899
I'm Nathan. a hovercraft full of eels.

4
00:00:44.100 --> 00:00:52.920
And we are back with Patrick Trouton's 2nd season as the doctor, and today we are covering 2 very, very special stories.

5
00:00:52.979 --> 00:00:54.359
Gentlemen, why are they so special?

6
00:00:54.420 --> 00:01:02.399
Well, was it, uh, you said that it was something like 18 months ago, we didn't have, uh, we didn't have full stories.

7
00:01:02.460 --> 00:01:06.420
We had 2 out of 12 episodes we're going to discuss today.

8
00:01:06.480 --> 00:01:17.819
We had Enemy of the World Part 3 and we had the Web of Fear Part one and then in an amazing, amazing turn of events, what are we saying?

9
00:01:17.879 --> 00:01:21.000
Nine more episodes turned up?

10
00:01:21.060 --> 00:01:21.719
That's right.

11
00:01:21.719 --> 00:01:27.480
It's inconveniently of consecutive stories and 2 of the most wanted and most loved anticipated.

12
00:01:27.599 --> 00:01:33.840
Yeah, but I mean, which may suggest that maybe we'll be hearing something at a possible maybe future.

13
00:01:34.319 --> 00:01:39.719
We'll have to sit through the other episodes of the celestial toy maker one day.

14
00:01:39.780 --> 00:01:42.780
We will re-record a podcast for that.

15
00:01:42.840 --> 00:01:47.640
It'll be 5 hours long and you'll all have to listen to it.

16
00:01:47.700 --> 00:01:50.159
I bet we might need the explicit tag for that one.

17
00:01:50.219 --> 00:01:52.920
We didn't have this for a long time, but we did have Ridge lie.

18
00:01:52.980 --> 00:01:56.099
And of course, one of these special stories is the enemy of the world.

19
00:01:56.219 --> 00:01:57.299
Hooray.

20
00:02:06.359 --> 00:02:11.340
Yeah, so we had episode three, which is a strange and sort of uncharacteristic episode.

21
00:02:11.400 --> 00:02:15.659
So it did give, I think, a rather wrong impression of what the story is.

22
00:02:15.719 --> 00:02:17.039
You know why they kept it, don't you?

23
00:02:17.099 --> 00:02:18.780
No, I was the only one in the archive.

24
00:02:18.840 --> 00:02:22.199
Pamela Ashtipper, there Shelby Fire thing.

25
00:02:22.259 --> 00:02:30.539
It's the 1st episode of Doctor to go from 405 to 625 line, which was on the mark as, you know, this is a much denser.

26
00:02:30.599 --> 00:02:31.919
We have this on film, don't we?

27
00:02:31.979 --> 00:02:34.979
So is the copy that we've discovered is on film, so we get a cleaner.

28
00:02:35.099 --> 00:02:38.280
Yes, looking forward to the Blu-ray commentary coming up.

29
00:02:38.340 --> 00:02:40.319
Well, it's not all, they'll never be fine, some of it.

30
00:02:40.379 --> 00:02:42.060
So it is...

31
00:02:42.180 --> 00:02:49.800
But yeah, the 625 line is a huge, huge jump and going along with selling 2 overseas networks just keeps keeping the format up to date.

32
00:02:49.860 --> 00:02:51.780
Like weirdly, they do it in the middle of a story.

33
00:02:51.840 --> 00:02:53.580
Yeah, it just when it came online.

34
00:02:53.639 --> 00:02:58.319
So that's why this one was kept because it was as a technical piece.

35
00:02:58.379 --> 00:02:59.759
It's a line marker.

36
00:02:59.819 --> 00:03:03.000
So it's a little bit like going from standard definition to higher definition.

37
00:03:03.060 --> 00:03:03.539
Absolutely.

38
00:03:03.599 --> 00:03:04.500
Yeah.

39
00:03:04.560 --> 00:03:07.319
And changed a lot of how the production team would approach the show.

40
00:03:07.439 --> 00:03:12.479
I know we've got a lot to say about the rediscovered episodes and what this show's about.

41
00:03:12.539 --> 00:03:22.680
So, I do hope that we come back to the Victorian Security Kitchen, and what an amazing comedy series that would have made if Griffin the Shep, at his own.

42
00:03:22.740 --> 00:03:24.060
I mean, not sure spectacular.

43
00:03:24.360 --> 00:03:37.680
Basically, uh, this is the only story this season, maybe apart from fury, from the deep, where it's not the doctor being menaced by people in stupid costumes, in a stupid monster costumes.

44
00:03:37.800 --> 00:03:42.960
Dang, dang, dang, dang, dang, dang, dang.

45
00:03:43.020 --> 00:03:45.300
Do you know, everyone says that this is a bond.

46
00:03:45.360 --> 00:03:46.919
Do they really?

47
00:03:46.979 --> 00:03:48.599
No, they say that as well.

48
00:03:48.659 --> 00:03:52.979
And it sort of be, certainly the 1st episode is massively like that.

49
00:03:53.039 --> 00:03:58.259
So you've got the doctor, Jamie and some woman.

50
00:03:58.319 --> 00:03:59.400
Stop it, Victoria.

51
00:03:59.460 --> 00:04:00.419
Terrible woman.

52
00:04:00.479 --> 00:04:07.800
Arrive in Australia of all places at Cape Arrod, which is on the great Australian bike in Western Australia.

53
00:04:07.860 --> 00:04:09.000
Oh okay.

54
00:04:09.060 --> 00:04:15.300
And it's the year 2018, which we didn't actually know until the episodes were returned.

55
00:04:15.360 --> 00:04:22.319
Yeah, because there was nothing in the script about that, and it just appears in a cutaway of the doctor going, oh, when was this helicopter registered?

56
00:04:22.379 --> 00:04:27.839
right Yeah, there's actually a little taste disk on behind a picture's head.

57
00:04:28.860 --> 00:04:29.819
There's something else as well.

58
00:04:29.879 --> 00:04:32.160
There's a newspaper or something from last year.

59
00:04:32.220 --> 00:04:38.459
Oh, it's, oh, we can't spoil it, but it's later on when they see an old newspaper and it says 2017.

60
00:04:38.699 --> 00:04:40.860
So certain things go a bit bonkers, yeah?

61
00:04:40.920 --> 00:04:41.639
Crazy.

62
00:04:41.699 --> 00:04:47.339
So it's at 50s in the future. in 2018. uh in Australia.

63
00:04:47.399 --> 00:04:52.439
It's a very, very, very grim day when they arrive in Australian, miserable, miserable.

64
00:04:52.680 --> 00:04:56.100
When I lived in Western Australia, the weather was just like...

65
00:04:56.160 --> 00:04:58.980
This is very southern. up to two. up to 2 in the afternoon.

66
00:04:59.040 --> 00:05:01.740
Maybe that's why there are so many English expats in Perth.

67
00:05:01.800 --> 00:05:03.240
No, they are anyway.

68
00:05:03.300 --> 00:05:07.980
It's all South Africans and expat English folk. very, very similitudinous to me.

69
00:05:08.160 --> 00:05:11.399
But we're absolutely in the middle of nowhere.

70
00:05:11.459 --> 00:05:16.620
The doctor decides to throw all of his clothes off except for his hilarious sort of long Johns comedy long Johns.

71
00:05:16.740 --> 00:05:18.600
And he goes jumping about in the sea.

72
00:05:18.660 --> 00:05:22.079
It's really, it's spectacularly running a man.

73
00:05:22.139 --> 00:05:24.779
Everyone's doing a comedy turn to someone else, aren't they?

74
00:05:24.839 --> 00:05:30.420
You've got even the TARDIS is doing its comedy term and swap swapping its doors for this episode.

75
00:05:30.480 --> 00:05:30.839
Oh, really?

76
00:05:30.899 --> 00:05:33.120
There's always got to be that nerd moment about the TARDIS.

77
00:05:33.180 --> 00:05:34.139
Yeah, the doors swap around.

78
00:05:34.199 --> 00:05:36.120
And it's Victoria's dressed as Jenny.

79
00:05:36.180 --> 00:05:39.899
Victoria's doing drag actors, pandomime peer drag actors, Jamie.

80
00:05:39.959 --> 00:05:40.980
And doing it better, actually.

81
00:05:41.040 --> 00:05:42.360
The Tamashan and the whole thing.

82
00:05:42.420 --> 00:05:45.540
Yeah, we know we were in for a romp right from the 1st moment, Toby.

83
00:05:45.600 --> 00:05:49.199
The other big 1st is, of course, that this is Barry Letts for the 1st time.

84
00:05:49.259 --> 00:05:50.519
Helicopters.

85
00:05:50.579 --> 00:05:54.180
He's going to be talking to the helicopters. exactly right It's going to be huge.

86
00:05:54.240 --> 00:05:56.459
It's going to be huge in the early 70s.

87
00:05:56.579 --> 00:06:01.139
But he was an actor and a director before he became a producer.

88
00:06:01.199 --> 00:06:02.759
And so this is him directing.

89
00:06:02.819 --> 00:06:09.480
And as Richard says, helicopters, hover crafts, we get... a giant chase.

90
00:06:09.540 --> 00:06:11.939
It's like Planet of the Spiners episode thing.

91
00:06:12.720 --> 00:06:14.459
Only entertaining.

92
00:06:16.079 --> 00:06:19.019
And that is the big bomb moment.

93
00:06:19.079 --> 00:06:23.699
It a little bit like bond being chased by the helicopter at the end of from Russia with love.

94
00:06:23.759 --> 00:06:24.660
Is that?

95
00:06:24.720 --> 00:06:27.300
I'm brushing up for when we abandoned it.

96
00:06:27.360 --> 00:06:29.160
You're right because...

97
00:06:29.220 --> 00:06:42.060
Well, we've got so far we're still up to underwater menace as far as bond references going, Doctor Who, because the last bond to be released was, oh, no, we were just on, you only live twice.

98
00:06:42.120 --> 00:06:44.100
Thunderball had been out for a couple of years.

99
00:06:44.160 --> 00:06:45.180
They came out in 65.

100
00:06:45.360 --> 00:06:47.939
You only live twice his 67 release.

101
00:06:48.300 --> 00:06:51.600
This one is broadcast right at the beginning.

102
00:06:51.660 --> 00:06:53.459
So yeah, they...

103
00:06:53.519 --> 00:07:00.300
They've seen volcanos hollowed out and men in Nehru suits with comedy, middle European accents and ballpates.

104
00:07:00.360 --> 00:07:01.620
And we've had we've had it all.

105
00:07:01.680 --> 00:07:02.519
I love that.

106
00:07:02.579 --> 00:07:03.300
We've had them so much.

107
00:07:03.360 --> 00:07:05.100
That's Roald Dahl.

108
00:07:05.220 --> 00:07:05.939
It is.

109
00:07:05.939 --> 00:07:07.860
Roald Dahl writing the same.

110
00:07:07.920 --> 00:07:09.120
You're talking about repeated plot.

111
00:07:09.180 --> 00:07:14.639
You only live twice as the same script 3 minutes after itself, 3 minutes on, 3 minutes on.

112
00:07:14.699 --> 00:07:18.720
It's like an endless ad for Japanese cigarettes, Japanese cars, a Japanese whiskey.

113
00:07:18.779 --> 00:07:22.740
I'm just going to go on the record and say, I think it's one of the worst bond films.

114
00:07:22.860 --> 00:07:23.459
For that really?

115
00:07:23.519 --> 00:07:26.879
I love it because of, well, it's Thunderbirds with racist accents.

116
00:07:27.060 --> 00:07:37.139
This Doctor Who story improves on every Bond film we've seen, I think this is probably the most intelligent group we've seen in Doctor Who in the history of the show. so far.

117
00:07:37.259 --> 00:07:39.000
And so, of course, it's Whitaker.

118
00:07:39.060 --> 00:07:44.819
And it will stay up being clever until very recently in the show's history.

119
00:07:44.879 --> 00:07:48.959
For me, this is it may not be my full-time favourite, but it's soundingly smart.

120
00:07:49.019 --> 00:07:51.300
One of the great things about it.

121
00:07:51.360 --> 00:07:53.160
And we have mentioned before, I think.

122
00:07:53.220 --> 00:07:53.939
What is it?

123
00:07:54.000 --> 00:07:54.600
What does it do?

124
00:07:54.660 --> 00:07:55.800
Have you seen this show?

125
00:07:55.860 --> 00:07:56.339
What is it?

126
00:07:56.399 --> 00:07:58.139
It's not Doctor Who, is it?

127
00:07:58.199 --> 00:07:58.920
Well, no.

128
00:07:58.980 --> 00:08:00.420
I mean it's a political thriller.

129
00:08:00.480 --> 00:08:05.279
And Doctor Who will do political thrillers, most notably in a couple of years time.

130
00:08:05.339 --> 00:08:08.759
I think ambassadors in there has the same kind of field.

131
00:08:08.819 --> 00:08:11.220
Yeah, and from a story by David Whittaker again.

132
00:08:11.279 --> 00:08:13.620
Yeah, he was clearly a politically minded man.

133
00:08:13.680 --> 00:08:28.560
So, and it's a sort of slightly crummy political thriller in the sense that it is sort of Bondian, but the big conceit is, of course, that the big Bond villain, Scaramanga, the salamander is played by Trouton.

134
00:08:28.620 --> 00:08:32.940
And so Trouton does a comedy accent, not really a comedy accent actually.

135
00:08:33.000 --> 00:08:34.200
It's actually pretty accurate.

136
00:08:34.500 --> 00:08:35.759
It's...

137
00:08:35.820 --> 00:08:38.820
This is just one of the misconceptions about this story.

138
00:08:38.820 --> 00:08:48.600
Because it was missing, everyone thought that trouton's performance with salamander would have to be comic and pantomime-ish when actually he's quite a scary...

139
00:08:49.320 --> 00:08:51.720
And very charismatic, you know.

140
00:08:51.960 --> 00:08:52.740
Stroke, yeah.

141
00:08:52.799 --> 00:08:54.480
Yeah, like a bomb villain.

142
00:08:54.539 --> 00:08:55.740
Just like a bomb villain.

143
00:08:55.799 --> 00:08:57.960
You hate him, but actually you quite like him as well.

144
00:08:58.080 --> 00:09:01.799
He allows the comedy to be the 2nd and 3rd bananas around him.

145
00:09:01.860 --> 00:09:05.399
There's a lot of expat time lords in this one, aren't there, as the people supporting it.

146
00:09:05.460 --> 00:09:06.419
We've got Milton Johns.

147
00:09:06.480 --> 00:09:08.279
Yeah, this is the...

148
00:09:08.279 --> 00:09:10.980
George Patrick as the lovely Dennis.

149
00:09:10.980 --> 00:09:11.340
Yes.

150
00:09:11.399 --> 00:09:12.120
Dennis, yeah.

151
00:09:12.179 --> 00:09:18.659
And we've got, can I just mention the greatest girl who should have been the companion, kick self, Ferrari.

152
00:09:18.899 --> 00:09:25.259
Yeah, so this is a bizarre one too, because we have actually got 2 women in it and that happens very rarely.

153
00:09:25.320 --> 00:09:33.120
So you have Astros Feria, who is Mary Peach, who is sort of auditioning to be sort of on a black medal.

154
00:09:33.179 --> 00:09:37.080
She was actually up for the dino rig replacement part on the Avengers.

155
00:09:37.200 --> 00:09:38.580
She was going to be Tara King.

156
00:09:38.639 --> 00:09:45.419
She, well, the name hadn't been formed yet, which I could believe, Brendan, she was on one of only 5 actors in the final row, right?

157
00:09:45.480 --> 00:09:46.200
Yeah, yeah.

158
00:09:46.259 --> 00:09:47.159
She was very, very cool.

159
00:09:47.879 --> 00:09:50.639
Mary John Porter, Mary P.

160
00:09:50.700 --> 00:09:50.940
Anyway.

161
00:09:51.000 --> 00:09:52.080
Yeah, she's got the sort of pair.

162
00:09:52.139 --> 00:09:54.000
She's types of beach girl, isn't it?

163
00:09:54.059 --> 00:09:56.580
zip up, zip up and let it go.

164
00:09:56.639 --> 00:10:11.159
In the wonderful book, who and me, by the way, Barry Letts, where he talks about Enemy of the World, he does say that the characterisation of the Outstrinders, by Mary Beach, was a, quote, direct pinch from on a Black man and Diana Ring.

165
00:10:11.159 --> 00:10:11.700
Right, quote.

166
00:10:11.759 --> 00:10:17.820
And does it beautifully, and it's really accurately and suitably because that's what this show is about for so much this year.

167
00:10:17.879 --> 00:10:20.820
This story is about what's going on in the world of media right now.

168
00:10:20.940 --> 00:10:30.899
The doctor is sort of initially, is sort of a bit suspicious of her, and you know, like her goons have been after him sort of firing at them.

169
00:10:30.960 --> 00:10:32.820
And firing her bizarrely.

170
00:10:32.879 --> 00:10:35.159
They have men, but they do fire...

171
00:10:35.220 --> 00:10:38.820
It is more like a spider, they're scripted in this 1st episode. isn't that good?

172
00:10:39.000 --> 00:10:41.639
But he really, he likes it.

173
00:10:41.700 --> 00:10:44.159
He flirts with her outrageously, actually.

174
00:10:44.220 --> 00:10:45.480
The doctor does, doesn't he?

175
00:10:45.539 --> 00:10:50.220
This is the 1st time we've seen something of the actor. himself into the role.

176
00:10:50.279 --> 00:10:55.919
What's also amazing about that is several minutes later when he's being asked to impersonate Salamander.

177
00:10:55.980 --> 00:10:58.740
He turns to Jamie and says, don't you think he's rather good looking?

178
00:10:58.799 --> 00:11:07.200
You know, it's it's the doctor actually being flirty in that modern way that modern doctors are flirty with their male companions as well.

179
00:11:07.259 --> 00:11:12.480
We know our flirtatious time wards are actually able to be with all their internal whipping wobby bits as well.

180
00:11:12.539 --> 00:11:19.080
Yes, well, as we're recording this, still, listener, death in heaven has actually gone out today. and Nathan and I have seen it, but Richard has...

181
00:11:19.080 --> 00:11:20.159
No.

182
00:11:20.159 --> 00:11:21.779
So, we're playing...

183
00:11:21.779 --> 00:11:23.700
You know they start ringing...

184
00:11:23.759 --> 00:11:25.980
Yeah, he knows who miss he is, but he doesn't know what happens next.

185
00:11:26.039 --> 00:11:26.700
No.

186
00:11:26.700 --> 00:11:30.960
I think she turns into Julie Andrews and flies away with talking umbrella.

187
00:11:31.019 --> 00:11:32.039
Ooh, it's fun, wait.

188
00:11:32.879 --> 00:11:38.039
So, um, so that's that's the one woman is Astrid Ferrier.

189
00:11:38.100 --> 00:11:44.039
And then bizarrely, someone with almost an identical name, Fariah, who is beautiful Carmen Monroe.

190
00:11:44.100 --> 00:11:44.759
She's wonderful.

191
00:11:44.820 --> 00:11:45.720
She's my favourite.

192
00:11:45.779 --> 00:11:48.000
I was going to say she's my favourite girl in Doctor Who so far.

193
00:11:48.059 --> 00:11:50.039
So she's love her.

194
00:11:50.100 --> 00:11:51.480
So straight, so real.

195
00:11:51.539 --> 00:11:53.879
So are we saying meta now instead of trips?

196
00:11:53.940 --> 00:11:54.779
So there.

197
00:11:54.840 --> 00:11:55.980
Isn't she?

198
00:11:56.039 --> 00:11:56.399
Really?

199
00:11:56.460 --> 00:11:57.899
She doesn't come from Doctor Who at all.

200
00:11:57.960 --> 00:11:58.799
She comes with a big screen.

201
00:11:58.860 --> 00:12:03.179
She's salamander's food taster and she has some history with him.

202
00:12:03.240 --> 00:12:04.860
She hates him, but she works with him.

203
00:12:04.919 --> 00:12:12.659
Presumably he's got something on her because we see salamander in later episodes, you know, doing blackmail and all of that sort of thing.

204
00:12:12.720 --> 00:12:17.580
But she really dislikes him and she's just strong and fabulous.

205
00:12:17.639 --> 00:12:26.159
It a great performance and she's a black woman and, you know, that's a real rarity. 60s Doctor Who is strong and challenging, educated like that.

206
00:12:26.220 --> 00:12:26.639
Yeah.

207
00:12:26.700 --> 00:12:31.500
She's the 1st black character played by a black actor who actually has a character.

208
00:12:31.559 --> 00:12:33.360
She's not a mute strong man.

209
00:12:33.419 --> 00:12:34.620
Not a mute, strong man.

210
00:12:34.679 --> 00:12:41.220
And even Jamaica, who I cited earlier, as being a positive step in terms of the representation of normal white races.

211
00:12:41.279 --> 00:12:43.500
Even he didn't have much character.

212
00:12:43.559 --> 00:12:44.580
He was more of a function.

213
00:12:44.639 --> 00:12:46.799
Now, Korea, this is 50 years in the future.

214
00:12:46.860 --> 00:12:49.259
So no one ever mentions her race inside the story.

215
00:12:49.320 --> 00:12:56.039
It's never treated as an issue, but in a way, that makes it even more important for the 19th experience.

216
00:12:56.100 --> 00:13:02.820
We had the Chicago riots in the US just a year before fires, deaths, the whole thing, the police getting turned upon.

217
00:13:02.879 --> 00:13:03.960
This was a major thing.

218
00:13:04.019 --> 00:13:07.500
Britain was dealing with the influx of immigrants from the former colonies.

219
00:13:07.559 --> 00:13:27.120
Star Trek hadn't hit British TV screens, if you mentioned before, Jerry Anderson hadn't cast UFO live action for another 2 years, where you have black British actors in major, important and beautifully played roles, Dolores Mantes, who've been up for this part as well, another Jamaican brilliant British actress.

220
00:13:27.840 --> 00:13:31.200
Please keep going, this is I love this story.

221
00:13:31.320 --> 00:13:38.340
Not for, and not for the obvious reasons that we, that we might actually say, because of the bond film that's clear in the sweet units, that we need a script.

222
00:13:38.399 --> 00:13:41.399
The actors all nail innocent her performance.

223
00:13:41.460 --> 00:13:43.919
No one, no one's really lazy in this form.

224
00:13:43.980 --> 00:13:45.659
I mean, there are great people.

225
00:13:45.720 --> 00:13:57.299
So the Cliffhanger to episode one has the sort of world-head chief security guy who is Reuben from Horror Fang Rock. and his name's Bruce.

226
00:13:57.360 --> 00:13:58.919
Come out old one.

227
00:13:59.159 --> 00:14:02.279
And he, he had common Douglas.

228
00:14:02.279 --> 00:14:03.720
Yeah. and isn't he good?

229
00:14:03.779 --> 00:14:05.700
I hadn't realised it was really good. really good.

230
00:14:05.759 --> 00:14:13.740
And he's got a lovely gruffness and true British, you know, military thing, but you get the sensibility and the truth behind the characters.

231
00:14:13.799 --> 00:14:15.720
It's like Kreason last...

232
00:14:15.720 --> 00:14:25.620
He talked about last episode of New Bong or Snowman, who gets an arc where initially you think he's sort of rigid and inflexible and security-minded and paranoid and that kind of thing.

233
00:14:25.679 --> 00:14:30.720
And then you discover he has a real sort of sense of honour and loyalty and things.

234
00:14:30.779 --> 00:14:39.720
And Bruce, like it's slightly crumbly done, but Bruce is eventually persuaded that it's worth investigating whether Salamand is a bad guy.

235
00:14:39.779 --> 00:14:42.659
Yeah, but the cliffhanger logically and cleanly.

236
00:14:42.720 --> 00:14:56.039
And people always say this about the cliffhangers in this story, where it's very rarely, you know, if someone's tied to a volcano or, you know, you have to answer an ice warriors question or we'll suck all the air out of the airlock.

237
00:14:56.100 --> 00:14:57.720
You know, they're very rarely stupid.

238
00:14:57.720 --> 00:15:02.460
Their characters discover something or the game changes slightly.

239
00:15:02.519 --> 00:15:13.200
So the very 1st one of these is, um, Bruce comes in and Giles Kent kind of forces Giles Kent, who is sort of a bond character.

240
00:15:13.259 --> 00:15:15.120
He's like the previous set of security.

241
00:15:15.899 --> 00:15:22.559
And he's, he's, you know, wants to get the doctor to recruit the doctor and just sort of finding salamander.

242
00:15:22.620 --> 00:15:35.759
He sends the doctor off, makes him dress a salamander, and then he comes, the doctor comes in, pretending to be salamander, doing a crapper version of the accent, you know, when transplating salamander.

243
00:15:35.820 --> 00:15:38.519
In a turtle Mexican.

244
00:15:38.639 --> 00:15:43.200
And, and, you know, the cliffhanger is wheel brews people, you know, by this.

245
00:15:43.259 --> 00:15:45.480
And there are lots of cliphangers like that.

246
00:15:45.539 --> 00:15:51.059
There's that cliffhanger where salamander begins to suspect that there is an impersonator.

247
00:15:51.120 --> 00:15:52.740
And that's with Bruce as well.

248
00:15:52.799 --> 00:16:05.879
You know, Salamander and Bruce are discussing, you know, someone who looks like you, you know, that's terrifically good to, you know, the cliffhanger where Mary Peach discovers Swan from the underground base, more of which in a minute.

249
00:16:05.940 --> 00:16:09.600
Um, you know, Yeah, they're conceptual cliffhanger.

250
00:16:09.720 --> 00:16:12.720
Rather than, as you say, someone tied to the railroad track.

251
00:16:12.779 --> 00:16:14.460
So why are these COVI so interesting?

252
00:16:14.519 --> 00:16:17.940
What's happening in the story that's making all of these people come together?

253
00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:20.100
Because it's kind of a complex plot.

254
00:16:20.159 --> 00:16:23.100
But it's, I mean, I like a bot.

255
00:16:23.159 --> 00:16:27.659
They blow all their money on the 1st episode, so everything else is kind of like indoors.

256
00:16:27.720 --> 00:16:29.940
You know, you don't get any big action sequences.

257
00:16:30.000 --> 00:16:31.980
So it's not quite like bond in that sense.

258
00:16:32.039 --> 00:16:35.220
It does just... crazy thing to have done. isn't it?

259
00:16:35.279 --> 00:16:36.779
Well, but they've done it before.

260
00:16:36.840 --> 00:16:43.740
Certainly, you know, Dalek invasion of Earth blows a whole heap of money in its 1st episode and then, you know, episode 2 is just in various studios.

261
00:16:43.799 --> 00:16:45.179
So there's a precedent.

262
00:16:45.240 --> 00:16:51.059
But, You know, basically it's a political thriller, salamander is trying to gain control of the world.

263
00:16:51.120 --> 00:16:59.399
He comes to the world as a kind of um, Saviour, he's developed some way of making food, uh, like making food crops and that sort of thing.

264
00:16:59.460 --> 00:17:07.079
But we discovered that he's using treachery and blackmail and all sorts of things to kind of get his flunkeys into sort of positions of power.

265
00:17:07.140 --> 00:17:11.579
And so like Jamie and Victoria go to Hungary while the doctor stays in Australia.

266
00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:14.160
The doctors in Australia the entire, the entire story.

267
00:17:14.160 --> 00:17:23.339
And they got hungry to investigate him and he's blackmailing the central European zone guy or something like that. and et cetera.

268
00:17:23.400 --> 00:17:26.339
Yeah, trying to get him to replace Denesh, who is George Pro after.

269
00:17:26.400 --> 00:17:29.519
And so it's all this sort of fun intrigue and things.

270
00:17:29.579 --> 00:17:30.960
You know, people are betraying people.

271
00:17:31.019 --> 00:17:36.480
He's a bond villain because he's really causing earthquakes and stuff like that in order to get what he wants.

272
00:17:36.539 --> 00:17:39.119
Um, That's sort of basically the thing.

273
00:17:39.180 --> 00:17:45.180
And the thriller thing is fun and it works and that some doctor who will sort of turn to, you know, in later years.

274
00:17:45.240 --> 00:17:46.019
Yeah.

275
00:17:46.079 --> 00:17:53.759
You know, it's funny you mentioned that it sort of blew its money in the 1st episode because Barry Letts really wanted that.

276
00:17:53.819 --> 00:17:55.500
The original script was far more complex.

277
00:17:55.559 --> 00:18:04.500
He says in his autobiography that it called for a crowded beach scene, and he actually picked up a pennant crossover, were crowded and wrote the word deserves, said.

278
00:18:04.559 --> 00:18:09.359
Now, the thing is, though, the doctor was going to be humped through the amusement arcades and what happened.

279
00:18:09.420 --> 00:18:10.200
So that was gone.

280
00:18:10.259 --> 00:18:11.519
So he had to figure out something else.

281
00:18:11.579 --> 00:18:12.539
So he got the helicopter.

282
00:18:12.660 --> 00:18:16.319
And it's like, yes, the helicopter will be more expensive, but we'll get more bang for our buck.

283
00:18:16.380 --> 00:18:21.839
And apparently the BBC said to him, well, that's okay, but you've got to figure out where the money's coming from somewhere else.

284
00:18:21.900 --> 00:18:28.440
So reworking the script because apparently the scripts were a bit hit on the ground. reworking the script they came up with.

285
00:18:28.799 --> 00:18:34.140
Episode three, which for the longest time was the episode that existed, and I'll quote here.

286
00:18:34.200 --> 00:18:37.680
The stuff in the kitchen, for instance, goes on far too long.

287
00:18:37.740 --> 00:18:41.640
It's full of padding and padding shows up at its dullest and a half hour show.

288
00:18:41.700 --> 00:18:48.359
And isn't it ridiculous that the VIV prisoner, Danish, played by George Bravta, is held in a corridor rather than in a room.

289
00:18:48.480 --> 00:18:51.960
The whole episode, number 3, is lacking intention.

290
00:18:52.019 --> 00:18:57.000
Nobody is in any real danger except poor Denesh, and we don't know him well enough to care very much.

291
00:18:57.059 --> 00:19:00.960
It's fine when you see it in isolation, but it actually works a great relief in the story.

292
00:19:01.079 --> 00:19:05.220
And it's really belittling to a man of his problems to put him in a corridor.

293
00:19:05.279 --> 00:19:08.279
It's actually quite serious when you see it.

294
00:19:08.339 --> 00:19:11.460
Well, what none of us has mentioned, is Griffin the Chef.

295
00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:13.019
Oh, no, no.

296
00:19:13.079 --> 00:19:13.680
Yeah, yeah.

297
00:19:13.740 --> 00:19:18.299
Who is from Walloo, and perhaps he should never have left Woolamaloo.

298
00:19:18.359 --> 00:19:21.240
He says, and he's really funny.

299
00:19:21.359 --> 00:19:22.680
So it's good.

300
00:19:22.740 --> 00:19:24.480
It's not true that it's padding.

301
00:19:24.539 --> 00:19:26.460
It is kind of character stuff.

302
00:19:26.519 --> 00:19:27.480
Yeah, absolutely.

303
00:19:27.480 --> 00:19:32.700
And it's a variant of light relief after all the other stuff that's going on, which just increases the tension.

304
00:19:32.759 --> 00:19:33.599
Yeah, yeah.

305
00:19:33.599 --> 00:19:45.720
Whitaker's famous for kind of delaying, you know, where the Daleks are coming, you know, sometime soon, you know, all of that sort of thing, we're used to him doing this delaying tactics.

306
00:19:45.720 --> 00:19:52.380
And here, you know, I presume that what we all want is the face off between the doctor and salamander.

307
00:19:52.500 --> 00:19:53.160
Do you know what I mean?

308
00:19:53.220 --> 00:19:54.420
And that's what we're waiting for.

309
00:19:54.480 --> 00:19:57.779
And the doctor's actually weirdly not doing anything.

310
00:19:58.019 --> 00:20:11.700
Yeah, I mean, it's, it's such, it's a contrivance, so they don't have to do split screen is what I feel about it because the doctor sits there for about 4 episodes going, no, I refuse to get involved unless you give me some actual proof that this man is horrible.

311
00:20:11.759 --> 00:20:12.539
It's like, when?

312
00:20:12.539 --> 00:20:14.819
When do you ever wait for a fruit?

313
00:20:14.880 --> 00:20:21.059
Like, you know, 2 months ago, it's like, I suspect that the sidemen might still be alive.

314
00:20:21.119 --> 00:20:23.579
I'm going to open up these tombs so 5 people die.

315
00:20:23.640 --> 00:20:26.460
This man is causing famines and killing people.

316
00:20:26.519 --> 00:20:28.380
Well, I, until I see a body?

317
00:20:28.440 --> 00:20:30.720
No, I'm not doing anything, but so strange.

318
00:20:30.779 --> 00:20:36.359
Fortunately, though, while the doctor's sitting in that lovely caravan, admiring...

319
00:20:37.140 --> 00:20:46.740
You do, you do get playing, playing salamander, and he's compelling, and you actually kind of forget that, that he's a doctor, everything is extraordinary.

320
00:20:46.799 --> 00:20:47.400
It's very true.

321
00:20:47.460 --> 00:20:50.700
I was impressed by the strength of this performance of salamander.

322
00:20:50.759 --> 00:20:59.940
I kind of wish in a way that they'd done a little bit of the massacre with it and actually just had salamander and had the doctor missing.

323
00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:08.279
You know, salamander could have even kidnapped the doctor and that way you don't have to constantly be coming back to the doctor resetting every 25 minutes to say, no, I must have more proof.

324
00:21:08.339 --> 00:21:11.579
Yes, okay, you've showed me the blood stained knife, but I must have more proof.

325
00:21:11.640 --> 00:21:22.799
I think that would have been some more interesting and far more dramatic if Salamander had discovered the doctor earlier and kind of went, you know, you could cause damage to me, so I'm going to kidnap you, so you can't pretend to be me.

326
00:21:22.859 --> 00:21:33.180
Yeah, except except you do want to delay that confrontation, you know, and when the confrontation comes, it is massive and epic and we'll talk more about it.

327
00:21:33.240 --> 00:21:37.140
But should we move on to the really, truly weird twist?

328
00:21:37.259 --> 00:21:38.400
Oh, God.

329
00:21:38.400 --> 00:21:50.339
So salamander is Patrick Trouton is playing the doctor and he's also playing salamander, but salamander is playing another character as well, where he is a survivor of a nuclear war.

330
00:21:50.400 --> 00:21:59.279
And he has a group of like terribly wet English people dressed in leader clan castles. 11 yellow jumps.

331
00:21:59.339 --> 00:22:00.839
Yeah, really.

332
00:22:00.900 --> 00:22:02.940
He's Rick from The Walking Dead.

333
00:22:03.000 --> 00:22:05.700
I don't know anything about what that even means.

334
00:22:06.000 --> 00:22:08.460
He, young person.

335
00:22:08.519 --> 00:22:10.559
I'm scared of zombies.

336
00:22:10.859 --> 00:22:16.799
He goes down this incredible lift shaft and they have great miniatures to the lift.

337
00:22:16.859 --> 00:22:17.880
You know, that works really well.

338
00:22:17.880 --> 00:22:30.900
And he finds himself in his face and it turns out that they all know him as salamander who goes up and scavenges food for them and that the whole place is sort of full of radiation and they can't go out.

339
00:22:30.960 --> 00:22:32.400
There's been a giant nuclear war.

340
00:22:32.460 --> 00:22:34.380
Take a drink, David Wishing.

341
00:22:34.619 --> 00:22:45.359
And so they're busy creating the earthquakes and volcanos to destroy the evil kind of mutant survivors of the human race.

342
00:22:45.839 --> 00:22:51.180
And it's just completely strange and unexpected.

343
00:22:51.240 --> 00:22:52.920
The English people.

344
00:22:52.980 --> 00:22:55.200
And remember we've been in Australia and Hungary.

345
00:22:55.259 --> 00:22:59.339
We haven't been to England, and these people are presumably underground in Australia, you know.

346
00:22:59.460 --> 00:23:01.500
We haven't been to England at all.

347
00:23:01.559 --> 00:23:05.880
So these are sort of very strange because people and you've got Colin and Mary, do you know what I mean?

348
00:23:05.940 --> 00:23:09.420
with like these incredibly kind of Colin is amazing.

349
00:23:09.480 --> 00:23:15.660
Colin does a lot of staring wistfully into the middle distance acting, talking about how lovely it would be to see the surface.

350
00:23:15.720 --> 00:23:17.819
It's like Logans are on 20 years old.

351
00:23:17.819 --> 00:23:20.759
That's all about the talent of Michael York.

352
00:23:20.819 --> 00:23:43.019
And then, and then, you know, um, is Salamander's found out by one of the people, Swan, who, um, who discovers in one of the food packages he's brought down at this, that there's a, a, a newspaper with a story of a liner that's sunk, a holiday liner, and Salamander explains to him, not everyone's dead.

353
00:23:43.079 --> 00:23:46.799
They're just all evil, scary mutants who have holiday lives.

354
00:23:47.279 --> 00:23:49.680
And the sword just called you guys.

355
00:23:49.740 --> 00:23:51.420
Oh, right, okay, yeah.

356
00:23:52.079 --> 00:23:57.599
So we've just seen this in the Avengers episode The Living Dead, haven't we, Brandon?

357
00:23:57.720 --> 00:23:58.500
Yes, that's very true.

358
00:23:58.559 --> 00:23:59.099
That's very true.

359
00:23:59.160 --> 00:24:00.480
But without the mutants.

360
00:24:00.539 --> 00:24:04.799
Yeah, without the scary zombies, 6 people actually want to be underground.

361
00:24:04.799 --> 00:24:06.359
With Julian Bluff.

362
00:24:06.420 --> 00:24:07.079
Oh, let by.

363
00:24:07.079 --> 00:24:07.259
Really?

364
00:24:07.259 --> 00:24:12.660
Doctor Who, star and future Doctor Who villain, Julian Glover.

365
00:24:12.720 --> 00:24:12.960
Yeah.

366
00:24:13.019 --> 00:24:14.880
It's a good one, yeah.

367
00:24:14.940 --> 00:24:17.039
So it is, it's strange.

368
00:24:17.099 --> 00:24:23.220
It's like a complete turnabout and it has him going into a completely different kind of story.

369
00:24:23.339 --> 00:24:35.640
So, and then, you know, everyone sort of defeats and things, but it really has been like a very, very strange fun runaround that goes to places and has a story structure completely different from anything else in this season.

370
00:24:35.700 --> 00:24:43.079
And it's just a massive relief from furry, scaling or metallic people attacking people on a base this month again.

371
00:24:43.140 --> 00:24:44.400
I don't know.

372
00:24:44.460 --> 00:24:45.720
There could have been this on Tara.

373
00:24:45.779 --> 00:24:47.640
Yes, if only they'd beat us on Tara.

374
00:24:47.700 --> 00:24:49.259
A terrelepts or perhaps.

375
00:24:50.400 --> 00:24:53.460
Oh, it's much more than that because it's Whitaker.

376
00:24:53.519 --> 00:24:54.839
We've got all these other layers.

377
00:24:54.900 --> 00:25:04.920
You know, Salamander is a, um, a villain, not just the bond thing's obvious, but he's an imperial senator trying to take over the empire, isn't it?

378
00:25:04.980 --> 00:25:11.759
To me, he's the threat to Rome of and the Senate of a new empire is Augustus, isn't he?

379
00:25:11.819 --> 00:25:13.079
rising again.

380
00:25:13.140 --> 00:25:17.880
He's depicted as in the United Nations. isn't he?

381
00:25:17.940 --> 00:25:21.059
There's even a shot and have I am I dreaming this?

382
00:25:21.119 --> 00:25:23.339
There's a shot at the United Nations building.

383
00:25:23.400 --> 00:25:28.079
But it's like the zones, like the government zones and stuff and he's all over.

384
00:25:28.140 --> 00:25:29.279
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

385
00:25:29.339 --> 00:25:30.000
So I think you're right.

386
00:25:30.059 --> 00:25:33.480
It is that he's like, um, he's Senator Palpatine.

387
00:25:33.539 --> 00:25:34.799
That's really my background.

388
00:25:34.859 --> 00:25:43.859
He's Senator Palpatine, and they're getting to become the emperor and take over from the benign Democratic government of the world's own.

389
00:25:43.920 --> 00:25:47.759
Yeah, except for the fact he's actually got some decent dialogue.

390
00:25:47.759 --> 00:25:50.099
I'm like Senator Palpatine.

391
00:25:50.160 --> 00:25:53.160
He's the only good thing about that entire prequel.

392
00:25:53.220 --> 00:25:55.380
Oh, he's brilliant, but...

393
00:25:55.440 --> 00:25:56.759
Yeah, it is.

394
00:25:56.819 --> 00:25:57.779
But he's really...

395
00:25:57.839 --> 00:26:06.779
And this, and this guy, and this, of course, because it's Whittaker, and he's so interested in the history of British magic and mediaeval folklore.

396
00:26:06.839 --> 00:26:12.059
Salamandra was the creature that lived and was born afire and could destroy and burn with its gaze.

397
00:26:12.180 --> 00:26:14.519
So hence the volcano.

398
00:26:14.579 --> 00:26:17.880
Mm, mm, there's always layers with a little script.

399
00:26:17.940 --> 00:26:18.240
Yeah.

400
00:26:18.299 --> 00:26:21.779
I am Salamander, Stormborn, Father.

401
00:26:21.779 --> 00:26:22.500
That's the one.

402
00:26:22.559 --> 00:26:25.440
Is that another pop culture reference, I think, yeah.

403
00:26:26.700 --> 00:26:32.759
I was actually thinking with salamander's plans and with the underground culture.

404
00:26:32.819 --> 00:26:39.480
It almost feels like the production team have looked at the underwater menace and given David Whittaker the same ingredients.

405
00:26:39.539 --> 00:26:48.299
We have this underground culture being led by a mad despot who actually wants to destroy the world, but unlike Zarov, who just wants to destroy the world for the scientific achievement.

406
00:26:48.359 --> 00:26:51.119
Salamander wants to rebuild it along his own lines.

407
00:26:51.180 --> 00:26:57.480
And so he has already gone into the business of food production, which is something Zarov was concerned with as well.

408
00:26:57.539 --> 00:26:58.140
Oh, yeah.

409
00:26:58.200 --> 00:27:01.799
It's like he's taken a similar plan to Zarov.

410
00:27:01.859 --> 00:27:06.720
But he would know about, but he's taken a similar plan to Zara, but thought it through to its logical conclusion.

411
00:27:07.140 --> 00:27:15.960
It's much easier. to save a bunch of people and then say, I am your leader, and they'll go, yeah, okay, you're our leader, then try and conquer a bunch of people.

412
00:27:16.019 --> 00:27:19.200
And say I am your leader. very clever, isn't it?

413
00:27:19.259 --> 00:27:20.519
Yeah, it's very clever.

414
00:27:20.579 --> 00:27:22.619
And you know, it's not explicitly spelled out that way.

415
00:27:22.680 --> 00:27:24.599
But when you think about it, it's very cool.

416
00:27:24.660 --> 00:27:40.440
It was this Innis Lloyd's Christmas present, as it's his swan song story, to Paddy, because Patrick had been saying for so long, if I'm really getting ground down by this and the shooting schedule, the fact that even the audience is starting to get bored by the repetition of the plots.

417
00:27:40.500 --> 00:27:48.960
So they've given him, you know, it was talked about, was it not, the beginning that this doctor would be based on Chaplin when they looked at other archetypes.

418
00:27:49.019 --> 00:27:50.880
This is the great dictator, isn't it?

419
00:27:50.940 --> 00:27:54.480
We've got Adenoid Hinkler playing up against the Wiley Tramp.

420
00:27:54.539 --> 00:28:01.980
Adnoid Hinkler being his character that throws the, the, you know, and Mill books, Brooks Spooks, that beautifully throws around the globe of the world.

421
00:28:02.039 --> 00:28:07.559
Yeah, yeah, yeah, this is, this is up there with those big similar ideas.

422
00:28:07.619 --> 00:28:11.579
And honestly, it is because I know we all sound a bit loving when we say it.

423
00:28:11.640 --> 00:28:16.619
We can cut it out if you like, but Pat is really, really good in this.

424
00:28:16.680 --> 00:28:18.000
He really is that level.

425
00:28:18.059 --> 00:28:19.920
He's amazingly good in it.

426
00:28:19.980 --> 00:28:23.339
And this was one in particular when Rob and I were making our way through and watching.

427
00:28:23.460 --> 00:28:26.339
It's one that neither of us really enjoyed.

428
00:28:26.400 --> 00:28:28.680
You know, I think we both have it about 4 of them.

429
00:28:28.740 --> 00:28:29.220
Oh, overall.

430
00:28:29.819 --> 00:28:31.019
This is before it was recovered.

431
00:28:31.079 --> 00:28:32.039
Oh, okay.

432
00:28:32.099 --> 00:28:33.000
Yeah, it is.

433
00:28:33.000 --> 00:28:36.420
So you was watching it on watching the reconscious.

434
00:28:36.480 --> 00:28:38.640
And again, the recons are very good.

435
00:28:38.700 --> 00:28:43.440
There's some CG in this recon for the whole going down in the tube sequence.

436
00:28:43.500 --> 00:28:44.759
Really, really well done.

437
00:28:44.880 --> 00:28:48.839
But you weren't getting the, you weren't getting the 5 with the subtle 2 people.

438
00:28:48.900 --> 00:28:50.400
See, that's why I like records.

439
00:28:50.460 --> 00:28:56.519
Yeah, but when we watched the real thing after it had been returned, we kind of discussed it.

440
00:28:56.519 --> 00:29:00.359
And yeah, for both of us, our estimation went up to like 7 or 8 out of 10.

441
00:29:00.599 --> 00:29:02.099
It is by no means perfect.

442
00:29:02.160 --> 00:29:04.440
It probably needs a bit of script tightening.

443
00:29:04.500 --> 00:29:07.500
But that's quite, quite common with David Whisaker.

444
00:29:07.619 --> 00:29:11.519
He got such big ideas that how do you cram those into 25 minutes of television.

445
00:29:11.640 --> 00:29:15.000
But it's such a worthy story.

446
00:29:15.059 --> 00:29:26.460
And I know in these podcasts, I've been defending the fact that the plots are repeated in this season, but that's okay because they come with new ideas each time.

447
00:29:26.519 --> 00:29:32.220
This is very, very refreshing and very interesting and very different. was, yeah.

448
00:29:32.279 --> 00:29:37.079
I'm not sure if I'd say it's my favourite of the season, but it's definitely very high up there for me.

449
00:29:37.140 --> 00:29:46.920
Look, I mean, I haven't really properly seen Fury from the deep, so there's every chance that that will take over as my favourite Doctor Who story when I watch it early this week.

450
00:29:46.980 --> 00:29:49.140
Foreshadowing Deal. don't think it will.

451
00:29:49.200 --> 00:29:49.740
Okay.

452
00:29:50.099 --> 00:29:59.099
But certainly, this is my favourite of the season and it might be my favourite trout and it is really spectacularly fun.

453
00:29:59.160 --> 00:30:01.859
I mean, it really is, it's something special.

454
00:30:01.920 --> 00:30:08.700
Funny, great characters, you know, interesting plot, demented over the top, something Doctor Who has never done before.

455
00:30:08.759 --> 00:30:13.200
And Doctor Who has stopped at this point being a show that does things that it's never done before.

456
00:30:13.680 --> 00:30:16.200
And that's a great shame.

457
00:30:16.259 --> 00:30:22.680
And when you look at where we can only go from this. imagine how good the dominators is going to be.

458
00:30:22.740 --> 00:30:24.240
Oh, God.

459
00:30:24.299 --> 00:30:29.279
The Dominators is the only fully excellent Doctor Who story that I've never been volunteered to finish.

460
00:30:29.339 --> 00:30:32.160
I don't know how you can say that. in the future.

461
00:30:32.279 --> 00:30:33.900
Yeah, yeah, it must be good.

462
00:30:33.960 --> 00:30:35.880
I'm sure it'd be better if it had a fish person.

463
00:30:35.940 --> 00:30:40.859
You know, I have been wondering if our listeners out there would like us to do a commentary or something.

464
00:30:40.920 --> 00:30:45.900
I think a commentary on the dominators, steadily drinking more sparkling wine could be very interesting.

465
00:30:45.960 --> 00:30:48.420
And then me leaving the room.

466
00:30:48.480 --> 00:30:51.180
That's the reason we get some little feedback on the board.

467
00:30:52.079 --> 00:30:54.480
Because you make threats like that.

468
00:30:55.019 --> 00:31:16.019
Just before we go on, I will say, you know, when you have seen so much, Doctor Who, even when you're watching stories that you haven't seen before, there's often very little that surprises you because you can kind of extrapolate and know what's coming next, but there is something that really shocked me the 1st time watching this story and that is the sudden tragic and quite meaningless death of Korea.

469
00:31:16.079 --> 00:31:17.940
It's, that's why.

470
00:31:17.940 --> 00:31:20.160
So, yeah, horror is such a starter character.

471
00:31:20.220 --> 00:31:21.059
It's so brutal.

472
00:31:21.119 --> 00:31:22.740
Well, it doesn't belong, Doctor Who, does it?

473
00:31:22.799 --> 00:31:23.700
It's Swifted Trump film.

474
00:31:23.759 --> 00:31:27.000
But, you know, it just makes you you already dislike Bennick.

475
00:31:27.059 --> 00:31:30.359
He's or a sadistic little bully. great.

476
00:31:30.420 --> 00:31:33.420
But he's also, until that point, he's been quite comedic.

477
00:31:33.480 --> 00:31:36.960
Like when he discovers Faria has betrayed salamander.

478
00:31:37.079 --> 00:31:40.740
He sort of looks up in the middle of the distance and says, Maria.

479
00:31:40.799 --> 00:31:43.319
And I expected him to go on with, I just met.

480
00:31:44.220 --> 00:31:56.279
And then like 5 minutes later, he guns her down, he shoots her in the back and when we were watching the reason, I actually paused it and I just, do you think she's, I said to Rob, do you think she's dead?

481
00:31:56.339 --> 00:31:58.140
And he says, oh, no, no, she'll be all right.

482
00:31:58.200 --> 00:32:01.319
And then, you know, the next bit of the recon is Bennett kicking her over.

483
00:32:01.380 --> 00:32:04.859
It's like, oh, and it threatens to shoot her again.

484
00:32:04.920 --> 00:32:07.740
She's already dead and he's sort of threatening to shoot her.

485
00:32:07.799 --> 00:32:11.160
And she says something about, you know, only being able to die once, I think.

486
00:32:11.160 --> 00:32:12.240
And it's really hard.

487
00:32:12.359 --> 00:32:16.799
And he whispers over her over to get the answer and that'd be a switches, you can't frighten me anymore.

488
00:32:16.859 --> 00:32:20.640
It's really, it's really surprising to see a Doctor Who story.

489
00:32:20.700 --> 00:32:23.819
People blame Eric, same with that kind of thing, but...

490
00:32:23.819 --> 00:32:26.640
Well, but Eric will do, he said, 20 of those in an episode.

491
00:32:26.700 --> 00:32:40.920
No, I don't think it, you know, like it is, you know, I've spoken negatively about violence and nastiness and stuff in Doctor Who, particularly in season three, but I don't mind it here because it is it's appropriate to the genre that he's doing.

492
00:32:40.980 --> 00:32:45.539
It's appropriate to the genre and because we care about this person is actually meaningful.

493
00:32:45.599 --> 00:32:48.299
Yeah, and because she's such a great performer.

494
00:32:48.359 --> 00:32:50.940
I think the doctor's quite upset when he learns that too.

495
00:32:51.000 --> 00:32:52.559
Well, he should be.

496
00:32:52.619 --> 00:32:53.339
She's the only one.

497
00:32:53.460 --> 00:33:03.299
We talk about, you know, this not being part of the Yoohoo realm, but she's also one of the few performers that isn't a little bit pantomimey, and I don't mean that in a disparaging way.

498
00:33:03.359 --> 00:33:06.660
Doctor Who's always been a little bit children's fiction.

499
00:33:06.720 --> 00:33:15.240
It's been okay to see, you can see why there was so much rub with Bill Hartmore and the production team, either how he saw the show going to how they wanted to take it.

500
00:33:15.299 --> 00:33:17.099
This is put each year.

501
00:33:17.160 --> 00:33:21.359
I guess that's why it's interesting, even though it's being so formulaic, it's still pushing against itself.

502
00:33:21.420 --> 00:33:28.680
This, these moments with this character fire and with Milton John's and all the rest of it doesn't really belong in Doctor Who.

503
00:33:28.740 --> 00:33:34.019
But that makes it all the more interesting to watch and for a modern audience, it's probably the freshest of the season.

504
00:33:34.079 --> 00:33:35.519
Hard to get through.

505
00:33:35.579 --> 00:33:39.180
I think it's hard to get through all those episodes because yeah, he's padded and we keep forgetting.

506
00:33:39.240 --> 00:33:41.220
You're not really meant to watch it as a movie.

507
00:33:41.279 --> 00:33:42.420
It was never made as a movie.

508
00:33:42.480 --> 00:33:46.740
No, this is one of the most Saturday morning cereal.

509
00:33:48.180 --> 00:33:50.099
You meant to have time in between each other, are you?

510
00:33:50.160 --> 00:33:56.519
Although there is a problem this season, which is that it's 4 episodes and then every subsequent one is six.

511
00:33:57.000 --> 00:34:00.000
Yeah, the 6 parts are pretty terrible.

512
00:34:00.059 --> 00:34:03.299
They're pretty they're pretty much all 4 parties, which could be expanded out.

513
00:34:03.960 --> 00:34:07.740
Because we lost those werewolves of Canfields, didn't we?

514
00:34:07.799 --> 00:34:12.420
Yeah, well, the Duggee Canfields operation where?

515
00:34:12.480 --> 00:34:13.199
Oh yeah, thank God.

516
00:34:13.260 --> 00:34:17.400
Well, I don't know, this was this is rumoured to be the one that was put together.

517
00:34:17.460 --> 00:34:19.079
No, okay, no, no, no.

518
00:34:19.139 --> 00:34:19.559
All right?

519
00:34:19.619 --> 00:34:20.820
Speaking of Duddy Canfield.

520
00:34:20.880 --> 00:34:23.940
Yeah, don't be careful just directing our next story.

521
00:34:24.000 --> 00:34:26.400
The classic or is it weather?

522
00:34:30.420 --> 00:34:32.820
And...

523
00:34:32.820 --> 00:34:36.119
That's one last out.

524
00:34:36.119 --> 00:34:37.559
Another production team, well.

525
00:34:43.619 --> 00:34:47.820
Yeah, say goodbye to Space Adventure. the last time we did.

526
00:34:48.480 --> 00:34:49.019
That was it.

527
00:34:49.079 --> 00:34:51.179
Maybe we should play it again.

528
00:34:51.239 --> 00:34:53.219
Let's just have a whole lot of just that sound.

529
00:34:53.340 --> 00:34:55.199
Just what we do discuss the story.

530
00:34:55.260 --> 00:35:03.360
Our 2nd baked good of the season, Rod has made us yeti pat brownies. except we've already eaten them.

531
00:35:03.420 --> 00:35:04.019
Yeti packs.

532
00:35:04.079 --> 00:35:05.820
I didn't think they had a digestive trap.

533
00:35:05.880 --> 00:35:10.860
You said that's why they were square because they're robots. fair enough.

534
00:35:10.920 --> 00:35:12.900
So the...

535
00:35:12.900 --> 00:35:15.179
It'd have the specific icing as well, didn't it?

536
00:35:15.179 --> 00:35:15.420
Yeah.

537
00:35:15.420 --> 00:35:17.159
It tastes a lot better than that.

538
00:35:17.400 --> 00:35:21.539
So they were they were chocolate brownies with cheesecake.

539
00:35:21.599 --> 00:35:23.579
They were, is that why they were so easy?

540
00:35:23.639 --> 00:35:25.260
That was, I think that's been the best so far.

541
00:35:25.320 --> 00:35:27.659
Yeah, there we go.

542
00:35:27.719 --> 00:35:32.280
There's a recommendation and the recipe will be up on the website at the time of this episode.

543
00:35:32.340 --> 00:35:34.500
Rich, I believe you're covering with a fear.

544
00:35:34.559 --> 00:35:36.360
Well, I'm diving in there.

545
00:35:36.420 --> 00:35:44.880
Look, there's a lot to say about it, but there's also not much to say because we're back to formula, but we're also finally getting to see how formula can be done beautifully.

546
00:35:44.940 --> 00:35:49.800
You've got the double award of, um, Having Douglas Canfield.

547
00:35:49.860 --> 00:35:57.420
So whatever you give him will just work because he's so he's so smart and logical and yet creative within that.

548
00:35:57.480 --> 00:35:58.619
And it's his favourite realm.

549
00:35:58.679 --> 00:36:00.300
You've got army boys and shooting things.

550
00:36:00.420 --> 00:36:02.340
Because he was in the army.

551
00:36:02.400 --> 00:36:03.000
He was.

552
00:36:03.300 --> 00:36:11.219
He's more happy when he's got a whole lot of blokes in Green Surge with pointy things and something running at them from the other end.

553
00:36:11.280 --> 00:36:13.320
Yeah, that's the one.

554
00:36:13.320 --> 00:36:16.619
But look, this is the reboot story.

555
00:36:16.679 --> 00:36:17.820
We've got WCaprio.

556
00:36:17.880 --> 00:36:20.219
We got Derek Sherman on now, a script editor.

557
00:36:20.280 --> 00:36:20.699
This is it.

558
00:36:20.760 --> 00:36:21.539
Goodbye, Ernest Lloyd.

559
00:36:21.599 --> 00:36:22.320
He's left now.

560
00:36:22.380 --> 00:36:25.260
We've got Terence Dix's assistant script editor.

561
00:36:25.320 --> 00:36:27.900
It's his 1st it's our 1st Terence.

562
00:36:27.960 --> 00:36:29.159
Our 1st Terence.

563
00:36:29.219 --> 00:36:34.619
And we've got Peter Bryant, who's in the role for as long as anybody ever would be in this in this era.

564
00:36:34.679 --> 00:36:36.659
But you've got some really good people working on this.

565
00:36:36.780 --> 00:36:40.920
This is maybe the best target novel of the year.

566
00:36:40.980 --> 00:36:50.400
I think Ian Marty's enemy of the world would have been the best target novel, but WH Smith when they got it back in the day, which was an early 80s, it was certainly along.

567
00:36:50.460 --> 00:36:52.139
It went way overcome.

568
00:36:52.199 --> 00:36:57.059
So if you, you know, normally we recommend reading the book, don't read the enemy of the world paperback.

569
00:36:57.119 --> 00:37:02.579
It makes no sense because of the injudicious cuts that they do to any and I is such a good writer.

570
00:37:02.639 --> 00:37:09.960
But this one, yeah, this one's worth doing because it's Terence, and it's Terence's 1st script editing job and you get a really nice little target hole out of it.

571
00:37:10.019 --> 00:37:19.920
What's happened is, interestingly, and we refer to an abominable snowman that, um, the great intelligence, Oh, Rupert, um, Richard E. Grant.

572
00:37:19.980 --> 00:37:20.280
Thank you.

573
00:37:20.340 --> 00:37:23.880
I want to say Rupert Everett, because they kind of played as camply as each other, aren't they?

574
00:37:23.940 --> 00:37:28.320
Yeah, yeah, around Richard E. Grant and covering cobwebs floating around in space.

575
00:37:28.440 --> 00:37:33.000
The TARNIS is is hauled out of the vortex or is it?

576
00:37:33.059 --> 00:37:39.239
So that it's actually in the vortex when it finds itself being covered in it is. in spraying on cock with.

577
00:37:39.300 --> 00:37:41.579
Yeah, when we see it from outside, it just seems to be in space.

578
00:37:41.639 --> 00:37:42.179
But you know.

579
00:37:42.239 --> 00:37:46.139
Well, actually, but it's the place of the inhabitants of the great intelligence.

580
00:37:46.199 --> 00:37:48.300
So it's the astral plane again.

581
00:37:48.360 --> 00:37:49.079
Woo woo.

582
00:37:49.139 --> 00:37:50.159
We're up there.

583
00:37:50.219 --> 00:37:52.320
We'd have a meditate and see if you can find the target.

584
00:37:52.380 --> 00:37:53.460
They'll be up there somewhere.

585
00:37:53.519 --> 00:37:55.320
That's tomorrow.

586
00:37:55.380 --> 00:38:09.659
Um, this is great for all the little moments, the beautiful sets, you know, the London um, London transport were ranging up BBC furiously demanding their £200 an hour fee because they thought that they're filmed in the underground.

587
00:38:09.719 --> 00:38:10.800
The sets are so good.

588
00:38:10.860 --> 00:38:11.519
You don't agree?

589
00:38:11.579 --> 00:38:17.039
Well, no, they're spectacular, but everyone is walking on wooden floors and stuff.

590
00:38:17.099 --> 00:38:20.639
So it's fairly clear just from the quality of the sound.

591
00:38:20.699 --> 00:38:24.119
You know, perhaps the line of transport people haven't watched television before.

592
00:38:24.239 --> 00:38:25.559
They're probably watching on old TV.

593
00:38:25.679 --> 00:38:27.420
I'm going to say, I actually didn't pick that up.

594
00:38:27.480 --> 00:38:28.800
I thought this was film quality.

595
00:38:28.800 --> 00:38:29.639
67.

596
00:38:29.820 --> 00:38:30.420
It looks good.

597
00:38:30.480 --> 00:38:31.440
It works really well.

598
00:38:31.500 --> 00:38:32.940
And all of that's great.

599
00:38:33.000 --> 00:38:35.699
Oh, the sets, but it's the lighting and the scores.

600
00:38:35.760 --> 00:38:37.320
Well, let's start the very beginning.

601
00:38:37.380 --> 00:38:50.460
You see, um, Travis in, in a much aged makeup with mugging away in lots of close-ups, some of this extraordinary kioskiro lighting, under Bartok's music, his piece of percussion.

602
00:38:50.519 --> 00:38:55.079
And celeste, um, and strings, um, Sting Cooper Cuse.

603
00:38:55.139 --> 00:38:58.079
It the same Georgia gramophone for the shining in 1980.

604
00:38:58.260 --> 00:39:01.440
So that beautiful piece of Bella Bartop.

605
00:39:01.500 --> 00:39:02.940
And we're on film, I think.

606
00:39:03.059 --> 00:39:07.739
We're on film, and can I just say it's probably for the last film of the series, we have pure children, expressionism.

607
00:39:08.219 --> 00:39:11.940
The way that's filmed, the close-ups, the right stage.

608
00:39:12.000 --> 00:39:18.239
It's funny they talk about the 30s having been back because this bills looks like a 1920s 1920s way of shooting.

609
00:39:18.300 --> 00:39:23.460
And then we, before we move on, can't you have really gets where he's going with this and he's setting it all up.

610
00:39:23.519 --> 00:39:26.099
It's an amazing opening sequence.

611
00:39:26.159 --> 00:39:29.400
It is a bit of a pity about Silverstein, though.

612
00:39:29.460 --> 00:39:34.260
Oh, he's so straight out of the ghetto. a very lazy stereotype.

613
00:39:34.320 --> 00:39:36.480
It's completely, completely.

614
00:39:36.539 --> 00:39:43.739
And so, Travis, just to make it to you, Travis, is your Alan Quartermain adventurer from Abominable Snowman.

615
00:39:43.800 --> 00:39:47.280
And now he's got ageing makeup because it's 40 years later.

616
00:39:47.400 --> 00:39:48.719
Yeah.

617
00:39:48.719 --> 00:40:00.719
Yeah, and now, you see, the fascinating thing with that is, as some, when I was younger, I watched, uh, the 1st episode of Weather Fear more than I watched, Epso 2 Abominable Snowman.

618
00:40:00.780 --> 00:40:04.019
So in my mind, that's what Jack Watley looked like.

619
00:40:04.199 --> 00:40:14.340
When I got around to watching the full reconstruction of the Abominable Stoneman, There's a lot more of him visually in photos, and I, as I mentioned last week, actually found him quite handsome.

620
00:40:14.400 --> 00:40:20.699
I had a great new appreciation for the makeup job and the acting job he does in this.

621
00:40:20.760 --> 00:40:21.360
You think so?

622
00:40:21.420 --> 00:40:26.340
Actually, I think it's really theatre in this and it kind of stands out as not being not necessarily worse or better.

623
00:40:26.400 --> 00:40:32.820
It was just not being on the same level and acting in the same way that everybody else. in the studio is he's very stagey.

624
00:40:32.880 --> 00:40:40.440
It works when you've got a lot of blokes dressed up as marks because they're all kind of doing the same thing, but here you've got a lot more of the, you know, the realism thing, the army boys.

625
00:40:40.500 --> 00:40:42.179
I think it kind of stands out as not fitting in.

626
00:40:42.300 --> 00:40:44.219
It's a great idea though, isn't it?

627
00:40:44.280 --> 00:40:46.260
Like the doctor, they come back.

628
00:40:46.320 --> 00:40:50.159
They come back 40 years later, you know, and there he is and he's got a daughter.

629
00:40:50.219 --> 00:40:54.119
So how, well, it's the 1st time he's come back and met someone.

630
00:40:54.179 --> 00:40:56.639
Yeah, yeah, aside from the monk who...

631
00:40:56.699 --> 00:40:59.519
He might have a bit of else on us because he certainly doesn't recognise Jamie.

632
00:40:59.579 --> 00:41:00.480
Maybe that's how he's played.

633
00:41:01.739 --> 00:41:02.639
Well, no, no.

634
00:41:02.699 --> 00:41:03.480
I think it works.

635
00:41:03.539 --> 00:41:12.239
I remember thinking this at the time, but it is just that, you know, it's been 40 years since you've seen Jamie, so he sees a young person.

636
00:41:12.300 --> 00:41:16.139
There's no way he's going to think it's Jamie because Jamie's now 60 something.

637
00:41:16.199 --> 00:41:23.159
Yeah, I believe he does comment, you know, those 2 young people look familiar, but I don't know who they are because, yeah, his brain can't...

638
00:41:23.159 --> 00:41:24.840
And he's never seen the tarts, he says.

639
00:41:24.900 --> 00:41:25.440
You know what I mean?

640
00:41:25.500 --> 00:41:26.219
Like he'd heard about it.

641
00:41:26.219 --> 00:41:27.780
Sure. weirdly, yeah.

642
00:41:27.780 --> 00:41:34.500
And it is, it's the episode where Pat's having a, a little lie down as well because he's being exploded.

643
00:41:34.559 --> 00:41:36.599
But you've also got some of the best support.

644
00:41:36.659 --> 00:41:37.500
You talk about the young people.

645
00:41:37.559 --> 00:41:40.019
You've got this some of their supporting cast.

646
00:41:40.079 --> 00:41:45.179
In fact, you know, got the template for all future stories involving this kind of setup.

647
00:41:45.239 --> 00:41:46.679
You've got Anne Travis.

648
00:41:46.739 --> 00:41:48.000
Oh, God, she's great.

649
00:41:48.059 --> 00:41:50.880
And Travis is an archetype, not just for the show.

650
00:41:50.940 --> 00:41:52.500
Well, I mean, she's this sure.

651
00:41:53.760 --> 00:41:57.719
You look at you look at episode 5 when they're pulling apart the spear and chatting away.

652
00:41:57.780 --> 00:42:04.019
It's almost like, I mean, it's not like, it's almost in the camera angles, the same as episode 3 of Speed.

653
00:42:04.619 --> 00:42:07.019
Yeah, with Carolina and John.

654
00:42:07.079 --> 00:42:18.300
Well, in fact, they're both they're working on a control device that has short range that can be used to neutralise the sort of strange robotic villain thing.

655
00:42:18.360 --> 00:42:24.539
Well, you know, coming up next year, there is one major character that we're deliberately holding off in a Whittaker style.

656
00:42:24.599 --> 00:42:27.000
I haven't mentioned who this story is famous for introducing.

657
00:42:27.480 --> 00:42:28.860
Exactly.

658
00:42:28.920 --> 00:42:34.920
It wasn't going to be Gene Marsh's brother coming back for invasion.

659
00:42:34.980 --> 00:42:36.480
It was written for Anne Travis.

660
00:42:36.539 --> 00:42:40.500
She was going to be the repeating character along with Jack Watley.

661
00:42:40.559 --> 00:42:42.000
Yeah, and it wasn't available.

662
00:42:42.059 --> 00:42:43.199
We'll get to the.

663
00:42:43.199 --> 00:42:44.219
How amazing.

664
00:42:44.280 --> 00:42:46.139
Is this support character woman?

665
00:42:46.199 --> 00:42:57.360
I spent, it feels like 2 years now for moaning how Caroline Ford's, part of the doctor's granddaughter was so poorly served and poorly, you know, is poorly addressed.

666
00:42:57.420 --> 00:43:00.119
But you've got in just the space of a couple of episodes.

667
00:43:00.179 --> 00:43:07.260
You've got Anne Travis completely sounding off against the David Frost character of the reporter Jawley.

668
00:43:07.320 --> 00:43:08.400
They're all in a bunker.

669
00:43:08.460 --> 00:43:10.019
They all stationed down in the underground.

670
00:43:10.079 --> 00:43:14.219
World War 2 was still a big deal 20 plus years later in the public mind.

671
00:43:14.280 --> 00:43:27.420
This went out on the 25th anniversary of the Bethnal Green disaster and over 130 people were killed trying to get out of one of the underground in a bomb raid.

672
00:43:27.480 --> 00:43:27.659
Right.

673
00:43:27.659 --> 00:43:31.380
So it's, it was really poignant for for the viewers at home.

674
00:43:31.380 --> 00:43:34.679
And they said an claustrophobia of this and is amazing.

675
00:43:34.739 --> 00:43:39.840
Yeah, but I know there's a certain character called Lethbridge Stewart who appears in this story, but he really doesn't have much to do.

676
00:43:39.900 --> 00:43:41.820
It's actually the Antrovist, not it, isn't it?

677
00:43:41.880 --> 00:43:43.860
So Anne gets 2 great things.

678
00:43:43.920 --> 00:43:51.599
The one you mentioned where she completely owns surely and calls him a gutter journalist and talks about his comic strips, reducing everything to a comic strip.

679
00:43:51.659 --> 00:43:53.039
You know that's all about David Frost.

680
00:43:53.280 --> 00:43:54.960
Fantastic.

681
00:43:55.019 --> 00:43:56.219
And he's terrific.

682
00:43:56.219 --> 00:43:59.280
And he won us opposite of and then sort of comes back towards the end.

683
00:43:59.340 --> 00:44:02.039
But then the other one is that the well with night.

684
00:44:02.099 --> 00:44:04.019
Yes, when night.

685
00:44:04.500 --> 00:44:14.760
Should we say that Nick Courtney was actually cast as Captain Knight and David Langdon, David Langdon with the, what else has he been on?

686
00:44:14.820 --> 00:44:22.139
He's been an Avengers, and he's a lovely sort of, he's the kind of Hugh, what's his spacey booze from?

687
00:44:22.139 --> 00:44:24.300
Hugh Monomill, his character.

688
00:44:24.360 --> 00:44:27.000
He played a similar part in soaps at the time back then.

689
00:44:27.059 --> 00:44:35.699
But yeah, so Dave Langley was actually cast as Colonel Stewart, as Colonel Lethbridge, as he was, and the Stewart was added later.

690
00:44:35.760 --> 00:44:44.280
I think the Letterby Stewart, the Scott thing was added simply to make sense of why Jamie is so sucky to English soldiers.

691
00:44:44.400 --> 00:44:46.320
And my boys got students.

692
00:44:46.380 --> 00:44:48.840
Oh, because you're part of the Scots.

693
00:44:48.900 --> 00:44:56.760
Yeah, and he's wearing a Stuart Tartan on his side. and that's why Jamie seems to accord him so much. so much of their civility so much.

694
00:44:56.820 --> 00:45:01.320
It makes no sense to me that Germany is so sweet with the English soldiers in this.

695
00:45:01.380 --> 00:45:02.460
He should be.

696
00:45:02.519 --> 00:45:03.300
Yes, what is it?

697
00:45:03.360 --> 00:45:04.260
That's right.

698
00:45:04.320 --> 00:45:07.079
Getting these jerk and stabbing them all.

699
00:45:07.559 --> 00:45:10.920
They're killing the lambs for being a bit rubbish.

700
00:45:12.360 --> 00:45:13.079
Anne is amazing.

701
00:45:13.139 --> 00:45:16.920
She was, as you were saying, she also gets that fantastic line of, why are you a scientist?

702
00:45:16.980 --> 00:45:17.940
Why did why?

703
00:45:18.059 --> 00:45:19.920
Yeah, what's a girl, like you're doing a place like this?

704
00:45:19.920 --> 00:45:22.440
Oh, when I was a little girl, I thought I'd be a scientist.

705
00:45:22.500 --> 00:45:24.659
Then I grew up and became a scientist.

706
00:45:25.440 --> 00:45:28.860
You've always got the Batman cows.

707
00:45:28.860 --> 00:45:30.420
I was just coming up.

708
00:45:30.480 --> 00:45:32.400
How amazing would it have been if we'd had her?

709
00:45:32.460 --> 00:45:42.239
Yeah, she's and she's beautiful and she's like smart under pressure and stuff and she doesn't go hysterical or crazy when her father gets kidnapped, but yeah, she's in control.

710
00:45:42.300 --> 00:45:43.380
Whereas Lethbridge Stewart.

711
00:45:43.440 --> 00:45:45.179
Her's a bit nuts and wet and pants.

712
00:45:45.300 --> 00:45:49.320
Well, he runs upstairs and gets that great location, common garden shooting.

713
00:45:49.380 --> 00:45:51.179
This is the 1st and only time you don't like it?

714
00:45:51.239 --> 00:45:55.559
Oh, I think it's I think Canfield cuts it really well.

715
00:45:55.619 --> 00:45:58.019
But the point of it is, it's a massacre.

716
00:45:58.079 --> 00:46:01.559
The only one that comes back, and this is the root future, bring it here.

717
00:46:01.619 --> 00:46:04.440
It goes and hides at the top of the skip.

718
00:46:04.500 --> 00:46:06.000
That's the only one here.

719
00:46:06.059 --> 00:46:09.059
And then he comes back down, loses it, gets a bit wet. mumbles.

720
00:46:09.119 --> 00:46:14.460
Well, I mean, it's that thing where they wipe out half of the cast, you know, in episode four.

721
00:46:14.519 --> 00:46:16.380
Yeah, but we don't need them anymore.

722
00:46:16.440 --> 00:46:26.519
But can we can we talk about, because the thing that I think spoils that location thing in episode four, which is clearly the big set pieces and it's directed.

723
00:46:26.820 --> 00:46:28.019
And do you remember those photos?

724
00:46:28.079 --> 00:46:30.659
They appeared on Facebook, they were like discovered a year or so ago?

725
00:46:30.719 --> 00:46:34.440
Yeah, there's a the yeti gooping about it, copping down.

726
00:46:34.500 --> 00:46:35.039
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

727
00:46:35.099 --> 00:46:38.940
And there's that one where the dog comes up to the yeti and kind of is scared and stuff.

728
00:46:39.000 --> 00:46:47.280
So anyway, so they're in Covent Garden, there's yeti, and they're redesigned yeti, and weirdly, the redesign is completely telegraphed because in the 1st episode.

729
00:46:47.340 --> 00:46:48.840
It transmogrifies.

730
00:46:48.900 --> 00:46:51.000
Yeah, and they do a roll back and mix.

731
00:46:51.119 --> 00:46:53.579
The intelligence is able to transmute matter.

732
00:46:53.639 --> 00:46:54.179
Yeah.

733
00:46:54.239 --> 00:47:01.079
So so that's presumably why it makes all those of incredibly crap control rooms in both of its stories.

734
00:47:01.139 --> 00:47:03.119
No, it gets months to do that.

735
00:47:03.179 --> 00:47:07.440
I think the new yeti look even more stupid than the previous yeti.

736
00:47:07.500 --> 00:47:13.619
And they've got like, they've got nose beaks, they've got mandual eyes.

737
00:47:13.679 --> 00:47:15.599
How good do they look in those tunnels?

738
00:47:15.659 --> 00:47:16.800
And how good do they sound?

739
00:47:16.860 --> 00:47:18.119
Yeah, they sound good.

740
00:47:18.179 --> 00:47:19.500
Do you know what that sounds?

741
00:47:19.500 --> 00:47:20.880
Slow down.

742
00:47:20.940 --> 00:47:25.380
It's a Thomas crapper system. from Tooting Beth.

743
00:47:25.440 --> 00:47:25.920
It is.

744
00:47:25.980 --> 00:47:28.199
It's the luminous sound.

745
00:47:28.679 --> 00:47:31.980
Well, I've never been terrified by them before, but...

746
00:47:32.039 --> 00:47:41.820
Yeah, no, they are scary sounding, but gosh, they look stupid and at this point, and it's the point that I've made before, at this point, they play space adventurer.

747
00:47:41.880 --> 00:47:45.480
Just in case you missed the point that they're lampooning themselves.

748
00:47:45.539 --> 00:47:48.119
All of the monsters are interchangeable.

749
00:47:48.179 --> 00:47:51.360
This week, the robots have shaggy things.

750
00:47:51.420 --> 00:48:04.500
You know, like in a few weeks time, they'll be weed, and then in a couple of weeks time, they'll be back to wearing sort of plum soles and shiny silver.

751
00:48:04.500 --> 00:48:05.699
This is the one where...

752
00:48:05.760 --> 00:48:10.559
This is the moment they're plugged into your randomiser and just come up with 4 random ideas.

753
00:48:10.619 --> 00:48:15.300
Yeah, robot, yeti, underground, webby stuff.

754
00:48:15.599 --> 00:48:17.519
Yeah, web shoes in you.

755
00:48:17.579 --> 00:48:19.739
Oh, yeah, we've got the BBC food machine back again.

756
00:48:19.800 --> 00:48:20.639
Hooray.

757
00:48:20.699 --> 00:48:25.619
Yeah, it's it's still getting more of small script action than Michael Crane's doing.

758
00:48:25.679 --> 00:48:30.059
Yeah, it was kind of cruel, but it's... not mindful.

759
00:48:30.119 --> 00:48:33.000
It's kind of, it's kind of cruel thing that you're right.

760
00:48:33.059 --> 00:48:33.960
It's exactly what it is.

761
00:48:34.019 --> 00:48:35.519
And you think this is...

762
00:48:35.519 --> 00:48:47.519
This is where it's very strange because, I mean, once again, yes, it is the same kind of structure for the story, but I think it just proves my point that it's not so much the structure of the story.

763
00:48:47.579 --> 00:48:48.119
It's important.

764
00:48:48.179 --> 00:48:51.719
It is the extra decoration that the script comes with.

765
00:48:51.780 --> 00:48:55.739
We have a collection of interesting and well-developed characters.

766
00:48:55.800 --> 00:49:00.059
We have, you know, Charlie...

767
00:49:00.119 --> 00:49:07.380
Imagine though, if you had different types of stories with different types of well-developed characters.

768
00:49:07.440 --> 00:49:08.400
Do you know what I mean?

769
00:49:08.460 --> 00:49:10.739
We kind of get that next year.

770
00:49:10.800 --> 00:49:14.099
Yes, but we don't get it this year and that's really my point.

771
00:49:14.159 --> 00:49:15.960
But I don't think...

772
00:49:15.960 --> 00:49:33.659
Season 6 is as successful as being entertaining as season 5, but we'll get to that next year, but as I was saying, because we have these interesting characters, we have an interesting Houdina element, because in the 1st Yeti story, we knew who the conduit was.

773
00:49:33.719 --> 00:49:36.599
We knew it would have the same...

774
00:49:36.659 --> 00:49:38.519
I just love saying that.

775
00:49:38.579 --> 00:49:40.139
I spent a lot of time practising.

776
00:49:40.199 --> 00:49:40.679
Yeah.

777
00:49:40.679 --> 00:49:44.519
And we knew that... was controlling Songston.

778
00:49:44.639 --> 00:49:46.440
This time...

779
00:49:46.440 --> 00:49:48.239
This really cool little decor figures.

780
00:49:50.039 --> 00:49:52.079
Which Debbie Watley still has one?

781
00:49:52.139 --> 00:49:53.099
Oh does she?

782
00:49:53.159 --> 00:49:59.880
I was co-hosting a convention last year that Deborah Walling was at, and one of them was up for auction somewhere.

783
00:49:59.940 --> 00:50:02.579
I mentioned that to her and she said, oh my god, I got one of those.

784
00:50:03.179 --> 00:50:06.780
So she was controlling the...

785
00:50:06.840 --> 00:50:10.739
And she asked me to look it up online and I did and I showed her how much it was working.

786
00:50:10.800 --> 00:50:13.559
She said, well, I don't want to sell it, but it's nice to know how much was it?

787
00:50:13.619 --> 00:50:15.480
Oh, God, that's £6000?

788
00:50:15.539 --> 00:50:16.380
£6000.

789
00:50:16.860 --> 00:50:17.400
Maybe.

790
00:50:17.400 --> 00:50:19.739
Let's get wickling.

791
00:50:19.800 --> 00:50:22.679
You just stick it in the brigadier's pocket.

792
00:50:23.159 --> 00:50:27.480
But yeah, we just don't know who the conduit is.

793
00:50:27.539 --> 00:50:38.699
And for those of you, this, you know, it's a possibility that for the 1st time, I think, in this podcast, we can say for those of you who haven't seen it, because you hadn't seen it, Nathan, until you were watching Boy's time.

794
00:50:38.760 --> 00:50:40.380
There's a possibility.

795
00:50:40.440 --> 00:50:43.019
The end listener, that you don't know who the traitor is.

796
00:50:43.079 --> 00:50:44.099
So I'm not going to mention it.

797
00:50:44.159 --> 00:50:46.980
But when it happened, when it was revealed.

798
00:50:47.039 --> 00:50:47.940
It was going to be rotten.

799
00:50:48.000 --> 00:50:49.860
That's what I think.

800
00:50:49.920 --> 00:51:01.860
I was surprised by who it was, but at the same time, I thought back over the plot and went, ah, yeah, it can be, it, and I'd also like to say, I really like John Rollerson in this. who plays Harold Trawley.

801
00:51:01.920 --> 00:51:09.119
And part of the reason I really like him in this is, dear listen, you may not know this, he was a very short-lived sidekick in the Avengers.

802
00:51:09.179 --> 00:51:10.320
He is too.

803
00:51:10.380 --> 00:51:10.860
Yeah.

804
00:51:10.920 --> 00:51:16.920
After the original Avengers lineup with Ian Hendry and Patrick McNee is the co-star.

805
00:51:17.039 --> 00:51:18.000
Doctor Martin.

806
00:51:18.059 --> 00:51:22.500
John Rollerson came in to play Dr. Martin King for 3 leftover scripts.

807
00:51:22.559 --> 00:51:29.460
Tara to his mate. before they figured out, oh, actually, we can cast a woman and we don't need to change the script.

808
00:51:29.579 --> 00:51:35.159
And you've heard me say it before that on a Blackman's role was essentially just written for a man and they crossed it in.

809
00:51:35.219 --> 00:51:37.920
Well, before they did that, they thought, let's have another man in here.

810
00:51:37.980 --> 00:51:41.340
And it was quite difficult for him on the set because he was a jobbing actor.

811
00:51:41.400 --> 00:51:52.679
You know, he had had to accept work as the corpse of a dead king in Shakespeare, who's just dragged out and dropped on stage for the 1st acts, and that's how he was that's how he was supporting his family.

812
00:51:52.800 --> 00:52:02.219
So he took the Avengers job, knowing it was only a 3 week gig, knowing he was in this big thing because the Avengers were still big already, but knowing that he wouldn't be a part of it for too long.

813
00:52:02.340 --> 00:52:06.599
And I was really disappointed when I saw his revenge and stuff because he's not really good in it.

814
00:52:06.659 --> 00:52:07.619
But in this, he's great.

815
00:52:07.679 --> 00:52:15.780
And he did have a nice change in luck because it was during this time he had a 6 year stint on Coronation Street and that is what he's remembered for.

816
00:52:15.840 --> 00:52:19.079
Nathan, I know we're butting heads on this again, but...

817
00:52:19.079 --> 00:52:27.900
I think this story is the whole based under siege thing in apopiosis is as good as based under siege gets.

818
00:52:27.900 --> 00:52:34.380
And part of that is because great direction, great writing, great characterisation.

819
00:52:34.440 --> 00:52:36.239
Great characterisation.

820
00:52:36.300 --> 00:52:37.739
We've got an epiphany in this.

821
00:52:37.800 --> 00:52:39.539
You don't get that very often, Doctor Who.

822
00:52:39.599 --> 00:52:49.559
The reason Letterbridge Stewart is brought back is because he has a right of passage, he loses those troops, and he's a very different character in the fight, although he does suggest to the doctor that he self-sacrifices.

823
00:52:49.619 --> 00:52:51.780
I wish we'd seen a bit more of that in the pertly era.

824
00:52:51.900 --> 00:52:56.340
But there was that moment of where he'd been completely different and quite manipulative.

825
00:52:56.400 --> 00:52:57.659
Well, he's the red hair and herring.

826
00:52:57.719 --> 00:53:00.900
We're supposed to believe that he's difficult for us to watch it now.

827
00:53:00.960 --> 00:53:02.820
He's not the villain.

828
00:53:02.880 --> 00:53:06.300
But you're meant to assume that he is, but at the time.

829
00:53:06.360 --> 00:53:08.039
Everyone's the red herring, though.

830
00:53:08.099 --> 00:53:12.480
For a while, you think it's surely, for a while, you think it's, surely, for a while, you think it's true.

831
00:53:12.480 --> 00:53:14.159
Yeah, it's just hands under suspicion.

832
00:53:14.280 --> 00:53:14.820
Yeah.

833
00:53:14.820 --> 00:53:16.980
I don't think that stuff's all that strong.

834
00:53:17.039 --> 00:53:30.300
But I probably agree with you that of the base under siege stories this year that this is the best one, but it did wear out as well, and I think it's 6 episodes, and I think the yeti are stupid, and that's a problem.

835
00:53:30.360 --> 00:53:32.519
It's like we said before, it would have made a great call partner.

836
00:53:32.579 --> 00:53:33.000
Yeah.

837
00:53:33.059 --> 00:53:33.840
Yeah.

838
00:53:33.900 --> 00:53:35.159
And I quite like the end.

839
00:53:35.219 --> 00:53:42.239
You know, the doctor has a plan and Jamie has a plan and they try and execute them both and Jamie's plan ruins the doctor's plan.

840
00:53:42.300 --> 00:53:51.239
The plan, he said, was to drain the great intelligence, but does that mean that he was going to absorb it and actually become omnipotent?

841
00:53:51.239 --> 00:53:52.679
No, no, no.

842
00:53:52.739 --> 00:53:54.059
Hello, carting of the weight.

843
00:53:54.119 --> 00:53:55.019
Yeah.

844
00:53:55.079 --> 00:53:58.320
And when you absorb a gin and tonic, you don't become a gin and tonic.

845
00:53:58.619 --> 00:53:59.340
We certainly do.

846
00:53:59.639 --> 00:54:02.820
It's depending on what you're doing at all.

847
00:54:02.880 --> 00:54:03.599
I don't know.

848
00:54:03.659 --> 00:54:05.400
It's a curious thing.

849
00:54:05.460 --> 00:54:06.300
It's not really explained.

850
00:54:06.360 --> 00:54:13.860
Isn't it possible that the doctor could have actually taken on more powers and that's why he was so aggrieved because just leaving a villain floating up in space.

851
00:54:13.920 --> 00:54:21.840
Well, we've mentioned before that this 2nd doctor is a lot darker than we might have casually viewed him previously, he's certainly been manipulative this season.

852
00:54:21.900 --> 00:54:24.239
I think maybe there might have been something going on there.

853
00:54:24.300 --> 00:54:26.699
Perhaps there was a plan to go back to Gallifrey one day.

854
00:54:26.760 --> 00:54:27.900
I shall go back.

855
00:54:27.960 --> 00:54:30.780
Something I have to say was back, but why not?

856
00:54:31.199 --> 00:54:39.420
It was at this point in America, the original X-Men comic series was still running, but it was very short B to be taken off.

857
00:54:39.480 --> 00:54:49.019
And a feature of that original X-Men comic series was that Professor Xavier and Magnus Magneto could actually communicate on the astral plane.

858
00:54:49.380 --> 00:54:51.900
It's been crowded up there, isn't it?

859
00:54:51.960 --> 00:54:54.780
And they would often have discussions on the astral plane.

860
00:54:54.840 --> 00:54:58.320
And, you know, Billy Xavier is not a very nice man.

861
00:54:58.380 --> 00:55:04.800
He actually attacked make this on the Astral plane at various points and tries to sort of burn out his brain and that kind of thing.

862
00:55:04.860 --> 00:55:15.539
And, you know, I have to wonder if the writers were, at the very least, aware of this comic tradition that was now coming out of the United States because Marvel was getting bigger and bigger in the states.

863
00:55:15.599 --> 00:55:20.579
But the Marvel stuff was actually picking up on the hippie stuff that we've been talking about before with Leary.

864
00:55:20.639 --> 00:55:25.019
So that's not necessarily the primary source, although it's a big part of this whole story.

865
00:55:25.079 --> 00:55:26.880
Yeah, everyone was looking at it.

866
00:55:26.940 --> 00:55:30.480
That's still playing with terms that George Harrison was using it in conversations and interviews.

867
00:55:30.539 --> 00:55:33.900
These were terms that were very new, but it was certainly peaking interest.

868
00:55:34.320 --> 00:55:38.219
I think the doctor was actually up to something a lot darker than any of us realised.

869
00:55:38.340 --> 00:55:40.320
Darker necessarily.

870
00:55:40.380 --> 00:55:42.900
Well, Depends on what he would have done with it.

871
00:55:42.960 --> 00:55:48.900
You wouldn't expect someone to, like, him to actually be after power, but then again...

872
00:55:48.900 --> 00:55:56.219
He still tend to work out for him surprisingly, maybe he isn't falling into everything in a way that we're about to discover at the end of next year.

873
00:55:56.280 --> 00:55:58.920
Perhaps things aren't quite as simple as we finish.

874
00:55:59.760 --> 00:56:06.300
Evans gets a chocolate bar from a vending machine, and it's Camfields, chocolate bar.

875
00:56:06.719 --> 00:56:08.639
They take a tanner.

876
00:56:08.699 --> 00:56:10.559
They take a 6pence piece.

877
00:56:10.619 --> 00:56:12.300
That machine takes 6 piece.

878
00:56:12.360 --> 00:56:14.280
That's all phased out by now.

879
00:56:14.340 --> 00:56:17.579
Oh, the whole 1975 thing now written.

880
00:56:17.639 --> 00:56:18.900
You were saying something again.

881
00:56:18.900 --> 00:56:20.760
It's can't be 1970. can't be 1975.

882
00:56:20.940 --> 00:56:22.500
The ads are Christmas 1967.

883
00:56:22.679 --> 00:56:24.119
We've got product placement in this one.

884
00:56:24.239 --> 00:56:31.139
Yeah, there's a film starring Sydney Poisier and something, which is there's... which is okay.

885
00:56:31.199 --> 00:56:35.579
It could be a revival, but there are other things that the actual London Underground.

886
00:56:35.639 --> 00:56:39.900
And Jamie weirdly now can read these maps even though I've never seen it underground triangle before.

887
00:56:40.019 --> 00:56:45.179
Yeah, it's no, there's a few things in here that it's definitely late 60s.

888
00:56:45.239 --> 00:56:46.380
There is not meant to be anything else.

889
00:56:46.440 --> 00:56:48.659
The 40 year thing, it could be vague.

890
00:56:48.719 --> 00:56:53.280
There's a suggestion that the abominable snowman could actually be in the 20s and not in the 30s.

891
00:56:53.340 --> 00:56:54.119
There's nothing to read.

892
00:56:54.119 --> 00:56:55.679
No one would know what a robot is.

893
00:56:56.159 --> 00:57:02.940
Because the word robots like invented in like 1920, but... by Taryn Capell, yeah. by Tari Capelle, yeah.

894
00:57:03.000 --> 00:57:04.139
Yeah, it is famous playing.

895
00:57:04.199 --> 00:57:05.460
That's the thing.

896
00:57:05.519 --> 00:57:19.679
Well, I've always been of the opinion that the whole 1975 thing is easy to work out by the fact that the only person who says it was 40 years ago in 1935 is Travers who's already been shown to be a bit eccentric and to have a faulty memory.

897
00:57:19.739 --> 00:57:24.960
Well, he thinks he can lose a control sphere behind the sofa or just his daughter does. something as important as that.

898
00:57:25.019 --> 00:57:25.980
No, no, no, no.

899
00:57:26.039 --> 00:57:27.719
It's the late 60s.

900
00:57:27.780 --> 00:57:28.860
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

901
00:57:28.920 --> 00:57:32.400
That's the only way to explain the costume choices.

902
00:57:32.519 --> 00:57:33.900
That's when this really happened.

903
00:57:34.139 --> 00:57:36.179
No, no, no, no, no.

904
00:57:36.239 --> 00:57:36.840
Yeah, visually.

905
00:57:36.900 --> 00:57:37.619
Yeah.

906
00:57:37.679 --> 00:57:38.460
No, I get it.

907
00:57:38.519 --> 00:57:43.980
I also think too, Covent Garden is still a cost among this thing, that it stopped by 1970.

908
00:57:44.159 --> 00:57:47.940
They're still flogging fruit and beach when they go up on the...

909
00:57:47.940 --> 00:57:49.920
Again, that's stopped if I said this.

910
00:57:49.980 --> 00:58:07.019
So I actually think that the unit dating controversy is just ridiculous, really, because what you're arguing about is in what year did yeti invade the underground and London get evacuated and your only possible answer.

911
00:58:07.139 --> 00:58:10.380
That would be that never actually happened.

912
00:58:10.440 --> 00:58:14.760
Or it happened on television in 1968.

913
00:58:15.059 --> 00:58:22.260
So the unit stories all happened in the year of transmission, but they only happened on television because they're not real.

914
00:58:22.320 --> 00:58:25.199
The common serious addresses that...

915
00:58:25.260 --> 00:58:26.460
No, they make fun of it.

916
00:58:26.519 --> 00:58:34.139
Tenant says something about, you know, like he worked the unit as a scientific advisor in the 70s or was it the 80s, you know, or something like that.

917
00:58:34.199 --> 00:58:36.900
See, I actually have a theory about it.

918
00:58:36.960 --> 00:58:44.159
But I'm not going to express it now because it revolves around something, a certain event that happens in certain Tom Baker story.

919
00:58:44.519 --> 00:58:52.860
So I'm going to wait until we get to that story and then I'm going to drop it because I've never seen I've never seen anyone else. guessing it's seen to do.

920
00:58:52.920 --> 00:58:53.400
I might be wrong.

921
00:58:53.460 --> 00:58:55.079
I'm going for pyramids of my arms.

922
00:58:55.139 --> 00:58:57.239
Okay, so you live in an envelope.

923
00:58:57.300 --> 00:58:58.860
Well, Brendan is from 1980.

924
00:58:58.980 --> 00:59:00.539
He is not actually from 1983.

925
00:59:00.659 --> 00:59:03.179
Oh, God. friend of the podcast.

926
00:59:03.239 --> 00:59:04.679
Jane Selwood is from 1980.

927
00:59:04.739 --> 00:59:06.179
Yes, he has his often bitch.

928
00:59:08.159 --> 00:59:11.039
In those Andy Pandy pyjamas.

929
00:59:12.239 --> 00:59:14.639
No, I just worked out why you waste those.

930
00:59:23.699 --> 00:59:27.780
Yeah, so, um, it's coming to the end of another podcast.

931
00:59:27.840 --> 00:59:34.079
Just a reminder, Boats, we do now have a regular giveaway competition with the podcast.

932
00:59:34.199 --> 00:59:48.780
Just like us on Facebook and share this episode, comment on the episode on the website to be in the running for a target book of your choice from a selection that we have donated to us by a friend of the podcast, Tony Galuzo.

933
00:59:48.840 --> 00:59:56.039
It does also count if you follow and retweet us on Twitter and then comment on our website too.

934
00:59:56.099 --> 00:59:58.800
We'll mention this on the show notes as well, of course.

935
00:59:58.860 --> 01:00:03.119
And just before we go, gentlemen, I'd just like to hear a brief opinion.

936
01:00:03.179 --> 01:00:06.179
Do you think there's more missing episodes that are coming back that we don't know about yet?

937
01:00:06.239 --> 01:00:09.659
Uh, we hear things that are being said.

938
01:00:09.719 --> 01:00:11.400
No, no, but yeah, look, there are.

939
01:00:11.460 --> 01:00:15.780
There are rivers, and I don't think you'll get to any trouble because, you know, there's only 3 of you listening.

940
01:00:16.199 --> 01:00:20.519
There are some Queensland fans who have had Marco Polo for a long time.

941
01:00:20.579 --> 01:00:26.519
There, yeah, there are other sources and that there are internal frictions, you know, and the payment thing.

942
01:00:26.579 --> 01:00:27.719
But yeah, look, they are out there.

943
01:00:27.780 --> 01:00:28.559
It's too much.

944
01:00:28.559 --> 01:00:30.659
Let's just apply Occam's razor.

945
01:00:30.719 --> 01:00:42.719
It's too much of a coincidence that the 2 stories that, you know, in the general astralness of fanniness, that the fans most wanted were weather fear and enemy of the world from the season.

946
01:00:42.780 --> 01:00:46.619
They let, you know, after on the convention set, but these are the ones they talk about.

947
01:00:46.679 --> 01:00:49.980
They both turn up, they come on, too much.

948
01:00:50.039 --> 01:00:51.000
Of course they're out there.

949
01:00:51.059 --> 01:00:55.860
We just have to hope they come out before we're on dialysis machines having to watch them in a mirror.

950
01:00:55.920 --> 01:00:56.880
What would you most like?

951
01:00:56.940 --> 01:00:58.380
It's obviously a massacre.

952
01:00:58.440 --> 01:01:00.780
It's such a popular choice in this podcast.

953
01:01:00.840 --> 01:01:01.860
Does that not exist?

954
01:01:01.920 --> 01:01:05.159
It felt like the old 12 episodes of that.

955
01:01:05.219 --> 01:01:18.780
Personally, what I would like to see are the ones that are the hardest to come to on an audio and the ones that don't necessarily, like you were saying, Brendan, earlier with enemy of the world, didn't really grab you so much as a reconstruction.

956
01:01:18.840 --> 01:01:21.239
But you enrolled, really got it when you watched it.

957
01:01:21.239 --> 01:01:30.659
I said, because you're seeing actors in real time doing doing stuff with the faces that actors do and voices and all the rest of it, pariah just blows me away on the screen.

958
01:01:30.719 --> 01:01:32.639
I always loved her as a character in the audio.

959
01:01:32.699 --> 01:01:39.659
That's my 1st love, but there's an audio, but that, no, no, no, she's just Carmen Monroe's just it for me this year.

960
01:01:39.719 --> 01:01:43.260
She's my go to choice if we have to give an award to this season.

961
01:01:43.320 --> 01:01:44.639
It's come on right.

962
01:01:44.699 --> 01:01:45.659
What would I like to see?

963
01:01:45.719 --> 01:01:49.260
the ones that are the most actually the ones that are actually about the subjects of performance?

964
01:01:49.320 --> 01:01:50.519
So yeah, it's still a massacre.

965
01:01:50.639 --> 01:01:53.400
Anything with an M, actually, mythmakers as well.

966
01:01:53.460 --> 01:01:54.900
Yeah, mythmakers would be something.

967
01:01:54.960 --> 01:01:56.280
I powered the Daleks.

968
01:01:56.280 --> 01:01:57.659
Oh, that's the other one.

969
01:01:57.719 --> 01:01:58.199
Yeah, yeah.

970
01:01:58.260 --> 01:01:59.519
So the one that I want back.

971
01:01:59.579 --> 01:02:00.960
I've got no idea. you know what I mean?

972
01:02:01.019 --> 01:02:10.739
Like there were all sorts of rumours and things, but everything seems to have dried up and I think it's all closely associated with the, you know, demise of the classic DVD range.

973
01:02:10.800 --> 01:02:13.320
I don't know, like that probably didn't have to end.

974
01:02:13.380 --> 01:02:20.039
You've got to think that, you know, maybe they had some releases schedule because they were expecting something and then had to drop them.

975
01:02:20.219 --> 01:02:26.280
So rather than doing the thing which you would have expected them to do, which is release special editions of things that had already been released or whatever.

976
01:02:26.340 --> 01:02:28.440
The thing has just gone away.

977
01:02:28.500 --> 01:02:40.679
So you think it has more to do with the comedy recasting by Cereon McKellen and Derek Jack of the, in the hit show, Vicious, now starring Philip Morris and Ian Levine on their Twitter feed.

978
01:02:40.739 --> 01:02:42.239
I think we only got that.

979
01:02:42.300 --> 01:02:43.619
I don't think you need to.

980
01:02:43.679 --> 01:02:44.639
Because everybody knows it.

981
01:02:44.699 --> 01:02:45.599
Yeah, seriously.

982
01:02:45.599 --> 01:02:47.039
He's sadly very public.

983
01:02:47.039 --> 01:02:49.139
Don't cut it, seriously, and keep this in.

984
01:02:49.199 --> 01:02:51.659
It's okay to put it up that everybody is saying this.

985
01:02:51.719 --> 01:02:52.559
It's on Facebook.

986
01:02:52.619 --> 01:02:54.360
People are saying this on Facebook.

987
01:02:54.420 --> 01:03:00.000
No, but on the Doctor Who page, you just say, Philip Morris and Ian Levine are just a great comic that you are of all time.

988
01:03:00.059 --> 01:03:06.900
I think you can see the kind of characters that are involved in this and the reason that for certain 12, you know, people might be holding stuff back.

989
01:03:06.960 --> 01:03:08.820
It's all out there on Facebook easy to read.

990
01:03:08.940 --> 01:03:25.920
Yeah, that's where I think there is something else going on because the way that the people involved are acting, and in this case, Philip Morrison, Ian Levine, and their animosity with each other, I'm really wanting that six-part show to be Rebecca Front could direct.

991
01:03:26.880 --> 01:03:37.019
No, I just think there has to be more than we know in order for there to be this croissant between them.

992
01:03:37.079 --> 01:03:39.119
In terms of...

993
01:03:39.179 --> 01:03:47.699
Now, in terms of, in terms of what I'd like to see back, I would actually, If I could only get one more back, if I could only get one more.

994
01:03:47.760 --> 01:03:49.800
It would be the macro terror.

995
01:03:49.860 --> 01:03:51.480
Yeah, good choice.

996
01:03:51.539 --> 01:03:53.219
One to have more Ben and Polly.

997
01:03:53.280 --> 01:03:54.059
That's good.

998
01:03:54.119 --> 01:03:59.159
And 2 because as I said last podcast, I think it is the best story of that season.

999
01:03:59.280 --> 01:04:00.840
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1000
01:04:00.900 --> 01:04:04.980
I quite like to see Zenia Merton's dance, though, in Marco Polo.

1001
01:04:05.039 --> 01:04:06.119
Marco Polo would be amazing.

1002
01:04:06.179 --> 01:04:06.539
Yeah.

1003
01:04:06.539 --> 01:04:08.820
Let's just let's just...

1004
01:04:08.880 --> 01:04:09.659
We want the whole lot.

1005
01:04:09.719 --> 01:04:11.699
I want everything for Christmas.

1006
01:04:11.760 --> 01:04:13.860
I even want the space pirates back.

1007
01:04:13.920 --> 01:04:16.199
I'd love to see the space pirates, actually.

1008
01:04:16.199 --> 01:04:17.099
To see it.

1009
01:04:17.159 --> 01:04:18.000
It looks amazing.

1010
01:04:18.059 --> 01:04:19.559
You could watch it with the sound down.

1011
01:04:20.280 --> 01:04:21.719
Right.

1012
01:04:21.780 --> 01:04:37.559
Well, on that note, dear listener, we will be back next week, finishing off, season 5 of Doctor Who, we are on the siege by Seaweed and Foam and Cybermen in uh Fury from the Beach and the Wheel in Space.

1013
01:04:37.679 --> 01:04:39.900
Another David Whittaker story.

1014
01:04:39.960 --> 01:04:41.400
Another David Whitt story.

1015
01:04:41.460 --> 01:04:43.320
Is it as good as any of the world?

1016
01:04:43.380 --> 01:04:44.760
Yeah, maybe.

1017
01:04:45.659 --> 01:04:48.239
Come back next weekend by now.

1018
01:04:48.300 --> 01:04:49.139
Until then good night.

1019
01:04:49.199 --> 01:04:50.039
Good night.

1020
01:04:50.099 --> 01:04:50.340
Thank you.

1021
01:04:54.599 --> 01:05:00.059
You have been listening to Flight 2 Entirety with Nathan Bottomley, Brendan Jones, and Richard Stone.

1022
01:05:00.059 --> 01:05:04.260
This episode, Internal Pink Wobbly Bits, was recorded on Sunday, the 9th of November.

1023
01:05:04.320 --> 01:05:06.719
The next episode will be released on December 7th.

1024
01:05:06.780 --> 01:05:13.139
You can find us online at flighttoentirety.com, collect your entirety on Facebook and iTunes and FTE podcast on Twitter.

1025
01:05:13.199 --> 01:05:17.159
If the leader of our worlds are in published good summers for all, we have eternal winter.

1026
01:05:20.219 --> 01:05:28.559
Uh, Yeah, so, uh, we've got one more episode for season five, which we will actually be recording.

1027
01:05:28.559 --> 01:05:39.059
The day this episode comes out because today is Doctor Who's Birthday, the day we release this episode in the 25th of November, which means it's Clara's birthday.

1028
01:05:39.119 --> 01:05:40.260
I hope she's still around.

1029
01:05:40.320 --> 01:05:42.179
I haven't seen the end.

1030
01:05:42.719 --> 01:05:42.900
No.

1031
01:05:42.960 --> 01:05:44.159
We do hope she's.

1032
01:05:44.159 --> 01:05:45.300
Oh, I'm not going to say anything.

1033
01:05:45.360 --> 01:05:50.940
Although living on the astral plane with the Great Intelligence, Richard E. Grant and Missy.

1034
01:05:51.000 --> 01:05:51.780
And actually, Emri.

1035
01:05:51.840 --> 01:05:52.500
Absolutely.