WEBVTT

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This transcript was created on 2026-05-04 at 17:23:02

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Hello, dear listener and welcome back to Flight Through Entirety

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the only Doctor Who podcast powered by the macro transmission of a

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K-filter wavelength in a self-replicating energy Blindfold

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Matrix.

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And also, of course, by love.

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I'm Nathan.

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I'm James.

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I'm Peter.

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And I'm Todd.

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Well, turns out David Tennant didn't regenerate quite as we

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expected, and so it's time for him to take his 18 month victory

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lap, which will begin with a lot of people standing around talking

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in rooms until Bad Wolfmark 2 turns up.

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It's funny and thrilling and only slightly problematic.

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It's journeys end.

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Todd, were you disappointed by the final outcome of the

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regeneration here?

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Um...

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Yes and no?

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Like, I mean, if David had regenerated. fine, you know?

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But of course, you couldn't really for story reasons and

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contracts.

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And the fact that you get to use the cutoff hand from the

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Christmas invasion as a plot point, which has been, you know

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circling this whole series since the end of season one and

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Torchwood, I just think it's hilarious that something that Russell

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throws in as like showing how regeneration works, something

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different.

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Um, And he never knows why he uses it, does these things.

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He just does them and then it works out to be, well, here we go.

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We can use it right here as to why he can syphon off his

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regeneration energy and still look like he looks and that's the

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brilliance of Russell T. Davies in terms of why he does what he

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does.

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It's also something that Moffatt does, isn't it?

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When Moffat comes back to this in time of the doctor.

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And he gets the doctor to explain why he regenerated into

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himself.

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And the explanation he gives is, you know, I had a sort of vanity

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thing going.

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And it is that, that's how tenant react.

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And so both of them are able to find things in Doctor Who's

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history, things that are lying around and repurpose them and find

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new things to do with them.

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And we talked last week so much about Russell's creative process

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and he's clearly doing that here.

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I'd forgotten that the hand is on the set of torchwood, like right

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from the beginning.

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Isn't it in the 1st episode?

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And all of this season, it's been lying around in plain sight in

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the Tartars.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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It's tremendous.

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It's so great.

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Such a clever thing.

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And of course, the way regeneration is, he could make up anything

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for, you know, to make it have any effect that he wants it to have

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really.

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I mean, it is the signalling, I think, in this episode that the

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plot mechanics are going to start taking over, which makes it

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slightly less joyous than last week, but still utterly joyous.

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Well, I mean, the 1st real joyous moment is the resolution of

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Sarah James Cliffhanger, where we get the 2 missing pieces, who

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weren't here last week, and that's Jackie and Mickey.

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Smiths had to stick together.

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And less than less than just Jackie, but Jackie with a massive

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gun.

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We've talked previously about Russell thinking in comic strip

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terms.

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And I was talking to friend of the podcast, Stuart Manning about

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this, and the fact that everyone's toting a gun, and his view was

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that Russell likes a big comic strip image.

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You know, he's a cartoonist.

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We've talked about that.

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And there's that fab pre-credit shot of Rose appearing in the

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street last week with the gum strapped over her shoulder, and

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that's the full page final frame image.

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But Russell being Russell has to undercut that and then does it

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with Jackie because that's hilarious.

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It's such a joyous moment.

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Less joyous, perhaps, is the way in which Gwen and Leanto get out

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of their predicament with a time lock program that Tosh is working

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on, so now she can manipulate time and energy fields, and it's one

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of these things that perhaps you're alluded to, is that this week

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I think we get a lot more scientific mumbo jumbo to get out of

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things throughout the episode, which makes it slightly less joyous

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for me at certain times where I kind of think, 0 my goodness, what

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are we going on with now?

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Does that really make any sense?

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Obviously, the counterpoint is all the lovely relationships and

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things that go on.

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But I do struggle a bit with some of that stuff in this episode.

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And who knew as well that Tosh could not handle a space piggy, but

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she could stop time.

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I actually think that Torchwood is a little bit underserved in

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this.

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And it is nice to have Gwen and Yanto in it, but they don't get

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very much to do.

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I do like the scene where Gwen is attacking a Dalek with a machine

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gun.

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That's fantastic.

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And I like the scene where she goes up and sort of pokes one of

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the bullets and stuff.

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That's all sort of very fun, but then it is very, definitely

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lampshaded.

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No, we're stuck in here for the duration and we're not going to be

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doing anything.

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Do you know what it reminded me of?

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The scenes from Shada that were used in the 5 doctors.

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Ah, yeah.

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They're caught in a time loop.

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They can't interact with the rest of the story. we'd come back and

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they were punching down the cam.

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We're spotted the answer.

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We're going to stick and Gwen laid out with a BFG.

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Well, you know, like, I think that Camille Kajuri sort of made the

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point that she doesn't get that much to do in this episode and

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like there are a lot of moving parts.

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There are a lot of people and everyone gets great character

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moments, but they don't all get great plot moments, I think.

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And I'm okay with that.

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Like I would sooner, like I would never say, Russell, you needed

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to have fewer guest stars and give each of them a more interesting

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arc.

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That's not what this is for.

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And so just seeing Yanto, having him do a few great lines, having

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Gwen, you know, fire a big gun, all of those things are absolutely

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worth seeing, and I don't care if those characters don't get that

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much to do.

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In a lot of ways, Jackie gets more to do than a lot of the other

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characters she gets put in, you know, potential peril.

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Yeah.

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Like, there's the whole scene where she's about to get fairy

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dusted and...

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Well, with Gita from EastEnders.

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Yes.

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Can I just say as well, sorry, James, just on that point.

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Geeta, I think, from EastEnders is like Elton from Love and

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Monsters.

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The doctor is woven through her life because not only is she there

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with Sarah on board that dalek ship, about to be disintegrated, but

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in 1993, the 6th doctor in ace visited her clothes store in Walsh

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coincidence.

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Sorry, James.

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There's that.

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And, well, you know, Elton was actually supposed to come back in

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this story too.

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Actually, that reminds me.

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Like how?

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But, but it's that bit, James, it's not just, you know, her

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getting to have part of the action, but it's her getting to have a

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character moment because you remember that they're all herded into

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this big room where they're testing the reality bomb, which

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doesn't seem to be a bomb.

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It seems to be a ray, but like whatever.

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And they're sort of all there, and they're all going to be

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disintegrated, and Jack and Mickey and Jackie are going to escape

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and the reason that Jackie doesn't go with them is that Gita has

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had a little bit of a turn and she's panicking and the Daleks are

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threatening her, and Jackie helped her, you know, like he's kind

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to her.

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And then when Jackie realises that she's going to abandon her and

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can't do anything about it, she says, I'm sorry, I'm so sorry.

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Like for a 2nd she becomes the doctor.

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Even Jackie, you know, who is the butt of all of the jokes and who

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everyone sort of makes fun of for being sort of trivial or

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incompetent or whatever.

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Like even Jackie has learned to be like the doctor.

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It's a great point that you just made there.

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Again, I find it.

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I guess the mechanics of it is something that I get hung up on.

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Like she's got this big yellow button to push.

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Why does it suddenly just deposit her on the other side of that

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door with Mickey?

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Why doesn't it send her back to wherever?

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To the other universe or whatever.

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I mean, I know because the plot requires it to be there.

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Yeah.

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They're using that to teleport around here, aren't they?

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And that's how they get them up off Earth.

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They get Sarah up with the Daleks, don't they?

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With the teleport.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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So I mean, that's how they sort of get them around, I guess.

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The plotting logistics are secondary to what this episode is, which

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is the event, it's the reunion.

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And so the fact that Davros is just building a bomb is pretty

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pedestrian.

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I mean, that's Doctor Who boilerplates.

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And, hey, do you think you got the idea from Kara in Revelation of

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the Dialects?

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What are you going to do, Davris?

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I'm going to build a bomb, a bomb, a great big bomb.

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But also the logic of it doesn't work.

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That's rare for Russell.

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The logic, if that doesn't work, because it's a bomb that will

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supposedly wipe out all other dimensions except for the Daleks.

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But if you think about other dimensions, there will be other

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dimensions there where the Daleks have built this bomb and the

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doctor hasn't been able to stop them, and so they will have

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decinated it and wiped out all dimensions.

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There is that issue about possible and actual worlds, which is, yes

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it doesn't sort of quite work if you think of those worlds as

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possibilities, but somehow able to interact with one another.

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There's a whole sort of kind of philosophy that deals with things

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like probabilities and might and should by positing imaginary

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possible worlds.

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I think these have to be a different kind of world than that for

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this to work.

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I think the reality bomb is a great idea, and it's absolutely

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Russell Techno Babble in that it does exactly what it says on the

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tin.

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It's a bomb that blows up reality.

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You know what I mean?

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Mum is not sitting next to you on the couch saying, what's a

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reality bomb, right?

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Like, it's all just very clear what it is.

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And I think as well that it is the payoff of that conversation

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that Davros has with the doctor in Genesis of the Daleks, about

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wiping everything out.

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And I read about time, uh, before recording this, and they mention

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dialogue, even in destiny of the Daleks, where Davros talks about

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creating weaponry that will destroy all mass that it encounters.

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And so Davros has always wanted to destroy everything.

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And so, you know, we bring him back, what's he doing?

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He's destroying everything.

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Yeah, it totally works.

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I get I get what you're saying.

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For me, it's the weakest thing where my grand plan is just to

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destroy everything.

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I don't I don't know.

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I just...

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No, no.

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It's not subtle, you know.

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You know, we get reality bomb, time lock.

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What do we have?

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we've got the Osterhagen key.

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I love that name.

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Osterhagen.

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It's like ice cream.

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It's an anagram of Earth's Gone.

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There you go.

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How many brain cells did they use up on that one?

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And again, in this episode, like last episode, we had misdirection

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with Jack saying, oh, Martha's down, right?

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So to try and make you think that she's dead when she uses Project

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Indigo.

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Here with the TARDIS going into the core of the Dalek crucible.

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You know, it's misdirection that it's going to be torn apart.

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Do you know what I'm saying?

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00:13:00.419 --> 00:13:01.620
Yeah.

252
00:13:01.679 --> 00:13:05.460
I mean, we know we know that neither of those things are going to

253
00:13:05.460 --> 00:13:05.759
happen.

254
00:13:05.820 --> 00:13:08.220
We know that Martha's not going to be killed and the TARDIS is not

255
00:13:08.220 --> 00:13:08.940
going to be destroyed.

256
00:13:08.940 --> 00:13:11.519
And we know that Donna's not going to be killed by something that

257
00:13:11.519 --> 00:13:12.659
happens early in the episode.

258
00:13:12.779 --> 00:13:17.039
But it's classic Russell misdirection with saying something and

259
00:13:17.039 --> 00:13:19.860
the characters believing one thing, but we know that it's not what

260
00:13:19.860 --> 00:13:20.639
it appears to be.

261
00:13:20.700 --> 00:13:22.620
Can I just say the Darnit crucible?

262
00:13:22.679 --> 00:13:25.799
It always reminds me that it's situated between Altos and Zeos.

263
00:13:27.960 --> 00:13:31.919
Like I just always look at it and I always think that it is the

264
00:13:31.919 --> 00:13:33.779
shadows spaceship in the middle of that.

265
00:13:33.840 --> 00:13:34.919
That's what's controlling it.

266
00:13:34.980 --> 00:13:36.240
It's mentalis.

267
00:13:36.360 --> 00:13:38.700
Mentalis is in charge of the Dalek fleet.

268
00:13:39.179 --> 00:13:42.539
Maybe that means that the shadow proclamation is actually the

269
00:13:42.539 --> 00:13:44.220
shadows proclamation.

270
00:13:45.840 --> 00:13:49.019
I think as well, talking about Martha.

271
00:13:49.080 --> 00:13:51.659
We've seen throughout this season that she's been a little bit

272
00:13:51.659 --> 00:13:55.320
short-changed in kind of the things that she's been given to do.

273
00:13:55.379 --> 00:13:58.919
She's been brought back and then not really rewarded the audience

274
00:13:58.919 --> 00:14:03.360
much, and the recurring problem happens here as well, because

275
00:14:03.360 --> 00:14:06.299
Martha's brought back as part of the, as part of the team.

276
00:14:06.360 --> 00:14:09.899
But then she has very little connection to the main action and no

277
00:14:09.899 --> 00:14:11.940
relationship to speak of with the doctor.

278
00:14:12.000 --> 00:14:15.720
So it's a little bit like when Harry was brought back in the

279
00:14:15.720 --> 00:14:16.740
Android invasion.

280
00:14:16.799 --> 00:14:19.440
You've got the familiar face, but they're not doing the things

281
00:14:19.440 --> 00:14:20.580
that you want them to do.

282
00:14:20.639 --> 00:14:23.220
She's there in practice, but not spirit.

283
00:14:23.279 --> 00:14:26.879
She kind of rattles around unit HQ spouting generic lines and then

284
00:14:26.879 --> 00:14:29.279
goes off into the D plot with the Hagendars key.

285
00:14:29.340 --> 00:14:30.779
And that's it.

286
00:14:30.840 --> 00:14:35.399
But, but she gets to go to Germany and we get to hear Daleks in

287
00:14:35.399 --> 00:14:35.879
German.

288
00:14:35.940 --> 00:14:41.700
And then she gets that moment with Rose when she gets to say, oh

289
00:14:41.700 --> 00:14:42.240
he found you.

290
00:14:42.299 --> 00:14:43.679
Is that the lines?

291
00:14:43.740 --> 00:14:45.419
Yeah, I love that line.

292
00:14:45.480 --> 00:14:47.279
And that payoff is just amazing.

293
00:14:47.340 --> 00:14:50.399
It gets my heart every single time when she says that.

294
00:14:50.399 --> 00:14:54.480
And she's the one that sort of is being warm and fuzzy after Rose

295
00:14:54.480 --> 00:14:58.500
has been a thoroughly old cow like in the previous episode.

296
00:14:58.620 --> 00:15:02.940
Whereas here, it then gives Rose the impetus to say, oh, she's

297
00:15:02.940 --> 00:15:04.379
good or whatever, right?

298
00:15:04.440 --> 00:15:05.519
A change of tune.

299
00:15:05.580 --> 00:15:09.059
Like it's actually quite nice to see that Martha effects rose.

300
00:15:09.120 --> 00:15:13.620
And it's also fixing a problem at the heart of the program in this

301
00:15:13.620 --> 00:15:16.259
era, and that is how badly Martha was treated.

302
00:15:16.259 --> 00:15:22.500
And Martha goes, you know, like Martha just says, he found you.

303
00:15:22.559 --> 00:15:26.460
I'm, you know, she's happy for Rose, she's not resentful.

304
00:15:26.519 --> 00:15:29.519
You can see that the character has moved on.

305
00:15:29.580 --> 00:15:34.559
She's over the doctor and that's some that's some character

306
00:15:34.559 --> 00:15:35.159
growth.

307
00:15:35.279 --> 00:15:38.399
Something that she wasn't really given in her own season.

308
00:15:38.460 --> 00:15:43.500
It's a it's a nice a nice character B. Yeah, and I mean, Freema's

309
00:15:43.500 --> 00:15:45.000
doing everything that she can with it, I think.

310
00:15:45.059 --> 00:15:49.019
It's just, I can't shake the feeling all throughout this season

311
00:15:49.019 --> 00:15:52.919
and especially in this episode, that she's the B team.

312
00:15:52.980 --> 00:15:56.519
She's not given kind of the big scenes with the doctor, which Rose

313
00:15:56.519 --> 00:15:57.779
and Donneget.

314
00:15:57.840 --> 00:16:01.559
She shuffled off a little bit, like the spinoffs are, and it's

315
00:16:01.559 --> 00:16:02.639
just a little bit of a shame.

316
00:16:02.700 --> 00:16:06.779
I guess the price that you pay for having so many guest characters

317
00:16:06.779 --> 00:16:10.080
is that not every one of them gets to do everything.

318
00:16:10.139 --> 00:16:14.399
I do think that Martha's sort of competence and things is really

319
00:16:14.399 --> 00:16:19.440
interesting and the way that Donna's criticism of what the doctor

320
00:16:19.440 --> 00:16:23.940
has done to Martha gets followed up here.

321
00:16:24.000 --> 00:16:29.879
So remember in the Santarin stratagem, where Donna actually sort

322
00:16:29.879 --> 00:16:34.259
of tells the doctor off for the fact that Martha is now a soldier

323
00:16:34.259 --> 00:16:35.279
in unit.

324
00:16:35.340 --> 00:16:37.980
And we learn, in fact, that Martha's role is a bit more

325
00:16:37.980 --> 00:16:39.299
complicated than that.

326
00:16:39.360 --> 00:16:45.059
But that's at the heart of what's being said here, I think, in

327
00:16:45.059 --> 00:16:46.139
this episode.

328
00:16:46.200 --> 00:16:49.679
So you get 2 groups of companions.

329
00:16:49.740 --> 00:16:54.960
You get Martha and then you get Sarah, Jack and Jackie and Mickey

330
00:16:54.960 --> 00:16:56.759
but basically Sarah and Jack, isn't it?

331
00:16:56.820 --> 00:16:58.860
Both come up with a plan.

332
00:16:58.919 --> 00:17:03.179
And their plan is to blow everything up.

333
00:17:03.539 --> 00:17:10.980
And, and, and Donna and the other doctor come up with a plan and

334
00:17:10.980 --> 00:17:14.279
what's their plan to kind of rush at Davros with a big gun?

335
00:17:15.359 --> 00:17:17.460
Is it to blow everything up?

336
00:17:17.519 --> 00:17:18.839
Yeah, yeah.

337
00:17:18.900 --> 00:17:20.819
Everybody seems to be blowing everything up.

338
00:17:20.880 --> 00:17:22.200
Davros is blowing everything up.

339
00:17:22.259 --> 00:17:26.339
Sarah Jane's got that emerald crystal thing to blow everything up

340
00:17:26.339 --> 00:17:26.640
with.

341
00:17:26.640 --> 00:17:30.539
Martha's going to blow everything up and then they've got the ray

342
00:17:30.539 --> 00:17:31.380
gun to blow up.

343
00:17:32.579 --> 00:17:34.619
And also Davros and the Daleks are going to blow everything up.

344
00:17:34.740 --> 00:17:35.160
Hooray.

345
00:17:35.220 --> 00:17:40.140
But so, and so that means that the doctor's companions are more

346
00:17:40.140 --> 00:17:43.799
like the Daleks than they are like the doctor.

347
00:17:43.859 --> 00:17:49.079
And remember the doctor's reaction of horror when he discovers

348
00:17:49.079 --> 00:17:53.460
what Jack and Sarah and Martha are all intending to do.

349
00:17:53.700 --> 00:17:57.539
But do you think, though, that that's actually, that's also

350
00:17:57.539 --> 00:18:02.400
selling the fact that these characters have all experienced the

351
00:18:02.400 --> 00:18:05.519
Daleks, or at least the lead characters that are making those

352
00:18:05.519 --> 00:18:10.619
decisions, know how much of a threat the Daleks are, and so they

353
00:18:10.619 --> 00:18:11.460
are willing to go that far?

354
00:18:11.519 --> 00:18:13.259
Oh yeah, no, sure.

355
00:18:13.319 --> 00:18:19.920
It's a case of they wouldn't do this, but it's this or the

356
00:18:19.920 --> 00:18:20.339
universe.

357
00:18:20.640 --> 00:18:23.039
And it helps sell the threat.

358
00:18:23.099 --> 00:18:23.880
Do you know what I mean?

359
00:18:23.940 --> 00:18:26.220
Because, I mean, basically by this point, we're all on the

360
00:18:26.220 --> 00:18:29.099
crucible, which is just a couple of sets where we're all standing

361
00:18:29.099 --> 00:18:32.579
around talking to one another over video conferences. you know

362
00:18:32.579 --> 00:18:32.880
what I mean?

363
00:18:32.940 --> 00:18:34.500
cement factory or something, isn't it?

364
00:18:34.559 --> 00:18:37.200
Another of Ed Thomas's old cement factories.

365
00:18:38.220 --> 00:18:41.640
And all of that's sort of quite fun, but it is a little bit kind

366
00:18:41.640 --> 00:18:43.140
of static, I think.

367
00:18:43.200 --> 00:18:48.059
And so there's a lot of sort of word peril. standing around in a

368
00:18:48.059 --> 00:18:49.019
cement factory.

369
00:18:49.079 --> 00:18:49.619
Yeah, that's right.

370
00:18:49.619 --> 00:18:53.640
I think this is definitely Russell lampshading what the arc that

371
00:18:53.640 --> 00:18:55.200
he's given, a lot of these characters.

372
00:18:55.259 --> 00:18:58.259
But I have to say, I'm not entirely on board with it because

373
00:18:58.259 --> 00:19:02.519
really, every character who Russell is introduced has ended up

374
00:19:02.519 --> 00:19:03.839
being a bit gun tooting.

375
00:19:03.900 --> 00:19:07.319
So what Davros says, it's an element of self-criticism is actually

376
00:19:07.319 --> 00:19:08.220
correct.

377
00:19:08.279 --> 00:19:11.819
You can't imagine in the old series that you would have brought

378
00:19:11.819 --> 00:19:15.660
back old companions and suddenly they would be hard bitten kind of

379
00:19:15.660 --> 00:19:21.900
gunslingers, you know, Polly or Joe. Exactly.

380
00:19:21.960 --> 00:19:25.259
Dodo would sit on the reality bomb and detonate it by accident

381
00:19:25.259 --> 00:19:30.599
after giving everyone syphilis. forgotten that.

382
00:19:30.720 --> 00:19:35.460
But I'm not entirely on board with those trajectories.

383
00:19:35.519 --> 00:19:36.960
I do wonder why it was done.

384
00:19:37.019 --> 00:19:40.799
I mean, Mickey, for instance, at this stage has just morphed into

385
00:19:40.799 --> 00:19:41.519
Noel Clark.

386
00:19:41.579 --> 00:19:43.980
There's very little of original Mickey left.

387
00:19:44.039 --> 00:19:44.880
It's now Noel Clark.

388
00:19:44.940 --> 00:19:47.460
There's even that comment about beefcake, isn't there?

389
00:19:47.519 --> 00:19:49.559
When does Jack hug him and say something about it?

390
00:19:49.559 --> 00:19:50.339
Cheesecake beef.

391
00:19:52.140 --> 00:19:55.980
I want to see, I want to see a big finish spinoff series called

392
00:19:55.980 --> 00:19:59.880
Smith and Jones with Mickey Smith and Martha Jones.

393
00:19:59.940 --> 00:20:01.259
Yeah, I think it'd be great.

394
00:20:01.319 --> 00:20:03.000
It's clearly where they're heading at the end.

395
00:20:03.059 --> 00:20:06.480
We'll get to that, but I'm amazed they haven't got there yet.

396
00:20:06.599 --> 00:20:08.700
Should I say it 3 times?

397
00:20:09.900 --> 00:20:13.980
I think it's Russell making the episode about something when it

398
00:20:13.980 --> 00:20:15.480
doesn't necessarily have to be.

399
00:20:15.539 --> 00:20:18.000
The whole point of this, like we were talking about last week, is

400
00:20:18.000 --> 00:20:19.079
that it's event television.

401
00:20:19.140 --> 00:20:23.700
This is Russell overlaying kind of something character on top of

402
00:20:23.700 --> 00:20:23.880
it.

403
00:20:23.940 --> 00:20:25.680
And I'm, I, I like that.

404
00:20:25.799 --> 00:20:26.160
That fine.

405
00:20:26.220 --> 00:20:29.039
I'm just not sure we had to end up here.

406
00:20:29.160 --> 00:20:36.119
Except, though, that what is the doctor's solution in contrast to

407
00:20:36.119 --> 00:20:36.599
this?

408
00:20:36.660 --> 00:20:40.619
So the doctor's companions come up with will blow up the crucible

409
00:20:40.619 --> 00:20:45.000
or will blow up the world or will Russia Davros with a big gun?

410
00:20:45.059 --> 00:20:49.140
And what is the solution to the Daleks in this situation?

411
00:20:49.200 --> 00:20:55.559
And the solution is, and Donna gets to do it, because it's

412
00:20:55.559 --> 00:21:00.539
metacrisis Donna, at this point, she gets to run in and she

413
00:21:00.539 --> 00:21:06.420
defeats the daleks by making them ridiculous and by being funny.

414
00:21:06.480 --> 00:21:09.359
So she comes out, she's super verbal.

415
00:21:09.420 --> 00:21:13.319
And that thing about, you know, like Donna's a bit dim and can't

416
00:21:13.319 --> 00:21:15.059
point out Germany on a map or whatever.

417
00:21:15.119 --> 00:21:15.839
Thank goodness.

418
00:21:15.900 --> 00:21:17.819
Martha was able to point out Germany on map.

419
00:21:17.880 --> 00:21:18.359
Exactly.

420
00:21:19.019 --> 00:21:23.579
And then suddenly Catherine Tate comes out and she is every bit as

421
00:21:23.579 --> 00:21:27.359
smart and as verbal as David Tennant.

422
00:21:27.420 --> 00:21:30.839
She is unbelievable at that moment.

423
00:21:30.900 --> 00:21:33.059
It's such a tremendous performance.

424
00:21:33.119 --> 00:21:38.460
And she solves the problem by typing because she's a temp and we

425
00:21:38.460 --> 00:21:41.819
learned that she types at 100 words per minute in the last

426
00:21:41.819 --> 00:21:42.359
episode.

427
00:21:42.420 --> 00:21:47.339
And so she solves the problem by being incredibly funny and fun to

428
00:21:47.339 --> 00:21:52.799
watch and by typing and by making the Daleks go round and round in

429
00:21:52.799 --> 00:21:53.460
circles.

430
00:21:53.519 --> 00:21:57.180
Let's make them go this way and they even give her a big knob that

431
00:21:57.180 --> 00:22:00.240
she can turn to make the Darlies go one direction or another

432
00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:01.019
direction.

433
00:22:01.079 --> 00:22:06.359
And so the solution for Doctor Who isn't, you have a big gun or

434
00:22:06.359 --> 00:22:10.019
you have a big bomb or something like that, and that's how you

435
00:22:10.019 --> 00:22:10.380
win.

436
00:22:11.279 --> 00:22:17.519
You win by being more fun than the villains, by being smarter and

437
00:22:17.519 --> 00:22:18.900
more compelling to watch.

438
00:22:18.960 --> 00:22:24.720
And so, this time, I think for the 1st time, I saw what the point

439
00:22:24.720 --> 00:22:26.640
of all that character stuff was.

440
00:22:26.700 --> 00:22:30.599
I thought it was there just to give Tenet the opportunity to pull

441
00:22:30.599 --> 00:22:34.559
a pouty face and feel sorry for himself, you know, oh, I'm

442
00:22:34.559 --> 00:22:35.160
terrible me.

443
00:22:35.220 --> 00:22:36.960
I'm turning all my companions into weapons.

444
00:22:37.019 --> 00:22:41.519
But in fact, it's about who the doctor is and why he wins.

445
00:22:41.519 --> 00:22:44.700
At the most basic level, and it's perfect.

446
00:22:44.759 --> 00:22:46.259
If everyone's tuning in.

447
00:22:46.319 --> 00:22:48.779
They need to know that that's what the doctor's about.

448
00:22:57.839 --> 00:23:01.559
I do have to say that I think that Julian's performances, Del Bros

449
00:23:01.559 --> 00:23:04.380
in this episode is just extraordinary, and the lines that he gets

450
00:23:04.380 --> 00:23:09.240
to say to the doctor, Some of the, the fact that Davros, and this

451
00:23:09.240 --> 00:23:13.440
is in the writing, gets to recognise Sarah Jane, like impossible

452
00:23:13.440 --> 00:23:14.700
that face after all these years.

453
00:23:14.759 --> 00:23:19.019
That is just brilliant, and it's such a payoff. for all of us who

454
00:23:19.019 --> 00:23:22.500
have known her for this long that she's elevated that status that

455
00:23:22.500 --> 00:23:23.700
he actually recognises.

456
00:23:23.759 --> 00:23:26.640
The moment a 1000 fanboys read to reach for the cleanness.

457
00:23:26.700 --> 00:23:29.099
But it's so good, isn't it?

458
00:23:29.160 --> 00:23:30.420
It doesn't ruin anything.

459
00:23:30.480 --> 00:23:36.180
It's appalling and it gets gives both of them a chance to act and

460
00:23:36.180 --> 00:23:38.880
it lifts Sarah into a more mythic status.

461
00:23:38.940 --> 00:23:41.160
I mean, she's already the lead of her own program.

462
00:23:41.220 --> 00:23:46.259
She gets to use the Sonic lipstick at one point, you know, but now

463
00:23:46.259 --> 00:23:50.160
she's entered into this sort of, you know, she has a relationship

464
00:23:50.160 --> 00:23:55.619
with someone who has mythic status, the creator of the Daleks and

465
00:23:55.619 --> 00:23:59.039
someone who was involved in the time war and all of that weird

466
00:23:59.039 --> 00:24:03.900
time war kind of language, you know, Davros was there.

467
00:24:03.960 --> 00:24:08.099
I think in the old series, companions didn't get mythic status.

468
00:24:08.160 --> 00:24:10.740
They might have been there, sort of important stories, but the

469
00:24:10.740 --> 00:24:12.599
series was not about being mythic.

470
00:24:12.660 --> 00:24:14.400
It was just episodic adventures.

471
00:24:14.460 --> 00:24:18.180
Whereas the new series has elevated the doctor to being mythic and

472
00:24:18.180 --> 00:24:20.339
elevating Sarah alongside him is very fishing.

473
00:24:20.460 --> 00:24:21.960
It's wonderful.

474
00:24:22.140 --> 00:24:25.920
I was like the fact that Davros is now in a league of villains

475
00:24:25.920 --> 00:24:30.180
where he gets to call the companion Ms. Tyler rather than Rose.

476
00:24:30.180 --> 00:24:31.619
That goes a long way.

477
00:24:35.279 --> 00:24:38.759
You know, this story could have been even longer than the 65

478
00:24:38.759 --> 00:24:39.539
minute slot.

479
00:24:39.599 --> 00:24:41.279
There's a lot of cuts.

480
00:24:41.339 --> 00:24:42.299
Yeah.

481
00:24:42.359 --> 00:24:48.119
Like, initially, we had an explanation of how you grow a TARDIS

482
00:24:48.119 --> 00:24:52.500
but, um, you know, the doctor was supposed to give the metacrisis

483
00:24:52.500 --> 00:24:55.740
doctor some corals so he could grow his own TARDIS and fly around

484
00:24:55.740 --> 00:24:57.599
the alternate universe.

485
00:24:57.720 --> 00:25:03.000
Um, And there was a scene as the TARDIS materialises at the end of

486
00:25:03.000 --> 00:25:09.900
it, the episode where Donna hears it and has a moment of of

487
00:25:09.900 --> 00:25:10.799
remembrance.

488
00:25:10.799 --> 00:25:14.759
And then, and then, and then sort of forgets and turns around and

489
00:25:14.759 --> 00:25:16.859
goes back to a conversation on the phone.

490
00:25:16.920 --> 00:25:21.960
Um, This episode is so full and then, you know, like, but there

491
00:25:21.960 --> 00:25:24.000
was so much more that they actually had to trim out of it.

492
00:25:24.059 --> 00:25:29.160
There's there's like maybe 10 minutes of footage that was probably

493
00:25:29.160 --> 00:25:30.240
on the cutting room floor.

494
00:25:30.299 --> 00:25:32.940
But for those, I don't mind those ones being cut.

495
00:25:33.000 --> 00:25:36.059
Sometimes I think those things actually help an episode much

496
00:25:36.059 --> 00:25:36.299
better.

497
00:25:37.019 --> 00:25:41.400
Going back to Dabros and his performance and what he gets to do.

498
00:25:41.460 --> 00:25:44.759
I mean, the fact that he talks about the doctor's soul being

499
00:25:44.759 --> 00:25:47.220
revealed and you take ordinary people and fashion them into

500
00:25:47.220 --> 00:25:49.920
weapons, I know you didn't particularly like that, Peter, but I

501
00:25:49.920 --> 00:25:52.740
actually think it ties in really well with everything that

502
00:25:52.740 --> 00:25:54.059
Russell's tried to do.

503
00:25:54.119 --> 00:25:57.539
And then we get that, how many people have died in your name

504
00:25:57.539 --> 00:26:02.579
flashback sequence, from the new series, like going back to series

505
00:26:02.579 --> 00:26:03.180
one.

506
00:26:03.299 --> 00:26:06.059
And it's so affecting.

507
00:26:06.119 --> 00:26:11.160
I think that, again, it's not the sort of thing that you would put

508
00:26:11.160 --> 00:26:14.519
up within anything other than a sort of big giant, you know, final

509
00:26:14.519 --> 00:26:16.559
finale for the era.

510
00:26:16.619 --> 00:26:19.200
It is a little bit indulgent.

511
00:26:19.259 --> 00:26:22.140
I think it's inexcusable that Adric is not there.

512
00:26:22.200 --> 00:26:23.759
Well, we don't care.

513
00:26:23.819 --> 00:26:26.400
That's really the reason, Catarina.

514
00:26:26.579 --> 00:26:29.880
But it is great to see.

515
00:26:29.940 --> 00:26:31.259
I mean, it is sort of really fun.

516
00:26:31.319 --> 00:26:35.640
So Dave Tennant gets to do 2 roles in this episode.

517
00:26:36.180 --> 00:26:42.059
His normal doctor, his newly regenerated, in love with myself

518
00:26:42.059 --> 00:26:46.859
doctor, and um, the doctor with one heart, who's half human or

519
00:26:46.859 --> 00:26:49.799
maybe not, but does go oi, oi, oi, a bit.

520
00:26:49.859 --> 00:26:53.640
What do you think of his performance as the doctor in blue?

521
00:26:53.759 --> 00:26:57.839
David Turner's always been a lesser performance in blue, I'm just

522
00:26:57.839 --> 00:26:58.380
putting it out there.

523
00:26:58.859 --> 00:27:01.259
What are you saying about series three?

524
00:27:02.279 --> 00:27:10.500
I like this idea, and I think that it ties into what I said before

525
00:27:10.500 --> 00:27:14.279
about the story's doing about the doctor's character.

526
00:27:14.940 --> 00:27:20.460
So just as Donna gets to be very doctor-ish, the doctor gets to be

527
00:27:20.460 --> 00:27:23.640
sort of very Donna-ish, and that's sort of reinforcing the idea

528
00:27:23.640 --> 00:27:27.960
that they're the same in all sorts of ways, which the season has

529
00:27:27.960 --> 00:27:30.779
been doing ever since partners in crime.

530
00:27:30.779 --> 00:27:35.220
And it gives the chance for 2 performers who really like one

531
00:27:35.220 --> 00:27:38.339
another and have been working closely together for, what, 9 months

532
00:27:38.339 --> 00:27:42.059
or whatever to do their best impersonations to each other.

533
00:27:43.319 --> 00:27:44.819
Yeah, yeah, I think they do it really well.

534
00:27:44.880 --> 00:27:47.819
I think both of them do it like tremendously well.

535
00:27:48.480 --> 00:27:55.380
I think there's a reason why they give the meta crisis doctor, a

536
00:27:55.380 --> 00:28:00.180
kind of Eccleston style jumper under his suit.

537
00:28:00.299 --> 00:28:03.779
Um, like, I think that that's sort of, that's sort of clear

538
00:28:03.779 --> 00:28:08.339
because what happens, you know, Donna comes out and is making the

539
00:28:08.339 --> 00:28:13.019
Dalek spin around and be silly and fun, and then the metacrisis

540
00:28:13.019 --> 00:28:16.920
doctor comes and has them all destroyed, you know, gets them all

541
00:28:16.920 --> 00:28:17.519
killed.

542
00:28:17.579 --> 00:28:20.220
And our doctor is super angry about that.

543
00:28:20.279 --> 00:28:26.099
He doesn't like that at all and, you know, calls that doctor on, on

544
00:28:26.099 --> 00:28:30.119
that and then, you know, ends up exiling him as a result.

545
00:28:30.180 --> 00:28:31.500
He can't be allowed to stay.

546
00:28:31.559 --> 00:28:36.420
But that's the doctor and Tennant will say this later in the

547
00:28:36.420 --> 00:28:36.779
episode.

548
00:28:36.839 --> 00:28:40.380
That's the doctor that we 1st met, the doctor who had wiped out

549
00:28:40.380 --> 00:28:44.339
all the daleks. who needs a rose to heal him in some ways.

550
00:28:44.400 --> 00:28:45.480
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

551
00:28:45.839 --> 00:28:47.220
Yeah.

552
00:28:47.279 --> 00:28:50.640
So, you know, there's a lot of sort of fun business around those

553
00:28:50.640 --> 00:28:52.319
the 2 doctors sort of thing.

554
00:28:52.799 --> 00:28:56.579
Darlik Khan calls him like the threefold doctor or something.

555
00:28:56.880 --> 00:28:59.339
It's like...

556
00:28:59.339 --> 00:29:02.099
The threefold man, and that's Donna.

557
00:29:02.160 --> 00:29:06.839
The doctor and the metacrisis doctor all get to be the doctor sort

558
00:29:06.839 --> 00:29:07.380
of here.

559
00:29:07.440 --> 00:29:09.119
So he's the threefold man.

560
00:29:09.180 --> 00:29:15.539
And so so we get to see the journey that that Doctor Who has been

561
00:29:15.539 --> 00:29:19.319
on since the beginning of series one, you know, we back to that

562
00:29:19.319 --> 00:29:19.559
doctor.

563
00:29:19.619 --> 00:29:20.160
Yeah.

564
00:29:21.059 --> 00:29:21.480
Makes sense.

565
00:29:21.539 --> 00:29:23.279
And Jack gets a joke.

566
00:29:23.640 --> 00:29:25.079
Yes.

567
00:29:25.200 --> 00:29:26.460
What does he say?

568
00:29:26.519 --> 00:29:30.960
He's distracted or thinking of some improper thoughts about, I

569
00:29:30.960 --> 00:29:33.420
can't remember the line of dialogue, but it does sound like he

570
00:29:33.420 --> 00:29:34.799
wants to have sex with all 3 of them.

571
00:29:35.940 --> 00:29:38.220
My dreams have all come true.

572
00:29:38.700 --> 00:29:42.420
I personally think it would have been completed if Jack had hit on

573
00:29:42.420 --> 00:29:43.259
Dalek Khan.

574
00:29:43.319 --> 00:29:45.000
Can you imagine that little scene?

575
00:29:52.079 --> 00:29:54.480
What do we think of Dalek Khan?

576
00:29:54.539 --> 00:29:56.460
Oh, Dalek Khan's amazing.

577
00:29:56.519 --> 00:29:59.400
I mean, it's a really great vocal performance from Nick Briggs.

578
00:29:59.460 --> 00:30:02.819
And like, I like the conception of it as well.

579
00:30:02.940 --> 00:30:07.079
Like, both Rose and Martha have met Dalek Khan?

580
00:30:07.140 --> 00:30:07.859
Yes.

581
00:30:07.920 --> 00:30:08.759
Yes.

582
00:30:08.759 --> 00:30:12.240
And I think Martha may mention Dalek Khan by name because she

583
00:30:12.240 --> 00:30:16.380
knows that Dalek Khan is kind of the only survivor of the cult of

584
00:30:16.380 --> 00:30:19.380
Scaro, as far as she's concerned, the only surviving Dalek, I

585
00:30:19.380 --> 00:30:19.559
think.

586
00:30:19.619 --> 00:30:22.859
So she knows about him as well.

587
00:30:22.920 --> 00:30:24.960
The doctor says you've met him before.

588
00:30:25.019 --> 00:30:26.279
Yeah, yeah, to Rose.

589
00:30:26.400 --> 00:30:27.480
That's right Yeah.

590
00:30:27.539 --> 00:30:29.700
I like how he can make prophecy.

591
00:30:29.759 --> 00:30:30.240
Yeah.

592
00:30:30.240 --> 00:30:30.839
Yeah.

593
00:30:30.900 --> 00:30:33.539
Like everybody else can make prophecies as well.

594
00:30:33.599 --> 00:30:36.480
But one thing I did pick up this time is the fact that he fell

595
00:30:36.480 --> 00:30:40.559
through like his temporal shift, took him to the time war to get

596
00:30:40.559 --> 00:30:44.099
Davros out of that situation, which I never really had picked up

597
00:30:44.099 --> 00:30:44.460
on before.

598
00:30:44.519 --> 00:30:45.720
So it was quite interesting.

599
00:30:45.779 --> 00:30:50.880
I love the way Nick delivers that line where he says, I...

600
00:30:50.940 --> 00:30:53.400
It's so fun, isn't it?

601
00:30:53.460 --> 00:30:56.579
And he, I reckon they sell that he can do prophecies because of

602
00:30:56.579 --> 00:31:00.359
the weird relationship he's had with time. he's gone into this odd

603
00:31:00.359 --> 00:31:01.500
space-time event.

604
00:31:01.559 --> 00:31:09.059
And but then the fact that he flew back into the time war, rescued

605
00:31:09.059 --> 00:31:13.440
Davros so he could use Davros to destroy all the Daleks.

606
00:31:13.740 --> 00:31:15.180
Yes.

607
00:31:15.240 --> 00:31:18.240
I have to say that I think about time is right about this.

608
00:31:18.299 --> 00:31:20.339
It is one hell of a baroque plan.

609
00:31:20.400 --> 00:31:22.319
So he rescues Davros.

610
00:31:23.160 --> 00:31:30.720
And Davros then creates 100s of 1000s of Daleks so that Dalek Khan

611
00:31:30.720 --> 00:31:34.859
can destroy them all, you know, because they're bad, it does seem

612
00:31:34.859 --> 00:31:38.220
like he could have just stopped before step one of that plan.

613
00:31:38.220 --> 00:31:42.000
And back out without saving... right.

614
00:31:42.059 --> 00:31:43.799
And everything would have been fine.

615
00:31:43.859 --> 00:31:46.500
It was just so he could get the last giggle.

616
00:31:49.559 --> 00:31:52.980
Yeah, look, I'm not sure that that revelation quite works.

617
00:31:53.039 --> 00:31:56.220
It was Dalek Khan, who'd realised that we were all bad.

618
00:31:56.279 --> 00:32:00.420
You know, the 2nd cult of Scaro guy just sort of suddenly say

619
00:32:00.420 --> 00:32:02.880
actually, Daleks are not such a great idea.

620
00:32:03.480 --> 00:32:07.019
Without him, we wouldn't have that incredible prop and that

621
00:32:07.019 --> 00:32:09.660
amazing puppet and the incredible performance.

622
00:32:09.720 --> 00:32:14.039
And he pre-steals John Hurtz lines from Day with the Doctor.

623
00:32:14.099 --> 00:32:14.700
Yes.

624
00:32:14.759 --> 00:32:17.220
He says no more, doesn't he?

625
00:32:17.279 --> 00:32:19.799
He sees the Daleks and says no more.

626
00:32:19.859 --> 00:32:25.079
And I have to think that Moffat told that because he, I think he

627
00:32:25.079 --> 00:32:26.819
loves Russell's Doctor Who.

628
00:32:27.000 --> 00:32:31.319
And that story is a response to Russell's Doctor Who, the day of

629
00:32:31.319 --> 00:32:35.220
the Doctor, is very much about how Russell had brought the show

630
00:32:35.220 --> 00:32:35.460
back.

631
00:32:35.519 --> 00:32:36.839
Oh yeah, totally.

632
00:32:36.900 --> 00:32:38.160
So I think that's deliberate.

633
00:32:38.279 --> 00:32:40.200
I'm going to, I'm going to believe that anyway.

634
00:32:40.259 --> 00:32:43.980
And it fits still so, because the cult of Scaro were meant to be

635
00:32:43.980 --> 00:32:44.640
the thinkers.

636
00:32:44.700 --> 00:32:47.700
And so you had Dalek Sec, who was thinking of one way of

637
00:32:47.700 --> 00:32:48.960
progressing the Dalek race.

638
00:32:49.019 --> 00:32:52.019
This is Dalek Khan, who's been through all that, thinking about

639
00:32:52.019 --> 00:32:55.500
where is this going to end up and coming to really the only

640
00:32:55.500 --> 00:32:56.640
conclusion that he could?

641
00:33:02.700 --> 00:33:06.839
Of course, the image which these episodes of building 2 is all of

642
00:33:06.839 --> 00:33:09.960
our favourites standing around the TARDIS console triumphantly.

643
00:33:10.019 --> 00:33:11.220
It's just irresistible.

644
00:33:11.339 --> 00:33:16.619
Um, and I've read criticisms of, you know, how can the TARDIS too

645
00:33:16.619 --> 00:33:17.819
the Earth home and things like that?

646
00:33:17.880 --> 00:33:19.319
And I mean, who cares?

647
00:33:19.740 --> 00:33:24.779
Kill the Moon, I think, is criticised correctly for its ridiculous

648
00:33:24.779 --> 00:33:28.500
science, because it's in service to an equally stupid plot, and

649
00:33:28.500 --> 00:33:30.299
that's the reason no one likes technobabble.

650
00:33:30.359 --> 00:33:33.900
But here we don't care because the science is dodgy because it's

651
00:33:33.900 --> 00:33:34.500
not important.

652
00:33:34.559 --> 00:33:37.200
The emotional payoff is all we care about here.

653
00:33:37.259 --> 00:33:40.440
And that image of everyone triumphantly working together and

654
00:33:40.440 --> 00:33:44.400
having a laugh and, you know, basically ending the plot on a

655
00:33:44.400 --> 00:33:46.019
positive note is all we need.

656
00:33:46.079 --> 00:33:47.880
No, no, not you, Jackie.

657
00:33:47.940 --> 00:33:51.960
Oh my god, I love that so much. just stay there.

658
00:33:52.920 --> 00:33:57.240
That scene is filled with beauty because you've got Jackie who's

659
00:33:57.240 --> 00:33:58.140
laughing about that.

660
00:33:58.200 --> 00:34:00.839
She takes it in good humour and she giggles with the others.

661
00:34:00.900 --> 00:34:04.559
You got Martha looking directly down the camera when she does her

662
00:34:04.559 --> 00:34:04.740
thing.

663
00:34:04.799 --> 00:34:06.180
She's inviting the audience in.

664
00:34:06.240 --> 00:34:07.019
It's great.

665
00:34:07.079 --> 00:34:12.000
And and the wonderful thing where um, I think Jack is hugging

666
00:34:12.000 --> 00:34:15.000
Sarah, and Donna just pushes Sarah out of the way.

667
00:34:15.360 --> 00:34:19.500
Shot goes in. flying across the console room.

668
00:34:19.559 --> 00:34:21.059
It's so good.

669
00:34:21.119 --> 00:34:24.719
It's Donna's little comment, Jack, I think you're the best.

670
00:34:24.780 --> 00:34:26.880
Yes, you're doing a very good job.

671
00:34:26.940 --> 00:34:31.260
But I just love the fact that it's a new thing to the TARDIS that

672
00:34:31.260 --> 00:34:35.159
it's supposed to have all these people operating it to make it fly

673
00:34:35.159 --> 00:34:35.760
correctly.

674
00:34:35.820 --> 00:34:40.559
It's just, it's just a lovely new element and and, and in that

675
00:34:40.559 --> 00:34:43.860
also, Rose and the doctor get to talk to Gwen Cooper and, and are

676
00:34:43.860 --> 00:34:47.039
you from an old Cardiff family, like just a little nugget in there

677
00:34:47.039 --> 00:34:48.000
back to series one?

678
00:34:48.059 --> 00:34:50.400
That's a new adventures reference, isn't it?

679
00:34:50.460 --> 00:34:54.300
I think Gareth Roberts invents the idea that the TARDIS should

680
00:34:54.300 --> 00:34:56.519
have more than you should have 6 pilots.

681
00:34:57.059 --> 00:35:02.099
So it had been in the new adventures, but here's what I think is

682
00:35:02.099 --> 00:35:07.079
interesting is that set is deliberately huge, when it's 1st

683
00:35:07.079 --> 00:35:10.679
introduced, and it's deliberately huge in order to make it clear

684
00:35:10.679 --> 00:35:12.780
how lonely the doctor is.

685
00:35:12.840 --> 00:35:17.280
You know, the doctor is by himself in this massive cavernous space

686
00:35:17.280 --> 00:35:20.699
and travelling all the way on his own.

687
00:35:20.760 --> 00:35:25.559
And in that scene, that's a response to that idea, isn't it?

688
00:35:25.619 --> 00:35:31.320
The room is now full of people laughing and enjoying themselves

689
00:35:31.320 --> 00:35:33.780
people who love the doctor and who the doctor loves.

690
00:35:33.900 --> 00:35:36.420
They give Sarah that wonderful line.

691
00:35:36.480 --> 00:35:39.420
You know, you act like such a lonely man, but you've got the

692
00:35:39.420 --> 00:35:40.800
biggest family in the universe.

693
00:35:40.860 --> 00:35:42.780
It's so good.

694
00:35:42.840 --> 00:35:44.940
I cry for the last 10 minutes of this episode.

695
00:35:45.000 --> 00:35:47.039
Yeah, he hasn't created soldiers.

696
00:35:47.099 --> 00:35:48.059
He's created family.

697
00:35:48.119 --> 00:35:48.659
Yeah.

698
00:35:48.719 --> 00:35:52.380
And all the fireworks are spontaneous fireworks around the world.

699
00:35:54.659 --> 00:35:57.480
And Worth returns to proper police.

700
00:35:59.099 --> 00:36:03.000
And that's the joy, Doctor Who, that humour that...

701
00:36:03.119 --> 00:36:07.260
But yes, the towing, the towing the earth back is perfect.

702
00:36:07.260 --> 00:36:10.739
And it happens for plot and emotional reasons.

703
00:36:10.800 --> 00:36:14.219
They use the magnetron to return the other...

704
00:36:14.280 --> 00:36:16.079
I think they literally call it the magnetron.

705
00:36:16.139 --> 00:36:19.500
They use the magnitron to return the other 26 planets and guess

706
00:36:19.500 --> 00:36:20.699
which planet is left.

707
00:36:20.760 --> 00:36:24.179
You know, it has to be Earth so that we can tow it home

708
00:36:24.179 --> 00:36:24.659
ourselves.

709
00:36:24.719 --> 00:36:25.559
It's glory.

710
00:36:25.619 --> 00:36:28.380
Is Magatron not the thing that Ian and Barbara came across in the

711
00:36:28.380 --> 00:36:29.579
Skaro jungle?

712
00:36:30.300 --> 00:36:32.280
the Magnodon.

713
00:36:32.639 --> 00:36:37.079
No, it's what the time lord is used to move the earth and its

714
00:36:37.079 --> 00:36:40.199
entire constellation across the galaxy.

715
00:36:40.199 --> 00:36:41.460
Magnetron?

716
00:36:41.519 --> 00:36:41.880
Yeah.

717
00:36:42.300 --> 00:36:44.340
Just wonderful.

718
00:36:44.400 --> 00:36:45.360
It's such a great scene.

719
00:36:45.420 --> 00:36:46.679
And it's that thing.

720
00:36:46.739 --> 00:36:51.599
There seems to be this sort of constant fear of Doctor Who going

721
00:36:51.599 --> 00:36:53.699
too big and being too exciting.

722
00:36:53.760 --> 00:36:58.619
No, you know, we can't have the Tartars towing the earth back into

723
00:36:58.619 --> 00:37:02.940
its proper place because that's too much fun and simply too

724
00:37:02.940 --> 00:37:03.659
exciting.

725
00:37:03.719 --> 00:37:07.380
And the TARDIS can't do that because even though it's completely

726
00:37:07.380 --> 00:37:12.599
made up, I know exactly how it works, you know, like it's it's a

727
00:37:12.599 --> 00:37:14.280
terrible instinct, I think.

728
00:37:14.340 --> 00:37:16.679
That's why I'm not Showrunner.

729
00:37:20.099 --> 00:37:22.920
Oh boy.

730
00:37:22.980 --> 00:37:25.440
And then you get all those farewells.

731
00:37:25.559 --> 00:37:33.960
Outside the Tartars, with Sarah, um, And Mickey, saying goodbye to

732
00:37:33.960 --> 00:37:35.940
Jackie as well inside, you know?

733
00:37:36.000 --> 00:37:40.019
Yeah. and and the whole Martha, Jack, and Mickey thing.

734
00:37:40.079 --> 00:37:42.239
I just had tears watching it, you know?

735
00:37:42.300 --> 00:37:45.780
Um, I can't, were they all going to be in tortured?

736
00:37:45.840 --> 00:37:46.260
Was that the plan?

737
00:37:46.320 --> 00:37:48.719
Certainly Mickey was, wasn't he, James?

738
00:37:48.840 --> 00:37:52.079
I think they all were in Children of Earth, yeah.

739
00:37:52.139 --> 00:37:55.920
Yeah, there was there was a plan behind that, yeah.

740
00:37:56.219 --> 00:38:02.280
I think it didn't happen because that's when Noel's career really

741
00:38:02.280 --> 00:38:04.260
takes off in a huge way.

742
00:38:04.320 --> 00:38:05.219
Like, isn't it?

743
00:38:05.280 --> 00:38:10.559
Like he'd had some success with, um, kidulthood.

744
00:38:10.679 --> 00:38:14.460
And then, and then like he was incredibly busy.

745
00:38:14.519 --> 00:38:17.699
So that's why that didn't happen, I believe.

746
00:38:17.820 --> 00:38:22.260
And does Chibnell poach Martha for Law and Order UK, which is why

747
00:38:22.260 --> 00:38:24.599
we get the lowest character in children of Earth?

748
00:38:24.659 --> 00:38:28.079
Like, I think I think Martha would have done that.

749
00:38:28.139 --> 00:38:29.940
So that was that was the idea of that.

750
00:38:30.000 --> 00:38:37.079
But I love that we got a chance to see Mickey and Jackie properly

751
00:38:37.079 --> 00:38:40.800
interacting as well because I think this is a thing about this

752
00:38:40.800 --> 00:38:44.280
episode, Nathan, you don't see Mickey and Rose at all.

753
00:38:44.340 --> 00:38:45.900
They barely share a line.

754
00:38:45.960 --> 00:38:47.519
It's all Mickey and Jackie.

755
00:38:47.579 --> 00:38:49.800
But that's the important relationships.

756
00:38:49.860 --> 00:38:50.940
Yes, isn't it?

757
00:38:51.000 --> 00:38:52.019
It's so important.

758
00:38:52.079 --> 00:38:58.800
Remember how lost Jackie is without Mickey in Love and Monsters.

759
00:38:58.860 --> 00:39:01.500
Like, obviously, she misses Rose.

760
00:39:01.559 --> 00:39:07.619
Because Rose is away, but she's lost Mickey kind of permanently at

761
00:39:07.619 --> 00:39:08.159
that point.

762
00:39:08.219 --> 00:39:11.699
And, you know, she tells Elton about him.

763
00:39:11.760 --> 00:39:18.360
And even the where's Mickey question that Jackie asks at the end

764
00:39:18.360 --> 00:39:23.940
of the age of steel when Mickey doesn't come back, and their

765
00:39:23.940 --> 00:39:27.659
relationship in aliens of London and World War 3, where they go

766
00:39:27.659 --> 00:39:30.539
from this antagonism to being really close.

767
00:39:30.599 --> 00:39:36.480
You know, where where Mickey says to Jackie stopped me, you know

768
00:39:36.480 --> 00:39:41.219
like I won't send these missiles towards Rose and the Doctor, if

769
00:39:41.219 --> 00:39:43.079
you stop me, you know, they're there together.

770
00:39:43.139 --> 00:39:46.800
And that relationship, I think, is absolutely underestimated.

771
00:39:46.860 --> 00:39:49.320
The beginning of Christmas invasion, you know, like all of it.

772
00:39:49.440 --> 00:39:52.800
And they share Doctor Who's 1st cliffhanger of the new era

773
00:39:52.800 --> 00:39:53.340
together.

774
00:39:53.400 --> 00:39:56.219
And let's not forget, they've come a long way since that entire

775
00:39:56.219 --> 00:39:59.400
year when Jackie accused Mickey of murdering Rose.

776
00:40:00.780 --> 00:40:04.619
The fact that he says, I'm going to miss you more than anyone.

777
00:40:04.679 --> 00:40:05.820
Yeah.

778
00:40:05.880 --> 00:40:07.199
And he means Rose.

779
00:40:07.260 --> 00:40:07.739
Yeah.

780
00:40:07.800 --> 00:40:09.000
It's just brilliant.

781
00:40:09.059 --> 00:40:13.800
And then Jackie just gets one of the most fantastic lines, bloody

782
00:40:13.800 --> 00:40:14.519
Norway.

783
00:40:15.420 --> 00:40:20.219
So after we drop everyone off, we're in Bad Wolf Bay, right?

784
00:40:20.280 --> 00:40:26.579
And that, for me, like my favourite line from Jackie there is

785
00:40:26.579 --> 00:40:31.139
where she calls the doctor a plum because she tricks him into

786
00:40:31.139 --> 00:40:36.360
thinking that the baby that she was pregnant with in doomsday, that

787
00:40:36.360 --> 00:40:38.099
she named him the doctor.

788
00:40:38.280 --> 00:40:41.940
And then he believes her and then she makes fun of it, which is

789
00:40:41.940 --> 00:40:42.599
just wonderful.

790
00:40:42.659 --> 00:40:45.480
You know, that's what Don has been doing all season.

791
00:40:45.539 --> 00:40:47.280
And of course, Jackie can do it.

792
00:40:47.280 --> 00:40:50.880
After he got the upper hand in the Tartars console room, she gets

793
00:40:50.880 --> 00:40:52.679
to make fun of him.

794
00:40:52.739 --> 00:40:56.760
You know, he might be good at Tartars consoles, but she's much

795
00:40:56.760 --> 00:40:58.320
better at people than he is.

796
00:40:58.380 --> 00:41:02.280
That's true What do we think of that scene?

797
00:41:02.340 --> 00:41:07.079
The final resolution with the Rose and the other doctor?

798
00:41:07.440 --> 00:41:10.079
Billy Piper hated it, didn't she?

799
00:41:10.139 --> 00:41:16.380
Because she'd been lumbered with an inferior, an inferior copy of

800
00:41:16.380 --> 00:41:16.980
the doctor.

801
00:41:17.039 --> 00:41:20.820
I mean, saying she hated it, maybe overstating a little bit, but

802
00:41:20.820 --> 00:41:23.159
she's definitely on record saying she didn't feel it.

803
00:41:23.219 --> 00:41:24.840
She didn't.

804
00:41:24.900 --> 00:41:27.119
It felt like Rose had had sloppy seconds.

805
00:41:27.179 --> 00:41:31.739
Yeah, but she, um, she felt that it wasn't, it wasn't right for

806
00:41:31.739 --> 00:41:32.460
the character.

807
00:41:32.519 --> 00:41:38.579
It was a disservice to the character of Rose and of the doctor and

808
00:41:38.579 --> 00:41:42.300
their relationship that, you know, she got palmed off with this

809
00:41:42.300 --> 00:41:47.579
broken, sort of 2nd hand, poorly copied version.

810
00:41:47.639 --> 00:41:52.440
We talked earlier in this episode about the fact that Rose does

811
00:41:52.440 --> 00:41:57.780
rescue the doctor in some ways like she did with Eccleston back at

812
00:41:57.780 --> 00:41:58.980
the beginning of the series.

813
00:41:59.099 --> 00:42:03.059
But it felt to me a little bit, like Rose had had her agency

814
00:42:03.059 --> 00:42:06.780
removed, but the doctor sort of deciding what she needed and what

815
00:42:06.780 --> 00:42:07.320
was right for her.

816
00:42:07.380 --> 00:42:11.519
Um, almost like sort of Susan, you know, 50 years earlier.

817
00:42:11.579 --> 00:42:12.719
He's very into that this season.

818
00:42:12.780 --> 00:42:14.940
He does it to Donna as well.

819
00:42:15.000 --> 00:42:16.199
We'll get to that.

820
00:42:16.260 --> 00:42:20.639
But I think, you know, like it's not entirely clear.

821
00:42:20.699 --> 00:42:26.159
I guess that Rose and Jackie have to go back to the parallel world

822
00:42:26.159 --> 00:42:29.579
whereas before they were trapped, this time we have a choice, but

823
00:42:29.579 --> 00:42:30.900
only for a short period of time.

824
00:42:32.039 --> 00:42:36.119
And they have to go back because that's where Tony and Pete are

825
00:42:36.960 --> 00:42:37.739
where home is now.

826
00:42:37.800 --> 00:42:40.139
Yeah, that's where that's where they live.

827
00:42:40.199 --> 00:42:45.360
So it's not quite, I think the job, I think the problem is the

828
00:42:45.360 --> 00:42:49.320
doctor just assuming that it's Rose's job to fix him, you know

829
00:42:49.320 --> 00:42:53.219
that a woman's job is partly to fix a broken man, you know.

830
00:42:53.280 --> 00:42:55.739
And I'm not sure that's all that good.

831
00:42:55.800 --> 00:42:59.820
That's very Moffat conception of a woman's role, isn't it?

832
00:42:59.940 --> 00:43:00.960
Well, I don't know.

833
00:43:01.019 --> 00:43:02.940
I think Moffat's been unfair, James.

834
00:43:03.840 --> 00:43:07.860
I think that Moffatt's ideas about men and women are more complex

835
00:43:07.860 --> 00:43:10.139
than that and that he's more likely to critique.

836
00:43:10.199 --> 00:43:12.840
I'm just being a bit, he's more likely to critique that position.

837
00:43:12.900 --> 00:43:14.880
Todd, what do you think about it?

838
00:43:15.179 --> 00:43:18.960
At the time, I was okay.

839
00:43:19.019 --> 00:43:21.780
Like, what are you going to do with this other doctor?

840
00:43:21.780 --> 00:43:24.059
And it was sort of a resolution.

841
00:43:24.119 --> 00:43:30.179
Um, she gets a doctor of sorts and I don't hate it.

842
00:43:30.239 --> 00:43:32.159
I know, particularly love it.

843
00:43:32.280 --> 00:43:35.699
It's a resolution to her character.

844
00:43:35.760 --> 00:43:36.960
What else is her character going to do?

845
00:43:37.019 --> 00:43:39.960
Is she going to reject her mother and that world and stay on this

846
00:43:39.960 --> 00:43:42.900
world and travel with the doctor, but she can't because she's off

847
00:43:42.900 --> 00:43:44.940
being famous and doing other things.

848
00:43:45.059 --> 00:43:47.940
So, we have to come up with something that's half reasonable.

849
00:43:47.940 --> 00:43:51.480
And, I think it's at least half reasonable and I'm okay with

850
00:43:51.480 --> 00:43:51.659
that.

851
00:43:51.719 --> 00:43:57.360
If she does get a doctor who can say that he loves her, even

852
00:43:57.360 --> 00:43:59.280
though for some reason...

853
00:43:59.280 --> 00:44:00.960
Because Doctor Who can never say that.

854
00:44:01.019 --> 00:44:03.780
I don't know why we don't show that on screen because that would

855
00:44:03.780 --> 00:44:04.739
have been surprising.

856
00:44:04.800 --> 00:44:06.179
I think they sort of shied back.

857
00:44:06.239 --> 00:44:07.739
I mean, there's no way.

858
00:44:07.800 --> 00:44:11.039
There's no other way of reading that whispering into her ear.

859
00:44:11.099 --> 00:44:12.599
So why not just say it?

860
00:44:12.659 --> 00:44:14.579
You know, Yeah, no, I...

861
00:44:14.639 --> 00:44:17.099
And if he'd said it, then it would have really made a clear

862
00:44:17.099 --> 00:44:20.519
distinction between the doctor. rather than having to whisper

863
00:44:20.519 --> 00:44:21.599
sweet nothings.

864
00:44:21.659 --> 00:44:23.280
I think it would have been perfect.

865
00:44:23.400 --> 00:44:25.380
In fact, I think it would have sold it. lot more.

866
00:44:25.440 --> 00:44:26.579
Yeah.

867
00:44:26.579 --> 00:44:32.699
I just think that doomsday is so easy to understand.

868
00:44:32.760 --> 00:44:36.480
It's like 2 people who can't be together for whatever reason.

869
00:44:36.719 --> 00:44:39.960
And that's what happens all the time.

870
00:44:40.019 --> 00:44:42.119
Whereas what exactly is going on?

871
00:44:42.179 --> 00:44:46.139
This is just like when you break up with your boyfriend and spend

872
00:44:46.139 --> 00:44:50.280
some time apart and then there's an identical version of that

873
00:44:50.280 --> 00:44:54.840
boyfriend who comes back and lives with you or something.

874
00:44:54.900 --> 00:44:56.099
Do you know what I mean?

875
00:44:56.159 --> 00:44:58.739
Like, it's just got no real world analogue. impossible to

876
00:44:58.739 --> 00:45:00.780
understand how you would feel about that.

877
00:45:00.840 --> 00:45:02.699
So what do you do with it?

878
00:45:02.760 --> 00:45:05.699
You can understand doomsday but I can't understand these.

879
00:45:05.760 --> 00:45:08.940
It could be like Troy and the 2 Rikers on...

880
00:45:08.940 --> 00:45:12.599
Star Trek, the next generation.

881
00:45:12.659 --> 00:45:14.159
Second chances.

882
00:45:15.059 --> 00:45:18.900
I think it's a problem with Rose coming back.

883
00:45:18.960 --> 00:45:21.900
I mean, obviously Rose had to come back because she's an intrinsic

884
00:45:21.900 --> 00:45:22.739
member of the team.

885
00:45:22.800 --> 00:45:25.500
Billy Piper was so popular. totally get that.

886
00:45:25.559 --> 00:45:29.039
But the character story was complete with Doomsday.

887
00:45:29.099 --> 00:45:31.980
And so you've got to bring it back and resolve it in a different

888
00:45:31.980 --> 00:45:33.780
way, which doesn't work as well.

889
00:45:33.840 --> 00:45:34.500
No.

890
00:45:34.619 --> 00:45:38.760
It might have been a better idea not to go back to Bad Wolf Bay.

891
00:45:38.880 --> 00:45:40.800
Do you know what I mean?

892
00:45:40.860 --> 00:45:45.000
Just, I don't know. somehow making it more different because it

893
00:45:45.000 --> 00:45:50.519
just seems like a slightly weird and overly complex version of the

894
00:45:50.519 --> 00:45:51.539
end of doomsday.

895
00:45:52.139 --> 00:45:56.940
And also on a production level, Bad Wolfbade doesn't look nearly

896
00:45:56.940 --> 00:45:59.579
as good because last time it was shot in the middle of winter and

897
00:45:59.579 --> 00:46:00.840
this time it's shot in the middle of summer.

898
00:46:01.440 --> 00:46:06.599
So is that that could be read in a way as being a positive thing.

899
00:46:06.659 --> 00:46:11.219
You know, like the weather is good because it's a more positive

900
00:46:11.219 --> 00:46:12.360
ending for the character.

901
00:46:12.480 --> 00:46:15.059
She's not heartbroken stuck in another universe.

902
00:46:15.179 --> 00:46:18.119
She's in another universe with a copy of the doctor.

903
00:46:18.179 --> 00:46:22.079
Yeah, but also just looks like a beach in Cardiff now.

904
00:46:32.039 --> 00:46:34.199
And so, I guess...

905
00:46:34.199 --> 00:46:38.340
We need to talk about the very end and what happens to Donna.

906
00:46:38.400 --> 00:46:42.119
I'm not on board with the normal reading of this, I think.

907
00:46:42.239 --> 00:46:47.639
I am a lot less negative towards the doctor's actions here than

908
00:46:47.639 --> 00:46:49.019
some people are.

909
00:46:49.079 --> 00:46:50.519
See, I think you're wrong.

910
00:46:50.579 --> 00:46:51.539
It's a violation.

911
00:46:51.659 --> 00:46:54.900
He steals her agency and then kills her.

912
00:46:55.019 --> 00:46:57.480
I've not forgiven Russell.

913
00:46:57.539 --> 00:46:58.559
I've still not forgiven Russell.

914
00:46:58.619 --> 00:47:01.019
But he has to for plot reasons.

915
00:47:01.079 --> 00:47:02.880
She is going to die if he doesn't.

916
00:47:02.940 --> 00:47:04.019
That she could choose to die.

917
00:47:04.079 --> 00:47:06.239
And she would have chosen to die.

918
00:47:06.300 --> 00:47:09.360
But you see, I think you do intervene in people's decisions to

919
00:47:09.360 --> 00:47:09.599
die.

920
00:47:09.659 --> 00:47:11.280
I think that's precisely what you do.

921
00:47:11.400 --> 00:47:13.980
When someone is choosing to die.

922
00:47:14.039 --> 00:47:15.179
You do intervene in it.

923
00:47:15.239 --> 00:47:22.199
And I also think too, that both the doctor and Donna know what the

924
00:47:22.199 --> 00:47:23.639
consequences are.

925
00:47:23.699 --> 00:47:25.139
Do you know what I mean?

926
00:47:25.199 --> 00:47:28.139
Like both of them know what's going to happen.

927
00:47:28.199 --> 00:47:32.159
Both of them know what the doctor can do.

928
00:47:32.219 --> 00:47:36.539
And this isn't a situation where someone more powerful is imposing

929
00:47:36.539 --> 00:47:44.460
there. their wishes on someone else because the 2 of them are

930
00:47:44.460 --> 00:47:46.980
equal and that's what the whole episode's been about.

931
00:47:48.360 --> 00:47:51.599
Like, I don't want to be in a position where I say she could have

932
00:47:51.599 --> 00:47:53.340
fought back. if she didn't want it to happen.

933
00:47:53.400 --> 00:47:56.760
Um, because that's that's bad.

934
00:47:57.420 --> 00:48:01.920
There's actually in one of those deleted scenes, there is actually

935
00:48:01.920 --> 00:48:07.980
a line, it's really on the nose line where she says, like the

936
00:48:07.980 --> 00:48:10.800
doctor, the doctor and Donna travelling through the universe

937
00:48:10.800 --> 00:48:16.079
together forever as equals, and that's what he needs, an equal.

938
00:48:16.260 --> 00:48:20.400
I think that it's more complex than that, and I don't think that

939
00:48:20.400 --> 00:48:22.739
what the doctor does is obviously wrong.

940
00:48:23.219 --> 00:48:25.440
Because he doesn't want to do it.

941
00:48:25.500 --> 00:48:27.420
He doesn't do it for his own satisfaction.

942
00:48:27.480 --> 00:48:30.420
He doesn't do it because he's going to benefit from it.

943
00:48:30.599 --> 00:48:33.840
He does it for her.

944
00:48:33.900 --> 00:48:42.000
Um, and I think, you know, that that in a situation where someone

945
00:48:42.000 --> 00:48:46.440
is, I don't know, it's complicated and I guess it's meant to be

946
00:48:46.440 --> 00:48:46.980
complicated.

947
00:48:47.039 --> 00:48:48.539
I don't think it's obviously wrong.

948
00:48:48.599 --> 00:48:50.880
I think you intervene when someone is trying to kill themselves

949
00:48:50.880 --> 00:48:52.500
ordinarily.

950
00:48:52.559 --> 00:48:54.840
He's doing it to save her pain.

951
00:48:54.900 --> 00:48:58.559
She she knows what the situation is and she knows that this is the

952
00:48:58.559 --> 00:49:02.280
only recourse, otherwise she'll die, but it's too painful to take

953
00:49:02.280 --> 00:49:05.340
that step because she knows what she's going to lose.

954
00:49:05.400 --> 00:49:07.320
So, it's euthanasia.

955
00:49:07.380 --> 00:49:08.760
Yeah, but that's different, I think.

956
00:49:08.820 --> 00:49:09.599
That is different.

957
00:49:09.659 --> 00:49:14.219
And we don't think of euthanasia as acceptable in every

958
00:49:14.219 --> 00:49:15.239
circumstance.

959
00:49:15.300 --> 00:49:16.320
Do you know what I mean?

960
00:49:16.380 --> 00:49:19.559
And we certainly wouldn't want someone who was suffering from

961
00:49:19.559 --> 00:49:22.739
depression to rock up to dignitas and get themselves off.

962
00:49:22.800 --> 00:49:28.679
You know, like it's not, it's, it's just not 100% clear that the

963
00:49:28.679 --> 00:49:30.719
doctor's doing something terribly wrong.

964
00:49:31.380 --> 00:49:36.059
But then we see the consequences of it.

965
00:49:36.119 --> 00:49:40.380
And the consequences of it are so brutal to watch. so painful.

966
00:49:40.440 --> 00:49:48.300
Oh, and the way that Sylvia and Wolf react, Sylvia does not

967
00:49:48.300 --> 00:49:48.780
forgive him.

968
00:49:48.840 --> 00:49:50.699
She tells him to get out. twice.

969
00:49:50.760 --> 00:49:52.920
Yeah, you've killed my daughter.

970
00:49:52.980 --> 00:49:58.139
You know, like, and Will says, she doesn't say that, but Will says

971
00:49:58.139 --> 00:50:00.300
she was better when she was with you.

972
00:50:00.420 --> 00:50:04.440
And there's this whole sort of, I mean, the character is dead.

973
00:50:04.500 --> 00:50:05.099
She's dead.

974
00:50:05.159 --> 00:50:06.840
Well, no, she isn't though.

975
00:50:06.900 --> 00:50:08.820
I think that's wrong because she's there.

976
00:50:08.880 --> 00:50:10.199
She's alive and breathing.

977
00:50:10.260 --> 00:50:13.320
She's the same Donna that we 1st met.

978
00:50:13.380 --> 00:50:17.340
And remember that that donor isn't that terrible.

979
00:50:17.400 --> 00:50:21.900
And that's, you know, the choice that the script makes in order to

980
00:50:21.900 --> 00:50:27.000
play up the doctor's loss and Donna's loss is to make her super

981
00:50:27.000 --> 00:50:27.719
trivial.

982
00:50:27.780 --> 00:50:30.480
Like she's having these sort of dumb phone conversations and stuff

983
00:50:30.480 --> 00:50:30.900
like that.

984
00:50:30.960 --> 00:50:34.619
And we see her just ignoring the doctor and that's super painful

985
00:50:34.619 --> 00:50:35.400
to watch as well.

986
00:50:35.460 --> 00:50:38.159
But she's alive.

987
00:50:38.219 --> 00:50:41.699
And just because Dalek Khan says that one of the faithful

988
00:50:41.699 --> 00:50:42.599
companions will die.

989
00:50:42.659 --> 00:50:45.000
Well, that was kind of a fake out and he's a Dalek.

990
00:50:45.179 --> 00:50:46.139
We can't trust him.

991
00:50:46.199 --> 00:50:49.500
That's right, and characters don't exist in limbo, just because

992
00:50:49.500 --> 00:50:53.760
she is regressed, being regressed to the point she was in Runaway

993
00:50:53.760 --> 00:50:57.480
Bride doesn't mean that she's now not going to go on and learn and

994
00:50:57.480 --> 00:51:01.500
become a better person and have a better Sylvia and a more kind of

995
00:51:01.500 --> 00:51:04.559
understanding wolf, you know, of what she's been through to kind

996
00:51:04.559 --> 00:51:05.940
of guide her and influence her.

997
00:51:06.000 --> 00:51:09.420
And we'll see when she comes back in the end of time, that she is

998
00:51:09.420 --> 00:51:14.039
a less trivial, less boisterous version of herself.

999
00:51:14.099 --> 00:51:15.000
She has developed.

1000
00:51:15.059 --> 00:51:18.659
She just hasn't developed in necessarily the way that we saw and

1001
00:51:18.659 --> 00:51:19.260
enjoyed.

1002
00:51:19.320 --> 00:51:21.480
We'll get that to that in about 6 months time.

1003
00:51:22.980 --> 00:51:25.440
And I agree with you, Peter.

1004
00:51:25.500 --> 00:51:29.699
I think, although we have the loss of this character, and there is

1005
00:51:29.699 --> 00:51:35.400
really no choice to be made, um, There's the potential that she

1006
00:51:35.400 --> 00:51:39.059
can grow and she can learn and she can become a better person, may

1007
00:51:39.059 --> 00:51:42.960
not be the same person that she ended up being with the doctor, but

1008
00:51:42.960 --> 00:51:44.340
there is that potential there.

1009
00:51:44.400 --> 00:51:49.019
I mean, it's absolutely heartbreaking and very affecting and, and

1010
00:51:49.019 --> 00:51:53.039
you know, as it was happening, like, I always think back to my

1011
00:51:53.039 --> 00:51:58.320
reaction to Janie and Zoe at the end of, um, the war games, and in

1012
00:51:58.320 --> 00:52:02.940
particular, not to lessen Zoe's time with the doctor, but in

1013
00:52:02.940 --> 00:52:07.139
particular, Janie, who has come, his growth has been amazing.

1014
00:52:07.199 --> 00:52:10.139
He will never remember Victoria, probably the closest relationship

1015
00:52:10.139 --> 00:52:15.960
he had with anybody, and as a child, as a teenager, whenever that

1016
00:52:15.960 --> 00:52:18.239
was one of the most affecting things ever.

1017
00:52:18.300 --> 00:52:23.219
Like for me, I was so just totally and utterly devastated by that

1018
00:52:23.219 --> 00:52:25.079
and the same feeling with this year.

1019
00:52:25.139 --> 00:52:28.199
And yet as an adult, you think about Jamie.

1020
00:52:28.260 --> 00:52:31.199
You think, yes, that's terribly sad, but you also think he had

1021
00:52:31.199 --> 00:52:35.099
that capacity to grow, and he had that capacity to care, and you

1022
00:52:35.099 --> 00:52:37.739
just know that he's going to go on and have a different, but

1023
00:52:37.739 --> 00:52:40.440
equally fulfilling life because that's who he is.

1024
00:52:40.500 --> 00:52:42.719
Or gets killed on a battlefield.

1025
00:52:43.199 --> 00:52:44.639
No.

1026
00:52:44.699 --> 00:52:46.199
The doctor saved him.

1027
00:52:46.260 --> 00:52:51.059
But I love the fact that both through this awful event, Sylvia has

1028
00:52:51.059 --> 00:52:54.480
grown and will grow and her character will change and she will be

1029
00:52:54.480 --> 00:52:56.400
a better mother and a better daughter.

1030
00:52:56.460 --> 00:53:01.139
And Wolf is always as he was even more so with more heart.

1031
00:53:01.199 --> 00:53:04.800
And if that's a positive out of takeout of this, then that's what

1032
00:53:04.800 --> 00:53:05.460
I take out of it.

1033
00:53:05.519 --> 00:53:09.239
And I'm so glad, James, that in 6 months' time we get to see Donna

1034
00:53:09.239 --> 00:53:13.980
again, and we can see some sort of positive rather than just being

1035
00:53:13.980 --> 00:53:18.000
left at this point where, you know, for her anyway.

1036
00:53:18.059 --> 00:53:20.340
It's it's not a good place.

1037
00:53:20.400 --> 00:53:24.239
At this point, remember that we were going to have a scene where

1038
00:53:24.239 --> 00:53:30.659
Donna heard the Tartar steam materialise and she sort of

1039
00:53:30.659 --> 00:53:33.780
recognises it or seems to be struggling to remember what it is or

1040
00:53:33.780 --> 00:53:35.400
something, but then dismisses it.

1041
00:53:35.460 --> 00:53:38.699
And I think they discuss it on the commentary.

1042
00:53:38.760 --> 00:53:42.119
It might be Julian Russell on the commentary for this story.

1043
00:53:42.480 --> 00:53:46.500
And I remember thinking at the time that would have been so much

1044
00:53:46.500 --> 00:53:46.860
better.

1045
00:53:46.920 --> 00:53:50.639
I would have been so much happier if we'd had that scene.

1046
00:53:50.699 --> 00:53:58.440
But their instinct is right because it cheats, it undercuts the

1047
00:53:58.440 --> 00:53:59.760
real loss, I think.

1048
00:54:00.059 --> 00:54:03.000
You're looking for consolation and you don't want it.

1049
00:54:03.119 --> 00:54:04.500
Agreed.

1050
00:54:04.559 --> 00:54:12.360
I think, I think, with, you know, like, I mean, this is all, it's

1051
00:54:12.360 --> 00:54:12.900
all made up.

1052
00:54:12.960 --> 00:54:14.340
You can make your own rules.

1053
00:54:14.400 --> 00:54:22.320
I mean, I agree that, you know, what he does to her saves her life

1054
00:54:22.320 --> 00:54:25.079
and she can grow and become a different person.

1055
00:54:25.139 --> 00:54:26.039
I don't disagree with that.

1056
00:54:26.400 --> 00:54:28.980
But it's a made up story.

1057
00:54:29.039 --> 00:54:31.860
I just want Catherine Tate to travel through time and space with

1058
00:54:31.860 --> 00:54:33.480
the doctor forever.

1059
00:54:33.539 --> 00:54:34.380
Like that.

1060
00:54:34.559 --> 00:54:37.980
Didn't they not, didn't they not even ask her about doing another

1061
00:54:37.980 --> 00:54:38.400
season?

1062
00:54:38.460 --> 00:54:40.440
They just assumed that she didn't want to come back or something

1063
00:54:40.440 --> 00:54:40.679
like that?

1064
00:54:40.739 --> 00:54:42.000
What, like with the Christmas special?

1065
00:54:42.059 --> 00:54:45.119
It was the fact that they were going onto the specials, yeah.

1066
00:54:45.599 --> 00:54:52.139
But, but you see, the reason that it hits us so hard is it's

1067
00:54:52.139 --> 00:54:55.079
imagine if you didn't know about the doctor.

1068
00:54:55.139 --> 00:55:00.420
Imagine, you know, if you had to stop travelling, you know, like

1069
00:55:00.420 --> 00:55:05.460
I'm coming to your place, James, and I am, um, I'm going to

1070
00:55:05.460 --> 00:55:11.760
firebomb your Doctor Who DVD collection, uh, and you'll never...

1071
00:55:11.820 --> 00:55:14.760
And you'll never, ever...

1072
00:55:14.760 --> 00:55:19.139
You'll never be able to watch Doctor Who ever again.

1073
00:55:19.260 --> 00:55:20.159
And that's what it is.

1074
00:55:20.219 --> 00:55:21.179
Do you know what I mean?

1075
00:55:21.239 --> 00:55:25.679
It's like for us, you know, the journey that we've had travelling

1076
00:55:25.679 --> 00:55:29.639
with a doctor ever since we were 10 or whatever that's been so

1077
00:55:29.639 --> 00:55:32.340
important to us that we've loved so much and we've derived so much

1078
00:55:32.340 --> 00:55:33.179
pleasure from.

1079
00:55:33.239 --> 00:55:37.019
And Donna gets kicked out of that and doesn't even remember it.

1080
00:55:37.079 --> 00:55:40.380
And so for us, it's the worst conceivable thing that could happen

1081
00:55:40.380 --> 00:55:41.400
to anyone.

1082
00:55:42.000 --> 00:55:47.340
But she actually manages still to live a full rich and satisfying

1083
00:55:47.340 --> 00:55:48.960
life in spite of that.

1084
00:55:49.019 --> 00:55:52.019
It goes back to what we were saying last week about this being an

1085
00:55:52.019 --> 00:55:53.519
immersive audience experience.

1086
00:55:53.579 --> 00:55:56.639
He invites the audience in because it does make you reflect on the

1087
00:55:56.639 --> 00:56:00.059
fact that Doctor is such a big part of our lives and your social

1088
00:56:00.059 --> 00:56:04.139
networks and whatever, that without it, it would just be an

1089
00:56:04.139 --> 00:56:07.139
emptier and sorrier existence, and that's what poor Donner is

1090
00:56:07.139 --> 00:56:07.739
consigned to.

1091
00:56:13.800 --> 00:56:16.980
All right, it's time for picks of the week. and I'm going to start

1092
00:56:16.980 --> 00:56:17.699
with you, James.

1093
00:56:17.760 --> 00:56:25.079
Well, my pick of the week this week is the fabulous series 3 Sarah

1094
00:56:25.079 --> 00:56:28.019
Jane Adventure story, the wedding of Sarah Jane Smith.

1095
00:56:28.199 --> 00:56:32.219
Oh, I love, I love the Sarah Chain Adventures.

1096
00:56:32.280 --> 00:56:36.119
I possibly more than the show it evolved out of.

1097
00:56:36.179 --> 00:56:43.019
It's just so joyous and I wish I had been a child when it was

1098
00:56:43.019 --> 00:56:43.679
broadcast.

1099
00:56:43.739 --> 00:56:46.500
I was, you know, 20 years too old.

1100
00:56:46.500 --> 00:56:49.980
Um, at the time, but it's just fantastic.

1101
00:56:50.039 --> 00:56:54.599
You get tenant coming back, sort of, as, you know, in a victory

1102
00:56:54.599 --> 00:56:57.659
lap to stop her making a terrible decision.

1103
00:56:57.719 --> 00:57:01.559
Um, Nigel Havers is her, her fiance.

1104
00:57:01.619 --> 00:57:02.820
It's just fantastic.

1105
00:57:02.880 --> 00:57:07.440
And, you know, you get you the annual evil plot by the trickster.

1106
00:57:07.500 --> 00:57:13.079
Um, and it's got Zenya Merton, um, Pingcho from Marco Polo in it.

1107
00:57:13.139 --> 00:57:13.739
It's fantastic.

1108
00:57:14.099 --> 00:57:16.019
Todd, your face.

1109
00:57:17.400 --> 00:57:19.440
Was that your choice, Todd?

1110
00:57:19.500 --> 00:57:21.840
No, my choice was stolen.

1111
00:57:21.900 --> 00:57:25.860
By the episode, I will listen to of FTE this morning when I was

1112
00:57:25.860 --> 00:57:29.579
walking around, so I can't recommend Avenue 5 enough.

1113
00:57:30.420 --> 00:57:33.960
So somebody else, please come up with another pick while I

1114
00:57:33.960 --> 00:57:35.579
scramble around here to find something.

1115
00:57:35.639 --> 00:57:36.300
Okay.

1116
00:57:36.360 --> 00:57:37.860
Peter.

1117
00:57:38.280 --> 00:57:44.760
So my pick of the week is the UK US co-production of War of the

1118
00:57:44.760 --> 00:57:47.699
Worlds, which has just come out, not to be confused with the Pete

1119
00:57:47.699 --> 00:57:51.780
Harness 3-part version, which was set contemporary to the novel

1120
00:57:51.780 --> 00:57:53.099
but a new version.

1121
00:57:53.159 --> 00:57:56.039
It's like 8 or 10 episodes, um, and it's set in the current day.

1122
00:57:56.099 --> 00:57:59.340
And I think it's quite fitting because we've just seen a war of

1123
00:57:59.340 --> 00:58:01.380
the world since the stolen earthen journey's end.

1124
00:58:01.440 --> 00:58:05.579
Um, It's a bit of a slow burn, so it's not for you if you're

1125
00:58:05.579 --> 00:58:09.599
looking for action and adventure, but, um, It's got a lot of

1126
00:58:09.599 --> 00:58:10.199
atmosphere.

1127
00:58:10.260 --> 00:58:13.380
It's got sort of interesting aliens that aren't really what you'd

1128
00:58:13.380 --> 00:58:16.679
expect them to be, and it also stars in one of the leading roles

1129
00:58:16.679 --> 00:58:22.019
Thai Tennant, who is the son of David Tennant and Georgia Moffat.

1130
00:58:22.139 --> 00:58:22.679
So there we go.

1131
00:58:22.739 --> 00:58:23.340
All wrapped up.

1132
00:58:23.579 --> 00:58:29.460
Well, my pick of the week. is the Netflix series Tiger King.

1133
00:58:31.139 --> 00:58:35.940
Because it always ends in a cliffhanger, and you can just recast

1134
00:58:35.940 --> 00:58:39.539
it with everybody from Doctor Who, and, you know, there's a lot of

1135
00:58:39.539 --> 00:58:40.679
people with really bad teeth.

1136
00:58:40.739 --> 00:58:44.639
So, you know, um, The big book of British smiles.

1137
00:58:44.699 --> 00:58:49.920
Billy Piper, you know, you can she could be Carol, and you can

1138
00:58:49.920 --> 00:58:53.579
cast whoever else you want in any of the other roles.

1139
00:58:53.639 --> 00:58:56.940
I'm only 3 episodes in, but the cliffhangers are wonderful.

1140
00:58:57.000 --> 00:59:01.440
Yes, it was huge old Tiger King, I think.

1141
00:59:01.500 --> 00:59:03.599
And I really liked it.

1142
00:59:03.599 --> 00:59:07.739
And I want, I want to thank you, Todd, for taking it a little bit

1143
00:59:07.739 --> 00:59:09.960
highbrow after our previous choices.

1144
00:59:13.440 --> 00:59:16.980
So my one is one from childhood and I don't know if I've

1145
00:59:16.980 --> 00:59:18.480
recommended this ever before.

1146
00:59:18.539 --> 00:59:24.239
But I'm in a sort of kind of mood where I'm not keen to challenge

1147
00:59:24.239 --> 00:59:27.000
myself with anything new.

1148
00:59:27.000 --> 00:59:31.380
And so I've been reading these books and they are children's books

1149
00:59:31.380 --> 00:59:37.800
essentially, by Finnish author Tova Jansen, who died in 2001.

1150
00:59:38.039 --> 00:59:40.199
It's a series of 9 books.

1151
00:59:40.260 --> 00:59:44.039
They're the movement books, and they were written from sort of

1152
00:59:44.039 --> 00:59:46.739
1945 to 1970.

1153
00:59:47.280 --> 00:59:53.400
And they're about little trolls that sort of live in Finland, and

1154
00:59:53.400 --> 00:59:55.139
they have a sort of family and stuff like that.

1155
00:59:55.260 --> 00:59:59.699
There's a TV show that James is thinking of right now, I think.

1156
00:59:59.760 --> 01:00:03.239
Yeah, no, they just made a new adaptation of it. sort of Jennifer

1157
01:00:03.239 --> 01:00:06.539
Saunders and Matt Berry and all sorts of really fun people.

1158
01:00:06.960 --> 01:00:09.659
I really adore them.

1159
01:00:09.719 --> 01:00:12.960
They're sort of whimsical and sort of sweet, but they were kind of

1160
01:00:12.960 --> 01:00:15.300
my introduction to literary fiction.

1161
01:00:15.360 --> 01:00:19.199
So the very early ones are all about sort of escaping from floods

1162
01:00:19.199 --> 01:00:21.900
and comets and magic and sort of strange things.

1163
01:00:21.960 --> 01:00:27.239
But later books become very introspective and nothing very much

1164
01:00:27.239 --> 01:00:31.019
happens, but characters all sort of sit around sort of agonising

1165
01:00:31.019 --> 01:00:31.739
about things.

1166
01:00:31.800 --> 01:00:36.659
And even as a child, I thought that those were superior and more

1167
01:00:36.659 --> 01:00:40.619
interesting than the more adventurous ones.

1168
01:00:40.679 --> 01:00:43.800
But now I recognise that that is actually my introduction to sort

1169
01:00:43.800 --> 01:00:44.579
of literary fiction.

1170
01:00:44.639 --> 01:00:46.559
So they're intellectual wambles.

1171
01:00:47.159 --> 01:00:48.659
Maybe.

1172
01:00:48.659 --> 01:00:49.679
Maybe.

1173
01:00:49.739 --> 01:00:52.260
I was going to say, Nathan, with introspective trolls.

1174
01:00:52.320 --> 01:00:55.380
It's a surprise you don't like the Bleak 7 episode animals.

1175
01:01:22.800 --> 01:01:25.980
Well, that's all we have time for this week.

1176
01:01:26.099 --> 01:01:29.159
We'll be back next week to clean up the mess we've made over the

1177
01:01:29.159 --> 01:01:32.219
last 13 weeks with our Series 4 retrospective.

1178
01:01:32.340 --> 01:01:36.119
In the meantime, you can find us wherever you get your podcasts

1179
01:01:36.119 --> 01:01:39.420
and you can keep up with us at Flight for Entirety on Facebook, at

1180
01:01:39.420 --> 01:01:43.860
FTE Podcast on Twitter, and on our website, FlightthroughEntirety

1181
01:01:42.300 --> 01:01:47.099
com, where you'll find links to our other podcasts, Bondfinger and

1182
01:01:47.099 --> 01:01:48.239
Jody Interterra.

1183
01:01:48.599 --> 01:01:53.219
Until next time, if a skinny man with sideburns tries to touch on

1184
01:01:53.219 --> 01:01:55.860
the face, you have our permission to slap him.

1185
01:01:55.920 --> 01:01:57.539
It's for your own protection.

1186
01:01:57.599 --> 01:02:00.300
Thank you very much for listening and good night.

1187
01:02:00.360 --> 01:02:01.380
Good night.

1188
01:02:01.500 --> 01:02:02.219
Bye-bye.

1189
01:02:02.280 --> 01:02:03.119
See you soon.

1190
01:02:06.179 --> 01:02:09.840
That was Flight 3 Entirety, starting Todd, B, B, Nathan Bottomley

1191
01:02:09.840 --> 01:02:11.340
Peter Griffith, and James Selwood.

1192
01:02:11.400 --> 01:02:14.219
Theme arrangement by Cameron Lamb, Strings performance by Jane

1193
01:02:14.219 --> 01:02:15.119
Orberg.

1194
01:02:15.179 --> 01:02:19.739
This episode, why he wins, was recorded on the 13th of April 2020

1195
01:02:19.739 --> 01:02:21.300
and released on the 7th of June.

1196
01:02:24.360 --> 01:02:27.960
Well, with one more episode until the end of our series 4 coverage

1197
01:02:27.960 --> 01:02:30.840
it's time to thank all the lovely people who joined us on the sofa

1198
01:02:30.840 --> 01:02:31.739
this series.

1199
01:02:31.800 --> 01:02:36.000
Eric Stadnick, Adam Richard, Max Gelbart, Johnny Spandrel, Josh

1200
01:02:36.000 --> 01:02:37.739
Snares, and Joe Lidstar.

1201
01:02:38.820 --> 01:02:41.460
I think we finished it there, do you think?

1202
01:02:41.519 --> 01:02:44.280
Well, what about Will saying goodbye?

1203
01:02:44.340 --> 01:02:47.159
Have we got anything to say about that, though?

1204
01:02:47.219 --> 01:02:50.940
Well, I mean, he looks up at the sky, you know, I look up the sky

1205
01:02:50.940 --> 01:02:53.880
and I think of you and I think, again, it breaks your heart and

1206
01:02:53.880 --> 01:02:57.719
then even with the doctor and the TARDIS looking around, it's not

1207
01:02:57.719 --> 01:03:01.920
like this comedy ending that we've had the last 3 years where he

1208
01:03:01.920 --> 01:03:03.539
goes, what, what, what, or whatever.

1209
01:03:03.599 --> 01:03:04.800
Because they cut that out.

1210
01:03:04.860 --> 01:03:05.579
Yeah, yeah.

1211
01:03:05.639 --> 01:03:06.599
It's got to be cyber.

1212
01:03:06.659 --> 01:03:09.000
Well, they filmed it, but they cut it.

1213
01:03:09.059 --> 01:03:14.340
Yeah, which might pell Ben convinced Russell not to include, and

1214
01:03:14.340 --> 01:03:15.239
it was the right instinct.

1215
01:03:15.480 --> 01:03:19.920
Again, it goes back to these choices that they make, these cuts

1216
01:03:20.280 --> 01:03:22.559
are actually the right decision.

1217
01:03:22.980 --> 01:03:27.179
And then you get him come back and be his companion for 2 episodes

1218
01:03:27.179 --> 01:03:33.420
at the end of his tenure. getting Bernard Crippens as a Doctor Who

1219
01:03:33.420 --> 01:03:37.559
companion, again, after like, what, 40 something years is

1220
01:03:37.559 --> 01:03:37.860
amazing.

1221
01:03:37.920 --> 01:03:41.280
And Russell has said that there's a version of the end of time in

1222
01:03:41.280 --> 01:03:44.099
his head where Donna would have played a much larger role.

1223
01:03:44.099 --> 01:03:47.039
And I remember hearing about that and thinking, why couldn't we

1224
01:03:47.039 --> 01:03:47.519
have had that?

1225
01:03:47.579 --> 01:03:48.719
I wanted more Donna.

1226
01:03:48.780 --> 01:03:52.380
But actually, the fact that she's a bit of a supporting character

1227
01:03:52.380 --> 01:03:56.639
in that and she's not playing an integral role underscores the

1228
01:03:56.639 --> 01:03:57.900
loss that we feel here.

1229
01:03:57.960 --> 01:04:01.079
You do get more of her and that's nice, but it doesn't undo

1230
01:04:01.079 --> 01:04:01.980
anything that's here.

1231
01:04:02.039 --> 01:04:05.039
And just a final word on Catherine Tate as well.

1232
01:04:05.099 --> 01:04:08.820
Strangely, I didn't truly get, until I was rewatching this episode

1233
01:04:08.820 --> 01:04:10.260
how much of a star that she is.

1234
01:04:10.320 --> 01:04:14.880
She carries important scenes like the TARDIS destruction and, you

1235
01:04:14.880 --> 01:04:16.800
know, the whole climax aboard the Dalek ship.

1236
01:04:16.860 --> 01:04:18.239
You only need her in shot.

1237
01:04:18.300 --> 01:04:19.500
She's all you watch.

1238
01:04:19.559 --> 01:04:20.820
She's a star.

1239
01:04:20.880 --> 01:04:24.179
So Doctor Who had 2 genuine leads this series.

1240
01:04:24.239 --> 01:04:28.679
And I think the only time that's ever happened is maybe Tom Baker

1241
01:04:28.679 --> 01:04:31.800
and Elizabeth Slaton, maybe, and William Hartnell and William

1242
01:04:31.800 --> 01:04:32.400
Russell.

1243
01:04:32.460 --> 01:04:35.280
I don't think Gogtu has ever had co-leads before.

1244
01:04:35.340 --> 01:04:36.360
And that's what she brought to the show.

1245
01:04:36.420 --> 01:04:38.880
What do you say about Jacqueline Hill?

1246
01:04:39.480 --> 01:04:40.860
No.

1247
01:04:40.920 --> 01:04:43.079
Leeds, William Martin William Russell.

1248
01:04:43.139 --> 01:04:43.380
Yeah.

1249
01:04:43.440 --> 01:04:44.820
Much as I love Jackie.

1250
01:04:45.239 --> 01:04:47.579
Alright, that could be the tag, actually.

1251
01:04:47.639 --> 01:04:54.239
Because I do like to go out on the, on the, um, Meaningful state.

1252
01:04:54.300 --> 01:04:54.900
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1253
01:04:54.960 --> 01:04:56.699
Feel free to cut any of my blood.

1254
01:04:56.760 --> 01:04:59.039
No, no, I feel free to cut everyone's body. not going to be this

1255
01:04:59.039 --> 01:04:59.400
episode at all.

1256
01:04:59.460 --> 01:05:00.119
No way.

1257
01:05:00.119 --> 01:05:04.679
You needed to, they needed to be the counterpoint about the, about

1258
01:05:04.679 --> 01:05:05.880
the thing.

1259
01:05:05.940 --> 01:05:06.719
Do you know what I mean?

1260
01:05:06.780 --> 01:05:08.760
There needed to be that needed to be said, I think.

1261
01:05:08.820 --> 01:05:10.619
Let's do pics of the week.

1262
01:05:11.159 --> 01:05:15.420
All right, it's time for picks of the week. and I'm going to start

1263
01:05:15.420 --> 01:05:16.139
with you, Jane.