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This transcript was created on 2026-06-07 at 15:02:42

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Hello, Day Lister, and welcome back to Flight Through Entirety, the only Doctor Who podcast that's just found out that for the last 7 years, we've been using the same jokebook as Rory's Best Man.

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And we're doing it now.

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I'm Nathan.

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I'm James.

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I'm Todd.

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I'm Peter.

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Well, for the last 13 weeks.

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We've seen what happens when you give creative control of the biggest thing on TV to the person who brought us Joking Apart series 2.

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So this week we're going to take one more look at how all that turned out by travelling backwards in our own timeline through those 13 weeks, creating the odd continuity era along the way in our series 5 retrospective.

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We always start with the hard hitting questions here in our retrospective.

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So, Peter, Snog marry avoid.

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Dorian, Churchill, or Cully?

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Cully from the 11th hour.

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Yes.

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Oh, it would have to be Cully from the 11th hour for all 3 because, I mean, I'm a secret dominators fan.

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Nobody knows this, but I think the dominant is actually pretty good.

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And so any chance, you know, Cully's in a dress there.

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I could take him straight up the aisle.

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It would be brilliant.

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Hang on, that was really rude.

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I made it.

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That staying in.

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No, that's not staying here.

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Yes, you could cheerfully marry Cully from the 11th hour.

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As for the other two, who were they?

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Dorian or Churchill?

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Dorian, you'd, well, no, I'd avoid Dorian, actually.

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And Churchill, well, you'd have to give Churchless Nog because he basically saved civilisation from fascism.

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So there we go.

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Right.

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Thank you very much for that.

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We'll now move on to my next question, which is one of our listener questions that I get from our tweets, and this is part of the Pandora Opens box.

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Luke Hobbs Arsis.

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This series just turned 10 years old, and we've had a lot of Doctor Who in the time since.

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Does series 5 still feel fresh, does it feel outdated?

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And is this a false choice that can only be resolved by an alchemic marriage of opposites?

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I think it's truly fresh.

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I think it's amazing.

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And maybe it's because we're coming at it after doing the RTD era, so it's a little bit like it is in context, but it's an exciting new take on Doctor Who, I think.

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And, you know, some of us are sort of coming off the Moffatt era where perhaps it does get a bit tired by the end, but this new thing that he's doing is so great in context, I think.

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And I think I was very familiar with series one through four, the Russell T. Davies era.

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And so I kind of knew what that felt like.

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And series 4 is very good.

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Then to get into the specials, which perhaps outstayed their welcome just a little bit.

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But then he hit series 5 and it does feel so fresh and new and revisiting now, I was surprised by how Moffatt was able to step in and make a series that felt so much the same and so much different.

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Oh look, I totally agree.

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Coming back to it.

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Like early Moffat, Doctor Who was never something I was a huge fan of just because I loved Russell so much.

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I kind of took against it.

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I still enjoyed watching, but I was like, oh, it's not as good as it used to be.

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What I made was a kid.

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But coming back to watch it for FTE.

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Wow.

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It's phenomenal.

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It's so, there's so much energy.

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There's so many ideas fizzing around like in this concoction.

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It's just, it really holds out well.

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I think it seems as fresh now as it did the day it was broadcast.

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And hasn't conspicuously dated, has it?

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You watch an episode from this series.

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It doesn't feel like it's back in time.

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Yeah, I agree.

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I do think it is as fresh as it was.

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And I also think that as similar as it is in terms of structure, and of course, the last time that we have the episodic structure in knew who.

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Like this is it after this, it's all different.

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We don't have necessarily an early two-parter, late two-parter, and two-part finale ever again, like in a series.

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I think it's absolutely amazing that you've got that, but Stephen just makes it seem different and it's such a success with it, I think.

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I've really enjoyed the whole run.

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You know, I'm very close to saying that series 5 is my favourite series of new who.

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I think RTD is still my favourite era.

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And series 5 has to vie with that incredible run of sort of 7 or 8 episodes at the end of series 4, which is perhaps the best run that the show has ever done.

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And, uh, you know, the corresponding bit of series 5 has that dreadful gibnal 2 part of SmackBang in the middle of it.

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But despite that, there's something so interesting about what it's doing.

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And over the last few weeks, Todd, you've talked about this as being like a novel, you know, it has a coherence.

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It tells a single story in a way that the show has never done before while not sacrificing the individual episodes.

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I think it's amazing.

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Yeah, I like what you're saying there, Nathan.

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Like in series four, you do have that incredible run.

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You have all those highs and you really are swept away with it all, but with all the continuity.

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Here, it is like a novel that unfolds chapter by chapter.

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And so if one chapter is a little bit disappointing.

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You're still wanting to go forward.

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And I necessarily don't think that the highs in this season are as dramatically high as maybe season four, but there's a consistency and there's a through line and there's just something that I really am intrigued by every single time I watch it. and it brings something new every time I watch it.

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It's one of those rare seasons, I think, that is greater than the sum of its parts.

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Exactly.

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And so even though there are a couple of disappointing episodes in there, what the season's aiming for and what you come away from it with is really pretty good.

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Another Pandora opens question.

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Bob Gilby says, this is the series that made Doctor Who big again in the USA.

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What do you think is the reason for that?

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I take issue with the word again.

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I think it's that intro, you know, that Amy does the voiceover of my imaginary friend.

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That's what made it US because it needs to be explained every week to the casual viewer, so they keep on coming back going, oh, I haven't seen this before.

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I think it was just a good sort of jumping on point.

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You know, Moffatt does refer to things that have happened before. but not a lot.

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And certainly the 1st episode has a completely new cast.

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And so it is an excellent jumping on point.

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And I think I've recommended that people start with the 11th hour, if they want to watch New Who.

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You know, however much I love the RTD era, it is sort of a good, reasonably modern starting point.

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It works well.

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So I think it was that.

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And there was just a lot of publicity and stuff, wasn't there?

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I think so.

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I also think that you've said a number of times this series about 3 young likeable leads.

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Yeah, yeah. for the 1st time since maybe the savages.

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Toto?

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Hartnell?

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And what else?

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That other one.

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And by the way, Todd, your fetching jumper puts me in mind of Stephen in the celestial toy maker.

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Yeah, yeah.

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Thank you for that You always won't get to see my fetching jumper.

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I'll just take a picture.

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Can we have some love for the 11th hour?

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Because, I mean, as an opener to a season, it's spectacular and it ticks every box, but the feat that that episode achieved by basically revamping the entire series and kicking off with nothing left from behind it.

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It's a more audacious feet than Rose, I think, in that respect.

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The only thing that's really left is Ed Thomas, behind the scenes.

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That's right, and he's gone by the end of the season.

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I mean, the other thing too, that it does, which hasn't been attempted before in the new series, is it doesn't hold off, introducing the doctor.

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So we have to wait to meet the doctor in both rows and the Christmas invasion, particularly in the Christmas invasion.

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Deep breath as well.

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Yeah, yeah, but every scene has Matt in it just about.

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It's actually quite a shock when we cut to the hospital for that scene with Rory and Dr. Ramsden because it's the 1st time that Matt hasn't been the centre of every scene and it's amazing.

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He just does so well in it.

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And starters, you mean to go on, I would have Matt at the centre of every scene going forward all season.

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I'd be very happy with that.

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No, I totally agree.

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Like that episode is phenomenal.

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And if that had not worked.

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The series could have easily, you know, by the end of it, it could have been all over, really.

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And so much of it is down to Matt's performance.

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I mean, that opening scene with Caitlin Blackwood is so wonderful.

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He's so tremendous in it.

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And I know he's had a go.

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Like he's been doing the show for a little while by the time he does that episode.

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But we've already said that he nails it from his 1st scene anyway.

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Simon Hart asks us why is Matt Smith so damn good?

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He is an actor, I think, who is visibly thinking and trying to do something interesting with what he's got and what he's got is generally very good.

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But he's thoughtful and finds new ways of doing things.

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There's that weird physicality that he has, you know, the sort of awkwardness.

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And on every single take, by all accounts.

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Yeah, something different.

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Yeah.

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Which made it really difficult for the editors to piece together series 5 because every take he'd had a different take on the way to play the scene.

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Wow.

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I mean, that's just, you know, an abundance of joy, isn't it?

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I think it was also because he hadn't really locked in the acting lane that he was in.

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And so he'd done previous things.

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He appeared on stage and he'd been very good.

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He'd been like the sidekick in the Billy Piper series, Ruby and the Smoke, he'd done party animals, and each of those was a slightly different performance and a slightly different expectation.

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I think it needed a role like the doctor, where you can be many things and bring your own attributes to it, to really kind of define what he was as an actor.

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And you just kind of, it was a natural fit.

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And I'm not sure there's been Tom Baker, obviously, but apart from him and Tom, I'm not sure there has been such a natural fit for the role.

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Yeah, tenants of performance.

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Like tenant is much more kind of calm and saturnine is a real person than his doctor is.

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So it's definitely an acting performance.

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And, you know, with Sylvester, I think maybe he's a lot like his doctor and he's sort of quite interesting to watch.

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Um, but he sometimes fails at some of the acting hurdles that are sort of presented to him.

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But I think he also is someone who is that sort of doctor.

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Yeah, and I don't necessarily mean bringing a lot of yourself to the role to craft the role around you, but just finding a role that suits the kind of actor that you are.

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Yeah.

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I think it's interesting when you look back on all the classic doctors.

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I think Tom is the one that is instantly there and very much the performance maybe from his 2nd story is a performance that you could say is there in his last story.

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Whereas everybody else, there is a shakedown period, I think, with everyone.

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I think you can see a shift in all of their performances after, you know, a number of stories or a season and a half or whatever it happens to be.

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I think the other thing with Matt is the fact that he gets to pull all this stuff on camera without it being broadcast.

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So he's quite free to do whatever he wants and take risks and try things and just be him.

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And, you know, riders haven't necessarily seen him.

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There's no preconceived sort of ideas about what he should be doing.

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And so I think that really does help him in this season, perhaps, to go out there and redefine the role and and make it as broad or as narrow as he wants.

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It's funny.

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I've sort of suggested before that I think that maybe once he is a known quantity, the writing tries to get him to do sort of Matt Smith style things, and I wonder what we'll think of that when we actually start to look closely at what's to calm.

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I think that also had an impact on the performance because the 1st thing that Matt shot after the series had gone out and he knew that he'd been a success and the show was still a success was his appearance in the Sarah Jane adventures.

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And then he came back and did a Christmas carol.

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And I think his performance in both of those and going forwards is appreciably different, not better, not worse, but a little bit different because he has that confidence of knowing that he was a success.

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I was about to say, there's a confidence in him, especially in that Christmas special.

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He's more confident.

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I'm not saying dramatically more, but there is just a little something, you know?

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I think too, and we're going to talk about this in our next episode, in a few weeks time, that Stephen Moffatt is now writing for him, and it's Stephen Moffatt doing the Christmas special that he had always wanted to do.

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So it's extremely good, but he's definitely writing for Matt's strengths in it.

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And I think it's a real kind of peak of Matt's performance in the show.

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Do you think that some of this series is not written for Matt?

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like it was written for David and it was just left or we went back and revised it.

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I mean, because obviously Stephen was trying to get David to stay on.

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My understanding is that they had negotiated with David for quite a while before they made the decision.

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Well, before David made the decision not to come back.

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It was months of negotiation.

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Oh, come back, come back.

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And he almost did.

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So I think there's there's a truth in that that those 1st sort of 4 or 5 episodes are not necessarily pitched format, but he's still brilliant in them.

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There was also quite a long lead up for this series.

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It had a very long pre-production.

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So I'm sure that Stephen would have been tailoring the role more for he saw Matt's performance as.

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All right, time for snob marrying void, I think.

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Liz 10, Sophie or Nasrene Chaudhary.

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Oh, God, I love Sophie.

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I'm like James Corden.

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I love Sophie.

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She is so superb.

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I love Daisy Haggard.

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So I would, I would snog her, I think.

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I think I would marry Nurse Ring, because, I mean, I think she's very, very smart and I would absolutely not tire of her.

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I just think she is one of the best guest stars in this in this season.

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And it's partly down to, it's mostly down to, um, to the performance though, I think.

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There is that venerable Doctor Who tradition of pairing the doctor with slightly older female character who comes in.

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We saw it with Ida Scott.

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We saw it back in the old days with Dr. Todd from Kinder and that. it works every damn time.

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Yeah, it's great actually older than the doctor as well.

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And that, that's what happens with Neresa Hughes's character, isn't it, in Kinder?

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Yeah.

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Yeah, it works really terrifically well.

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And then the 3rd choice was...

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She's the bloody queen, mate.

213
00:17:12.960 --> 00:17:15.059
You'd get to be the prince consort.

214
00:17:15.180 --> 00:17:17.039
I would. get to be Prince Philip.

215
00:17:17.099 --> 00:17:18.599
If you avoid her, she might behead you.

216
00:17:18.660 --> 00:17:19.980
Yeah she is great.

217
00:17:20.039 --> 00:17:21.180
This is super difficult.

218
00:17:21.240 --> 00:17:22.380
They're actually all really good.

219
00:17:22.440 --> 00:17:24.660
I got 3 fantastic choices.

220
00:17:25.079 --> 00:17:33.539
I really like Liz Tan, and I think it's an amazingly great performance, and it was such a thrill to see her back in episode 12, wasn't it?

221
00:17:33.660 --> 00:17:35.579
She's just terrific.

222
00:17:35.640 --> 00:17:39.359
But as a Republican, I would have to avoid her, I think.

223
00:17:39.420 --> 00:17:40.619
Fair enough.

224
00:17:40.680 --> 00:17:42.420
Todd, I take issue with these questions.

225
00:17:42.480 --> 00:17:45.599
How come Nathan gets Liz 10 and people like that?

226
00:17:45.660 --> 00:17:46.980
And I get Dorium?

227
00:17:48.359 --> 00:17:50.099
comic effect.

228
00:17:50.279 --> 00:17:54.119
Oh, Peter, you know, I have to get back at you, sir.

229
00:17:54.960 --> 00:17:57.240
In my CSO kitchen.

230
00:17:57.299 --> 00:18:03.539
But that's one of the things I love about Moffat's Doctor Who in his season plot arcs.

231
00:18:03.599 --> 00:18:14.460
He does it again and again where he will get characters that he's introduced throughout the season and then all have them kind of teaming up towards the end of the season.

232
00:18:14.519 --> 00:18:22.140
He does it fantastically in series 5, in series 6, you get that twice, really.

233
00:18:23.220 --> 00:18:26.039
And it's just fun.

234
00:18:26.099 --> 00:18:31.019
And obviously, you know, it's all filmed at the same time and just inserted.

235
00:18:31.079 --> 00:18:43.259
But it really gives a sense of coherence and like Todd was saying earlier, that sort of continuous story, like a novel on television.

236
00:18:43.500 --> 00:19:10.380
I mean, Russell makes an attempt to bring everything together at the end of the season, but generally, the way he does that is by making the finale a kind of sequel to a story earlier in the run and also foregrounding, the companions' families, which is something that Moffat obviously doesn't have, although Tabitha and Augustus do come in in the final episode.

237
00:19:10.559 --> 00:19:12.779
Tiny, tiny, little.

238
00:19:12.779 --> 00:19:13.619
It's so great.

239
00:19:13.680 --> 00:19:14.519
Is that their name?

240
00:19:14.519 --> 00:19:15.420
That's their name.

241
00:19:15.480 --> 00:19:20.519
So they have fairy tale names as well, which I just think is terrific.

242
00:19:20.579 --> 00:19:22.440
I didn't know that until today.

243
00:19:22.500 --> 00:19:24.900
Sounds like what they should have named the cats.

244
00:19:25.440 --> 00:19:27.599
What's the aunt's name?

245
00:19:27.660 --> 00:19:29.160
Oh, she's Aunt Sharon.

246
00:19:29.220 --> 00:19:30.119
Auntie Sharon.

247
00:19:30.180 --> 00:19:30.900
Sharon?

248
00:19:30.960 --> 00:19:34.140
Tabitha and Augustus.

249
00:19:34.200 --> 00:19:38.700
Yeah, I want Sharon to be Tabitha's sister, I think.

250
00:19:38.759 --> 00:19:42.779
Although it's not absolutely made clear in the script.

251
00:19:42.779 --> 00:19:44.279
And she is fabulous.

252
00:19:44.339 --> 00:19:47.339
She does give good exasperated face in that final episode.

253
00:19:47.400 --> 00:19:49.019
It was the neris role.

254
00:19:49.319 --> 00:19:51.359
That's what I was thinking.

255
00:19:51.420 --> 00:19:54.960
Now I'm going to forget about these things after this episode.

256
00:19:55.019 --> 00:20:06.599
So it's interesting, isn't it, because Russell creates the family who you follow, whereas Moffatt's more interested in the family of the season, the characters who you've kind of become familiar with and he uses them in the same way.

257
00:20:06.660 --> 00:20:09.900
Do you think it's a shame that we never see them again or?

258
00:20:09.900 --> 00:20:13.500
I don't...

259
00:20:13.559 --> 00:20:17.400
I am happy for the show to move on and do something new.

260
00:20:17.460 --> 00:20:18.480
I think that's it.

261
00:20:18.539 --> 00:20:21.000
And it very clearly says it's going to do that.

262
00:20:21.119 --> 00:20:29.700
At the end of the season finale, they jump in the TARDIS, pop their head out and go, yes, this is goodbye. and run off.

263
00:20:29.759 --> 00:20:31.259
It's like, you know, that was fun.

264
00:20:31.319 --> 00:20:32.819
We're gonna do something else now.

265
00:20:32.880 --> 00:20:33.839
Yeah, yeah.

266
00:20:34.140 --> 00:20:39.240
So let's talk about the runaway bride, as opposed to the runaway couple at the moment.

267
00:20:39.299 --> 00:20:41.400
Amy or Amelia?

268
00:20:41.460 --> 00:20:42.420
Or both.

269
00:20:42.539 --> 00:20:45.720
What are your views now that we've seen a whole series?

270
00:20:46.380 --> 00:20:50.519
I think that Amy is really great.

271
00:20:50.579 --> 00:20:54.660
And I like how spiky she is.

272
00:20:54.720 --> 00:20:59.579
I like how sort of sexually aggressive she is.

273
00:20:59.640 --> 00:21:04.799
I actually even like how kind of dismissive she is of Rory.

274
00:21:04.859 --> 00:21:07.319
I think all of those things are funny.

275
00:21:07.380 --> 00:21:09.779
I think she's a good, solid sitcom character.

276
00:21:09.839 --> 00:21:17.400
I think Caitlin Blackwood is astonishingly good. as an actor in that 1st scene.

277
00:21:17.460 --> 00:21:21.180
Like, just amazing for a child actor.

278
00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:30.420
But when she comes back in the finale, she is very sidelined, like she doesn't get to do anything particularly interesting.

279
00:21:30.480 --> 00:21:32.099
And so, I don't know.

280
00:21:32.160 --> 00:21:40.619
I think that there's something to having an adult woman who is in a sexual relationship in the TARDIS.

281
00:21:40.680 --> 00:21:42.180
I'm absolutely on board with it.

282
00:21:42.240 --> 00:21:53.940
It's Moffat who introduces it and it is that thing where you don't get to go on adventures because you have to be at home being a wife and we jettison that absolutely firmly in this season and I'm all here for it.

283
00:21:54.000 --> 00:22:00.480
Something that I noticed over the range of the season was that Amy is quite a comic book character.

284
00:22:00.539 --> 00:22:06.119
I think she's less grounded and less real feeling than someone like Martha.

285
00:22:06.180 --> 00:22:07.319
Oh, yeah.

286
00:22:07.319 --> 00:22:07.799
Rose.

287
00:22:07.859 --> 00:22:14.400
And I think the performance does an awful lot to ground her and to make her seem more like a real person.

288
00:22:14.640 --> 00:22:29.579
Karen's got comic ticks and that, most of which work and some of which take me out of it a little bit, but she absolutely brings a gravity to Amy in the serious moments and makes you feel like this is a real person with actual steaks.

289
00:22:30.660 --> 00:22:36.180
Wow, a gravity to Amy in serious moments.

290
00:22:36.240 --> 00:22:38.160
I could never have put it like that.

291
00:22:38.220 --> 00:22:41.759
But now you say it, that's exactly what it is.

292
00:22:41.819 --> 00:22:46.680
And that's my discovering in this season that Karen is so much better than I thought.

293
00:22:46.680 --> 00:22:51.420
She's got the comedy, but towards the end, when there are large stakes.

294
00:22:51.480 --> 00:22:56.339
She really does make you feel for what's going on and I think that's been tremendous.

295
00:22:56.400 --> 00:23:07.799
I vocalise that I'm not the greatest fan of Amy, and I still will say that, you know, at times in the season, I do struggle with the characterisation and how she's written, not what Karen's going for.

296
00:23:07.859 --> 00:23:18.359
But I'm liking her a lot more, and I'm hoping that that will continue in through next series, which I always did like her more as she went along anyway.

297
00:23:18.420 --> 00:23:28.319
But, you know, it's a big jump for me going from what I would say up to this point of the, the, the 4 female companions.

298
00:23:28.380 --> 00:23:31.259
She'd be my least favourite, but now I'm not so sure.

299
00:23:31.319 --> 00:23:48.660
Moffat gets all the kudos for casting Matt Smith, and so he should, because it was an absolute casting coup, but we sometimes forget that he then did the same thing with Karen Gillan and found somebody else who could play in that register and be the perfect accompaniment format, and that's a success in itself.

300
00:23:49.259 --> 00:23:54.660
Look, I think the casting of all 3 leads in this series is brilliant.

301
00:23:54.720 --> 00:24:10.859
Arthur Darville, you know, is sidelined for the, you know, for a lot of this season, but he's a bloody good actor, and he, he's a perfect foil for their outrageously irresponsible behaviour.

302
00:24:12.119 --> 00:24:24.539
Yeah, I think too, given that they are in some sense sitcom characters, like given that so often they're doing jokes and trying to make us laugh, that Arthur fits into that very well.

303
00:24:24.599 --> 00:24:36.480
And we talked about that 2 weeks ago in, you know, those absurdly comic moments in the Pandorica opens that centre around, kind of, Matt suddenly realising that Arthur's back.

304
00:24:36.539 --> 00:24:45.059
And he plays it really, very well, but he is a bit more grounded and he does tend to get lost in the mix a bit in series five.

305
00:24:45.119 --> 00:24:50.339
Absolutely Rory is Ricky and the doctor and Amy are both Lucy.

306
00:24:54.660 --> 00:24:59.519
Eric Stadnick says Nurse Rory or Centurion Rory.

307
00:24:59.579 --> 00:25:00.240
Both.

308
00:25:00.299 --> 00:25:09.900
Moffat has a very weird sex comedy thing going on about people getting dressed up in costumes and nurses costumes in particular.

309
00:25:09.960 --> 00:25:20.700
There's a scene in press gang where someone says that nurses costumes looked terrible and Linda Day replies sort of fairly awkwardly.

310
00:25:20.759 --> 00:25:28.859
Oh, yes, and they're so uncomfortable and then is sort of slightly embarrassed as if she's sort of dressing up as a nurse to have sex with Dexter Fletcher.

311
00:25:28.920 --> 00:25:32.940
And it just seems very period.

312
00:25:33.059 --> 00:25:39.480
Like he is a middle-aged man writing about sex who wrote sex comedies in the 90s.

313
00:25:39.539 --> 00:25:43.980
And so that's why when we 1st meet Karen, she's dressed up as a police woman.

314
00:25:44.039 --> 00:25:47.519
And then in our next episode.

315
00:25:47.640 --> 00:25:54.240
She'll be dressed as a policewoman and he'll be dressed as a centurion so that they can have sex on the enterprise in their honeymoon.

316
00:25:54.299 --> 00:25:59.579
And so they turn up on the bridge looking really shamefaced because these are their sex outfits.

317
00:25:59.700 --> 00:26:03.059
It's very weird.

318
00:26:03.119 --> 00:26:07.980
This would also explain why Sister Lamont was such a pinup for so many boys in the 70s.

319
00:26:08.039 --> 00:26:09.599
Oh, and me, particularly.

320
00:26:10.319 --> 00:26:13.200
It explains his homosexuality.

321
00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:18.900
I think I'm going to go with Centurion Rory moving forward.

322
00:26:18.960 --> 00:26:22.440
He has a confidence about him that perhaps Nurse Rory didn't.

323
00:26:22.500 --> 00:26:23.460
Says big finish.

324
00:26:23.519 --> 00:26:24.839
Yes.

325
00:26:24.900 --> 00:26:25.559
Yeah.

326
00:26:25.619 --> 00:26:26.819
Someone said it 3 times.

327
00:26:26.880 --> 00:26:28.559
What, Centurion Rory.

328
00:26:28.619 --> 00:26:30.059
Yeah, they've done it.

329
00:26:30.119 --> 00:26:34.079
They've done a spinoff series with Arthur Darville playing the Lone Centurion.

330
00:26:34.140 --> 00:26:34.920
Of course they have.

331
00:26:34.980 --> 00:26:38.160
And we know that Centurion Rory gives good sortie.

332
00:26:56.220 --> 00:26:57.599
Snog Murry avoid.

333
00:26:57.660 --> 00:27:03.900
Prisoner Zero, the Star Whale, or the Ironsides.

334
00:27:05.099 --> 00:27:12.900
I saw Prisoner Zero giving you the eye. of them.

335
00:27:14.099 --> 00:27:20.160
So I think I'd marry the star whale because it'll put up with a hell of a lot.

336
00:27:20.220 --> 00:27:21.180
Yep.

337
00:27:21.660 --> 00:27:23.940
Also takes you where you want to go.

338
00:27:24.000 --> 00:27:25.500
I'll leave that there.

339
00:27:26.940 --> 00:27:29.759
I would snog prisoner Zero.

340
00:27:29.819 --> 00:27:31.980
Very carefully, I would think.

341
00:27:32.039 --> 00:27:32.640
Very careful.

342
00:27:32.700 --> 00:27:33.720
Lots of tea.

343
00:27:33.779 --> 00:27:34.799
Yeah, the tongue though.

344
00:27:34.859 --> 00:27:36.180
What form?

345
00:27:36.240 --> 00:27:37.859
Mostly tongue.

346
00:27:37.920 --> 00:27:39.779
What form would it be in?

347
00:27:40.319 --> 00:27:43.740
Oh, you get to snug Olivia Goldman.

348
00:27:43.799 --> 00:27:44.460
Or Matt Smith?

349
00:27:44.579 --> 00:27:46.859
No, definitely, definitely Olivia Coleman.

350
00:27:48.119 --> 00:27:50.579
Not in mother mode, though.

351
00:27:50.640 --> 00:27:52.019
You wouldn't want to marry him.

352
00:27:52.079 --> 00:27:52.920
But the kids were older.

353
00:27:52.980 --> 00:27:54.000
The kids would always be there.

354
00:27:55.200 --> 00:27:59.819
And I would avoid the Ionsides because they're devious bastards.

355
00:27:59.940 --> 00:28:02.279
I really like the Ironside.

356
00:28:02.339 --> 00:28:03.359
Yeah, they make your tea.

357
00:28:03.420 --> 00:28:04.259
Yeah.

358
00:28:04.319 --> 00:28:05.339
Yeah they're good.

359
00:28:05.400 --> 00:28:07.319
And then exterminate you.

360
00:28:09.059 --> 00:28:15.180
A long time ago, Peter, you mentioned something about Stephen Moffatt failures.

361
00:28:15.240 --> 00:28:26.759
How would we react to Stephen Moffatt not hitting an episode out of the ballpark like he has for the last 4 series because he's only had an episode or 2 to do and this year he's had to do so much more.

362
00:28:27.059 --> 00:28:30.599
How do you feel about his episodes this year?

363
00:28:30.720 --> 00:28:37.740
I'm thinking now about the Beast Below, which I really, really like now, but at the time I thought had a lot of problems.

364
00:28:37.799 --> 00:28:48.059
And there's certainly maybe a few little elements in there that don't quite work the way Stephen wanted to, but I actually think is actually a really solid episode of Doctor Who.

365
00:28:48.119 --> 00:28:58.920
How do you feel about his, and I put in inverted commas, failures, whether that be as a writer of an episode or as the showrunner.

366
00:28:58.980 --> 00:29:05.220
I may have put that slightly unkindly for good reason in that when I said that I wanted to see Stephen Moffat fail.

367
00:29:05.279 --> 00:29:19.079
I wanted to see an episode where everything was not ideal for him and to see how interesting that would be, whether it was on the production side or whether he was too rushed with writing it, and I'm sad slash overjoyed to report that that hasn't happened this season.

368
00:29:19.200 --> 00:29:42.119
We've seen Stephen firing on all cylinders, every episode, including the beast below, which I think is a really marvellously good script, maybe not quite achieved by the production, but I think we're going to have to wait until next year to achieve that phenomenon of Stephen being tired and trying to write something and not quite hitting the mark and it being as interesting as it is.

369
00:29:42.420 --> 00:29:45.960
If you look at the overall arc of the season.

370
00:29:46.019 --> 00:30:01.799
Um, I think looking back on it now when it feels like it's more regular, it's incredible to think that someone was able to step into that program and keep it, and keep its profile and keep it as critically praised as it had been during Russell's era.

371
00:30:01.859 --> 00:30:09.779
And I think this brings me to something which is very important with Doctor Who, which is continuity of people running the show.

372
00:30:09.839 --> 00:30:16.619
So back in the 1970s, I think Doctor Who goes off the rails when it loses its continuity.

373
00:30:16.680 --> 00:30:22.079
So as you go through, you will always have someone who is a key creative under the previous production team.

374
00:30:22.140 --> 00:30:29.039
So you'll have, say, Robert Holmes, who is key creative during the Barry Letts era, will become a script editor.

375
00:30:29.099 --> 00:30:32.279
And so you have an important figure there who knows how the show works.

376
00:30:32.339 --> 00:30:43.440
And Blake 7 clearly killed Doctor Who in the 1970s because it took the 2 people who were the obvious continuity showrunners away.

377
00:30:43.559 --> 00:30:50.819
So once you reach the end of the Hinchcliffe era, clearly David Maloney should have been the next producer, having played a very important role.

378
00:30:50.880 --> 00:30:54.839
And Chris Belcher was clearly being groomed as the new script editor.

379
00:30:54.900 --> 00:31:02.579
And if both of them had stepped in, business as usual, doctor would continue to be a creative and popular success, which didn't have any issues.

380
00:31:02.640 --> 00:31:04.859
Unfortunately, they were both poached for Blake 7.

381
00:31:04.920 --> 00:31:10.920
And instead you got 2 people who'd never worked on the show and didn't have a clear idea of what they wanted it to be.

382
00:31:11.039 --> 00:31:15.779
They would have great successes, but it removed that line of continuity.

383
00:31:15.839 --> 00:31:19.319
So bring us back to Stephen Moffat.

384
00:31:19.380 --> 00:31:23.220
He was the very clear person who needed to take over.

385
00:31:23.279 --> 00:31:29.339
He had done so well under the previous production team and had a very clear idea of what he wanted to do with the show.

386
00:31:29.400 --> 00:31:36.599
And I think that could have been gotten wrong very easily and we wouldn't be here talking about the show as a current item now.

387
00:31:36.660 --> 00:31:37.440
Yeah.

388
00:31:37.500 --> 00:31:38.880
Nathan?

389
00:31:39.599 --> 00:31:42.480
I would have to agree with Peter.

390
00:31:42.539 --> 00:31:58.079
I think that we are going to start seeing interesting failures next year and those are episodes that I tend to like more than most people, I think, but I do recognise that they fall to bits in all sorts of important ways.

391
00:31:58.140 --> 00:32:08.339
I think the flaws in next year's season are also in the ones that Moffatt didn't write, particularly.

392
00:32:08.400 --> 00:32:15.420
Here, clearly, for some reason, Chris Chibnell is thought to be a safe pair of hands.

393
00:32:15.480 --> 00:32:19.319
And I do think that that two-parter fails.

394
00:32:19.380 --> 00:32:21.240
It is not very good.

395
00:32:21.299 --> 00:32:29.220
And it's possible that bringing the Silurians back is not a good decision.

396
00:32:29.279 --> 00:32:31.740
They've never been back since.

397
00:32:31.799 --> 00:32:51.000
We've had the single character of Madame Vastra, who works very well, but we've never had another Silurian story, and I think doing the Silurians is a mistake, and it is possible that the Silurians only really ever work in their 1st story, that they seem to be there to tell a particular story.

398
00:32:51.059 --> 00:33:01.500
But Moffatt wants to bring them back into the fold, you know, to be part of Doctor Who Law, the way that Russell had done with the Santarans and the Daleks and the Cyberman.

399
00:33:01.559 --> 00:33:06.059
But I think maybe the Salurians were the wrong choice.

400
00:33:06.119 --> 00:33:11.400
And so that might be his one kind of bad creative decision this season.

401
00:33:12.000 --> 00:33:25.140
Moffatt, I think, fails upwards a lot of the time. either because he's got a good production team around him or because even when things don't work.

402
00:33:25.200 --> 00:33:38.400
There's so much creative energy and so many, really through interesting, clever ideas that he uses again and again and again by the end of his era.

403
00:33:38.519 --> 00:33:51.180
I think if you can criticise Buffett for anything, it's being too creative and having too many ideas to fit into an episode.

404
00:33:51.299 --> 00:33:54.059
It's never an absence of that.

405
00:33:54.119 --> 00:34:01.740
It's never, oh, he was trying something, and he didn't have the skill to achieve it.

406
00:34:02.039 --> 00:34:04.319
Something else has gone wrong.

407
00:34:04.380 --> 00:34:07.079
It's not, that wasn't a good enough idea.

408
00:34:07.140 --> 00:34:09.360
That wasn't clever enough.

409
00:34:09.420 --> 00:34:11.460
That wasn't witty enough.

410
00:34:11.579 --> 00:34:14.699
Like he's he's always reaching for something.

411
00:34:14.760 --> 00:34:21.239
He doesn't always get there, but he's always got an abundance of creativity and ambition, I think.

412
00:34:21.300 --> 00:34:25.139
Stephen has a baseline of ambition and creativity, doesn't he?

413
00:34:25.199 --> 00:34:27.719
He will always deliver on something for you.

414
00:34:27.780 --> 00:34:37.619
So no matter how tired, how pressured, how many things he's got on his plate, whatever he serves you up will have something or many things in it where you go, that's interesting.

415
00:34:37.679 --> 00:34:40.559
It's just whether it comes together in a brilliant hole.

416
00:34:40.619 --> 00:34:43.260
Most of the time it does, sometimes it doesn't.

417
00:34:43.380 --> 00:34:46.679
You could never accuse him of having a lack of imagination.

418
00:34:46.739 --> 00:34:47.099
No.

419
00:34:53.159 --> 00:35:00.900
I think it's interesting, like, Peter, you were saying, and I agree with you, I think all of these episodes that he writes this year, are a success.

420
00:35:00.960 --> 00:35:03.420
The episodes that are not written by him.

421
00:35:04.440 --> 00:35:09.659
There are some that are a big success and others that perhaps are not quite as successful, right?

422
00:35:09.780 --> 00:35:24.420
And as a showrunner, I mean, you compare with Russell as to throwing around terms here, success and values, and we're never quite sure how much of a rewrite things are and how much they're put into the script.

423
00:35:24.480 --> 00:35:40.440
And so I think it's always interesting to look at those episodes, perhaps not written by him and just seeing how successful they perhaps are and how much of a season thematic continuity is worked in and seeing whether you can really see his hand in it or not.

424
00:35:40.500 --> 00:35:41.760
I find that quite interesting.

425
00:35:41.820 --> 00:35:45.539
It's rarely commented on the fact that Stephen doesn't have Stephen.

426
00:35:45.599 --> 00:35:54.900
So Russell was very lucky and that he had 2 episodes a year sometimes, which he could just hand off to Stephen and they would come back fully formed and so we had those and we had the Russell episodes.

427
00:35:54.960 --> 00:35:56.340
Stephen doesn't have a Stephen.

428
00:35:56.460 --> 00:36:01.139
Yeah, there's no one completely reliable whom he doesn't have to kind of rewrite.

429
00:36:01.199 --> 00:36:01.679
That's right.

430
00:36:01.739 --> 00:36:02.039
Not yet.

431
00:36:02.099 --> 00:36:04.019
Liam McNicholas.

432
00:36:04.079 --> 00:36:05.460
Ask us this.

433
00:36:05.519 --> 00:36:08.820
Would you like to see Simon Nye and Richard Curtis Wright more who?

434
00:36:08.880 --> 00:36:12.420
I think they have a very different take and would love to see another one.

435
00:36:12.480 --> 00:36:26.460
You were talking about this the other day in one of the episodes about having these one-off writers that Stephen knows that have done big films and other things and it's really great to see their different take on things and bring a different slant to stuff and it's really interesting.

436
00:36:26.519 --> 00:36:36.539
I personally don't necessarily see them coming back again because I think it's their one big idea that they've got, that they've always wanted to do on Doctor Who, and it's a case of sequelitis.

437
00:36:36.599 --> 00:36:40.440
But I do like the fact that if you bring in big names to do an episode.

438
00:36:40.500 --> 00:36:45.179
I think we get that perhaps with the doctor's wife next year, right?

439
00:36:45.239 --> 00:36:52.739
You often have a genesis of an idea that, depending on how much they write or what Stephen takes with it, can then form an episode that is exceptional.

440
00:36:52.800 --> 00:37:00.119
And we've seen that with Vincent and the doctor, which I don't necessarily think is the best episode ever, but the last 15 minutes just saw.

441
00:37:00.659 --> 00:37:04.679
I think that this is something that Russell had tried to do, isn't it?

442
00:37:04.739 --> 00:37:06.000
He tried to get Stephen Fry.

443
00:37:06.119 --> 00:37:07.320
He tried to get Paul Abbott.

444
00:37:07.380 --> 00:37:12.179
He had wanted to get sort of big riders from TV outside of the show.

445
00:37:12.239 --> 00:37:14.940
I mean he gets... sometimes did, Matthew Graham, for instance.

446
00:37:15.000 --> 00:37:16.139
Yeah, Matthew Graham, exactly.

447
00:37:16.199 --> 00:37:17.579
How did that go?

448
00:37:19.199 --> 00:37:36.300
And yes, maybe both Matthew Graham and Neil Gaiman are sort of good counterexamples to this because when they come back, I think they don't do anywhere near as good a job as they do the 1st time.

449
00:37:36.360 --> 00:37:45.659
And Matthew Graham did fear her, which is not great, but it also suffers from its incredible similarity to the idiot's lantern.

450
00:37:45.719 --> 00:37:50.639
So that's a problem for it, but it does at least try and do something different.

451
00:37:50.699 --> 00:37:54.179
The monster is something that we've never experienced before.

452
00:37:54.239 --> 00:38:04.860
He doesn't know how Doctor Who works, so he thinks they're going to be able to recreate the opening ceremony of the 2012 games in a way that is in any way satisfactory.

453
00:38:04.920 --> 00:38:07.079
And of course, they can't do that.

454
00:38:07.139 --> 00:38:14.940
But having someone who is skilled at writing television, but not versed in Doctor Who, I think is a good idea.

455
00:38:15.000 --> 00:38:32.940
And one of the problems with say it in the 80s, for instance, is that he had sort of ring fenced around the people that he thought could write Doctor Who, and he would say, most people can't do it, you know, most people can't write Doctor Who, even if they're good writers.

456
00:38:33.000 --> 00:38:45.840
And one of the things that make Karm more successful is he throws that out and just gets young riders in and gets them to write brilliant Doctor Who. basically creates a sort of an embryonic writer's room.

457
00:38:45.900 --> 00:38:46.559
Yeah.

458
00:38:46.619 --> 00:38:47.219
Yeah.

459
00:38:47.219 --> 00:38:47.579
Yeah.

460
00:38:47.639 --> 00:38:50.099
And he was very collaborative in that.

461
00:38:50.159 --> 00:39:00.360
And that's why his series of Doctor Who are still highly regarded, I think, because it was so collaborative and like there was a coherence there.

462
00:39:00.420 --> 00:39:15.420
As a showrunner, you have to be willing to put in the work with someone who's not familiar with the series or maybe hasn't written in that genre before, but the point of getting involved, people like Simon Nye on Amy's choice and Richard Curtis, was they bring a voice?

463
00:39:15.539 --> 00:39:16.139
Yeah.

464
00:39:16.139 --> 00:39:18.960
And that voice is so important to the episodes that they have.

465
00:39:19.019 --> 00:39:22.559
Maybe the problem with Matthew Graham was he didn't particularly bring a voice.

466
00:39:22.619 --> 00:39:28.860
And so fear her doesn't feel like anything in particular, but I absolutely applaud Stephen for doing that.

467
00:39:28.920 --> 00:39:36.000
I think that the people he brings on board make for really interesting episodes, maybe not 100% successful, but really interesting.

468
00:39:36.300 --> 00:39:42.059
I was astounded this time around by Amy's choice and how incredibly good it is.

469
00:39:42.119 --> 00:39:48.659
And by how it's absolutely pivotal to the season arc.

470
00:39:48.719 --> 00:39:52.500
And I just would love to know how that happened.

471
00:39:52.559 --> 00:39:56.820
Like, to what extent was he briefed by Stephen?

472
00:39:56.880 --> 00:40:03.840
You know, at what point was he told this has to be the episode where we really properly discovered that Amy loves Rory?

473
00:40:03.900 --> 00:40:06.179
It's so important and it's so good.

474
00:40:06.239 --> 00:40:07.320
It's so interesting.

475
00:40:07.380 --> 00:40:09.119
It's properly hilarious.

476
00:40:09.179 --> 00:40:10.320
It's imaginative.

477
00:40:10.380 --> 00:40:13.320
You know, he creates a great role in the Dreamlord.

478
00:40:13.380 --> 00:40:14.820
I think he's really, really good.

479
00:40:14.880 --> 00:40:25.559
So, yeah, I'm 100% behind bringing people like that in, but eventually I think there's probably diminishing returns. like all that you've said.

480
00:40:25.619 --> 00:40:36.420
Like, I think coming in for an episode is good. having them back again, probably not so much, and also what you said about the fact that Russell did have Stephen, that he could rely on.

481
00:40:36.480 --> 00:40:38.639
Stephen doesn't have that same person.

482
00:40:38.699 --> 00:40:50.219
And so, I think, as he gets tighter and more production begins to speed up and he's got less time, then you start to see a few more cracks, but that doesn't mean to say that's a bad thing.

483
00:40:50.280 --> 00:40:52.139
There's still interesting things happening.

484
00:40:52.199 --> 00:40:57.900
Some episodes are more successful than others and we'll obviously talk more about that as we, as we move forward.

485
00:40:57.960 --> 00:40:59.820
I think I saw a few cracks this season.

486
00:40:59.880 --> 00:41:01.260
Just a few.

487
00:41:01.559 --> 00:41:03.360
Boom, boom.

488
00:41:15.420 --> 00:41:22.380
Well, speaking of episodes, is there a particular episode this season for any of you that stands out above the rest?

489
00:41:22.380 --> 00:41:29.699
I think there's been some really amazing episodes and I could talk about them until the cows come home.

490
00:41:29.760 --> 00:41:37.380
The 11th hour, obviously just an amazing opening episode that takes, as I said earlier, so many boxes and does it so well.

491
00:41:37.440 --> 00:41:47.579
I think Pandora opens, has a strong case for being the most successful episode of Doctor Who ever, just in how well it fulfils its mission.

492
00:41:47.639 --> 00:41:52.139
The time of angels 2 parter is phenomenally good and possibly my favourite.

493
00:41:52.260 --> 00:42:02.940
My favourite story of the entire new era, just because it is so many things and so exciting and a level of production that I don't think we'd ever seen before.

494
00:42:03.000 --> 00:42:04.860
However, having said all of that, the lodger.

495
00:42:04.980 --> 00:42:07.619
The lodger is fantastic.

496
00:42:07.679 --> 00:42:18.719
It is so warm and so fun and does things the Doctor Who's never done before and wow, you know, we're 50 years into the show and we're still seeing new styles of episode.

497
00:42:19.380 --> 00:42:22.500
I never would have thought that you would have picked the lodger.

498
00:42:22.559 --> 00:42:23.760
That's amazing.

499
00:42:23.880 --> 00:42:24.780
Yeah, it's great.

500
00:42:24.840 --> 00:42:32.400
I think that's something about this season that there's so many, it's so similar, but it's so different and you can, you can pick anything, you know?

501
00:42:32.460 --> 00:42:52.860
I mean, I really adore the 11th hour and I know it's not part of this season, but the Christmas special is the other one for me that is the big standout, but just coming back to this, every single episode, there are moments that I really love in every single episode, whether that be heart wrenching or funny or whatever.

502
00:42:52.920 --> 00:43:06.900
And so, I can pick 2 episodes that I don't particularly care for, which is the 2nd part of that Silurian 2 part, which I think is appalling or very standard, and the 2nd half, well, bits and pieces of the Dalek episode, right?

503
00:43:06.960 --> 00:43:09.780
They're my 2 that I see falling down, right?

504
00:43:09.840 --> 00:43:14.940
But everything else is enjoyable and moments that I would do not.

505
00:43:15.059 --> 00:43:17.519
I think it's after the 1st 13 minutes, isn't that?

506
00:43:17.519 --> 00:43:18.480
13.5 minutes.

507
00:43:19.320 --> 00:43:22.800
Yeah, the 1st 13.5 minutes are great.

508
00:43:22.860 --> 00:43:24.659
And then there's the rest of the episode.

509
00:43:24.719 --> 00:43:26.400
Oh, come on, there's the Jamie Dodger thing.

510
00:43:26.699 --> 00:43:33.900
Nathan, I would absolutely agree with Peter's choices there.

511
00:43:33.960 --> 00:43:35.820
Like almost exactly.

512
00:43:35.880 --> 00:43:41.519
I think those are the best episodes of the season and they're not just very good.

513
00:43:41.579 --> 00:43:46.320
They're astoundingly good in places as good as Doctor Who has ever been.

514
00:43:46.619 --> 00:43:59.760
I want to give props to the overlooked vampires of Venice, partly because Helen McCrory is so spectacularly great in it and plays against Matt Smith so well.

515
00:43:59.820 --> 00:44:05.519
But it also has the sort of it's got 2 unenviable jobs.

516
00:44:05.519 --> 00:44:13.619
And one is being just a standard episode amidst a whole heap of things that are a bit more kind of interesting.

517
00:44:13.679 --> 00:44:22.199
And 2 is being the 1st attempt, the 1st failed attempt to get Amy to realise how much he loves Rory.

518
00:44:22.260 --> 00:44:23.880
So it doesn't actually work.

519
00:44:23.940 --> 00:44:29.039
It doesn't actually do anything and we have to wait till the following episode for that to actually happen.

520
00:44:29.099 --> 00:44:33.840
But despite that, it just manages to be solidly enjoyable and to look pretty great as well.

521
00:44:33.960 --> 00:44:37.800
If that's the standard of your standard episode is pretty high standard, yeah.

522
00:44:37.860 --> 00:44:46.739
Besides, what we always say that, you know, a boring episode is the greatest crime, but interesting failures are much more interesting than moderate successors.

523
00:44:46.800 --> 00:44:53.340
And so even though vampires of Venice doesn't hit, it doesn't score on everything, it's so interesting in so many ways.

524
00:44:53.460 --> 00:44:58.679
With the beast below, it's the other really improved for me this time round.

525
00:44:58.739 --> 00:45:01.739
And I agree with everything that you just said about that.

526
00:45:01.800 --> 00:45:11.400
For me, it would be Vincent and the Doctor, to me, regardless of quality, Vincent, the Doctor is my favourite Doctor Who story of all time.

527
00:45:11.460 --> 00:45:14.039
You are very upper middle class, though, Jess.

528
00:45:14.099 --> 00:45:15.539
Yes, I am.

529
00:45:16.380 --> 00:45:20.280
It's just got an emotional resonance with me.

530
00:45:21.000 --> 00:45:40.079
To think growing up, watching Doctor Who, that Doctor Who could do that, could address depression and mental health and do it in a quite considered and respectful way and nuanced way.

531
00:45:40.139 --> 00:45:43.679
I, like, it's just I cry for most of that episode.

532
00:45:43.739 --> 00:45:57.300
And to me, it's like the pinnacle of what Doctor Who can be, and it's almost... feels like it fits more in Russell's era, Doctor Who, because of emotional heart there.

533
00:45:57.360 --> 00:46:01.860
And being Doctor Who had achieved all of that and threw in a giant invisible turkey as well.

534
00:46:03.239 --> 00:46:08.699
But even then, you know, crap monster, there's a point to that as well.

535
00:46:08.760 --> 00:46:17.460
And you feel sorry for that monster. that, like, wounded alien creature as well.

536
00:46:17.519 --> 00:46:20.219
And it's, I know, I just, I just love it so much.

537
00:46:20.519 --> 00:46:27.000
It never ceases to bring a tear tear eye at some point in it.

538
00:46:27.059 --> 00:46:30.480
I mean, the whole them just lying in the field with a starry, starry night.

539
00:46:30.539 --> 00:46:46.500
Like that's that's an amazing moment as much as, you know, for Amy at the end or Vincent in his own museum, you know, they're all just incredible moments in that episode, which is, well, sound like a broken record, just amazing.

540
00:46:46.559 --> 00:46:48.840
But now I'll just change tack.

541
00:46:48.840 --> 00:46:55.860
And I'm just going to go to Snog, marry, and avoid for myself, and it's Rosanna Calvieri, Rest tack, and Ambrose.

542
00:46:56.639 --> 00:46:59.340
You're marrying Ambrose, aren't you?

543
00:47:00.360 --> 00:47:02.400
Todd is Ambrose.

544
00:47:03.659 --> 00:47:05.340
Oh wow.

545
00:47:05.820 --> 00:47:08.820
Ambrosia steeped in it.

546
00:47:09.659 --> 00:47:12.539
I'm avoiding Ambrose.

547
00:47:12.599 --> 00:47:15.179
I'm going to snog wrestack.

548
00:47:15.300 --> 00:47:17.039
That tongue.

549
00:47:17.099 --> 00:47:18.179
Yeah, yeah.

550
00:47:18.239 --> 00:47:21.239
Which means, you know, I'm going to have to marry Rosanna.

551
00:47:21.360 --> 00:47:22.920
She is spectacular.

552
00:47:23.159 --> 00:47:29.400
Another spectacular older woman with Matt Smith.

553
00:47:29.460 --> 00:47:37.440
So let's talk about the other older woman that we haven't spoken about yet, and that has to be River Song, and her involvement with this era of the show.

554
00:47:37.500 --> 00:47:41.760
If Alex Kingston had no chemistry with Matt Smith. would be over.

555
00:47:42.599 --> 00:47:46.260
I think that she is fantastic.

556
00:47:46.320 --> 00:47:51.179
It's one of my favourite things about this era is that you have her dropping in occasionally.

557
00:47:51.239 --> 00:47:53.639
I love the episodes that she's in.

558
00:47:53.699 --> 00:47:57.420
I think she just lifts any episode that she's a part of.

559
00:47:57.480 --> 00:47:59.639
I think she's wonderful with Matt.

560
00:47:59.699 --> 00:48:02.579
I think the concept of the character is terrific.

561
00:48:02.639 --> 00:48:17.639
I think that 1st introduction in David's last season and the way that that story ends is, you know, astonishing, if not sort of 100% original, I'm totally on board for it, she's absolutely one of the highlights of the era.

562
00:48:17.699 --> 00:48:24.119
And if you can get Alex Kingston to agree to be on your show as much as that, use her as much as possible.

563
00:48:24.239 --> 00:48:26.760
Yeah, she is fantastic, isn't she?

564
00:48:26.820 --> 00:48:28.739
Do you know who she reminds me of?

565
00:48:28.800 --> 00:48:32.820
From the classic series in terms of her importance and her utility?

566
00:48:32.880 --> 00:48:33.960
Corporal Bell.

567
00:48:35.519 --> 00:48:40.559
There were freak weather conditions on that beach.

568
00:48:40.619 --> 00:48:42.239
No, the brigadier, actually.

569
00:48:42.300 --> 00:48:43.800
Yeah, I was thinking that too.

570
00:48:43.800 --> 00:48:57.239
She's that important to the show and she just she walks into the series and pitches her performance so perfectly and the character fits in so well that she she's in danger of taking over the series.

571
00:48:57.300 --> 00:48:58.320
She's like the master.

572
00:48:58.380 --> 00:49:00.599
And every time she comes onto the screen.

573
00:49:00.659 --> 00:49:06.179
She absolutely draws your eye and is another principle to match the doctor.

574
00:49:06.239 --> 00:49:09.420
It's an incredible creation river song.

575
00:49:09.480 --> 00:49:11.699
I'd happily let her take over the show.

576
00:49:11.820 --> 00:49:13.619
No more Matt.

577
00:49:13.679 --> 00:49:15.179
Well, no, no.

578
00:49:15.239 --> 00:49:22.139
Just, you know, like, the more river in a Doctor Who season, the better, in my opinion.

579
00:49:22.199 --> 00:49:26.639
Can you think of a female character who's been quite like that ever?

580
00:49:26.699 --> 00:49:27.900
In the series?

581
00:49:27.960 --> 00:49:44.519
Well, yeah, like in Doctor Who, up until this point, because she has that sort of swagger and bravado and that sort of, you know, she's an adventurer, but she's like super glamorous and confident and absolutely sort of feminine.

582
00:49:44.579 --> 00:49:47.039
I just think she's so fabulous.

583
00:49:47.099 --> 00:49:48.119
It's so interesting.

584
00:49:48.179 --> 00:49:49.980
I think of the Rani.

585
00:49:50.039 --> 00:50:03.239
But the Rani was so 80s and so of that time and that production team that they never achieve anything of the heights of River song, but she was definitely a prototype kind of character who could have taken over the show in that interesting way.

586
00:50:03.300 --> 00:50:05.940
Yeah, I think she's...

587
00:50:05.940 --> 00:50:12.300
She is a little bit more panto, like in her 2nd appearance, which is kind of my favourite.

588
00:50:12.360 --> 00:50:16.920
And I like her a great deal, but there is something about this.

589
00:50:16.980 --> 00:50:26.519
And, you know, like we end up complaining that Moffatt writes strong women because he loves being bossed around by women and that's his kind of thing.

590
00:50:26.579 --> 00:50:34.199
Like, well, he likes the idea of a sort of hapless man who has a woman to come in and kind of sort him out.

591
00:50:34.320 --> 00:50:43.440
And that's been variously interpreted as empowering or, you know, a bit sexist by different critics.

592
00:50:44.159 --> 00:50:47.820
But I really like her.

593
00:50:47.880 --> 00:50:52.139
I just think she's amazingly charismatic and she's just fun to have around.

594
00:50:52.199 --> 00:50:55.619
That thing at the beginning of Time of Angels.

595
00:50:55.679 --> 00:51:05.219
That whole sort of wonderful caper sequence and she's in a sort of gorgeous evening dress and all of that, the heels, the glasses, the glasses.

596
00:51:05.280 --> 00:51:06.360
It's wonderful.

597
00:51:06.420 --> 00:51:07.559
It's so enjoyable.

598
00:51:07.619 --> 00:51:17.159
You know, it occurs to me, as we're speaking now, that there's sometimes debate over whether the river is a companion or not, you know, one of those useless canonical debates, but she's not a companion.

599
00:51:17.219 --> 00:51:17.760
She's a doctor.

600
00:51:17.820 --> 00:51:32.400
She's given the same amount of on-screen presence and backstory and scenes that she has to herself that she leads and she's played by an actress who is of a calibre where she just easily could have been the doctor.

601
00:51:32.460 --> 00:51:34.440
And so when have we had that in the past?

602
00:51:35.880 --> 00:51:50.519
It's interesting that you compared it to the brigadier, because I was just thinking going along the lines of having her in there is like having this older female that pops up in all these stories, but it's an ongoing one, but you're so totally right.

603
00:51:50.579 --> 00:51:53.760
She just is that other lead in the show.

604
00:51:53.760 --> 00:51:57.119
And she's brilliant.

605
00:51:57.179 --> 00:51:57.960
I'm lover.

606
00:51:58.440 --> 00:52:01.079
I know we're doing the River song podcast.

607
00:52:01.139 --> 00:52:18.000
We just did it So this is one for everybody.

608
00:52:18.059 --> 00:52:19.199
Snogmarrier, void.

609
00:52:19.260 --> 00:52:22.079
Vincent, Craig, Jeff.

610
00:52:22.800 --> 00:52:25.679
So easy, very.

611
00:52:26.099 --> 00:52:33.059
Snog, Jeff, because look at him, marry Craig and avoid Vincent, because drama.

612
00:52:33.179 --> 00:52:34.559
Yeah.

613
00:52:34.679 --> 00:52:37.320
Well, that lasted all the 5 times.

614
00:52:37.380 --> 00:52:44.400
See, see, I would marry Vincent because he needs someone to support him.

615
00:52:44.400 --> 00:52:45.239
You want to fix her upper?

616
00:52:45.300 --> 00:52:48.059
No, I just, I have compassion for him.

617
00:52:48.179 --> 00:52:49.800
Baby.

618
00:52:50.219 --> 00:52:53.400
Also, he died quite early and left a large estate.

619
00:52:53.460 --> 00:52:55.019
No, he did.

620
00:52:55.139 --> 00:52:58.260
He left in a 100 years time.

621
00:52:58.320 --> 00:52:59.340
Lovely painting.

622
00:52:59.460 --> 00:53:02.699
Well, it's mainly about the lovely paintings.

623
00:53:02.760 --> 00:53:05.219
I think Jeff.

624
00:53:05.280 --> 00:53:06.179
Oh, Jeff.

625
00:53:06.239 --> 00:53:07.980
I know, what a waste.

626
00:53:08.039 --> 00:53:08.940
The pretty one.

627
00:53:09.000 --> 00:53:10.079
I said on screen.

628
00:53:10.139 --> 00:53:12.719
It's so funny that line.

629
00:53:12.780 --> 00:53:14.219
And Rory's reaction.

630
00:53:14.280 --> 00:53:14.760
Oh, thanks.

631
00:53:15.360 --> 00:53:16.920
So great.

632
00:53:17.039 --> 00:53:21.300
So I yes, I think if I started snogging Jeff, I wouldn't stop.

633
00:53:24.659 --> 00:53:31.260
Who are you a fan of this season in terms of actors and actresses that have come into the show as guest stars?

634
00:53:32.219 --> 00:53:35.039
Well, Olivia Coleman, obviously.

635
00:53:35.099 --> 00:53:36.360
And Helen.

636
00:53:36.420 --> 00:53:38.880
And Helen McCrory, I think, probably.

637
00:53:38.940 --> 00:53:40.440
And Daisy Haggard.

638
00:53:40.500 --> 00:53:42.300
Oh, Daisy Haggard, absolutely.

639
00:53:42.360 --> 00:53:44.639
I mean, it's an unshowy part, isn't it?

640
00:53:44.699 --> 00:53:46.079
She is magnificent.

641
00:53:46.139 --> 00:53:53.760
And you know, it's got to know her and things like back to life and episodes. with her famous catchphrase.

642
00:53:56.880 --> 00:53:58.980
So she's wonderful.

643
00:53:59.039 --> 00:54:03.059
But, I mean, the casting in that episode. is spectacular, the lodger.

644
00:54:03.119 --> 00:54:04.139
We get Daisy Haggard.

645
00:54:04.260 --> 00:54:09.719
We get James Corden, who then was sort of at the peak of his dramatic power. on British screens.

646
00:54:09.780 --> 00:54:15.059
And I mean, can we just say how many great people have we had from the history boys?

647
00:54:15.059 --> 00:54:17.280
We had James Corden.

648
00:54:17.340 --> 00:54:20.639
Of course, we're going to get Danny Pink in a couple of seasons time.

649
00:54:20.699 --> 00:54:23.400
Dominic Cooper and people like that who've just been amazing.

650
00:54:23.460 --> 00:54:25.559
And Russell Toby, of course.

651
00:54:25.619 --> 00:54:27.420
So that provided...

652
00:54:27.420 --> 00:54:28.079
Sasha.

653
00:54:28.199 --> 00:54:31.320
Well, how could I miss my boyfriend Sasha?

654
00:54:31.679 --> 00:54:34.559
We don't talk much about his career, yeah.

655
00:54:34.619 --> 00:54:36.659
Too busy doing that.

656
00:54:36.719 --> 00:54:37.980
You just stare longingly.

657
00:54:38.039 --> 00:54:39.000
That's correct.

658
00:54:39.059 --> 00:54:45.840
But, I mean, that production unleashed an enormous amount of talent into British screens.

659
00:54:45.840 --> 00:54:50.940
And I think James Corden was the perfect choice to play that role in the lodger.

660
00:54:51.000 --> 00:54:53.760
It wouldn't have been as charming with anyone else.

661
00:54:54.000 --> 00:54:56.280
There's so many to pick from.

662
00:54:56.340 --> 00:54:57.420
There really is.

663
00:54:57.480 --> 00:55:14.340
I mean, I can't remember actors and actresses names, but if we go with like Liz 10, or if we go with Nasrin Chowdhry, or if we go with Vincent, you know, episode after episode has somebody in it that is a name that is a standout that is a character.

664
00:55:14.400 --> 00:55:25.920
I think Tony Curran is amazing, as Vincent, and you had to really get, as well as it's written, you had to get someone who could just look like him and embody that character.

665
00:55:25.980 --> 00:55:27.900
And I think he does an incredible job.

666
00:55:27.960 --> 00:55:33.360
I will go back to Helen Macquarie again back in the vampires of Venice because I think she is that good.

667
00:55:33.420 --> 00:55:35.400
And serenely beautiful.

668
00:55:35.460 --> 00:55:36.960
Oh magnificent.

669
00:55:37.019 --> 00:55:42.659
I think it's really difficult to choose. a favourite this season.

670
00:55:42.719 --> 00:55:45.659
There are so many good guest actors.

671
00:55:45.719 --> 00:55:47.820
Helen McCrory is amazing.

672
00:55:47.880 --> 00:55:57.179
Going back to watching this season, I was never a huge fan of Vampires of Venice because, like you said earlier, Nathan is a standard episode.

673
00:55:57.239 --> 00:56:03.900
There's nothing really plot wise in the season that makes it that important.

674
00:56:03.960 --> 00:56:08.280
Oh, so I thought when I was watching it, but she is amazing.

675
00:56:08.340 --> 00:56:10.260
She's a brilliant.

676
00:56:10.320 --> 00:56:11.940
She was a brilliant actress.

677
00:56:12.599 --> 00:56:17.099
Yeah, it's really, it's really difficult to choose someone not to like.

678
00:56:17.159 --> 00:56:19.860
That's because you're a complicated space-time event.

679
00:56:21.900 --> 00:56:23.639
The dream lord.

680
00:56:23.760 --> 00:56:25.380
Toby...

681
00:56:25.380 --> 00:56:25.920
Toby Jones.

682
00:56:25.980 --> 00:56:28.739
Toby Jones, I think does a phenomenal job in that episode.

683
00:56:28.800 --> 00:56:31.380
So let's do a dog, Mary avoid.

684
00:56:31.440 --> 00:56:33.300
Strong Mary avoid.

685
00:56:33.360 --> 00:56:34.139
Bracewell.

686
00:56:34.199 --> 00:56:36.659
Father Octavian, the Dream Lord.

687
00:56:36.780 --> 00:56:39.599
You'd have to avoid the Dream Lord, surely.

688
00:56:39.659 --> 00:56:52.559
Yeah, particularly in that sort of 70s, you know, shirt open to the waist look that he does. right. in his butcher's frock trying trying to do Amy in her nurse's frock and not succeeding.

689
00:56:52.619 --> 00:56:55.800
He's he is amazing, Todd, isn't he?

690
00:56:55.860 --> 00:56:56.760
He really is something.

691
00:56:56.820 --> 00:56:58.440
It's a great character too.

692
00:56:58.559 --> 00:57:00.719
And I'm glad it doesn't go anywhere.

693
00:57:00.780 --> 00:57:06.239
It's just a one off, a super weird kind of quirk in the doctor's psychology or something.

694
00:57:06.420 --> 00:57:08.159
For space reason.

695
00:57:08.219 --> 00:57:09.539
Yeah, space reasons.

696
00:57:09.599 --> 00:57:13.440
We don't have to go back and kind of find out what planet he's from or anything like that.

697
00:57:13.500 --> 00:57:15.059
He's really good.

698
00:57:15.119 --> 00:57:17.519
I think you have to avoid the Dreamlord.

699
00:57:17.639 --> 00:57:20.099
I'd snog Father Octavian?

700
00:57:20.159 --> 00:57:21.780
Oh, yeah, I think that's the logical choice.

701
00:57:21.840 --> 00:57:23.639
You want to see the best of him, don't you?

702
00:57:23.699 --> 00:57:25.500
Yes, yes.

703
00:57:25.559 --> 00:57:27.420
And so that leaves us with...

704
00:57:27.420 --> 00:57:28.019
Bracewell.

705
00:57:28.320 --> 00:57:31.320
Bracewell seems like a bit of an old romantic.

706
00:57:31.380 --> 00:57:36.900
I think I could put up with that. nice little house Yeah, absolutely, you'd have competition with that woman he was always talking about.

707
00:57:36.960 --> 00:57:38.519
Yeah, Adorabella.

708
00:57:39.119 --> 00:57:42.059
Dorabella, where is that name from?

709
00:57:42.179 --> 00:57:46.079
Sorry, I just have never heard of it before, and, you know, that's my middle name.

710
00:57:49.139 --> 00:57:50.820
Just stop it, Peter.

711
00:57:50.880 --> 00:57:55.679
Wasn't that the name of, um, It's like a cow name, isn't it?

712
00:57:56.400 --> 00:57:58.380
Like, where does it come from?

713
00:57:58.500 --> 00:58:00.840
Like, I mean, we know a lot of eccentric British names.

714
00:58:00.900 --> 00:58:04.199
No offence to anybody who's from Britain who makes...

715
00:58:04.260 --> 00:58:05.639
Oh, he's called Torabella.

716
00:58:05.699 --> 00:58:07.320
I've never heard of that.

717
00:58:07.380 --> 00:58:10.739
Like, Esme, whatever it happens to me, adorable.

718
00:58:10.739 --> 00:58:12.480
It reminds me of Doris from the Silurians.

719
00:58:12.599 --> 00:58:14.940
There's so many in my barn.

720
00:58:15.360 --> 00:58:18.599
I was going to say, Mrs. Watson name's kitchen.

721
00:58:18.659 --> 00:58:19.139
What's her name?

722
00:58:19.199 --> 00:58:20.639
Mrs. Farrell.

723
00:58:20.699 --> 00:58:21.960
That Farrell.

724
00:58:22.019 --> 00:58:23.039
Yeah.

725
00:58:23.039 --> 00:58:27.719
It was actually Rodan's 1st name in the Invasion of Time.

726
00:58:27.780 --> 00:58:29.400
Whatabella Road?

727
00:58:29.460 --> 00:58:29.760
Yeah, yeah.

728
00:58:29.820 --> 00:58:30.719
Not many people know.

729
00:58:30.780 --> 00:58:31.739
Just draw for short.

730
00:58:31.800 --> 00:58:33.539
Yeah, just me and Andrew Pixley know that one.

731
00:58:33.599 --> 00:58:37.800
He was a very popular name on Gallifrey. was also Dorabella Angen.

732
00:58:40.860 --> 00:58:42.119
Oh, dear.

733
00:58:42.179 --> 00:58:42.960
All right.

734
00:58:43.019 --> 00:58:47.159
Let's head into Jenny Laird.

735
00:58:47.219 --> 00:58:49.679
Oh, Jenny Lanner Ward.

736
00:58:50.159 --> 00:58:57.539
It goes to Stephen Moffat for giving Chris Chibnell an important two-part episode at the end of the season.

737
00:58:57.599 --> 00:59:00.900
I will not be elaborating further on that at this time.

738
00:59:00.960 --> 00:59:04.980
I think the puzzling creative choice has to be the obvious one, those Daleks.

739
00:59:05.579 --> 00:59:08.280
But we secretly like them.

740
00:59:08.340 --> 00:59:12.300
We secretly do, but there's a reason that we secretly like them and don't openly like them.

741
00:59:13.079 --> 00:59:16.500
I love Nathan and Peter, both of your choices.

742
00:59:16.559 --> 00:59:17.760
I think they're great.

743
00:59:17.820 --> 00:59:19.980
I can't come up with anything to supersede that.

744
00:59:20.039 --> 00:59:22.199
I really can't, you know, I really can't.

745
00:59:22.260 --> 00:59:23.579
James.

746
00:59:23.880 --> 00:59:26.340
It has to be those Staleks.

747
00:59:26.639 --> 00:59:31.019
They were so close in a lot of ways.

748
00:59:31.079 --> 00:59:34.320
Like the idea of very far away in lots of other ways.

749
00:59:34.380 --> 00:59:40.260
Yeah, yeah, they like, it was a great idea to redesign them. you know, to freshen them up.

750
00:59:40.320 --> 00:59:46.619
And I think the idea of making them pop art colours is not necessarily a bad one.

751
00:59:46.679 --> 00:59:57.119
It's the fiddling too much with the design of them, the humpback, the, you know, tiny, tiny heads.

752
00:59:57.179 --> 01:00:01.199
The tiny heads and the big asses. right here.

753
01:00:02.880 --> 01:00:18.840
And you can tell from the moment that they like made the decision to make certain design changes that they regretted it because they spend the next, you know, 3 or 4 seasons, like every time they come back, you know, shooting them instead of ways, repainting them.

754
01:00:18.900 --> 01:00:21.599
Um, multicolidelics is a great idea.

755
01:00:21.659 --> 01:00:25.500
And it's such a cruel juxtaposition with the Ionsides in that story, which look phenomenal.

756
01:00:25.559 --> 01:00:26.519
Yeah, yeah.

757
01:00:26.579 --> 01:00:31.739
And they basically just say, well, the iron sides are no more, which gets every fan offside, I think, you know?

758
01:00:31.800 --> 01:00:34.860
So it's an important time now for Stog Mario, avoid.

759
01:00:34.920 --> 01:00:37.980
The new Salurians, the new Dalek paradigm or Angel Bob.

760
01:00:38.099 --> 01:00:40.920
Oh, Angel Bob.

761
01:00:40.980 --> 01:00:46.139
Pre-getting his spine ripped out. post.

762
01:00:48.300 --> 01:00:51.239
The only chance I stand, I think.

763
01:00:51.239 --> 01:00:53.760
That jawline.

764
01:00:53.820 --> 01:00:54.119
Wow.

765
01:00:54.179 --> 01:00:56.820
I mean, look, you wouldn't...

766
01:00:56.820 --> 01:00:57.539
You wouldn't remember it.

767
01:00:58.380 --> 01:00:59.940
That's true.

768
01:01:00.000 --> 01:01:01.679
You just have to experience it again and again.

769
01:01:03.059 --> 01:01:06.539
I have a big soft spot for the new Silurians.

770
01:01:06.599 --> 01:01:07.739
I think that they're good.

771
01:01:07.800 --> 01:01:10.500
I'd marry them Not Malakare though.

772
01:01:10.559 --> 01:01:12.360
Yeah, he's a monster.

773
01:01:12.659 --> 01:01:15.780
But we talked about this in the episodes.

774
01:01:15.840 --> 01:01:22.679
I think that you can't have super rubber faced people and still have that work.

775
01:01:22.739 --> 01:01:24.119
You need to have an actors' performance.

776
01:01:24.179 --> 01:01:26.460
So I think they're quite well judged.

777
01:01:26.519 --> 01:01:32.460
And certainly the success of Madame Vastra kind of...

778
01:01:32.519 --> 01:01:32.940
Yeah, yeah.

779
01:01:33.000 --> 01:01:37.860
And if there is a slight problem this season and it's not a big problem at all.

780
01:01:37.920 --> 01:01:39.960
I think that the design sometimes misses.

781
01:01:40.019 --> 01:01:43.079
I think that the new Daleks were misconceived.

782
01:01:43.139 --> 01:01:47.940
They got wrong, the things were trussle absolutely got right when he brought the Daleks back.

783
01:01:48.000 --> 01:01:57.239
I think the Silurians aren't entirely successful in their prosthetics and the way that they look and why they are the Silurians, if they're going to be so different.

784
01:01:57.300 --> 01:02:02.039
And, you know, just on a smaller level, things like the Dalek control room and victory of the Dalek. doesn't work.

785
01:02:02.099 --> 01:02:06.179
And so there's a couple of noticeable lapses in design work, just a couple.

786
01:02:06.239 --> 01:02:10.260
So you're avoiding the new Dialect paradigm and you're marrying angel Bob.

787
01:02:10.320 --> 01:02:10.679
Is that correct?

788
01:02:10.739 --> 01:02:14.460
Uh, I would snog and marry Angel Bob.

789
01:02:14.519 --> 01:02:17.940
Thank you for clarifying that Then try and avoid him and die.

790
01:02:19.199 --> 01:02:20.820
All right.

791
01:02:20.880 --> 01:02:25.260
The Bonnie Langford, the startling discovery or moment of...

792
01:02:25.260 --> 01:02:30.599
Oh, I think the Bonnie Langford Award should go to Karen Gillen.

793
01:02:30.659 --> 01:02:34.739
She's an unknown actress, really, at that point.

794
01:02:34.800 --> 01:02:40.320
And she has gone on to great success since.

795
01:02:40.800 --> 01:02:43.380
But she's just revelation.

796
01:02:44.039 --> 01:02:46.920
I think that Bonnie Langford goes to Matt Smith.

797
01:02:46.980 --> 01:02:48.960
I'll be allowed to choose him.

798
01:02:49.079 --> 01:02:50.460
Yeah, absolutely.

799
01:02:50.519 --> 01:02:51.599
I'm choosing Matt Smith.

800
01:02:51.659 --> 01:02:53.219
I think he is astonishing.

801
01:02:53.340 --> 01:02:55.920
And immediately astonishing.

802
01:02:55.980 --> 01:03:02.460
In fact, maybe not immediately, maybe he doesn't land that scene at the end of End of Time part two.

803
01:03:02.519 --> 01:03:04.619
You know, like he's not quite sure what he's doing.

804
01:03:04.679 --> 01:03:06.960
Which has charms all the time.

805
01:03:07.019 --> 01:03:07.619
Yes, yeah.

806
01:03:07.619 --> 01:03:10.679
To be fair, he has half of the Tartars in his mouth at that point.

807
01:03:10.739 --> 01:03:11.760
Yeah, yeah, I know.

808
01:03:11.820 --> 01:03:13.199
But it suddenly, suddenly...

809
01:03:13.260 --> 01:03:15.000
We won't see that again until the door is away.

810
01:03:18.059 --> 01:03:22.619
But he suddenly appears on the scene at the beginning of the 11th hour and he's incredible.

811
01:03:22.679 --> 01:03:30.000
And it's a kind of doctor that we hadn't had in the new series because you had Russell saying, I don't want the doctor to be eccentric.

812
01:03:30.059 --> 01:03:31.800
He's got the time machine and all of that.

813
01:03:31.860 --> 01:03:33.179
He's got enough going on.

814
01:03:33.239 --> 01:03:35.159
He doesn't have to wear a silly costume.

815
01:03:35.219 --> 01:03:36.780
He doesn't have to be a weirdo.

816
01:03:36.840 --> 01:03:48.900
But it turns out making him eccentric and making him into the eccentric old man that he was when the show started was a brilliant idea and that Matt was the perfect person for it.

817
01:03:48.960 --> 01:03:50.639
So mine goes to Matt Smith.

818
01:03:50.699 --> 01:03:56.219
I mean, Matt is the obvious choice, but can I also say, Matt Smith's doctor, Bonnie Langford's companion.

819
01:03:56.280 --> 01:03:58.500
I would watch an entire series of that.

820
01:03:58.860 --> 01:04:00.659
Say it 3 times.

821
01:04:00.719 --> 01:04:18.900
My Bunny Langford will go to Adam Smith, the director of the Time of Angels 2 parter and the 11th hour because he resets this series and brings let the series in general and brings a confidence and a style and a focus to production that is unprecedented, I think, in Doctor Who.

822
01:04:19.019 --> 01:04:21.300
I don't know if I really got one.

823
01:04:21.360 --> 01:04:26.159
I think, you know, I think Karen's a startling discovery, for me, Matt is phenomenal.

824
01:04:26.219 --> 01:04:28.679
I've always loved Arthur Darvel in the role.

825
01:04:28.739 --> 01:04:42.300
It might even be the vampires of Venice, could be my Bonnie Langford for an episode that I had really discounted and one that just really surprised me so much and how pivotal you've mentioned is to the whole season.

826
01:04:42.360 --> 01:04:53.099
And I guess the other moment for me, originally was the starry night when they were lying down in the fields and seeing the heavens just come to life as a painting.

827
01:04:53.099 --> 01:04:59.219
Every time I watch that episode this season, that moment is just there for me.

828
01:05:06.059 --> 01:05:10.079
All right, we're about to embark on series 6.

829
01:05:10.139 --> 01:05:12.300
Where do you sit with that at the moment?

830
01:05:12.360 --> 01:05:15.119
What are your thoughts or what do you hope to discover?

831
01:05:15.300 --> 01:05:30.239
I think I'm going to be disappointed because I originally thought series 6 was better than series 5 and I think I'm going to be terribly, terribly underwhelmed by it.

832
01:05:30.300 --> 01:05:34.739
I hope I'm not, but I think I will be.

833
01:05:34.860 --> 01:05:43.920
I've watched ahead because I wanted to be more familiar with Matt sort of generally before we started doing series 5.

834
01:05:44.219 --> 01:06:03.059
And I think there are some good things in series 6, but I think that I think that he tries to do a similar arc centred on Amy and a particular kind of milestone that she reaches in her life.

835
01:06:03.119 --> 01:06:07.619
And I think that the treatment of it is weird and upsetting.

836
01:06:07.679 --> 01:06:13.619
And I think that there's a significant problem in the production that causes it to be split into 2 parts.

837
01:06:13.679 --> 01:06:19.019
There's something going on in the background that actually starts to affect the quality of what we see on screen.

838
01:06:19.079 --> 01:06:27.780
But nevertheless, it's still like incredibly entertaining and I think there are some amazing episodes in it and some really dismal ones.

839
01:06:27.840 --> 01:06:28.980
Peter?

840
01:06:29.039 --> 01:06:36.539
I think I'll get my wish of seeing Moffat fail, and that will be very interesting and nevertheless absorbing viewing.

841
01:06:36.599 --> 01:06:42.960
I think also the series loses maybe a little bit of its reviewer next series.

842
01:06:43.019 --> 01:06:44.400
That may not be true.

843
01:06:44.460 --> 01:06:46.079
I'm looking forward to rewatching it and seeing.

844
01:06:46.139 --> 01:06:58.440
For me, what I'm looking forward to is seeing where Karen goes with the role of Amy because I'm reevaluating her and I'm now starting off in a much better place.

845
01:06:58.559 --> 01:07:03.239
So that may affect what I actually think of a number of episodes.

846
01:07:03.300 --> 01:07:12.239
But I say this quite openly, I consider series 6 to be the worst Moffat season for me by far in all of the 6 that he did do.

847
01:07:12.300 --> 01:07:13.440
Others won't agree.

848
01:07:13.500 --> 01:07:16.079
Um, but it's my least favourite.

849
01:07:16.139 --> 01:07:18.900
I'm going to see where, obviously, made up.

850
01:07:18.960 --> 01:07:20.099
You'll end up loving it.

851
01:07:21.239 --> 01:07:33.480
Listeners, I am looking at Nathan now with my desk stair look that I give to children in class who won't shut up or say a smart comment that just does not impress me very much, but hey, you know me.

852
01:07:33.539 --> 01:07:35.099
I'll end up loving.

853
01:07:35.280 --> 01:07:36.780
Thank you.

854
01:08:03.900 --> 01:08:08.579
Well, Davis, now that's all we had time for this week, and for this series of Doctor Who.

855
01:08:08.699 --> 01:08:13.679
We'll be back in a few weeks' time for Christmas in July with a Christmas carol.

856
01:08:13.739 --> 01:08:29.220
In the meantime, you can find us wherever you get your podcasts, and you can keep up with us at Flightthrough Entirety on Facebook, at FT Podcast on Twitter, and on our website, FlightthroughEntirety.com, where you'll find links to our other podcasts, Bondfinger, and Jody Intetera.

857
01:08:29.340 --> 01:08:34.859
Until next time, whatever it is, whatever you're doing, let's make it a good one, eh?

858
01:08:34.920 --> 01:08:36.119
We'll see you soon.

859
01:08:36.180 --> 01:08:38.939
Thank you very much for listening and good night.

860
01:08:39.000 --> 01:08:39.720
Good night.

861
01:08:39.779 --> 01:08:40.560
See you later.

862
01:08:40.619 --> 01:08:41.039
Good night.

863
01:08:45.600 --> 01:08:52.439
That was Flight 3 Entirety, starring Todby, will be Nathan Bottomley, Peter Dorabella Griffiths and James Selwood.

864
01:08:52.500 --> 01:08:54.600
Theme arrangement by Cameron Lamb.

865
01:08:54.659 --> 01:09:00.659
This episode of Brilliant Pole was recorded on the 6th of June 2020 and released on the 13th of June.

866
01:09:03.720 --> 01:09:14.279
We're off in a few weeks, holiday now, so if you need us, we've got our sunglasses, our sun lotion, and our water wings, and you'll find us sitting in a fizzy puddle somewhere on the planet, Florama.

867
01:09:14.340 --> 01:09:16.680
Oh, wait, should that red light be flashing?

868
01:09:21.359 --> 01:09:23.699
I think your phone is buzzing.

869
01:09:24.479 --> 01:09:27.239
It might be an idea to take it off the table.

870
01:09:27.300 --> 01:09:28.439
Oh, okay.

871
01:09:28.500 --> 01:09:29.220
Someone's is.

872
01:09:29.279 --> 01:09:30.119
Might have been mine.

873
01:09:30.840 --> 01:09:32.699
It could have been me.

874
01:09:32.880 --> 01:09:34.920
No, that was 8 minutes ago.

875
01:09:34.979 --> 01:09:37.500
Anyone else fancy sister Lamont?

876
01:09:38.819 --> 01:09:40.800
Pre-Zigon.

877
01:09:42.659 --> 01:09:44.460
Or post?

878
01:09:44.460 --> 01:09:47.880
I loathe this abomination of a body.

879
01:09:48.840 --> 01:09:52.199
He was the sucker, persistently.

880
01:09:55.260 --> 01:09:56.939
I think we pay that one.

881
01:09:57.000 --> 01:09:57.539
Come on.

882
01:09:58.920 --> 01:10:02.939
A fetish, please, locking people in oxygen tanks.

883
01:10:03.840 --> 01:10:05.880
What's the safe word?

884
01:10:07.439 --> 01:10:09.060
Scaraza.

885
01:10:13.979 --> 01:10:18.239
Well, on that note, James, Snog Murray avoid.