WEBVTT NOTE This transcript was created on 2026-06-07 at 15:12:29 1 00:00:36.000 --> 00:00:45.420 Hello, Delister, and welcome back to Flight Through Entirety, the only Doctor Who podcast that's a bit out of practice, but has certainly had some wonderful feedback. 2 00:00:45.479 --> 00:00:47.159 I'm Nathan. 3 00:00:47.280 --> 00:00:48.659 I'm Brendan. 4 00:00:48.719 --> 00:00:51.659 I'm Joe. And I'm Jack. 5 00:00:51.719 --> 00:01:00.119 Well, it's the night before the doctor's certain death, and so who else would he spend his last few hours with but James Corden? 6 00:01:00.179 --> 00:01:03.420 We all learn a valuable lesson about fatherhood. 7 00:01:03.479 --> 00:01:07.260 We have a bit of a dance, and it's all as funny and thought provoking as usual. 8 00:01:07.379 --> 00:01:09.780 Time to say goodbye, doctor. 9 00:01:09.840 --> 00:01:11.280 It's closing time. 10 00:01:32.700 --> 00:01:37.980 So, I have a feeling that we did this one before together earlier this year. 11 00:01:38.219 --> 00:01:44.280 This is just a remake of the lodger, isn't it? 12 00:01:44.340 --> 00:01:59.040 Yeah, I mean, if you really like the lodge of the 1st time and really laughed at the jokes, you'll get a, I guess, a warm chuckle out of this, depending on, depending on how hard you love the 1st time. 13 00:01:59.099 --> 00:02:05.340 So we could make a list of the things that are the same, okay? 14 00:02:05.400 --> 00:02:13.139 So we have people going missing, being lured to their death by aliens for some secret purpose. 15 00:02:13.439 --> 00:02:19.439 Yep, and those aliens also are scraping by to survive. 16 00:02:19.500 --> 00:02:20.819 They're on their last legs. 17 00:02:20.879 --> 00:02:25.979 We had a spaceship above a house and this time we've got a spaceship below a shop. 18 00:02:27.419 --> 00:02:45.360 We have James Corden's character, has to take on an exciting new role, a new responsibility that he is tentative about and he solves the alien invasion plot by wholeheartedly accepting that new responsibility. 19 00:02:45.479 --> 00:02:55.319 There's a technological lure that is bringing human beings into an environment where they are stripped down for parts for a machine. 20 00:02:57.479 --> 00:03:01.379 The doctor is better at everything than James Corden. 21 00:03:01.439 --> 00:03:04.259 And love sodding, conquers all. 22 00:03:04.319 --> 00:03:06.599 Yeah, yeah, in both of them. 23 00:03:06.659 --> 00:03:21.719 In this abundance of repeats that closing time does with shtick that the lodger did, one of the saddest casualties is one of the lodger's great successes, which is the character of Sophie, who I think is... 24 00:03:21.780 --> 00:03:24.780 Seriously missing. 25 00:03:24.840 --> 00:03:28.500 Or as Nathan, as Nathan calls her, the next 14th doctor. 26 00:03:28.680 --> 00:03:32.460 Unfortunately, she was working full time on a stage play. 27 00:03:32.520 --> 00:03:39.780 She was asked to appear in the whole episode before scripting even began, but yeah, she could only give them 2 days of filming. 28 00:03:39.840 --> 00:03:50.460 But it's nice to know that, even though the whole thing, of course, is let's get James Corden back with Matt Smith, they're like, well, the episode wouldn't have been so good without Daisy Haggard as well, is Daisy available? 29 00:03:50.520 --> 00:03:54.900 Oh, unfortunately she isn't, but we can, we can still have her in the story. 30 00:03:54.960 --> 00:03:56.039 Yeah. 31 00:03:56.099 --> 00:04:03.180 And, you know, she does get some really lovely lines where she's like, actually, I've labelled all the food and, you know, arrows. 32 00:04:03.240 --> 00:04:10.020 Yeah, arrows, you know, it's again, it's an obvious setup, but when she comes back and the house is immaculate. 33 00:04:10.080 --> 00:04:11.879 It is really quite a lovely little scene. 34 00:04:12.659 --> 00:04:31.019 I really lamented in the lodger that there was that icky kissy scene between James Corden, Daisy Haggard at the end, but nothing could have prepared me for the butt clenching moment where I thought that Matt Smith and James Corder were going to kiss as they beamed into the Simonman's lair. 35 00:04:31.079 --> 00:04:33.060 That was a terrifying moment, you know. 36 00:04:33.120 --> 00:04:34.019 No, I don't want to see it. 37 00:04:34.079 --> 00:04:37.259 It's my favourite example of queer baiting in Doctor Who. 38 00:04:44.699 --> 00:04:47.339 Well, okay, I have a question then. 39 00:04:47.399 --> 00:04:54.000 Why are we watching a pale imitation of the lodger as we head into the finale of season 6? 40 00:04:54.000 --> 00:04:55.079 Series 6? 41 00:04:55.139 --> 00:04:55.379 Sorry. 42 00:04:55.439 --> 00:05:00.060 Well, like, I'm not super convinced it's a pale imitation of the lodger. 43 00:05:00.120 --> 00:05:04.019 It's not as fresh as the lodger, which was one of the things that the lodger had going for it. 44 00:05:04.079 --> 00:05:06.600 And Matt doesn't get naked in it. 45 00:05:06.660 --> 00:05:07.560 So there's that as well. 46 00:05:07.620 --> 00:05:12.420 But um, I think it's here for the same reason that the lodger is here. 47 00:05:12.480 --> 00:05:21.480 It's just a nice little character moment before we get into the sort of giant events of the series finale. 48 00:05:22.259 --> 00:05:42.600 I also think the reason that we have Craig in particular is that earlier this series in Let's Kill Hitler and also Last Week in the God Complex, it's kind of been made clear by those 2 stories that for the 11th doctor, the emotion he associates the most with his companions going right the way back to Rose is guilt. 49 00:05:42.660 --> 00:05:55.439 You know, he feels guilty for how Rose ended up and what happened to Martha's family, what happened to Donna, and he drops off Amy and Rory last week because he is afraid for them. 50 00:05:55.560 --> 00:05:58.980 So Craig is really the last person he has to check in on. 51 00:05:59.339 --> 00:06:05.639 And it's like, it's like he is just turning up to sort of go, okay, you're all right. 52 00:06:05.699 --> 00:06:06.959 I did something right. 53 00:06:07.860 --> 00:06:13.800 Because he could we put those 2 together and then the last time we saw them, there was a crack appearing on their wall. 54 00:06:13.860 --> 00:06:15.120 Yeah. 55 00:06:15.180 --> 00:06:20.220 And if it did swallow them, presumably that was undone by the finale. 56 00:06:20.279 --> 00:06:24.360 So the doctor, he's kind of just popping in to kind of go, oh, well, look, I did something right. 57 00:06:24.660 --> 00:06:34.740 And I think in that opening scene, because, you know, we have mentioned the saminess of a lot of closing time. 58 00:06:34.800 --> 00:06:45.720 One of the things I think in the beginning it does well is that, obviously, the setup is, as we've mentioned, more or less the same as the lodger with people being lured in. 59 00:06:45.779 --> 00:06:56.459 We kind of drop in on Sophie and Craig's relationship at a point where Craig is in a moment of personal jeopardy. 60 00:06:56.519 --> 00:06:58.860 The difference being, as opposed to telling her, I love you. 61 00:06:58.920 --> 00:07:00.720 I can take care of the baby by myself. 62 00:07:00.779 --> 00:07:05.279 And it is, you know, when the doctor knocks on the door and goes, hello, Craig, I'm back. 63 00:07:05.339 --> 00:07:08.100 It's literally shot in exactly the same way. 64 00:07:08.160 --> 00:07:23.699 But, um, uh, one of the reasons why I think, at least initially, that kind of works is because Craig has, you know, gone through the lodger, so he picks up on the saminess of the situation. 65 00:07:23.819 --> 00:07:29.459 So where it's, you know, when he's walking around the kitchen table, it was like, no, no, no, I have nightmares about that face. 66 00:07:30.839 --> 00:07:37.740 And also, it wasn't lost on the production team because throughout most of filming, this script didn't actually have a title. 67 00:07:37.860 --> 00:07:50.639 It was untitled on the copies that were given to the actors, like it was just episode 12, because the writer had trouble coming up with a title, and unofficially it was referred to as the Lodger 2. 68 00:07:51.300 --> 00:07:54.839 And also carry on lodging. 69 00:07:55.620 --> 00:07:57.660 They should have gone with that. 70 00:07:57.779 --> 00:07:59.459 I would have been an excellent time. 71 00:07:59.639 --> 00:08:04.379 And the original pitch, however, was 3 cybermen and a baby. 72 00:08:05.399 --> 00:08:08.279 Dear, that's so bad. 73 00:08:09.060 --> 00:08:12.480 To be fair, I don't think they strayed very far from that bitch. 74 00:08:12.540 --> 00:08:13.920 No, no. 75 00:08:13.980 --> 00:08:25.920 I mean, what sort of happened was the original function of the side men in the plot, which we'll get back to later, was somewhat different, and there were only 3 side men, whereas in the ship, in closing time, there are 6. 76 00:08:25.980 --> 00:08:34.139 And by that point, they kind of went, okay, well, you know, if you call it 6 cybermen and a baby, it gets further away from the title you're pasticing and it won't really work. 77 00:08:34.200 --> 00:08:35.399 So they had to come up with something else. 78 00:08:35.460 --> 00:08:40.259 The other potential title for this at a late stage was everything must go. 79 00:08:41.039 --> 00:08:43.440 Ah, that's good as well. 80 00:08:43.500 --> 00:08:50.220 So, yeah, everything must go on closing time. were both suggested by Clayton Hickman and closing time is the title, but one out. 81 00:08:50.279 --> 00:08:56.220 Is this the 1st season where there isn't a 2 part finale at the end of the season? 82 00:08:56.279 --> 00:08:57.360 That is correct. 83 00:08:57.419 --> 00:08:57.960 Yes. 84 00:08:58.019 --> 00:09:04.860 So this is the quietest penultimate episode that we've had because all of the other seasons. 85 00:09:04.919 --> 00:09:10.980 There's always been a massive like, you know, momentum building game changer as the penultimate episode. 86 00:09:11.039 --> 00:09:13.799 That does make this season stand out a bit. 87 00:09:13.860 --> 00:09:16.259 I'm not sure in an entirely positive way. 88 00:09:16.320 --> 00:09:40.500 I think I would actually, um, because Joe and I rewatched uh, the entirety of series 7 quite recently and the penultimate episode of part one of series 7 A was The Power of Three, which is quite standalone from Angels Take Manhattan, but it does end with that kind of grim sort of pronouncement with um, Brian kind of going, bring them back alive. 89 00:09:40.559 --> 00:09:48.000 And you kind of get that here as well with the storyline hook into the Wedding of River song. 90 00:09:48.059 --> 00:09:55.320 But, um, yeah, I think you're right. about later as well, because that felt completely bolted onto this episode. 91 00:09:55.379 --> 00:09:58.799 I thought in quite an intrusive way, but that last scene. 92 00:09:58.919 --> 00:10:01.139 Surprise, surprise, Joe, it was. 93 00:10:01.200 --> 00:10:05.460 It was not part of the original script and it was added by Stephen Moffatt. 94 00:10:05.519 --> 00:10:08.039 Well, we talked about this in the lodger, though, didn't we? 95 00:10:08.100 --> 00:10:13.919 We said in the lodger that there was the scene with Amy at the ring at the end of the episode. had nothing to do with the episode as a whole. 96 00:10:13.980 --> 00:10:22.679 So let's talk about the sort of things that happen in the episode before the 2 part finale. 97 00:10:22.740 --> 00:10:33.659 Because if you think about, let's say, turn left in series 4, that ends with a massive reveal about what's happening going into the finale. 98 00:10:33.720 --> 00:10:41.940 The previous year was utopia, okay, which is nearly the 1st part of a three-part story. 99 00:10:42.000 --> 00:10:45.179 But we hadn't had that approach before. 100 00:10:45.240 --> 00:10:49.620 And I think that this is in Boomtown territory. 101 00:10:49.679 --> 00:10:59.220 It's a quieter, smaller scale story that is about just the regulars. 102 00:10:59.220 --> 00:11:03.179 And there are no regulars at this point, really, apart from the doctor. 103 00:11:03.240 --> 00:11:12.840 And I mean, the reason it's called closing time is not just because it's set in a shop, but because the doctor is going to his death. 104 00:11:12.899 --> 00:11:18.419 This is his last adventure before he goes and is killed on Lake Salencio. 105 00:11:18.480 --> 00:11:20.220 Is he though? 106 00:11:20.279 --> 00:11:21.179 going to his death? 107 00:11:21.240 --> 00:11:21.840 Yeah. 108 00:11:21.840 --> 00:11:26.220 I think he is absolutely killed in the Impossible Astronaut. 109 00:11:26.279 --> 00:11:27.600 That's the doctor. 110 00:11:27.659 --> 00:11:32.460 Canton is telling the truth, and the doctor is originally killed there. 111 00:11:32.519 --> 00:11:34.919 And the doctor clearly thinks that. 112 00:11:35.100 --> 00:11:37.620 He hasn't come up with a way out of it yet. 113 00:11:37.679 --> 00:11:46.259 And we see him at the end of the episode collecting the Stetson and the blue envelopes that appear in the Impossible Astronaut. 114 00:11:46.320 --> 00:12:00.779 So he's going straight from here to Utah in order to get killed and he already knows that's happening because of Amy admitting it to the real doctor and because of the files he got from the test selector, I think. 115 00:12:00.899 --> 00:12:22.139 And I think one of the things I would add on top of that is, and I think this is partly what distinguishes it as a lead in to the finale, is that I think in previous series finales, the way they work is it's kind of the doctor being pulled into a new story, which is the story of the finale. 116 00:12:22.200 --> 00:12:35.820 Whereas the difference here, it's the doctor resigning himself and walking into the story of the finale, which in this case has been the story literally from episode one, which is the doctor dies. 117 00:12:36.059 --> 00:12:43.980 And this is kind of slightly well trodden material because we did have this same thing in the specials, I think. 118 00:12:43.980 --> 00:12:51.960 The doctor is aware that something is coming for him and that he will knock 4 times and that he's going to die. 119 00:12:52.019 --> 00:12:56.700 So we've already seen the doctor facing certain death. 120 00:12:56.759 --> 00:13:02.399 And I have to say that I like how Matt does it. 121 00:13:02.460 --> 00:13:05.279 There are some sort of sad moments. 122 00:13:05.340 --> 00:13:16.019 There's one thing where Craig says to him, you always win and you always survive and he sort of smiles a little ruefully and says those were the days. 123 00:13:16.559 --> 00:13:23.399 Even when he sort of puts his head against the wall of the Tartars at the very beginning and says, I'm done saving them. 124 00:13:23.460 --> 00:13:25.080 I'm not going to do this anymore. 125 00:13:25.679 --> 00:13:32.759 I think that Matt facing certain death does a better job of it than David Tennant does. 126 00:13:32.820 --> 00:13:35.399 It's all just a lot less overwrought, I think. 127 00:13:35.700 --> 00:13:41.580 Oh, a massive drama queen, so I think maybe too... 128 00:13:41.580 --> 00:13:44.940 It's just far too subtle and nuanced to me, I'm afraid. 129 00:13:45.000 --> 00:14:00.600 And you mentioned that bit where, and it's played very comedically when the doctor is just doing the doctory thing of noticing just about every discrepancy and every possible alien intervention that could be going on and him going, oh, no, no. 130 00:14:00.659 --> 00:14:01.860 He does a scan. 131 00:14:01.919 --> 00:14:02.460 Oh, no. 132 00:14:02.519 --> 00:14:05.820 And then Banks's head on the door and says, I'm going away now. 133 00:14:05.879 --> 00:14:14.100 Hard cut to the doctor not going away now. which is, which is, admittedly, that is kind of my comedic Achilles heel. 134 00:14:14.159 --> 00:14:16.799 It is a very obvious gag, but it did get me very good. 135 00:14:18.480 --> 00:14:31.559 Speaking of parallels in other episodes, so in the Big Bang at the wedding, you know, when the doctor says I'm only at the wedding for the dancing, who ends up dancing with are all the kids and showing them a very silly dads? 136 00:14:31.740 --> 00:14:35.340 And then as soon as the doctor is going to interfere. 137 00:14:35.399 --> 00:14:40.740 We cut to him showing kids expensive toys and say, go get money from your parents. 138 00:14:40.799 --> 00:14:43.019 They're just going to spend it on something boring like lambs. 139 00:14:43.259 --> 00:14:44.580 Actually, this is a bit overpriced anyway. 140 00:14:44.639 --> 00:14:47.460 Yeah, yeah, yeah, great. 141 00:14:47.519 --> 00:14:49.019 I love him there. 142 00:14:49.080 --> 00:14:54.480 And yappy, yappy the robot dog, and you've got Matt Padding, yappy like this. 143 00:14:54.539 --> 00:14:57.360 And later on when he picks up the Cyberman. 144 00:14:57.419 --> 00:14:59.820 He patsed it exactly the same way. 145 00:15:00.120 --> 00:15:08.279 Yeah, he likes steps out of the house in the morning and he's like caressing it. like a little cat. it's so cute. 146 00:15:21.960 --> 00:15:37.379 One of the things with this story that I think kind of makes it such a success, in some respects, is the fact that James Corden and Matt Smith works so well as a comedic duo. 147 00:15:37.440 --> 00:15:47.700 And I, you know, that is pretty much the reason why this episode exists is because they were like, James Corden, Matt Smith really hit it off. 148 00:15:47.759 --> 00:15:49.019 Why not give them another episode? 149 00:15:49.259 --> 00:15:56.159 Yeah, and James Corden Starr was massively on the rise at this point because of Gavin and Stacy. 150 00:15:56.279 --> 00:16:00.899 And with the fact that we're kind of doing the same thing again. 151 00:16:00.960 --> 00:16:04.080 Well, that's what you kind of get in buddy comedy movies. 152 00:16:04.139 --> 00:16:05.759 You know what I mean? 153 00:16:05.820 --> 00:16:18.779 Like if you watch all the Marx Brothers movies back to back or Laurel and Hardy or Abbott and Costello, it's the same kind of gags held together by a plot, the plot exists to serve the chemistry. 154 00:16:18.840 --> 00:16:21.480 And I think it's okay to do that occasionally. 155 00:16:21.539 --> 00:16:31.019 And the funny thing is, I think the closest thing we've had to it in new series who, before Cordon and Smith, was probably Tenant and Tate. 156 00:16:31.080 --> 00:16:43.080 And even then, I don't think there's an, a whole episode that's based around the same thing of, it's just these 2 making jokes for 45 minutes and we'll figure out, we'll figure out the plot otherwise. 157 00:16:43.139 --> 00:16:46.139 It's just kind of peppered here and there. 158 00:16:46.200 --> 00:16:51.360 There's probably a reason for that because this is all a little thin, isn't it? 159 00:16:51.480 --> 00:16:58.799 I feel I feel like I'm probably the dissenting voice in this episode because I thought this was incredibly mundane to watch. 160 00:16:58.860 --> 00:17:06.359 And as a lead instead of finale, just incredibly forgettable and didn't get me excited for what was coming. 161 00:17:06.420 --> 00:17:10.619 Whereas I think the 3 of you had a much more positive reaction to this than me. 162 00:17:11.039 --> 00:17:33.480 I think that one of the advantages of Doctor Who going to 45 minute episodes is that we don't have to have a big adventure every week, and I'm always longing for that, and the classic series did it in things like Planet of Fire or Morden Undead, where it is just sort of 4 episodes of them sort of mucking about while some thin plot sort of takes place in the background. 163 00:17:33.599 --> 00:17:51.420 And when Boomtown came along, and we discovered that Doctor Who can do that, and I think Boomtown is one of the unsung heroes of series one, I think it's a spectacular episode, and it's as thin as anything. 164 00:17:51.480 --> 00:17:56.579 I mean, it's ridiculous, but it's fun and it's nice to hang out with those people. 165 00:17:56.700 --> 00:17:58.619 You say it's thin. 166 00:17:58.740 --> 00:18:02.220 But I'd say it's got a bit of substance to it, Boomtown. 167 00:18:02.279 --> 00:18:08.880 It does have that conversation about the death penalty and yeah, a couple of conversations. 168 00:18:08.940 --> 00:18:11.279 And yeah, the whole thing about the doctor. 169 00:18:11.339 --> 00:18:13.619 Sorry, we're talking about a completely different episode now. 170 00:18:13.680 --> 00:18:14.759 Sorry to derail this. 171 00:18:14.759 --> 00:18:19.140 The doctor dealing with like consequences of previous adventures. 172 00:18:19.200 --> 00:18:20.640 It kind of leads into all of that. 173 00:18:20.700 --> 00:18:25.980 And I think that's a bit more substantial and a bit more interesting than what's happening here. 174 00:18:26.039 --> 00:18:28.740 Yeah, I mean, you've got Russell T. Davis riding boom down. 175 00:18:28.799 --> 00:18:30.480 We don't got quiet. 176 00:18:30.539 --> 00:18:40.079 But I think that being entertaining is a thing that a Doctor Who story can do and should certainly try to do. 177 00:18:40.140 --> 00:18:41.700 And sometimes that's enough. 178 00:18:41.759 --> 00:18:45.240 And I mean, there are plenty of times when Doctor Who doesn't even reach that level. 179 00:18:45.420 --> 00:18:48.539 I think half of my, my problem here was. 180 00:18:48.599 --> 00:18:53.220 You remember I said to you about 20 times in the lodger that I found it incredible relatable? 181 00:18:53.279 --> 00:18:56.279 In fact, I think you called that episode relatable, yeah? 182 00:18:56.339 --> 00:18:59.460 Well, I used to work in a department store, right? 183 00:18:59.519 --> 00:19:00.960 And it's really dreary. 184 00:19:01.440 --> 00:19:06.539 And so, and so this was the most relatable Doctor Who episode. 185 00:19:06.660 --> 00:19:11.460 The cybermen are handing, they're hanging out in a department store. 186 00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:13.980 Like, man, they've fallen low, haven't they? 187 00:19:14.039 --> 00:19:15.119 They've fallen on tough times. 188 00:19:15.240 --> 00:19:16.980 It's interesting. 189 00:19:17.039 --> 00:19:19.740 Well, just with on that thing about substance. 190 00:19:19.799 --> 00:19:36.660 One of the things I found very strange about this episode is that it feels very light and very thin, but I think it does tap into some of the things that Moffat, Stephen Moffat does come back to as a writer, which is the theme of parenthood. 191 00:19:36.720 --> 00:19:40.859 You know, that's part of the story of coupling, isn't it? 192 00:19:40.920 --> 00:19:42.480 Isn't that towards the end. 193 00:19:42.539 --> 00:19:57.900 It's that, so, and again, which is why I feel it's, again, like with the lodger, which felt like a, you know, a sitcom episode that was outsourced to someone else, I find it weird that an episode that is about fatherhood, which is a prime concern of Stephen Moffats, is, again, outsourced to another writer. 194 00:19:57.960 --> 00:20:00.839 I feel we made that exact point in the logic, didn't we? 195 00:20:00.900 --> 00:20:01.259 Yeah, yeah. 196 00:20:01.259 --> 00:20:05.819 How is Super Moffatt not writing this episode, it seems tailor made for him? 197 00:20:05.880 --> 00:20:26.940 I suppose it's because Stephen Moffat has done that already, you know, and he does bring the that sensibility to Doctor Who, but he's also a writer who, and he said this himself, he doesn't like doing the same thing over and over and over again, and compared to Russell, he does reinvent the series a lot more often. 198 00:20:27.059 --> 00:20:35.160 I was actually thinking about that. this week in regards to queer representation in the Stephen Moffatt series, and of course, there's basically none in series 5. 199 00:20:35.400 --> 00:20:40.019 Then series 6, we've got 2 unnamed gay characters who are killed. 200 00:20:40.140 --> 00:20:42.420 Let's not talk about that, okay? 201 00:20:42.480 --> 00:20:43.859 Talk about those 2 characters. 202 00:20:43.920 --> 00:20:47.339 Then Clara is sort of nebulously bisexual. 203 00:20:47.460 --> 00:20:55.740 But then you get Bill, who is a fully formed queer character who has a queer romance and that romance ends up saving the day. 204 00:20:55.799 --> 00:20:57.000 And that's the thing. 205 00:20:57.059 --> 00:20:59.880 Stephen Moffat is constantly going, okay, what can we do that's new and different? 206 00:20:59.940 --> 00:21:04.980 So perhaps he didn't do this sort of sitcom aspect so he could get a fresh take on it? 207 00:21:05.039 --> 00:21:07.500 But it ends up being the same story as last year? 208 00:21:07.559 --> 00:21:08.460 Yeah. 209 00:21:08.700 --> 00:21:19.140 One of the earliest notes I wrote down was, this feels like the joke from a good man goes to war where Rory holds his baby for the 1st time. 210 00:21:19.200 --> 00:21:26.460 Oh my god, I thought I was going to be totally cool and then starts crying and it feels like that joke stretched out for 45 minutes. 211 00:21:27.839 --> 00:21:42.599 I mean, I think the interesting thing is, and perhaps it's a bit lazy, actually, is that last year, our overall plot was Amy wondering what to do with her relationship with Rory. 212 00:21:42.660 --> 00:21:43.920 Should she get married? 213 00:21:43.920 --> 00:21:49.740 And she escapes the night before her wedding in order to go off with her imaginary friend. 214 00:21:49.799 --> 00:21:56.279 And then James Corden is having the same dilemma in the lodger. 215 00:21:56.339 --> 00:22:02.039 And then this year, both of the writers go immediately to parenthood. 216 00:22:02.160 --> 00:22:04.980 It's like that's the next thing that we think of. 217 00:22:05.099 --> 00:22:13.019 And so Amy's pregnant in the arc story and has a child and Craig and Sophie have a child as well. 218 00:22:13.140 --> 00:22:18.599 And so it seems to be just kind of the most obvious next thing to do. 219 00:22:18.660 --> 00:22:24.900 And I don't think it's deliberately shadowing the main series 6 plot. 220 00:22:24.960 --> 00:22:27.900 I just think it is kind of like here's where we go next. 221 00:22:27.960 --> 00:22:41.940 Well, the irony in this episode of having James Corden's character come back and deal with the fallout of being a father when in the series writ large, they completely fudge that with Amy Bonds. 222 00:22:42.059 --> 00:22:44.700 They absolutely should be doing this episode with Amy. 223 00:22:45.240 --> 00:23:06.299 So when this series went out, I had a physical subscription to Doctor Who magazine, I only get it digitally now because of postage, but the issue that came out, I think, in the week before a good man goes to war, the cover was Amy, a Madame Caverian, with the title birth shock. 224 00:23:06.359 --> 00:23:07.559 Oh, my God. 225 00:23:08.940 --> 00:23:10.680 Yikes. 226 00:23:10.740 --> 00:23:27.240 And in his production notes, and I may not get this verbatim, but Stephen Moffat says, yes, Amy and Rory are having a baby because you can get married, but having a baby is the next level, and I think he may even use the words, you're not really married until you have a baby. 227 00:23:28.740 --> 00:23:32.460 Me, gay, no interest in having children. 228 00:23:32.519 --> 00:23:35.039 I went, that seems a bit insensitive. 229 00:23:35.099 --> 00:23:45.720 Um, and it is interesting how much this series focusses on parenthood, particularly fatherhood because we have Captain Avery. 230 00:23:45.779 --> 00:23:50.460 We have Alex in Night Terrors, and we have Craig here. 231 00:23:50.519 --> 00:23:58.980 Now, of course, you've got Amy and Rory as well, but as you say, Joe, they kind of drop the ball on that and then don't actually deal with Amy and Rory having to bring up a child. 232 00:23:59.039 --> 00:24:13.440 And that's kind of treated as a triumph at the end of the year, whereas you then have 3 stories which are about people who doubt their ability as parents really stepping up and stepping into the role. 233 00:24:13.440 --> 00:24:23.339 And I am someone who's quite critical of this series, it is my least favourite of the entire new series because of the plotter. 234 00:24:23.400 --> 00:24:29.160 And curse of the black spot is in my bottom 5 episodes, but I do think. 235 00:24:30.059 --> 00:24:38.640 The character of Avery, the character of Alex and the character of Craig actually present parenthood in a really positive light in Doctor Who. 236 00:24:38.700 --> 00:24:39.180 Yeah. 237 00:24:39.180 --> 00:24:42.299 And there's a real drama there in real arcs. 238 00:24:42.359 --> 00:24:48.299 And it's funny, like, as I say, I have no interest in becoming a father myself, but I watch that and I go, that's actually really heartwarming. 239 00:24:48.720 --> 00:24:56.819 Yeah, and I think in this particular instance, what closing time is about relating to parenthood? 240 00:24:56.819 --> 00:25:01.440 It's about the instincts of parenthood, and the instincts of fatherhood. 241 00:25:01.500 --> 00:25:10.920 It's a story about men who are terrified about being dads, and more specifically about being inadequate and their own inadequacies making them redundant as fathers. 242 00:25:10.980 --> 00:25:12.900 You know, Craig is early on. 243 00:25:13.019 --> 00:25:15.900 I've read the books, you know, where are the off switches? 244 00:25:16.019 --> 00:25:21.539 And he's like stressed out the entire time that, you know, he can't get Alfie to sleep. 245 00:25:21.599 --> 00:25:24.660 Um, he doesn't understand his own child. 246 00:25:24.720 --> 00:25:32.400 But for all of Craig's lack of instinct and his inability to be responsive to what Alfie needs. 247 00:25:32.460 --> 00:25:39.900 All that is left in his brain, even when the cybermen cleans it of emotion, is this instinct, this love for his child. 248 00:25:39.960 --> 00:25:43.740 And that's what saves the day and confirms he is a good father. 249 00:25:43.799 --> 00:25:57.839 Yeah, I wondered what the cybermen were doing given that they're kind of famously emotionless and it didn't seem to be Craig's problem that he didn't love Alfie. 250 00:25:57.900 --> 00:25:59.279 That didn't seem to be the problem. 251 00:25:59.339 --> 00:26:01.859 And it is exactly what you identify, Jack. 252 00:26:01.920 --> 00:26:03.359 It's, I have no instincts. 253 00:26:03.420 --> 00:26:04.500 I have no instincts. 254 00:26:04.559 --> 00:26:14.519 And I guess what's being said here, and I don't know whether it's that good a message, but whatever, is that your instincts don't matter. 255 00:26:14.579 --> 00:26:19.859 The only thing that matters is that you love your son. 256 00:26:19.920 --> 00:26:58.680 And so the reason the cybermen are there is because they're vulnerable to emotion and because we need Craig's decision to kind of resolve the plot, because Craig is realising that his love for his son is enough and that's all that matters, and that incidentally blows up this particular kind of alien that we have here, just as last year, we're set up in this sort of complicated and utterly ridiculous situation where Craig's declaration of love for Sophie makes the spaceship explode, you know. 257 00:26:58.740 --> 00:27:04.440 This is why he couldn't have been a main companion because the resolution would be every week. 258 00:27:04.500 --> 00:27:08.700 Craig identifying a different reason why he loves something. 259 00:27:08.940 --> 00:27:12.839 He would be he would be more powerful than bad wolf. 260 00:27:19.680 --> 00:27:28.140 The moment itself, though, is so agonising when the helmet is coming over him and he's like, and he makes that choice. 261 00:27:28.200 --> 00:27:39.059 I feel like over the years, the cybermen's weaknesses have gotten more extreme and more ridiculous, but James Corden deciding to have a go, you know, of being a parent. 262 00:27:39.119 --> 00:27:42.779 That's just the Nadir of side of their weaknesses. 263 00:27:42.839 --> 00:27:45.960 I don't know. nail polish probably beats it out. 264 00:27:46.019 --> 00:27:47.819 Gold arrows. 265 00:27:47.880 --> 00:27:50.039 I mean, there's been a few, isn't there? 266 00:27:50.099 --> 00:27:56.700 I will say, though, in the new series till this point, emotion is their main weakness. 267 00:27:56.759 --> 00:27:59.039 Like we don't have gold as a weakness yet. 268 00:27:59.099 --> 00:28:00.660 We don't have radiation as a weakness. 269 00:28:00.720 --> 00:28:02.640 We don't have nail polish remover as weakness. 270 00:28:03.240 --> 00:28:08.220 The original script did have the use of gold. 271 00:28:08.339 --> 00:28:14.279 Now, I don't think it's something that really happens here in Australia, but Joe and Jack, you're going to know what I'm talking about. 272 00:28:14.339 --> 00:28:21.779 There would have been a scene where Craig explained there was a gold necklace in an envelope because Sophie was going to send it into a cash for gold website. 273 00:28:22.740 --> 00:28:24.180 Yeah. 274 00:28:24.180 --> 00:28:27.660 And so the doctor would throw that at the cyberbat. 275 00:28:27.720 --> 00:28:34.859 And Stephen Moffatt basically just came back and said, I think we can, you know, we've got 2 very physical actors who do physical comedy. 276 00:28:34.920 --> 00:28:38.099 Let's make it a fight scene with the cyberback. 277 00:28:38.160 --> 00:28:38.940 Yeah. 278 00:28:39.299 --> 00:28:50.640 Now, I totally understand, Joe, why you find that scene to be agonising, and I think anytime the solution is love, that's going to be a marmite solution for people. 279 00:28:51.119 --> 00:28:57.240 I'm not saying that you can't lean into the idea that, you know, emotion, they're susceptible to emotions. 280 00:28:57.299 --> 00:29:05.519 Do you remember in the age of steel, where the doctor turns off the thing, and then you have that shot of one cyberman, like looking in a mirror, screaming. 281 00:29:05.579 --> 00:29:07.920 Like it can be really effective. 282 00:29:07.980 --> 00:29:10.859 I just think it's just so melodramatic. 283 00:29:10.920 --> 00:29:12.180 It's so overdone in this. 284 00:29:12.480 --> 00:29:20.279 But I mean, at this point, the cybermen are kind of like buffy monsters, you know, the whole thing is we don't really care. 285 00:29:20.339 --> 00:29:23.940 The thing that we care about isn't the alien invasion at all. 286 00:29:24.000 --> 00:29:30.660 It is that Craig steps up and becomes a good parent, that he gains Stormageddon's approval, I think. 287 00:29:30.720 --> 00:29:31.559 Yeah. 288 00:29:31.559 --> 00:29:33.900 It's just like Rose, isn't it? 289 00:29:33.960 --> 00:29:37.019 Rose was very much, you know, not about the autumns. 290 00:29:37.079 --> 00:29:38.519 It was about Rose's journey. 291 00:29:38.579 --> 00:29:40.740 And, you know, bizarrely enough. 292 00:29:40.799 --> 00:29:43.440 They're both state department stores as well. strangers. 293 00:29:43.500 --> 00:29:49.559 Well, one of the original concepts to set this story in was actually a police station. 294 00:29:49.619 --> 00:29:53.880 And the idea is they could use sort of an old police station and that sort of thing. 295 00:29:53.940 --> 00:29:56.160 But during the writing process. 296 00:29:56.220 --> 00:30:02.099 It's just like, how how do you justify the doctor and Craig going back and forth to a police station? 297 00:30:02.160 --> 00:30:05.160 And so a department store was decided upon instead. 298 00:30:05.220 --> 00:30:12.720 But the big starting point for this episode was, let's do a sidemen story like in the 60s, where you barely see them. 299 00:30:12.839 --> 00:30:16.380 They're in the shadows and they're just taking people. 300 00:30:16.440 --> 00:30:20.279 You know, so sort of like in the invasion or the moon base. 301 00:30:20.700 --> 00:30:25.980 Um, and I'm going to pin my colours to the mast here. 302 00:30:26.039 --> 00:30:32.819 Oh, this is probably my 2nd or 3rd favourite new series, Sidemen Story. 303 00:30:32.880 --> 00:30:33.900 Okay. 304 00:30:33.900 --> 00:30:36.240 And in my top five... 305 00:30:36.240 --> 00:30:40.140 Because of the, because of the way it uses the cybermen. 306 00:30:40.319 --> 00:30:46.319 And I think, obviously, world enough and time beats it, knocks down the park, knocks almost everything out of the park. 307 00:30:46.380 --> 00:30:56.279 The other new series story it's competing with for me is the haunting of Villa Diodati, which does the same thing of keeping a shard in the shadows and making him a sinister force. 308 00:30:56.339 --> 00:31:03.359 Wouldn't you say that a Shardin deodarti, though, was way more effective than the Simon in this? 309 00:31:03.420 --> 00:31:08.099 But there's one minute, deliberately, they're supposed to be a bit pathetic, aren't they? 310 00:31:08.160 --> 00:31:10.680 and a bit useless and gathering their forces. 311 00:31:10.740 --> 00:31:12.779 But yet still deadly. 312 00:31:12.839 --> 00:31:15.119 And that's the thing, you never doubt a shard is deadly. 313 00:31:15.180 --> 00:31:17.880 But you look at these side men and go, oh, they're a bit rubbish. 314 00:31:17.940 --> 00:31:21.359 Yeah, but they're still going to send a side map after you with like a Chihuahua jaw or something. 315 00:31:23.160 --> 00:31:27.720 May I very politely offer a counter argument? 316 00:31:31.440 --> 00:31:39.240 Because I thought the cyberman's presence in this story was a real fundamental problem with it. 317 00:31:39.900 --> 00:31:42.480 Definitely see where you're coming from. 318 00:31:42.539 --> 00:31:45.059 But it got into a lot of different things for me. 319 00:31:45.119 --> 00:31:47.160 Sorry, I am going to be ranting about this for a little bit. 320 00:31:47.220 --> 00:31:50.220 I will speed through my thoughts as quickly as possible. 321 00:31:50.279 --> 00:31:57.359 So what made the lodger work so well is that the sci-fi plot was deliberately unimportant? 322 00:31:57.420 --> 00:32:04.019 That way it could comfortably fall into the background of the Dr. and Craig's story without feeling like a problem. 323 00:32:04.079 --> 00:32:07.140 Even when Meglos was the villain in the lodger. 324 00:32:07.200 --> 00:32:11.759 The joke was he was so forgettable, a villain, we didn't need to waste any time on him. 325 00:32:11.819 --> 00:32:15.059 Here, the villains are the cybermen. 326 00:32:15.119 --> 00:32:17.220 Doctor Who's 2nd most recognisable villain. 327 00:32:17.279 --> 00:32:17.819 Can I say that? 328 00:32:17.880 --> 00:32:19.200 Yeah, definitely. 329 00:32:19.259 --> 00:32:19.859 Okay. 330 00:32:20.579 --> 00:32:27.000 And I think they naturally draw the audience's attention just by the gravity of their significance. 331 00:32:27.059 --> 00:32:34.619 But not only that, but this is the 1st story in Matt Smith's era where they are technically the main villain of the episode. 332 00:32:34.680 --> 00:32:41.099 So there is this additional expectation that is built into this being the 1st proper Smith Cyberman showdown. 333 00:32:41.160 --> 00:33:02.460 However, as in the lodger, the expectation is to keep the monsters in the background, or in this case, keep them in, you know, I guess the changing room, which is, which is fine until you create or use a monster whose appearance generates interest and expectation, which also risks leaving the audience feeling like they were a bit of a waste. 334 00:33:02.519 --> 00:33:18.480 And I think that tension tugs at or at worst undercuts the episodes, other priorities with Craig and the doctor, which are absolutely the correct priorities, but you need a monster that the audience is willing to see relegated to the sidelines in service of something else. 335 00:33:18.539 --> 00:33:32.099 And even then using the cybermen, the way they are deployed feels like a conscious, if not deliberate acknowledgement that they are the runners-up to the Daleks, we all cut. 336 00:33:32.160 --> 00:33:36.299 It was established in Army of Ghost in Doomsday, wasn't it? 337 00:33:36.359 --> 00:33:38.039 They are definitely 2nd place to the die. 338 00:33:38.099 --> 00:33:39.900 It was established in the 60s. 339 00:33:40.200 --> 00:33:53.880 I think, though. that one way that you can avoid spending time on the science fiction plot is to make it kind of thin to non-existent like in the lodger. 340 00:33:53.940 --> 00:34:00.240 But another way that you can do it is just say, oh, and it's Cyberman, and we don't need to spend any time explaining it. 341 00:34:00.299 --> 00:34:07.200 We don't need, like, to expend any energy, trying to work out who they are or what they're up to. 342 00:34:07.259 --> 00:34:09.960 They're cybermen doing cybermen things. 343 00:34:10.019 --> 00:34:11.820 And so that saves us time. 344 00:34:11.880 --> 00:34:18.780 And I also think that this is a cyberman story in the sense that the Pandorica opens is a cyberman story. 345 00:34:18.840 --> 00:34:29.400 I don't think that Moffatt's Doctor Who is comfortable with the Dalek story or the Cyberman story as a thing at all. 346 00:34:29.400 --> 00:34:40.260 And so the Cyberman here are merely here to be the thing to be the kind of science fiction plot that doesn't need any explanation. 347 00:34:40.320 --> 00:34:50.880 And I also don't think that the cybermen, with the kind of normal Doctor Who audience, I don't think the cybermen are a massive event. 348 00:34:50.880 --> 00:34:59.219 I think that there's some recognisable Doctor Who stuff that appears in Doctor Who stories and that's their role here. 349 00:34:59.280 --> 00:35:08.099 Like, this is the 1st time, for instance, that the cybermen don't fit into the continuity that's established by Russell, the cyber side. 350 00:35:08.159 --> 00:35:19.260 Cyberman, who are created by John Lumic in Rise of the Cyberman, and even when they appear in the next doctor, it's explained how they got there and came back in time. 351 00:35:19.320 --> 00:35:21.300 These cybermen have been here for 1000s of years. 352 00:35:21.360 --> 00:35:22.500 How is that even possible? 353 00:35:22.559 --> 00:35:24.840 And the answer is that we don't care. 354 00:35:24.900 --> 00:35:26.639 You know, we just don't care. 355 00:35:26.760 --> 00:35:29.519 And we're not spending any time. 356 00:35:29.639 --> 00:35:30.840 That's right. 357 00:35:30.900 --> 00:35:43.679 We're not spending any time on why they're here or what they're for because they are as thin as the emergency killing people hologram from the lodger. 358 00:35:43.739 --> 00:35:46.139 Well, you say they're not an event. 359 00:35:46.199 --> 00:35:50.699 I do think just bunging them into the season is going to draw in some more viewers. 360 00:35:50.760 --> 00:35:56.219 I don't know what the ratings were for this one, but it absolutely is gonna bring some people that wouldn't normally watch Doctor Who in. 361 00:35:56.280 --> 00:36:01.019 Jack, I've got a counterargument to your counteroffer because... 362 00:36:01.019 --> 00:36:08.519 I agree with you and I think the side men are absolutely dreary in this episode and completely forgettable. 363 00:36:08.579 --> 00:36:14.099 If I was having to like name Sidemen episode, I would never, ever think to mention closing time. 364 00:36:14.219 --> 00:36:24.480 However, it does feature the best ever cyber map scene, which is extraordinarily good and the highlight of the episode. 365 00:36:24.539 --> 00:36:27.480 I mean, those scary, bloody teeth. 366 00:36:27.539 --> 00:36:29.880 It's so funny and so scary. 367 00:36:30.000 --> 00:36:31.619 I thought that scene was excellent. 368 00:36:31.679 --> 00:36:36.719 Yeah, it's hilarious and it's terrifying at the same time. 369 00:36:36.960 --> 00:36:39.599 But why did they jettison them? 370 00:36:39.659 --> 00:36:44.159 Like when they're back next year, the cybermats are out and the cybermites are in. 371 00:36:44.159 --> 00:36:48.360 And I just, I would have loved to have seen more of these side mats. 372 00:36:48.420 --> 00:36:49.260 They had potential. 373 00:36:49.320 --> 00:36:50.340 Why didn't they? 374 00:36:50.400 --> 00:36:53.519 This is sitting in a department store, in a toy store. 375 00:36:53.639 --> 00:36:57.360 Why didn't they have those cyber mats being sold? 376 00:36:57.420 --> 00:37:04.199 And then they're all activated at once and those horrible nasty teeth come out and lots of children are murdered around the world. 377 00:37:04.260 --> 00:37:05.340 That would be an amazing story. 378 00:37:05.400 --> 00:37:06.719 Way better than this. 379 00:37:06.780 --> 00:37:13.800 So this, I think, is a good opportunity to talk about the script development. and where the title 3 Cybermen and the Baby comes from. 380 00:37:13.860 --> 00:37:14.460 No. 381 00:37:14.460 --> 00:37:22.980 So originally, you know, you had the kind of similar premise of, we're in a department store, people are going missing, et cetera. et cetera. 382 00:37:23.159 --> 00:37:32.699 But people are going missing at a certain interval and it varies according to the draft, sometimes at 77 years, sometimes at 64 years, et cetera. 383 00:37:33.179 --> 00:37:42.840 And it turns out what's happened is, Years and years and years ago, the cybership crashed, and it sent out one scout and one cyber mat. 384 00:37:43.380 --> 00:37:53.519 Some ancient Britons poured sort of quick setting lime onto the side of that, and it ended up in a foundation stone under the department store. 385 00:37:53.579 --> 00:38:03.539 And without getting any data, the scout was just basically, okay, I'm just going to stand around and get data, and ended up replacing bits of itself with organic components. 386 00:38:03.599 --> 00:38:09.659 So the reason these people are going missing is he's recreating himself as a Frankenstein's monster. 387 00:38:10.199 --> 00:38:23.699 But, This is the reason, also, it's set in Colchester, there was old King Briffer of Colchester, and there's a legend that he protected the town and protected the children of the town. 388 00:38:23.760 --> 00:38:30.000 So when he is taken, into the body of the cyberman, he becomes a protector. 389 00:38:30.780 --> 00:38:43.980 And what happens is the doctor and Craig figure this out, Craig actually appeals to the part that is Briffer and also one of the workers in the department store to kind of say, look, stop doing this. 390 00:38:44.219 --> 00:38:49.860 And it actually goes well and the cyberman dies and everything's fine. 391 00:38:49.920 --> 00:38:53.280 And then Craig's like, but isn't there like a ship full of them? 392 00:38:53.280 --> 00:38:57.960 And 3 cybermen appear, like full powered, et cetera, et cetera. 393 00:38:58.019 --> 00:38:59.519 Sounds amazing. 394 00:38:59.639 --> 00:39:01.199 Why aren't we watching that instead? 395 00:39:01.320 --> 00:39:14.400 Well, I think the reason was they wanted Craig sort of more integral to the solution, and it comes back to what you were saying earlier with, we've got the ending we want where Craig proves himself. 396 00:39:14.460 --> 00:39:16.500 How do we fit that? 397 00:39:16.559 --> 00:39:17.760 How do we fit that in? 398 00:39:17.820 --> 00:39:20.099 And coming back to something you were saying, Jack, about. 399 00:39:20.159 --> 00:39:25.500 It's okay to use Meglosk as a 2nd rate monster because we don't care. 400 00:39:25.559 --> 00:39:31.980 I was just thinking, what sort of monster could we use from the past of Doctor Who that people wouldn't really care about? 401 00:39:32.039 --> 00:39:35.219 And would still basically fulfil the same function. 402 00:39:35.219 --> 00:39:39.719 And like taking people on board to help them fly their spaceships. 403 00:39:39.780 --> 00:39:45.360 And this could have been the return of the crotons. would be there for that. 404 00:39:45.420 --> 00:39:47.760 Imagine the protons in CGI. 405 00:39:47.820 --> 00:39:48.659 Oh wow. 406 00:39:49.260 --> 00:39:53.219 And you could still build it up like it was the site of that. 407 00:39:53.280 --> 00:39:55.679 You know, you just have metallic hands coming out. 408 00:39:55.739 --> 00:39:56.940 You have a metallic voice. 409 00:39:57.420 --> 00:39:58.980 Do you what? 410 00:39:58.980 --> 00:39:59.760 Are we watching that? 411 00:39:59.760 --> 00:40:00.539 It doesn't. 412 00:40:00.539 --> 00:40:01.260 That sounds incredible. 413 00:40:01.320 --> 00:40:06.480 Do you just replace the cybernet with like a rolling crystal or something? 414 00:40:06.780 --> 00:40:08.460 Why not? 415 00:40:08.519 --> 00:40:09.239 Why? 416 00:40:09.239 --> 00:40:10.079 Absolutely. 417 00:40:10.139 --> 00:40:10.440 Why not? 418 00:40:10.500 --> 00:40:17.219 And, you know, it occurs to me that, okay, the crotons aren't particularly susceptible to emotion, but they're sort of high brain low brain. 419 00:40:17.280 --> 00:40:24.300 If they regard love as a low brain thing, That's how Craig destroys them. 420 00:40:24.360 --> 00:40:29.039 So it also gets away from the schmaltziness, if you like, of the power of love. 421 00:40:29.099 --> 00:40:32.579 And Craig could be saying, oh, it's because I love Alpha and the doctor. 422 00:40:32.639 --> 00:40:35.519 Actually, it's because that emotion is far too simple and basic. 423 00:40:35.579 --> 00:40:36.719 Yeah, yeah, it's not. 424 00:40:36.780 --> 00:40:42.119 Yeah, imagine an army of protons over their heads spinning around, going crazy and blowing up. 425 00:40:42.239 --> 00:40:42.900 That would be incredible. 426 00:40:42.960 --> 00:40:50.099 I do take your point, Brendan, about the way the cybermen are used here in the shadows because that's something we haven't seen in a while. 427 00:40:50.159 --> 00:40:55.019 And certainly these are the quietest side, but I think we've ever seen with their Zoom. 428 00:40:56.099 --> 00:40:59.699 So quiet you may not remember them being there at all. 429 00:41:00.659 --> 00:41:03.599 But then that's mission accomplished. 430 00:41:03.659 --> 00:41:04.619 Do you know what I mean? 431 00:41:04.679 --> 00:41:09.420 That's exactly why they're there because they're an extremely low effort science fiction point. 432 00:41:09.539 --> 00:41:10.079 I think. 433 00:41:10.139 --> 00:41:13.199 Moffat isn't interested in Doctor Who Monsters. 434 00:41:13.260 --> 00:41:14.820 Look at what he does to the Son Torans. 435 00:41:14.880 --> 00:41:17.760 He basically makes them unuseable. from here on in. 436 00:41:17.820 --> 00:41:20.099 And the same with the Silurians. 437 00:41:20.159 --> 00:41:30.239 You know, he is interested in those things as a source of Doctor Whoness, but isn't really interested in writing episodes about them. 438 00:41:30.420 --> 00:41:31.860 Yeah. 439 00:41:31.920 --> 00:41:35.760 And I also wouldn't trade anything in the world for the cybermats. 440 00:41:35.820 --> 00:41:44.940 The scene where Matt Smith jumps through the window and is fighting a cyberbat with I am the doctor playing is possibly one of the funniest things I've ever seen. 441 00:41:45.000 --> 00:41:46.800 Seriously enjoyable, isn't it? 442 00:41:47.400 --> 00:41:51.539 Like, like Matt Smith does physical comedy, extra. 443 00:41:51.599 --> 00:41:54.119 God, I'm saying very positive things about that. 444 00:41:54.179 --> 00:42:00.539 You've chosen 2 good episodes and I've noticed that you've chosen episodes where Amy Pond's ducked out as well. have lots to say about her. 445 00:42:00.599 --> 00:42:04.559 But yeah, it's so funny in that scene. really, really good. 446 00:42:04.619 --> 00:42:08.880 And I feel like it's a sign of the show's confidence in itself. 447 00:42:08.940 --> 00:42:11.579 It's a bit like bringing the macro back in gridlock. 448 00:42:11.639 --> 00:42:13.139 The show's confident enough in itself. 449 00:42:13.199 --> 00:42:22.320 It's like, we can bring something a little silly back from the old show and be very happy to just put it on screen and not be self-conscious. 450 00:42:22.380 --> 00:42:25.320 You know, and have lines like, it's not a rat. 451 00:42:25.380 --> 00:42:26.639 It's a cyber mat. 452 00:42:27.420 --> 00:42:33.420 Lovely to have that back. talking about Matt Smith. 453 00:42:33.480 --> 00:42:43.260 I think I think my favourite Matt Smith scene is in this episode, and that's a big thing to say over those 3 years, because he gets a lot of moments, doesn't he? 454 00:42:43.320 --> 00:42:51.900 But, you know, I don't really like it when he's waving his hands around a solid screwdriver and he's screaming about jelly and ice cream and lemonade taps and things like that. 455 00:42:51.900 --> 00:42:53.699 I felt like all very extreme. 456 00:42:53.760 --> 00:42:58.980 But the scene with the baby, when he puts the stars on the wall. 457 00:42:59.039 --> 00:43:05.280 I always feel he does his best work with children and this is like the ultimate with children the scene for Matt Smith. 458 00:43:05.340 --> 00:43:06.659 Isn't that scene just gorgeous? 459 00:43:07.019 --> 00:43:08.400 Yeah. 460 00:43:08.400 --> 00:43:11.519 I love too, that it's initially negative. 461 00:43:11.639 --> 00:43:21.000 Like he initially says you've got all these things ahead of you, mortgages and, you know, a persistent sense of spiritual emptiness or something like that. 462 00:43:21.059 --> 00:43:26.820 And then and then he corrects himself and then talks about what his life has been like. 463 00:43:26.880 --> 00:43:33.059 And because he's about to die, because they're at opposite ends of their lives, Alfie and the doctor. 464 00:43:33.119 --> 00:43:43.139 And it is one of those things where Matt's doctor is rarely visibly sorry for himself, but he is aware that he's going. 465 00:43:43.199 --> 00:43:47.519 And I just think that scene is fantastically great. 466 00:43:47.639 --> 00:43:50.940 And that baby is an incredible actor. 467 00:43:51.000 --> 00:43:59.280 What about the, um, when when Matt shushes him in that very early scene and he just reacts immediately and quietens down. 468 00:43:59.340 --> 00:44:06.119 They must have like had the camera on that baby for like 6 hours in order to find their reaction. 469 00:44:06.179 --> 00:44:11.039 When you think of all the children in the Stephen Moffatt era, and there are lots of them. 470 00:44:11.039 --> 00:44:16.739 And I put them under the umbrella term of the brood of the damned because a lot of them are terrible actors. 471 00:44:16.800 --> 00:44:18.179 Sorry, Jack, I know you don't like that. 472 00:44:18.239 --> 00:44:20.760 And, um, and just upon it. 473 00:44:20.820 --> 00:44:21.900 The baby, man. 474 00:44:21.960 --> 00:44:22.920 The baby. 475 00:44:22.920 --> 00:44:25.199 Imagine Arcy, don't even go there. 476 00:44:25.440 --> 00:44:28.320 But that baby, what a great actor. 477 00:44:28.440 --> 00:44:29.400 It was amazing. 478 00:44:30.059 --> 00:44:55.860 But I also, I also think that the way the doctor works so well with Alfie feeds into what the story is saying about fatherhood because, you know, Sophie is Alfie's mother and she's no longer there and Craig feels incompetent, but also the doctor works so well opposite a child because he is a children's character. 479 00:44:55.920 --> 00:44:59.579 So, of course, he is naturally responsive. 480 00:44:59.639 --> 00:45:02.159 That's why he speaks baby, essentially. 481 00:45:02.219 --> 00:45:05.639 Maybe I'm reading a bit too much depth into that one, but it sounded nice. 482 00:45:06.179 --> 00:45:08.820 Yeah, no, I totally agree with you. 483 00:45:08.880 --> 00:45:11.460 Alfie was played by 3 babies. 484 00:45:13.800 --> 00:45:15.780 Incredible actors, yeah. 485 00:45:15.780 --> 00:45:20.400 Isabel James, Josie James, and Ellis Pomeroy. 486 00:45:21.179 --> 00:45:25.320 And if anyone wants to feel old, they'll all be about 10 now. 487 00:45:27.659 --> 00:45:29.519 Thanks, Brendan. 488 00:45:29.820 --> 00:45:32.519 But yeah, Matt Smith is... 489 00:45:32.519 --> 00:45:36.480 He brings the melancholy here. 490 00:45:36.539 --> 00:45:50.280 And much like Sylvester McCoy, that seems to be something he is very conscious of as an actor in his performance in that, you know, the doctor wants to be happy and wants to have fun, but there is always this pervasive melancholy underneath. 491 00:45:50.340 --> 00:46:00.900 There's a bit that's cut from this episode, which, interestingly, I think, is pretty much reworked for the time of the doctor, and I'm going to read to you, if I may. 492 00:46:00.960 --> 00:46:09.360 So basically, this is the doctor discovering the tunnel down to the cyberman spaceship, and he grabs the cyberman out of his pocket and starts talking to it. 493 00:46:09.480 --> 00:46:22.500 From their spaceship, which any reasonable person, bitey, would assume was up in space, like most spaceships, hence the name spaceship, and not, in fact, actually under the shop all along. 494 00:46:22.860 --> 00:46:24.539 Nothing to say? 495 00:46:24.599 --> 00:46:28.260 No, anyone would have made the same mistake, doctor, don't blame yourself. 496 00:46:28.320 --> 00:46:30.719 Worst companion ever. 497 00:46:33.119 --> 00:46:35.820 Impression is amazing, by the way. 498 00:46:35.940 --> 00:46:38.639 Well, I'm jealous of Jack Soldi, you see. 499 00:46:40.380 --> 00:46:48.659 He has a line that he says to the baby, which I just thought was so moving. and he says, save the tears for later, boyo. 500 00:46:48.719 --> 00:46:51.000 Oh, it's just so cute. 501 00:46:51.059 --> 00:46:51.599 I love it. 502 00:46:51.659 --> 00:46:53.219 It's heart wrenching. 503 00:46:53.280 --> 00:46:53.880 Yeah. 504 00:46:53.940 --> 00:46:56.219 It sort of feeds into a moment. 505 00:46:56.280 --> 00:47:05.280 I really hate from next week's episode, but is totally in keeping with the character where River explains how they're trying to save him and he turns around and says, you embarrass me. 506 00:47:05.340 --> 00:47:08.699 And it's just like, that kind of fury. 507 00:47:08.760 --> 00:47:11.219 You see, you see that beneath the surface here. 508 00:47:11.219 --> 00:47:15.000 It's just a tiny bit and it pulls himself back, even though that's a bit I don't like. 509 00:47:15.119 --> 00:47:16.559 It a quality of the actor, which is amazing. 510 00:47:16.739 --> 00:47:32.699 When I graduated university, I gave the valedictorian speech for my college, and um, I really, I struggled very hard to find a theme that could summarise all these wonderful years I'd had there because you didn't want to make it too morkish. 511 00:47:32.760 --> 00:47:35.099 You didn't want to make it too funny. 512 00:47:35.159 --> 00:47:42.539 And the only thing I could settle on was, I think one of the final lines I put in it was, I hope you all had as much fun as I did. 513 00:47:42.599 --> 00:47:45.300 Um, so, so hearing, yeah. 514 00:47:45.360 --> 00:47:52.079 Yeah, so yeah, so when I heard Matt Smith telling a baby, I hope you had as much fun as I did, it really got to me. 515 00:47:52.139 --> 00:48:01.559 I feel incredibly mundane, you know, you saying, you know, the memory you're leaning into is you gave the valedictorian speech and the memory I lent in 2 years, I worked in a department store. 516 00:48:01.619 --> 00:48:03.000 Honestly. 517 00:48:03.780 --> 00:48:09.000 I would actually like to talk about the department store characters a bit because I think they're a big girl. 518 00:48:09.059 --> 00:48:11.460 I think they're a big success in that. 519 00:48:11.460 --> 00:48:12.539 Linda Barron. 520 00:48:12.659 --> 00:48:17.699 You get Linda Barron in to play this gossipy perfume counter woman. 521 00:48:17.760 --> 00:48:19.800 She's so great. 522 00:48:19.860 --> 00:48:23.579 And she's so supportive of Craig and the doctor's relationship. 523 00:48:23.639 --> 00:48:25.320 It's very sad. 524 00:48:25.380 --> 00:48:26.699 Not enough of her, though, isn't it? 525 00:48:26.760 --> 00:48:28.739 I feel like she should have had a bigger role. 526 00:48:28.800 --> 00:48:31.980 Like, when you think of her as, oh, my word. 527 00:48:32.039 --> 00:48:33.840 Thank you very much in environment. 528 00:48:34.619 --> 00:48:41.760 Part of what makes her and the other department store characters so successful is they don't realise they're in a Doctor Who story. 529 00:48:41.820 --> 00:48:42.659 Yeah. 530 00:48:42.719 --> 00:48:56.340 Like you look at so many other stories where there's just incidental characters, and very often the writers sort of go out of their way to give them a sort of companion moment, a moment where they realise they're in something bigger than themselves, so they help the doctor. 531 00:48:56.400 --> 00:49:01.019 And here, that moment with Linda Barron, where the doctor's like, have you seen anything strange? 532 00:49:01.019 --> 00:49:04.679 And she's like, well, at the office, Christmas. 533 00:49:04.739 --> 00:49:09.239 They just totally refuse to be part of this alien invasion plotline. 534 00:49:09.300 --> 00:49:09.780 Thank you very much. 535 00:49:09.840 --> 00:49:16.800 You know, they've got they've got their day off to think about, you know, Paul Kelly not getting the day off because Shona's been taken by a Cyberman. 536 00:49:16.860 --> 00:49:19.019 Um, you know, George. 537 00:49:19.079 --> 00:49:23.519 Those people are so well drawn, you know, when I say words in the department shop, those people were absolutely working there. 538 00:49:23.579 --> 00:49:31.739 Yeah, yeah, yeah, awesome. yeah And you know, you've got George, the security guard, who, of course, when we 1st see him, he's, you know, big and gruff. 539 00:49:31.739 --> 00:49:32.340 He's imposing. 540 00:49:32.400 --> 00:49:33.000 He going to mess about. 541 00:49:33.059 --> 00:49:39.539 And then the 2nd he sees the doctor, huge smile on his face and, oh my god, my friend's here, how lovely, sort of thing, you know? 542 00:49:39.599 --> 00:49:41.579 And then of course, he's horribly murdered. 543 00:49:42.659 --> 00:49:52.800 In fact, upsettingly, the 2 people that we see killed are the 2 black employees of the department store. 544 00:49:52.860 --> 00:49:57.659 And I think that's a bit of a problem. 545 00:49:57.780 --> 00:50:07.920 And I think when this writer's final script comes out, there's all kinds of inadvertent colourblind casting which spoils it a little bit as well. 546 00:50:07.980 --> 00:50:09.659 It is the cast, you know, isn't it? 547 00:50:09.719 --> 00:50:11.099 Obviously, it's not deliberating. 548 00:50:11.099 --> 00:50:12.059 Yeah, it's not the writing. 549 00:50:12.119 --> 00:50:13.860 No, no, no. not the writing. 550 00:50:13.920 --> 00:50:17.519 It is the casting, but it's something that I think people need to be a bit more careful about. 551 00:50:17.579 --> 00:50:22.320 And it is a bit of a problem, I think. 552 00:50:22.980 --> 00:50:36.119 I will say that in the script, only Shona is specified as being black, George wasn't, there was also another actor who played a warehouse man who was also taken. 553 00:50:36.179 --> 00:50:36.960 Oh, okay. 554 00:50:36.960 --> 00:50:41.400 So Ian Hilditch, who was to play that warehouse worker, is a white actor. 555 00:50:41.460 --> 00:50:49.440 So unfortunately cutting him does lead to that unfortunate thing of the 2 people we see killed on screen are both people of colour. 556 00:50:49.500 --> 00:50:53.340 And it will become a bigger problem in the caretaker. 557 00:51:06.179 --> 00:51:24.840 So, it's interesting, there's all this stuff about cybermen and fatherhood and all this other stuff, and the main plotline of the series, which is Amy Rory and River, they're kind of cameo tacked on additions to the rest of this story. 558 00:51:25.199 --> 00:51:32.159 And I suppose Amy and Rory have a bit more of a thematic resonance in this story. 559 00:51:32.280 --> 00:51:38.579 But by the time you get to the closing, the closing scene, it's a bit more grafted on. 560 00:51:38.699 --> 00:51:39.420 I suppose. 561 00:51:39.840 --> 00:51:57.059 So that scene with Amy and Rory, I think, is also kind of reminding us and maybe reminding the doctor of why he left them behind because the doctor actually regrets staying to help Craig at some point. 562 00:51:57.119 --> 00:52:01.619 Do you remember that where he says, I'm a vain and selfish man? 563 00:52:01.679 --> 00:52:06.599 And I sort of show off and put my friends in danger. 564 00:52:06.659 --> 00:52:13.739 And he made the decision to stop doing that with Amy and Rory after the God complex. 565 00:52:13.800 --> 00:52:21.599 And now he's finding himself unable to break the habit and doing it again with Craig. 566 00:52:21.659 --> 00:52:31.019 And so I think that there's a whole sort of thing working up towards him making the decision to, like I'm going to go, like it's time for me to leave. 567 00:52:31.199 --> 00:52:37.679 And that obviously leads to the final scene, doesn't it? 568 00:52:37.739 --> 00:52:49.500 Because we see river leaving to go to Lake Silencio just after we see the doctor leaving to go and they'll be confronting each other sort of quite soon. 569 00:52:49.559 --> 00:52:52.019 How do we feel that scene goes? 570 00:52:52.559 --> 00:52:56.639 Well, is there an expectation there that people have watched the whole season? 571 00:52:56.699 --> 00:53:03.599 Because if the expectation is there that people are just watching this episode, then that scene is just so weird at the end of this episode. 572 00:53:03.780 --> 00:53:06.840 If that is the case, though, and they've just tuned in. 573 00:53:06.900 --> 00:53:13.500 It's a really good way to get them to tune in next week and also to jump on iPlayer and and see what they've missed. 574 00:53:13.559 --> 00:53:19.079 Imagine you hadn't seen any of this season, and the end, you've been, well, what the hell was that about? 575 00:53:19.380 --> 00:53:26.579 But I mean, that's true of any serialised media, and this season is more serialised than Doctor Who has ever been. 576 00:53:27.059 --> 00:53:34.500 The expectation is that if you're just dipping into an episode, there'll be enough there for you to enjoy, but there'll be bits that you don't get. 577 00:53:34.679 --> 00:53:44.219 You know, you could say the same thing about, say, the episode of Battlestar Galactica, where the final 5 here, Bob Dylan and meet in that room, you know? 578 00:53:44.280 --> 00:53:49.739 And if you hadn't seen any episode of the series before that, it will be like, oh, what is this? 579 00:53:49.800 --> 00:53:55.800 But when you have seen everything, you're like, 0 my god, it means these 5 people that we've just spent 4 seasons with asylons. 580 00:53:55.860 --> 00:53:56.880 You know? 581 00:53:57.119 --> 00:54:04.679 Is it there, you're comparing, possibly, you know, one of the greatest moments. 2 series 6 of Doctor Who. 582 00:54:04.739 --> 00:54:07.320 There is there is a gulf between the two. 583 00:54:07.440 --> 00:54:09.780 It's it's the same device. 584 00:54:09.840 --> 00:54:10.559 Okay? 585 00:54:10.619 --> 00:54:16.380 I will compare it to something totally terrible for you in the 90s, right? 586 00:54:16.440 --> 00:54:19.500 There was a series called Team Knight Rider. 587 00:54:19.559 --> 00:54:20.519 Wow. 588 00:54:20.579 --> 00:54:21.360 Okay. 589 00:54:21.360 --> 00:54:30.000 So it was a, it was a spinoff from Knight Rider, and it was a little bit Power Rangers in that there was like a team of 10 people, all of whom had talking cars. 590 00:54:30.000 --> 00:54:46.260 And at the end of the 1st episode, one of them attempts to find out how the Knight Rider program started and finds a classified file on Michael Knight, and she can't get into it, but she says, but I have the highest clearance. 591 00:54:46.800 --> 00:54:48.420 Shock. 592 00:54:48.539 --> 00:54:53.760 And it's like, okay, well, that's clearly there to make you watch the rest and find out who this Michael Knight person is. 593 00:54:53.820 --> 00:54:54.780 I didn't. 594 00:54:54.960 --> 00:54:57.539 And I think a lot of people didn't. 595 00:54:57.599 --> 00:55:00.599 Why am I hearing about this for the 1st time? 596 00:55:01.380 --> 00:55:04.500 Because we haven't done it on Bondfinger somehow. 597 00:55:04.500 --> 00:55:07.260 It's that kind of device. 598 00:55:07.320 --> 00:55:09.900 It's the device to reward the long-term viewer. 599 00:55:09.960 --> 00:55:15.719 But also to pull in the people who have come in halfway through. 600 00:55:15.780 --> 00:55:20.579 So they go back and watch the rest of it or so they go out and buy the DVD box set. 601 00:55:20.699 --> 00:55:22.019 Right. 602 00:55:22.079 --> 00:55:24.599 And I'm kind of springing off that. 603 00:55:24.659 --> 00:55:39.840 I think one of the things that scene does is that the main bits of information it hooks into are episode one, it uses the visual reference of the astronaut, which is straight there from the very beginning of the series. 604 00:55:39.840 --> 00:55:45.360 The other information we know is that River is Amy's daughter. 605 00:55:45.420 --> 00:55:54.179 They reference Melody Pond, which is the midpoint of the series, and that river has been engineered by the silence, which is the other big episode. 606 00:55:54.239 --> 00:56:02.099 So the information it's signposting in that scene are the big tent pole episodes of the whole series structure. 607 00:56:02.159 --> 00:56:03.960 That's a really good point. 608 00:56:04.019 --> 00:56:06.239 And generally speaking. 609 00:56:06.300 --> 00:56:13.440 I mean, generally speaking, the 1st episode of a series is the one that people are most likely to have watched. 610 00:56:13.500 --> 00:56:16.199 It'll be the one with the highest viewing figures. 611 00:56:16.260 --> 00:56:25.139 And what this does is it positions this episode as a prequel to episode one. 612 00:56:25.199 --> 00:56:28.019 And so it makes the season circular. 613 00:56:28.079 --> 00:56:33.119 And that's something that, you know, Moffatt is unable to resist, I think. 614 00:56:33.659 --> 00:56:35.159 Yeah. 615 00:56:35.219 --> 00:56:46.920 And also, I think part of why it can get away with, because, you know, the revelations of a good man goes to war and let's kill Hitler are technically just in the middle of the season. 616 00:56:46.980 --> 00:56:57.659 And in any other season, it would be a bit of a gamble staking so much of the audience's retention of information to roughly around the midpoint of the season. 617 00:56:57.719 --> 00:57:17.460 But because the season has been structured with this mid-season finale and then this mid-season premiere, it can kind of get away with referencing stuff that happens roughly in the middle because those points have been treated as an episode 12 and an episode one. 618 00:57:17.519 --> 00:57:18.480 Yeah. 619 00:57:18.840 --> 00:57:29.340 Also, I think we found watching through that the arc elements do intrude in just about every episode of this season. 620 00:57:29.400 --> 00:57:38.639 So we aren't really relying on people remembering something that happened sort of 6 months ago because it keeps coming up again and again. 621 00:57:38.699 --> 00:57:55.500 And so for all of the complexity of this arc, and I think it is the most ambitious and complex arc that the show ever attempts, our hands are kind of held all the way through and we're kind of constantly being reminded of it. 622 00:57:56.099 --> 00:58:05.039 My biggest problem with that taxi is I found it more enticing and more exciting than the previous 40 minutes. 623 00:58:05.099 --> 00:58:14.699 And I was like, well, I wish we'd been watching this for the last 40 minutes, and my other issue with it is it offers huge promise, and then they deliver the wedding with River Song. 624 00:58:14.760 --> 00:58:17.280 But I'm not on that episode, so I'll leave you to do that next week. 625 00:58:18.360 --> 00:58:19.920 Bye bye. 626 00:58:46.980 --> 00:58:49.860 Well, they listener, that's all we have time for this week. 627 00:58:49.920 --> 00:58:55.980 We'll be back next week to watch history completely collapse again in the wedding of River Song. 628 00:58:56.159 --> 00:59:16.679 In the meantime, you can find us wherever you get your podcasts and you can keep up with us at Flightthrough Entirety on Facebook at FTE Podcast on Twitter and on our website, FlightthroughEntirety.com, where you'll find links to our other podcasts, Bondfinger, Jody into Terror, Maximum Power, and Untitled Star Trek project. 629 00:59:16.800 --> 00:59:19.199 Jack, where can people find you online? 630 00:59:19.320 --> 00:59:23.760 You can find me on Twitter at Shaq Janahan. 631 00:59:23.820 --> 00:59:35.820 You can also find me as one of the illustrious co-hosts of the Naimon B praise, which I do with another irascible character who should not be named or listened to. 632 00:59:35.880 --> 00:59:41.940 Um, uh, by the name of Joe Ford, uh, and you can follow us at uh, Naimon podcast. 633 00:59:42.420 --> 00:59:45.659 And Joe, where else can people find you? 634 00:59:45.719 --> 00:59:47.760 Oh, I've never podcasted before. 635 00:59:47.820 --> 01:00:00.480 No, you can you can find me on my commentary podcast, Dr. Commentary podcast called Hammerson with a Blunt Penknife, of which everybody on this chat has contributed. 636 01:00:00.539 --> 01:00:03.300 Nathan has done about 6 stories now. 637 01:00:03.840 --> 01:00:06.239 What's your favourite one you've done? 638 01:00:06.360 --> 01:00:10.679 I really enjoyed doing arachnids in the UK. 639 01:00:10.739 --> 01:00:13.199 That was massively popular as well. 640 01:00:13.320 --> 01:00:13.739 You know? 641 01:00:13.800 --> 01:00:14.460 Go Jolie. 642 01:00:14.820 --> 01:00:19.199 Brendan gave a meteoric defence of time fly. 643 01:00:20.039 --> 01:00:24.119 And and Jack did one of his favourites, the brain of Morbius. 644 01:00:24.179 --> 01:00:27.659 And you can find me on Twitter on at DocOho. 645 01:00:27.840 --> 01:00:32.099 Until next time, you're very, very welcome. 646 01:00:32.159 --> 01:00:34.860 Thank you very much for listening and good night. 647 01:00:34.920 --> 01:00:35.940 Good night. 648 01:00:36.000 --> 01:00:36.900 Good night. 649 01:00:36.960 --> 01:00:38.219 Good night. 650 01:00:44.280 --> 01:00:46.320 That was Flight through Entirety. 651 01:00:46.380 --> 01:00:49.619 Sorry, Nathan Bottomley drove forward, Brendan Jones, and Jack Shanahan. 652 01:00:49.739 --> 01:00:51.900 Theme arrangement by Cameron Lann. 653 01:00:51.960 --> 01:00:57.659 This episode, Alfie, was recorded on the 10th of October 2021 and released on the 5th of December. 654 01:00:58.079 --> 01:01:00.659 Yet another shameless plug. 655 01:01:00.719 --> 01:01:08.699 Joe Ford and I can currently be heard on Untitled Star Trek project, in which we watch and discuss random episodes from every Star Trek series. 656 01:01:08.760 --> 01:01:15.539 Stay tuned until after these closing credits to see how effortlessly professional we are at podcast production. 657 01:01:18.599 --> 01:01:21.179 Time to say goodbye, doctor. 658 01:01:21.239 --> 01:01:22.860 It's closing time. 659 01:01:25.980 --> 01:01:27.659 Awful, that was even better than the 1st time. 660 01:01:27.659 --> 01:01:28.739 Thank God we went again. 661 01:01:28.800 --> 01:01:30.179 Yeah, I did a deliver. 662 01:01:30.239 --> 01:01:31.800 Yeah, yeah, I agree. 663 01:01:31.860 --> 01:01:33.599 In the groove now. 664 01:01:36.239 --> 01:01:37.739 There we go. 665 01:01:39.360 --> 01:01:43.440 So I have a feeling that we've done this one before. 666 01:01:48.599 --> 01:01:58.260 I am not leaving in any reference to the fact that I didn't press record, except possibly in the tag. so funny. 667 01:01:59.039 --> 01:02:01.079 Oh my god. 668 01:02:03.960 --> 01:02:09.239 Well, since we get to reuse jokes again, I feel like I'm in a chronic hysteresis. 669 01:02:12.480 --> 01:02:16.500 Incidentally, incidentally, swarm. 670 01:02:16.559 --> 01:02:22.500 Santarans, weeping angels, ravages Megalos? 671 01:02:22.559 --> 01:02:23.699 Yeah. 672 01:02:23.820 --> 01:02:25.380 You've cracked the code. 673 01:02:25.440 --> 01:02:27.900 You have cracked the code. 674 01:02:27.960 --> 01:02:30.480 We nearly had Meg loss in this last year. 675 01:02:30.539 --> 01:02:31.139 Anyway. 676 01:02:31.260 --> 01:02:33.239 But I'm going to go... 677 01:02:33.300 --> 01:02:36.659 Oh, I'm going to go and do that. you meant series. 678 01:02:36.719 --> 01:02:40.079 We nearly had them in series 12. 679 01:02:40.320 --> 01:02:44.039 Imagine Megloss written by Chris Chibnall. 680 01:02:45.059 --> 01:02:48.719 That would that would be another orphan 55 moment. 681 01:02:48.780 --> 01:02:53.579 That may actually have bumped it up a bit in my in my estimation, I think. 682 01:02:53.639 --> 01:02:55.860 The timeless child is. 683 01:02:59.099 --> 01:03:03.360 And it is Olivia Coleman as attached. 684 01:03:05.579 --> 01:03:08.099 Or you make all the greatest hips. 685 01:03:08.519 --> 01:03:10.500 Oh my god. 686 01:03:10.559 --> 01:03:12.539 If only she'd never been in the show. 687 01:03:12.599 --> 01:03:13.500 All right, here goes. 688 01:03:13.619 --> 01:03:15.659 So cactus. 689 01:03:15.719 --> 01:03:16.559 Sorry. 690 01:03:16.559 --> 01:03:22.139 So I have a feeling that we did this one before together earlier this year.