WEBVTT

NOTE
This transcript was created on 2026-06-07 at 15:32:39

1
00:00:33.000 --> 00:00:39.659
Hello, and welcome back to Flight Through Entirety, the only Doctor Who podcast, which doesn't mind being a queen, although we really didn't have much of a choice.

2
00:00:39.719 --> 00:00:40.439
I'm Brendan.

3
00:00:40.560 --> 00:00:41.340
I'm Nathan.

4
00:00:41.399 --> 00:00:48.000
And hello, I'm surprisingly not pregnant, and back from Cambridge, although I think that slip on the weir might have had something to do with it.

5
00:00:48.060 --> 00:00:50.880
I have this wait time carrying is nothing to do.

6
00:00:50.939 --> 00:00:52.560
Richard is back with us.

7
00:00:52.619 --> 00:00:56.640
And Todd is just getting a quick vacation in Devil's Hump, I believe.

8
00:00:56.700 --> 00:00:58.859
Well, that's what he wrote on the postcard.

9
00:00:58.920 --> 00:00:59.820
It meant nothing to me.

10
00:00:59.880 --> 00:01:01.079
What does it mention?

11
00:01:01.140 --> 00:01:09.540
As we move into possibly Doctor Who's only 2nd story dealing with Time Paradoxes, Day of the Daleks.

12
00:01:18.599 --> 00:01:20.099
Right, well, lucky me.

13
00:01:20.159 --> 00:01:25.500
This one's mine, and I'm glad I've got this one, 'cause I have to go and study it forever. and learn all about things.

14
00:01:25.560 --> 00:01:34.500
Well, we're here watching a show that isn't really about what it says it's about, and that's not necessarily a bad thing, because the Daleks were a last minute put in thing, weren't they?

15
00:01:34.560 --> 00:01:37.620
They were going to be in Robert Sloman's final story of the year.

16
00:01:37.739 --> 00:01:43.260
And then they thought, oh, no, we need another whiz banger sees an opening.

17
00:01:43.799 --> 00:01:46.620
And Sloman had previously proven himself to be a really good writer.

18
00:01:46.680 --> 00:01:53.340
And I think he is a really good writer and we won't look forward to, we look forward to your opinions on that at the end of the season.

19
00:01:53.400 --> 00:01:55.260
Gee, that'll be fun, won't it?

20
00:01:55.319 --> 00:02:01.980
But Gray of the Daleks, or Doris Day of the Daleks, if you look at what Katie's wearing in this little number.

21
00:02:02.040 --> 00:02:03.239
She's not actually, is she?

22
00:02:03.299 --> 00:02:09.360
Brendan slipped through a time bridge. hanging around a bridge beside a canal at a certain point in history.

23
00:02:09.419 --> 00:02:13.319
I think Katie's outfit in this is the height of fashion, quite frankly, I don't think.

24
00:02:13.379 --> 00:02:14.879
Well, even Katie says it's nuts.

25
00:02:15.000 --> 00:02:16.439
Even she says it's terrible.

26
00:02:16.439 --> 00:02:18.000
She says she has.

27
00:02:18.060 --> 00:02:19.259
And we have it on proof.

28
00:02:19.319 --> 00:02:19.560
Anyway.

29
00:02:19.620 --> 00:02:21.599
Well, Stewart Fell agrees with me at least.

30
00:02:21.659 --> 00:02:23.400
I mean, mostly it is Stuart Full.

31
00:02:23.460 --> 00:02:24.300
This is great.

32
00:02:24.360 --> 00:02:29.159
We've got Percy Granger's English country garden getting the pantomime goodies treatment, haven't we?

33
00:02:29.280 --> 00:02:31.560
It's hard to know where I am.

34
00:02:31.620 --> 00:02:33.060
Am I on a backlot?

35
00:02:33.120 --> 00:02:34.860
Am I in a disused?

36
00:02:34.919 --> 00:02:35.819
It's not a quarry.

37
00:02:35.939 --> 00:02:37.620
Disused sort of greeny place?

38
00:02:37.680 --> 00:02:38.039
I, you know.

39
00:02:38.099 --> 00:02:41.639
Yeah, it does give it a bit of visual, visual variety. doesn't it?

40
00:02:41.699 --> 00:02:46.259
We've got we've got the country house and we've got this sort of scrub land.

41
00:02:46.319 --> 00:02:52.080
And even though they're both predominantly green, the scrub land is dying off and it's yellowed and there's blocks of concrete everywhere.

42
00:02:52.139 --> 00:02:54.599
So we've already got that tense dichotomy.

43
00:02:54.659 --> 00:02:56.520
And that's just the original styles.

44
00:02:56.580 --> 00:03:05.159
So what we've got, what we've got is a lovely English country heist, and we've got a conference because of course it's 1970 blah, whichever version you believe in.

45
00:03:05.219 --> 00:03:07.439
And of course, Nixon hadn't got to China yet and all the rest of it.

46
00:03:07.560 --> 00:03:10.860
So, you know, the Daytente thing was simmering away.

47
00:03:10.919 --> 00:03:16.080
The Cold War had sort of turned into some interesting thing in, um, in our region here in Australia, really.

48
00:03:16.139 --> 00:03:22.439
You've got Vietnam going on for far too bloody long, simply because Henry Kissinger believes you've got to destroy every communist, wherever you can find it.

49
00:03:22.500 --> 00:03:26.460
Nixon got in, promising to end it, and that's how they got rid of LBJ.

50
00:03:26.520 --> 00:03:29.520
Nixon, of course, was that we own him because he's been in Doctor Who.

51
00:03:29.580 --> 00:03:35.280
And we then had Kissinger behind the scenes telling him with the CIA that it had to continue.

52
00:03:35.340 --> 00:03:36.300
The war had to continue.

53
00:03:36.360 --> 00:03:38.939
So the money had to, in fact, was taken out of the space program.

54
00:03:39.000 --> 00:03:42.840
So we've got lots of things to be angry to with Mr. Nixon for at this time.

55
00:03:42.900 --> 00:03:57.599
But also, before all of that was going on, Nixon was actually trying to get behind the scenes stuff to try and get a big Congress in China and meet with Mao Zi, Mao Zi, Dong, and Chewing, Ginsburg, whatever his name was.

56
00:03:57.659 --> 00:04:03.840
And, um, you know, try and ease east-west, the new east-west relations.

57
00:04:03.900 --> 00:04:09.900
So that's what we're seeing here with world conferences of, you know, a couple of blokes in hats.

58
00:04:09.960 --> 00:04:18.660
And so that kind of overshadows, all kind of is really important to the entire story because the centre is, as you were saying.

59
00:04:18.720 --> 00:04:21.120
It's about wine and cheese, isn't it?

60
00:04:21.180 --> 00:04:22.860
Giant wine and cheese do.

61
00:04:23.279 --> 00:04:25.620
And the PLO.

62
00:04:25.980 --> 00:04:29.160
The world is in terrible danger and the doctor isn't aware of it at the beginning.

63
00:04:29.220 --> 00:04:34.560
The brigadier says, you know, I don't think you realise how terrible the international situation is, or is that cause of axos?

64
00:04:34.620 --> 00:04:36.600
anyway. a blur, isn't it?

65
00:04:36.660 --> 00:04:47.939
Well, it's a constant, it's a constant consideration in Perley's 1st 3 seasons, and indeed, this seems to be the conference that leads on from the conference in the mind of the...

66
00:04:48.360 --> 00:04:50.160
And units handling security arrangements.

67
00:04:50.220 --> 00:04:57.360
Again, it's interesting what you were saying, Richard, about how Nixon's platform about how he got in in that your current leader can't do this.

68
00:04:57.420 --> 00:04:58.620
I can win this war.

69
00:04:58.680 --> 00:05:01.259
Where have we seen that in local politics recently?

70
00:05:01.319 --> 00:05:01.920
I wonder.

71
00:05:02.040 --> 00:05:04.560
The repetition goes round and round, isn't it?

72
00:05:04.680 --> 00:05:05.100
Yeah.

73
00:05:05.160 --> 00:05:09.300
And when are we going to get one of our microphones into a hotel room with Tony Abbott?

74
00:05:09.540 --> 00:05:11.339
Please, no.

75
00:05:11.399 --> 00:05:14.220
Actually, should we should we email this to George Brandis?

76
00:05:14.279 --> 00:05:16.139
I think that's the dumb thing now.

77
00:05:16.199 --> 00:05:17.639
We email everything to Jordan.

78
00:05:17.699 --> 00:05:19.740
I guess your international listener would think all this.

79
00:05:19.800 --> 00:05:21.000
What's the closest?

80
00:05:21.120 --> 00:05:24.360
David Cameron and Nick League don't really come anywhere near them, do they?

81
00:05:24.420 --> 00:05:33.600
No, they try to. one umping each other on a waiter on a race to the bottom, but it does fit in with that whole tone of history repeating itself.

82
00:05:33.660 --> 00:05:37.019
And I think Louis Marx must have been a very politically aware writer.

83
00:05:37.139 --> 00:05:42.060
Lewis Marx isn't a bad writer at all for a bloke who came up with friction drive daleks in the 60s.

84
00:05:42.120 --> 00:05:44.759
Isn't that what he actually had a lovely toy empire?

85
00:05:44.879 --> 00:05:46.800
I'm sure it's the same person.

86
00:05:46.800 --> 00:05:50.819
That was M-AR-X. Groucho's younger brother.

87
00:05:50.879 --> 00:05:56.220
But look, this one... is am I crazy or did he write...

88
00:05:56.220 --> 00:05:57.240
Planet of Giant?

89
00:05:57.300 --> 00:05:57.839
Yes, he did.

90
00:05:57.899 --> 00:05:59.160
Which has...

91
00:05:59.220 --> 00:06:00.720
Yes, you're right. hasn't done anything this is?

92
00:06:00.779 --> 00:06:01.620
Yeah.

93
00:06:01.620 --> 00:06:07.139
And, yeah, he would later write a mask of man dragger rather, which, again, has a political bent.

94
00:06:07.199 --> 00:06:08.939
And are both terrific stories.

95
00:06:09.000 --> 00:06:09.779
And you know what?

96
00:06:09.839 --> 00:06:12.720
So is this one if it just, if you just ignore all the tweaks and pulls.

97
00:06:12.779 --> 00:06:15.120
So he's writing a story which is called the Ghost Hunters.

98
00:06:15.779 --> 00:06:18.420
And the current political situation goes pear shaped.

99
00:06:18.540 --> 00:06:27.000
Like what happens is the conference goes wrong and it fails. and it creates, you know, a 100 years of war.

100
00:06:27.060 --> 00:06:34.680
And so people come back in time, anticipating the Terminator by 15 years and try and put a stop to it.

101
00:06:34.740 --> 00:06:36.720
And that's the story that he's written.

102
00:06:36.779 --> 00:06:40.199
It's like a ghost story that becomes a time paradox story and things.

103
00:06:40.259 --> 00:06:44.759
And because of what you said earlier, They shoehorn the daleks into it.

104
00:06:44.819 --> 00:06:51.959
And I have to say that I think that that they do it really, really badly and they risk wrecking the story by doing it.

105
00:06:52.019 --> 00:06:56.759
They do throw another story into another story, but I think they do it really well because, well, I'll get to that.

106
00:06:56.819 --> 00:07:01.800
But because there's really no other technocrat organisation other than Scaro.

107
00:07:01.800 --> 00:07:03.839
Inc. that's going to have time tick.

108
00:07:03.899 --> 00:07:11.399
And really, Daleks work best when you see them through a slot, and you only see them for of minutes on screen each story.

109
00:07:11.459 --> 00:07:13.860
The less is more with Dalek, certainly by this stage.

110
00:07:13.920 --> 00:07:15.660
Well, certainly these Daleks.

111
00:07:15.720 --> 00:07:17.160
I mean, they're terrible, aren't they?

112
00:07:17.220 --> 00:07:22.980
So in the intervening time, since we last had the Daleks, and it's been a very, very long time.

113
00:07:23.040 --> 00:07:23.879
Five years.

114
00:07:23.879 --> 00:07:24.600
Yeah.

115
00:07:24.779 --> 00:07:36.420
Someone said it's like longer between, you know, the Daleks and Evil of the Daleks, that's a shorter length of time than the time that they've been offscreen.

116
00:07:36.480 --> 00:07:36.720
Yeah.

117
00:07:36.720 --> 00:07:39.720
So no one can remember how to do them.

118
00:07:39.779 --> 00:07:42.360
So there's 3 Daleks left.

119
00:07:42.420 --> 00:07:44.759
They're in really shockingly bad condition.

120
00:07:44.879 --> 00:07:45.420
3.5 .

121
00:07:45.480 --> 00:07:46.199
There was a skirt.

122
00:07:46.259 --> 00:07:50.519
That was left, which is the which is the bit that you see burning in the car park.

123
00:07:50.579 --> 00:07:52.560
It's early 70s Doctor Who.

124
00:07:52.620 --> 00:07:53.220
There always a skirt.

125
00:07:53.279 --> 00:07:56.819
So there's someone tweeted the other day and I'll put it in the show notes.

126
00:07:56.879 --> 00:07:57.720
Was it Clayton?

127
00:07:57.779 --> 00:07:58.920
Yeah, it was Clayton Hickman.

128
00:07:58.980 --> 00:08:13.319
He tweeted a screenshot of one of the Daleks from Day of the Daleks, whose luminosity emitter thing on the dome, you know, the light that flashes the mini Cooper light that flashes to let you know that he's talking. is stuck on with duct tape.

129
00:08:13.379 --> 00:08:15.540
Like there's a cross of duct tape.

130
00:08:15.600 --> 00:08:16.860
So they're a mess.

131
00:08:16.920 --> 00:08:17.759
They're really battered.

132
00:08:17.819 --> 00:08:19.740
No one can remember how to shoot them.

133
00:08:19.800 --> 00:08:24.240
There's no Dougie Campfield to, you know, do extreme close-ups or make them look good.

134
00:08:24.300 --> 00:08:32.519
Director Paul Bernard had never worked on the show before to the point that at the beginning of each episode, at the end of the cliffhanger, he has the sting in there because he thought that's what you did.

135
00:08:32.519 --> 00:08:35.700
Because he's what, he's never even watched a previous episode.

136
00:08:35.759 --> 00:08:38.759
Paul Bernard is a really good painter.

137
00:08:38.820 --> 00:08:40.080
I don't know if he's still with this.

138
00:08:40.139 --> 00:08:41.220
No, he really was.

139
00:08:41.279 --> 00:08:42.659
And he only did directions.

140
00:08:42.720 --> 00:08:49.019
He only got into TV to support his painting career and he's since left and went on to have a really successful.

141
00:08:49.080 --> 00:08:55.799
No, he's actually a high-end level. proper, yeah, yeah. actually, I really liked his stuff, looked him up.

142
00:08:55.860 --> 00:08:58.860
I actually think he's a very good director, specifically for people.

143
00:08:58.980 --> 00:08:59.759
Yeah.

144
00:08:59.759 --> 00:09:03.419
I like that the Daleks, so the other monsters in the cupboard, literally, you don't see them.

145
00:09:03.480 --> 00:09:05.700
You know, the one thing we haven't mentioned, I was holding off deliberately.

146
00:09:05.759 --> 00:09:14.940
But the reason they feel shoe horned and they don't have much space is because this is actually about the glamour and apologies because this is a kind of contentious point to make now.

147
00:09:15.000 --> 00:09:17.940
But back in those days, terrorism was glamorous.

148
00:09:18.000 --> 00:09:22.559
A lot of sympathy was being given to the PLO.

149
00:09:22.620 --> 00:09:31.379
Don't forget the 1968 Israeli border war, that 6 day war that was seen to Israel really kind of tit their PR job in in that one.

150
00:09:31.440 --> 00:09:34.740
It was seen as being expansionist and without very much.

151
00:09:34.799 --> 00:09:49.919
Anyway, the public opinion at the time was that the PLO had a worthy complaint, and as long as they didn't affect any citizens, even the IRA, but weirdly enough, was actually seeing more sympathetic light than it would be later on in the 70s, according to it.

152
00:09:49.980 --> 00:09:54.000
Well, you do use the word terrorist this year and it comes up in the mutants again.

153
00:09:54.059 --> 00:09:55.679
Exactly. vastly different way.

154
00:09:55.740 --> 00:09:58.259
It was glamorous because of Leila Khaled.

155
00:09:58.320 --> 00:10:00.299
Yes, I wonder where that name's going to come up again.

156
00:10:00.360 --> 00:10:05.399
And, of course, he was actually an incredibly stunning girl who was who happened to be a PLO.

157
00:10:05.399 --> 00:10:09.480
And, of course, Patty Hearst, who was the daughter of Awesome Wilt?

158
00:10:09.539 --> 00:10:15.360
No, but she was the daughter of William Randolph Hurst and subsequent star of many John Waters films.

159
00:10:15.419 --> 00:10:17.340
In between those 2 things.

160
00:10:17.399 --> 00:10:24.240
She was one of the kids who was, in effect, kidnapped, the daughter of a, you know, the story, don't you?

161
00:10:24.299 --> 00:10:26.220
The daughter of the empire.

162
00:10:26.279 --> 00:10:38.100
Is it the character that, um, Awson Wells-based, his citizen Kane film on, and she was kidnapped and developed something that, you know, we later all knew to be called Stockholm Syndrome.

163
00:10:38.159 --> 00:10:40.080
She became sympathetic with her keepers.

164
00:10:40.139 --> 00:10:44.220
And she was then filmed doing naughty things with a gun, holding things up.

165
00:10:44.279 --> 00:10:47.519
Apparently she didn't actually injure anybody, but she spent time in prison.

166
00:10:47.580 --> 00:10:52.139
And of course, that's why John Waters discovered her, and she's in some really funny John Waters film.

167
00:10:52.200 --> 00:11:08.700
There's a really great interview with Paddy Hearst in John Waters book role models, which came out a few years ago, and I would urge anyone who's interested in the background of Annat in this one, played by Annat Barry to look it up.

168
00:11:08.759 --> 00:11:12.240
Fascinatingly, of course, Annat in the script was not a woman.

169
00:11:12.299 --> 00:11:14.820
Originally, was she originally?

170
00:11:15.120 --> 00:11:20.220
She was assumed to be male and Paul Bernard decided, no, look, let's have a woman.

171
00:11:20.279 --> 00:11:20.820
This is the future.

172
00:11:20.879 --> 00:11:25.860
Let's have a woman who is getting down and dirty and really mostly in charge of this group.

173
00:11:25.919 --> 00:11:28.559
There's only, we only see one person superior to her.

174
00:11:28.559 --> 00:11:30.659
And he comes in later too.

175
00:11:30.720 --> 00:11:33.000
He comes in later and indeed defers to her.

176
00:11:33.059 --> 00:11:37.259
Like he questions some of her decisions, but it's not because she's a woman.

177
00:11:37.320 --> 00:11:40.259
It's because he doesn't agree with the way she has done things.

178
00:11:40.320 --> 00:11:43.139
He's got a great moustache, that guy.

179
00:11:43.200 --> 00:11:44.759
There are some great moustaches in Doctor Who.

180
00:11:44.820 --> 00:11:47.100
Oh, she got Playgirl.com.

181
00:11:47.100 --> 00:11:48.659
Yeah.

182
00:11:48.720 --> 00:11:54.360
And we've also got TV's version of Malcolm McDowell playing Stahl, whatever his name is.

183
00:11:54.480 --> 00:11:59.639
Scott Fredericks. would later appear menacing Paul Yorick in Image of the Fendal.

184
00:11:59.700 --> 00:12:00.299
He's so pretty.

185
00:12:00.360 --> 00:12:01.379
Who is it?

186
00:12:01.440 --> 00:12:02.639
Scott Fredericks.

187
00:12:02.700 --> 00:12:04.320
Oh, yes, Boaz.

188
00:12:04.379 --> 00:12:05.519
Boaz.

189
00:12:05.580 --> 00:12:05.820
Yeah.

190
00:12:05.879 --> 00:12:06.720
Featherboat.

191
00:12:06.720 --> 00:12:07.379
Feather to his back.

192
00:12:07.440 --> 00:12:08.039
Feather Boaz, yeah.

193
00:12:08.100 --> 00:12:08.820
Featherboat.

194
00:12:08.940 --> 00:12:13.620
They're all sort of vaguely kind of sexy names, I was going to say.

195
00:12:14.279 --> 00:12:15.720
They are.

196
00:12:15.779 --> 00:12:26.519
But they're also the most convincing of the characters and players in this, and I think they're the reason that the show kind of works and you're not, look, okay, I'm going to put it out there.

197
00:12:26.580 --> 00:12:36.600
A lot of these are a little trenchant. to sit through, especially if you're doing a seasonal viewing simply because the pacing and timing of early 70s television is not what we're accustomed to now.

198
00:12:36.720 --> 00:12:40.740
I actually find the early 60s ones pacier than these ones.

199
00:12:40.799 --> 00:12:51.480
But the pacing of the editing in these is continuing something you commented on last season, Nathan, which is the characters say, oh, let's go investigate that.

200
00:12:51.539 --> 00:12:53.460
And we don't see the travel time. just see them there.

201
00:12:53.519 --> 00:12:54.120
Yeah.

202
00:12:54.120 --> 00:12:57.120
And that certainly happens in this season as well.

203
00:12:57.179 --> 00:13:06.600
And with Day of the Daleks, we have a similar conceit to Inferno where we're switching between this time to time zones rather than to realities.

204
00:13:06.600 --> 00:13:20.820
And the action moves quite quickly in places, but then slows down for conversations, like that conversation between Joe, the doctor and the controller played by...

205
00:13:21.179 --> 00:13:23.639
Can we get onto Aubrey fabulouswoods.com?

206
00:13:23.700 --> 00:13:24.840
He's so good.

207
00:13:24.899 --> 00:13:38.279
When I was a little boy, the very 1st, I was one once, the very 1st single, I forced my poor mother to buy me was Sammy Davis Jr. singing The Candyman from Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory from 1971.

208
00:13:38.399 --> 00:13:45.659
If you get out the video and watch it again, as many of us do, the Gene Wilder and far more proper Willy Wonka.

209
00:13:45.720 --> 00:13:47.159
Guess who sings Candyman in that?

210
00:13:47.279 --> 00:13:49.139
Aubrey Woods.

211
00:13:49.200 --> 00:13:50.580
Camp is up.

212
00:13:50.700 --> 00:13:51.360
So good.

213
00:13:51.419 --> 00:13:53.759
In Hessian sack full of candy cones.

214
00:13:53.820 --> 00:13:56.639
He is really nuts and he's really, really good.

215
00:13:56.700 --> 00:13:57.960
And I think he's amazing in this.

216
00:13:58.019 --> 00:14:00.840
So he and the terrorists are the things that make this work.

217
00:14:01.019 --> 00:14:07.379
Oh, and don't forget the pants, people on the Thermins as his UFO, shadow operative, moon-based goals.

218
00:14:07.440 --> 00:14:12.000
How freaking cool is the is the future when everyone's in Nehru suits working for Shadow?

219
00:14:12.059 --> 00:14:15.659
It is operated by gesture, which is what we're seeing in computers now.

220
00:14:15.720 --> 00:14:22.679
There is now there is now a one-handed keyboard that DJs can use and play notes into their mix.

221
00:14:22.799 --> 00:14:24.720
Most DJs have worked like that for years, do you?

222
00:14:24.779 --> 00:14:25.860
In one-handed.

223
00:14:25.919 --> 00:14:28.799
Oh, so just so that people know exactly what we're talking about.

224
00:14:28.860 --> 00:14:31.200
So we go to the future.

225
00:14:32.820 --> 00:14:42.179
So we go to the future in Aubrey Woods is the controller of a kind of region and he has this secretarial stuff with shiny, shiny faces and blonde air.

226
00:14:42.179 --> 00:14:45.899
And he also has a lot of...

227
00:14:46.019 --> 00:14:50.340
Is this the moment where I can have my nerd goes on of the story?

228
00:14:50.399 --> 00:14:51.659
peaking early.

229
00:14:51.720 --> 00:14:52.500
It's even better.

230
00:14:52.559 --> 00:14:53.279
Thank you.

231
00:14:53.340 --> 00:14:54.179
It's even better.

232
00:14:54.240 --> 00:14:55.379
It's been a while.

233
00:14:55.440 --> 00:14:56.519
It's even better than that.

234
00:14:56.580 --> 00:15:05.399
He reaches out and touches a pretty much like a 4tran card, which looks metallic, and he's able to read the information on it just by touching it.

235
00:15:05.460 --> 00:15:17.039
Now, I had an exciting little Frisson boy nerd moment when I thought, ah, maybe the skin effect they have is some kind of dalek nanotech mutation thing where their skin.

236
00:15:17.100 --> 00:15:26.759
The way that the girls are able to operate the termini, without actually touching it, that they have perhaps a field interface over their skin and he's able to read the data on a card just by touching it.

237
00:15:26.820 --> 00:15:35.820
Like those people who get magnets, some putaneous magnets inserted in them and they can feel, you know, like microwaves and various other things.

238
00:15:35.879 --> 00:15:37.200
It could be like that.

239
00:15:37.259 --> 00:15:39.480
There's a cybernetics expert, Kevin Warwick.

240
00:15:39.539 --> 00:15:50.340
And he's been interviewed for the Doctor Who DVD range and he has been implanting RFID chips and nearfield communication stuff into his body into his wrist and whatnot to unlock his front door.

241
00:15:50.340 --> 00:15:52.799
And he's really...

242
00:15:52.860 --> 00:15:54.360
Well, he's...

243
00:15:54.360 --> 00:15:57.059
It's his sounding very graham. very a bunch of keys, really.

244
00:15:57.120 --> 00:15:58.500
I mean, he's a professor.

245
00:15:58.620 --> 00:15:59.220
Is it that hard?

246
00:15:59.279 --> 00:16:00.179
They're not that heavy.

247
00:16:00.240 --> 00:16:01.019
It's always losing.

248
00:16:01.019 --> 00:16:02.519
Processor inside the netics, you know.

249
00:16:02.580 --> 00:16:04.980
And he is...

250
00:16:04.980 --> 00:16:07.080
He's interested in Dr. and interested in the cyberman.

251
00:16:07.200 --> 00:16:08.100
Come on, we love him.

252
00:16:08.159 --> 00:16:08.940
Yeah, yeah.

253
00:16:09.000 --> 00:16:12.480
He's very, you know, it may not be something I would do, but he's very, very interesting.

254
00:16:12.539 --> 00:16:13.919
Yeah, will become like him.

255
00:16:13.980 --> 00:16:14.580
Yeah.

256
00:16:14.580 --> 00:16:18.000
A bit annoying when you, you know, shaking hands with your wife.

257
00:16:18.059 --> 00:16:19.320
It's a bit cold, love.

258
00:16:19.679 --> 00:16:27.899
It is interesting, though, that we started talking about the dialects and straightaway veered into talking about the humans of this story because they are the more interesting.

259
00:16:27.960 --> 00:16:29.159
Well, that's what they're doing the voices.

260
00:16:29.220 --> 00:16:31.440
No, to the people who never do the most.

261
00:16:31.440 --> 00:16:33.059
I've never done before, and oddly never will again.

262
00:16:33.120 --> 00:16:33.600
But you know what?

263
00:16:33.659 --> 00:16:34.860
They lost the ring modulator.

264
00:16:34.919 --> 00:16:38.340
They were doing the voices live from the suits.

265
00:16:38.399 --> 00:16:39.539
There wasn't the pre-recorded thing.

266
00:16:39.600 --> 00:16:42.659
They were doing them in the little things and then trying to treat them after.

267
00:16:42.779 --> 00:16:43.379
They always did do that.

268
00:16:43.379 --> 00:16:45.539
Yeah, but they didn't have a ring modulator.

269
00:16:45.600 --> 00:16:50.039
So they were kind of guessing around and the early blokes, David Graham was busy.

270
00:16:50.100 --> 00:16:54.179
I don't know what, driving Sylvia Anderson around somewhere and Peter Hawkins.

271
00:16:54.179 --> 00:17:00.240
Peter Hawkins was just drunk on a big ship with Tom the Cabin boy, I think, as Captain Pugwash.

272
00:17:00.299 --> 00:17:01.019
Oh okay.

273
00:17:01.139 --> 00:17:03.360
Because he's captain, of course, because that's a 60s thing.

274
00:17:03.360 --> 00:17:05.759
So Peter Gilbert and Oliver Messalin.

275
00:17:05.819 --> 00:17:06.359
Yes they're the ones.

276
00:17:06.420 --> 00:17:08.700
Oliver Messalin has a hugely impressive name.

277
00:17:08.759 --> 00:17:09.539
He does.

278
00:17:09.599 --> 00:17:12.299
I keep thinking he's a mid-century composer, but he's not.

279
00:17:12.299 --> 00:17:21.960
They have both said that the reason they did it so flat was they were actually told that the sort of hysterical thing was part of the voice modulation.

280
00:17:22.019 --> 00:17:29.400
So sort of the very high, like the high pitch that Peter Hawkins and Graham did, that it would be done in post.

281
00:17:29.460 --> 00:17:38.819
So they were told, give as neutral a performances you can, so we can play with it because as we've just, as we've just said, they hadn't done it for 5 years, no one on the current production team.

282
00:17:38.880 --> 00:17:40.259
No. had done it.

283
00:17:40.319 --> 00:17:40.799
Had seen that.

284
00:17:40.799 --> 00:17:41.220
Yeah, yeah.

285
00:17:41.279 --> 00:17:43.559
You know, so it was like, oh, what are we doing?

286
00:17:43.619 --> 00:17:45.059
And yeah, they...

287
00:17:45.059 --> 00:17:46.619
Well, we're doing Planet of the Apes, aren't we?

288
00:17:46.680 --> 00:17:48.779
Yeah, we are doing Planet of the Apes.

289
00:17:48.839 --> 00:17:50.220
So there's no room for Daleks.

290
00:17:50.279 --> 00:17:52.920
But, I mean, the Daleks, fortunately, are barely in us.

291
00:17:52.980 --> 00:17:55.619
They do their traditional episode one reveal.

292
00:17:55.680 --> 00:17:59.400
You know, it's called something of the Dalek, so the Daleks will be the Cliffhanger.

293
00:17:59.460 --> 00:18:02.460
Ooh, it's the Daleks in, you know, in the cliffhanger to episode one.

294
00:18:02.519 --> 00:18:05.640
But of course, they've appeared midway through the episode for like...

295
00:18:05.640 --> 00:18:06.000
Whoops.

296
00:18:06.000 --> 00:18:10.920
Just a terrible suddenly crash zoom where one of them says report.

297
00:18:10.980 --> 00:18:15.359
You know, it's like a shocking... you just see the skirt of them?

298
00:18:15.720 --> 00:18:17.039
Okay.

299
00:18:17.099 --> 00:18:18.839
Do you know my best bloop in this one?

300
00:18:18.900 --> 00:18:20.160
The Ogons.

301
00:18:20.220 --> 00:18:22.740
And any ogons are the bilottis of this story, aren't they?

302
00:18:22.799 --> 00:18:25.559
But I mean, you've got grunting...

303
00:18:25.559 --> 00:18:31.619
And then you see the 2nd one, just totally forget what how he's meant to be doing the voice and Aubrey was supposed to be doing no complications.

304
00:18:32.160 --> 00:18:34.140
Yes, it's great.

305
00:18:34.259 --> 00:18:37.140
They're really, really shockingly terrible, aren't they?

306
00:18:37.200 --> 00:18:38.339
But I mean, they make the...

307
00:18:38.339 --> 00:18:39.420
I think they look good.

308
00:18:39.480 --> 00:18:40.079
I think they're very good.

309
00:18:40.140 --> 00:18:51.900
I think there's that one moment where it's a bit questionable, would have been shot very early on and they do later have a great deal of consistency in terms of movement and choreography and in terms of characterisation.

310
00:18:51.960 --> 00:18:58.440
Indeed, after that 1st scene, they don't really speak very much, they're just big heavies who will mess you up.

311
00:18:58.500 --> 00:19:04.200
And they, I mean, they kind of work thematically and I do want to kind of try and rescue this a little bit.

312
00:19:04.380 --> 00:19:06.359
We don't sound enthused about this too.

313
00:19:06.480 --> 00:19:07.440
No, I love this story.

314
00:19:07.500 --> 00:19:09.960
But the Darks...

315
00:19:09.960 --> 00:19:11.400
I mean, I think it works out really well.

316
00:19:11.460 --> 00:19:11.700
Yeah.

317
00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:18.960
In Galaxy, Manhattan, the dialects represent a sort of capitalism run wild, you know what I mean?

318
00:19:19.019 --> 00:19:27.420
And that's a story where there's oppressed, unemployed, homeless people living in Central Park, and the Daleks are building this sort of luxury skyscraper and things.

319
00:19:27.420 --> 00:19:34.200
And they're very corporate and Mr. Diagoras, who comes along is wearing a sharp suit and he's, you know, sort of terribly capitalist.

320
00:19:34.259 --> 00:19:42.000
And I think the same thing is happening here because you get the Daleks are the people who motivate the controller to exploit the workers.

321
00:19:42.059 --> 00:19:50.819
And this is something that's starting to happen a little bit in Doctor Who now that's starting, I think, to rescue and rehabilitate John Pertwee.

322
00:19:50.880 --> 00:20:08.279
So the Daleks exploit the workers and they tell Aubrey Woods to increase the output of mine, blah, blah, blah, sector 12 and Aubrey Wood says, well, that will kill the workers and they say, well, you know, only the week workers and, you know, everyone else will survive and things.

323
00:20:08.339 --> 00:20:19.920
And so what's kind of happened is this capitalist depression is the result of whatever happened in sort of 1971 when the conference blew up.

324
00:20:19.980 --> 00:20:26.819
So I guess the Daleks sort of have some kind of thematic thing going for them.

325
00:20:27.119 --> 00:20:29.579
But they're really ineptly done.

326
00:20:29.640 --> 00:20:39.119
And what they've forgotten is that sort of Whitticarian idea that the Daleks are the doctor's nemesis and that they're representations of evil.

327
00:20:39.180 --> 00:20:44.220
And so we don't even get the doctor confronting the Daleks.

328
00:20:44.279 --> 00:20:48.119
No, they sort of strap him to a table and shout at him and then put him in a cell.

329
00:20:48.180 --> 00:20:50.759
Yeah, well, give him to Aubrey Aubrey Woods to talk.

330
00:20:50.819 --> 00:21:04.500
Yeah, there was a conversation written that was mainly just to explain how the Daleks seem to have survived the events of evil of the Daleks and they decided, look, it's not necessary, which is quite interesting when you consider that's kind of what the new series do with the Daleks.

331
00:21:04.559 --> 00:21:07.259
You know, the 1st few times the Daleks appear in the new series is.

332
00:21:07.319 --> 00:21:09.059
And that's the last of the Daleks that have been destroyed.

333
00:21:09.119 --> 00:21:10.079
Oh, except for the ones over here.

334
00:21:10.140 --> 00:21:11.339
Okay, we'll destroy them.

335
00:21:11.400 --> 00:21:13.559
That's the last except for the one except you know what?

336
00:21:13.619 --> 00:21:15.059
just going to stop explaining it.

337
00:21:15.119 --> 00:21:17.220
That's perfect sense because they have time travel.

338
00:21:17.460 --> 00:21:22.079
Oh, we haven't even mentioned Dalek Invasion of Earth 20 cough cough, whatever.

339
00:21:22.140 --> 00:21:23.160
That was actually meant to be.

340
00:21:23.220 --> 00:21:24.960
They do mention it though, don't they?

341
00:21:25.019 --> 00:21:25.799
57?

342
00:21:25.859 --> 00:21:27.539
We have invaded Earth again or something.

343
00:21:27.960 --> 00:21:29.039
We have changed the course of history.

344
00:21:29.099 --> 00:21:30.000
Yeah.

345
00:21:30.059 --> 00:21:35.039
And I think the implication here is this time they've invaded Earth before their previous invasion.

346
00:21:35.160 --> 00:21:38.759
Yes, this is meant to be earlier. 20th century.

347
00:21:38.819 --> 00:21:39.420
Which makes sense.

348
00:21:39.480 --> 00:21:56.279
Not a lot of sense when you got certainly got the sense that the Scorovian Daleks in that one was their 1st go, which is why there were a bit pants that the whole thing you wanted to hollow out, habited planet, where they make, you know, with a magnet a spear and go flying, all that nonsense for duh.

349
00:21:56.339 --> 00:21:59.640
Oh, yeah, yeah, but Russell 2 Davies explained that, so all is forgiven.

350
00:21:59.759 --> 00:22:01.799
You're reconning.

351
00:22:01.859 --> 00:22:02.339
Yes.

352
00:22:02.400 --> 00:22:04.440
Can we talk per tweak?

353
00:22:04.500 --> 00:22:06.299
Yeah, you know, I think I think we should.

354
00:22:06.359 --> 00:22:08.339
I was avoiding that because I haven't had a go for a while.

355
00:22:08.400 --> 00:22:09.240
Yes, go on.

356
00:22:09.539 --> 00:22:11.940
You don't want to tell that.

357
00:22:12.059 --> 00:22:15.359
Oh, I wanted to talk about the Bogdanovich limitation effect.

358
00:22:15.480 --> 00:22:20.819
That's what prevents them from going back and trying to assassinate.

359
00:22:20.880 --> 00:22:27.900
Can either of you explain the tag scene because, okay, my research for this was, in fact, reading the target book, I'll come out and say it.

360
00:22:27.960 --> 00:22:28.799
I'll be out in a bit.

361
00:22:28.859 --> 00:22:30.059
I didn't watch the TV thing.

362
00:22:30.119 --> 00:22:31.740
I read the target book again.

363
00:22:31.799 --> 00:22:32.579
Is it Terence?

364
00:22:32.640 --> 00:22:34.319
Yeah, it is.

365
00:22:34.380 --> 00:22:35.579
But it's good.

366
00:22:35.640 --> 00:22:36.779
Are you serious?

367
00:22:36.779 --> 00:22:37.980
sometimes good.

368
00:22:38.039 --> 00:22:39.240
Yeah, he is.

369
00:22:39.240 --> 00:22:40.619
Most often when he's got a bit of time.

370
00:22:40.680 --> 00:22:46.319
He's certainly, you know, the 1st author I read with any, any truth persistence at the age of whatever.

371
00:22:46.380 --> 00:22:52.500
The tag scene is cut out of the TV version where they meet again in the lab, simply for a time.

372
00:22:52.559 --> 00:22:52.740
Okay.

373
00:22:52.799 --> 00:22:53.339
It was filmed.

374
00:22:53.400 --> 00:22:57.000
The whole Bogdanovich limitation, I said, is surely that you can't meet yourself.

375
00:22:57.059 --> 00:23:00.059
So what's going on in that 1st scene and what's going on in that tag scene?

376
00:23:00.180 --> 00:23:11.819
It's that you can't, for instance, the future doctor can't say to his past self, don't press that button because I'll come into existence because then he's not there to say, don't press that button or I won't come into existence.

377
00:23:11.940 --> 00:23:14.220
But that's exactly what happens around the console.

378
00:23:14.339 --> 00:23:15.420
And we do it all the time.

379
00:23:15.480 --> 00:23:16.319
Do you know what I mean?

380
00:23:16.380 --> 00:23:17.400
Like in Doctor Who now.

381
00:23:17.460 --> 00:23:25.559
I mean, Blenovic limitation effect is essentially just a crummy McGuffin, you know, like it's an I'll explain later, essentially.

382
00:23:25.619 --> 00:23:26.160
Yeah, yeah.

383
00:23:26.220 --> 00:23:27.420
It's not actually a thing.

384
00:23:27.480 --> 00:23:28.859
And they ignore it routinely.

385
00:23:28.980 --> 00:23:31.799
Does it come up again in Modronundu?

386
00:23:31.859 --> 00:23:33.599
Yeah, Is that the thing that...

387
00:23:33.839 --> 00:23:42.299
Yeah, and wherein it becomes too sentient beings, I suppose, from 2 different time zones, cannot touch or else...

388
00:23:42.359 --> 00:23:43.140
Sorry.

389
00:23:43.200 --> 00:23:43.920
I thought it was the same.

390
00:23:44.039 --> 00:23:54.359
Yeah, so yeah, 2 of the same sentient being from different time zones can't. can't touch, can't interact physically without there being a massive explosion of time differential energy.

391
00:23:54.420 --> 00:23:59.339
Except Kazra and Sardic hugs himself in...

392
00:23:59.460 --> 00:24:01.619
The Christmas Carol. doesn't explode.

393
00:24:01.680 --> 00:24:07.799
I mean, that's to me, that's the least questionable thing about the Christmas carol, but we're getting ahead of ourselves. outrageous.

394
00:24:07.920 --> 00:24:09.359
No, no, I'm not saying I didn't like it.

395
00:24:09.420 --> 00:24:11.400
I just said, I just said there is quite...

396
00:24:11.400 --> 00:24:12.960
Oh, no, I totally really care about it.

397
00:24:13.740 --> 00:24:22.200
No, but per we in this, I think it's continuing something we were talking about last season. which is his character is softening.

398
00:24:22.200 --> 00:24:28.259
In this instance, he doesn't have to be almost forcibly dragged to come in and help out at the peace conference.

399
00:24:28.319 --> 00:24:36.960
Let Prince Stewart turns up and says, I need you and they have a bit of banter back and forth, which you always know is going to end up with the doctor going down there, but he's just going through...

400
00:24:37.019 --> 00:24:39.779
I was going to say, he doesn't actually have to be cajoled, does he?

401
00:24:40.380 --> 00:24:42.000
You know, what the brigadier wants.

402
00:24:42.059 --> 00:24:47.700
It's just sort of a playful, awful slash moment.

403
00:24:47.759 --> 00:24:48.720
Please don't very quickly.

404
00:24:48.779 --> 00:24:49.680
Come on.

405
00:24:49.740 --> 00:24:58.500
You know, it's gone from the antagonistic relationship they would have sometimes in the early seasons of the doctor saying, no, I just want to have a look at this.

406
00:24:58.559 --> 00:25:04.680
Sorry, what's the name of the thing I've written on the prop to actually... get to that later in the season.

407
00:25:04.740 --> 00:25:06.420
Yeah, the naughty thing is pinned onto props.

408
00:25:06.539 --> 00:25:08.160
Yeah, that's...

409
00:25:08.220 --> 00:25:09.539
I think I missed that. don't you?

410
00:25:09.599 --> 00:25:14.039
I actually miss when Pertwe's doctor had a real kind of reason to push against something.

411
00:25:14.099 --> 00:25:17.220
He's just a little bit too comfy, cosy home counties.

412
00:25:17.279 --> 00:25:20.519
No, you see, I actually think that it's a bit cleverer than that.

413
00:25:20.640 --> 00:25:23.400
He's not as obnoxious as he normally is with Reginald style.

414
00:25:23.460 --> 00:25:25.559
So Reginald Styles, he's pretty awful.

415
00:25:25.619 --> 00:25:26.880
Being obnoxious.

416
00:25:26.940 --> 00:25:29.039
He's being obstructionist.

417
00:25:29.099 --> 00:25:32.880
He's not telling us the truth about what he experienced the night before, all of that.

418
00:25:33.539 --> 00:25:36.299
Yeah, if anyone deserves to be treated obnoxiously.

419
00:25:36.359 --> 00:25:38.039
And Kertwe is actually quiet.

420
00:25:38.099 --> 00:25:39.900
He doesn't push him.

421
00:25:39.960 --> 00:25:48.059
He sort of lets him tell all of the kind of strange confabulations he comes up with to explain things, but he doesn't push him and he's not obnoxious.

422
00:25:48.059 --> 00:25:53.099
And this is a civil servant who you might expect Pertley to be horrible to.

423
00:25:53.160 --> 00:26:02.039
And then we do see him being very comfortable in home counties in episode one where he's slappably reading the wine cellar.

424
00:26:02.160 --> 00:26:03.839
Look, at least he's stealing the wine.

425
00:26:03.900 --> 00:26:04.680
Do you know what I mean?

426
00:26:04.740 --> 00:26:06.000
That's a little trout and touch.

427
00:26:06.059 --> 00:26:07.200
He's at least stealing this stuff.

428
00:26:07.259 --> 00:26:09.660
And you know, he's not just having a glass of wine.

429
00:26:09.720 --> 00:26:13.200
He pulls out a bottle and 3 wedges of cheese and grapes or what.

430
00:26:13.259 --> 00:26:14.279
And Joe's just like, what?

431
00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:16.079
has a bouquet.

432
00:26:16.140 --> 00:26:17.220
Yeah.

433
00:26:17.279 --> 00:26:19.500
It's sardonic but not cynical.

434
00:26:19.559 --> 00:26:22.019
And we get that we get that charming scene where...

435
00:26:22.019 --> 00:26:23.339
Cody rides her eyes, yeah.

436
00:26:23.400 --> 00:26:29.339
Yeah, Joe tries to give Benton some food and Mike comes in and you're not meant to be eating on duty and sends Benton away and he eats.

437
00:26:29.400 --> 00:26:31.079
And what about that date, Miss Grant that we never have?

438
00:26:31.200 --> 00:26:32.099
She's, yeah, right.

439
00:26:32.880 --> 00:26:37.380
So I'm not, like, I'm not a massive fan of action pertswing.

440
00:26:37.500 --> 00:26:40.259
I don't think that the doctor should be running around hitting people, frankly.

441
00:26:40.319 --> 00:26:42.000
It's not havoc pertly anymore.

442
00:26:42.059 --> 00:26:43.619
It's profile pertly, is it?

443
00:26:43.680 --> 00:26:46.140
I am a little bit of a fan of the moment.

444
00:26:46.200 --> 00:26:47.339
Terry Walsh.

445
00:26:47.400 --> 00:26:50.220
Yeah, yeah, just doing the stunts.

446
00:26:50.279 --> 00:26:51.960
So we have to mention Terry Walsh is not in this story.

447
00:26:52.019 --> 00:26:56.160
We contractually obligated to mention Terry Walsh every story from...

448
00:26:56.160 --> 00:26:58.799
Terry Walsh's son is now following the podcast.

449
00:26:58.920 --> 00:27:02.579
I believe he found our comment for punching Terry Walsh in the face.

450
00:27:02.640 --> 00:27:07.019
I do hope he realises that that's not meant as an instruction because we think his dad's wonderful.

451
00:27:07.079 --> 00:27:08.940
So we're going to start Walsh watch.

452
00:27:09.000 --> 00:27:14.940
So profile was like his stunt team thing that he...

453
00:27:15.000 --> 00:27:16.740
I think it's just Terry standing side on.

454
00:27:16.799 --> 00:27:18.900
Oh, okay, profile, obviously.

455
00:27:19.079 --> 00:27:21.359
Yeah, they got a bit pansy.

456
00:27:21.420 --> 00:27:32.880
Someone at the BBC was getting smarty pants because Derek Weir, covered in fleas still to this day, was both an agent and a stuntman and they didn't like him having 2 jobs.

457
00:27:33.000 --> 00:27:35.519
So which is pretty much why Havoc disbanded.

458
00:27:35.579 --> 00:27:39.839
So Persui gets attacked by Ashura or someone in episode one.

459
00:27:39.900 --> 00:27:43.559
And he's doing his horrible wine and cheese thing.

460
00:27:43.619 --> 00:27:52.500
And he actually manages to attack Shura, knock him unconscious without putting his glass down, and then when Shura falls over, he takes a sip.

461
00:27:52.559 --> 00:27:55.140
We don't, oh, it's awful.

462
00:27:55.200 --> 00:27:57.299
I'm afraid I like it too.

463
00:27:57.359 --> 00:28:00.599
Like, it's the kind of thing I think Roger Moore tries to do it as James Bond.

464
00:28:00.720 --> 00:28:02.220
Yeah, he doesn't get away with it either exactly.

465
00:28:02.279 --> 00:28:14.039
But I think I think Pertwee does get away with it because Roger Moore would do it and, you know, possibly still kick the body while it's down because that's a very James Bond thing to do.

466
00:28:14.099 --> 00:28:17.700
Whereas the doctor is about, okay, remove the immediate threat. and carry on.

467
00:28:17.759 --> 00:28:24.059
Well, the reason the stunts always looks so terrible in the 70s is Roger was too lazy to do any proper rehearsals.

468
00:28:25.319 --> 00:28:27.359
Yeah, Roger would just do a little...

469
00:28:27.420 --> 00:28:27.779
That's it.

470
00:28:27.839 --> 00:28:28.259
Yeah, yeah.

471
00:28:28.319 --> 00:28:28.559
Yeah.

472
00:28:28.619 --> 00:28:33.240
So he is very obnoxious and he's sort of horribly middle class and kind of annoying.

473
00:28:33.299 --> 00:28:43.559
But when it comes time, he sees the oppressed workers from a distance in a car park because the future consists largely of sort of car parks and the South Bank.

474
00:28:43.619 --> 00:28:44.519
Yeah, terrible.

475
00:28:44.579 --> 00:28:46.140
Cottage is under bridges.

476
00:28:46.200 --> 00:28:50.220
But then he goes into bat on their behalf.

477
00:28:50.279 --> 00:28:51.359
Do you know what I mean?

478
00:28:51.420 --> 00:28:59.940
And what we find is increasingly in this season, but we did find it last season as well, that he goes into bat on the progressive side of causes.

479
00:29:00.000 --> 00:29:11.880
And here it's very, very clear where he talks about the oppressed workers being fit only to lead the lives of a dog, about how they're being, you know, monstered by secret police and all of that sort of thing.

480
00:29:11.940 --> 00:29:14.460
And so Pertuys sort of dropped the obnoxious thing.

481
00:29:14.519 --> 00:29:21.660
He still does sort of come in as a sort of patrician saviour who, you know, intervenes from a sort of moral high ground.

482
00:29:21.660 --> 00:29:24.960
That was the political savvy at the time, though, wasn't it?

483
00:29:25.019 --> 00:29:35.339
Yeah, yeah, yeah. ingratiate yourself with the upper glasses and then say, excuse me, you people have a real problem here because of the way you're treating your quote unquote lower classes.

484
00:29:35.400 --> 00:29:49.500
In fact, that scene where he's actually delivering that polemic about the oppression of the workers from a lovely couch with wine and grapes and all of those things, which sort of parallels season one.

485
00:29:49.559 --> 00:29:57.240
And he doesn't do his usual blustering, you know, attacking Mr. Brown Rose or horrible walker from the ministry or whatever.

486
00:29:57.299 --> 00:30:01.380
He's actually quite sort of urbane and quite calm about it.

487
00:30:01.440 --> 00:30:04.859
And I think it is an improvement in his character.

488
00:30:04.859 --> 00:30:14.220
And spoiler alert, I'm finding myself not disliking poetry quite as much as I expected to.

489
00:30:14.279 --> 00:30:20.460
Dear listener, my string of pearls was about to snap from the way I am clutching them.

490
00:30:20.519 --> 00:30:21.900
My word name.

491
00:30:21.960 --> 00:30:28.799
I think Nathan's speaking entirely honourable and fair about this because the character of the doctor in this is entirely honourable.'re right.

492
00:30:28.859 --> 00:30:31.920
He's there is glorious without the vein in front of us.

493
00:30:31.980 --> 00:30:34.380
He's automatically sympathetic to the terrorists.

494
00:30:34.500 --> 00:30:36.539
Even when they're tying him up in the cellar.

495
00:30:36.599 --> 00:30:37.619
And thank you.

496
00:30:37.680 --> 00:30:42.480
Can we just mention that, the doctor gets some proper biffo in this, and how good is the casting?

497
00:30:42.539 --> 00:30:50.339
They're very rodent featured, no offence to the actor, but there is no one in this I don't thoroughly believe is true to their part.

498
00:30:50.400 --> 00:30:51.960
The casting of this is superb.

499
00:30:52.019 --> 00:30:56.039
And the bloke at the end, not to spoil it for anyone who hasn't watched it.

500
00:30:56.099 --> 00:31:00.059
But we's jailer. is one of the most convincing villains I've seen in Doctor Who ever.

501
00:31:00.839 --> 00:31:04.619
There's yeah, there's no one in this that I would say is poorly cast.

502
00:31:04.680 --> 00:31:10.140
And what's really great about pert we softening in the role in this one?

503
00:31:10.140 --> 00:31:11.400
Like a ripe breeze.

504
00:31:11.460 --> 00:31:13.440
Like a rice left out on the lawn?

505
00:31:13.500 --> 00:31:15.000
It has a good runny Camembert.

506
00:31:15.059 --> 00:31:17.099
It has a great, it has a great deal of character.

507
00:31:17.160 --> 00:31:23.460
Is this the 1st time that we have seen him inspire a villain to become heroic?

508
00:31:24.359 --> 00:31:26.279
Ah, okay.

509
00:31:26.339 --> 00:31:27.660
Savages?

510
00:31:27.720 --> 00:31:30.599
Wasn't there some consideration of what was going on?

511
00:31:30.660 --> 00:31:31.319
Absolutely.

512
00:31:31.319 --> 00:31:31.680
Absolutely.

513
00:31:31.740 --> 00:31:31.980
Yeah.

514
00:31:32.039 --> 00:31:37.019
So I was thinking, particularly with Pertwee's doctor, you know, usually he just slaps the villain of alphabet or what have you.

515
00:31:37.079 --> 00:31:38.400
He actually saved his life.

516
00:31:38.460 --> 00:31:39.059
Yeah, yeah.

517
00:31:39.059 --> 00:31:40.980
He does prevent them from killing him.

518
00:31:41.039 --> 00:31:47.220
He saves the controller's life and the controller sort of thinks about what he said and not only actively helps him from that point.

519
00:31:47.279 --> 00:31:49.859
I think he saved him because he had great heroic death.

520
00:31:49.920 --> 00:31:53.400
I think he saved him because he was really envious of that peacock green neighbourhood.

521
00:31:53.460 --> 00:31:55.500
He really wanted to wear from season one.

522
00:31:55.559 --> 00:31:57.839
It is a fabulous. mostly about the frost.

523
00:31:57.900 --> 00:31:58.799
Fabulous suit.

524
00:31:58.859 --> 00:32:01.319
So can we talk very briefly about the special edition?

525
00:32:01.440 --> 00:32:02.640
I think we should.

526
00:32:02.700 --> 00:32:04.319
So have you seen this?

527
00:32:04.380 --> 00:32:08.880
I saw the special edition when it came out, but as I say, I read the Tiger book this time, which again was fun.

528
00:32:09.000 --> 00:32:15.420
I didn't watch it this time because I wanted the authentic, horrible experience of Peter Messelli in his voice.

529
00:32:15.480 --> 00:32:16.680
Was it that bad?

530
00:32:16.740 --> 00:32:17.400
It really is.

531
00:32:17.519 --> 00:32:18.660
Oliver Messi.

532
00:32:18.660 --> 00:32:19.559
Oliver Messi.

533
00:32:19.619 --> 00:32:21.480
Oliver Gilbert and Peter Messaline.

534
00:32:21.599 --> 00:32:22.319
Yeah, yeah, terrible.

535
00:32:22.440 --> 00:32:23.160
Truly terrible.

536
00:32:23.220 --> 00:32:24.539
So what they did for the special edition?

537
00:32:24.599 --> 00:32:25.799
A lot of bird noises on the lawn.

538
00:32:26.039 --> 00:32:29.519
They put some crummy CG special effects.

539
00:32:29.579 --> 00:32:36.900
So instead of like council blocks where the controller lives with his retinue of blonde secretaries.

540
00:32:36.960 --> 00:32:40.619
No, I've seen them once in the original cut, I just remember some white concrete...

541
00:32:40.680 --> 00:32:41.099
Yeah, yeah.

542
00:32:41.160 --> 00:32:45.779
So but instead they're sort of space towers, I think that's actually done rather sympathetically.

543
00:32:45.839 --> 00:32:49.980
It's done by Farmageddon, the same chat behind the 5 doctors special edition.

544
00:32:49.980 --> 00:32:50.339
Okay.

545
00:32:50.400 --> 00:32:53.700
And Flight of the Darnd, which are 2 of the greatest.

546
00:32:53.759 --> 00:32:56.220
The side of the dance. about socks.

547
00:32:56.700 --> 00:32:58.920
We can link to it on the website.

548
00:32:58.980 --> 00:32:59.579
Oh, okay, all right.

549
00:32:59.640 --> 00:33:00.599
You're in for a treat.

550
00:33:00.660 --> 00:33:06.119
Let's just say Farmageddon does a little turn on time flight.

551
00:33:06.180 --> 00:33:07.319
Oh, okay.

552
00:33:07.319 --> 00:33:08.400
It's based on time flight.

553
00:33:08.460 --> 00:33:10.019
But yeah, there's that, of course.

554
00:33:10.079 --> 00:33:15.599
Nick Briggs does the new Dalek voices and we have new effects.

555
00:33:15.660 --> 00:33:16.859
We have some new editing.

556
00:33:16.920 --> 00:33:18.900
No, they did a great thing.

557
00:33:18.960 --> 00:33:19.319
Yeah.

558
00:33:19.380 --> 00:33:21.539
They got some people that dress up as unit people.

559
00:33:21.599 --> 00:33:24.180
They got some people to dress up as Ogre.

560
00:33:24.240 --> 00:33:25.740
They got a bunch of Daleks.

561
00:33:25.799 --> 00:33:27.119
So, because the final...

562
00:33:27.119 --> 00:33:28.799
Do they get Sean Pertley and drag as he's dead?

563
00:33:28.859 --> 00:33:30.480
No, I want that.

564
00:33:30.539 --> 00:33:32.220
Although he did do that for Halloween.

565
00:33:32.279 --> 00:33:33.539
He did, and we should stick that.

566
00:33:33.599 --> 00:33:35.339
I want that, dude. pretty good, please.

567
00:33:35.400 --> 00:33:37.859
So, and the alp off against Capaldi.

568
00:33:37.920 --> 00:33:41.160
With Michelle Gomez in the middle saying, you too.

569
00:33:41.279 --> 00:33:47.160
Just be like, it'd be like, Mark of the Rani, only less crap. even better.

570
00:33:47.700 --> 00:33:56.039
So they restage the giant climactic battle at the end of episode four, which is actually the original location.

571
00:33:56.099 --> 00:34:01.500
They used they used the same type of camera that they filmed the exteriors on.

572
00:34:01.559 --> 00:34:11.760
Because they've got 6 Ogrons and 3 Daleks, and these people are trying to prevent their entire invasion of Earth from ever happening.

573
00:34:11.820 --> 00:34:15.900
Even the Daleks are trying to stop it, but they can only afford to send 3 of them.

574
00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:22.139
Even Katie said, you know, in subsequent interviews, she and John thought it was all a bit, you know, that is a bit rubbish.

575
00:34:22.199 --> 00:34:27.059
And this is still sort of fairly rubbish, but it does improve things sort of enormously.

576
00:34:27.179 --> 00:34:34.079
Oh, can we just also mention, is this the 1st time I've ever seen the doctor actively and sensibly, insensibly?

577
00:34:34.139 --> 00:34:38.460
Shoot, a protagonist, sentia being for no good damn reason.

578
00:34:38.519 --> 00:34:39.360
No, seeds of death.

579
00:34:39.420 --> 00:34:44.579
But he's having a great time being Roger Moore with a pistol.

580
00:34:45.360 --> 00:34:50.579
The Ice Warrior did have a gun when the doctor shoots the ogre on this.

581
00:34:50.639 --> 00:34:51.780
The doctor just comes around the corner.

582
00:34:51.840 --> 00:34:53.940
There's one Ogon with his gun raised and the doctor shoots him.

583
00:34:54.000 --> 00:34:59.880
The doctor turns around, sees another Oberon, doesn't have a gun in his hand, takes the time to aim and shoots him.

584
00:34:59.940 --> 00:35:01.440
Does he shoot 2 Ogron?

585
00:35:01.500 --> 00:35:02.820
This is an episode.

586
00:35:02.880 --> 00:35:03.179
Yeah.

587
00:35:03.239 --> 00:35:05.820
Interestingly enough, in the special edition.

588
00:35:06.960 --> 00:35:09.239
They Star Wars it.

589
00:35:09.300 --> 00:35:10.739
The Ogron shoots fast.

590
00:35:10.800 --> 00:35:14.579
They do other things like they cut out the no complications line.

591
00:35:14.639 --> 00:35:19.920
They cut out like all sorts of really just sort of inept directorial moments.

592
00:35:19.980 --> 00:35:21.300
So they do improve it.

593
00:35:21.360 --> 00:35:24.420
In the book, it's a shootout, as you say.

594
00:35:24.480 --> 00:35:26.820
Okay, the doctor doesn't shoot 1st in the book.

595
00:35:26.880 --> 00:35:29.039
I don't like Trout and shooting those.

596
00:35:29.039 --> 00:35:29.579
No.

597
00:35:29.579 --> 00:35:31.079
Seeds of death. awful.

598
00:35:31.139 --> 00:35:32.099
It's not very trap.

599
00:35:32.159 --> 00:35:45.900
Can I just say, though, I do kind of like the only 3 Daleks aspect of the story for most of it because I love the idea that Earth is only important enough to warrant 3 Daleks.

600
00:35:45.960 --> 00:35:49.619
Oh, I thought there were only the 3 dialects of that region because it's a region.

601
00:35:49.920 --> 00:35:52.980
Maybe England is only important enough to warrant 3 Daleks.

602
00:35:53.039 --> 00:36:01.679
Where the final battle scene falls down then is, when, you know, you're shooting the same daleks in different places to make it look like that.

603
00:36:01.739 --> 00:36:03.960
That usually works. unless one of them is gold.

604
00:36:04.019 --> 00:36:10.260
And we've already been told there's only one gold dalek and suddenly there's 10 because you're shooting them from different angles.

605
00:36:10.320 --> 00:36:13.320
If they just had a shot, the 2 gray Daleks from lots of different angles.

606
00:36:13.500 --> 00:36:15.119
I think it would have been a lot more convincing.

607
00:36:15.179 --> 00:36:16.260
That wrist rabens.

608
00:36:16.320 --> 00:36:18.119
Well, maybe not a lot more convincing.

609
00:36:18.179 --> 00:36:39.719
Well, the gold one, because it draws your eye, immediately tells you that these are just the same 3 props, whereas if you've got clever editing and, oh, there's the gold dialect and 2 great Alex, and there's a great dialect, and there's 2 more great Alecs there, you would still sit down afterwards and go, oh, hold on, they were probably the same props, but probably not what you're watching at the time.

610
00:36:39.900 --> 00:36:42.599
You know why they're that colour, though, don't you?

611
00:36:42.659 --> 00:36:48.480
It's funny you mentioned that the transponder emitter on their heads were stuck taped on.

612
00:36:48.539 --> 00:36:52.199
They're the colours of minis and mini coopers respectively at the time.

613
00:36:52.260 --> 00:36:54.360
The gray is a, yeah, it's calf name.

614
00:36:54.420 --> 00:36:59.039
The gold was called something sunset that Mini Coopers came out in the year before.

615
00:36:59.159 --> 00:37:00.239
Lovely.

616
00:37:00.360 --> 00:37:04.679
Do you know, we've done the whole of this story without mentioning Miss Paget.

617
00:37:05.099 --> 00:37:08.219
Oh, she's rather bad. full of poetry.

618
00:37:08.280 --> 00:37:09.420
Yeah, she is one of them.

619
00:37:09.480 --> 00:37:23.400
I think possibly though, she's a bit eclipsed by Anat, but maybe maybe that's a direct comparison we can draw, you know, even though the future is horrible and people are being worked to death, at least women aren't just secretaries who are told to shut up by their boss because they're telling the military the truth.

620
00:37:23.460 --> 00:37:25.079
You see, English.

621
00:37:25.139 --> 00:37:25.619
That's a charm.

622
00:37:25.679 --> 00:37:26.940
Miss Paget could be a terrorist.

623
00:37:27.000 --> 00:37:29.400
That would be a spinoff that I would really like to see.

624
00:37:29.519 --> 00:37:32.340
Well, we kind of got it, didn't we?

625
00:37:32.400 --> 00:37:37.260
In Age of Steel, Rise of the Cybermen, with Mrs. Moore.

626
00:37:37.380 --> 00:37:38.699
Oh bless.

627
00:37:38.760 --> 00:37:40.320
I love Mrs. Moore.

628
00:37:40.920 --> 00:37:43.739
Well, you know what?

629
00:37:43.800 --> 00:37:54.059
I think possibly after this story, Joe saw how brave Captain Mike Yates was, and we see her agree to go on a date with him at the beginning of The Curse of Peladin.

630
00:37:54.119 --> 00:37:55.619
Well, what could possibly go wrong?

631
00:38:02.099 --> 00:38:09.119
I don't think they're going on a date, and she's certainly not dressed as if she's going to share a comedy beer if she does.

632
00:38:09.179 --> 00:38:10.320
She is a comedy beard.

633
00:38:10.380 --> 00:38:24.059
She, um, she's, you know, taking out to the clubs and she's wearing something, you know, a bit fabulous, but a little bit frumpy because she doesn't want to attract attention away from Mike, who's obviously the main, the main attraction here.

634
00:38:24.119 --> 00:38:25.380
Good beating for each other.

635
00:38:25.440 --> 00:38:26.519
Yeah, I think so.

636
00:38:26.579 --> 00:38:28.199
I think that's clearly what's happening.

637
00:38:28.320 --> 00:38:30.780
It's a very, very strange opening.

638
00:38:31.500 --> 00:38:32.639
I see he was just doing her hair.

639
00:38:32.699 --> 00:38:34.559
Have you seen all the publicity shots for this?

640
00:38:34.619 --> 00:38:41.159
Every single publicity shot that was done before the final shoot, Katie had forgotten to remove one of the rollers from her hair.

641
00:38:41.219 --> 00:38:43.860
She's got a big pink roll.

642
00:38:43.920 --> 00:38:48.780
I mean, well, I think Mike was just in such a hurry. forgot to finish. forgot to...

643
00:38:48.840 --> 00:38:50.400
But he only gets mentioned.

644
00:38:50.460 --> 00:38:51.480
We don't actually see him.

645
00:38:51.539 --> 00:38:55.500
And this is kind of important because it's tiresome at this time.

646
00:38:55.559 --> 00:38:57.420
He's getting pretty tiresome.

647
00:38:57.480 --> 00:38:58.500
No, nonsense.

648
00:38:58.559 --> 00:39:11.519
This story actually has like an opening that doesn't involve the regular cast and it's it's set on an alien planet, a sort of strange mediaeval planet where, you know, an argument is taking place in a throne room.

649
00:39:11.579 --> 00:39:15.539
And it is something that we really haven't had for a very, very long time.

650
00:39:15.599 --> 00:39:17.159
It's the 1st story.

651
00:39:17.159 --> 00:39:21.239
It's the 1st story of John Pert, not to feature Nicholas Courtney.

652
00:39:21.360 --> 00:39:21.960
Yeah.

653
00:39:21.960 --> 00:39:22.500
Very important.

654
00:39:22.559 --> 00:39:23.400
That's interesting.

655
00:39:23.460 --> 00:39:31.199
Even in colleague in space, you know, he was there to help the setup and for a moment we believe went, it's all going to be on earth and then suddenly we're in space.

656
00:39:31.260 --> 00:39:35.340
This time it's just no, it's traditional Doctor Who, we're in the Tartars and we're about to land somewhere.

657
00:39:35.400 --> 00:39:38.579
Yeah, there's not even a scene on Earth at all at the beginning.

658
00:39:38.639 --> 00:39:41.280
And the doctor claims to have fixed the Tatus, doesn't he?

659
00:39:41.340 --> 00:39:43.320
He claims that it's a test flight.

660
00:39:43.380 --> 00:40:02.340
So this argument in the throne room is kind of the big thematic argument, and it's between the high priest and the chancellor, and it's the lovely lisping David Trouton, is king of Paladon, and these are his 2 sort of beloved advisors, and they're arguing about joining the European economic community.

661
00:40:02.400 --> 00:40:03.539
You know, everyone...

662
00:40:03.599 --> 00:40:05.099
I believe, join Eurovision.

663
00:40:05.280 --> 00:40:16.800
You know, I actually think I actually think that people overplay the European economic community thing, and I don't think it really works as an allegory because Peladon is this sort of primitive culture.

664
00:40:16.860 --> 00:40:17.699
Do you know what I mean?

665
00:40:17.760 --> 00:40:20.400
And they're all sort of technologically advanced and stuff.

666
00:40:20.460 --> 00:40:26.460
But I think that there is something about progress, and I think it's important, sort of in the pertwi era.

667
00:40:26.519 --> 00:40:31.980
Unit belongs to the United Nations, which is a big sort of supernational organisation.

668
00:40:32.039 --> 00:40:41.159
Both mind of evil and day of the Daleks present international diplomacy as a sort of progressive thing as a way of avoiding war as a way of making the world better.

669
00:40:41.219 --> 00:40:47.099
And in claws of Axos, Britain misbehaves by keeping Axonide for itself. you know.

670
00:40:47.159 --> 00:40:53.099
So the perjury era has this idea that forging alliances and things is a good thing in itself.

671
00:40:53.159 --> 00:40:54.840
And so this is what we see happening here.

672
00:40:54.900 --> 00:40:58.980
You've got 2 stories in a row that are actually looking at current political events.

673
00:40:59.039 --> 00:41:01.860
That hasn't happened, I don't think, ever before in Doctor Who has it.

674
00:41:01.920 --> 00:41:09.360
The savages touched on it, but you've not seen stories that are trying to be quite so contemporary as this season has been.

675
00:41:09.420 --> 00:41:11.760
This one, you know, you touched on it before.

676
00:41:11.820 --> 00:41:14.639
Britain was trying again to join the EU.

677
00:41:14.699 --> 00:41:27.539
The reason it had taken so long is that De Gaul, apparently because of simply because of Dunkirk and feeling that Britain had let them down so terribly in the war, opposed Britain joining the EUC.

678
00:41:27.599 --> 00:41:34.019
And it was only after his passing that finally jumped in very quickly and had a very short window in which to do it.

679
00:41:34.079 --> 00:41:49.800
So, really, you're just, you're seeing on TV all the delegates in grapery getting together in capes because apparently you're not a delegate, unless you're wearing a high collar, even if you're trundling around in a front loader, you know, with suds effects, you've still got to have a collar on the back of it.

680
00:41:49.860 --> 00:41:50.460
And you have to be green.

681
00:41:50.519 --> 00:41:51.960
They're actually all green.

682
00:41:52.320 --> 00:41:53.099
Well, actually, yeah.

683
00:41:53.159 --> 00:42:01.559
And again, I think the best, yeah, the best thing about this story, if you want to look at it, because when you analyse it and what's actually working, it's not much, but the whole thing works together.

684
00:42:01.619 --> 00:42:04.679
I think the costumes and the designs are gorgeous.

685
00:42:04.739 --> 00:42:05.940
They really get that right.

686
00:42:06.059 --> 00:42:09.360
And the lighting is lovely and the sets really work.

687
00:42:09.420 --> 00:42:13.079
Well, for instance, the Peladonians are all different shades of heliotrope.

688
00:42:13.139 --> 00:42:14.760
Different shades of purple.

689
00:42:14.760 --> 00:42:15.840
And the delicates are...

690
00:42:15.900 --> 00:42:17.039
I thought they were all Cadbury purple.

691
00:42:17.099 --> 00:42:17.699
They are.

692
00:42:17.760 --> 00:42:18.960
Oh, don't say that.

693
00:42:19.079 --> 00:42:19.559
We get soon.

694
00:42:20.099 --> 00:42:22.619
We've already mentioned George Brandon.

695
00:42:22.679 --> 00:42:26.340
They melt in your, they melt in your hand, not in your mouth or something like that.

696
00:42:26.460 --> 00:42:27.780
Lovely agador.

697
00:42:27.840 --> 00:42:28.980
We haven't even touched on him yet.

698
00:42:29.039 --> 00:42:33.659
Look, we haven't really said what this story is because if you're listening to this, you probably know.

699
00:42:34.320 --> 00:42:37.320
And it's meant to be a hound of the basketballs thing.

700
00:42:37.380 --> 00:42:39.119
You see a lot of fans say, I don't even see that.

701
00:42:39.179 --> 00:42:42.420
It's just other than it's got a teddy bear that's disappeared for a long time and comes back.

702
00:42:42.539 --> 00:42:53.699
I think one of the bigger influences is Star Trek's Journey to Bay. which went out about a year before the script was written 2 years before broadcast and it has a very similar thing.

703
00:42:53.760 --> 00:42:58.920
It's a bunch of cultures actually on their way to a conference when there is a murder.

704
00:42:59.099 --> 00:43:07.920
It's all it all dates back to Conan Doyle and Agatha Christie, of course, but Journey to Babel sort of has that element, the strongest.

705
00:43:07.980 --> 00:43:10.619
It doesn't have the mysticism element, which is what this has in actor.

706
00:43:10.679 --> 00:43:13.679
You'd think it would, but there's one caveat.

707
00:43:13.739 --> 00:43:16.440
There's one thing that makes me say it's actually nothing to do with.

708
00:43:16.920 --> 00:43:18.840
It just superficially looks like it's the trek thing.

709
00:43:18.900 --> 00:43:22.500
Actually, there's a lot more to do with, okay, if we want to go back to antecedents.

710
00:43:22.559 --> 00:43:24.659
This is really Ursula Le Guin's Ecumen stories.

711
00:43:24.719 --> 00:43:26.639
Did you read those when you were a tiny, tiny person?

712
00:43:26.699 --> 00:43:27.780
read a few of them.

713
00:43:27.900 --> 00:43:33.480
You know, the long separated non-humanoid races that reestablish.

714
00:43:33.539 --> 00:43:38.579
Well, Gethen in those books is Alpha Centauri with an unfixed gender, but just a lot more convincing.

715
00:43:38.639 --> 00:43:42.659
That's not hard We'll get on to what lovely Lenny Maine.

716
00:43:42.719 --> 00:43:44.219
You know who was actually credited at one point?

717
00:43:44.280 --> 00:43:54.420
It was a joke and it almost went out, that the director of this story, the Australian ex-donceur, that became a director, was actually billed as lovely Lenny Maine director.

718
00:43:54.480 --> 00:43:56.219
And someone said, get that off that car.

719
00:43:57.480 --> 00:43:59.039
That's true.

720
00:43:59.039 --> 00:43:59.699
He was Australian.

721
00:43:59.760 --> 00:44:07.019
He was Australian and had a very fruity vocabulary, which we may well touch on. especially when it comes to Alpha Centauri.

722
00:44:07.079 --> 00:44:12.539
This story actually comes about, I think, again, with the political stuff that was happening with Britain and the end of Empire.

723
00:44:12.599 --> 00:44:17.579
If touch on mining corporations, which is really, you know, what this story seems to be about minerals.

724
00:44:17.639 --> 00:44:27.659
Mining corporations as then as now, had influence at the diplomatic level, and we're pushing treaties, giving them partial ownership of countries themselves, in South America, and in Africa.

725
00:44:27.659 --> 00:44:40.380
And Britain, just as in every Bond film over the last 10 years, was the moralising adjudicator, you know, who offered aid whilst shoring up its own banks, with loans that would take generations for these countries to pay back.

726
00:44:40.440 --> 00:44:43.739
Now, if you look at how the federation is operating here.

727
00:44:43.800 --> 00:44:49.800
I don't think the Star Trek Federation would have ever had battleships supplying around going, well, you know, if this doesn't work out, we're going to blow them.

728
00:44:49.920 --> 00:44:52.980
No, no, the buggerries out of your purple shorts.

729
00:44:53.039 --> 00:44:53.579
No.

730
00:44:53.639 --> 00:44:54.780
No.

731
00:44:54.840 --> 00:45:01.679
So on the surface, it definitely feels tricked, but I actually think it's much more insidious and darker in English than Trek ever gone into.

732
00:45:01.739 --> 00:45:05.340
And I think Jody Tobabel is probably the best Trek story of the original series.

733
00:45:05.400 --> 00:45:08.699
And similarly, I think this is Brian Hale's best script for the show.

734
00:45:08.760 --> 00:45:10.139
And he's really good, isn't he?

735
00:45:10.199 --> 00:45:11.460
Yeah, he's great.

736
00:45:11.519 --> 00:45:12.900
I love what he's done with the Ice Warriors.

737
00:45:12.960 --> 00:45:14.340
Spangly now.

738
00:45:14.400 --> 00:45:15.360
They have Spangler capes.

739
00:45:15.420 --> 00:45:18.780
I actually was actually thinking they're not quite as Spangly as they used to be.

740
00:45:18.840 --> 00:45:20.639
No, they've got a new Spangley tuck cape, apparently.

741
00:45:20.699 --> 00:45:21.900
Well, you remember the Marshall?

742
00:45:21.900 --> 00:45:22.980
Seeds of Death.

743
00:45:23.039 --> 00:45:25.139
Well, no one...

744
00:45:25.860 --> 00:45:32.039
Deal listener, this is actually the day after the Mardi Gras parade, and I was in that, and there were quite a few grand marshals, judging by the amount of glitter.

745
00:45:32.099 --> 00:45:33.659
I still have glitter on me.

746
00:45:33.719 --> 00:45:37.320
And the other listener, I didn't wear glitter, nor did I hug anyone wearing glitter.

747
00:45:37.380 --> 00:45:37.980
No, that's right.

748
00:45:37.980 --> 00:45:38.820
God knows how it happens.

749
00:45:38.880 --> 00:45:41.099
The ice warriors in this.

750
00:45:41.159 --> 00:45:46.260
The people have talked about it being humanising the ice warriors.

751
00:45:46.320 --> 00:45:47.159
Well, quite frankly, though.

752
00:45:47.280 --> 00:45:49.199
That's a racist term, isn't it, really?

753
00:45:49.260 --> 00:45:51.059
I think that's quite racist.

754
00:45:51.119 --> 00:45:55.619
Mainly because our human influences in this story are Joe and the doctor.

755
00:45:55.619 --> 00:45:57.360
Amazonia.

756
00:45:57.360 --> 00:45:59.579
And Amazonia further down the line.

757
00:46:00.659 --> 00:46:04.619
The chairman delegate from Earth, Nathan is looking very confused.

758
00:46:04.679 --> 00:46:05.760
She's billed as Amazonia.

759
00:46:05.820 --> 00:46:06.659
Oh, is she?

760
00:46:06.719 --> 00:46:07.440
I love her.

761
00:46:07.500 --> 00:46:08.579
Oh, can we talk about her later?

762
00:46:08.639 --> 00:46:09.059
Yeah.

763
00:46:09.119 --> 00:46:10.199
That means she's from the Amazon.

764
00:46:10.260 --> 00:46:12.059
Did you notice everyone's called from the country?

765
00:46:12.059 --> 00:46:13.860
so it's Arcturus.

766
00:46:13.920 --> 00:46:17.099
So the doctor should really be called Earth, Soul.

767
00:46:17.159 --> 00:46:17.880
Soul.

768
00:46:17.940 --> 00:46:19.860
But because the doctor doesn't trust.

769
00:46:19.920 --> 00:46:21.059
The Ice Warriors.

770
00:46:21.119 --> 00:46:23.039
Joe immediately doesn't trust the ice Warrior.

771
00:46:23.099 --> 00:46:28.739
So I, you know, I would say the racism here is coming from the human element, which ties in with the colonial theme.

772
00:46:28.800 --> 00:46:34.920
But it's wonderful how the doctor then, when he realises he's been wrong about the ice war is.

773
00:46:34.980 --> 00:46:36.300
He doesn't attempt to justify himself.

774
00:46:36.360 --> 00:46:37.860
He just says, look, you know, I was wrong.

775
00:46:37.920 --> 00:46:41.219
I was wrong because of my past experience and I'm sorry about that.

776
00:46:41.280 --> 00:46:43.679
Joe's actually a little bit sceptical of him.

777
00:46:43.739 --> 00:46:51.239
She eventually sort of follows on and she finds Arcturus's thing in... she gives them the benefit of the doubt first.

778
00:46:51.300 --> 00:46:59.219
Yeah, she does call the doctor a little bit on his prejudice, but look, I think the ice Warriors are great and it is a great thing to turn them from villains into heroes.

779
00:46:59.340 --> 00:47:01.739
But gosh, those costumes are awful.

780
00:47:01.800 --> 00:47:04.139
I mean, they really, really just look terrible.

781
00:47:04.260 --> 00:47:05.280
Oh, they do.

782
00:47:05.280 --> 00:47:06.179
I swore it was all weird.

783
00:47:06.239 --> 00:47:07.739
Yes, the ice Warriors are terrible.

784
00:47:07.800 --> 00:47:09.900
They are bits and pieces left over, you know?

785
00:47:10.019 --> 00:47:13.440
They were a bit of a. they look worse in colour than they do in black and white.

786
00:47:13.500 --> 00:47:14.880
No, that's possible.

787
00:47:15.480 --> 00:47:18.119
Black and white hides a multitude of things.

788
00:47:18.239 --> 00:47:19.679
Are you saying that the costumes aren't convincing?

789
00:47:19.739 --> 00:47:21.420
Have we touched on Alpha Centaur yet?

790
00:47:21.480 --> 00:47:22.559
Well, that would be rude.

791
00:47:22.619 --> 00:47:24.539
This is not...

792
00:47:24.539 --> 00:47:26.219
You know, the director is not consented.

793
00:47:26.280 --> 00:47:30.900
If we haven't seen if the listener hadn't seen Alpha Centauri, how would you describe?

794
00:47:31.019 --> 00:47:37.800
Well, look at being giant green penis in a shower curtain. hexodecimal hexapods, shooter pod waving.

795
00:47:37.860 --> 00:47:38.699
It's got 6...

796
00:47:38.760 --> 00:47:42.179
It's got a big round head with an iris and...

797
00:47:42.239 --> 00:47:43.260
Yes, yes.

798
00:47:43.320 --> 00:47:46.199
And it's green, which you wouldn't have read in colour, so it would actually have been even ruder.

799
00:47:46.260 --> 00:47:49.860
It turned up, and Lenny Maine said, and I'll say this very carefully.

800
00:47:49.920 --> 00:47:54.539
It looks like an effing prick, is it?

801
00:47:54.599 --> 00:47:56.460
But with an Australian accent.

802
00:47:56.519 --> 00:47:57.360
That was like an acting prick.

803
00:47:57.420 --> 00:47:59.099
He said, get rid of it. do something with it.

804
00:47:59.159 --> 00:48:00.480
We don't have Australian accent.

805
00:48:00.539 --> 00:48:01.139
No, we don't.

806
00:48:01.199 --> 00:48:01.679
No, we don't.

807
00:48:01.739 --> 00:48:03.360
We're very not very convincing.

808
00:48:03.420 --> 00:48:07.320
So they took it away and put literally a shower curtain around it.

809
00:48:07.320 --> 00:48:09.719
He said, now it looks like an effing prick in a cave.

810
00:48:10.440 --> 00:48:13.440
But it's not as good as what he said about Aguador.

811
00:48:13.500 --> 00:48:19.679
He was really annoyed with how English all the extras and the actors were being when Agador finally makes his appearance in the throne room.

812
00:48:19.739 --> 00:48:24.059
Not terribly. looks quite convincing in the half lit tunnels shot from below.

813
00:48:24.119 --> 00:48:26.940
But I'm sorry, it's a bloke in a teddy bear suit when he comes out.

814
00:48:27.000 --> 00:48:28.079
Oh, it's Nick Hobbs.

815
00:48:28.139 --> 00:48:29.219
Nick Hobbs is gorgeous.

816
00:48:29.280 --> 00:48:32.880
We saw him in Claws of Axos. as the unit driver hypnotised by the master.

817
00:48:32.940 --> 00:48:33.719
He's quite gorgeous.

818
00:48:33.780 --> 00:48:35.639
But anyway, care fluffy out there, right?

819
00:48:35.699 --> 00:48:37.500
Well, only you would know that watching it.

820
00:48:37.559 --> 00:48:42.059
So the folk at home are just sitting there thinking, oh, it's a lovely teddy bear and everyone goes, yes, it's a teddy bear.

821
00:48:42.119 --> 00:48:46.440
Anyway, the story goes, Lenny Maine says sort of classic.

822
00:48:46.500 --> 00:48:50.699
Look at this thing, like you go to all say, holy freaking cow.

823
00:48:50.760 --> 00:48:56.159
And of course, there was a troop during the camera rehearsal troop of Boy Scouts being led around by their vicar.

824
00:48:56.219 --> 00:49:07.679
So, of course, at that point, Agedor comes in in the entire cast in unison calls out, holy freaking cow, in a foam, for Australian accents, for the scout boys all burst into laugh.

825
00:49:07.739 --> 00:49:09.840
You don't need to go to conventions.

826
00:49:09.900 --> 00:49:11.039
You can hear it all in the year.

827
00:49:11.099 --> 00:49:20.460
You'd think, though, by this point that Vickers would just know to avoid the Doctor Who set or indeed. hanging around with young scouts, considering later eventualities.

828
00:49:20.519 --> 00:49:21.119
Yes, sadly.

829
00:49:22.320 --> 00:49:24.539
Can I talk pertween?

830
00:49:24.599 --> 00:49:25.500
I think we have to.

831
00:49:25.559 --> 00:49:26.400
I think we have to.

832
00:49:26.519 --> 00:49:30.059
Yeah, it's, it's kind of, it's kind of... a bit into pert we watch.

833
00:49:30.179 --> 00:49:31.079
We don't necessarily.

834
00:49:31.199 --> 00:49:32.400
I just love that hair.

835
00:49:32.460 --> 00:49:37.139
This is the 1st time when he does a truly convincing B. Arthur for the entire...

836
00:49:37.199 --> 00:49:38.639
No, seriously, the entire performance.

837
00:49:38.699 --> 00:49:41.760
There are moments when I have to squint to be sure it's not per week.

838
00:49:41.820 --> 00:49:45.059
He does have to strap on his fighting wig.

839
00:49:45.119 --> 00:49:46.800
Yes, oh, here we are.

840
00:49:46.800 --> 00:49:48.000
And notice to attack.

841
00:49:48.059 --> 00:49:59.219
Yeah, in order to make Grant because he's fairly obviously played by Terry Walsh during that scene at the end of episode three, I want to say, when, you know, he's fighting the King's champion.

842
00:49:59.280 --> 00:50:01.019
Gron is a member of Habik, you knew.

843
00:50:01.019 --> 00:50:01.619
Oh, is he?

844
00:50:02.219 --> 00:50:03.360
Yeah, scored some Claire, yes.

845
00:50:03.420 --> 00:50:03.659
Yes.

846
00:50:03.719 --> 00:50:07.199
Yeah, I think I saw some of him last night at Mardi Gras.

847
00:50:07.260 --> 00:50:08.519
And he's an arranger.

848
00:50:08.519 --> 00:50:11.340
And it's time to Ranger as well, in his own right.

849
00:50:11.400 --> 00:50:12.719
Yes, Ian Terry.

850
00:50:12.719 --> 00:50:15.059
Why does he had his tongue cut out or something?

851
00:50:15.119 --> 00:50:16.860
Oh, because...

852
00:50:16.860 --> 00:50:19.079
Well, because just be grateful he's not black.

853
00:50:19.139 --> 00:50:20.340
Yeah that's true.

854
00:50:20.400 --> 00:50:22.199
It's usually what they have to be, isn't it?

855
00:50:22.500 --> 00:50:31.440
And we do we do have another situation in this story where Joe doesn't really get to meet any strong women.

856
00:50:31.500 --> 00:50:33.239
Oh, I don't know.

857
00:50:33.239 --> 00:50:34.440
Since Pellet, I think.

858
00:50:35.340 --> 00:50:39.900
Yeah, Rod did comment that although he enjoyed the story, he gave it 8 out of 10.

859
00:50:40.079 --> 00:50:44.760
He doesn't really understand Peladin's marriage proposal because he's clearly gay.

860
00:50:44.820 --> 00:50:46.260
So why is he proposing to Joe?

861
00:50:46.320 --> 00:50:48.119
That's the same reason Mike Yates is.

862
00:50:48.179 --> 00:50:48.480
Thank you.

863
00:50:48.539 --> 00:50:52.860
I think that was artfully set up in the opening scene for us all to go.

864
00:50:52.920 --> 00:50:53.280
Ah, yes.

865
00:50:53.340 --> 00:50:55.199
Instead of cunning parallel.

866
00:50:55.260 --> 00:51:00.539
Well, it was difficult in the 70s for young men with, you know, raspberry ripple hairdos too.

867
00:51:00.539 --> 00:51:01.739
Convincing.

868
00:51:01.739 --> 00:51:03.480
In those shorts.

869
00:51:03.539 --> 00:51:04.860
Have you mentioned the disco shorts?

870
00:51:04.920 --> 00:51:06.179
And the go-go there?

871
00:51:06.239 --> 00:51:10.440
She's taking fashion advice from Altos from...

872
00:51:10.440 --> 00:51:11.639
She's got the legs for it, though.

873
00:51:11.820 --> 00:51:13.980
From the keys of Mariners.

874
00:51:14.039 --> 00:51:16.320
Yes, one of my favourite stories.

875
00:51:16.380 --> 00:51:17.699
I totally blank.

876
00:51:17.699 --> 00:51:18.780
Second only to the massacre.

877
00:51:18.840 --> 00:51:19.380
Yeah.

878
00:51:19.380 --> 00:51:20.460
Which is still good.

879
00:51:20.519 --> 00:51:22.380
Yes, I was watched a bit of it this week.

880
00:51:22.440 --> 00:51:23.400
Right.

881
00:51:23.460 --> 00:51:26.400
Peter Purvis says it was the best story he did, the massacre.

882
00:51:26.460 --> 00:51:37.980
Then again, he said it was the most intelligent script and it was it was really done for adults and I think that, you know, if you're not getting it, you're probably looking at Doctor Who for the wrong reasons.

883
00:51:38.099 --> 00:51:40.559
I'm really fond of Peter Purpose.

884
00:51:40.619 --> 00:51:42.360
Is that the one with the terraleptol in it?

885
00:51:42.480 --> 00:51:47.579
I don't think that's the one that's not a nice way to talk about. hastily along.

886
00:51:47.699 --> 00:51:49.559
And chaplet.

887
00:51:49.739 --> 00:51:58.139
That being said, you know, I think the relationship between Peladon and Joe is very sweet. is touching, isn't it?

888
00:51:58.199 --> 00:52:10.380
Mainly because of how Katie Manning plays it because this is the 1st time and since Joe arrived on the show where Joe has had Joe has met anyone who inspires her as much as the doctor does.

889
00:52:10.440 --> 00:52:16.079
You know, it's very clear early on last season that Joe thinks the world of the doctor.

890
00:52:16.139 --> 00:52:21.179
At the end of last season, she is ready to sacrifice herself for him.

891
00:52:21.239 --> 00:52:23.219
You're saying she's a bit upwardly mobile?

892
00:52:23.280 --> 00:52:26.400
No, no, she only goes for talk.

893
00:52:26.460 --> 00:52:27.480
Ooh, a king.

894
00:52:27.539 --> 00:52:28.860
No, no, no.

895
00:52:28.920 --> 00:52:32.039
I suppose I suppose it could be construed that way.

896
00:52:32.099 --> 00:52:33.599
Essex, isn't she?

897
00:52:33.599 --> 00:52:42.239
I think Katie plays the conflict very well of choosing between her life with the doctor and possibly a life with peladin.

898
00:52:42.300 --> 00:52:48.659
And I don't think the royalty appeals because really, you know, peladin is an asset rich planet, but it's not a socially rich planet.

899
00:52:48.719 --> 00:52:54.960
Well, he wouldn't want to live in a big fisher price rock face with, you know, stuffed turdy bear.

900
00:52:55.019 --> 00:52:57.840
I think I had the toy version of that in Castle Greyskull as a child.

901
00:52:58.139 --> 00:53:00.420
West Castle Gray, Scott, was it?

902
00:53:00.420 --> 00:53:01.739
It's pretty much Castle Gray, Scott.

903
00:53:01.800 --> 00:53:03.780
But a lot of the same cast.

904
00:53:03.840 --> 00:53:11.699
But that final scene is beautiful and it does begin to set up an element of Joe's character in that, you know, she is a young woman.

905
00:53:11.760 --> 00:53:24.000
And I think it's possibly the 1st time where a companion character is allowed to have these romantic feelings without just being kicked out of a TARDIS, Susan.

906
00:53:24.059 --> 00:53:27.719
She gets free. and she leaves with the 3rd one.

907
00:53:27.780 --> 00:53:30.539
But she gets petal or whatever his name is, last name.

908
00:53:30.599 --> 00:53:31.139
Lartep.

909
00:53:31.199 --> 00:53:32.519
It's petal backwards.

910
00:53:32.579 --> 00:53:36.480
Um, from, uh, Planet of the Daleks.

911
00:53:36.539 --> 00:53:37.800
And then later, of course, some.

912
00:53:38.099 --> 00:53:38.760
Professor Jones.

913
00:53:38.820 --> 00:53:40.139
Lovely Professor Jones.

914
00:53:40.199 --> 00:53:41.280
Long hair.

915
00:53:41.340 --> 00:53:43.980
I inherited that from the family, obviously.

916
00:53:44.039 --> 00:53:45.900
Sight gag, it was not.

917
00:53:46.019 --> 00:54:03.059
But no, I think that, especially that final scene where she is genuinely torn and would be devastated with either choice, but she has to make one and also pert with his portrayal of his reaction that he would be devastated as well, but he wouldn't try to stop her.

918
00:54:03.119 --> 00:54:04.079
He's very sweet.

919
00:54:04.139 --> 00:54:05.219
I think in that sweet.

920
00:54:05.219 --> 00:54:06.000
It's very sweet.

921
00:54:06.059 --> 00:54:08.159
And then, of course, they have to make their comedy escape.

922
00:54:08.219 --> 00:54:12.840
But they don't forget they're acting emotionally when they realise they have to get out of there.

923
00:54:12.900 --> 00:54:17.400
Like Joe's voice is still breaking slightly when she's joking about going to see the coronation.

924
00:54:17.460 --> 00:54:23.519
We haven't seen an evolution of a relationship like this since I think the doctor and Barbara.

925
00:54:23.579 --> 00:54:26.820
I don't know that it's being done in the writing.

926
00:54:26.880 --> 00:54:27.539
Do you know what I mean?

927
00:54:27.659 --> 00:54:29.519
or particularly the production?

928
00:54:29.579 --> 00:54:36.059
But I think it is just an artefact of John and Casey warming towards each other and enjoying working together.

929
00:54:36.119 --> 00:54:43.679
And I think too, that the doctor is being allowed to relax a little bit and be a little bit more silly.

930
00:54:43.739 --> 00:54:46.320
So he gets some comedy moments here.

931
00:54:46.380 --> 00:54:47.400
Do you know what I mean?

932
00:54:47.460 --> 00:54:51.599
He's got this rotating mirror that he's going to hypnotise Agatore with.

933
00:54:51.659 --> 00:54:55.500
He looks at it and nearly hypnotise himself and has to sort of shake it off.

934
00:54:55.559 --> 00:55:03.719
And he sings Twankador and it's sort of terribly funny and like he hypnotises Joe by mistake with it later and all of that sort of thing.

935
00:55:03.780 --> 00:55:07.559
And he's starting to be allowed to do funny doctor-ish things again.

936
00:55:07.800 --> 00:55:12.119
We were talking a little bit about the poetry from our childhood.

937
00:55:12.179 --> 00:55:13.619
Were you saying that, Brendan?

938
00:55:13.679 --> 00:55:16.079
This is starting to be the per tweet from my childhood.

939
00:55:16.139 --> 00:55:22.500
Yeah, this is this is the part we that people remember because when I talk to people who aren't Doctor Who fans, about Doctor Who.

940
00:55:22.559 --> 00:55:27.360
Half of them remember Tom and he's their doctor and half of them remember John and he's their doctor.

941
00:55:27.420 --> 00:55:35.340
And the people who remember John remember the funny side and they remember, oh, that, you know, that one with the teddy bear in the caves.

942
00:55:35.400 --> 00:55:37.019
Yeah, for instance.

943
00:55:37.079 --> 00:55:39.900
And he's like, he treats Agador like a dog.

944
00:55:39.960 --> 00:55:40.739
Do you know what I mean?

945
00:55:40.800 --> 00:55:42.179
Like in a kind of sweet way.

946
00:55:42.239 --> 00:55:43.500
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

947
00:55:43.559 --> 00:55:43.920
Yeah.

948
00:55:43.980 --> 00:55:48.539
Yeah. terrific if we'd actually got to keep Agador as an early K-not.

949
00:55:48.599 --> 00:55:50.039
That would have been something, wouldn it?

950
00:55:50.159 --> 00:55:53.039
He would have livened up the mutants enormously.

951
00:55:53.099 --> 00:55:53.579
Oh, God.

952
00:55:53.579 --> 00:55:55.380
The mutants coming up.

953
00:55:55.559 --> 00:56:02.340
He's not just the pompous, obnoxious Tory bastard.

954
00:56:02.400 --> 00:56:04.199
Oh, that's hard. in season seven.

955
00:56:04.260 --> 00:56:06.059
Yeah, that is harsh.

956
00:56:06.179 --> 00:56:10.440
This is what he was like all last month without your influence, Richard.

957
00:56:10.500 --> 00:56:13.920
But now, you know, like I'm really warming to him enormously.

958
00:56:14.219 --> 00:56:16.320
Doctor is Patrician.

959
00:56:16.380 --> 00:56:19.260
I do like that line that Danny plays to Capaldi.

960
00:56:19.320 --> 00:56:25.679
Oh, you're a lord, of course you are, even with the, even with the Glaswegian docs brine that you're throwing over it.

961
00:56:25.800 --> 00:56:29.519
I can really hear you, you really are very lordly, and I really like that moment.

962
00:56:29.699 --> 00:56:33.719
Moffat has picked up on, the doctor is Patrician.

963
00:56:33.780 --> 00:56:47.219
No matter how much he may try to deny it, which I think is why I found the 10th doctor, slightly grating, and he's the love that they picked up on it, the Dick Van Dyke, sensibility, copy accent, because it always felt a bit phoney.

964
00:56:47.280 --> 00:56:55.380
And you could see Tenet have moments of tenet have moments of real obnoxious patricianism in a way that the only one that really wasn't was Eccleston.

965
00:56:55.440 --> 00:57:02.400
It is that thing where the doctor comes in to solve your problems from a position of kind of superior knowledge.

966
00:57:02.579 --> 00:57:05.159
Are you saying pissing from a great height?

967
00:57:05.219 --> 00:57:06.480
Something like that.

968
00:57:06.539 --> 00:57:07.019
Yeah.

969
00:57:07.019 --> 00:57:07.320
Yeah.

970
00:57:07.380 --> 00:57:09.239
And I think that's unavoidable in the character.

971
00:57:09.300 --> 00:57:14.699
And the show critiques that and perhaps particularly under Moffatt, but the show does critique that a bit.

972
00:57:14.820 --> 00:57:18.000
It's not until he actually does lose everything.

973
00:57:18.059 --> 00:57:19.079
This is the pet.

974
00:57:19.139 --> 00:57:27.119
This is a petulant teen adolescent doctor, really, if you look at his overall lifespan. commented on later, that he's had his toys taken away.

975
00:57:27.179 --> 00:57:28.260
He's lost his flying ball.

976
00:57:28.320 --> 00:57:28.980
He's been grounded.

977
00:57:29.039 --> 00:57:40.800
He's going to be here. been grounded sent to his room with a whole lot of friends he's got to make for himself that aren't on his level. and okay, he's doing quite well considering. and they'll send his best worstie bestie worstie enemy from school.

978
00:57:40.860 --> 00:57:52.079
Can you imagine what brittle little queens they could have both been in the pride on Academy playground, just absizing everybody else up, sitting on the sidelines, not playing sport and just bitching about everybody else.

979
00:57:52.139 --> 00:57:55.800
That's right. creating time flow analogues and wrecking everyone's homework.

980
00:57:55.920 --> 00:57:56.820
Exactly.

981
00:57:57.239 --> 00:58:05.639
On a side note, Russell T. Davis was actually approached by the BBC to make a series about a teenage doctor.

982
00:58:05.880 --> 00:58:07.380
Whoa.

983
00:58:07.440 --> 00:58:08.820
Oh, Golly Wally.

984
00:58:08.880 --> 00:58:09.840
When was this?

985
00:58:09.900 --> 00:58:11.039
After his...

986
00:58:11.099 --> 00:58:14.039
This was during the, this was um, when it was really big.

987
00:58:14.099 --> 00:58:19.860
I think during the production of season two, they started talking to him about before Sarah Jones.

988
00:58:19.920 --> 00:58:22.019
Yeah, yeah, it becomes Sarah Jane Adventures, that's what they do.

989
00:58:22.079 --> 00:58:23.219
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

990
00:58:23.579 --> 00:58:24.360
Do you think they would have gone?

991
00:58:24.420 --> 00:58:25.559
Well, that's the thing.

992
00:58:25.619 --> 00:58:28.679
He said, I did like a one page document and decided it would be absolutely terrible.

993
00:58:28.739 --> 00:58:30.420
So I pitched them Sarah Jane instead.

994
00:58:30.480 --> 00:58:31.800
Well, I'm really grateful for that.

995
00:58:31.860 --> 00:58:37.559
I don't think it would have been terrible, but I think it would have been a lot more work when, you know, Liz gave us a whole world.

996
00:58:37.619 --> 00:58:38.579
Yeah, we don't want to know.

997
00:58:38.639 --> 00:58:40.139
It would have been demystification.

998
00:58:40.199 --> 00:58:44.039
Yeah, we had that lovely moment in listen recently where we had the young doctor.

999
00:58:44.099 --> 00:58:45.539
Spoiler alert, but you know what?

1000
00:58:45.599 --> 00:58:46.559
It was broadcast a few months ago.

1001
00:58:48.420 --> 00:58:51.360
But yeah, I, you know, that was brilliant.

1002
00:58:51.420 --> 00:58:54.059
And we don't see him.

1003
00:58:54.119 --> 00:58:58.980
We see him in shadow and we see him like we see a monster, which is amazing.

1004
00:58:59.099 --> 00:59:03.599
And that, I mean, that brings me back to the monsters in this.

1005
00:59:03.659 --> 00:59:05.159
Put these nostrils.

1006
00:59:05.219 --> 00:59:07.260
You do get quite a few shots of those.

1007
00:59:07.320 --> 00:59:07.739
Yeah, yeah.

1008
00:59:07.800 --> 00:59:10.079
Remember when he's lying on that he hates those nostrils.

1009
00:59:10.139 --> 00:59:13.559
They do them quite a lot for someone who's asked them not to, don't they?

1010
00:59:13.619 --> 00:59:24.179
But what's what's really interesting about this is they're really trying to do non-humanoid aliens because Star Trek had finished its run in the UK by this point.

1011
00:59:24.239 --> 00:59:26.639
And the original Star Trek had 2 types of aliens.

1012
00:59:26.699 --> 00:59:35.760
They had humans with funny bits or funny paint on them and they had wibbly cameras on the pattern representing energy beings and sometimes a combination of the two.

1013
00:59:35.880 --> 00:59:42.780
So when Doctor Who's trying to do aliens, they're going to do a non-bipedal alien.

1014
00:59:42.840 --> 00:59:45.300
Okay, ends up looking like a penis in a coat, but whatever.

1015
00:59:45.360 --> 00:59:48.480
And they're going to do an alien which is a head in a jar.

1016
00:59:48.539 --> 00:59:49.980
We do it much, much better.

1017
00:59:50.039 --> 00:59:52.440
I can't wait to see how they do Croton the Coronavore.

1018
00:59:52.500 --> 00:59:53.400
It's going to be fantastic.

1019
00:59:53.519 --> 00:59:56.880
But the croats on the coronavirus.

1020
00:59:56.940 --> 00:59:59.579
I love the I love the head on the jar.

1021
00:59:59.639 --> 01:00:02.519
That's like the face of bow. you know where he turns up later?

1022
01:00:02.579 --> 01:00:03.840
Octurus.

1023
01:00:03.900 --> 01:00:04.980
Very good.

1024
01:00:05.039 --> 01:00:07.860
It only turns out later, Bernard's his name.

1025
01:00:07.920 --> 01:00:08.940
Burn it up.

1026
01:00:08.940 --> 01:00:10.619
Bernard is his name.

1027
01:00:10.679 --> 01:00:11.519
Do you know he turns up?

1028
01:00:11.579 --> 01:00:13.139
In fact, he is Bernard.

1029
01:00:13.199 --> 01:00:19.920
The same out costume he's used to the blackout a Christmas special and he's with nursey inside it, Bernard, and he's part of the...

1030
01:00:19.920 --> 01:00:21.659
He's part of the triple husbandoid.

1031
01:00:21.719 --> 01:00:22.739
That's right.

1032
01:00:22.800 --> 01:00:23.579
That Queenie.

1033
01:00:23.639 --> 01:00:25.320
I must say that again.

1034
01:00:25.380 --> 01:00:27.179
So they did revive and resuscitate him.

1035
01:00:27.239 --> 01:00:28.260
And it was nursey all the time.

1036
01:00:28.320 --> 01:00:31.679
It's actually Murphy Grumba inside that machine.

1037
01:00:31.679 --> 01:00:32.460
It's been a Dalek.

1038
01:00:32.519 --> 01:00:35.460
Murphy Grumbo and he has to operate the gun by kicking it with his foot.

1039
01:00:35.519 --> 01:00:48.780
But this is a, I mean, this is this is what they try and do in the end of the world and then again in the rings of Atkinson, which is to produce as many sort of strange aliens as they possibly can on their sort of limited budget.

1040
01:00:48.840 --> 01:01:02.219
And you can see, like Russell's just pulling out all of the stops in the end of the world to be as expensive as possible. in the discontinuity guide, Cornell Day and topping note that there's only one bed in the ice Warriors.

1041
01:01:02.280 --> 01:01:03.000
Yes.

1042
01:01:03.119 --> 01:01:05.880
We don't know the gender of Sorg, though, do we?

1043
01:01:05.940 --> 01:01:06.659
Sorg has to stand.

1044
01:01:07.199 --> 01:01:08.760
How do you know that?

1045
01:01:09.420 --> 01:01:11.880
Because the outfit has a rod in the back.

1046
01:01:11.940 --> 01:01:14.519
That's the thing has to click into.

1047
01:01:14.579 --> 01:01:18.599
To sit down on the set of the ice Warriors, Bernard Brisler had to have a shooting stick round up.

1048
01:01:18.659 --> 01:01:19.860
So to me, really?

1049
01:01:19.980 --> 01:01:21.000
Yes, you know, you did.

1050
01:01:21.059 --> 01:01:21.360
He did.

1051
01:01:21.420 --> 01:01:23.099
That's why he's terrible.

1052
01:01:23.159 --> 01:01:25.260
That's why he begged to have the part returned.

1053
01:01:25.260 --> 01:01:34.139
Who would have known that fibreglass was so expensive that you had to amortise the expense over like 4 terrible stories?

1054
01:01:34.320 --> 01:01:36.539
Okay, they're not that terrible.

1055
01:01:36.599 --> 01:01:39.780
Except for Monster Paladon, which is really, truly awful.

1056
01:01:39.840 --> 01:01:40.800
Well, we're not there yet.

1057
01:01:40.860 --> 01:01:53.400
I do think this is a lot more effective than, like, all the aliens turning up in the end of the world and all the aliens turning up in rings of Akaten, simply because each of the aliens in this are given a character, they're given characterisation.

1058
01:01:53.460 --> 01:01:56.219
Oh, they're just spectacle, I think, in the end of the world. you know what I mean?

1059
01:01:56.280 --> 01:02:02.099
I think that's deliberately, you know, intended to say this is Doctor Who, you know, you might remember it.

1060
01:02:02.159 --> 01:02:04.739
Well, this is this is flashing...

1061
01:02:04.739 --> 01:02:10.920
You might remember it as a sort of penis in our shower curtain, but we have a lot more money now and here's what we can do.

1062
01:02:10.980 --> 01:02:12.659
And we've got people made out of wicker baskets.

1063
01:02:12.780 --> 01:02:17.099
I actually think the most convincing alien is Alpha Centauri, and I love the characterisation.

1064
01:02:17.159 --> 01:02:20.760
He's utterly convincing as a perplexed civil servant.

1065
01:02:20.820 --> 01:02:34.019
And you know, Isan Churchman, who plays, yeah, the queen of the spiders, as Alpha Centauri, as everything else, was told to play Centauri as a perplexed and bothered homosexualist civil servant.

1066
01:02:34.079 --> 01:02:34.679
Yes.

1067
01:02:34.679 --> 01:02:35.699
I think she's great.

1068
01:02:35.760 --> 01:02:38.219
It's a really memorable character.

1069
01:02:38.280 --> 01:02:38.699
I really love it.

1070
01:02:38.760 --> 01:02:39.420
Really love him.

1071
01:02:39.480 --> 01:02:42.000
And especially... he was going to get his own spinoff too, wasn't he?

1072
01:02:42.059 --> 01:02:43.079
Offer Centorian friends.

1073
01:02:43.139 --> 01:02:46.139
I thought that was just disappearance on the black and white minstrel show.

1074
01:02:46.199 --> 01:02:50.159
Yes, we should make sure that he actually did appear. didn't he actually appear...

1075
01:02:50.219 --> 01:02:51.360
Did he do it black and white men?

1076
01:02:51.360 --> 01:02:51.780
Yeah, he do.

1077
01:02:51.840 --> 01:02:57.119
Yeah, yep, they did a dance number on the moon, so he's surrounded by people in blackface and curly wings.

1078
01:02:57.179 --> 01:02:59.340
Oh my God, England is such a miserable place.

1079
01:02:59.400 --> 01:03:00.840
You know, it says a lot.

1080
01:03:00.840 --> 01:03:06.659
It was the highest rating program on the ABC. rated higher than the 2 Ronnies, which was the other highest rating thing at the time.

1081
01:03:06.719 --> 01:03:12.599
It says a lot when the when the least objectionable thing on the screen is a giant green penis in a shower curtain.

1082
01:03:12.719 --> 01:03:14.099
I've never seen no.

1083
01:03:15.119 --> 01:03:17.159
I've seen this.

1084
01:03:17.159 --> 01:03:19.139
I was going to say, the greens are your dogs.

1085
01:03:19.199 --> 01:03:19.980
It's very sensible.

1086
01:03:20.039 --> 01:03:24.360
I think we stop it from splashing all over the parquetry.

1087
01:03:24.480 --> 01:03:26.639
Ah, parquetry.

1088
01:03:26.699 --> 01:03:28.559
The doctor's in his parquet waistcoat.

1089
01:03:28.559 --> 01:03:30.960
It's the 1st time he wears a waistcoat.

1090
01:03:31.079 --> 01:03:33.179
Forgive our indulgence listener, we'll get there in the end.

1091
01:03:33.300 --> 01:03:34.260
And he makes it out of parquet.

1092
01:03:34.320 --> 01:03:35.639
It's so awful, isn't it?

1093
01:03:35.699 --> 01:03:41.880
There are some real... terrible fashion experiments for the doctor this year because in the mutants he's going to wear...

1094
01:03:41.880 --> 01:03:42.239
Stop that.

1095
01:03:42.300 --> 01:03:45.780
Do you know Pertwee was designing his own outfits because Patrick McNee got to.

1096
01:03:45.840 --> 01:03:47.280
Did you know this story, Brandon?

1097
01:03:47.340 --> 01:03:49.320
this time I'm wearing a cravat.

1098
01:03:49.380 --> 01:03:50.579
We had a lot more.

1099
01:03:50.639 --> 01:03:53.099
Yeah, probably had a lot more influence on what he wore this season.

1100
01:03:53.159 --> 01:03:54.599
I can't say I'm surprised.

1101
01:03:54.659 --> 01:03:56.400
Yeah, it certainly didn't help though.

1102
01:03:57.360 --> 01:03:59.760
Awful, awful, awful.

1103
01:03:59.820 --> 01:04:03.059
Look at what Roger and Tony were wearing in the persuaders.

1104
01:04:03.119 --> 01:04:05.340
It's not that bad right at the same time.

1105
01:04:05.400 --> 01:04:13.739
And it does add a lot more character to him because he pretty much spent 8 of the 9 stories of his 1st 2 years in the same costume.

1106
01:04:13.739 --> 01:04:24.420
And this year, there's red coats, there's orange coats, there's the black coat and blue coat occasionally, you know, it makes him a lot more...

1107
01:04:24.420 --> 01:04:25.199
Scarf and a pin.

1108
01:04:25.199 --> 01:04:27.119
Oh, that's next season.

1109
01:04:27.239 --> 01:04:28.920
I think we're getting less capes too.

1110
01:04:28.980 --> 01:04:31.019
And I actually think I hate the cape.

1111
01:04:31.079 --> 01:04:31.800
I think it just looks stupid.

1112
01:04:31.920 --> 01:04:34.500
He's got a lovely Inverness cape now, hasn't he?

1113
01:04:34.559 --> 01:04:37.559
Sherlock Holmes, because again, it's the Baskervilles reference.

1114
01:04:37.619 --> 01:04:39.780
I think it's to wear the cape as much.

1115
01:04:39.840 --> 01:04:41.340
He'll wear it at the beginning and then take it off.

1116
01:04:41.400 --> 01:04:43.139
I think it's his day wear.

1117
01:04:43.199 --> 01:04:47.699
He looks like dashing, I have to say, with the jacket. you know what I mean?

1118
01:04:47.760 --> 01:04:48.659
Like, I like it a lot.

1119
01:04:48.840 --> 01:04:49.860
Just with the velvet.

1120
01:04:49.920 --> 01:04:57.480
Yeah, no previous doctor has, you know, everyone's worn sort of tails or quite a long jacket and he's just wearing a sort of normal length coat thing.

1121
01:04:57.599 --> 01:04:58.500
I think he looks pretty good.

1122
01:04:58.559 --> 01:05:06.179
And I like the way his costume's going where it'll be like a wardrobe of different coloured sort of velvet. he mixes and snatches with that.

1123
01:05:06.239 --> 01:05:11.519
Like, sort of like Capaldi, except that that polka dot thing that he wears in Kilamoon is unforgivably bad.

1124
01:05:11.579 --> 01:05:19.980
I'll see if I can find it, but there was a rather wonderful thing when the classic series Doctor Who figures 5 inch range was still in production.

1125
01:05:21.599 --> 01:05:25.619
You know, an adult wouldn't snigger at the words 5 inch.

1126
01:05:26.039 --> 01:05:31.199
But it was when various pertwies were coming out.

1127
01:05:31.260 --> 01:05:36.000
I think we ended up with sort of six. to figure outfits of pert week.

1128
01:05:36.059 --> 01:05:44.340
Well, someone took the basic stock standard photo of the pert we action figure and Photoshopped all the different possible pert we outfits.

1129
01:05:44.400 --> 01:05:51.659
And I think they ended up with about 20 because, of course, some of them are unique to their story, like Monster of Pellet and he never wears that again. et cetera, et cetera.

1130
01:05:51.719 --> 01:05:55.559
And I just thought I would buy all 20 of these.

1131
01:05:55.980 --> 01:05:59.340
I would want to have my rainbow of pertly.

1132
01:05:59.400 --> 01:06:01.019
And I think that's that's the one.

1133
01:06:01.139 --> 01:06:02.519
Rainbow of perk, sweet.

1134
01:06:02.579 --> 01:06:04.199
We would now have the collective noun.

1135
01:06:05.099 --> 01:06:08.219
I think he'd approve. he'd approve of that.

1136
01:06:08.280 --> 01:06:21.659
Poetry, we do discover at the end, and it does seem to be something that's kind of grafted on by Terence Diggs because Brian Hales is writing a kind of old-fashioned story where the doctor's just sort of travelling around.

1137
01:06:21.780 --> 01:06:30.480
So Terrence Dix has the doctor to decide that in fact, what's happened all along is that he hasn't got the TARDAS to work and this is the time...

1138
01:06:30.539 --> 01:06:30.900
Yeah.

1139
01:06:30.960 --> 01:06:35.820
And that's something that is going to be used in a couple of times again, I think, in the it's been used once before.

1140
01:06:35.880 --> 01:06:37.980
It's going to be used once more.

1141
01:06:38.039 --> 01:06:40.380
Yeah, so it's been used in colony.

1142
01:06:40.440 --> 01:06:46.320
It's going to be used again in mutants, and then it's used for a couple of early Tom Bakers, actually.

1143
01:06:46.380 --> 01:06:47.400
Yes, yes, that's true.

1144
01:06:47.460 --> 01:06:50.699
But he won't quite fix the TARDIS, yeah.

1145
01:06:50.760 --> 01:06:51.059
No.

1146
01:06:51.119 --> 01:07:00.059
And as we'll see, the next story seems to be going back a little in the per we hear in that we do not see the Tartars at all in the sea devils.

1147
01:07:07.079 --> 01:07:12.840
Someone said that it's the last story where the TARDIS doesn't get seen or mentioned.

1148
01:07:12.900 --> 01:07:16.380
It is the last story where you just, it's not even. progged.

1149
01:07:16.440 --> 01:07:23.159
The only time it almost happens again is seeds of doom, but they throw in that last... at the end.

1150
01:07:23.219 --> 01:07:24.420
Have we been here before?

1151
01:07:24.480 --> 01:07:26.219
It's like doing a podcast, isn't it?

1152
01:07:26.340 --> 01:07:27.420
Have we said this before?

1153
01:07:27.480 --> 01:07:29.820
No, I was wondering if in season 12.

1154
01:07:30.119 --> 01:07:31.260
Like, you don't see...

1155
01:07:31.380 --> 01:07:35.519
Yes, actually, you don't see it in... and Genesis of the Daleks.

1156
01:07:35.639 --> 01:07:37.199
Yeah, it might get a mention, though.

1157
01:07:37.199 --> 01:07:38.219
I think it might be mentioned.

1158
01:07:38.340 --> 01:07:40.320
I don't think it's even mentioned in this story.

1159
01:07:40.380 --> 01:07:42.000
No, it's not.

1160
01:07:42.059 --> 01:07:46.260
Yeah, we've got Malcolm Hawke back again writing a direct sequel to his season 7 story.

1161
01:07:46.320 --> 01:07:48.659
We haven't applauded Malcolm Hulk yet, have we?

1162
01:07:48.719 --> 01:07:49.199
No, no.

1163
01:07:49.260 --> 01:07:54.360
So this is Malcolm Hulk's yearly story about giant lizards, as you would say, Nathan.

1164
01:07:54.480 --> 01:07:55.559
We have the sea devils here.

1165
01:07:56.400 --> 01:08:04.139
Yes, and the experimental score by Malcolm Clark, who wouldn't work on the show again until 1982.

1166
01:08:04.320 --> 01:08:05.400
Poor thing though.

1167
01:08:05.460 --> 01:08:10.440
Apparently he was just told we want it to be electronic, unusual, and experimental.

1168
01:08:10.500 --> 01:08:12.179
You know, I was given no other guidance.

1169
01:08:12.239 --> 01:08:13.139
You know why?

1170
01:08:13.199 --> 01:08:13.980
It was a budget cup.

1171
01:08:14.039 --> 01:08:20.460
The reason they could have Dudley was working very, very hard on other things and was bringing things only 3 days before the cut.

1172
01:08:20.460 --> 01:08:30.060
Because Dudley was also freelancer, the BBC radiophonic workshop, and yes, they weren't actually seen as perfunctory as the title suggests, we're told to do it.

1173
01:08:30.119 --> 01:08:33.060
And I think was Hodgson said, look, you know, we're all too busy.

1174
01:08:33.119 --> 01:08:35.279
We've got lovely young chap here called Malcolm Clark.

1175
01:08:35.340 --> 01:08:42.479
And he was given the Delaware, as they called it, because of Delaware, Delaware Road, but it's the SC 63, I think it was. exerciseer.

1176
01:08:42.539 --> 01:08:43.979
Yeah, it was a very early synthesiser.

1177
01:08:44.039 --> 01:08:49.680
But the problem is you could only play one note at a time, so everything had to be multi-tracked just to get a chord, every single chord.

1178
01:08:50.159 --> 01:08:53.279
Funnily enough, I don't find this score.

1179
01:08:53.340 --> 01:08:56.340
We haven't talked much about the music so far this year, and yet it's quite prevalent.

1180
01:08:56.399 --> 01:09:02.579
I don't find this score anywhere near as grating as my all-time favourite composer's work for this series is Tristram Carey.

1181
01:09:02.640 --> 01:09:05.939
I mean, Tristram's work comes up in a future story of this season.

1182
01:09:05.939 --> 01:09:07.680
It's really annoying.

1183
01:09:07.739 --> 01:09:13.140
I think that, I mean, the music is odd this season and this stands out, but not that much.

1184
01:09:13.199 --> 01:09:14.520
That's the thing, isn't it?

1185
01:09:14.579 --> 01:09:19.739
It should support the story, but not to the point you're going, what the hell is that noise when you're actually trying to watch the production?

1186
01:09:19.859 --> 01:09:20.760
It's true.

1187
01:09:20.760 --> 01:09:24.119
It does a bit of both. face or something like that?

1188
01:09:24.180 --> 01:09:28.380
See, what I quite like about it is it starts off as really quite conventional.

1189
01:09:28.439 --> 01:09:35.939
But then when the monsters start appearing, we get the famous, you know, we get the famous...

1190
01:09:36.960 --> 01:09:38.579
So you don't need, you don't need TV.

1191
01:09:38.640 --> 01:09:42.359
No, I'm just going to sit here and listen to Brendan and do the...

1192
01:09:42.359 --> 01:09:45.359
I really quite like it.

1193
01:09:45.420 --> 01:09:46.439
And we get all those things.

1194
01:09:46.439 --> 01:09:49.439
Like, bang, wing, wing.

1195
01:09:49.439 --> 01:09:54.960
They do the they do the master's theme in the sea devil style music sting.

1196
01:09:55.020 --> 01:09:55.920
You know, it's really well.

1197
01:09:55.979 --> 01:09:57.720
And of course, Roger Delgado's back.

1198
01:09:57.779 --> 01:10:02.399
We haven't seen him for a couple of stories, which is...

1199
01:10:02.460 --> 01:10:11.460
This is probably the biggest story where you can look at it and go, right, I'm seeing where Michelle Gomez is getting informed by her characters because the master is having a wow of a time in this story.

1200
01:10:11.520 --> 01:10:14.159
You know, yes, okay, he's locked up, but he's in luxury.

1201
01:10:14.279 --> 01:10:16.560
I want a colour telly.

1202
01:10:16.619 --> 01:10:18.960
But Russell steals the clang of scene.

1203
01:10:19.020 --> 01:10:22.319
So the clangers are like knitted puppets.

1204
01:10:22.319 --> 01:10:23.039
Little knitted puppet.

1205
01:10:23.159 --> 01:10:25.739
On wood instruments.

1206
01:10:25.800 --> 01:10:26.939
They talk with recorders.

1207
01:10:27.000 --> 01:10:32.159
Yeah, and they sort of go for a couple of years and stuff and they're like kids TV, a little short, I think.

1208
01:10:32.159 --> 01:10:33.420
You can see them on YouTube.

1209
01:10:33.479 --> 01:10:36.539
But Russell steals the scene for sound of drums.

1210
01:10:36.600 --> 01:10:38.340
Yeah, with Teletubbies.

1211
01:10:38.399 --> 01:10:47.699
Yeah, I don't I don't think it's impacted there simply because John Sim isn't the charming master, like Rod Delgado is very charming and so...

1212
01:10:47.699 --> 01:10:49.079
He's actually there whistling along with them.

1213
01:10:49.140 --> 01:10:51.239
Like, as if he's trying to communicate with them.

1214
01:10:51.300 --> 01:10:53.460
He's actually whistling as he's watching the players.

1215
01:10:53.520 --> 01:10:58.079
And he's watching the clangers on the world's worst video screen, which they just stole from the goodies set.

1216
01:10:58.199 --> 01:11:00.060
Oh, you mean John Sims or this one?

1217
01:11:00.180 --> 01:11:02.340
No, they are goodies.

1218
01:11:02.340 --> 01:11:03.899
Yeah, they're yellow painted.

1219
01:11:03.960 --> 01:11:05.699
Yellow Venetian blinds.

1220
01:11:05.760 --> 01:11:07.380
Because this is the future.

1221
01:11:07.800 --> 01:11:10.260
But in the goodies, it's done as a joke.

1222
01:11:11.520 --> 01:11:14.760
Yeah, it was meant to be said on an oil rig.

1223
01:11:14.819 --> 01:11:21.300
The old sea fort where the doctor 1st encounters sea devils was meant to be an oil rig, and that was ruled out for several reasons.

1224
01:11:21.359 --> 01:11:22.439
First of all, the location.

1225
01:11:22.500 --> 01:11:27.239
It wasn't where the oil rigs at the time existed and there was no evidence there would be oil there.

1226
01:11:27.300 --> 01:11:30.479
So of all the things to go, oh, that's too much of a stretch.

1227
01:11:30.539 --> 01:11:33.600
We're not going to say there's oil under this stretch of the channel.

1228
01:11:33.659 --> 01:11:40.680
But the main reason was they wouldn't have been able to do any location filming on it because women weren't permitted on oil rigs.

1229
01:11:40.739 --> 01:11:42.960
And Katie wouldn't have been able to go on it.

1230
01:11:43.079 --> 01:11:45.119
They could have just got Stuart failing the week.

1231
01:11:45.180 --> 01:11:45.539
What exactly?

1232
01:11:45.600 --> 01:11:46.739
Two points of irony there.

1233
01:11:47.279 --> 01:11:50.579
Joe never climbs the exterior of the four.

1234
01:11:50.699 --> 01:11:51.359
It Stuart fell.

1235
01:11:51.479 --> 01:11:52.439
Very convincing.

1236
01:11:52.500 --> 01:11:52.920
Yeah.

1237
01:11:52.979 --> 01:11:53.399
Oh yeah.

1238
01:11:53.399 --> 01:11:54.300
There's a bottom double.

1239
01:11:54.359 --> 01:11:58.140
Stuart Fell is...

1240
01:11:58.140 --> 01:12:02.340
He says in an interview that he deliberately gave himself a bit of a wiggle to emulate Katie.

1241
01:12:02.399 --> 01:12:08.220
But the 2nd thing, do we know who the 1st woman in Britain allowed on an oil rig was?

1242
01:12:08.279 --> 01:12:09.180
Margaret Thatcher.

1243
01:12:09.239 --> 01:12:10.859
Elizabeth Sladen.

1244
01:12:10.920 --> 01:12:11.460
Oh, really?

1245
01:12:11.520 --> 01:12:16.079
Several years later, and you can see this on the terror of the Zigon's DVD.

1246
01:12:16.140 --> 01:12:20.939
Yeah, she made a school special about oil rigs and she was the 1st woman permitted on an oil rig.

1247
01:12:21.000 --> 01:12:21.420
Wow.

1248
01:12:21.420 --> 01:12:25.739
I can see them all clutching their phantom pearls and spooning all these poor riggers.

1249
01:12:25.800 --> 01:12:28.800
But collapsing under the weight of...

1250
01:12:28.800 --> 01:12:31.920
Because they have to wear pants because there's a lady around.

1251
01:12:31.979 --> 01:12:34.140
But the thing is, I do love the story.

1252
01:12:34.199 --> 01:12:35.760
It's such a clever script.

1253
01:12:35.819 --> 01:12:37.739
For instance, it is Mac Hulk.

1254
01:12:37.859 --> 01:12:42.119
Blind, Trenchard, Hart, Walker.

1255
01:12:42.300 --> 01:12:49.439
The 4 major human characters who assist the doctor and really take the place of the unit and the civil servant in this story.

1256
01:12:49.859 --> 01:12:53.819
They're all named after commissioned ships of the time.

1257
01:12:53.880 --> 01:12:55.199
Oh bless.

1258
01:12:55.260 --> 01:13:01.619
And also Blythe, as well as being an incredibly strong female character who would have outranked Sergeant Benton.

1259
01:13:01.680 --> 01:13:03.060
Is that Maggie Harris?

1260
01:13:03.060 --> 01:13:04.020
It is Maggie Harris.

1261
01:13:04.079 --> 01:13:04.439
Yeah, yeah.

1262
01:13:04.439 --> 01:13:06.539
And the whole reason she was hired...

1263
01:13:06.539 --> 01:13:09.420
The one who murdered Victoria not long after the incurrence.

1264
01:13:09.479 --> 01:13:09.960
That's right.

1265
01:13:10.020 --> 01:13:23.520
The whole reason she was hired was that director Michael Lee Bryant had worked on Fury from the Deep. and was impressed with her because of the scene where she walks into the water and he sort of says, you know, she made no fuss about it.

1266
01:13:23.579 --> 01:13:24.300
There was no panic.

1267
01:13:24.359 --> 01:13:32.460
She went in and stayed under the water for 30 seconds before popping out. 30 minutes before anyone had remembered that she was there before popping her head up and saying, that's professional.

1268
01:13:32.520 --> 01:13:33.180
Did I get that right?

1269
01:13:33.239 --> 01:13:35.279
She actually died in 10 minutes.

1270
01:13:35.340 --> 01:13:36.119
We have to recite.

1271
01:13:36.180 --> 01:13:37.079
But you know, she's a professional.

1272
01:13:37.199 --> 01:13:41.159
But she is such a, she is such a bit slow now.

1273
01:13:41.220 --> 01:13:43.800
A bit, you know, bones hard to remember the words.

1274
01:13:43.859 --> 01:13:47.939
Yeah, and then or, you know, where she put a soup or anything, but she's, she's a trooper.

1275
01:13:48.000 --> 01:13:54.899
She's such a strong character and everyone around her treats her with the respect, you know what?

1276
01:13:54.899 --> 01:13:56.279
And she never says she met Nelson.

1277
01:13:56.340 --> 01:13:58.800
No, she never she never bloody does.

1278
01:13:58.859 --> 01:14:03.600
The only person to disrespect her on the basis of her agenda is Walker.

1279
01:14:03.659 --> 01:14:04.140
Walker.

1280
01:14:04.140 --> 01:14:04.380
Yeah.

1281
01:14:04.439 --> 01:14:05.460
That's true.

1282
01:14:05.520 --> 01:14:06.239
And that's the thing.

1283
01:14:06.239 --> 01:14:07.800
We're not meant to like Walker.

1284
01:14:07.859 --> 01:14:08.279
No, no, no.

1285
01:14:08.340 --> 01:14:10.680
Mr. Walker's the one who can't stop notion, can he?

1286
01:14:10.739 --> 01:14:12.539
He's the pert we. in a puffyosis.

1287
01:14:12.659 --> 01:14:14.159
He's season 7 pertly.

1288
01:14:14.220 --> 01:14:15.659
He's season 7 per week.

1289
01:14:15.720 --> 01:14:17.880
Whereas Per we nixed the cheese sambos, though.

1290
01:14:17.880 --> 01:14:20.039
Per we does need so mean...

1291
01:14:20.100 --> 01:14:23.100
I think it's the Nadir of their relationship is in this one.

1292
01:14:23.159 --> 01:14:26.100
He's pretty horrible in this...

1293
01:14:26.159 --> 01:14:28.859
I think that's the worst thing that he does to her.

1294
01:14:28.920 --> 01:14:32.760
But again, he doesn't violent sword play makes me hungry.

1295
01:14:32.819 --> 01:14:35.819
Yeah, no, he's constantly stealing sandwiches all the way.

1296
01:14:35.880 --> 01:14:37.619
Yeah, he steals the master sandwich.

1297
01:14:37.739 --> 01:14:39.060
He steals that guy's boat.

1298
01:14:39.119 --> 01:14:42.359
He does sort of apologise to Joe for the sandwiches.

1299
01:14:42.420 --> 01:14:47.939
Yeah, and Blythe is just like, Blythe kind of gives her a look like, oh, man, I'll go make his...

1300
01:14:48.000 --> 01:14:48.659
No, thank you.

1301
01:14:48.720 --> 01:14:49.619
She does, man.

1302
01:14:49.619 --> 01:14:50.100
That's the thing.

1303
01:14:50.159 --> 01:14:51.119
She doesn't make the sandwiches.

1304
01:14:51.180 --> 01:14:53.100
She orders someone else to make the sense.

1305
01:14:53.159 --> 01:14:54.119
She's too good for that.

1306
01:14:54.180 --> 01:14:59.460
If she is a wren, at the time the women's naval officers were in a different category.

1307
01:14:59.520 --> 01:15:05.880
She is a 3rd officer, which is the equivalent of a sub-lieutenant or ensign.

1308
01:15:05.939 --> 01:15:09.300
So she's the Leslie Phillips equivalent from the Navy luck.

1309
01:15:09.359 --> 01:15:10.500
I think the reason I really liked this.

1310
01:15:10.560 --> 01:15:12.420
You know, Perkley was still making the Navy life.

1311
01:15:12.420 --> 01:15:13.260
Oh, yeah, this was filmed.

1312
01:15:13.319 --> 01:15:13.560
Yeah.

1313
01:15:13.560 --> 01:15:14.640
You know, we've touched on it.

1314
01:15:14.699 --> 01:15:15.960
I'm still making that after Doctor Who.

1315
01:15:16.020 --> 01:15:16.739
Yeah, very much so.

1316
01:15:16.800 --> 01:15:17.699
Went into the late 70s.

1317
01:15:17.760 --> 01:15:21.239
The longest running British sitcom happened to be on the radio.

1318
01:15:21.300 --> 01:15:22.140
It started in 59.

1319
01:15:22.319 --> 01:15:24.300
And I love Pertwi in that.

1320
01:15:24.359 --> 01:15:27.359
I actually like him a lot more in that than I do in Doctor Who.

1321
01:15:27.420 --> 01:15:32.579
What's him do, I think, because the characters, but I think Perkley himself felt more comfortable in his playing a denoted character.

1322
01:15:32.640 --> 01:15:33.960
I think he was still.

1323
01:15:34.199 --> 01:15:35.220
Did you get the feeling?

1324
01:15:35.279 --> 01:15:36.899
Maybe that's why, in fact, he's interesting.

1325
01:15:36.960 --> 01:15:40.380
He's still not feeling entirely comfortable with the idea of just playing himself.

1326
01:15:40.439 --> 01:15:41.760
Doesn't know who that is.

1327
01:15:41.819 --> 01:15:51.840
So he keeps defaulting to Basil Rathbone in the Robin Hood film or he's a little bit patrician or, you know, when he's with a little bit with whomever.

1328
01:15:51.899 --> 01:15:55.260
He's still trying to work out exactly what the doctor is, but that makes it interesting to watch.

1329
01:15:55.319 --> 01:15:58.800
Well, I think when his demands are placed on him.

1330
01:15:58.859 --> 01:15:59.760
Do you know what I mean?

1331
01:15:59.760 --> 01:16:03.180
when he's actually forced to act by the script and that doesn't happen very often.

1332
01:16:03.239 --> 01:16:04.680
He's pretty good.

1333
01:16:04.739 --> 01:16:12.000
When he's horribly treated, when he's under adversity, such as Dave the Daleks, he's actually at his best when he's actually getting a bit of proper biffo.

1334
01:16:12.060 --> 01:16:15.060
I mean, here too, here too, he has to convince people as well.

1335
01:16:15.119 --> 01:16:18.479
He doesn't just have the brigadier to, you know, go and do what he says.

1336
01:16:18.539 --> 01:16:19.439
Yeah.

1337
01:16:19.439 --> 01:16:21.060
And with walk...

1338
01:16:21.060 --> 01:16:21.359
Yeah.

1339
01:16:21.359 --> 01:16:22.619
Is that Edwin Richfield?

1340
01:16:22.680 --> 01:16:23.399
Edwin Richfield.

1341
01:16:23.460 --> 01:16:27.720
He just he literally just stepped off the set from UFO playing an admiral.

1342
01:16:27.779 --> 01:16:29.819
Captain John Hart, not the James.

1343
01:16:29.880 --> 01:16:33.060
Yeah, sorry, Captain's character from from Torchwork.

1344
01:16:33.119 --> 01:16:42.840
He's very convincing because you know how they got to use the pom-pom guns and other things is that a lot of the officers on the ships thought that Richfield was actually a captain. because they weren't allowed.

1345
01:16:42.899 --> 01:16:44.640
Siiblings weren't allowed anywhere near any of the tech.

1346
01:16:44.699 --> 01:16:45.060
Yeah.

1347
01:16:45.060 --> 01:16:46.500
Could I have some gam on this place?

1348
01:16:46.560 --> 01:16:49.560
Oh, yes, though. and opi-pops.

1349
01:16:49.560 --> 01:16:53.880
Yeah, he said to he said to a warrant officer, I think, oh, this boat has gone.

1350
01:16:53.939 --> 01:16:54.899
How does that work?

1351
01:16:54.899 --> 01:16:56.520
Warrant officer, oh, well, you press this.

1352
01:16:56.579 --> 01:16:57.359
Oh, so I pressed this.

1353
01:16:57.420 --> 01:16:58.140
Yes, that's right, sir.

1354
01:16:58.199 --> 01:16:58.859
Okay, let's go.

1355
01:16:58.920 --> 01:17:09.539
And that was that got into the final program and the Navy were rather annoyed, but as Barry Letz pointed out to them, we've just given you 6 weeks of free publicity showing people how wonderful life is in the Navy.

1356
01:17:09.600 --> 01:17:16.739
And a series got made off the back of this by the BBC called Warship, which ran for 4 years.

1357
01:17:17.039 --> 01:17:22.380
It was already in pre-production because let's pitch a series to the BBC.

1358
01:17:22.439 --> 01:17:23.760
You know, now we've worked with the Navy does.

1359
01:17:23.760 --> 01:17:29.520
And they said, actually, we're making one already, but it helped strengthen the relationship to make warship and worship ran for 4 years.

1360
01:17:29.579 --> 01:17:32.220
A few details about the production of the story.

1361
01:17:32.279 --> 01:17:35.340
First of all, it actually had a very pragmatic development.

1362
01:17:35.399 --> 01:17:38.520
First of all, they decided the sort of setting they wanted.

1363
01:17:38.579 --> 01:17:40.079
They wanted a contemporary earth setting.

1364
01:17:40.140 --> 01:17:44.579
And then they thought, well, we've got to have the master back and he's got to escape so we can use them in future stories.

1365
01:17:44.699 --> 01:17:49.500
Then they thought, oh, okay, in terms of a monster, we need to have a monster in the story.

1366
01:17:49.560 --> 01:17:51.119
The Silurians, they were very popular.

1367
01:17:51.180 --> 01:17:52.380
It was actually planned.

1368
01:17:52.439 --> 01:17:53.939
Let's bring the Silurians back.

1369
01:17:54.000 --> 01:17:59.159
And it was Mac Hook, because he was chosen as the writer after that idea.

1370
01:17:59.220 --> 01:18:01.079
It was, let's bring the Solarians back.

1371
01:18:01.140 --> 01:18:03.000
Oh, and if we're having a modern day earth story.

1372
01:18:03.060 --> 01:18:10.500
Let's make it a six-parter in case we need to make new costumes because it's cheaper to make costumes for a six-parter than it is for a four-parter.

1373
01:18:10.560 --> 01:18:17.699
And then it was decided, Mac Hook, and it was Mac Hook, who decided I will give you a related race rather than just do the same race again.

1374
01:18:17.760 --> 01:18:20.279
It was going to be called the C signing rate.

1375
01:18:20.340 --> 01:18:24.300
I think that was just a working title until we came up with something better.

1376
01:18:24.420 --> 01:18:26.520
Oh, he never did, though, did he really?

1377
01:18:26.579 --> 01:18:28.079
Watery otters.

1378
01:18:28.140 --> 01:18:36.539
Also, the 1st episode of this story was one of the lowest rating of the season, but that was because power strikes.

1379
01:18:36.600 --> 01:18:37.439
Power strikes.

1380
01:18:37.500 --> 01:18:37.920
That's right.

1381
01:18:37.979 --> 01:18:51.840
Because of a mining strike, meaning there was no coal to go in the power, which also meant that at the top of episode two, Doctor Who got its 1st ever narrated reprise, if you missed Doctor Who last week, here is what happened.

1382
01:18:51.899 --> 01:18:53.460
It's on the disk, isn't it?

1383
01:18:53.460 --> 01:18:54.359
Oh, is it?

1384
01:18:54.420 --> 01:18:57.359
And the ratings did actually go up and up and up.

1385
01:18:57.420 --> 01:19:00.899
This was another story which broke 10000000 viewers several times.

1386
01:19:01.439 --> 01:19:12.899
Again, we see the new sort of production model, Barry, let's set up of 2 episodes being filmed at once because we've got the prison for the 1st 4 episodes and then we get the sea devil's base for the last 2 episodes.

1387
01:19:12.960 --> 01:19:16.739
We've got Trenchard for the 1st 4 episodes and then we get Walker for the last 2 episodes.

1388
01:19:16.800 --> 01:19:20.460
Is this also the 1st one that's broadcast out of production order?

1389
01:19:20.520 --> 01:19:21.420
It is indeed.

1390
01:19:21.479 --> 01:19:25.020
So it was shot after the mutants, but broadcast before.

1391
01:19:25.079 --> 01:19:26.579
That's right, before.

1392
01:19:26.579 --> 01:19:31.800
And so sometimes in the 60s, they were, I think they got as close as a fortnight before transmission.

1393
01:19:31.920 --> 01:19:36.659
The whole reason this was broadcast out of order was to take advantage for longer filming days.

1394
01:19:36.720 --> 01:19:37.680
Oh okay.

1395
01:19:37.739 --> 01:19:51.539
Because this was an episode with so much outside filming, they allocated a more summary time of the year to get the hours and pushed, I think it was Curse of Peladin, which was more studio bound into the winter months for production.

1396
01:19:52.560 --> 01:19:56.579
They wanted some non-unit stories and they wanted to kind of, you know, space them out.

1397
01:19:56.640 --> 01:19:59.399
This is the only non-unit story, though, on Earth.

1398
01:19:59.460 --> 01:20:01.260
Yeah, yeah, at all.

1399
01:20:01.319 --> 01:20:05.159
And unit is certainly mentioned and Captain Hart called them to get the doctor.

1400
01:20:05.220 --> 01:20:11.760
They keep mentioning them, actually, in his unit passes and all of that, and unit is the only reason that the doctor and Joe get to see the master in his prison.

1401
01:20:11.880 --> 01:20:12.779
Yes, yeah.

1402
01:20:12.840 --> 01:20:16.079
And the master is the only prisoner in his prison.

1403
01:20:16.199 --> 01:20:17.220
It's a converted castle.

1404
01:20:17.279 --> 01:20:19.800
You know, we're back in the influence of Patrick McGooan again, I think.

1405
01:20:19.920 --> 01:20:28.140
And it's guarded by people in capes and berets, all of whom have moustaches, and all of whom drive citrons.

1406
01:20:28.199 --> 01:20:29.640
So are they all French?

1407
01:20:29.699 --> 01:20:31.680
Renault's without the drawers on.

1408
01:20:31.739 --> 01:20:32.399
Yeah, yeah.

1409
01:20:32.460 --> 01:20:38.279
Well, the whole reason for that was Michael E. Bryant owned one and never saw them very much on British Rhodes.

1410
01:20:38.399 --> 01:20:40.560
So if I'm setting this slightly in the future.

1411
01:20:40.619 --> 01:20:45.420
Let's get something that's not popular in Britain yet, but my wife and I have one and it's wonderful.

1412
01:20:45.539 --> 01:20:47.159
People must start buying them soon.

1413
01:20:47.159 --> 01:20:51.000
And we'll take the doors off to make them look futuristic because of it.

1414
01:20:51.000 --> 01:20:52.260
Why do they all have moustaches?

1415
01:20:52.319 --> 01:20:53.399
That just seems...

1416
01:20:53.399 --> 01:20:55.500
Well, I think I think that's the influence of the master.

1417
01:20:55.500 --> 01:20:59.100
Because, yeah, clearly hypnotising the guards.

1418
01:20:59.159 --> 01:21:06.000
What I find really fascinating, though, is, you know, when Trenchard starts acting weirdly, you think, oh, he's hypnotised Trenchard, but no, he hasn't.

1419
01:21:06.060 --> 01:21:11.159
He's just convinced Trenchard that it's his patriotic duty to help him and there's enemy agents.

1420
01:21:11.220 --> 01:21:14.340
And because Trenchard is this ex-colonial governor.

1421
01:21:14.399 --> 01:21:16.020
We're back on the theme of colonialism.

1422
01:21:16.140 --> 01:21:22.920
And he's been essentially put out to pastor, you know, he used to run a whole colony and now he runs a prison with one prisoner.

1423
01:21:23.039 --> 01:21:27.119
Which a lot of ex-clinonials would be, you know, shuffled into when they came home.

1424
01:21:27.180 --> 01:21:29.279
Like they joke about him being a failure.

1425
01:21:29.340 --> 01:21:31.859
Even the doctor and the master joke about how...

1426
01:21:31.920 --> 01:21:37.319
Yeah, yeah, he got sent out as colonial governor and the colony declared independence, you know, like a few weeks later.

1427
01:21:37.380 --> 01:21:39.600
You'll see it again with the marshal and the mutants.

1428
01:21:39.659 --> 01:21:40.979
Yeah, we'll talk about that.

1429
01:21:41.039 --> 01:21:50.939
Yeah, I mean, it's amazing because it's the 1st time the masters had someone helping him, but instead of forcing them to help him, He's manipulated him into that position.

1430
01:21:51.000 --> 01:22:05.399
And that makes his death all the more tragic because unlike, say, Farrell or the Verger in the Daimons, you know, you feel sorry for them because they had no control of their actions, here's someone who has just made a series of very bad decisions.

1431
01:22:05.460 --> 01:22:07.979
But for the what he believes is the right reason.

1432
01:22:08.039 --> 01:22:22.739
The novelisation, which is also by Malcolm Hulk, makes Trenchard's death even more kind of tragic, what happens in the actual broadcast thing, the sea devils invade the prison sort of roundabout episode four, sort of midway through.

1433
01:22:22.800 --> 01:22:28.800
And they're attacking everyone and all of the moustache beret guys are all being killed and that sort of thing.

1434
01:22:28.859 --> 01:22:34.979
And Trenchard goes to his office and gets out a revolver, his trustee service revolver and he shoots a few.

1435
01:22:35.039 --> 01:22:37.619
We see him get off a few shots, but they don't have any effect.

1436
01:22:37.680 --> 01:22:42.060
And then the next time we see him, he's just lying dead in the corridor.

1437
01:22:42.119 --> 01:22:43.500
In the novelisation.

1438
01:22:43.560 --> 01:22:46.560
He imagines, because he's terribly patriotic.

1439
01:22:46.619 --> 01:22:51.300
He imagines that he'll be the one man who sort of fought back against the sea devils.

1440
01:22:51.359 --> 01:22:59.220
He envisages a future where there's a plaque on the wall, with his name on it, talking about his sort of heroic victory.

1441
01:22:59.279 --> 01:23:06.600
And then he goes to shoot a sea devil and realises just at the moment when the sea devil's ray gun kind of cooks his body.

1442
01:23:06.659 --> 01:23:09.899
Just at that moment he realises he's left the safety catch on.

1443
01:23:10.979 --> 01:23:15.720
Oh, that is, that, oh, that's really...

1444
01:23:15.720 --> 01:23:16.199
Yeah.

1445
01:23:16.260 --> 01:23:25.140
But it is that thing. you know, Mac Hulk, when he does his novelisations, gives so much sort of depth and richness to the characters in the background.

1446
01:23:25.199 --> 01:23:26.279
Mr. Robbins.

1447
01:23:26.340 --> 01:23:31.859
The doctor steals his boat and then Joe steals his motorcycle and then the doctor blows up his boat.

1448
01:23:31.979 --> 01:23:35.039
He's not going to get that deposit back.

1449
01:23:35.100 --> 01:23:38.159
He wanted the master to be killed.

1450
01:23:38.220 --> 01:23:42.300
Like the death penalty and that was a big public trial and all of that sort of thing.

1451
01:23:42.359 --> 01:23:48.420
The doctor intervenes to suggest life imprisonment for the master and all of that sort of thing, but it had been a sort of big political thing.

1452
01:23:48.479 --> 01:23:58.319
And so there's all this stuff, all this extra stuff, which I think, you know, always makes Matt Hulk's novelisations superior to the actual stories.

1453
01:23:58.380 --> 01:23:59.460
Absolutely.

1454
01:23:59.520 --> 01:23:59.939
Absolutely.

1455
01:24:00.000 --> 01:24:04.079
I mean, even if he doesn't put it in the script, Mac Hole just has this all in his head.

1456
01:24:04.140 --> 01:24:08.460
He's like, I can't, you know, I can't put this into half an hour of television, but I can put it into a book.

1457
01:24:08.520 --> 01:24:14.699
A word on some of the actors, of course, Edward and Richfield, famous character actor, Richard, you mentioned, he was in UFO.

1458
01:24:14.760 --> 01:24:18.720
He is the only actor aside from Patrick McNee to appear in every season of The Avengers.

1459
01:24:18.779 --> 01:24:20.760
He plays a different villain every season.

1460
01:24:20.819 --> 01:24:22.079
Oh, he does.

1461
01:24:22.140 --> 01:24:23.279
This is Captain Hart.

1462
01:24:23.340 --> 01:24:24.960
This is Captain Hart, Edward Richfield.

1463
01:24:25.020 --> 01:24:27.000
Do you know who he goes on to play in Doctor Who?

1464
01:24:27.060 --> 01:24:31.859
Yes, of course, he goes on to play Mestor in Doctor Who.

1465
01:24:31.920 --> 01:24:32.939
They're being sluggy.

1466
01:24:32.939 --> 01:24:33.899
The big...

1467
01:24:33.960 --> 01:24:34.680
Is that who he was?

1468
01:24:34.680 --> 01:24:35.520
That's who he was.

1469
01:24:35.579 --> 01:24:39.000
But only sometimes because he was incredibly claustrophobic.

1470
01:24:39.180 --> 01:24:42.359
And, you know, they put him in this giant slot costume.

1471
01:24:42.420 --> 01:24:46.979
Declan Mulholland. turns up as one of the workers converting the fort.

1472
01:24:47.039 --> 01:24:48.420
And he'll turn up again.

1473
01:24:48.420 --> 01:24:52.380
Androids of Tara. and was also the original jab of the hut.

1474
01:24:52.439 --> 01:24:54.899
Ah, yes, okay.

1475
01:24:54.960 --> 01:25:04.319
And Hugh Futcher, his co-worker on the rig, was actually a contender for the 7th doctor all the way later in 1987.

1476
01:25:04.439 --> 01:25:05.100
Really?

1477
01:25:05.159 --> 01:25:06.899
Yeah, I didn't realise that either.

1478
01:25:06.960 --> 01:25:12.479
Sorry, another nice note about Declan Melholland who, of course, passed away, I think, in the early 2000s.

1479
01:25:12.539 --> 01:25:24.479
The DVD mentions that any royalties he gets from DVD sales or TV sales or anything like that actually go to a bursary funding the education of young actors.

1480
01:25:24.539 --> 01:25:26.220
Oh, bless.

1481
01:25:26.279 --> 01:25:27.119
So he's rather wonderful.

1482
01:25:27.239 --> 01:25:33.180
And this is also a really, really good story for Pert Wheat, I think.

1483
01:25:33.239 --> 01:25:36.779
Because, okay, we do have that incident with the sandwiches.

1484
01:25:36.840 --> 01:25:47.039
Yes, but also he's got those really rather wonderful gentle scenes with the chief sea devil, where he actually tells off the chief sea devil for running away underground.

1485
01:25:47.100 --> 01:25:50.579
When he's with the old Silurian in the Solurians.

1486
01:25:50.640 --> 01:25:52.439
There's no recrimination.

1487
01:25:52.500 --> 01:25:53.579
He's very, very gentle.

1488
01:25:53.640 --> 01:25:57.960
But here, his voice is very gentle, but he's saying things to the sea devil.

1489
01:25:58.020 --> 01:26:04.859
Like, you abandoned this planet, and now you're turning up and complaining because 1000000s of years later, someone else is making use of it.

1490
01:26:04.920 --> 01:26:06.359
How about you share it?

1491
01:26:06.420 --> 01:26:11.880
You know, he doesn't kind of say that, oh, yes, you're absolutely right.

1492
01:26:11.939 --> 01:26:13.199
He doesn't say you're absolutely wrong.

1493
01:26:13.260 --> 01:26:18.779
He says, look, you know, it's not as if you have been displaced.

1494
01:26:18.840 --> 01:26:22.079
You displaced yourselves, but let's try and find a peaceful solution of this.

1495
01:26:22.140 --> 01:26:24.840
And when the master starts shouting, oh, no, he's your enemy.

1496
01:26:24.899 --> 01:26:26.939
The doctor just, no, I'm going to maintain my car.

1497
01:26:27.000 --> 01:26:28.319
I'm maintaining my adult voice.

1498
01:26:28.380 --> 01:26:29.340
He's being a child.

1499
01:26:29.399 --> 01:26:30.539
We're the adults here.

1500
01:26:30.600 --> 01:26:32.159
It nearly works. too, doesn't it?

1501
01:26:32.220 --> 01:26:34.020
The thing that stops it is that...

1502
01:26:34.020 --> 01:26:34.680
Bloody Walker.

1503
01:26:34.739 --> 01:26:36.000
Walker bombs them.

1504
01:26:36.000 --> 01:26:43.680
Yeah, and Walker is the example of what happens when the bureaucrats are there and the doctor isn't.

1505
01:26:43.739 --> 01:26:49.979
In fact, the doctor, you know, has a perfect opportunity to be a blustering, obnoxious fool with Walker.

1506
01:26:50.039 --> 01:26:52.800
And he has every reason to be, actually.

1507
01:26:52.859 --> 01:26:53.640
Do you know what I mean?

1508
01:26:53.699 --> 01:26:55.260
Because Walker does.

1509
01:26:55.319 --> 01:27:02.460
This is before the doctor meets him, that Walker bombs the sea devil base and puts paid to the idea of peace.

1510
01:27:02.520 --> 01:27:05.699
But then he comes up and actually tries to persuade him.

1511
01:27:05.760 --> 01:27:13.739
You know, we saw last a couple of episodes of the podcast that Pertwe would come in, be obnoxious, everyone will get their back up and no one would help him.

1512
01:27:13.800 --> 01:27:27.539
But here he actually persuades and cajoles Walker into letting him continue the peace process by saying, you know, wouldn't you like to be called Walker the Peacemaker and all of that sort of thing by flattering him?

1513
01:27:27.600 --> 01:27:30.600
And so the obnoxious thing has kind of gone away.

1514
01:27:30.659 --> 01:27:33.659
And he has some fun, doctor-ish moments again.

1515
01:27:33.720 --> 01:27:35.100
Like the sandwiches is fun.

1516
01:27:35.159 --> 01:27:49.319
He's in Trenchard's office blindfolded and he cuts a ball into a glass, you know, when they're trapped on the fort and he turns the transistor radio into a transmitter and it doesn't work and he looks like a bit of an idiot and then it does work.

1517
01:27:49.380 --> 01:27:49.739
Yeah, exactly.

1518
01:27:49.739 --> 01:27:52.260
And then it blows up in his face, you know, and all of that.

1519
01:27:52.319 --> 01:27:54.180
And so he gets to be fun and silly.

1520
01:27:54.239 --> 01:27:55.859
Yeah, he gets to be fallible.

1521
01:27:56.039 --> 01:27:56.579
Yeah.

1522
01:27:56.579 --> 01:28:01.560
And also, that really extends to when the sea devil is trying to break into the room on the fort.

1523
01:28:01.619 --> 01:28:05.159
He actually looks quite terrified by what's about to happen.

1524
01:28:05.220 --> 01:28:08.760
I know a criticism of him that you've laid, Nathan, is.

1525
01:28:08.819 --> 01:28:11.159
If the doctor's not scared, why should we be scared?

1526
01:28:11.220 --> 01:28:13.739
But in this, yeah, he's allowed to be scared.

1527
01:28:13.800 --> 01:28:15.840
He is allowed to be fallible and make mistakes.

1528
01:28:15.899 --> 01:28:18.539
He gets chained up and not for the 1st time.

1529
01:28:18.600 --> 01:28:19.500
Joe rescues him.

1530
01:28:19.560 --> 01:28:21.600
And I've been trying to do a count in my head.

1531
01:28:21.659 --> 01:28:23.520
So we've got terror of the Auto.

1532
01:28:23.640 --> 01:28:24.720
Joe rescues him.

1533
01:28:24.779 --> 01:28:28.260
Mind of Evil, Joe tries to break him out of the cell.

1534
01:28:28.319 --> 01:28:31.619
She thinks he's still unconscious, and she tries to get him out of there.

1535
01:28:31.680 --> 01:28:40.319
Damons, of course, she tries to sacrifice himself, herself for him, this moment in sea devils, which is almost identical to the moment in terror of the autons.

1536
01:28:40.380 --> 01:28:44.039
But instead of breaking a vase over someone's head, She actually uses her brain a bit.

1537
01:28:44.100 --> 01:28:46.140
No, I'll get locked in with him.

1538
01:28:46.199 --> 01:28:48.539
That sequence is actually terribly enjoyable.

1539
01:28:48.600 --> 01:28:50.159
Yeah, the sign language.

1540
01:28:50.220 --> 01:28:53.819
It's like Donna and the doctor in partners in crime.

1541
01:28:53.880 --> 01:29:00.960
But she, the only reason that she's running free in the, in the grounds of the prison is because Walsh watch...

1542
01:29:00.960 --> 01:29:02.760
She's punched terry in the face.

1543
01:29:02.819 --> 01:29:04.020
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1544
01:29:04.079 --> 01:29:05.819
In fact, she overcomes 2 guards.

1545
01:29:05.880 --> 01:29:08.039
Yeah, well, she...

1546
01:29:08.100 --> 01:29:11.399
Yeah, she throws Terry Walsh into Terry Walsh.

1547
01:29:12.000 --> 01:29:16.920
And yeah, there's...

1548
01:29:16.979 --> 01:29:18.779
Yeah, they did explode into a universe.

1549
01:29:18.779 --> 01:29:20.220
I think that it happened off screen.

1550
01:29:20.279 --> 01:29:23.399
Yeah, I mean, Joe's just basically pretty wonderful in this story.

1551
01:29:23.460 --> 01:29:29.520
When they 1st meet Trenchard, Joe now realises that she's the one who has to start the introductions.

1552
01:29:29.579 --> 01:29:32.880
Hello, I'm Joe. You know, I'm the charming one.

1553
01:29:32.939 --> 01:29:38.460
Hello. and and this is the doctor, you know, don't she's like, no, I'm not going to let him introduce himself else.

1554
01:29:38.520 --> 01:29:40.079
He'll just say, you're a dick.

1555
01:29:40.199 --> 01:29:41.819
You know, let's just get on.

1556
01:29:41.880 --> 01:29:45.119
Trenton sleazes on to her, really, revoltingly later on.

1557
01:29:45.180 --> 01:29:48.000
She deals with, like, she puts him in his place so well.

1558
01:29:48.060 --> 01:29:57.000
Like, he sleazes onto her in Captain Hart's office later and she sort of extricates her hand and then he goes to give her a handshake and she just not doing it.

1559
01:29:57.060 --> 01:29:59.640
Slapping him in the face would have been an even better.

1560
01:29:59.699 --> 01:30:04.680
But the cold rejection for someone like that who's so full of himself is a really good tactic.

1561
01:30:04.739 --> 01:30:14.159
The other great thing about Joe is towards the end of the story, when he's going to go down to the sea devils for a 2nd time in the diving bell, you know, she protests and she's like, no, you can't do that.

1562
01:30:14.220 --> 01:30:15.539
Look at what happened last time.

1563
01:30:15.600 --> 01:30:17.399
And you almost got blown up.

1564
01:30:17.460 --> 01:30:19.020
Well, she objects the 1st time.

1565
01:30:19.079 --> 01:30:20.399
She says, do you really have to go down?

1566
01:30:20.460 --> 01:30:24.239
But the 2nd time is when she really says, no, no, no, you really you can't.

1567
01:30:24.300 --> 01:30:32.520
But when he finally decides to and we see them walk out, she's made her objection, but she is still going to stand by and well, she does it.

1568
01:30:32.579 --> 01:30:35.520
Yeah, it's the definition of friendship.

1569
01:30:35.579 --> 01:30:38.220
I don't agree with what you're going to do, but I'm still going to support you in doing it.

1570
01:30:38.279 --> 01:30:40.979
Isn't that sequence so superb?

1571
01:30:41.100 --> 01:30:45.539
that the navy thing and all that navy hardware and stuff.

1572
01:30:45.600 --> 01:30:46.560
It's so fun.

1573
01:30:46.619 --> 01:30:48.600
That scene is really good.

1574
01:30:48.720 --> 01:30:50.039
And they're all real sailors.

1575
01:30:50.100 --> 01:30:55.979
Except for the admiral who's most in Evans, previously seen as the puppet in colony in space.

1576
01:30:56.760 --> 01:30:57.119
Brilliant.

1577
01:30:57.180 --> 01:31:05.279
But as Barry Letts pointed out after the rushes were in, you do realise that admirals are meant to have perfect eyesight and you wouldn't be wearing glasses.

1578
01:31:05.340 --> 01:31:07.260
Apparently that's a thing.

1579
01:31:07.380 --> 01:31:07.800
Really?

1580
01:31:07.800 --> 01:31:08.399
It's a lesson.

1581
01:31:08.399 --> 01:31:09.659
They learned from Lord Nelson.

1582
01:31:09.779 --> 01:31:15.359
But yeah, Buckley Bryant's responsibility was, but he looked so clever in his glasses.

1583
01:31:15.479 --> 01:31:20.100
And finally, you know, Joe really gives Walker a big telling off.

1584
01:31:20.159 --> 01:31:29.939
The doctor's attitude of pacifism and not blowing things up is really rubbing off on her, but rather than take it out on the doctor, which we saw didn't work out too well in the Damons, but probably should have.

1585
01:31:30.000 --> 01:31:36.960
Yeah, instead, you know, she's directing at where it should be directed and calling in a monster and a butcher and what have you.

1586
01:31:37.020 --> 01:31:42.960
We see Walker eating all the time and we get those close-ups of his mouth while he's eating and talking while he's eating.

1587
01:31:43.020 --> 01:31:50.579
He is constantly engaged in a destructive act. in a very sensual carnal, destructive act.

1588
01:31:51.000 --> 01:31:58.979
Sandifer tries to say that that part of the story is almost being told from the sea devil's point of view is if we're looking at it.

1589
01:31:58.979 --> 01:32:01.979
Well, that's where the doctor is, like an animal sort of thing.

1590
01:32:01.979 --> 01:32:04.800
He's sort of chewing his way through sandwiches.

1591
01:32:04.859 --> 01:32:09.539
Yeah, it's kind of reaching a little bit to find any real politics here though, isn't it?

1592
01:32:09.600 --> 01:32:10.140
You know what I say?

1593
01:32:10.140 --> 01:32:11.340
No, it's a recruitment.

1594
01:32:11.340 --> 01:32:12.539
For the Navy.

1595
01:32:12.600 --> 01:32:12.960
Yeah.

1596
01:32:12.960 --> 01:32:17.039
Because the, you know, the sign, it's also anti-colonial.

1597
01:32:17.100 --> 01:32:23.880
The fact that the master turns up really just turns it into a sort of, you know, a cartoonish kind of thing.

1598
01:32:23.939 --> 01:32:25.439
And that's not a criticism.

1599
01:32:25.500 --> 01:32:30.840
The Silurians attempted, I think, to have something about colonialism and something about immigration.

1600
01:32:30.899 --> 01:32:41.460
But I think I argued at the time. that it was undermined by the fact that the Silurians killed the only sympathetic side you were in in the entire colony and just went out and tried to be terribly evil.

1601
01:32:41.520 --> 01:32:43.199
Here, you don't even get that.

1602
01:32:43.260 --> 01:32:44.159
Do you know what I mean?

1603
01:32:44.220 --> 01:32:46.140
Yeah, there's no manipulating them.

1604
01:32:46.199 --> 01:32:48.720
And there's no discussion between the Solurians.

1605
01:32:48.779 --> 01:32:51.060
There's the chief solar in. the only one with any character.

1606
01:32:51.180 --> 01:32:52.500
The sea devil.

1607
01:32:52.560 --> 01:32:53.880
Sorry, the chief sea devil.

1608
01:32:53.939 --> 01:32:55.680
He's the only one with any character, yeah.

1609
01:32:55.739 --> 01:33:00.000
Yeah, well, it's actually, you know, apart from the noble personnel that are closest to the doctor.

1610
01:33:00.060 --> 01:33:04.020
They're the most sympathetic, the only sympathetic characters outside of their team.

1611
01:33:04.079 --> 01:33:14.340
And there seems to be that whole kind of the Jacques Cristeau documentaries that were really big in the early 70s when we got colour TV, the undersea thing was on every almost every week.

1612
01:33:14.399 --> 01:33:16.199
You know, there was a new respect.

1613
01:33:16.260 --> 01:33:17.699
It wasn't just something to be exploited.

1614
01:33:17.760 --> 01:33:20.279
It was a wonderful place that we were only starting to learn about.

1615
01:33:20.340 --> 01:33:23.159
I think that, you know, it's considering also it's Mac Hock.

1616
01:33:23.220 --> 01:33:30.659
And he had been a member of the Communist Party and he certainly was still very much a humanist and believed in the rights of the underprivileged and the underdogs. generally.

1617
01:33:30.720 --> 01:33:33.539
And yeah, I think that the sea devils, certainly.

1618
01:33:33.539 --> 01:33:48.239
There's that wonderful scene that almost wants a member of, oh, you're being served to be doing the voice for the sea devil when he's on the on board the submarine and they're standing around as if they're playing Ludo.

1619
01:33:48.300 --> 01:33:50.880
And it's just so silly and so funny.

1620
01:33:50.939 --> 01:33:54.479
It's the sea devil's world and we're looking out from in their world.

1621
01:33:54.539 --> 01:33:59.340
I think I mean, I think this is Hulk's least political script.

1622
01:33:59.460 --> 01:34:02.819
Yeah, it is the most action adventure one. exactly.

1623
01:34:02.880 --> 01:34:07.619
And it has a lot of hardware and lots of great locations and stuff, stacks of filming.

1624
01:34:07.680 --> 01:34:15.420
And so it is really terrifically enjoyable to watch, but it's not exactly the sort of thing that Matt Hulk will do kind of normally.

1625
01:34:15.479 --> 01:34:25.979
I think it's all the more effective for that. because he is such an intelligent writer, we do get an action adventure story, but we get an action adventure story with a lot of brains as well.

1626
01:34:26.039 --> 01:34:28.920
Yeah, yeah, that's which I think is really effective.

1627
01:34:29.039 --> 01:34:30.960
In terms of the characters.

1628
01:34:31.020 --> 01:34:32.699
I would just like to talk about the master for a second.

1629
01:34:32.760 --> 01:34:36.000
He spends the 1st half of the story, having a wow of a time.

1630
01:34:36.060 --> 01:34:39.420
Yes, he's in prison, but because he's taken over the prison.

1631
01:34:39.479 --> 01:34:42.779
He just has a staff at his beck and call.

1632
01:34:42.840 --> 01:34:44.220
He's the lord of the castle.

1633
01:34:44.279 --> 01:34:45.479
He really is.

1634
01:34:45.539 --> 01:34:47.760
He's very much Bezel Rathbone in this one.

1635
01:34:47.819 --> 01:34:50.220
We haven't seen him for a while, so they're giving him a big.

1636
01:34:50.939 --> 01:34:51.300
Yeah, yeah.

1637
01:34:51.359 --> 01:34:52.020
Oh, it's great.

1638
01:34:52.079 --> 01:34:52.979
Yeah, big comeback.

1639
01:34:53.039 --> 01:34:56.279
Yeah, and he gets who all the masterly things except shrink people.

1640
01:34:56.340 --> 01:34:57.840
You know, he gets to hold a gun.

1641
01:34:57.899 --> 01:34:59.579
He gets to throw knives and have a sword fight.

1642
01:34:59.640 --> 01:35:01.020
He gets to dress up in disguise.

1643
01:35:01.079 --> 01:35:02.640
He gets to do electronic things.

1644
01:35:02.699 --> 01:35:06.000
He gets to lie to people, he gets to hypnotise people.

1645
01:35:06.000 --> 01:35:07.739
There's that wonderful scene, of course.

1646
01:35:07.800 --> 01:35:09.060
We know it's subterfuge.

1647
01:35:09.119 --> 01:35:14.279
But he tries to hypnotise the garden, the girl just says, let me know when you finish with your book and walks in.

1648
01:35:14.279 --> 01:35:16.859
And Delgado's reaction to that is perfect.

1649
01:35:16.920 --> 01:35:34.800
Where it all falls down, of course, is where it always falls down for the master in that the master's whole storyline in this can be summed up as the master turns to the doctor for help again, and the doctor tricks him again, and the master doesn't realise the doctor's tricked him until the doctor explains that he's tricked him again.

1650
01:35:34.859 --> 01:35:39.479
And the sea devils betray the master and bless him, he's really surprised.

1651
01:35:39.539 --> 01:35:40.619
I know.

1652
01:35:40.680 --> 01:35:47.340
Who would have thought of the autons and Nazal, and, you know, literally every other alien he's ever brought to earth.

1653
01:35:47.939 --> 01:35:49.680
How cute.

1654
01:35:49.739 --> 01:36:01.680
Oh, yeah, you kind of start to feel sorry for him because underneath it all, he seems to have a really great sense of fair play, but he wants everyone to play fair by him, but he doesn't get to play fair by everyone else.

1655
01:36:01.739 --> 01:36:12.479
You know, he's like a little boy who, you know, in one of those made up games, like tag or something where this is safe and this is, you know, he's declaring everything safe, but, you know, someone can still tackle you.

1656
01:36:12.539 --> 01:36:14.220
It doesn't matter if you say that's safe.

1657
01:36:14.819 --> 01:36:18.060
He's very well prepared in this story, I think.

1658
01:36:18.180 --> 01:36:21.119
And I think that's an impressive take home lesson.

1659
01:36:21.180 --> 01:36:23.819
So he and the doctor escape.

1660
01:36:23.880 --> 01:36:34.680
They're floating, you know, up from the Siberian base and they're rescued and he fakes a heart attack and he happens to have a master mask on him at the time.

1661
01:36:34.739 --> 01:36:39.180
And so he's able to put the mastermask on the sort of ambulance guy.

1662
01:36:39.239 --> 01:36:44.220
He escapes in the hovercraft and the mastermask is on the ambulance guy and they take it off.

1663
01:36:44.279 --> 01:36:51.180
So I've got a mastermask on me right now, actually, just in case sort of something similar occurs to me on the way home from here.

1664
01:36:51.239 --> 01:36:53.100
It's the last time we see them, isn't it?

1665
01:36:53.159 --> 01:36:54.420
The mastermask.

1666
01:36:54.479 --> 01:36:55.619
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1667
01:36:55.680 --> 01:36:56.340
Yeah, I think it is.

1668
01:36:56.399 --> 01:36:59.100
The hovercraft, the boats, the little ski-doos.

1669
01:36:59.159 --> 01:36:59.819
They're all wonderful.

1670
01:36:59.880 --> 01:37:02.939
Well, they did create some problems on production, though.

1671
01:37:03.000 --> 01:37:05.340
They were meant to have a helicopter, but they ended up with her.

1672
01:37:05.399 --> 01:37:09.539
You know, you're talking about the moment where Katie was having to drive the hovercraft.

1673
01:37:09.600 --> 01:37:10.260
Well, that's one moment.

1674
01:37:10.319 --> 01:37:10.920
Do you want to tell it?

1675
01:37:10.979 --> 01:37:19.619
Oh, it was just, you know, being Katie, she pressed the wrong button and the starboard skirt deflated and a dozen sailors fell on top of the dot com.

1676
01:37:21.000 --> 01:37:23.399
Well, why do you think I?

1677
01:37:23.399 --> 01:37:25.140
Why do you think I dress up as Katie Manley?

1678
01:37:25.199 --> 01:37:26.579
I wanted to be Katie Manic.

1679
01:37:26.640 --> 01:37:32.939
The other thing that happened, of course, was you had those little sort of jet ski things that the doctor chases the master on.

1680
01:37:33.000 --> 01:37:38.819
And of course, the master in that shot is Derek Ware because Roger had terrible sea legs.

1681
01:37:38.880 --> 01:37:41.100
Well, like me, Roger Delgado couldn't swim.

1682
01:37:41.159 --> 01:37:43.500
And so was terrified of the open water.

1683
01:37:43.560 --> 01:37:45.359
It is him floating around at the end.

1684
01:37:45.420 --> 01:37:46.380
I know.

1685
01:37:46.439 --> 01:37:52.380
It is him floating around at the end and apparently it took 20 minutes to coax him into the water and just as he was about to get in.

1686
01:37:52.619 --> 01:37:53.819
Should have just pushed him into it.

1687
01:37:53.880 --> 01:37:54.539
That would have done it.

1688
01:37:54.600 --> 01:37:57.180
Like John was already in the water saying, look, Roger, it's fine.

1689
01:37:57.239 --> 01:37:58.319
Come into the wall.

1690
01:37:58.380 --> 01:37:58.920
Come into the water.

1691
01:37:58.979 --> 01:37:59.819
It's lovely.

1692
01:37:59.819 --> 01:38:00.840
I mean, did you water?

1693
01:38:00.899 --> 01:38:02.279
Apparently, just as he was getting in.

1694
01:38:02.340 --> 01:38:04.859
A member of the crew said, oh, finally.

1695
01:38:04.920 --> 01:38:09.899
And John lost his nut and just said, sort of, like right there and then.

1696
01:38:09.960 --> 01:38:11.399
How dare you?

1697
01:38:11.520 --> 01:38:15.359
How dare you criticise an actor for preparing his performance loan?

1698
01:38:15.359 --> 01:38:19.500
And then went up to Barry Later and said, we are not working with this person. do you know what he did to Roger?

1699
01:38:19.560 --> 01:38:20.760
Barry's a bit, yeah.

1700
01:38:20.760 --> 01:38:21.600
What did Barry say?

1701
01:38:21.659 --> 01:38:26.760
I don't know I don't know what Barry said, but yeah, John John was one, you don't do that to an actor two.

1702
01:38:26.819 --> 01:38:31.199
You don't do that to my friend, who is, I was just coming to be a child. you know who I am?

1703
01:38:31.260 --> 01:38:33.000
But anyway, the jet skis.

1704
01:38:33.180 --> 01:38:37.500
Of course, filming takes a long time to set up.

1705
01:38:37.560 --> 01:38:39.539
John and Katie had nothing to do.

1706
01:38:39.600 --> 01:38:42.060
There are 2 jet skis sitting there.

1707
01:38:42.119 --> 01:38:43.260
Where is this story going?

1708
01:38:43.319 --> 01:38:47.039
This is going into John and Katie in the next few scenes.

1709
01:38:47.100 --> 01:38:48.720
They were going to be soaked down anyway.

1710
01:38:48.779 --> 01:38:53.100
So in full costume, jumped on the 2 jet skis and we're chasing each other around.

1711
01:38:53.159 --> 01:38:55.020
I forgot that on film.

1712
01:38:55.079 --> 01:38:59.159
The problem being, Katie's flares shrunk.

1713
01:38:59.220 --> 01:39:04.439
They shrunk around the waist so the zipper couldn't be done up and they rode up about 4 inches.

1714
01:39:04.500 --> 01:39:09.659
She had a spare pair, which they used for the ab sailing scene the next day, which tour.

1715
01:39:09.720 --> 01:39:18.720
So Katie's trousers are about 4 inches longer on location than they were in the studio. which means in the studio, her jumper is untucked.

1716
01:39:18.720 --> 01:39:21.239
On location, her jumper is tucked in.

1717
01:39:21.300 --> 01:39:25.500
It is also why in the studio we get so many shots of Katie's bum.

1718
01:39:25.560 --> 01:39:36.720
Because if there was a if there was a shot, if there was a shot of her metre, if i.e. when she's going up into the roof and she was facing the camera. the fly was constantly busting.

1719
01:39:37.260 --> 01:39:40.020
This is how she tells the story.

1720
01:39:40.079 --> 01:39:49.079
Well, actually, in the in the doctor prison break scene, after she's down on the floor, when she gets up, as she goes to the door, you see her doing up her flight.

1721
01:39:49.500 --> 01:39:51.239
What do you have borrowed?

1722
01:39:51.239 --> 01:39:53.100
Stuart Fowls out, family?

1723
01:39:53.159 --> 01:39:54.600
Well, that was one of the spares.

1724
01:39:54.659 --> 01:39:55.140
Oh, okay.

1725
01:39:55.140 --> 01:39:58.079
So he didn't take it home with him, right?

1726
01:39:58.439 --> 01:39:59.399
No, no.

1727
01:39:59.460 --> 01:40:00.600
No, he took the wig.

1728
01:40:00.659 --> 01:40:01.619
He took the wig home.

1729
01:40:01.680 --> 01:40:04.859
But continuing on the behind the scenes.

1730
01:40:04.920 --> 01:40:06.479
God, I love Michael Bryant's direction.

1731
01:40:06.539 --> 01:40:09.420
Yeah, it's a lot of work, friends.

1732
01:40:09.479 --> 01:40:11.399
Do you have a lot of crazy camera angles and stuff?

1733
01:40:11.460 --> 01:40:16.199
There's lots of crazy camera angles, but also he uses triangles a lot in his geometry.

1734
01:40:16.260 --> 01:40:19.319
He'll have a figure standing in the foreground and another figure sitting in the background.

1735
01:40:19.380 --> 01:40:26.340
So you have the foreground figures head, the foreground figures, waist, and the figure in the background's head as your triangle.

1736
01:40:26.399 --> 01:40:28.319
And Katie's bum in the making.

1737
01:40:28.380 --> 01:40:29.460
And Katie's bum, of course.

1738
01:40:30.000 --> 01:40:34.079
I believe all the angles add up to 180 degrees on Katie's butt.

1739
01:40:34.859 --> 01:40:44.100
When John and Roger are in scenes together, if there is a shot of John, there is a negative space in the shot.

1740
01:40:44.159 --> 01:40:51.600
And then in the next shot of Roger, Roger's in the negative space and there's and there's negative space in his shot, they're completing each other's shots, they're yin and yang.

1741
01:40:51.659 --> 01:40:54.119
Michael Lee Bryant is very, very clever.

1742
01:40:54.180 --> 01:41:04.560
But you notice it most in the beginning of episode 3 after the doctor and the master have had their big sword fight and Trenchard catches them and takes the doctor prisoner and lie, da, da, da.

1743
01:41:04.619 --> 01:41:07.920
Whenever the doctor and the master are talking, there's almost no one else in the shop.

1744
01:41:07.979 --> 01:41:12.659
There's lots of negative space and they're cutting back and forth between the doctor and the master.

1745
01:41:12.720 --> 01:41:19.199
Now that is a standard of visual filmmaking, but it's a standard to imply that these 2 characters are very deeply connected.

1746
01:41:19.260 --> 01:41:24.479
And I don't recall seeing another director previously in a story do that.

1747
01:41:24.600 --> 01:41:27.060
I think Mike Lee Bryant's terribly clever.

1748
01:41:27.180 --> 01:41:34.140
So just before we move on, there's a continuation to something we were talking about earlier and there's an end to something as well.

1749
01:41:34.199 --> 01:41:38.039
So for the continuation, Nathan, what do we see in this story that we've seen in several previous stories?

1750
01:41:38.159 --> 01:41:38.760
All right.

1751
01:41:38.819 --> 01:41:46.859
Well, a couple of episodes ago, Todd, listed every gurning instance in the pertwe era up until that point.

1752
01:41:46.920 --> 01:41:55.079
And it turns out he'd gurned at least once per story up until, I can't remember exactly when, but certainly midway through sort of season eight.

1753
01:41:55.199 --> 01:42:03.359
Here he gets captured in at the end of episode 5 of the episode 5 Cliffhanger, he gets captured by a sea devil and does some real quality gurney.

1754
01:42:03.420 --> 01:42:06.960
So I thought I'd mention that for as a little shout out to Todd.

1755
01:42:07.020 --> 01:42:07.739
Yeah, yeah.

1756
01:42:07.800 --> 01:42:11.520
And also, sadly with this story, we say goodbye to Havoc.

1757
01:42:11.579 --> 01:42:14.159
This is the last story with action by havoc.

1758
01:42:14.220 --> 01:42:22.199
The sea devils, Stuart fell flipping along the beach, which the other Stantartists apparently didn't approve of because the BBC should only get what they paid for.

1759
01:42:22.260 --> 01:42:24.239
They're not paying for Flit Stewart. dont do any flips.

1760
01:42:24.300 --> 01:42:28.619
This is the last story that havoc is build on. shall we say?

1761
01:42:28.739 --> 01:42:29.220
Yeah.

1762
01:42:29.279 --> 01:42:34.319
And it's the only story in which the doctor says reverse the polarity of the neutron flow.

1763
01:42:34.439 --> 01:42:34.979
Indeed.

1764
01:42:34.979 --> 01:42:38.159
Although in Time Monster, we get a lot of variations on that theme.

1765
01:42:38.220 --> 01:42:39.300
Oh, yeah, yeah, it does.

1766
01:42:39.359 --> 01:42:44.640
There are variations of it, but it doesn't actually occur again until the 5 doctors in its, you know, glorious entirety.

1767
01:42:54.359 --> 01:43:03.000
What a perfect time to say that our next episode, out in two weeks, will be focussing on the mutants and the Time Monster.

1768
01:43:03.479 --> 01:43:11.819
Please don't forget that you can comment on our website for a chance to win a target novelisation from a selection we still have available.

1769
01:43:11.880 --> 01:43:13.859
Of only these 5 stories.

1770
01:43:14.039 --> 01:43:15.899
Only these photos.

1771
01:43:15.960 --> 01:43:22.979
Also, we do have a presence on Facebook, just search for this flight through entirety, and Twitter, FTE podcast.

1772
01:43:23.039 --> 01:43:26.159
There are also some changes to the website incoming.

1773
01:43:26.220 --> 01:43:28.500
So if you are new to our podcast, Welcome.

1774
01:43:28.560 --> 01:43:32.399
We will be introducing some pages before our next episode.

1775
01:43:32.460 --> 01:43:41.819
We'll be listing each episode of the podcast along with the stories covered in them and separated out by doctor as well because this is, gentlemen, our 25th episode.

1776
01:43:41.939 --> 01:43:43.199
Hurrah.

1777
01:43:43.260 --> 01:43:45.659
Well, I should say the nemesis of episodes.

1778
01:43:45.720 --> 01:43:50.579
Actually, I should say, there's a lovely portrait of you just as Madame Poppadour.

1779
01:43:50.699 --> 01:43:55.739
Yeah, yeah, they actually use that at the beginning of every Gainsborough picture in the 30s and 40s.

1780
01:43:55.859 --> 01:43:57.420
Of you, just to Stuart Phil.

1781
01:43:57.479 --> 01:43:58.739
Yeah, yeah, it's lovely.

1782
01:43:58.800 --> 01:43:59.460
Yeah.

1783
01:43:59.520 --> 01:44:08.159
And until next time where I will be dressed in a brown and yellow knitted ensemble or is it blue and white?

1784
01:44:08.279 --> 01:44:08.760
I'm not sure.

1785
01:44:08.819 --> 01:44:09.479
Good night.

1786
01:44:09.539 --> 01:44:10.739
Good night.

1787
01:44:10.800 --> 01:44:11.760
And thank you.

1788
01:44:14.819 --> 01:44:19.800
You have been listening to Flight Through Entirety with Nathan Bottomley, Brendan Jones, and Richard Stone.

1789
01:44:19.859 --> 01:44:25.439
This episode, a Hessian Sack full of candy canes, was recorded on Sunday, March the 8th.

1790
01:44:25.500 --> 01:44:28.439
The next episode will be released on March the 29th.

1791
01:44:28.560 --> 01:44:32.279
Now, if you'll excuse me, I have to go make 7000 sandwiches.

1792
01:44:32.340 --> 01:44:33.539
Herclees coming over.

1793
01:44:39.600 --> 01:44:41.520
Oh, yeah, we're not starting yet.

1794
01:44:41.579 --> 01:44:41.939
Okay.

1795
01:44:42.000 --> 01:44:45.659
Now, yours may pop off, so just keep an eye, keep an eye on that.

1796
01:44:46.979 --> 01:44:49.020
I may position it.

1797
01:44:49.079 --> 01:44:51.840
A little further up, just because...

1798
01:44:51.840 --> 01:44:52.920
Just clamp it onto his nipple.

1799
01:44:52.979 --> 01:44:54.840
Yeah, that's better folds. not very big.

1800
01:44:54.899 --> 01:44:55.380
Okay.

1801
01:44:55.439 --> 01:44:56.220
Where is he?