WEBVTT

NOTE
This transcript was created on 2026-05-04 at 14:41:22

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Hello and welcome back to Flight Through Entirety, the weekly

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Doctor Who podcast that agrees with Garman.

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Shoes are insane, Davros.

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I'm Brendan.

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I'm Nathan.

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I'm Todd.

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I'm Richard.

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All right.

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That's who you are.

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Our transmat beam has been intercepted, and we are being sent like

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a scrambled Morse message onto the quarry-like world of Scarrow

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for Genesis of the Daleks.

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Exactly the same thing happens in Rocky Horror picture show.

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Prepare the transmat beam.

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I don't know that Davros and Nida.

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Have we watched The Simpsons yet?

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It feels like it's been on.

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Wasn't actually Davros and Ida just based on Monty Burns and

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Smithers.

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I'm sure The Simpsons has been playing that long.

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Well, Slithers and Mr. Burns, and possibly Davros and Nyder, were

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based on comedia de latte characters.

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The leather masks.

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And specifically there is a character.

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I believe he's called Alacino, who was the old miser, hook nosed

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bald headed, spoke with a thought and rat.

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Nothing anti-Semitic in this at all.

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And certainly, well, Semitism or anti-Semitism is a strong theme

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of this story because we're going right back to something you said

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originally, Richard, way back when, about a year ago when we were

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doing the Daleks, where you said, this is not a story about

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Nazism.

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This is a story about communism.

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It was definitely then.

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Yeah, not necessarily now.

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I remember you said at the time, you know, it's not until a guy, I

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believe you said someone comes in in their woo-woo funny

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wheelchair that it becomes about Nazism.

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Okay, it says that Terry Nation wrote this on screen, but

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deterioration actually write this?

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It's too good.

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I was thinking about preparing my list.

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You know, the last...

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Nathan's list, have a drink list.

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No, the last 2 times we had a Terry Nations three.

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I just did a list of things that appear in the story.

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It can't be Terry Nation.

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There's no one called Tarrant.

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There's an uncle Tarrant, but in fact, there's actually very few

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of the things that Terry is kind of known for.

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Yeah, I mean, we've got Severin, who is just kind of a retread of

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Belle Al or Wester.

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Except you know where the name Severn comes from, don't you?

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Severn is Dr. Sasha Masix's hero in Venus in Furs.

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The term masochism comes from this novel by Sasha Masick.

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He was the victim of the batan character.

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And his Venus Infurs had the short blonde hair and was it, you can

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look up masochism, if you care to.

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So everyone is a character.

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And if you, and if you're home, don't look out for you.

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I mean, or you can just listen to the velvet underground on Lou

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Reed song, Venus and First, which will give you the entire

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synopsis of the novel.

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No, sir, it's quite a deliberate ploy that there are some very

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dark undercurrents in this story.

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Severn, Severn is the massacres in that story.

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Okay.

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Well let me just get back to my list.

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Is that all right?

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Is there a space plate?

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I really want a space plate.

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So there's no space plague.

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We do have Western and Bell El's...

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Cousin.

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Bell end cousin.

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And people are toting a lot of bombs around the place too.

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That's always a bit of a thing.

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But, you know, otherwise it's actually not full of the normal

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terry nation things.

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And so I think what's happening here is what will later happen in

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Blake 7. where Terry can write a good action adventure romp, but

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is really ropey with dialogue in Blake 7.

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You've got him writing the stories in the 1st bit and Chris

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Boucher fixing the dialogue.

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Here, you've got someone, I think, perhaps even more skilled than

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Chris Boucher in Bob Holmes.

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And certainly the 1st scene is classic homes.

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I mean, in fact, there is an initial scene where we get some World

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War one arconography with the gas masks and people shooting each

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other and...

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The 1st time there were proper letters.

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And the 1st time Mary Whitehouse noticed Doctor Who.

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Because it's all done in slow motion. no blood or anything.

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And as I was watching this, I was going, I can't remember this.

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Like, had I just blacked it out?

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Maybe we were just so young.

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Did they cut it?

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Anyway.

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But the 1st proper scene is the scene between the doctor and the

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timelord.

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And so a timelord comes, just like in terror of the autons, to

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explain the background of the plot, to the doctor and to send him

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on his mission.

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And the scene is very similar, except that Tom's demeanour is sort

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of different.

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Like her twee is sort of sardonic and camp and hilarious.

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Do you know what I mean?

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And you'd better think of a witty way of dealing with it then.

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And the time mode is, of course, you know, absurd.

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Yeah, yeah.

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So this guy's dressed like a kind of...

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Well, you know what he is actually dressed.

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What is he?

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Well, you know what he's dressed at.

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Thank you.

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The 7th seal.

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If any of our listeners, the lovely listeners live in Sydney, the

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Sydney Film Festival, I think 51st is just played and one of my

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all-time favourite film directors, Ingmar Bergman.

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I think we've cited him before.

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They've just had a retrospective of some of his great films.

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He really is superb.

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If you want to know, in Marburgman, just look up French and

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Saunders doing all of his greatest films because it is actually

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they get it right.

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But no, this is almost shot for shot, the opening scene of 7th

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seal, and we can bookend that beautifully.

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The dance at the end of 7th seal is the same thing that happens

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with the time ring at this.

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It's very deliberate.

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Very deliberate.

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And it's the same collar and it's the almost the same exposition

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but it's certainly newest in the same tropes of acting that you

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see with between Tom.

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I think it's one of Tom's greatest scenes.

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It's just a tiny little moment.

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Daleks.

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Tell me more.

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It's wonderful. beautiful, isn't it?

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But yeah, yeah, he's definitely death and the night.

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And I believe that comes from David Maloney, because as I

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understand it, in the script, in the script, the...

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He was floating in the air wearing a bowl hat.

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The timelord actually brings the doctor to a garden, a beautiful

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garden.

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Right.

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And there's Billy in the background with his roses.

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They are a dandy a clown and what the hell are you?

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What are you young people doing inside my garden?

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And then drops him in the middle of the quarry and that was meant

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to be the big shock.

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So yeah, it's David Maloney who's bringing in the Ingmar Bergman.

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And a considerable saving for the beep.

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Another shoot.

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And I also would like to recommend for the listener.

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And I'm damn sure we can find a link for it.

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The McCalliff program, Sean McCalliff's ABC Variety slash sketch

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series.

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That's ABC Australian broadcasting is not ABC American.

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Yes, or indeed Associated British Corporation.

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Which became Thames TV in 1970.

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No one remembers.

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But he and Wayne Hope do an excellent take on incumbent.

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That's the 7th seal.

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And I'm not going to say anything well because otherwise I'll

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reveal the punchline.

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Fuck.

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Anyway, moving on.

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Yeah, it's such a strong opening.

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It's because we have, we have that harrowing scene with all those

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people being mowed down and then going on through the mist, like

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the battle goes, and that just tells you the battle goes on.

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It's a very economic or very effective way of storytelling.

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And then we have that scene and then we have Sarah and Harry

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arriving.

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So hooray.

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Yeah, but then there's like that whole barrage and poor Sarah is

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screening through it all. covering her ears.

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It's awful, isn't it?

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You know, and even when they go from that great location work to

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in the studio, I mean, then, you know, they're all casting down

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there.

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What you think about the mind?

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They're lying under deadline.

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What do you think about the mine?

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Because apparently that's one of the things that the Bill Slater

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said were really queried.

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You know, it's Tom standing on a landmine. they thought was too

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much.

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I just think it's brilliant.

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And as a child, that's not a threat because as children.

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You know that at the very same time, Paul Pot was training 12 year

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old boys and the Khmer Rouge to use landlines because a 12 year

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old child doesn't know threat, should we say, ontological threat

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have a drink?

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But that doesn't doesn't recognise those sorts of threats because

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they're not immediate.

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So for a child watching this drama, that kind of stuff and the

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explosions and the noise, children are a burst of noise.

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I didn't find that so horrifying.

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I think that as a parent I might have, but no, I actually don't

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think it's that good.

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I actually don't think it's that good a scene because there is I'm

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so glad you're here.

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There isn't all...

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It's a very terry nation scene.

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Do you know what I mean?

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It is, it's like we'll, like we get lots and lots of Harry puts

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rocks under a landmine for a while.

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We more or less fairly certain that Tom's not going to be blown

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up.

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Do you know what I mean?

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We don't really learn anything about anyone.

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So I'm not sure that that's so great.

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But that scene does also have.

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And Todd, I know you've mentioned sort of Sarah having to scream

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and be scared of the explosions, but it does also have Sarah

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figuring out that this is a war of attrition. because she is the

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one who notices that, you know, this soldier is in a sort of

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natural, rough hewn fibre, but this is a modern synthetic fibre.

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I hate that scene again.

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Because, and then someone says, and this weapon dates from a long

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time before this weapon.

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Can we just have a moment?

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Do you know where the laser rifle actually originates with the

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yellow person?

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Is it a drama?

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Well done.

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It is, in fact, they are driving guns that are being storage.

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And the funny thing is, a very strikingly similar design is used

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as the phaser rifles on Star Trek next generation.

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We'll get it.

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Do you think the giraffe will segue everywhere?

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Well, look at Deanna Troy's hair.

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What?

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Anything, anywhere.

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Actually, especially season one.

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She's got the bun head.

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She got the decorations in it.

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She just doesn't have the stick on Daimonte eyebrows.

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No, she would never cut it as a drive-in.

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Bring back the drive-ins, I say.

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Come on, Steve.

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So I don't think that seems very good because you've got 3

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characters saying the same thing 3 times.

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It's like 3 bits of evidence that this is a war of attrition.

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And so it's just slightly inept, I think.

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But it's nice to have all 3 of them together because they're going

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to be separated very soon and Sarah's offer on her own little

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adventure for a few episodes.

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And the doctor and Ian have to confront Lieutenant Gruber.

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Yeah.

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Yes, from a level, our third.

254
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Appearance from somebody from a level.

255
00:10:51.299 --> 00:10:51.960
Yes, indeed.

256
00:10:52.019 --> 00:10:55.620
And of course, Nyder is on the case very early, giving a lot of

257
00:10:55.620 --> 00:10:57.179
exposition in that scene.

258
00:10:57.240 --> 00:10:58.200
Well, don't you remember?

259
00:10:58.200 --> 00:10:59.639
Is does when does Snyder appear?

260
00:10:59.700 --> 00:11:02.039
Does Snyder appear after they escape and get recaptured?

261
00:11:02.100 --> 00:11:05.940
No, they just before and he goes, Raven, get down and then they

262
00:11:05.940 --> 00:11:06.179
shoot.

263
00:11:06.299 --> 00:11:06.840
Yes, yes.

264
00:11:06.899 --> 00:11:09.419
It's after they've it's after they've taken control of Raven.

265
00:11:09.480 --> 00:11:14.820
And I have to say, you know, I think I said when we were talking

266
00:11:14.820 --> 00:11:16.620
about invasion of dinosaurs.

267
00:11:16.679 --> 00:11:19.980
This is Peter Miles' best performance in Doctor Who.

268
00:11:19.980 --> 00:11:23.039
Because the 2 professors he's played before were essentially the

269
00:11:23.039 --> 00:11:23.639
same character.

270
00:11:23.700 --> 00:11:27.000
I actually think diabetic is a little bit more low key because

271
00:11:27.000 --> 00:11:30.600
remember, Dr. Lawrence is transigent base commander.

272
00:11:30.720 --> 00:11:32.340
So he's a panicky idiot.

273
00:11:32.399 --> 00:11:36.000
But they both have this style of delivery.

274
00:11:36.059 --> 00:11:38.279
No, it does as well. and I just still super cat.

275
00:11:38.399 --> 00:11:39.419
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

276
00:11:39.480 --> 00:11:40.679
Oh, stop it.

277
00:11:40.740 --> 00:11:44.580
Midnight general, the order specifies midnight.

278
00:11:44.639 --> 00:11:46.500
You're really going out on a limb there.

279
00:11:46.559 --> 00:11:49.620
The difference the difference is the control in the voice.

280
00:11:49.679 --> 00:11:53.100
Because there's always that degree of panic with professors

281
00:11:53.100 --> 00:11:54.600
Whittaker and Lawrence.

282
00:11:54.659 --> 00:11:57.539
There is never a degree of panic tonight.

283
00:11:57.600 --> 00:11:58.440
I know, he's terrific.

284
00:11:58.500 --> 00:12:02.100
They bring back Peter Miles for the I-Davros audio series.

285
00:12:02.159 --> 00:12:04.860
And in that, you know, he's 20 years younger.

286
00:12:04.919 --> 00:12:07.019
He's the leader of a crack commando squad.

287
00:12:07.080 --> 00:12:09.600
And listening to him here and looking at him here.

288
00:12:09.659 --> 00:12:10.259
You can believe that.

289
00:12:10.320 --> 00:12:14.100
You can believe that he used to use elite his own raids.

290
00:12:14.159 --> 00:12:18.840
You can believe that he is a, it's, it is an incredible acting

291
00:12:18.840 --> 00:12:23.279
challenge to play this character who is very camp and very nasal

292
00:12:23.279 --> 00:12:27.899
and very sardonic, but you can believe that he would, he has 20

293
00:12:27.899 --> 00:12:30.000
ways to kill you in 2 seconds.

294
00:12:30.059 --> 00:12:32.879
Just with a look with a withering remark.

295
00:12:32.940 --> 00:12:34.019
Just with a paper card.

296
00:12:34.080 --> 00:12:36.179
So he's wearing the iron cross.

297
00:12:36.299 --> 00:12:38.940
Yes, and you disappears halfway through...

298
00:12:39.059 --> 00:12:39.360
You know why?

299
00:12:39.419 --> 00:12:40.740
They kept telling him to take it off.

300
00:12:40.799 --> 00:12:43.259
It's his own That's kind of bizarre.

301
00:12:43.320 --> 00:12:46.379
Heater Miles had a collection of Nazi memorabilia.

302
00:12:46.440 --> 00:12:48.600
Ask him about it, the next con you go to.

303
00:12:48.659 --> 00:12:50.279
Have you ever interviewed Peter Meyer?

304
00:12:50.580 --> 00:12:51.179
did not know that.

305
00:12:51.240 --> 00:12:52.799
Well, why not?

306
00:12:52.860 --> 00:12:55.139
I don't think he's got a collection of that, does he?

307
00:12:55.200 --> 00:12:56.639
He does. in the notes.

308
00:12:56.700 --> 00:12:57.360
It's in the notes.

309
00:12:57.419 --> 00:12:57.960
No, he does.

310
00:12:58.019 --> 00:13:00.120
And Hinchcliffe was saying, look, you know, kind of a bit far

311
00:13:00.120 --> 00:13:00.720
pinched.

312
00:13:00.779 --> 00:13:02.820
Oh, come on, it's glorious.

313
00:13:02.879 --> 00:13:05.759
Anyway, I'm just getting a fail for me part.

314
00:13:05.820 --> 00:13:08.519
Before he's off to the aerodrome.

315
00:13:08.580 --> 00:13:09.899
He does.

316
00:13:09.960 --> 00:13:11.879
He does, he does, you couldn't possibly know.

317
00:13:11.940 --> 00:13:14.399
That doesn't make any sense because Davros can't reach that high.

318
00:13:14.460 --> 00:13:16.980
There are so many great lines in this.

319
00:13:17.039 --> 00:13:20.220
It's very difficult to talk about this as a story because we just

320
00:13:20.220 --> 00:13:23.759
keep getting sunk into the details because this is one of those

321
00:13:23.759 --> 00:13:27.059
gestolt to have another drink where all the some of the parts go

322
00:13:27.059 --> 00:13:29.340
up to make the hole in the, I can't tell which bit is more

323
00:13:29.340 --> 00:13:30.779
glorious, the hole or the bits.

324
00:13:30.840 --> 00:13:34.259
It does the thing that has actually been happening this season

325
00:13:34.259 --> 00:13:36.600
which is that each episode introduces something new.

326
00:13:36.659 --> 00:13:38.159
So what's the new thing here?

327
00:13:38.220 --> 00:13:40.019
So episode episode one.

328
00:13:40.080 --> 00:13:40.860
Do you know what I mean?

329
00:13:40.919 --> 00:13:43.620
We get very little apart from establishing that we've had this war

330
00:13:43.620 --> 00:13:44.399
of attrition.

331
00:13:44.460 --> 00:13:47.220
There's some time wasting stuff where the doctor and Harry kind of

332
00:13:47.220 --> 00:13:50.460
escape and then immediately get recaptured, but basically not very

333
00:13:50.460 --> 00:13:52.440
much happens beyond establishing the premise.

334
00:13:52.559 --> 00:13:54.779
It's a many 1000 year war.

335
00:13:54.840 --> 00:13:58.559
At a distance of its dome cities that you can walk to.

336
00:13:58.679 --> 00:13:59.399
Yeah.

337
00:13:59.399 --> 00:14:05.039
Then you get Sarah's, she gets caught by the files and enslaved

338
00:14:05.039 --> 00:14:05.940
into the brain.

339
00:14:06.000 --> 00:14:07.080
Yeah, she almost passes for human.

340
00:14:07.139 --> 00:14:08.159
She does.

341
00:14:08.220 --> 00:14:10.200
She's almost a normal. almost a normal.

342
00:14:10.259 --> 00:14:12.600
How good is that rock, those scenes with a rocket.

343
00:14:12.659 --> 00:14:13.139
How good is it?

344
00:14:13.200 --> 00:14:14.039
It's Hilary Minter.

345
00:14:14.100 --> 00:14:17.399
Is it as the thou guard, who later turns up as inner low, low.

346
00:14:17.399 --> 00:14:20.220
Yes, yes. as General von Klinkerhoff.

347
00:14:20.279 --> 00:14:23.639
On the same side as Lieutenant Gruber now. who as Guy Sina, who

348
00:14:23.639 --> 00:14:28.200
plays the very 1st Kali General, the Boy Generals.

349
00:14:28.259 --> 00:14:32.220
That's a that's a Joe Orton play that never made it to the stage

350
00:14:32.220 --> 00:14:32.759
did it?

351
00:14:32.820 --> 00:14:34.019
Good boy.

352
00:14:34.080 --> 00:14:37.799
And how good is Guy Seiner, when it keeps going on about the glory

353
00:14:37.799 --> 00:14:38.879
of the Khalib, right?

354
00:14:38.940 --> 00:14:40.620
I've got a big thing about concrete, actually.

355
00:14:40.679 --> 00:14:41.940
He does kind of dialogue.

356
00:14:42.000 --> 00:14:46.620
And what I find so good about his performance is that halfway

357
00:14:46.620 --> 00:14:50.399
through the story, he does change his allegiance bit, but that

358
00:14:50.399 --> 00:14:53.279
seated early on when he's trying to do the best he can and people

359
00:14:53.279 --> 00:14:54.539
keep taking away his equipment.

360
00:14:54.779 --> 00:14:58.679
Everyone in this story has their own motivation and their own

361
00:14:58.679 --> 00:15:00.120
purpose. quite different in each coast.

362
00:15:00.179 --> 00:15:02.159
And it's and it's always believable.

363
00:15:02.220 --> 00:15:03.480
Even when it changes.

364
00:15:03.720 --> 00:15:04.679
Especially with Nider.

365
00:15:04.740 --> 00:15:08.220
There's a lot of frustrated filial, well, daddy love between

366
00:15:08.220 --> 00:15:08.879
himself.

367
00:15:08.940 --> 00:15:10.320
Shall we get a little bit psych?

368
00:15:10.379 --> 00:15:11.879
Now you know how much.

369
00:15:11.940 --> 00:15:16.320
You know how much interest Hinchcliffe had in amateur psychology?

370
00:15:16.379 --> 00:15:18.840
I've mentioned La Khan before.

371
00:15:18.899 --> 00:15:23.220
The greatest Lacan reference in this, and it's, I'm not pulling

372
00:15:23.220 --> 00:15:24.779
this out of my lexicon.

373
00:15:24.840 --> 00:15:28.559
This is actually Hinchcliffe, I'm quoting, is the delayed shock

374
00:15:28.559 --> 00:15:34.919
between the physical death and the actual death itself of the

375
00:15:34.919 --> 00:15:35.279
body.

376
00:15:35.279 --> 00:15:38.100
And Davros is the sinequanon of this.

377
00:15:38.159 --> 00:15:41.519
Davros's real death happened before we even got to the screen.

378
00:15:41.580 --> 00:15:43.559
It's a cadaver in a bath chair.

379
00:15:43.620 --> 00:15:48.720
And we have the mordant horror of watching an animated corpse. with

380
00:15:48.720 --> 00:15:49.799
a frisky right hand.

381
00:15:49.860 --> 00:15:52.200
Why the hell, hang on, just a moment.

382
00:15:52.259 --> 00:15:57.120
Why the hell did he have an off switch on his bath chair for his

383
00:15:57.120 --> 00:15:58.019
life support?

384
00:15:58.080 --> 00:16:02.159
That's some horrible kink role-play between him and night. present

385
00:16:02.159 --> 00:16:03.179
night, you present?

386
00:16:03.240 --> 00:16:04.440
Oh, I'm dying.

387
00:16:04.500 --> 00:16:05.519
Stop, stop.

388
00:16:06.120 --> 00:16:09.179
You know those 2 got up to Friskies, don't you?

389
00:16:09.240 --> 00:16:10.379
But it's like the big...

390
00:16:10.440 --> 00:16:13.799
No, no, it's a thing he had a total big total. thing.

391
00:16:13.860 --> 00:16:18.240
It was labelled total destruction in case you missed it at home.

392
00:16:18.299 --> 00:16:20.100
Yeah, no, it's very nation script.

393
00:16:20.159 --> 00:16:21.840
We need a total destruction.

394
00:16:21.899 --> 00:16:23.220
But we are getting ahead.

395
00:16:23.279 --> 00:16:25.200
That's we are getting towards episode.

396
00:16:25.200 --> 00:16:26.039
What would that be?

397
00:16:26.100 --> 00:16:26.580
Five.

398
00:16:26.700 --> 00:16:30.120
I just love I just love the end of episode one.

399
00:16:30.179 --> 00:16:35.399
Sarah sees Davos for the very 1st time. and, you know, I just

400
00:16:35.399 --> 00:16:37.559
think the mask and the performance are wonderful. and then, and

401
00:16:37.559 --> 00:16:38.100
then...

402
00:16:38.100 --> 00:16:39.120
No, that's Liz's real face.

403
00:16:41.580 --> 00:16:43.379
That's terrible.

404
00:16:43.679 --> 00:16:47.639
But she does present the mask of horror and fear, and her face

405
00:16:47.639 --> 00:16:48.120
does.

406
00:16:48.179 --> 00:16:51.779
Actually, the horror of that scene is not so much Michael Wisher

407
00:16:51.779 --> 00:16:52.379
in the rubber.

408
00:16:52.440 --> 00:16:54.360
It's, it's Liz's reaction.

409
00:16:54.360 --> 00:16:55.919
And she, and she's out.

410
00:16:55.980 --> 00:16:57.179
Yeah, she's our place now.

411
00:16:57.240 --> 00:16:58.080
Now we can begin.

412
00:16:58.139 --> 00:17:02.519
So it is, it is our episode one, end of episode one, Dalek Reveal

413
00:17:02.519 --> 00:17:06.359
but it is so much better than so much better. because the Daleks

414
00:17:06.359 --> 00:17:07.079
are hardly in it.

415
00:17:07.140 --> 00:17:09.420
They don't get to be the Daleks.

416
00:17:09.480 --> 00:17:12.000
We they get called the Daleks, you know, somewhere in episode two

417
00:17:12.000 --> 00:17:12.359
I think.

418
00:17:12.480 --> 00:17:14.819
But they're not really the Daleks until the end.

419
00:17:14.940 --> 00:17:18.240
They're a number 91 omnibus to Clapham, aren't they?

420
00:17:18.299 --> 00:17:20.160
Mark 3 travel machine.

421
00:17:20.220 --> 00:17:20.579
Not three.

422
00:17:20.579 --> 00:17:21.059
Protein.

423
00:17:21.779 --> 00:17:26.160
I mean, the reason the Cliffhanger works is the previous 3 Dalek

424
00:17:26.160 --> 00:17:29.160
stories, the Cliffhanger has been about the doctor discovering

425
00:17:29.160 --> 00:17:30.240
that there's Daleks.

426
00:17:30.299 --> 00:17:33.359
Right from the 1st scene, the doctor knows that he's going to

427
00:17:33.359 --> 00:17:34.319
encounter the Daleks.

428
00:17:34.380 --> 00:17:40.500
What this cliffhanger is is Sarah encountering the Daleks.

429
00:17:40.559 --> 00:17:42.839
And it's more effective because Sarah's us.

430
00:17:42.900 --> 00:17:44.519
And she's seen them before.

431
00:17:44.579 --> 00:17:48.599
And last time, there were lovely, shiny, brilliantined, gorgeous

432
00:17:48.599 --> 00:17:52.259
pepper pot, Lewis Marks, 60s Daleks, as well as we were saying in

433
00:17:52.259 --> 00:17:52.920
the last podcast.

434
00:17:52.980 --> 00:17:55.500
That was the very last true Dalek story.

435
00:17:55.559 --> 00:17:56.279
Did you know?

436
00:17:56.279 --> 00:17:59.640
It's in Terry Nations actual contract that the Davros had to

437
00:17:59.640 --> 00:18:01.319
appear in every subsequent Dalek story.

438
00:18:01.380 --> 00:18:03.180
Yes, he insisted on that.

439
00:18:03.240 --> 00:18:06.180
I always think it was laziness, but...

440
00:18:06.240 --> 00:18:09.000
Did you find that a bit entire set before?

441
00:18:09.059 --> 00:18:09.960
Oh, yeah, awful.

442
00:18:10.019 --> 00:18:13.680
That's why Eric Saywood and later Ben Aronovic, included Dad Ross

443
00:18:13.680 --> 00:18:14.880
because that was one of the stipulations.

444
00:18:15.000 --> 00:18:16.980
It's the contract to use the Daleks.

445
00:18:17.039 --> 00:18:19.440
I always assumed it was laziness on the BBC part.

446
00:18:19.500 --> 00:18:21.720
It's Terry Bloody Nation, dear listener.

447
00:18:21.779 --> 00:18:24.240
I mean, there's something to be said for Davros, and we are

448
00:18:24.240 --> 00:18:27.960
getting way ahead of ourselves, but because you have to be a good

449
00:18:27.960 --> 00:18:30.059
writer, it's a right good Dalek dialogue.

450
00:18:30.119 --> 00:18:30.779
Do you know what I mean?

451
00:18:31.140 --> 00:18:34.859
And if the Daleks are just going to wander around saying, seek

452
00:18:34.859 --> 00:18:37.799
locate, exterminate, then they're really boring and you need a

453
00:18:37.799 --> 00:18:40.619
human being to speak on their behalf, hence Stavros.

454
00:18:40.680 --> 00:18:45.240
But in fact, you can write Daleks quite well, they don't need to

455
00:18:45.240 --> 00:18:46.259
be as boring as that.

456
00:18:46.319 --> 00:18:47.940
They weren't in the 60s.

457
00:18:48.000 --> 00:18:50.039
They aren't in the new series, you know.

458
00:18:50.099 --> 00:18:54.900
So I think that Davros allows the writers to be lazy with the

459
00:18:54.900 --> 00:18:57.359
Daleks and it actually has the opposite effect.

460
00:18:57.599 --> 00:18:59.759
I want to go back to episode two.

461
00:18:59.819 --> 00:19:01.140
Episode 2 begins.

462
00:19:01.200 --> 00:19:02.099
There's no reprise.

463
00:19:02.160 --> 00:19:05.099
It's just straight into Sarah being smothered and attacked by the

464
00:19:05.099 --> 00:19:05.759
mid Coast.

465
00:19:05.819 --> 00:19:07.380
We haven't had that for a long time, have we?

466
00:19:07.440 --> 00:19:09.240
That's so disturbing.

467
00:19:09.299 --> 00:19:11.519
Like, you know, what, you know, she is literally being

468
00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:12.839
manhandled.

469
00:19:12.900 --> 00:19:14.160
Muto handled.

470
00:19:14.640 --> 00:19:16.500
They're people.

471
00:19:16.680 --> 00:19:19.019
Yeah, but horrible things could happen.

472
00:19:19.079 --> 00:19:21.119
Like it really is quite on another level.

473
00:19:21.180 --> 00:19:22.380
Really, it is too.

474
00:19:22.440 --> 00:19:25.920
You just, yeah, in these Hessian sacks of male intent pause to

475
00:19:25.920 --> 00:19:26.339
reflect.

476
00:19:26.400 --> 00:19:28.200
And they, you know, and they fight over, if they're going to kill

477
00:19:28.200 --> 00:19:28.859
Sarah.

478
00:19:28.920 --> 00:19:31.619
Yeah, it's quite, you know, she is in this jeopardy.

479
00:19:31.680 --> 00:19:34.619
Meanwhile, of course, the doctor has been interrogated and he asks

480
00:19:34.619 --> 00:19:38.640
for some tea. at a very trying time.

481
00:19:38.700 --> 00:19:41.940
But who is Sarah rescued from the mutos bye?

482
00:19:42.059 --> 00:19:45.059
So isn't she's wrestling by?

483
00:19:45.119 --> 00:19:48.900
Well, she's rescued by Severn 1st and then the False, yeah.

484
00:19:48.960 --> 00:19:52.559
And the most amazing thing for anyone who's seen any Doctor Who at

485
00:19:52.559 --> 00:19:57.599
all, or at least, you know, 2 Terry Nation stories, in the past 12

486
00:19:57.599 --> 00:20:01.740
years, is that the files are collecting slave workers, aren't

487
00:20:01.740 --> 00:20:01.920
they?

488
00:20:01.920 --> 00:20:04.619
And so the muters want to kill you.

489
00:20:04.680 --> 00:20:07.380
The car leads, you know, firing guns at you.

490
00:20:07.440 --> 00:20:10.799
And then the files come along, wasting good ammunition shooting

491
00:20:10.799 --> 00:20:14.519
mutos and now they're collecting people to load dystronic

492
00:20:14.519 --> 00:20:17.579
explosives into their last great rocket.

493
00:20:17.640 --> 00:20:19.559
And so everyone is evil.

494
00:20:19.619 --> 00:20:21.779
Is it saying that about World War II then?

495
00:20:21.839 --> 00:20:26.099
No, I don't think it is, but I do think it's Terry Nation's

496
00:20:26.099 --> 00:20:29.880
instinct, you know, like in Blake 7, he wants everything to be

497
00:20:29.880 --> 00:20:31.559
very gun and grim and dark.

498
00:20:31.619 --> 00:20:38.819
And Bob Holmes is not the person to get him to kind of mitigate

499
00:20:38.819 --> 00:20:40.500
that instinct in any way.

500
00:20:40.559 --> 00:20:44.519
But Bob Holmes has a lightness of touch and a great ability at

501
00:20:44.519 --> 00:20:45.180
duality.

502
00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:47.759
So in the darkest moments, you'll throw in a lovely mom.

503
00:20:47.819 --> 00:20:48.839
Like, what, no tea?

504
00:20:48.900 --> 00:20:52.859
But the doctor gets to be funny and our heroes get to be good, but

505
00:20:52.859 --> 00:20:55.140
basically everyone's awful.

506
00:20:55.259 --> 00:20:56.039
I think.

507
00:20:56.099 --> 00:20:57.359
Don't you?

508
00:20:57.420 --> 00:21:00.059
Do you think that by awful, you mean not redeemable?

509
00:21:00.119 --> 00:21:02.640
But horrible people, the whole, everyone's horrible.

510
00:21:02.700 --> 00:21:05.039
As ever, except for as a group.

511
00:21:05.099 --> 00:21:09.960
Actually, if I end up the only irredeemable characters, a Nider

512
00:21:09.960 --> 00:21:11.220
and Davros, as it should be.

513
00:21:11.279 --> 00:21:12.720
No, not necessarily.

514
00:21:12.779 --> 00:21:16.500
So, I mean, I think that Sevron is a nice person.

515
00:21:16.559 --> 00:21:21.720
And then the Kali... that wants to escape with Sarah.

516
00:21:21.779 --> 00:21:24.480
The one who's awfully plumb and very RP.

517
00:21:24.539 --> 00:21:26.039
Dystronic Toxivia.

518
00:21:26.099 --> 00:21:27.900
This is it's so awful, this.

519
00:21:27.960 --> 00:21:30.839
He's the Richard Franklin of season 12, isn't he?

520
00:21:30.900 --> 00:21:33.000
So the doctor meets him, doesn't he?

521
00:21:33.059 --> 00:21:35.400
this one's, yeah, like he meets him.

522
00:21:35.460 --> 00:21:37.140
He's the one who takes him to General Raven.

523
00:21:37.200 --> 00:21:39.960
Somehow he's captured by the files, but we don't actually see that

524
00:21:39.960 --> 00:21:40.380
happen.

525
00:21:40.500 --> 00:21:44.039
And then Sarah's leading out leading the breakout because they

526
00:21:44.039 --> 00:21:46.799
don't want dystronic toxaemia or whatever and they want to

527
00:21:46.799 --> 00:21:47.099
escape.

528
00:21:47.160 --> 00:21:48.299
And so they have to...

529
00:21:48.359 --> 00:21:49.140
And the rocket square.

530
00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:50.039
It will never fly.

531
00:21:50.099 --> 00:21:51.960
It will just cause a huge mess before it goes up.

532
00:21:52.019 --> 00:21:55.140
But they have to, so they climb up the scaffolding.

533
00:21:55.200 --> 00:21:56.640
Which is horrific.

534
00:21:56.700 --> 00:22:01.380
So we're in Ealing Studio suddenly and we're on film and the

535
00:22:01.380 --> 00:22:04.380
camera is slowly panning up.

536
00:22:04.440 --> 00:22:05.519
It's one of the times.

537
00:22:05.579 --> 00:22:06.660
I don't think it's even panning.

538
00:22:06.720 --> 00:22:08.519
It's like actually going up.

539
00:22:08.579 --> 00:22:09.599
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

540
00:22:09.660 --> 00:22:11.819
And the vertiginous scale of that.

541
00:22:11.880 --> 00:22:12.660
Wonderful.

542
00:22:12.720 --> 00:22:16.380
And then people are being shot and falling off the thing.

543
00:22:16.440 --> 00:22:19.740
And there's one utterly, utterly horrifying moment and remind me

544
00:22:19.740 --> 00:22:23.700
why Sarah ever gets in the time I've ever had, whether young, that

545
00:22:23.700 --> 00:22:28.680
young Khaled officer, Sarah can't get her handhold. the young

546
00:22:28.680 --> 00:22:32.460
coloured officer puts his arms around her to support her as she

547
00:22:32.460 --> 00:22:36.960
gets up and then he shot dead and he falls off the thing and you

548
00:22:36.960 --> 00:22:37.680
see him hit the ground.

549
00:22:37.740 --> 00:22:39.599
Yeah, it's all full.

550
00:22:39.660 --> 00:22:40.380
It's so awful.

551
00:22:40.440 --> 00:22:41.880
She screams, he screams.

552
00:22:41.940 --> 00:22:44.039
It's it's horrifying.

553
00:22:44.099 --> 00:22:48.779
And then she falls for the cliffhanger, off the...

554
00:22:48.779 --> 00:22:50.519
For a freeze frame.

555
00:22:50.579 --> 00:22:52.019
First freeze frame, cliffhanger.

556
00:22:52.140 --> 00:22:53.579
Awful, just horrendous.

557
00:22:53.640 --> 00:22:55.319
Now when do I remembered it as a kid?

558
00:22:55.440 --> 00:22:56.700
Yeah, Harold.

559
00:22:56.759 --> 00:22:57.539
How good was it?

560
00:22:57.599 --> 00:23:00.900
That was going about the reprise to episode 3 how she suddenly

561
00:23:00.900 --> 00:23:03.480
falls inside, but she doesn't fall inside.

562
00:23:03.539 --> 00:23:04.380
She just falls on this.

563
00:23:05.400 --> 00:23:06.420
No, it's a cheap.

564
00:23:06.599 --> 00:23:09.660
The platform is hanging outside the scaffold.

565
00:23:09.720 --> 00:23:10.500
It is outside.

566
00:23:10.559 --> 00:23:12.599
Yeah, she's not even winded though.

567
00:23:12.660 --> 00:23:14.519
She's unconscious.

568
00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:17.519
That's pretty weird.

569
00:23:17.519 --> 00:23:20.220
Come on, they shake her and she's, all right, I'll keep climbing

570
00:23:20.220 --> 00:23:20.579
up the thing.

571
00:23:21.059 --> 00:23:23.460
She doesn't even say ow.

572
00:23:23.519 --> 00:23:24.539
She gets to the top.

573
00:23:24.599 --> 00:23:28.859
And then it's like, you know, having to jump over this crevice, you

574
00:23:28.859 --> 00:23:29.700
know, to the other side.

575
00:23:29.759 --> 00:23:32.220
And then that horrible statistic soldier when they actually do

576
00:23:32.220 --> 00:23:35.880
capture the top, then dangles are off the top of the rocket.

577
00:23:35.940 --> 00:23:37.740
Like, I mean, I'm having heart palpitations.

578
00:23:37.799 --> 00:23:39.480
And it's very terry nation dialogue too.

579
00:23:39.539 --> 00:23:42.119
It's that thing, you know, they say that people die before they

580
00:23:42.119 --> 00:23:42.839
hit the ground.

581
00:23:42.900 --> 00:23:44.039
I don't believe that.

582
00:23:44.099 --> 00:23:44.700
Do you?

583
00:23:44.759 --> 00:23:46.200
I mean, it's so sadistic.

584
00:23:46.259 --> 00:23:47.339
It's awful.

585
00:23:47.400 --> 00:23:49.380
Although...

586
00:23:49.440 --> 00:23:52.680
There is one nice thing in that it's nice to see the 2nd instance

587
00:23:52.680 --> 00:23:57.180
of Elizabeth Slayton's wonderful. can't move.

588
00:23:57.599 --> 00:24:00.180
I always love when she does that.

589
00:24:00.240 --> 00:24:01.140
Yes, yes.

590
00:24:01.200 --> 00:24:05.279
Meanwhile, the doctor meets Ronson, the scientist in white, and

591
00:24:05.279 --> 00:24:08.819
Ronson is then convinced by the doctor's use of the word dalek

592
00:24:08.819 --> 00:24:12.480
before Daros is uses Dalek, and so then he talks about getting

593
00:24:12.480 --> 00:24:15.720
them to the citadel to talk to the leaders.

594
00:24:15.779 --> 00:24:17.579
And so in episode three, that happens.

595
00:24:17.579 --> 00:24:20.700
And it just sort of, it's just a cut, like, I mean, you see a bit

596
00:24:20.700 --> 00:24:23.279
of their journey, but then you don't see the initial meeting or

597
00:24:23.279 --> 00:24:24.180
how they get together.

598
00:24:24.240 --> 00:24:25.259
They just are.

599
00:24:25.319 --> 00:24:27.359
And that's one of the things that I find interesting about this

600
00:24:27.359 --> 00:24:30.059
story is that quite often there are these little jumps through

601
00:24:30.059 --> 00:24:30.240
it.

602
00:24:30.299 --> 00:24:33.359
So they reach Councillor Mogrid.

603
00:24:33.420 --> 00:24:35.819
And his associates.

604
00:24:35.880 --> 00:24:40.380
They're all pretty like dull and dying with them like their

605
00:24:40.380 --> 00:24:44.339
moustaches and their hair and their. is so close to Mogadon, isn't

606
00:24:44.339 --> 00:24:44.640
it?

607
00:24:44.700 --> 00:24:48.660
But I do like how Raven now has to be nice to the doctor because

608
00:24:48.660 --> 00:24:50.519
he's got Mogren on the side.

609
00:24:50.579 --> 00:24:54.720
And so Raven's explaining the stuff about the dome and the Raven

610
00:24:54.720 --> 00:24:57.240
takes that very well as he takes a lot of things very well, I

611
00:24:57.240 --> 00:24:58.740
expect, because he's used to following orders.

612
00:24:58.799 --> 00:25:02.220
So just that the doctor is now assumed to be in the pajeminist

613
00:25:02.220 --> 00:25:02.700
hierarchy.

614
00:25:02.819 --> 00:25:06.420
But also, as I said earlier, he's been having his doubts because

615
00:25:06.420 --> 00:25:12.000
his resources keep being taken away and he wants, he is a good

616
00:25:12.000 --> 00:25:14.400
soldier in that he wants to do the best he can do.

617
00:25:14.460 --> 00:25:17.220
And as you said, I'm expected to fight a war without men or a

618
00:25:17.220 --> 00:25:17.519
request.

619
00:25:17.579 --> 00:25:20.940
His primary drive is his internal logic, which I guess is what a

620
00:25:20.940 --> 00:25:21.720
soldier is supposed to be.

621
00:25:22.559 --> 00:25:27.420
Of course, the doctor and Harry have to traverse through Davros

622
00:25:27.420 --> 00:25:28.380
experiments.

623
00:25:28.440 --> 00:25:31.740
And of course, Harry stumbles across the giant plant.

624
00:25:31.799 --> 00:25:33.480
The clam of thrills.

625
00:25:33.480 --> 00:25:36.420
With the wonderful fake rock that the doctor picks up to.

626
00:25:36.480 --> 00:25:40.200
The 2nd worst aquatic giant monster in exist.

627
00:25:40.259 --> 00:25:44.339
Do you know, I learned a new Latin word from this. because I

628
00:25:44.339 --> 00:25:45.480
actually didn't know this before.

629
00:25:45.539 --> 00:25:49.079
So when Harry gets rescued and he goes, oh, you know, why do I

630
00:25:49.079 --> 00:25:51.539
always have to be the one who puts my foot in it in a reference to

631
00:25:51.539 --> 00:25:52.200
Arc in Space.

632
00:25:52.259 --> 00:25:52.740
Yes.

633
00:25:52.740 --> 00:25:54.900
And then he says Magna Polorus.

634
00:25:54.960 --> 00:25:56.940
And the doctor says what?

635
00:25:57.000 --> 00:25:59.819
And he says Latin and the doctor says, never mind the Latin.

636
00:25:59.940 --> 00:26:03.000
Magna pelorus just means giant clam, but I didn't know the word

637
00:26:03.000 --> 00:26:05.519
pelorus in Latin before, and it is feminine.

638
00:26:05.700 --> 00:26:07.680
It's all grammatically correct.

639
00:26:07.740 --> 00:26:08.460
It is.

640
00:26:08.519 --> 00:26:09.000
Thank you.

641
00:26:10.079 --> 00:26:13.319
But then suddenly we're in the thal dome, aren't we?

642
00:26:13.380 --> 00:26:15.839
And it does get rather confusing in the middle of this story.

643
00:26:15.900 --> 00:26:17.339
I'm confused where I'm at.

644
00:26:17.400 --> 00:26:22.259
They move from speaking to the car-led counsellors to, then

645
00:26:22.259 --> 00:26:23.400
they're in the Faldome.

646
00:26:23.460 --> 00:26:27.539
And in the Faldome, we get Davros and Nider.

647
00:26:27.599 --> 00:26:28.319
Yeah, yeah.

648
00:26:28.319 --> 00:26:31.319
Davros and I, and betraying the people by giving the form.

649
00:26:31.440 --> 00:26:36.660
Because Mogadon or whatever his name has ordered Dabros to shut

650
00:26:36.660 --> 00:26:37.920
down his experiments.

651
00:26:37.980 --> 00:26:41.339
So Davros arranges for the dome, which is all where all the

652
00:26:41.339 --> 00:26:43.559
civilians and the politicians are because he's under the dome.

653
00:26:43.680 --> 00:26:45.720
He ranges for the dome to be destroyed.

654
00:26:45.779 --> 00:26:47.759
So that is another quick move, isn't it?

655
00:26:47.819 --> 00:26:51.240
And then we get the doctor, you know, breaking into rescue Sarah

656
00:26:51.240 --> 00:26:54.539
and everyone from their dystronic nightmare.

657
00:26:54.599 --> 00:26:57.960
And he looked, he reminds me of X-Ling in the house.

658
00:26:58.019 --> 00:26:58.859
In that suit.

659
00:26:58.920 --> 00:26:59.519
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

660
00:26:59.579 --> 00:27:01.920
And it's another really effective cliffhanger.

661
00:27:02.039 --> 00:27:04.619
He's being electrocuted and bearing his teeth.

662
00:27:04.680 --> 00:27:07.380
It's Tommy Payne, which happens quite a lot during the Hinchcliffe

663
00:27:07.380 --> 00:27:07.559
era.

664
00:27:07.619 --> 00:27:09.359
We see lots of Tom bearing his teeth in game.

665
00:27:09.420 --> 00:27:10.500
But it's a magic button.

666
00:27:10.559 --> 00:27:12.480
Like, why does that thing have to be electrocuted?

667
00:27:12.539 --> 00:27:14.099
Is it Terry Walsh is the guard?

668
00:27:14.160 --> 00:27:15.000
Who the guard they're going to do?

669
00:27:15.059 --> 00:27:16.019
No, it's not Terry Walsh.

670
00:27:16.079 --> 00:27:16.980
Cherry Walsh will appear later.

671
00:27:17.039 --> 00:27:19.019
He's not done with yet.

672
00:27:19.079 --> 00:27:21.240
But he's just inches towards the button.

673
00:27:21.299 --> 00:27:24.420
The special button, but electrocutes and puts you up against

674
00:27:24.420 --> 00:27:25.079
like...

675
00:27:25.079 --> 00:27:26.759
Yeah, why do they have that button?

676
00:27:26.819 --> 00:27:29.460
It is the bottom of the scaffold, which the prisoner is trying to

677
00:27:29.460 --> 00:27:30.299
escape up earlier.

678
00:27:30.359 --> 00:27:32.160
So maybe they've electrified it.

679
00:27:32.220 --> 00:27:33.059
There you go.

680
00:27:33.119 --> 00:27:33.779
Recon.

681
00:27:33.839 --> 00:27:34.980
Recon is awesome.

682
00:27:35.039 --> 00:27:38.279
Episode 4 is the 1st time we have another female character.

683
00:27:38.400 --> 00:27:40.079
It's our third woman for the year.

684
00:27:40.140 --> 00:27:40.920
Hooray.

685
00:27:41.039 --> 00:27:44.759
And who just happens to suddenly appear and talk to the doctor.

686
00:27:44.759 --> 00:27:47.579
And you're a great fan of...

687
00:27:48.660 --> 00:27:52.200
I think she's really great. she is.

688
00:27:52.259 --> 00:27:57.779
Because it's clear that she is a very junior member of either the

689
00:27:57.779 --> 00:28:00.480
Senate staff or all the army staff, probably armed forces because

690
00:28:00.480 --> 00:28:03.240
she's quite a good fighter later on, but, you know, she's just

691
00:28:03.240 --> 00:28:06.059
hanging around in the background while all the sort of politicians

692
00:28:06.059 --> 00:28:07.920
and whatnot are talking about the dome and she doesn't say

693
00:28:07.920 --> 00:28:10.380
anything until all her bosses leave and she just says to the

694
00:28:10.380 --> 00:28:12.240
doctor, look, there's an amnesty. free to go.

695
00:28:12.299 --> 00:28:15.839
I think that she's a very sympathetic character from the off.

696
00:28:15.839 --> 00:28:21.900
And indeed, because at that point, the doctor and us, the viewer

697
00:28:21.900 --> 00:28:23.759
are worried that Sarah and Harry have been killed.

698
00:28:23.759 --> 00:28:27.059
She's immediately introduced as a companion substitute asking all

699
00:28:27.059 --> 00:28:27.839
the same things as well.

700
00:28:27.900 --> 00:28:30.000
Yes, yes, because the doctor thinks they're both dead.

701
00:28:30.059 --> 00:28:32.220
Yeah, yeah. sent my friends back into that.

702
00:28:32.279 --> 00:28:36.059
The real lack of females really does begin to annoy me and

703
00:28:36.059 --> 00:28:37.200
especially in the elite.

704
00:28:37.259 --> 00:28:37.740
They're all men.

705
00:28:37.799 --> 00:28:39.240
It's ridiculous.

706
00:28:39.299 --> 00:28:42.779
In episode five, they find a lovely new outfit for Sarah in a

707
00:28:42.779 --> 00:28:44.339
cupboard somewhere with some bombs.

708
00:28:44.400 --> 00:28:45.599
Like, who's been wearing that?

709
00:28:45.660 --> 00:28:49.079
Garmin has been relaxing in that after work?

710
00:28:49.140 --> 00:28:50.880
Not only that, but it's green camouflage.

711
00:28:50.940 --> 00:28:53.640
We've already seen that the quarry outside is completely gray.

712
00:28:53.700 --> 00:28:54.720
What is the point?

713
00:28:54.779 --> 00:28:56.160
It's really interesting.

714
00:28:56.220 --> 00:28:59.039
Garmin is in the background for a lot of things up until episode 4

715
00:28:59.039 --> 00:29:02.339
is when he suddenly starts to become involved in the pot.

716
00:29:02.400 --> 00:29:05.099
And I thought he was really much more involved throughout the

717
00:29:05.099 --> 00:29:05.400
whole thing.

718
00:29:05.460 --> 00:29:06.839
No, so it's that.

719
00:29:06.900 --> 00:29:10.259
You know, it's the Holmes thing of splitting it into a four-parter

720
00:29:10.259 --> 00:29:13.319
and a two-parter, and so it's preparing for parts 5 and 6, which

721
00:29:13.319 --> 00:29:14.160
are about the bunker.

722
00:29:14.279 --> 00:29:17.400
Of course, and they get to prepare for parts 5 and 6 by going past

723
00:29:17.400 --> 00:29:20.640
the giant clamps again. poor Elizabeth Sudden has to act her socks

724
00:29:20.640 --> 00:29:21.960
off by shrieking at these things.

725
00:29:22.019 --> 00:29:22.980
They don't even move.

726
00:29:23.279 --> 00:29:25.319
They're the new slither.

727
00:29:25.380 --> 00:29:27.420
They're the new cheaply realised Maya beasts.

728
00:29:27.539 --> 00:29:30.900
And then there's a lot of little moment when Harry crawls into

729
00:29:30.900 --> 00:29:33.420
that tunnel and the doctor and Sarah have this moment.

730
00:29:33.420 --> 00:29:35.579
It's all about, well, what could be at the end of this?

731
00:29:35.579 --> 00:29:39.359
And the doctor says, well, better not tell Harry he's gone first.

732
00:29:39.420 --> 00:29:42.660
And of course, then she climbs in and there's that reaction, just

733
00:29:42.660 --> 00:29:43.740
goes, you know.

734
00:29:43.799 --> 00:29:45.599
Okay, I'm reacting people.

735
00:29:45.660 --> 00:29:47.880
I'm not expressing it over the podcast.

736
00:29:47.940 --> 00:29:50.880
Yeah, and it's just a lovely moment.

737
00:29:50.940 --> 00:29:53.579
It's lovely to have all 3 of them together again. after being

738
00:29:53.579 --> 00:29:53.940
separated.

739
00:29:54.000 --> 00:29:54.480
Yeah.

740
00:29:54.480 --> 00:29:58.559
Plot wise, this story is not really weird. analysing because there

741
00:29:58.559 --> 00:30:01.920
are so many holes you can fall in the larger neighbours of a giant

742
00:30:01.920 --> 00:30:02.279
clam.

743
00:30:02.339 --> 00:30:04.019
It's about the characters.

744
00:30:04.019 --> 00:30:05.160
It's about the relationship.

745
00:30:05.220 --> 00:30:08.460
You know why this story is so strong for me looking back at it

746
00:30:08.519 --> 00:30:12.299
because the doctor is almost ineffectual and in the end, you know

747
00:30:12.299 --> 00:30:13.019
what does he do?

748
00:30:13.079 --> 00:30:14.039
Put it back a 1000 years.

749
00:30:14.099 --> 00:30:15.480
Why did he even bother?

750
00:30:15.539 --> 00:30:18.960
He's so distant from the centre of the plot.

751
00:30:19.079 --> 00:30:21.359
Well, I actually think that's a flaw.

752
00:30:21.420 --> 00:30:25.380
You know, episodes one to four, the Khalid War and stuff, and

753
00:30:25.380 --> 00:30:29.579
that's pretty much put a stop to by the end of episode four, and

754
00:30:29.579 --> 00:30:32.099
episodes 5 and 6 are about what's going on in the bunker.

755
00:30:32.160 --> 00:30:33.839
Politics in the bunker.

756
00:30:33.900 --> 00:30:36.480
It's all about other Dalek's going to be created or not.

757
00:30:36.539 --> 00:30:38.640
It's where the doctor gets to do his one big thing.

758
00:30:38.640 --> 00:30:42.000
And that one big thing is blow up the incubator room.

759
00:30:42.000 --> 00:30:46.140
And I actually kind of like it because in the Somtarin experiment

760
00:30:46.140 --> 00:30:48.660
sort of in the 2nd half of that, the doctor goes straight up to

761
00:30:48.660 --> 00:30:50.099
Stire and confronts him.

762
00:30:50.160 --> 00:30:54.480
Whereas in this, the doctor and Davros are in the same room in, I

763
00:30:54.480 --> 00:30:57.480
think, episode 2 for quite a period of time, but Davros just

764
00:30:57.480 --> 00:31:01.920
completely ignores him, it's like, if this is a Nazi parable to an

765
00:31:01.920 --> 00:31:02.579
extent.

766
00:31:02.640 --> 00:31:06.119
A prisoner of war who's been picked up with no papers is not going

767
00:31:06.119 --> 00:31:07.559
to get to meet Adolf Hitler.

768
00:31:07.619 --> 00:31:12.359
You know, it's through the doctor's various actions in the plot

769
00:31:12.359 --> 00:31:15.839
undermining Dan Ross, making the senators rise up against him

770
00:31:15.839 --> 00:31:17.400
trying to broker a piece.

771
00:31:17.460 --> 00:31:19.680
It's through those actions that he comes to that Ross's

772
00:31:19.680 --> 00:31:19.980
attention.

773
00:31:20.099 --> 00:31:23.940
And I actually quite like that slow build.

774
00:31:24.000 --> 00:31:27.059
You're waiting for them to meet for the whole story because we

775
00:31:27.059 --> 00:31:32.279
keep seeing Davros and Davros' intelligence and cunning then is

776
00:31:32.279 --> 00:31:34.799
not defined by his relationship with the doctor.

777
00:31:34.859 --> 00:31:39.059
He's allowed to be established as a character who is intelligent

778
00:31:39.059 --> 00:31:42.240
or ruthless in his own right, not because he's out to get the

779
00:31:42.240 --> 00:31:48.000
doctor, but because he is so single-minded and determined against

780
00:31:48.000 --> 00:31:50.220
his own people but working for his own people.

781
00:31:50.400 --> 00:31:56.400
And so Todd is this scene in episode 5 that we're about to get to

782
00:31:56.400 --> 00:31:58.019
is that their 1st moment together?

783
00:31:58.079 --> 00:31:59.220
I think so.

784
00:31:59.279 --> 00:32:02.339
When they almost exterminated earlier with the Darling?

785
00:32:02.400 --> 00:32:02.880
Yeah, yeah.

786
00:32:02.940 --> 00:32:05.039
That's what you were talking about before.

787
00:32:05.099 --> 00:32:07.319
Yeah, Davos orders the dialect to exterminate them.

788
00:32:07.380 --> 00:32:08.880
And, yeah, yeah.

789
00:32:08.940 --> 00:32:10.559
Ronson steps in and stops him.

790
00:32:10.619 --> 00:32:13.079
But as you were saying here, we're transitioning to the last 2

791
00:32:13.079 --> 00:32:14.579
part story.

792
00:32:14.640 --> 00:32:17.039
And so we've got the classic nighter.

793
00:32:17.099 --> 00:32:19.319
Well, you could do a bit of me. sorry Thank you.

794
00:32:19.380 --> 00:32:20.279
That's what I wanted to know.

795
00:32:20.339 --> 00:32:21.180
Yes.

796
00:32:21.240 --> 00:32:23.099
Love, and, of course, they're betrayed.

797
00:32:23.160 --> 00:32:25.920
And then, of course, now at the end of this episode, we've got the

798
00:32:25.920 --> 00:32:28.799
Dr. Davos, Sarah and Harry are under interrogation.

799
00:32:28.859 --> 00:32:31.920
So apparently the Daleks invaded Earth in the year 2000.

800
00:32:32.099 --> 00:32:32.640
Do you remember?

801
00:32:33.119 --> 00:32:35.039
just after the Olympics.

802
00:32:35.099 --> 00:32:38.640
Yes, but he also throws in that line that they're defeated by the

803
00:32:38.640 --> 00:32:39.960
Earth's magnetic core.

804
00:32:40.079 --> 00:32:40.559
They're not.

805
00:32:40.619 --> 00:32:42.960
They're def defeated by lovely Barbara Wright.

806
00:32:43.019 --> 00:32:46.859
But also, we now need to remember that.

807
00:32:46.980 --> 00:32:50.400
At the end of the story, things are set back by a 1000 years.

808
00:32:50.460 --> 00:32:52.680
But that's before things are set back.

809
00:32:53.099 --> 00:32:57.180
Maybe we're living in the post-chain, post-time war timeline.

810
00:32:57.240 --> 00:33:01.559
Or the timelordy brain is able to twist facts, just a little bit.

811
00:33:01.619 --> 00:33:03.839
I just think Terry didn't look it up properly.

812
00:33:04.079 --> 00:33:07.559
We haven't got to the virus that decays the...

813
00:33:07.559 --> 00:33:10.619
Well, that's where we're up to. that know that eats the insulation

814
00:33:10.619 --> 00:33:12.240
on the cables on Mars.

815
00:33:12.299 --> 00:33:13.799
That's right.

816
00:33:13.859 --> 00:33:14.579
When is that coming?

817
00:33:14.640 --> 00:33:17.819
Oh, the war fleet of rockets from the planet Hyper.

818
00:33:17.880 --> 00:33:18.359
That's the one.

819
00:33:18.420 --> 00:33:22.140
So we're now in episode five, that interrogation scene that you've

820
00:33:22.140 --> 00:33:25.140
been talking about, which I just think Michael Wisher and Tom

821
00:33:25.140 --> 00:33:25.740
Baker.

822
00:33:25.799 --> 00:33:27.180
It's incredible.

823
00:33:27.299 --> 00:33:30.359
Is this the defining moment of Doctor Who for the 70s when you get

824
00:33:30.359 --> 00:33:31.440
the 2 opposings?

825
00:33:31.500 --> 00:33:32.819
Davros's logic.

826
00:33:33.599 --> 00:33:35.039
At least it's organic and internal.

827
00:33:35.099 --> 00:33:36.119
We may find it flawed.

828
00:33:36.240 --> 00:33:39.299
The Daleks are ultimately a force for good because all opposition

829
00:33:39.299 --> 00:33:41.700
will be wiped out and there will finally be peace.

830
00:33:41.819 --> 00:33:45.480
Well, the difference causes dissension, different causes.

831
00:33:45.539 --> 00:33:46.980
Difference and variation.

832
00:33:47.039 --> 00:33:51.420
Whereas the doctor says difference, et la joie, de viv, differences

833
00:33:51.420 --> 00:33:53.339
the spice of life, and joyousness.

834
00:33:53.400 --> 00:33:55.799
So he's actually the queer friendly character in this, whereas

835
00:33:55.799 --> 00:33:59.460
Davros is the government says you can't have marriage equality

836
00:33:59.519 --> 00:34:03.539
despite his friends. or indeed because of them.

837
00:34:03.599 --> 00:34:07.619
I mean, it is an entire society of men who all live underground

838
00:34:07.619 --> 00:34:10.980
you know, and to march up and down in...

839
00:34:11.039 --> 00:34:11.880
I'm not drawing anything from that.

840
00:34:11.940 --> 00:34:15.000
Harry gets to get in one of those black...

841
00:34:15.059 --> 00:34:15.900
Yeah, he looks great.

842
00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:17.039
Amazing.

843
00:34:17.400 --> 00:34:21.059
Back to the 60s movie and...

844
00:34:21.059 --> 00:34:24.179
Burning Crippers. like, would you care to it?

845
00:34:24.239 --> 00:34:26.519
No, Nathan, does Terry Walsh turn up with garment in this

846
00:34:26.519 --> 00:34:26.699
episode?

847
00:34:26.760 --> 00:34:27.420
Yes.

848
00:34:27.480 --> 00:34:29.880
So Terry Walsh turns up.

849
00:34:29.940 --> 00:34:33.840
He's a car-led scientist, and that's when you find some bombs in a

850
00:34:33.840 --> 00:34:36.420
cupboard and so on with hilarious results. cute togies.

851
00:34:36.480 --> 00:34:38.639
Yes, a new clothes, which is just so convenient.

852
00:34:38.699 --> 00:34:41.219
This helps continuity for the very next story.

853
00:34:41.280 --> 00:34:42.659
When did they have a wash?

854
00:34:42.780 --> 00:34:44.519
That's what worries me.

855
00:34:44.579 --> 00:34:45.719
And it was terry, of course.

856
00:34:45.780 --> 00:34:46.920
Sorry, Terry.

857
00:34:46.980 --> 00:34:49.920
Terry's playing everyone, even in Marta's character here.

858
00:34:49.980 --> 00:34:54.780
No, because Harry hasn't changed clothes since the end of Robots.

859
00:34:54.840 --> 00:34:55.500
Yes, right.

860
00:34:55.559 --> 00:34:59.340
His clothes have frequently seen his muddy, you know, when he's on

861
00:34:59.340 --> 00:35:00.599
location.

862
00:35:00.659 --> 00:35:03.179
And so he must stink like a corpse.

863
00:35:03.239 --> 00:35:04.920
It's outrageous.

864
00:35:04.980 --> 00:35:06.000
We can't get into the Tartars.

865
00:35:06.119 --> 00:35:10.380
Especially considering as according to the later BBC books, he

866
00:35:10.380 --> 00:35:13.260
gets turned into a werewolf between 2 of these stories as well.

867
00:35:13.320 --> 00:35:14.699
That never happened.

868
00:35:14.760 --> 00:35:17.159
We're heading towards the conclusion but we're not there yet.

869
00:35:17.219 --> 00:35:20.099
The time ring, of course, is re-mentioned here.

870
00:35:20.159 --> 00:35:21.719
I love the time ring.

871
00:35:21.780 --> 00:35:23.699
I like the whole concept of the time ring throughout these

872
00:35:23.699 --> 00:35:24.059
stories.

873
00:35:24.119 --> 00:35:26.519
I wanted a time ring when I was there.

874
00:35:26.579 --> 00:35:30.179
Yeah, but it's a piece of lovely 70s copper art. to make it

875
00:35:30.179 --> 00:35:30.420
school.

876
00:35:30.480 --> 00:35:32.039
Oh, you just go anywhere, really?

877
00:35:32.099 --> 00:35:33.179
You didn't need a TARDIS.

878
00:35:33.239 --> 00:35:34.679
You could just use the time ring.

879
00:35:34.739 --> 00:35:37.139
But of course, the end of the episode is, of course, the doctor in

880
00:35:37.139 --> 00:35:40.199
the incubator room trying to do some damage.

881
00:35:40.199 --> 00:35:42.960
And of course, he comes out with the crowded mutant strangling

882
00:35:42.960 --> 00:35:43.139
him.

883
00:35:43.199 --> 00:35:46.559
So can we talk about this because this is iconic, isn't it?

884
00:35:46.619 --> 00:35:49.199
I think it's a reference to the viewers and listeners society.

885
00:35:49.260 --> 00:35:50.639
I think it's meant to be Mary White.

886
00:35:51.059 --> 00:35:53.579
His speech is in episode six.

887
00:35:53.699 --> 00:35:54.539
It's in episode six.

888
00:35:54.599 --> 00:35:54.960
Yeah.

889
00:35:55.019 --> 00:35:57.659
So he's in there to blow up the Daleks and his speech in episode

890
00:35:57.659 --> 00:35:58.500
six.

891
00:36:00.119 --> 00:36:03.059
That's just too creepy.

892
00:36:03.119 --> 00:36:05.940
The speech makes it clear that he'll destroy the Daleks forever.

893
00:36:06.000 --> 00:36:06.719
That what's at stake.

894
00:36:06.780 --> 00:36:08.039
Can I destroy the Daleks?

895
00:36:10.559 --> 00:36:13.860
Well, that's what that's what that's what the doctor said.

896
00:36:13.860 --> 00:36:15.420
That's what he wanted to destroy.

897
00:36:16.800 --> 00:36:21.539
The big moral issue that he raises is a kind of utilitarian one.

898
00:36:21.599 --> 00:36:25.079
So the idea is that an action is good depending on how good its

899
00:36:25.079 --> 00:36:25.980
consequences are.

900
00:36:26.039 --> 00:36:30.000
And because the consequences are in some way incalculable.

901
00:36:30.059 --> 00:36:31.199
You know what I mean?

902
00:36:31.260 --> 00:36:33.239
He can't tell what the consequences are going to be.

903
00:36:33.300 --> 00:36:35.400
He can't bring himself to do it.

904
00:36:35.460 --> 00:36:38.760
And so it's eventually saved from having to make that decision.

905
00:36:38.820 --> 00:36:43.079
But there is a big giant cheek, of course, which is that he just

906
00:36:43.079 --> 00:36:44.760
goes back and does it anyway later.

907
00:36:44.820 --> 00:36:45.659
Yes.

908
00:36:45.659 --> 00:36:49.139
It doesn't destroy the Daleks this time for no readily apparent

909
00:36:49.139 --> 00:36:52.079
reason, and he doesn't have to join the wires together himself

910
00:36:52.079 --> 00:36:54.659
anyway, because a handy Dale comes and does it for him.

911
00:36:54.719 --> 00:36:55.559
Do you know what I mean?

912
00:36:55.619 --> 00:36:58.920
So that is rightly praised, I think, that scene.

913
00:36:58.980 --> 00:37:01.019
It is good and Tom's great in it, don't you?

914
00:37:01.139 --> 00:37:01.860
Yes, definitely.

915
00:37:01.920 --> 00:37:05.880
It makes the decision something really concrete, you know, by

916
00:37:05.880 --> 00:37:08.400
having the 2 bits of wine that the doctor has to join together

917
00:37:08.400 --> 00:37:12.480
giving him a positive visible action that you can see him tending

918
00:37:12.480 --> 00:37:18.300
towards doing. you know, is perfect, but it doesn't really quite

919
00:37:18.300 --> 00:37:20.940
work and it is a little bit of a cheat.

920
00:37:21.000 --> 00:37:24.599
And it's Sarah is the one who is saying, no, you have to do it.

921
00:37:24.659 --> 00:37:27.719
And interestingly, she says, you have to complete your mission for

922
00:37:27.719 --> 00:37:28.739
the timelords.

923
00:37:28.800 --> 00:37:34.500
At 1st she appeals with, if you like, the humanitarian side of it

924
00:37:34.500 --> 00:37:35.760
like the Daleks are evil.

925
00:37:35.820 --> 00:37:37.559
There are no redeeming features about them.

926
00:37:37.619 --> 00:37:38.219
What have you?

927
00:37:38.280 --> 00:37:42.420
But I find it very interesting that she views it as a matter of

928
00:37:42.420 --> 00:37:44.039
just following orders.

929
00:37:44.159 --> 00:37:47.460
Well, don't you think that by then she's just throwing anything at

930
00:37:47.460 --> 00:37:49.860
him, do you know what I mean, to get him to do it?

931
00:37:49.920 --> 00:37:51.840
Like, she just wants to get him to do it.

932
00:37:51.840 --> 00:37:53.760
Yeah. home.

933
00:37:53.820 --> 00:37:58.139
She's had such a torrid timing the last few weeks.

934
00:37:58.199 --> 00:38:01.800
She just wants to kill a race. a little bit better.

935
00:38:02.880 --> 00:38:05.460
I think we've all had those like that.

936
00:38:05.519 --> 00:38:09.780
I think, though, we've also glossed over the fact that that speech

937
00:38:09.780 --> 00:38:13.679
is a response to the discussion earlier.

938
00:38:13.739 --> 00:38:18.360
Imagine if you had created in your lab in your laboratory, a virus

939
00:38:18.360 --> 00:38:21.360
so contagious in it, an infectious that it killed immediately on

940
00:38:21.360 --> 00:38:23.460
contact, would you allow its use?

941
00:38:23.519 --> 00:38:26.820
Now there, the doctor is likening the daleks to the virus.

942
00:38:26.880 --> 00:38:30.840
But when he has the power to kill them all, he is the virus.

943
00:38:30.900 --> 00:38:35.219
Well, he likens them to a child, in fact, when he...

944
00:38:35.219 --> 00:38:36.420
Could you kill that child?

945
00:38:37.079 --> 00:38:37.619
as well.

946
00:38:37.679 --> 00:38:42.659
You know that speech is so much engrained in fan lore and fan

947
00:38:42.659 --> 00:38:48.300
thinking that it was written into a backbencher under Tony Blair's

948
00:38:48.300 --> 00:38:50.820
speech in the 90s?

949
00:38:50.940 --> 00:38:54.119
Yeah, I think I remember hearing about it that often announced it

950
00:38:54.119 --> 00:38:54.780
in Parliament.

951
00:38:54.840 --> 00:38:58.139
So we're rapidly heading towards the conclusion of the story and

952
00:38:58.139 --> 00:39:02.579
Space Betan is back and she's ready to blow up the corridor, so

953
00:39:02.579 --> 00:39:05.280
the doctor cannot get out of the bunker.

954
00:39:05.340 --> 00:39:08.880
See, I think she's like Jenny from Dalek Invasion of Earth, which

955
00:39:08.880 --> 00:39:10.019
is why I hate Earth.

956
00:39:10.079 --> 00:39:15.059
So she's the mean one who won't allow us just 15 minutes to get

957
00:39:15.059 --> 00:39:18.239
you know, our friends out of the bunker because she's so crazy.

958
00:39:18.300 --> 00:39:21.780
But she's quite, they're not quite good technology because they've

959
00:39:21.780 --> 00:39:24.539
got that special scanner that can penetrate through and see what's

960
00:39:24.539 --> 00:39:28.380
going on in that. give you a monochrome video signal. very crisp.

961
00:39:28.440 --> 00:39:30.420
It's a bit crummy, isn't it?

962
00:39:30.480 --> 00:39:34.199
Because they kind of realise that our heroes need to know that

963
00:39:34.199 --> 00:39:37.679
Davros and Nada have been killed and that the Daleks have taken

964
00:39:37.679 --> 00:39:41.039
over, but none of them can possibly be present in that scene

965
00:39:41.039 --> 00:39:42.360
because they would all be killed.

966
00:39:42.420 --> 00:39:45.780
So they just watch it all on various videos, which is really

967
00:39:45.780 --> 00:39:46.320
awful.

968
00:39:46.380 --> 00:39:50.280
And then the other really terrible terri nation plot device is

969
00:39:50.280 --> 00:39:53.340
when Tom drops the fluid link during the scuffle.

970
00:39:53.400 --> 00:39:57.780
And the time ring...

971
00:39:57.780 --> 00:40:01.920
Oh, that was... during the scuffle and then they can't escape from

972
00:40:01.920 --> 00:40:02.400
the room.

973
00:40:02.460 --> 00:40:07.199
So it's sort of delaying tactics and sort of slightly ham-fisted

974
00:40:07.199 --> 00:40:07.920
plotting, I think.

975
00:40:07.980 --> 00:40:12.239
So you're saying that despite Terry Nation slash Robert Holmes

976
00:40:12.239 --> 00:40:16.260
writing this story, those Terry Nations. is still underlying.

977
00:40:16.380 --> 00:40:18.480
There's still plenty of terry nationness to it.

978
00:40:18.539 --> 00:40:23.159
And, you know, you, I used to think this story was really

979
00:40:23.159 --> 00:40:23.880
overrated.

980
00:40:23.940 --> 00:40:27.119
I don't now. you know, having watched it in context.

981
00:40:27.179 --> 00:40:30.780
I think it's amazing and it's full of just incredible performances

982
00:40:30.780 --> 00:40:32.639
Dudley Simpsons on fire for it.

983
00:40:32.699 --> 00:40:35.639
You know, just everything comes together.

984
00:40:35.880 --> 00:40:39.840
And my objections to it would be that, I think it's probably too

985
00:40:39.840 --> 00:40:44.460
horrible for Doctor Who, but that's not a massive objection.

986
00:40:44.519 --> 00:40:48.960
But it is still tarry nation with all the attendant problems that

987
00:40:48.960 --> 00:40:49.860
entails.

988
00:40:49.920 --> 00:40:54.420
I like a lot of the minor performances in this by the supporting

989
00:40:54.420 --> 00:40:54.900
characters.

990
00:40:54.960 --> 00:40:58.260
Severon in particular, who Sarah thanks at one point after they

991
00:40:58.260 --> 00:40:59.579
escape and then he's back at the end.

992
00:40:59.639 --> 00:41:02.340
He's just there, you know, and I think he does a really good job.

993
00:41:02.400 --> 00:41:04.500
Garmin, I'm not that impressed with.

994
00:41:04.559 --> 00:41:08.099
I think his lisp in particular comes through and I actually think

995
00:41:08.099 --> 00:41:10.079
he's playing. isn't he?

996
00:41:10.139 --> 00:41:11.219
With that hair.

997
00:41:11.280 --> 00:41:15.599
Anyway, I just don't I think he's actually pretty...

998
00:41:15.659 --> 00:41:16.679
Rod thinks he's pretty.

999
00:41:16.739 --> 00:41:18.599
I think he didn't say that.

1000
00:41:18.599 --> 00:41:25.079
He's very average and he's like an acting ability will a peer.

1001
00:41:25.139 --> 00:41:29.880
I'm sorry I actually like going as the human face.

1002
00:41:29.940 --> 00:41:30.900
He is kind of the side.

1003
00:41:30.960 --> 00:41:33.599
He is one side of that conflict in those last 2 episodes.

1004
00:41:33.659 --> 00:41:34.559
He is important to the story.

1005
00:41:34.619 --> 00:41:37.619
He's a little bit famous 5 though, let's be honest.

1006
00:41:37.679 --> 00:41:38.159
Yeah.

1007
00:41:38.159 --> 00:41:39.599
And of course, Sam...

1008
00:41:39.599 --> 00:41:40.739
So that must have a choice.

1009
00:41:40.800 --> 00:41:41.460
You say that?

1010
00:41:41.460 --> 00:41:42.480
like it's a bad thing.

1011
00:41:42.539 --> 00:41:46.500
And then, of course, at the end, we've got time ring and out and

1012
00:41:46.500 --> 00:41:49.860
we get to see them spinning on the floor of the studio, is it?

1013
00:41:49.920 --> 00:41:51.659
The doctor's line there too.

1014
00:41:51.780 --> 00:41:55.860
I know out of their evil must come something good, like the last

1015
00:41:55.860 --> 00:41:58.980
great time war in which a whole bunch of people, including

1016
00:41:58.980 --> 00:42:00.000
everyone on Galafra.

1017
00:42:00.059 --> 00:42:01.199
Actually, that is pretty good, isn't it?

1018
00:42:01.320 --> 00:42:03.539
Somewhere in he said anything.

1019
00:42:03.599 --> 00:42:06.780
Somewhere in his youth or childhood, he must have done something

1020
00:42:06.780 --> 00:42:07.559
good.

1021
00:42:07.619 --> 00:42:09.719
But it is, again, in my burglar.

1022
00:42:09.780 --> 00:42:13.500
It's the dance at the end of 7th seal, and I love it for that.

1023
00:42:13.559 --> 00:42:15.059
I think it's pretty much flawless.

1024
00:42:15.119 --> 00:42:18.300
I don't care that there are plot holes you can dive for starship

1025
00:42:18.300 --> 00:42:19.139
through. great.

1026
00:42:19.199 --> 00:42:21.119
Look, I found it really enjoyable.

1027
00:42:21.179 --> 00:42:23.940
I think it's excellent It's not going to be my top favourite thing

1028
00:42:23.940 --> 00:42:24.420
ever.

1029
00:42:24.480 --> 00:42:27.480
But it's certainly, you know, of a very high quality.

1030
00:42:27.539 --> 00:42:28.260
Yeah.

1031
00:42:28.260 --> 00:42:31.079
Do you know Michael Wisher wasn't the 1st casting of Devros.

1032
00:42:31.139 --> 00:42:34.260
He's just around because he'd just done the previous story and

1033
00:42:34.260 --> 00:42:35.460
he'd done Dalek voices.

1034
00:42:35.519 --> 00:42:39.119
I would love to know who was the 1st casting of Davros.

1035
00:42:39.179 --> 00:42:40.079
Unless City Kendall.

1036
00:42:40.139 --> 00:42:40.679
Thank you.

1037
00:42:40.739 --> 00:42:41.940
It's all I needed to know.

1038
00:42:42.000 --> 00:42:44.460
It's not in the, it's not in the show notes.

1039
00:42:44.460 --> 00:42:47.099
And I, it's so far, and I have researched it.

1040
00:42:47.159 --> 00:42:49.860
No one can tell who was actually 1st cast.

1041
00:42:49.920 --> 00:42:51.539
Just before we finish up.

1042
00:42:51.599 --> 00:42:54.960
I foreshadowed that I had a Liz Sladen story.

1043
00:42:55.019 --> 00:42:57.599
If you watch the making of documentary on the Genesis of the

1044
00:42:57.599 --> 00:43:02.519
Daleks DVD, it features an interview with Visbeth Sladen.

1045
00:43:02.579 --> 00:43:03.239
Oh, yeah.

1046
00:43:03.239 --> 00:43:07.320
And the interview was conducted by Ian Levine, who produced the

1047
00:43:07.320 --> 00:43:08.039
whole documentary.

1048
00:43:08.159 --> 00:43:08.760
It's very well done.

1049
00:43:08.820 --> 00:43:13.199
But he includes a blooper at the end, which makes fun of him a

1050
00:43:13.199 --> 00:43:17.460
little, because you hear Ian Levine's voice off camera asking, Liz

1051
00:43:17.460 --> 00:43:20.639
can I just ask you, why is it that halfway through this horrible

1052
00:43:20.639 --> 00:43:22.619
story about war where you're being hunted down?

1053
00:43:22.679 --> 00:43:24.059
Do you find another outfit?

1054
00:43:24.480 --> 00:43:30.960
And Liz Leyden replies with something... reminds something I'm

1055
00:43:30.960 --> 00:43:31.440
going off.

1056
00:43:31.500 --> 00:43:35.099
Oh, Ian, you try running about in the same clothes for 4 weeks

1057
00:43:35.099 --> 00:43:35.340
darling.

1058
00:43:35.400 --> 00:43:37.079
With a darling up your ass.

1059
00:43:37.199 --> 00:43:40.019
This is the actual word she uses.

1060
00:43:52.739 --> 00:43:57.539
Well, that's all the extended time we have for Genesis of the

1061
00:43:57.539 --> 00:44:02.460
Daleks, but the Nerva Beacon Story Arc ends next week.

1062
00:44:02.519 --> 00:44:03.840
Sorry, did I say beacon?

1063
00:44:03.900 --> 00:44:05.639
I don't know why I could have said beacon.

1064
00:44:05.699 --> 00:44:09.960
So we head back to the space station for Revenge of the Sidemen.

1065
00:44:10.019 --> 00:44:13.559
Until then, do please find us at flightthroughentirety.com, flight

1066
00:44:13.559 --> 00:44:15.780
through entirety on Facebook and iTunes.

1067
00:44:15.840 --> 00:44:18.539
You expected me to say something there, but I'm not going to

1068
00:44:18.539 --> 00:44:20.340
because I think you'll ride a robot now.

1069
00:44:20.400 --> 00:44:22.199
Please review.

1070
00:44:22.260 --> 00:44:24.360
We won't shut up until you do.

1071
00:44:24.420 --> 00:44:26.820
Or FTE podcast on Twitter.

1072
00:44:26.880 --> 00:44:29.579
Until then, thank you very much for listening and good night.

1073
00:44:29.639 --> 00:44:30.360
Good night.

1074
00:44:30.420 --> 00:44:31.440
Good everything.

1075
00:44:31.500 --> 00:44:33.059
I'm exhausted.

1076
00:44:34.559 --> 00:44:36.960
Explains your costume change.

1077
00:44:38.460 --> 00:44:42.840
That was Flight through Entirety with Todd BLB, Nathan Boffinley

1078
00:44:42.840 --> 00:44:44.460
Brendan Jones and Richard Stone.

1079
00:44:44.519 --> 00:44:48.659
This episode, Bring Back the Dravens, was recorded on Sunday, June

1080
00:44:48.659 --> 00:44:49.320
14th.

1081
00:44:49.380 --> 00:44:52.199
The next episode will be released on the 19th of July.

1082
00:44:52.260 --> 00:44:55.320
If you had a potentially spoilerific discussion during your

1083
00:44:55.320 --> 00:44:57.840
podcast recording, Would you allow its use?

1084
00:44:57.900 --> 00:44:58.500
Well, I have.

1085
00:44:58.559 --> 00:45:00.780
So if you want to avoid spoilers, press stop now.

1086
00:45:04.260 --> 00:45:08.940
Yeah, and also I gather I know nothing else about this, but

1087
00:45:08.940 --> 00:45:13.139
apparently Peter Capaldi's doctor will be faced with that decision

1088
00:45:13.139 --> 00:45:14.219
at some point this year.

1089
00:45:14.340 --> 00:45:18.480
He'll have to decide whether to wear that horrible black and white

1090
00:45:18.480 --> 00:45:21.420
polka dotted shirt from Kill the Moon again. correct.

1091
00:45:21.539 --> 00:45:25.440
Or just take Jenna Coleman between his thumb and forefinger.

1092
00:45:25.500 --> 00:45:27.239
No, no, squish her hands.

1093
00:45:27.300 --> 00:45:29.880
Apparently, there is a storyline this year based around.

1094
00:45:29.940 --> 00:45:33.539
If you were told a child was completely equal.

1095
00:45:33.599 --> 00:45:34.679
Could you then kill that child?

1096
00:45:34.739 --> 00:45:36.780
Oh, so Stephen Moffatt.

1097
00:45:36.840 --> 00:45:39.059
I'm certain I reckon I could.

1098
00:45:39.119 --> 00:45:40.019
What do you reckon?

1099
00:45:40.079 --> 00:45:40.800
Can we just have a moment?

1100
00:45:40.860 --> 00:45:43.199
I just want to put money down for the dear listener.

1101
00:45:43.260 --> 00:45:44.639
You can put this at the end if you like.

1102
00:45:44.760 --> 00:45:48.719
But I reckon that the companion for Missy will be another version

1103
00:45:48.719 --> 00:45:49.739
of...

1104
00:45:49.739 --> 00:45:51.900
Sarah Jane Smith.

1105
00:45:51.960 --> 00:45:53.039
No, I'd like to say that.

1106
00:45:53.099 --> 00:45:55.920
Well, I do think that the casting of Jenna Coleman, she's meant to

1107
00:45:55.920 --> 00:45:59.039
be the Sarah Jane for the 21st century, and not just in looks, but

1108
00:45:59.039 --> 00:46:02.699
in background, and okay, she's a school teacher and a nanny, but

1109
00:46:02.699 --> 00:46:04.320
she's meant to be Sarah Jane.

1110
00:46:04.380 --> 00:46:07.079
Oh, yeah, yeah, very much so.

1111
00:46:07.139 --> 00:46:10.440
No, I think I think that we'll get another we'll get another Clara

1112
00:46:10.440 --> 00:46:13.199
in one of her other incarnations through the time stream.