WEBVTT NOTE This transcript was created on 2026-05-04 at 16:08:26 1 00:00:28.980 --> 00:00:34.259 Hello, dear listeners, and welcome to Flightthrow Entirety, the 2 00:00:34.259 --> 00:00:37.560 only Doctor Who podcast to have worked with Professor Stein before 3 00:00:37.560 --> 00:00:39.060 he died, and then we stopped. 4 00:00:39.119 --> 00:00:40.380 I'm Brendan. 5 00:00:40.439 --> 00:00:41.939 I'm Nathan. 6 00:00:42.000 --> 00:00:46.200 I was going to say I'm the faceless ones in a 3D sauna that I'm 7 00:00:46.200 --> 00:00:46.920 really just stunned. 8 00:00:48.780 --> 00:00:52.619 And I think we're all going to be stunned as we head into some 9 00:00:52.619 --> 00:00:56.579 wonderful CSO video model work in Nightmare of Eden. 10 00:01:05.819 --> 00:01:10.200 It's, um, it's Bob Baker solo after the great divorce. 11 00:01:10.260 --> 00:01:12.900 That's a video I never, ever want to see. 12 00:01:12.959 --> 00:01:16.439 It's like 1979's worst album release ever. 13 00:01:16.980 --> 00:01:19.980 But it turns out... for cleaning that up. 14 00:01:20.040 --> 00:01:20.340 Yeah. 15 00:01:20.340 --> 00:01:26.400 It does turn out that Dave Martin was to blame for everything. 16 00:01:26.459 --> 00:01:28.799 Yeah, but they can actually write. 17 00:01:28.859 --> 00:01:30.900 This isn't surprisingly good. 18 00:01:30.959 --> 00:01:34.680 There was a lot of reworking on the studio floor. 19 00:01:34.739 --> 00:01:39.840 Lewis Fianders brilliant interpretation of our Brendan. 20 00:01:39.959 --> 00:01:44.040 And he threw that in, as you know, on the floor to lighten up the 21 00:01:44.040 --> 00:01:44.280 mood. 22 00:01:44.340 --> 00:01:45.540 There's some great. 23 00:01:45.540 --> 00:01:46.079 It's terrible. 24 00:01:46.140 --> 00:01:47.280 Yeah, really. 25 00:01:47.280 --> 00:01:48.480 He's nearly wrecked. 26 00:01:48.540 --> 00:01:51.239 And yet some of the best model effects shot in one of the worst 27 00:01:51.239 --> 00:01:54.180 manners you could possibly do that blew the budget. 28 00:01:54.239 --> 00:02:01.140 It has... a nice, tight, and an, interesting script. 29 00:02:01.200 --> 00:02:02.099 It has some terrific. 30 00:02:02.159 --> 00:02:03.239 Hello, David Dacre. 31 00:02:03.299 --> 00:02:07.560 It has some terrific actors, a guest artist, and we can thank Alan 32 00:02:07.560 --> 00:02:08.819 Bromley for the casting. 33 00:02:08.879 --> 00:02:11.639 Yeah, and we can also thank Conor Bromley for a lot of other 34 00:02:11.639 --> 00:02:12.300 things, can't we? 35 00:02:12.360 --> 00:02:14.939 Alan Bromley being for the listener at home who's never bothered 36 00:02:14.939 --> 00:02:17.280 to watch this and you don't need to if we'll talk to us talking 37 00:02:17.280 --> 00:02:17.699 about it. 38 00:02:17.759 --> 00:02:18.719 The director. 39 00:02:18.780 --> 00:02:21.719 And he also directed one of my all-time favies. 40 00:02:21.780 --> 00:02:27.360 The time was a potato man meets mediaeval beak noises. which also 41 00:02:27.360 --> 00:02:28.319 featured David Dacre. 42 00:02:28.379 --> 00:02:32.580 Alan Bromley have a, he had the tendency to just kind of down 43 00:02:32.580 --> 00:02:34.080 tools and walk off the set. 44 00:02:34.139 --> 00:02:35.219 Not exactly. 45 00:02:35.280 --> 00:02:36.060 It's strange. 46 00:02:36.120 --> 00:02:38.099 He was sort of this contradiction in that he was a very old school 47 00:02:38.099 --> 00:02:41.819 director and by this point he was semi-retired. was in his 60s. 48 00:02:41.879 --> 00:02:44.039 We're talking Ali Pali era. 49 00:02:44.099 --> 00:02:45.419 Right, directing, yeah. 50 00:02:45.479 --> 00:02:50.699 But at the same time, he was very dynamic in the sense that he was 51 00:02:50.699 --> 00:02:54.599 changing things after a week's rehearsal on the studio floor. 52 00:02:54.659 --> 00:02:57.060 And that was the main thing that caused tension between himself 53 00:02:57.060 --> 00:02:59.580 and the other actors, and particularly Tom. 54 00:02:59.639 --> 00:03:05.340 It didn't make sense that an old TV director who cut his teeth in 55 00:03:05.340 --> 00:03:09.659 the early days of BBC and therefore knew that everything is 56 00:03:09.659 --> 00:03:14.639 immobile except the upper 3rd of the actor's face because that's 57 00:03:14.639 --> 00:03:15.900 all you can move. 58 00:03:15.960 --> 00:03:16.439 No, it's true. 59 00:03:16.500 --> 00:03:18.840 That's why Billy used to wave the hands is because I can't move 60 00:03:18.840 --> 00:03:19.379 from my shot. 61 00:03:19.439 --> 00:03:20.580 Your mark is your mark. 62 00:03:20.639 --> 00:03:22.740 And we'll get to that a bit later, weren't we, when a certain 63 00:03:22.740 --> 00:03:23.939 thing happened on the studio floor? 64 00:03:24.000 --> 00:03:24.539 Indeed. 65 00:03:24.539 --> 00:03:25.439 About marks? 66 00:03:26.759 --> 00:03:31.379 But it makes no sense to me why he was at cross purposes with his 67 00:03:31.379 --> 00:03:31.979 own intentions. 68 00:03:32.039 --> 00:03:33.120 And you get that. 69 00:03:33.240 --> 00:03:36.240 Do you think that's why this story should be good and isn't good? 70 00:03:36.300 --> 00:03:37.500 We've got to that already. 71 00:03:37.560 --> 00:03:41.759 The odd thing is, I've Surprise, surprise, deal, listen, I've 72 00:03:41.759 --> 00:03:42.419 always rather enjoyed this one. 73 00:03:42.479 --> 00:03:48.900 And when I was learning about the directorial problems, which you 74 00:03:48.900 --> 00:03:54.300 can see in the info text on the DVD, I was quite amazed because I 75 00:03:54.300 --> 00:03:58.740 don't see say that much wrong with the direction as we sometimes 76 00:03:58.740 --> 00:04:03.240 get in the 1980s where it's just a matter of, okay, Peter, Janet 77 00:04:03.240 --> 00:04:06.780 Mark, you've got one minute to do this 3 minute scene, go, we'll 78 00:04:06.780 --> 00:04:07.319 cut as we go. 79 00:04:07.379 --> 00:04:11.159 I don't get that same sense here, but maybe that's down to the 80 00:04:11.159 --> 00:04:12.960 cast kind of going. 81 00:04:13.020 --> 00:04:16.079 We can't allow these problems behind the scenes to come across on 82 00:04:16.079 --> 00:04:16.439 screen. 83 00:04:16.560 --> 00:04:19.079 And I'm just going to go on record as saying I actually really 84 00:04:19.079 --> 00:04:20.459 like Trist's accent. 85 00:04:20.519 --> 00:04:21.959 Gosh, it's terrible. 86 00:04:22.019 --> 00:04:25.379 It's this sort of some Peter Sellers thing that he's got going 87 00:04:25.800 --> 00:04:27.180 deliberately thinks that's funny. 88 00:04:27.240 --> 00:04:29.819 But do you know why he did it? 89 00:04:29.879 --> 00:04:33.000 Yeah, because they were all having such miserable time in 90 00:04:33.000 --> 00:04:36.300 rehearsal because Bromley was really cantankerous and angry and he 91 00:04:36.300 --> 00:04:37.259 shouldn't have been brought back. 92 00:04:37.319 --> 00:04:40.019 It was kind of a favour from Williams, wasn't it, too? 93 00:04:40.019 --> 00:04:41.399 Keep getting moving. 94 00:04:41.399 --> 00:04:42.600 So what he was... 95 00:04:42.660 --> 00:04:43.500 Yeah. 96 00:04:43.500 --> 00:04:46.439 So Fiander was doing it to make the rest of the class. 97 00:04:46.500 --> 00:04:48.540 Just make everyone laugh because Brombie was just being a 98 00:04:48.540 --> 00:04:48.839 monster. 99 00:04:48.899 --> 00:04:51.899 And yes, as you say, notes coming down from the control room 100 00:04:51.899 --> 00:04:52.319 constantly. 101 00:04:52.379 --> 00:04:54.120 Yeah, you know, can you change this? 102 00:04:54.180 --> 00:04:57.480 But another reason Lewis founder did that accent or what he said 103 00:04:57.480 --> 00:05:02.459 in later years was that he read the script and found out, spoiler 104 00:05:02.459 --> 00:05:04.620 alert, dear listeners, he's one of the villains at the end. 105 00:05:04.920 --> 00:05:11.100 And he thought, you know what, if I make myself ridiculous, it 106 00:05:11.100 --> 00:05:13.379 will be a surprise to the viewer when I'm revealed as a villain. 107 00:05:13.439 --> 00:05:16.379 Yeah, but he... 108 00:05:16.379 --> 00:05:17.279 It's extremely terrible. 109 00:05:17.339 --> 00:05:20.220 I don't know whether we've mentioned this before, but Douglas 110 00:05:20.220 --> 00:05:24.839 Adams has this thing that he says about the problem with the way 111 00:05:24.839 --> 00:05:26.879 that actors respond to a script that's funny. 112 00:05:26.939 --> 00:05:31.860 And he thinks comedy should be played straight. that makes it more 113 00:05:31.860 --> 00:05:32.279 effective. 114 00:05:32.339 --> 00:05:34.319 In the pirate planet, for instance. 115 00:05:34.379 --> 00:05:35.699 There's all these jokes and things. 116 00:05:35.759 --> 00:05:38.639 And then we discovered that this massive atrocity is happening and 117 00:05:38.639 --> 00:05:42.180 all of these worlds are being destroyed and the jokes and the 118 00:05:42.180 --> 00:05:45.060 horror of that kind of work really well together. 119 00:05:45.120 --> 00:05:48.000 And it's a very Adams way of writing, actually. 120 00:05:48.120 --> 00:05:50.459 Yeah, it's an interesting that they held it over for the next 121 00:05:50.459 --> 00:05:50.819 season. 122 00:05:50.879 --> 00:05:54.480 But that you create you make jokes to increase the dichotomy and 123 00:05:54.480 --> 00:05:55.800 therefore the tension when it's released. 124 00:05:55.860 --> 00:06:01.319 But what he, what Adams always says is that when actors see that 125 00:06:01.319 --> 00:06:04.259 then they come in and do funny voices and funny walks and that 126 00:06:04.259 --> 00:06:06.240 kind of thing and just undermine it completely. 127 00:06:06.300 --> 00:06:09.720 And I just think that Fi Anders thing is the absolute canonical 128 00:06:09.720 --> 00:06:10.740 example of that. 129 00:06:10.800 --> 00:06:15.420 It really, really a shame, and it just renders every scene that 130 00:06:15.420 --> 00:06:18.480 he's in sort of distractingly kind of ridiculous. 131 00:06:18.600 --> 00:06:19.740 Wow. 132 00:06:19.800 --> 00:06:21.600 Yeah, no, I'm very cross about it. 133 00:06:21.600 --> 00:06:25.740 Because like you, I actually think that this is really good. 134 00:06:25.800 --> 00:06:31.199 And I think it displays some of the Baker and Martin problems, but 135 00:06:31.199 --> 00:06:34.800 it doesn't fall into the trap that they usually fall into. 136 00:06:34.860 --> 00:06:37.740 So I think the problem is the characters are all sort of rather 137 00:06:37.740 --> 00:06:41.100 broadly drawn and sort of fairly terrible. 138 00:06:41.160 --> 00:06:45.240 But the Baker and Martin problem of coming up with, you know, an 139 00:06:45.240 --> 00:06:48.839 idea and then abandoning it after 5 to 7 minutes only to run after 140 00:06:48.839 --> 00:06:52.740 a new shiny idea, which was really, really evident in, say 141 00:06:52.740 --> 00:06:53.759 Armageddon factor. 142 00:06:53.819 --> 00:06:57.779 Here, I think there's three main ideas, and they're all linked, and 143 00:06:57.779 --> 00:07:01.319 they're all kind of involved in the plot, and they all resolve 144 00:07:01.319 --> 00:07:03.060 themselves at more or less the same time. 145 00:07:03.120 --> 00:07:08.339 And I don't know whether that's just because Bob Baker's having a 146 00:07:08.339 --> 00:07:11.699 good day or whether it's the influence of Douglas Adams, because 147 00:07:11.699 --> 00:07:14.279 Douglas Adams is someone who plots things. 148 00:07:14.339 --> 00:07:17.819 You know, you kind of think of him as a fairly shambolic writer 149 00:07:17.819 --> 00:07:20.879 and you've got hitchhikers, which is famous for being made up 150 00:07:20.879 --> 00:07:24.420 while the actors are in the other room, you know, waiting for 151 00:07:24.420 --> 00:07:25.620 their lines to appear. 152 00:07:25.680 --> 00:07:30.600 But his books are really tightly plus. ploss You can see the way 153 00:07:30.600 --> 00:07:33.360 the man's mind worked and what it was was over. 154 00:07:33.360 --> 00:07:36.779 And again, everyone gives Joss Whedon the credits for story arcing 155 00:07:36.779 --> 00:07:41.040 in the meeting, but it's actually atoms with hitchhikers and now 156 00:07:41.040 --> 00:07:41.759 with Doctor Who. 157 00:07:41.819 --> 00:07:44.160 This whole season has a thread we touched on last time. 158 00:07:44.220 --> 00:07:48.600 And the individual against order, if you like, against boredom 159 00:07:48.600 --> 00:07:49.800 capitalism, whatever you want to call it. 160 00:07:49.860 --> 00:07:52.379 It's all dovetotals, beautifully. 161 00:07:52.439 --> 00:07:57.600 This one, again, is really nicely arcing Adam's feel, and you can 162 00:07:57.600 --> 00:08:01.680 follow those threads you're talking about through how this flows. 163 00:08:01.740 --> 00:08:05.279 And there's a very dark and real, not say dark, it's just truthful 164 00:08:05.279 --> 00:08:07.199 concept of how drugs are bad. 165 00:08:07.500 --> 00:08:09.060 They are. 166 00:08:09.120 --> 00:08:12.360 And just, and it shows me how things fall apart. 167 00:08:12.420 --> 00:08:14.339 The David Dacre character is the linchpin of that. 168 00:08:14.399 --> 00:08:16.259 And he plays it for real. 169 00:08:16.319 --> 00:08:18.480 Yeah, it's it's, it doesn't. 170 00:08:18.540 --> 00:08:20.399 Well, he doesn't... 171 00:08:20.459 --> 00:08:24.720 The rule one of drugs on TV is everyone on TV has much better 172 00:08:24.720 --> 00:08:29.699 drugs than you because like no one ever behaves on drugs like they 173 00:08:29.699 --> 00:08:31.139 behave on drugs on television. 174 00:08:31.199 --> 00:08:34.740 We haven't seen what drugs or zip as it was called. 175 00:08:34.799 --> 00:08:37.080 We haven't seen what Redstone actually can do that. 176 00:08:37.139 --> 00:08:40.620 And if you've seen, you know, television or crystal method. 177 00:08:40.679 --> 00:08:42.179 That's actually over. 178 00:08:42.299 --> 00:08:43.799 Yeah, I think he underplays a high. 179 00:08:43.860 --> 00:08:47.519 Well, that's the thing is what, you know, he plays what we would 180 00:08:47.519 --> 00:08:50.399 see, someone as having been on very hard drugs for a very long 181 00:08:50.399 --> 00:08:51.240 time coming down. 182 00:08:51.299 --> 00:08:53.159 Well, we don't have time to do that in Doctor Who. 183 00:08:53.220 --> 00:08:58.320 So we have this space drug which gives you 150000 hits all at once 184 00:08:58.320 --> 00:09:00.960 and then the and then the resulting withdrawal. 185 00:09:01.019 --> 00:09:02.460 Not the internet, really. 186 00:09:02.519 --> 00:09:04.620 Popularity on the internet. 187 00:09:04.679 --> 00:09:08.940 So, you know, it's not necessarily a gritty, realistic portrayal 188 00:09:08.940 --> 00:09:12.299 of drugs, but it's as realistic portrayal of drugs as Doctor Who 189 00:09:12.299 --> 00:09:12.659 can do. 190 00:09:12.720 --> 00:09:14.519 And that scene where he attacks Romana. 191 00:09:14.580 --> 00:09:19.799 It is harrowing and both actors are playing it incredibly well. 192 00:09:19.860 --> 00:09:24.120 A few weeks ago, I criticised Lala's reaction to the Daleks as 193 00:09:24.120 --> 00:09:27.179 being a bit too scared, but I think Romana plays the fear in that 194 00:09:27.179 --> 00:09:28.379 scene very well. 195 00:09:28.440 --> 00:09:32.279 She's kind of doing the thing that we credit Elizabeth Sladen a 196 00:09:32.279 --> 00:09:34.500 lot for, you know, being scared and being brave at the same time 197 00:09:34.500 --> 00:09:38.639 because she knows that she has to do this scientific gobbledygook 198 00:09:38.639 --> 00:09:38.879 thing. 199 00:09:38.940 --> 00:09:42.419 And that's her that's her driving force in the scene and this is 200 00:09:42.419 --> 00:09:43.080 her obstacle. 201 00:09:43.139 --> 00:09:47.820 But for once, you know, as we've come to expect Romana just sort 202 00:09:47.820 --> 00:09:52.320 of brushing aside anything that's far too dull and uninteresting 203 00:09:52.320 --> 00:09:52.620 for her. 204 00:09:52.679 --> 00:09:55.679 She's like, no, I actually have to deal with this real world thing 205 00:09:55.679 --> 00:09:56.340 that's happening. 206 00:09:56.399 --> 00:10:03.000 And it's it's quite interesting that Romona, with all her power as 207 00:10:03.000 --> 00:10:06.360 a time lord, that she's demonstrated in all of her stories up and 208 00:10:06.360 --> 00:10:09.659 down to this point, she doesn't get herself out of that 209 00:10:09.659 --> 00:10:10.620 situation. 210 00:10:10.679 --> 00:10:15.059 And it's kind of sending the message that there are dangerous 211 00:10:15.059 --> 00:10:18.899 situations in the real world, which you may get yourself into 212 00:10:18.899 --> 00:10:20.700 trouble too, if you approach. 213 00:10:20.759 --> 00:10:23.759 You know, if she hadn't, say, just karate chopped him in the neck 214 00:10:23.759 --> 00:10:26.039 you could see that as irresponsible, because that's kind of saying 215 00:10:26.039 --> 00:10:28.379 to children, well, if someone's acting manic, you know, just 216 00:10:28.379 --> 00:10:31.559 karate chopped them in the neck, whereas actually Romana's like 217 00:10:31.559 --> 00:10:36.299 I'm trying to avoid this terrible situation and gets rescued by 218 00:10:36.299 --> 00:10:40.919 Jeffrey Hinsliff as Fisk, who at one point calls Trist Fisk. 219 00:10:40.980 --> 00:10:47.220 And it's, it is this kind of strange, very real danger in the 220 00:10:47.220 --> 00:10:50.759 middle of this story about polycyrene monsters who crumble and 221 00:10:50.759 --> 00:10:52.919 turn into analylicit substance. 222 00:10:52.980 --> 00:10:56.820 So terrifying they couldn't be seen on the photo shoot. 223 00:10:56.879 --> 00:10:57.779 That's right. 224 00:10:57.840 --> 00:10:58.139 Yes. 225 00:10:58.740 --> 00:11:03.000 Before we go to that, we're talking about verisimilitude within 226 00:11:03.000 --> 00:11:04.139 performances, aren't we? 227 00:11:04.200 --> 00:11:05.159 within the narrative. 228 00:11:05.220 --> 00:11:08.879 And look, I'm sort of in the middle, literally at this table as 229 00:11:08.879 --> 00:11:11.639 well, but thinking that, yeah, I can see where they're going with 230 00:11:11.639 --> 00:11:14.700 this, and certainly when I was young, thinking again, 1st time 231 00:11:14.700 --> 00:11:17.100 watching this, which is always the freshest interpretation. 232 00:11:17.159 --> 00:11:18.480 I got that too. 233 00:11:18.539 --> 00:11:23.159 But in the end, it was really about Cantel, mostly, that's 234 00:11:23.159 --> 00:11:24.299 actually what the drug shoot. 235 00:11:24.360 --> 00:11:26.340 And it was originally going to be called zip, the episode, but 236 00:11:26.340 --> 00:11:29.340 Lala and Williams thought that that was actually making drugs to 237 00:11:29.340 --> 00:11:30.360 his too cool. 238 00:11:30.419 --> 00:11:33.539 I think this narrative, like you're saying, Brendan, really, really 239 00:11:33.539 --> 00:11:36.779 achieves its end far greater than Nancy Reagan ever could, because 240 00:11:36.779 --> 00:11:41.580 it makes drugs look not just utterly uncle, but kind of something 241 00:11:41.580 --> 00:11:43.860 you just don't really want to get involved with because it just 242 00:11:43.860 --> 00:11:44.820 looks a little bit messy. 243 00:11:44.879 --> 00:11:46.440 What did you think? 244 00:11:46.500 --> 00:11:48.899 I think it's a strange place for Doctor Who to go. 245 00:11:48.960 --> 00:11:52.019 And it's something that it doesn't really do again. 246 00:11:52.080 --> 00:11:55.379 And I think it is a bit heavy handed. 247 00:11:55.440 --> 00:11:58.320 And I'm not sure that element of the plot really works. 248 00:11:58.379 --> 00:12:04.259 I'm not quite sure who offscreen is drunking people's drinks and 249 00:12:04.259 --> 00:12:04.860 why. 250 00:12:04.919 --> 00:12:06.240 So... 251 00:12:06.240 --> 00:12:07.559 I always assumed it was Trist. 252 00:12:07.620 --> 00:12:13.019 Yeah, so David Dacre gets a dose intended for Romana. 253 00:12:13.080 --> 00:12:13.379 Yes. 254 00:12:13.379 --> 00:12:16.620 And the co-pilot or the navigator in episode one. 255 00:12:16.679 --> 00:12:19.200 Oh, he's being drunk, so they cause the crash. 256 00:12:19.259 --> 00:12:21.360 No, no, he hasn't been drugged. 257 00:12:21.419 --> 00:12:22.559 He is taking the drug. 258 00:12:22.620 --> 00:12:23.879 Like he has his own supply. 259 00:12:23.940 --> 00:12:25.259 Oh okay. 260 00:12:25.320 --> 00:12:27.419 Which he possibly got from Trist. 261 00:12:27.480 --> 00:12:29.100 It's never confirmed one way or the other. 262 00:12:29.159 --> 00:12:32.879 Yeah, see, there is some slack slackness to that part. 263 00:12:32.940 --> 00:12:34.500 And we shouldn't be having to sit here and puzzle that out. 264 00:12:34.559 --> 00:12:35.759 That stuff should be obvious. 265 00:12:35.820 --> 00:12:37.559 I mean, it's not as entertaining as funny. 266 00:12:37.559 --> 00:12:42.120 Felicity Kendall's, you know, entomological love child is actually 267 00:12:42.120 --> 00:12:44.340 the one slipping them everything, don't you think? 268 00:12:44.399 --> 00:12:45.480 It's not really about that. 269 00:12:45.539 --> 00:12:47.639 It's not it's not the unicorn the wasp. 270 00:12:47.700 --> 00:12:48.840 It's just, that was fun. 271 00:12:48.899 --> 00:12:51.720 You're looking for a mystery thing going on, okay. 272 00:12:51.779 --> 00:12:52.919 What was the drug in that tea? 273 00:12:53.580 --> 00:12:58.379 Well, I want to know why it's called Raxoan instead of Raxoan as 274 00:12:58.379 --> 00:13:01.080 well, because clearly it's like space heroin, isn't it? 275 00:13:01.139 --> 00:13:02.100 But it was it. 276 00:13:02.100 --> 00:13:04.799 Yeah, I know, but they call it Rexuan. 277 00:13:04.860 --> 00:13:07.019 There is a reference to zip. 278 00:13:07.080 --> 00:13:09.360 Like XYP is the fungus that it comes from. 279 00:13:09.480 --> 00:13:11.940 That was how it was sort of going to be referred to. 280 00:13:12.000 --> 00:13:15.240 I just realised that means the mandrals are fungal creatures. 281 00:13:15.299 --> 00:13:16.320 They are. 282 00:13:16.379 --> 00:13:18.840 They had those huge moustaches. 283 00:13:18.899 --> 00:13:21.539 I actually thought it was a statement, a really prescient 284 00:13:21.539 --> 00:13:24.779 statement on the drug culture coming up in the 80s because they 285 00:13:24.779 --> 00:13:27.179 all look like Freddie Mercury plush toys. 286 00:13:27.240 --> 00:13:30.480 I actually think it's just really damp on Eden and they're not 287 00:13:30.480 --> 00:13:33.059 very careful with their personal hygiene that would be. 288 00:13:33.179 --> 00:13:36.059 Well, they were originally scripted as mud monsters. 289 00:13:36.120 --> 00:13:38.159 You know, and then that was changed. 290 00:13:38.220 --> 00:13:39.179 What do you think of them? 291 00:13:39.240 --> 00:13:40.500 I think they're terribly cute. 292 00:13:40.559 --> 00:13:42.480 They are very... 293 00:13:42.480 --> 00:13:43.620 You do want to hug them, don't you? 294 00:13:43.740 --> 00:13:46.320 Yeah, they're terribly sweet Which is good in a way because 295 00:13:46.320 --> 00:13:47.279 they're not evil. 296 00:13:47.399 --> 00:13:48.179 No. 297 00:13:48.179 --> 00:13:51.059 You know, they're just beasts. 298 00:13:51.120 --> 00:13:52.620 I think a big problem with that. 299 00:13:52.620 --> 00:13:55.679 Like mini moustachioed tall things were in the late 70s. 300 00:13:55.740 --> 00:13:58.620 Including, yeah, most of the crew on their ship. 301 00:13:58.679 --> 00:13:59.940 There is that flavour. 302 00:14:00.000 --> 00:14:05.100 But Alan Bromley has no hint of being theatrically minded in other 303 00:14:05.100 --> 00:14:05.279 ways. 304 00:14:05.340 --> 00:14:08.340 I think that's just the look at the time. 305 00:14:08.399 --> 00:14:14.159 I think a big problem with the mandrels is in episodes 2 and 3 306 00:14:14.159 --> 00:14:18.899 when we're wandering about the Eden projection or we see them in 307 00:14:18.899 --> 00:14:20.220 the matter interfaces. 308 00:14:20.279 --> 00:14:23.279 We get the Terrence Dix, Robert Holmes approach of, you know, we 309 00:14:23.279 --> 00:14:26.279 see a claw or we see a close-up of an eye or we see this or we see 310 00:14:26.279 --> 00:14:26.460 that. 311 00:14:26.519 --> 00:14:28.860 It's rather undermined by the fact that the end of episode one, we 312 00:14:28.860 --> 00:14:32.519 see one leaning through a hole going, waving its arms. 313 00:14:32.580 --> 00:14:33.120 Yes. 314 00:14:33.120 --> 00:14:36.659 In fact, that's a terrible episode one. monster a bit. the round 315 00:14:36.659 --> 00:14:37.019 window. 316 00:14:37.080 --> 00:14:41.100 No, no, because they cut the hole in the thing for no readily 317 00:14:41.100 --> 00:14:41.700 apparent reason. 318 00:14:41.759 --> 00:14:43.440 It comes out in roars. 319 00:14:43.500 --> 00:14:46.139 Then next week we have the reprise and they go, oh, we'll seal 320 00:14:46.139 --> 00:14:48.419 that hole up again and so they just seal it up immediately. 321 00:14:48.480 --> 00:14:51.840 And I don't think we've seen them before. 322 00:14:51.899 --> 00:14:54.299 You know, we've heard them growl before, but we haven't had the 323 00:14:54.299 --> 00:14:57.360 whole bit by bit by bit like you do in, say, terror of the 324 00:14:57.360 --> 00:14:57.960 zygobs. 325 00:14:58.019 --> 00:15:00.059 It's just, and a monster cave. 326 00:15:00.539 --> 00:15:02.759 Well, I think they're sweet. 327 00:15:02.820 --> 00:15:07.259 I love it when the doctor uses his little sonic whistle and they 328 00:15:07.259 --> 00:15:10.980 do little groaning sweet groaning. 329 00:15:11.639 --> 00:15:12.539 Pine pipes them, yeah. 330 00:15:12.600 --> 00:15:13.860 And there's lots of underplays. 331 00:15:13.919 --> 00:15:16.440 Some of the best lines were cut out, probably as they will be from 332 00:15:16.440 --> 00:15:18.240 most of our podcasts, gentle listener. 333 00:15:18.299 --> 00:15:21.659 You know, when Romana's chomping on an Apple in that scene, you 334 00:15:21.659 --> 00:15:23.519 know, and Tom looks at her and says best not to look what happened 335 00:15:23.519 --> 00:15:24.360 last time. 336 00:15:24.419 --> 00:15:27.360 Well, fuff that line. why they cut it out. 337 00:15:27.419 --> 00:15:30.539 Don't you find that Della and Stott, who is what, Jennifer 338 00:15:30.539 --> 00:15:32.159 Lonsdale and a bloke? 339 00:15:32.220 --> 00:15:33.480 Barry Andrews? 340 00:15:33.539 --> 00:15:34.019 That Q? 341 00:15:34.080 --> 00:15:34.740 Barry Andrew. 342 00:15:34.799 --> 00:15:36.120 We're actually pretty good. 343 00:15:36.179 --> 00:15:38.220 I used to love the best the best. 344 00:15:38.279 --> 00:15:38.879 This is the problem. 345 00:15:38.940 --> 00:15:40.259 You're pitching for realism. 346 00:15:40.320 --> 00:15:43.980 And then you're kind of pitching for Panto Doctor Who, Quantil. 347 00:15:44.039 --> 00:15:46.440 You've got them in the same frame, though. 348 00:15:46.500 --> 00:15:49.919 Yeah, it's it's going to end, it's always going to end up with the 349 00:15:49.919 --> 00:15:52.919 same squeaking sound that deck chairs on the Titanic make, don't 350 00:15:52.919 --> 00:15:53.100 you? 351 00:15:53.159 --> 00:15:56.879 So yeah, can we talk about the Quantel paint box theme? 352 00:15:56.940 --> 00:15:57.419 Please. 353 00:15:57.480 --> 00:15:58.500 Ter exciting. 354 00:15:58.559 --> 00:16:01.620 I actually think that it's some of the most successful bits in the 355 00:16:01.620 --> 00:16:01.980 episode. 356 00:16:02.100 --> 00:16:04.620 Like the opening scene with those models. 357 00:16:04.679 --> 00:16:05.820 I think the models look quite good. 358 00:16:05.879 --> 00:16:08.039 They were beautiful and they cost a lot. 359 00:16:08.100 --> 00:16:09.840 It looks like gold. 360 00:16:09.899 --> 00:16:12.539 Do you remember the Blake 7 episode gold, which has sort of 361 00:16:12.539 --> 00:16:14.519 similar sort of model work. wonderful. 362 00:16:14.639 --> 00:16:16.620 Is that your pick of the week? 363 00:16:16.919 --> 00:16:20.759 And like the video effects are really great and then the unstable 364 00:16:20.759 --> 00:16:22.500 matter interfaces look really good. 365 00:16:22.559 --> 00:16:27.059 There's that fantastic cliffhanger to episode three. 366 00:16:27.120 --> 00:16:28.919 When they walk through... 367 00:16:28.919 --> 00:16:30.000 When Tom gets dissolved. 368 00:16:30.059 --> 00:16:31.440 Yeah, when he disappeared. 369 00:16:31.500 --> 00:16:32.820 That's another course. great. 370 00:16:32.879 --> 00:16:34.620 It's those 2 big things. 371 00:16:34.679 --> 00:16:37.080 So we look at that now and go, oh, yeah, that's, you know, it's 372 00:16:37.080 --> 00:16:40.620 nicely done, but that was a massive wow back in the day. 373 00:16:40.679 --> 00:16:43.379 We hadn't seen it, and it took them forever to shoot that. 374 00:16:43.440 --> 00:16:46.200 So kudos, I guess, to Bromley for getting that right. 375 00:16:46.259 --> 00:16:50.279 No, particularly the aversion that he showed to proper effects of 376 00:16:50.279 --> 00:16:51.899 any kind in the previous way. 377 00:16:52.620 --> 00:16:54.360 I think, yeah, I think there was a whole lot. 378 00:16:54.419 --> 00:16:56.700 Well, you know that some of this direction we're praising was 379 00:16:56.700 --> 00:16:59.340 actually Graham Williams when you came down onto the studio. 380 00:16:59.399 --> 00:17:00.120 Yes, indeed. 381 00:17:00.179 --> 00:17:01.980 Just another word on that Quantel. 382 00:17:02.039 --> 00:17:05.640 It's kind of what goes around, comes around because the Quantel 383 00:17:05.640 --> 00:17:07.980 machine they were using was designed for picture and picture and 384 00:17:07.980 --> 00:17:08.640 news broadcast. 385 00:17:08.759 --> 00:17:11.640 Amy Stewart was designed for Amy Stewart wearing a carnival 386 00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:13.440 pretzel. 387 00:17:13.440 --> 00:17:16.859 It came out just a few months before from Berlin. 388 00:17:16.920 --> 00:17:21.960 But how they achieved the effects we see in Nightmare of Eden is 389 00:17:21.960 --> 00:17:27.839 similar to how Bernard Lodge achieved the 1st 3 Doctor Who title 390 00:17:27.839 --> 00:17:28.680 sequences. 391 00:17:28.740 --> 00:17:33.119 They fed the input back in on the machine and it then degraded and 392 00:17:33.119 --> 00:17:36.900 degraded and degraded as with the Hartnell Trout and Pertwee 393 00:17:36.900 --> 00:17:37.980 opening titles. 394 00:17:38.160 --> 00:17:40.980 I thought you were going to say as the quality of the narrative 395 00:17:40.980 --> 00:17:41.519 also. 396 00:17:41.579 --> 00:17:43.440 Bernard Lodge is not actually a person, it's a place. 397 00:17:44.039 --> 00:17:49.079 It's just a drug fuelled ghetto where Delia Derbyshire would sit 398 00:17:49.079 --> 00:17:52.140 and chew away on bits of piano wire, and that's why her teeth were 399 00:17:52.140 --> 00:17:52.559 so awful. 400 00:17:52.680 --> 00:17:55.259 And all those other young people just get up there and that's what 401 00:17:55.259 --> 00:17:58.500 this story is about, this story is about young creatives getting 402 00:17:58.500 --> 00:18:01.559 into Bernard Lodge and ruining their future careers. 403 00:18:01.680 --> 00:18:04.740 By taking zip, by by by chewing on a zip. 404 00:18:04.799 --> 00:18:05.279 That's right. 405 00:18:05.339 --> 00:18:09.240 Speaking of which, the mandrills, I think the zip is actually 406 00:18:09.240 --> 00:18:12.779 named after that extraordinary feature on the back of the mandrill 407 00:18:12.779 --> 00:18:15.000 costume, which is constantly invisible. 408 00:18:15.059 --> 00:18:16.200 Thank you for raising that. 409 00:18:16.259 --> 00:18:20.220 There's a bit of a theme of hilariously and non-metaphorically 410 00:18:20.220 --> 00:18:22.380 splitting your trousers this season. 411 00:18:22.380 --> 00:18:24.839 As we get it in this one. 412 00:18:24.900 --> 00:18:28.980 Well, there's a whole lot of, what's Mr. Adams trying to tell us? 413 00:18:29.039 --> 00:18:29.700 What's Duggo? 414 00:18:29.819 --> 00:18:33.960 I'm trying to tell us about bum flashing in this season. 415 00:18:34.019 --> 00:18:35.460 I think he's forum. 416 00:18:35.519 --> 00:18:36.660 Yeah, generally. 417 00:18:36.720 --> 00:18:41.880 I wonder if it's a subtle comment on state of play, BBC 418 00:18:41.880 --> 00:18:42.480 generally. 419 00:18:42.539 --> 00:18:45.420 Well, in just 2 years time, of course, he will flash his own bum 420 00:18:45.420 --> 00:18:47.220 in Hitchhiker's Guy into the Galaxy. 421 00:18:47.279 --> 00:18:47.819 Bad, actually. 422 00:18:47.940 --> 00:18:49.799 Yeah, you know, I think he was this big chap. 423 00:18:49.859 --> 00:18:50.579 He had been a bouncer. 424 00:18:50.640 --> 00:18:54.480 He had been terribly fit before the before the fun of the 70s got 425 00:18:54.480 --> 00:18:54.900 to him. 426 00:18:54.960 --> 00:18:58.440 He never stopped having fun and that's why we had him for such 427 00:18:58.440 --> 00:18:59.099 little time. 428 00:18:59.279 --> 00:19:01.980 It's great sadness, isn't it? 429 00:19:02.039 --> 00:19:04.140 Well, a great deal of alcohol and cigarettes. 430 00:19:04.200 --> 00:19:08.700 Yeah, but we say fun. combined with just a chronic inability to 431 00:19:08.700 --> 00:19:09.779 get anything finished. 432 00:19:09.839 --> 00:19:13.259 It just means that all we have are the 5 hitchhikers novels and 433 00:19:13.259 --> 00:19:17.220 2.5 dirk gently, well, 2 and a quarter, 2 and a 8. 434 00:19:17.220 --> 00:19:18.240 And they rise. 435 00:19:18.299 --> 00:19:19.920 But, you know, on paper, you're right. 436 00:19:19.980 --> 00:19:22.980 But I actually think he got more finished than we generally give 437 00:19:22.980 --> 00:19:25.559 credit and you can see it in the way this season unfolds. 438 00:19:25.619 --> 00:19:29.099 And the fact that the last episodes invisible, last story is 439 00:19:29.099 --> 00:19:29.640 invisible. 440 00:19:29.640 --> 00:19:32.099 It's very Douglas Adams in itself, isn't it? 441 00:19:32.160 --> 00:19:37.799 Douglas Adams did actually have an overarching set of themes. 442 00:19:37.859 --> 00:19:39.900 And I'm not saying it was conscious, and I'm certainly not saying 443 00:19:39.900 --> 00:19:40.680 it was even worked out. 444 00:19:40.740 --> 00:19:44.880 What I am saying is he's so clever. that unconsciously, if you 445 00:19:44.880 --> 00:19:47.880 like, he's spinning this out and it does come together because 446 00:19:47.880 --> 00:19:51.180 truly, truly clever creative people are doing this on many levels 447 00:19:51.180 --> 00:19:51.660 at once. 448 00:19:51.720 --> 00:19:54.000 And I think that's in the end why we love him. 449 00:19:54.059 --> 00:19:57.000 He's giving us more that we can even coming back 30 something 450 00:19:57.000 --> 00:19:57.599 years later. 451 00:19:57.660 --> 00:20:00.660 We can still find these new threads, these new surprises. 452 00:20:00.720 --> 00:20:05.099 You know who in the modern era reminds me a bit of Douglas, and 453 00:20:05.099 --> 00:20:07.079 certainly not in terms of the content he produces? 454 00:20:07.140 --> 00:20:08.940 Quentin Tarantino? 455 00:20:09.000 --> 00:20:14.579 Because Quentin Tarantino has really quite a small repertoire. 456 00:20:14.640 --> 00:20:14.940 Yes. 457 00:20:15.000 --> 00:20:18.660 And, you know, he does have his constant themes and I'm not saying 458 00:20:18.660 --> 00:20:20.940 I'm necessarily a fan of all his work. 459 00:20:20.940 --> 00:20:25.019 But like Douglas, he has his own vision and he sticks to that 460 00:20:25.019 --> 00:20:25.200 vision. 461 00:20:25.319 --> 00:20:27.900 This is where it could get violent. 462 00:20:27.960 --> 00:20:32.220 Yes, indeed. speaking Tarantino, he's like, I find Tarantino 463 00:20:32.220 --> 00:20:36.480 monstrously violent, and he is Asperge, and he's kind of, he's 464 00:20:36.480 --> 00:20:38.579 pretty much admitted his mother talked about it, that he would 465 00:20:38.579 --> 00:20:40.500 just sit and stare at films and write them down. 466 00:20:40.559 --> 00:20:42.960 He just refilms other films, but I find his violence 467 00:20:42.960 --> 00:20:44.220 indigestible. 468 00:20:44.279 --> 00:20:47.460 And that's exactly what Douglas is against. 469 00:20:47.519 --> 00:20:49.740 Sono thematically, you're talking about threads. 470 00:20:49.799 --> 00:20:51.960 I see what you're saying, but it's an interesting person to bring 471 00:20:51.960 --> 00:20:55.140 up because they are diametrically opposed. absolutely. 472 00:20:55.200 --> 00:20:56.700 Yeah, I'm, I am not... 473 00:20:56.700 --> 00:20:59.099 It's like saying the Black Guardian's a little more, actually 474 00:20:59.099 --> 00:21:01.500 Black Guardian is probably more fun than the white Guardian, as 475 00:21:01.500 --> 00:21:02.220 often the case. 476 00:21:02.279 --> 00:21:04.799 Can we talk about the CET machine? 477 00:21:06.180 --> 00:21:08.099 An interesting idea. 478 00:21:08.160 --> 00:21:12.180 So, oh, yes, I love going to space 1979 land. 479 00:21:12.240 --> 00:21:13.380 Yeah. 480 00:21:13.380 --> 00:21:15.000 So I think... 481 00:21:15.000 --> 00:21:19.500 Look, it's the it's a sort of the miniscope's non-Mexican Union 482 00:21:19.500 --> 00:21:20.519 equivalent, isn't it? 483 00:21:20.579 --> 00:21:25.559 Like it was a great idea back when Bob Holmes had it in the mid 484 00:21:25.559 --> 00:21:26.460 70s. 485 00:21:26.519 --> 00:21:31.319 But I think that there are moments where it threatens to derail it 486 00:21:31.319 --> 00:21:31.680 as well. 487 00:21:31.740 --> 00:21:33.240 I think it's really incompetently done. 488 00:21:33.299 --> 00:21:35.460 And I think there are scenes that would have been just 489 00:21:35.460 --> 00:21:36.480 spectacular. 490 00:21:36.539 --> 00:21:40.619 Like the Cliffhanger to episode two, had it been well realised. 491 00:21:40.740 --> 00:21:45.240 So the CET machine is basically, you know, like a bit of a picture 492 00:21:45.240 --> 00:21:47.579 frame surrounding half of the studio. 493 00:21:47.579 --> 00:21:51.960 And as Richard points out, it's just they drop in sort of film 494 00:21:51.960 --> 00:21:55.019 insets of planets from Space Night. 495 00:21:56.160 --> 00:21:56.640 Yes. 496 00:21:56.640 --> 00:22:02.160 Except for Eden, which is just... like really shockingly bad. 497 00:22:02.220 --> 00:22:05.519 And not for a 2nd does it look like a screen and there's no sort 498 00:22:05.519 --> 00:22:06.599 of video effects over it. 499 00:22:06.660 --> 00:22:11.039 And so it's absolutely no surprise at all when they leap over that 500 00:22:11.039 --> 00:22:13.559 tiny bit of wall and end up in Eden. 501 00:22:13.619 --> 00:22:15.480 And it's quite a well acted cliffhanger. 502 00:22:15.539 --> 00:22:18.539 You've got Roman going, we'll be torn apart, doing like more 503 00:22:18.539 --> 00:22:21.960 acting in one line than Mary did in... 504 00:22:22.259 --> 00:22:28.259 And all of that, you know, like the sting comes in before we cut 505 00:22:28.259 --> 00:22:30.720 to the credits, all of that sort of thing. really, really good. 506 00:22:30.779 --> 00:22:33.779 But it just never convinces for a second. 507 00:22:33.839 --> 00:22:35.579 And there's that other scene. 508 00:22:35.640 --> 00:22:38.099 And I was mystified by this for years. 509 00:22:38.160 --> 00:22:40.200 She's standing in front of the projection. 510 00:22:40.259 --> 00:22:41.880 She's idly playing with the machine. 511 00:22:41.940 --> 00:22:45.059 She stands in front of the Eden projection, and a little video 512 00:22:45.059 --> 00:22:48.839 blip thing, comes out and hits her on the neck and she falls down 513 00:22:48.839 --> 00:22:53.220 and I had no idea what that was meant to be until I read the 514 00:22:53.220 --> 00:22:54.000 novelisation. 515 00:22:54.059 --> 00:22:56.579 It's an insect lying out of the projection. 516 00:22:56.700 --> 00:22:59.640 Yeah, and it's meant to inform the audience that things can get 517 00:22:59.640 --> 00:22:59.880 out. 518 00:22:59.940 --> 00:23:01.859 But it's incomprehensible. 519 00:23:01.920 --> 00:23:02.339 Yeah, exactly. 520 00:23:02.400 --> 00:23:06.299 And even Bob Baker on the DVD says, you know, that's what I wrote 521 00:23:06.299 --> 00:23:08.759 into the script and they had to make it into a video effect. 522 00:23:08.819 --> 00:23:10.740 And I understand why they did that, but you lose the meaning. 523 00:23:10.799 --> 00:23:13.259 The other thing with that cliffhanger. 524 00:23:13.319 --> 00:23:17.700 In the script, when they jump across the threshold, they don't 525 00:23:17.700 --> 00:23:18.839 just land in Eden. 526 00:23:18.900 --> 00:23:20.220 They are torn apart. 527 00:23:20.339 --> 00:23:23.700 And that is the cliffhanger that they vanish the way Tom vanishes 528 00:23:23.700 --> 00:23:24.480 at the end of M3. 529 00:23:24.599 --> 00:23:25.380 That would have been good. 530 00:23:25.440 --> 00:23:29.339 And then at the top of the episode three, they just reappear in 531 00:23:29.339 --> 00:23:34.859 Eden and the sort of falling action of the tension is that that's 532 00:23:34.859 --> 00:23:36.240 just how you get into the projection. 533 00:23:36.299 --> 00:23:39.059 You know, it dissolves you like a transporter, but with the viewer 534 00:23:39.059 --> 00:23:39.480 don't know that. 535 00:23:39.839 --> 00:23:43.740 I still like the idea that if it had been a convincing screen. 536 00:23:43.799 --> 00:23:45.839 If we'd thought for a 2nd it was a screen. 537 00:23:45.960 --> 00:23:49.440 Yeah, having the doctor and Omana jump into a television screen 538 00:23:49.440 --> 00:23:52.619 and end up on television would have been just terrific. 539 00:23:52.680 --> 00:23:55.500 You know what I think would have been a wonderful way to do it 540 00:23:55.500 --> 00:23:58.680 would be at some point to have filmed that screen from the side. 541 00:23:58.740 --> 00:24:01.740 And so when they jump in, they just don't, you don't see them come 542 00:24:01.740 --> 00:24:02.339 out the other side. 543 00:24:02.400 --> 00:24:04.859 So it's the ultimate flat screen. 544 00:24:04.920 --> 00:24:07.200 The original idea was, you know, they would disappear in a 545 00:24:07.200 --> 00:24:10.200 maelstrom and you'd hear them screaming and that would be the 546 00:24:10.200 --> 00:24:12.359 cliffhanger and unfortunately, you know, we would have just had 547 00:24:12.359 --> 00:24:14.880 Tom saying, oh, my arms, my legs, my everything. 548 00:24:14.940 --> 00:24:17.519 Oh I quite like that. 549 00:24:17.579 --> 00:24:20.039 So do I. It's totally stupid. 550 00:24:20.160 --> 00:24:23.880 It is sort of preempted by the fact that he's wearing a different 551 00:24:23.880 --> 00:24:28.920 jacket this episode and it's his stunt being torn apart on Eden 552 00:24:28.920 --> 00:24:32.700 jacket so that he still has the nice jacket for subsequent 553 00:24:32.700 --> 00:24:33.000 stories. 554 00:24:33.059 --> 00:24:37.140 Romana's costume on the other hand, isn't it dreadful? 555 00:24:37.200 --> 00:24:39.180 The most horrific thing she ever wears. 556 00:24:39.240 --> 00:24:41.579 It's like a maternity file. 557 00:24:41.700 --> 00:24:43.140 It is a monster game. 558 00:24:43.200 --> 00:24:46.680 I am a child of the 70s, and I have to say she's right up to the 559 00:24:46.680 --> 00:24:49.140 thumping minute in fashionability there. 560 00:24:49.200 --> 00:24:51.180 No, actually it's rather lovely. 561 00:24:51.240 --> 00:24:54.180 It's look at Carly Simon's album covers around the time. 562 00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:54.960 Look at... 563 00:24:54.960 --> 00:24:58.319 I will say it looks wonderful when she's running because of course 564 00:24:58.319 --> 00:24:59.640 in Doctor Who... 565 00:24:59.700 --> 00:25:02.579 Yeah, in Doctor Who for running, you have to run very slowly. 566 00:25:02.640 --> 00:25:07.319 So the dress gives an indication of extra movement, you know. 567 00:25:07.619 --> 00:25:12.720 I've come to regard Lala as, if you could say, symbiotically 568 00:25:12.720 --> 00:25:14.759 associated with her frock. 569 00:25:14.819 --> 00:25:19.740 Yeah, no, and there's the hair does some slightly odd things and 570 00:25:19.740 --> 00:25:21.660 creature, but that was her 1st crack, wasn't it? 571 00:25:21.779 --> 00:25:23.279 It's doing a little bit, sort of. 572 00:25:23.339 --> 00:25:25.140 I am going to play Ophelia, you know. 573 00:25:25.200 --> 00:25:28.799 I am, because we know you are, and she hadn't done it. 574 00:25:28.859 --> 00:25:29.640 Oh, she didn't. 575 00:25:29.640 --> 00:25:32.220 I thought she did it towards the end. 576 00:25:32.279 --> 00:25:35.160 Maybe you're right, because by the time we get to Naimon, she was 577 00:25:35.160 --> 00:25:40.079 certainly in charge of the BBC. dressing for the coast. 578 00:25:40.140 --> 00:25:42.480 But in this one, I just look, all the fox are lovely. 579 00:25:42.539 --> 00:25:46.500 I think what hurts this is the same reason that hurts a trip to 580 00:25:46.500 --> 00:25:49.500 Europe for Australians when you go anywhere further than the UK. 581 00:25:49.500 --> 00:25:54.779 Or anyway, north is where if you go to any of the clean countries 582 00:25:54.779 --> 00:25:58.019 the Scandalwegians or the Dutch, and you go to any H and M sale or 583 00:25:58.019 --> 00:25:59.460 just any anything really. 584 00:25:59.519 --> 00:26:03.599 You find everybody's wearing mustard, mustard seems to be. 585 00:26:03.660 --> 00:26:06.900 I mean, it's not really, it's just a way to cover up food you 586 00:26:06.900 --> 00:26:07.859 don't really eat in the 1st place. 587 00:26:07.920 --> 00:26:11.400 And why did they paint this rather beautiful spaceship mustard? 588 00:26:11.460 --> 00:26:16.259 Well, I've got 4 episodes of looking at baby poo coloured walls. 589 00:26:16.319 --> 00:26:16.859 It does hurt. 590 00:26:16.920 --> 00:26:20.339 It's apparently the Art Deco influence, and I believe the colour 591 00:26:20.339 --> 00:26:22.259 is called Colonial Cream. 592 00:26:22.319 --> 00:26:23.160 It's very nice of them. 593 00:26:23.220 --> 00:26:26.220 There was a colour they call tobacco, which I can pull out for 594 00:26:26.220 --> 00:26:27.839 your listeners at home. love that one. 595 00:26:27.900 --> 00:26:30.779 Show you pictures on the interweb radio, I mean. 596 00:26:30.839 --> 00:26:31.559 No, yeah, yeah. 597 00:26:31.619 --> 00:26:33.000 No, it's flat. 598 00:26:33.059 --> 00:26:38.819 And Lewis Fianders are just a naughty, naughty man for doing the 599 00:26:38.819 --> 00:26:39.119 accent. 600 00:26:39.180 --> 00:26:42.599 It would have been nicer to have some sort of relief on the walls 601 00:26:42.599 --> 00:26:44.400 you know, even just have light relief. 602 00:26:46.380 --> 00:26:48.480 But my old theatre group. 603 00:26:48.539 --> 00:26:56.160 There was a time when the director had 2 had 2 colours. 604 00:26:56.220 --> 00:26:59.700 He want paint, he want, he would want painted into every set 605 00:26:59.700 --> 00:27:01.559 because, you know, we were doing shows like are you being served 606 00:27:01.559 --> 00:27:04.559 in classic comedies like that, and they were heritage red and 607 00:27:04.559 --> 00:27:05.579 colonial cream. 608 00:27:05.640 --> 00:27:09.180 Everything was heritage, red, and colonial cream. 609 00:27:09.240 --> 00:27:10.440 We did a Doctor Who send-up. 610 00:27:10.500 --> 00:27:12.960 The Daleks were heritage, red and colonial cream. 611 00:27:13.019 --> 00:27:14.039 David, I hope you're listening. 612 00:27:14.099 --> 00:27:17.579 Did you think some mid-Bunswick green and mission brown? 613 00:27:17.640 --> 00:27:21.240 Yeah, did he force you to go to the London Zoo quite often because 614 00:27:21.240 --> 00:27:23.339 they are the colours of a baboon's bottom? 615 00:27:23.460 --> 00:27:25.500 That's why they called mandrills. 616 00:27:25.559 --> 00:27:28.980 That's right. we're back in the room. 617 00:27:29.099 --> 00:27:33.779 So I'd like to talk a bit, if I may, about the directorial 618 00:27:33.779 --> 00:27:34.319 problems. 619 00:27:34.380 --> 00:27:38.700 Oh, I think we're well beyond not talking about that. 620 00:27:38.880 --> 00:27:42.839 So as we know, there was no film work conducted for this. much to 621 00:27:42.839 --> 00:27:46.259 the chagrin of Colin Mapson, the model designer. 622 00:27:46.319 --> 00:27:49.619 Because he did design those ship models to be seen on film and 623 00:27:49.619 --> 00:27:51.720 then they were shot on video and he said, you know, usually we had 624 00:27:51.720 --> 00:27:54.359 5 days to shoot on film, but there was a budget cut and we had 4 625 00:27:54.359 --> 00:27:54.599 hours. 626 00:27:54.960 --> 00:27:58.859 And you get a lot of grain, we should say, with video that you 627 00:27:58.859 --> 00:28:00.420 don't get in those days with film. 628 00:28:00.480 --> 00:28:04.559 You can really up the quality and film very slowly on celluloid, so 629 00:28:04.559 --> 00:28:05.819 you get detail on a model. 630 00:28:05.940 --> 00:28:08.700 Thank you, Ian Scones, and the lovely opening to invasion of... 631 00:28:08.700 --> 00:28:10.980 Tinny or whatever, it's called invasion of time. 632 00:28:11.039 --> 00:28:12.900 But it... 633 00:28:12.960 --> 00:28:13.140 Yeah. 634 00:28:13.200 --> 00:28:14.880 I actually don't think they look that terrible. 635 00:28:14.940 --> 00:28:18.480 You know, they're not they're not terrible, but studio cameras 636 00:28:18.480 --> 00:28:22.019 were not designed to move in that way because much like model work 637 00:28:22.019 --> 00:28:25.859 a lot of model work for spaceships are still done now, the cameras 638 00:28:25.859 --> 00:28:29.160 were moving, not the models, which is why we get some very jittery 639 00:28:29.160 --> 00:28:30.059 model scenes. 640 00:28:30.119 --> 00:28:32.700 And Richard is now moving a model. 641 00:28:32.759 --> 00:28:36.240 His home-built Tyson he made when he was 12? 642 00:28:36.299 --> 00:28:38.279 32 years old. 32 years. 643 00:28:38.339 --> 00:28:41.880 Just as old as long as the listeners been listening to this 644 00:28:41.880 --> 00:28:42.299 podcast. 645 00:28:42.359 --> 00:28:43.799 I don't imagine their feeling. 646 00:28:43.859 --> 00:28:45.359 Let's get to Alan Bromley. 647 00:28:45.420 --> 00:28:47.279 We love the monsters, don't we? 648 00:28:47.339 --> 00:28:51.539 The reason that the budget was slashed so much is Graham Williams 649 00:28:51.539 --> 00:28:56.519 said, I will not produce a season finale on a shoestring again. 650 00:28:56.579 --> 00:28:59.819 I'll take some money earlier in the year when inflation means that 651 00:28:59.819 --> 00:29:00.480 money is made. 652 00:29:00.539 --> 00:29:01.380 That money goes further. 653 00:29:01.440 --> 00:29:03.779 Yeah, because inflation was really, really ripping away. 654 00:29:04.200 --> 00:29:04.380 Exactly. 655 00:29:04.440 --> 00:29:06.180 No, that makes no sense. 656 00:29:06.240 --> 00:29:09.480 If you're saving money that's worth more now and inflation's 657 00:29:09.480 --> 00:29:11.220 rising, later, it'll be worth less. 658 00:29:11.279 --> 00:29:13.380 Yes, but he has more of it to play. 659 00:29:13.440 --> 00:29:14.579 Oh, no, it doesn't make sense. 660 00:29:14.640 --> 00:29:18.720 If you could only sort of jump forward in time. use that money and 661 00:29:18.720 --> 00:29:21.119 then bring that back to now. bring that money back. 662 00:29:21.180 --> 00:29:24.000 The cost of your meal is incredibly paid for. 663 00:29:24.059 --> 00:29:27.299 So we have 6 studio days. was perfect. 664 00:29:28.079 --> 00:29:32.279 We have 6 studio days to cover these 4 episodes. 665 00:29:32.339 --> 00:29:37.500 And as we discussed earlier, Bromley constantly changing things 666 00:29:37.500 --> 00:29:39.779 not communicating well with the cast wasn't going down well. 667 00:29:39.839 --> 00:29:43.140 Do we know why he was such a cranky back bottom on this? 668 00:29:43.259 --> 00:29:43.799 No. 669 00:29:43.920 --> 00:29:45.119 No, we really don't. 670 00:29:45.180 --> 00:29:45.779 Anyone? 671 00:29:45.779 --> 00:29:48.059 There's no sort of indication. 672 00:29:48.180 --> 00:29:49.799 Well, we know what happened and why. 673 00:29:49.859 --> 00:29:52.980 He would ticked Lala off. the old thing, but she wasn't on her 674 00:29:52.980 --> 00:29:55.799 mark, which he'd only just moved and she didn't know about, and he 675 00:29:55.799 --> 00:29:58.200 really tore strips of it from the booth. 676 00:29:58.259 --> 00:30:02.400 According to, I think it's the makeup designer, Joan Stripling 677 00:30:02.400 --> 00:30:06.779 gave an interview where she said it was a full-blown verbal 678 00:30:06.779 --> 00:30:11.519 assault, which lasted minutes in front of the entire cast and 679 00:30:11.519 --> 00:30:11.940 crew. 680 00:30:12.000 --> 00:30:14.160 And that was actually the final straw for Tom. 681 00:30:14.460 --> 00:30:19.079 And then spent the day muttering... 682 00:30:19.079 --> 00:30:22.680 Not so sutter, but so back so the control room could hear about 683 00:30:22.680 --> 00:30:27.960 you know, I'm going to get, I think, it's City Carter from that 684 00:30:27.960 --> 00:30:31.440 chap up there, being a disease that you get from parrots. 685 00:30:31.500 --> 00:30:32.460 Yes. 686 00:30:32.460 --> 00:30:36.180 Because, as he also commented, do we have a director up there in 687 00:30:36.180 --> 00:30:36.900 commentator? 688 00:30:36.960 --> 00:30:38.279 Wow. 689 00:30:38.579 --> 00:30:40.920 Oh, that is... 690 00:30:40.920 --> 00:30:42.839 Tom at his worst best. 691 00:30:42.900 --> 00:30:46.259 And the thing is, that is what he actually screamed into the 692 00:30:46.259 --> 00:30:46.740 microphone. 693 00:30:46.859 --> 00:30:51.539 And production broke for dinner and everyone went off for dinner 694 00:30:51.539 --> 00:30:56.160 and came back to the last came back to do the last half day's 695 00:30:56.160 --> 00:30:59.460 filming and Graham Williams was in the gallery saying, right, I'm 696 00:30:59.460 --> 00:31:00.119 calling the shots now. 697 00:31:00.180 --> 00:31:02.640 And... 698 00:31:02.640 --> 00:31:03.900 So Bromley was replaying. 699 00:31:03.960 --> 00:31:04.440 Oh, yeah. 700 00:31:04.500 --> 00:31:09.420 And there is there is no consensus on whether Graham Williams 701 00:31:09.420 --> 00:31:13.980 fired him or Graham Williams pulled him to one side and said, Alan 702 00:31:13.980 --> 00:31:15.420 do you think maybe you should go home? 703 00:31:15.480 --> 00:31:17.519 And some people say that Alan said, you're right. 704 00:31:17.579 --> 00:31:18.240 I've had enough of this. 705 00:31:18.299 --> 00:31:19.319 I've wanted to say this for weeks. 706 00:31:19.380 --> 00:31:23.400 But yeah, I think it speaks a lot to Tom's professionalism that he 707 00:31:23.400 --> 00:31:24.299 was willing to... 708 00:31:24.299 --> 00:31:26.279 Praises he rarely hear. 709 00:31:26.339 --> 00:31:28.440 Oh, hear me out. 710 00:31:28.500 --> 00:31:32.819 That, as disenchanted as he was and disenfranchised by Alan 711 00:31:32.819 --> 00:31:36.660 Bromley's working method, it was only when Bromley did the 712 00:31:36.660 --> 00:31:41.460 ultimate professional sin of personally attacking, not just a cast 713 00:31:41.460 --> 00:31:44.460 member, but at this stage, Tom's partner, really. 714 00:31:44.519 --> 00:31:45.839 I believe they were dating at this stage. 715 00:31:45.900 --> 00:31:48.720 But I would like to think if he'd done it to any cast member, Tom 716 00:31:48.720 --> 00:31:49.559 would have probably done the same thing. 717 00:31:49.619 --> 00:31:51.119 You know, Tom... 718 00:31:51.180 --> 00:31:58.440 But Tom, you know, put up with a lot until the director had lost 719 00:31:58.440 --> 00:31:59.400 control, basically. 720 00:31:59.460 --> 00:32:04.319 And considering that Thomas put up with Norman Stewart on 721 00:32:04.319 --> 00:32:04.920 underworld. 722 00:32:04.980 --> 00:32:07.200 Not that Norman Stewart was necessarily a problem, but Norman 723 00:32:07.200 --> 00:32:09.059 Stewart was a technical directory, didn't know how to direct 724 00:32:09.059 --> 00:32:11.579 actors, but Tom was sympathetic to that, you know. 725 00:32:11.640 --> 00:32:15.420 Tom could only take so much before he just said, look, enough is 726 00:32:15.420 --> 00:32:15.599 enough. 727 00:32:15.660 --> 00:32:18.119 I need to take care of this as the star of the show. 728 00:32:18.180 --> 00:32:21.900 And we sort of, we hear so much this year about, oh, Tom's out of 729 00:32:21.900 --> 00:32:22.980 control, this, that, the other. 730 00:32:23.039 --> 00:32:25.680 I think if Tom was out of control, he probably would have attacked 731 00:32:25.680 --> 00:32:26.759 Bromley far sooner. 732 00:32:27.000 --> 00:32:29.700 Bromley was away up in the control room. 733 00:32:29.759 --> 00:32:31.019 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 734 00:32:31.079 --> 00:32:33.960 I mean, they did actually have a screening match before this. 735 00:32:34.019 --> 00:32:38.700 But both of them said that actually cleared the air, you know, and 736 00:32:38.700 --> 00:32:41.099 they were able to work well for a day or so after that. 737 00:32:41.160 --> 00:32:45.119 And speaking of directorial commands coming from on high, we've 738 00:32:45.119 --> 00:32:46.559 got an obelisk coming in, gentlemen. 739 00:32:46.799 --> 00:32:49.980 So here we are with the nightmare of Eden, listeners. 740 00:32:50.039 --> 00:32:52.980 You know, I maintain that Bob Baker and Dave Martin write two good 741 00:32:52.980 --> 00:32:54.480 episodes of Doctor Who the Year. 742 00:32:54.539 --> 00:32:56.339 But this is just Bob Baker by himself. 743 00:32:56.400 --> 00:32:57.720 And you know what? 744 00:32:57.779 --> 00:33:00.299 I actually really like this script, but I don't think it should 745 00:33:00.299 --> 00:33:04.019 have ever been attempted in 1979, or even 1989. 746 00:33:04.200 --> 00:33:06.660 I actually think that it could have been rewritten for the new 747 00:33:06.660 --> 00:33:10.079 series as a 45 minute episode, and produced with great special 748 00:33:10.079 --> 00:33:11.519 effects for the new series. 749 00:33:11.579 --> 00:33:13.019 What do you think? 750 00:33:13.079 --> 00:33:14.759 Anyway, I'm now off to the next story. 751 00:33:14.880 --> 00:33:17.160 Surely the monsters can't get any sillier. 752 00:33:17.819 --> 00:33:19.980 It's a good point. 753 00:33:20.039 --> 00:33:23.339 I hate drug things on television, drug message stories on 754 00:33:23.339 --> 00:33:23.700 television. 755 00:33:23.759 --> 00:33:27.539 I think that, uh, it's just, well, I think it's just disingenuous 756 00:33:27.539 --> 00:33:29.819 to say that there's a problem with drugs separate from the problem 757 00:33:29.819 --> 00:33:33.480 caused by the way we treat them in the criminal justice system. 758 00:33:33.539 --> 00:33:34.619 So. 759 00:33:34.740 --> 00:33:37.619 Stories about how drugs are bad just annoy the hell out of me. 760 00:33:37.680 --> 00:33:40.619 And I also think that they tend to be directed against young 761 00:33:40.619 --> 00:33:40.920 people. 762 00:33:40.980 --> 00:33:44.339 They tend to be middle aged people writing about how terrible 763 00:33:44.339 --> 00:33:45.180 young people are. 764 00:33:45.299 --> 00:33:47.220 So it's ever since... 765 00:33:47.220 --> 00:33:47.940 Of course, of fun. 766 00:33:48.000 --> 00:33:49.920 Two young people and the fun what you want. 767 00:33:49.980 --> 00:33:54.180 Like, I don't want Nancy Reagan to waltz on set and start 768 00:33:54.180 --> 00:33:56.220 lecturing me in Doctor Who, frankly. 769 00:33:56.279 --> 00:33:59.759 And she and Capaldi have similar hair. 770 00:33:59.940 --> 00:34:01.859 Increasingly so. 771 00:34:01.920 --> 00:34:04.559 I don't like the drug thing at all. 772 00:34:04.619 --> 00:34:09.179 I do like the unstable matter interfaces thing, you know, creating 773 00:34:09.179 --> 00:34:10.619 weird spaces. 774 00:34:10.679 --> 00:34:13.139 Don't muck around with unstable matters. 775 00:34:13.199 --> 00:34:13.619 Exactly. 776 00:34:13.679 --> 00:34:15.239 Don't get started with them. 777 00:34:15.300 --> 00:34:16.800 They'll ruin your life. 778 00:34:16.860 --> 00:34:21.780 And the fact that the space has created a weird television spaces 779 00:34:21.780 --> 00:34:24.119 you know, that consist of video effects and stuff. 780 00:34:24.179 --> 00:34:25.619 I think all of that stuff is great. 781 00:34:25.619 --> 00:34:31.019 You know, there's a lot of good things to say about this, but the 782 00:34:31.019 --> 00:34:32.699 drug thing just annoys the hell out of me. 783 00:34:32.760 --> 00:34:37.260 If I'd had my time over, I would have talked about the era of 784 00:34:37.260 --> 00:34:41.760 prohibition in the US and how it was one man trying to protect his 785 00:34:41.760 --> 00:34:48.179 anti-alcohol department, and the, oh, the levels of corruption, as 786 00:34:48.179 --> 00:34:49.860 you know, and increasing crime. 787 00:34:49.920 --> 00:34:52.199 And he just didn't want to lose, and Hoover was with him, of 788 00:34:52.199 --> 00:34:56.400 course, but he didn't want to lose his money in his department. 789 00:34:56.460 --> 00:34:59.099 So they just transferred their interest from alcohol to drugs. 790 00:34:59.219 --> 00:35:00.840 Really where it's all come from. 791 00:35:01.260 --> 00:35:03.179 It was readily available. 792 00:35:03.239 --> 00:35:07.619 My grandmother used to buy heroin in distilled, which you could 793 00:35:07.619 --> 00:35:09.059 buy at the pharmacist. 794 00:35:09.119 --> 00:35:10.320 Drunk in those. 795 00:35:10.380 --> 00:35:12.780 Drunks don't start to become a lady's pains. 796 00:35:12.840 --> 00:35:13.079 Yes. 797 00:35:13.139 --> 00:35:16.920 Drugs don't start to become illegal in Australia until 1905, I 798 00:35:16.920 --> 00:35:17.159 think. 799 00:35:17.219 --> 00:35:20.579 And then it's a racist thing directed against the Chinese, banning 800 00:35:20.579 --> 00:35:22.320 opium for smoking, but you could still... 801 00:35:22.380 --> 00:35:23.699 That would have been a more fun episode actually. 802 00:35:23.760 --> 00:35:27.480 We can still get, you know, opium for drinking at the chemist, you 803 00:35:27.480 --> 00:35:27.719 know. 804 00:35:27.780 --> 00:35:28.920 In Newtown, right now. 805 00:35:29.699 --> 00:35:34.079 And of course, in America, around the time of the Great Depression 806 00:35:34.079 --> 00:35:36.900 the actual reason that marijuana was banned, it was nothing to do 807 00:35:36.900 --> 00:35:39.119 with Roof or Madness, it was everything to do with the cotton 808 00:35:39.119 --> 00:35:39.420 industry. 809 00:35:39.480 --> 00:35:43.860 Yes, of course, because hemp is a much better, far lower water 810 00:35:43.860 --> 00:35:48.119 using product and much stronger, but of course, the industry is 811 00:35:48.119 --> 00:35:48.539 already there. 812 00:35:48.599 --> 00:35:51.780 Why do you think Americans still have pennies because of the zinc 813 00:35:51.780 --> 00:35:52.380 lobby? 814 00:35:52.440 --> 00:35:56.039 It costs more to make a penny than it does to mint one. 815 00:35:56.099 --> 00:36:00.239 But of course, Well, it now costs more to make a ¢5 piece than to 816 00:36:00.239 --> 00:36:00.659 mint one. 817 00:36:00.719 --> 00:36:04.500 So we may see the back of those. ¢5 pieces. 818 00:36:04.559 --> 00:36:05.880 Can I just say how much I hate them? 819 00:36:05.940 --> 00:36:10.860 And if I ever have like ¢25 pieces, I'm really, really anxious and 820 00:36:10.860 --> 00:36:12.900 angry until I can get rid of at least one of them. 821 00:36:12.960 --> 00:36:14.400 That's why we have Boy Scouts. 822 00:36:14.519 --> 00:36:16.320 Just insert them in a Boy Scout. 823 00:36:16.380 --> 00:36:17.159 Oh, right. 824 00:36:17.219 --> 00:36:22.380 I wonder if really, it's the same with Nightmare of Eden and that 825 00:36:22.380 --> 00:36:25.199 it costs more to watch this than it did to produce. 826 00:36:25.260 --> 00:36:27.179 Yes, that's almost certainly true. 827 00:36:27.239 --> 00:36:30.179 This podcast had a higher budget, I think, probably. 828 00:36:30.599 --> 00:36:34.679 Can I draw attention to one performance that I think is truly 829 00:36:34.679 --> 00:36:35.159 dire? 830 00:36:35.219 --> 00:36:36.840 Really, just the one? 831 00:36:36.900 --> 00:36:37.920 You know what? 832 00:36:37.980 --> 00:36:39.659 Just one, because as I've said, I don't have a problem with Lewis 833 00:36:39.659 --> 00:36:40.260 Fiander. 834 00:36:40.320 --> 00:36:42.719 I think Jeffrey Inslip is awful in this. 835 00:36:42.780 --> 00:36:44.460 He's Fisk. 836 00:36:44.519 --> 00:36:46.559 Yeah, he's shockingly bad isn't he? 837 00:36:46.619 --> 00:36:49.500 Which is amazing because he's so good in Image of the Fender. 838 00:36:49.559 --> 00:36:50.699 Yeah, he's lovely in that. 839 00:36:50.760 --> 00:36:52.860 Peter Craze is okay, you know? 840 00:36:52.980 --> 00:36:55.079 Which one's Peter Crane? 841 00:36:55.139 --> 00:36:58.079 Peter Craze is Darko and he's also Michael Craze's brother. 842 00:36:58.139 --> 00:37:01.019 So Peter Craze is the other customs officer. 843 00:37:01.139 --> 00:37:02.639 Oh okay. 844 00:37:02.699 --> 00:37:06.480 Yeah, everyone was having a rotten time during the shoot, and 845 00:37:06.480 --> 00:37:10.559 actors, sensitive actors, and Hinsliff is one of them can't do 846 00:37:10.559 --> 00:37:12.179 their best if they don't feel loved. 847 00:37:12.239 --> 00:37:15.960 Just as we feel loved by you, do listen and why we're still here 848 00:37:15.960 --> 00:37:17.340 doing this, because we love you. 849 00:37:17.940 --> 00:37:21.059 And five, not ¢5 pieces. 850 00:37:21.119 --> 00:37:22.019 No. 851 00:37:22.079 --> 00:37:26.519 I want to find some way of shoehorning a reference to demon's evil 852 00:37:26.519 --> 00:37:27.840 villain to do list. 853 00:37:27.900 --> 00:37:30.599 Because I love a good evil villain to do this. 854 00:37:30.659 --> 00:37:32.639 Just cut all of my silliness out and just put that in. 855 00:37:32.699 --> 00:37:36.300 We haven't we haven't had an evil villain to do this since Peter 856 00:37:36.300 --> 00:37:37.320 Butterworth, really. 857 00:37:37.380 --> 00:37:39.179 I remember that. 858 00:37:39.239 --> 00:37:42.659 And it's very, it's very pressing because I think the next story 859 00:37:42.659 --> 00:37:46.980 we do owes in a timey, whimey kind of reverse causality sort of 860 00:37:46.980 --> 00:37:50.280 way owes a lot to Marge versus the monorail. 861 00:37:50.400 --> 00:37:55.980 And Lyle Landley has a very, very fantastic, illustrated evil-to 862 00:37:55.320 --> 00:37:57.420 do list as well. 863 00:37:57.480 --> 00:38:00.300 So I like to encourage people to keep to-do lists. 864 00:38:00.360 --> 00:38:02.760 I think it's an important productivity thing. 865 00:38:02.820 --> 00:38:05.940 And if you're a villain, I think it's particularly important to 866 00:38:05.940 --> 00:38:09.000 keep track of your next actions and your long-term project. 867 00:38:09.059 --> 00:38:10.079 I like that, yeah. 868 00:38:10.500 --> 00:38:12.360 I let it go. 869 00:38:12.420 --> 00:38:14.099 That's why I'm not the villain I should have been. 870 00:38:14.159 --> 00:38:17.159 There you go, kids, just don't do lists. 871 00:38:32.760 --> 00:38:37.019 Dear listeners, we're departing the orbit of the planet, Azure, to 872 00:38:37.019 --> 00:38:40.139 put the residence of the planet, ridge back where they belong. 873 00:38:40.139 --> 00:38:43.619 Until next week, when we'll be back with the horns of Naimon 874 00:38:43.619 --> 00:38:46.079 please check us out online at FlightthroughEntirety.com, flight 875 00:38:46.079 --> 00:38:49.019 through Entirety on Facebook and iTunes and FTE podcast on 876 00:38:49.019 --> 00:38:49.320 Twitter. 877 00:38:49.380 --> 00:38:55.019 We also have, finally, Bondfinger is up to date with Casino Royale 878 00:38:55.019 --> 00:38:57.659 and the 1st 5 Sean Connery Bond films. 879 00:38:57.719 --> 00:38:59.579 Casino Royale, of course, being 1967. 880 00:38:59.760 --> 00:39:03.360 You can find that on Bondfinger.com, Bondfinger on Facebook and 881 00:39:03.360 --> 00:39:05.519 iTunes and Bondfinger cast on Twitter. 882 00:39:05.579 --> 00:39:09.059 Until next week, may you never feel comfortable in an electronic 883 00:39:09.059 --> 00:39:09.420 zoo. 884 00:39:09.480 --> 00:39:10.500 Thank you very much and good night. 885 00:39:10.559 --> 00:39:10.980 Good night. 886 00:39:11.039 --> 00:39:11.880 Good then. 887 00:39:13.440 --> 00:39:17.880 That was fled through entirety with Nathan Bottomley, Brenda Jones 888 00:39:17.880 --> 00:39:18.780 and Richard Storm. 889 00:39:18.840 --> 00:39:23.760 This episode, I don't want Nancy Reagan, was recorded on the 6th 890 00:39:23.760 --> 00:39:24.539 of February. 891 00:39:24.599 --> 00:39:28.320 The next episode will be released on February 21st. 892 00:39:28.380 --> 00:39:32.280 I hope that this accent is considered that I am actually the 893 00:39:32.280 --> 00:39:33.480 million of the... 894 00:39:33.480 --> 00:39:34.619 Damn. 895 00:39:40.739 --> 00:39:44.699 The nightmare of Eden, February the 6th. 896 00:39:44.820 --> 00:39:46.500 I think it's just Nightmare of Eden. 897 00:39:46.559 --> 00:39:47.340 Yes, that's right. 898 00:39:47.400 --> 00:39:49.139 There's no definite article. 899 00:39:49.920 --> 00:39:52.019 Bear role nominal. 900 00:39:52.559 --> 00:39:54.539 There you go, kids. 901 00:39:54.599 --> 00:39:56.340 Just don't do list. 902 00:39:57.119 --> 00:40:00.659 Don't transcribe every other composer for piano. 903 00:40:00.719 --> 00:40:01.980 Don't do list. 904 00:40:03.119 --> 00:40:05.219 How funny was that? 905 00:40:06.480 --> 00:40:09.000 Apologies to Leslie Howard. 906 00:40:09.059 --> 00:40:09.960 How funny was that? 907 00:40:10.019 --> 00:40:14.340 So you keep Chopin changing that line every time you move in. 908 00:40:15.179 --> 00:40:17.820 You're barks worse than you buy.