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This transcript was created on 2026-06-07 at 16:49:04

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Hello, dear listener, and welcome back to Flightthrough Entirety, the only Doctor Who podcast whose walk isn't quite right.

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And then there's the accents.

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I'm Brendan.

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I'm Nathan.

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I'm here too.

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And we're being sucked down to one of the last planets of humanity and a very young Geoff Rawl.

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It's Frontios.

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Hey, let's drop the dead donkey.

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So, um, Christopher Hamilton bit me. fan of the podcast.

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Oh, patron of the podcast.

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Patron saint of the podcast.

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For those of you who don't know, when we recorded our Castro Volver commentary, during the 1st 5 minutes, Nathan referred to Castro Volver as being plotless.

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Well, I think I said flawed and plotless, to be fair.

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That's right.

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To which, um, and I did say that about Lagopolis as well, let's just say.

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To which Christopher Hamilton bid me delivered a sick burn, which is the Ramblingest Doctor Who podcast I've ever heard, has the nerve to call Castraval the plotless, to which we...

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You call us ramblingers in a braggadocious name.

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Is that even a word?

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To which we asked if we could use that as a quotation.

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And as you'll see, the ticker on our website, flight through entirety.sexy, where you can occasionally see ramblingist CH bidmate because he told us we could cut out any padding. a lot of padding in that tweet.

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I'll tell you what.

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We did actually ask if he might like to join us for this podcast, to which he very thankfully, but graciously declined.

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So we won't be joined by Christopher Hamilton with me.

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This is terrific. and we think he's terrific. and I'm serious. really is good.

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In fact, it is a little bit unfortunate because I imagine that Christopher H.

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Bidmeat has a lot on his plate and he probably only had time to listen to the 1st 5 minutes of me bitching about Castrovolver, but we did spend a lot of time during season 18 and even during the Castrovolver episode.

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Well, no, I think we said he was great.

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And I think here, I think this is a really strong story.

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He's one of us.

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He grew up reading Fred and Jeffrey Hoyle.

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This is good old 60s, 70s hard SF.

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It really is.

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It's even got, I wanted to say Jeff Coons.

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It's even got, it feels like the cover of a 70s Chris Foss spaceship covered SF novel.

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It's a proper 60s Doctor Who story.

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Do you feel that really we're just in the land of the savages again or indeed?

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Hartner, not even Troughton, but the high concept, big thinking SF ideas of the early shows.

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Yeah, it's landing on a world like ours, but something has changed, which was one of the central tenets of Hartnell.

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I don't just think this is Mead's best script.

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I think this is the best story this season.

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Oh for sure.

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Definitely.

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And I mean, I'm including caves in that.

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I think this is a strong season, though.

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People disagree, but I do think that Caves is really incredibly good, but this there's something special about this one.

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I actually agree with you.

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I think that 5 of this season stories are very strong stories and this is the top of those 5 and 2 of them very clearly languish behind.

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I think I know which 2 are.

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Yeah, yeah, we'll discuss that more at the end of the season.

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Harsh, but fair.

51
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Yeah, in fact, I think there's more than two, but even the ones that I don't like, even the remakes of Earthshock from last year, they still have things going for them from a production standpoint.

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I think they're really misconceived, but they're not terrible terrible.

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I think it's very telling that you refer to Earth Shock as being last year, forgetting we've had a whole season, a whole rather mediocre season, in between Earth Shock and Warriors.

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So what is the deep?

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18, 19, 21?

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That's all right.

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So 19 was Earthshock.

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This is 21.

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What comes between 19 and 21?

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20.

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You're making me kiddy.

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This is like we were living in Castrovalva.

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Oh, again, where's the child at the washing basin to ask?

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We needed the sendant of Carol and John to help us.

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Descendant relative, I'm not sure.

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So we do have that great sci-fi concept and what's really kind of wonderful about it is, and it's kind of odd that it starts with Davison being wonderfully eccentric with that stuff about the hat stand.

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You're not hat people, are you?

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He does it really well.

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And friend of the podcast, Peter Griffiths, actually. told me this week that he thinks that this is the best portrayal of the doctor by anyone in any story.

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And I'm not sure that I would go quite that far. strong talk, isn't it?

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But Bidmead gets the character. got a head on that one, hasn't it?

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It's a bold claim.

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I think Bidmead writes better dialogue for the doctor than we've had for a while and he gets that the doctor is snarky.

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He's obnoxious.

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He doesn't listen to people.

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He's kind of dismissive.

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All those Thomas things that, you know, they were trying to avoid for Pete.

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Bitmead seems to just come in and do them anyway. right into the doctor and it's always the same doctor.

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And that's a really good take on it.

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Let the actor put the spin on it, right generically. let the actor in rehearsals develop the character.

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That's what I actors do Yeah.

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And so the idea that Pete's bland.

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I think it's just fundamentally... still wearing the beige.

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Yeah, the beige. huge costume change.

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Yeah, he's a new costume, though.

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The whole thing.

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Even the shoes.

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But he's snarky.

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He torments Tegan.

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He's impatient.

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So he's really at one with a viewer on this one, isn't he?

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Well, he's he's the one. yucky, though, because we still get the, even though we've got bid meat, who's a powerful force in narrative writings in Doctor Who, we still get, say, would stick in his little bilious green finger in it, don't we?

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and get a lot of deaths, there are a lot of deaths, but I don't feel it's like...

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It's not as good as we...

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It's not, this isn't, this was actually the human centipede.

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Yeah, for Doctor Who.

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You know, you know what the original plot was, don't you?

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So, yeah, the machine that we see at the end was meant to be entirely made out of human body parts.

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Out of dancers.

100
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Tiny made of dances coupled over each other. crawling along. would have been spectacular.

101
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I've just been to a Sydney dance company show and everything they do is inspired by Christopher H.

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Bitmeans.

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There's no way they were ever going to be able to do that.

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Oh, why not?

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No, I've seen it on stage.

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I'll send you clips Yeah, it's called untamed if you want to look it up.

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SDC.

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You know what, though?

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After the disappointing realisation of the murker earlier this year, I'm kind of glad they went for a less is more approach with that because...

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Yeah, big cardboard disc with a head sticking out the front of it in front of a glad wrap, Klingfoil box, serrated edge.

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You know what?

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So you can cut off your lunch wrap with it.

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I haven't seen the dance shows you've seen, but certainly I've seen dance shows where dancers will move together as a single thing, but that takes months of rehearsal.

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Very hard work and they need to do it very well.

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But you have seen the human centipede one and two, haven't you?

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have not.

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I will say. look that up immediately.

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I have.

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No, I really don't if you're under a certain I have.

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I have seen the South Park episode, The Human Scent I pack.

121
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Yeah, it's very similar.

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Um, where um, they tie a few humans together because they won't read the Apple terms and conditions and that's actually in the Apple conditions that Apple can do this to you.

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But I wrote down an observation in the 1st episode of this. at the moment to do listener.

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Mouth and ear.

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I don't know.

126
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Don't have the veal.

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Okay.

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I had lettuce.

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Like, I got halfway through the 1st episode of this and I'm like, we've gone well drawn characters.

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We do.

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My gravis has no nose.

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How does it smell?

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He went to his own accord.

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Well-drawn characters.

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Sparkling dialogue, sympathetic music.

136
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And I just wrote, what series is this?

137
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It's Patty Kingsland.

138
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It's Patty Kingsley's.

139
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But it's Ron Jones directing.

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It actually does a really good joke.

141
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I think he suffered a savage blow to the head in post-production.

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Is it just that when everything else goes well, you kind of competence.

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And he is a competent director.

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Because it's not visionary.

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You know what I think it might be?

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At this point he's still relatively inexperienced.

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There's some crappy moments, like the violent stuff of the killing of one of the outer people, and you think this is just like a static camera, and it goes on too long, and it's yucky pants. that's true.

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Yeah, they're in really nice ways that have shot it, but the ship itself, the idea of the ship is so beautifully realised.

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It looks like OB, doesn't it?

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Even though it's all studio.

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It's a studio bound story that doesn't feel studio bound.

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You don't feel like you've got a roof because the sky is decent.

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The proportions are well done.

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Leslie Dunlop is just delightful.

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And not covered in pink.

156
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Once again.

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You know, for the 2nd story running, we have someone where you're like, why don't you join the TARDIS at the end?

158
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Again.

159
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Who's her dad again?

160
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Peter Gilmore from the Enedon line, isn't it?

161
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Well, her dad is Peter Gilmore is in the story, but her dad is William Lucas.

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Oh, that's fine.

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She's also lovely.

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And this is a bit sad.

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We might as well tell this story now.

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Mr. Range played by William Lucas.

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Originally cast was Peter Arn.

168
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Is there a delicate way to say that his interests in a personal level were ones that would lead to extreme behaviour and eventually lead to his death?

169
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And he had a very difficult and repressed life and wasn't out, but he was very big.

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He was mates with George, who was Francis Bacon's lover, and very heavily into the SM London underground scene, the art scene.

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So he was mates with Francis Bacon and Jordan very much on that extreme end. proclivity and he died a very unpleasant death by a lover who killed him.

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It's a bit difficult to determine exactly what happened, but he was found bludgeoned to death on the afternoon after a costume fitting for this story, and a few days later, someone he was known to have associated with was found to have committed suicide. with Peter Arm's blood on his clothes.

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So it's very unpleasant.

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William Lucas was kind of called in.

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So he never got to the stage where he met the rest of the cast, but the rest of the cast were aware they were having Peter on on the show and it was a big deal to have people on the show.

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Very good actor. saturnine, very controlled, very cool, great drama because of course he brought that aspect of his own life into the light and that's what a good actor can do.

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There are 2 Kathy Gale Avengers episodes he's in.

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Warlock and the Golden Eggs, which were shot 2 months apart.

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So the idea was in the latter one, he had his hair lightened.

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He put glasses on, played it with different accent, et cetera.

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Due to a scheduling quirk, they were broadcast 2 weeks apart.

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But if you watch them that way, you still don't quite twig because his 2 characters are so different.

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And that is his strength as an actor.

184
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And of course, he did.

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The prisoner and other shows of the time, the saint, that sort of thing.

186
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So yeah, he was quite a coup to get.

187
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And he was replaced by William Lucas.

188
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Now, I think William Lucas is absolutely lovely in the role, and he's such warmth with Leslie Dunlop as his daughter as Norna.

189
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Really lovely.

190
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Yeah, and it's kind of odd because he's sort of a bit of a fuddy-duddy character and a bit of a fuddy-duddy performance, but you never feel he is a comedy character.

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He provides some comic relief, but he's never a comedy character.

192
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Peter Gilmore is brazen.

193
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I kind of fancy him.

194
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He's got great hair.

195
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Lots and lots of hair.

196
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Huge quantities of it.

197
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And there's that...

198
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Like enough for 4 per twees from season 11, I think.

199
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There's a great bit, I think, in episode 3 where during the hearing, Turlow keeps going on about the tractators and everyone tries to shut him up and Gilmore just sidles up to him and says, I want to hear all about this.

200
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He's a great.

201
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He is a great character because do you remember Cree song in the...

202
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Yes, Norman Jones, later Hieronymus.

203
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He starts off as being sort of really military and rigid and ends up being quite thoughtful and interesting.

204
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And I think Brazen does that as well.

205
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You know, you think that Brazen's an antagonist because he's Mr. Shouty, and because he doesn't care about the retrogrades being killed and all of that sort of thing, and, you know, he's the obstacle trying to prevent them from getting into the ship to get the battery.

206
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So he looks like he's going to be an antagonist, but he's actually really genuinely sympathetic.

207
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And when he reveals that he saw what happened to Captain Revere towards the end, Yeah.

208
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You know, it becomes clear that he really does care about what happens to the colony.

209
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He really does want to protect people.

210
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He's not not just acting out of kind of military discipline or something.

211
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And then of course, he sacrifices himself.

212
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And it's really clear that he really loves Plantagenet as well, like a father. you know, that comes across.

213
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And his sacrifice, again, yeah, you're right, Richard, that machine is very, very clumsy and it kind of it kind of robs the moment somewhat.

214
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That and the realisation that the tractators ruin the show.

215
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We wanted zombie, didn't we?

216
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And we thought that's what beginning.

217
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Again, the flexibility that you talked about that's envisioned by the writers and that these things would, you know, be dancers and be able to roll up into a ball and roll about.

218
00:14:34.320 --> 00:14:36.779
But they were never going to be able to realise that.

219
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So they end up being big, stupid looking fibreglass things with the hands.

220
00:14:42.179 --> 00:14:49.559
But compare the reveal of the Tractators at the end of episode two, when Turlo and Norna walk past them and they're just part of the walls and then they turn.

221
00:14:49.620 --> 00:14:55.980
You know, I think I think it cuts a few seconds too late, but compare that to excellent skimmers.

222
00:14:56.039 --> 00:14:57.299
I'm just going to do that every week.

223
00:14:58.259 --> 00:15:02.820
God, Ron Jones, after your last 2 failures.

224
00:15:02.879 --> 00:15:04.440
Well, bloody done, mate.

225
00:15:04.440 --> 00:15:06.779
Well, you are doing a brilliant job with this.

226
00:15:07.080 --> 00:15:09.419
I think everyone liked him and got on.

227
00:15:09.480 --> 00:15:11.340
It was still a very tight shoot, wasn't it?

228
00:15:11.399 --> 00:15:13.440
They were really running behind.

229
00:15:13.559 --> 00:15:17.580
I'm like, worries of the deep, which at least had a little bit of pre-filming.

230
00:15:17.700 --> 00:15:26.340
This was entirely studio bound and compared to other studio bound stories, like say, actually, not even terminus, because terminus had pre-filming.

231
00:15:26.399 --> 00:15:32.220
Actually, the studio pound stories of the Davidson era tend to do quite well for like...

232
00:15:32.220 --> 00:15:34.860
For to Doomsday is quite...

233
00:15:34.860 --> 00:15:35.639
Enlightenment.

234
00:15:35.700 --> 00:15:45.720
You know, they're up against the clock, but I think possibly because they don't have the filming element, the crews are a bit more aware we've got to try and make this look good.

235
00:15:45.779 --> 00:15:49.500
I think the sets look amazing. good, actually.

236
00:15:49.559 --> 00:15:51.960
I think we've gone on about this, so they won't do it again.

237
00:15:52.019 --> 00:15:53.759
I don't think we mind doing that though.

238
00:15:53.820 --> 00:15:56.399
Everything's visually interesting.

239
00:15:56.460 --> 00:15:57.960
Like, the shots are interesting.

240
00:15:58.019 --> 00:15:59.159
The colour is really good.

241
00:15:59.220 --> 00:16:03.120
Gorgeous matte paintings to make the ship look huge.

242
00:16:03.179 --> 00:16:03.779
Yeah.

243
00:16:03.840 --> 00:16:04.440
Yeah, yeah.

244
00:16:04.500 --> 00:16:07.019
It does feel like proper 70s.

245
00:16:07.019 --> 00:16:08.519
Well, who am I thinking of?

246
00:16:08.580 --> 00:16:09.480
But maybe Philip C.

247
00:16:09.480 --> 00:16:09.720
Dick.

248
00:16:09.779 --> 00:16:11.220
Anyway, that doesn't matter, does it?

249
00:16:11.340 --> 00:16:12.120
a whole lot of writers.

250
00:16:12.179 --> 00:16:23.940
And that great set for the track tators down underneath with the big spherical cage to keep Plantagenet in and like it's a weird open space with all this sort of negative space instead of walls.

251
00:16:24.000 --> 00:16:25.500
Yes, we love the negative space.

252
00:16:25.559 --> 00:16:28.200
Yeah, no, I think it's really, it looks great.

253
00:16:28.320 --> 00:16:31.919
I think the music is fantastic Tastes surreal.

254
00:16:31.919 --> 00:16:33.059
Possibly go wrong, yeah.

255
00:16:33.120 --> 00:16:42.539
And it's kind of weird because most of episodes two, three, and 4 is people wandering about caves, but it never feels boring.

256
00:16:42.600 --> 00:16:43.379
No.

257
00:16:43.379 --> 00:16:47.399
And there's lots of capture and escape and release of what have you.

258
00:16:47.460 --> 00:16:54.240
You get that beautiful moment where the doctor and Tegan are captured and they're sliding along on their butts.

259
00:16:54.539 --> 00:16:56.159
So to speak.

260
00:16:56.220 --> 00:17:06.359
And again, they're really charming in that scene, and the whole thing with Tegan being an android, and the doctor and the gravis flirting outrageously.

261
00:17:06.420 --> 00:17:15.359
I mean, the doctor really torments Tegan quite a lot in this story and it's really fun to watch and there's really something going on with the relationship there.

262
00:17:15.420 --> 00:17:22.440
Is there a moment in episode one where like Turlow and Teagan just roll their eyes at each other about how irritating the doctor is?

263
00:17:22.500 --> 00:17:23.160
Yeah, yeah.

264
00:17:23.220 --> 00:17:26.880
I think it's when he he's been saying, we can't interfere, we can't interfere, we can't interfere.

265
00:17:26.940 --> 00:17:27.779
Right, I'm going to operate.

266
00:17:27.839 --> 00:17:30.480
You go get this stuff from the TARDS and they just go, oh, fuck, God.

267
00:17:30.539 --> 00:17:39.119
I love it when he rushes in to save Plantagenet and tells Tegan to rip the wires down off the walls.

268
00:17:39.119 --> 00:17:39.779
Just put them up.

269
00:17:39.779 --> 00:17:42.779
Yes, jolly good. go and rip them down again.

270
00:17:42.839 --> 00:17:44.579
He's so great.

271
00:17:45.599 --> 00:17:53.579
I mean, there are a few things I look at with the story and go, well, why is that like the doctor being so concerned about the time lords finding Addy's interfering?

272
00:17:53.640 --> 00:17:55.140
But at the same time...

273
00:17:55.140 --> 00:17:56.400
It is lovely.

274
00:17:56.460 --> 00:17:58.680
It's very 60s, except it's got time laws.

275
00:17:58.740 --> 00:18:00.720
We're at the edge of the known universe.

276
00:18:00.779 --> 00:18:07.019
And there's some really great fan wanky things to think about why the Tartars can't go any further and where this is.

277
00:18:07.079 --> 00:18:11.759
You know, is this 2000000 years in the future with the mysterious planet?

278
00:18:11.819 --> 00:18:13.619
No, the Marcus 10 million.

279
00:18:13.740 --> 00:18:18.119
So are we, or are we the end of the world with Eccleston?

280
00:18:18.180 --> 00:18:22.920
No, I think that we would be foolish to try.

281
00:18:22.920 --> 00:18:25.440
No, chronology of the guy.

282
00:18:25.500 --> 00:18:40.079
But this does give rise to the fantastic scene where Turlo is reading off about the planet in the Varuna system where he's talking about the doomed planet Earth with absolute relish, just just Susan.

283
00:18:40.140 --> 00:18:43.559
Yes, just to piss off Tegan slash.

284
00:18:43.619 --> 00:18:50.099
But what I love is Tegan in season 19 would have stomped her feet and been shouting and screaming.

285
00:18:50.160 --> 00:18:52.980
Tegan in this just kind of gives him daggers.

286
00:18:53.819 --> 00:19:00.539
You know, she doesn't need, you know, makes a political statement without even raising her eyebrows.

287
00:19:00.599 --> 00:19:09.599
So let's think about the things that lift what is essentially a story about people wandering around studio corridors talking to one another.

288
00:19:09.660 --> 00:19:11.400
What lifts it?

289
00:19:12.119 --> 00:19:14.519
And like it is the music, it is the set design.

290
00:19:14.579 --> 00:19:32.880
But I think that there are some things in the plot and you touched upon it, the incredible high concept, the fact that this is a colony of people from the future, maybe the last people alive, you know, who the doctor's trying to save, and that gives it a kind of mythical quality.

291
00:19:33.000 --> 00:19:35.099
It certainly does.

292
00:19:35.160 --> 00:19:41.640
And it, again, it's doing stuff that bid me does really well that we don't see many other writers in Doctor Who doing.

293
00:19:41.700 --> 00:19:42.839
That's being brave.

294
00:19:42.900 --> 00:19:43.980
Yeah, yeah.

295
00:19:44.039 --> 00:19:44.940
Yeah, absolutely.

296
00:19:45.000 --> 00:19:46.619
I was having a discussion.

297
00:19:46.680 --> 00:19:52.380
This is a bit off topic, but I was having a discussion with a friend the other day about, um, uh, the hungry earth and cold blood.

298
00:19:52.440 --> 00:19:53.279
Yes.

299
00:19:53.339 --> 00:19:55.140
I'm meant to mention that here.

300
00:19:55.200 --> 00:20:00.960
And, you know, you've got the link to Frontios with people being dragged under the earth.

301
00:20:01.019 --> 00:20:06.000
But the other thing is, people talk about that story being so disappointing because of the ending.

302
00:20:06.059 --> 00:20:12.720
And I agree the ending's disappointing because that was a real chance to go, you know, we're not in Russell T. Davies, Doctor Who universe anymore.

303
00:20:12.779 --> 00:20:18.240
We're now going to have lizard people wandering about the streets with humans for the next few years.

304
00:20:18.480 --> 00:20:21.180
And that would have been a brave thing to do.

305
00:20:21.240 --> 00:20:25.440
And that is the kind of brave thing that Christopher Hamilton bid me does here.

306
00:20:25.559 --> 00:20:28.859
At the end of the story, they don't have a thriving colony.

307
00:20:28.920 --> 00:20:30.960
They're still on starvation point.

308
00:20:31.019 --> 00:20:34.680
They just have a chance to start again and the doctor just goes off.

309
00:20:34.740 --> 00:20:41.099
It's not the end of the sun makers where it's like, now you're completely free and you have all this technology.

310
00:20:41.160 --> 00:20:43.259
It's like, actually, you're in the same position you were before.

311
00:20:43.319 --> 00:20:46.440
There's just nothing acting externally on you now.

312
00:20:46.500 --> 00:20:49.680
It's a happy ending, but not a miraculous ending.

313
00:20:49.680 --> 00:20:51.599
And I think it's more realistic because of that.

314
00:20:51.660 --> 00:20:53.339
And it raises the stakes.

315
00:20:53.400 --> 00:20:55.680
It just makes it a little bit more interesting.

316
00:20:55.799 --> 00:21:07.259
I think your stuff as well, Richard, about the doctor's reluctance to interfere because he's a timelord and he'll be in trouble for intervening at what must be a crunch point in human history.

317
00:21:07.319 --> 00:21:13.440
And the fact that Gravis knows of Galifrea knows what a TARDIS is and, you know, knows about the doctor, I think.

318
00:21:13.500 --> 00:21:15.180
Although there's a lot of that.

319
00:21:15.240 --> 00:21:18.960
We had the Silurians knowing far too much about all of that in the story.

320
00:21:19.019 --> 00:21:21.119
But I do like what you're saying here.

321
00:21:21.180 --> 00:21:24.420
This to me, because Bidmeat is so clever and so good.

322
00:21:24.480 --> 00:21:28.859
Hello, Chris, is so good at what he does and the high concept stuff.

323
00:21:28.920 --> 00:21:30.720
I think this also touches on philosophy.

324
00:21:30.779 --> 00:21:52.680
You know about Wittkenstein's piece on Tractatus, which Bidmead said, you know, bully for him for saying he said he wasn't aware of or hadn't recalled when he wrote this, but it was basically, with constraints, Tractatus's piece was on the mathematical promulgations and the way we're viewing the world a purely solipsistic and that there isn't anything a priori.

325
00:21:52.740 --> 00:21:55.200
So in other words, it's all nurture, it's not nature.

326
00:21:55.259 --> 00:22:20.220
So our way of living in the world, a way of viewing the world, our social constructs, all the rest of it, even and he's coming from a mathematical point that what we see as universal truths, and this is pre-Hawkins, but what we see as universal truths, are actually simply out applied code for rationalising, in a Newtonian sense, that very small sliver of reality that we can see.

327
00:22:20.279 --> 00:22:30.000
And I like that Bidmead looks at pretty much all his scripts and says that we are actually little microbes on a Petri dish and we can only deal with what we have and what we have here.

328
00:22:30.059 --> 00:22:39.779
And that is both terrifying and humbling, and actually kind and isolating, but it's actually kind of, well, we just have to do the best we can and make the most of it.

329
00:22:39.839 --> 00:22:52.200
And there's actually a really lovely, if you want to say, almost a Buddhist concept to it, because Doctor Who talks about that a lot as well as we've noticed, is to just say, be the best you possibly can, that is your purpose in life.

330
00:22:52.319 --> 00:22:55.799
Your only purpose is you have a very limited horizon.

331
00:22:55.859 --> 00:23:01.799
You live on a tiny speck at the end of a barely fashionable arm of the spiral galaxy.

332
00:23:01.859 --> 00:23:04.440
Do what you can and be the best that you can be.

333
00:23:04.500 --> 00:23:10.680
And this story seems to say the same thing, even with threats that are, that couldn't be any greater.

334
00:23:10.740 --> 00:23:12.660
You actually have the sky falling on your heads.

335
00:23:12.720 --> 00:23:21.779
We've got an asterisk comic villain here that distends and distorts gravity and destroys the whole process of Doctor Who itself, which is the TARDIS.

336
00:23:21.900 --> 00:23:26.279
This script is about pulling apart the concept and precept of what Doctor Who is.

337
00:23:26.339 --> 00:23:30.359
Did you get a sense when you were watching this that the TARDIS was gone now?

338
00:23:30.480 --> 00:23:31.859
Where is this gonna go?

339
00:23:31.920 --> 00:23:32.819
You know what?

340
00:23:32.880 --> 00:23:35.460
I only have very vague memories of this story as a kid.

341
00:23:35.519 --> 00:23:37.380
It was one I had when I was 5 years old.

342
00:23:37.440 --> 00:23:40.920
And what I remember about it is watching it with my brother.

343
00:23:40.920 --> 00:23:45.359
And my brother was 9 years older than me, so we weren't incredibly close as kids.

344
00:23:45.420 --> 00:23:55.680
But I was so terrified after watching this at the age of 5 that my brother actually let me sleep with him in his bed because I couldn't sleep otherwise.

345
00:23:55.740 --> 00:23:56.940
We had a bunk.

346
00:23:57.000 --> 00:24:03.000
And I remember for years afterwards, if I ever pulled it off the shelves, he would say you're not allowed to watch that one.

347
00:24:03.539 --> 00:24:06.299
Because we're never having that evening again.

348
00:24:06.960 --> 00:24:10.559
Was it the cliffhanger to episode one that scared you?

349
00:24:10.680 --> 00:24:12.480
I think it was the decapitation.

350
00:24:12.539 --> 00:24:13.980
Yeah, that is awful.

351
00:24:14.039 --> 00:24:15.119
But that's the thing.

352
00:24:15.180 --> 00:24:17.700
I can't remember the Cliffhanger to episode one, but watching it now.

353
00:24:17.759 --> 00:24:23.279
I kind of feel like it's similar to when the same thing happens in the magician's apprentice.

354
00:24:23.339 --> 00:24:27.480
You know the TARDIS is not going to be destroyed because then you don't have a show.

355
00:24:28.319 --> 00:24:30.599
You know the backstory, don't you?

356
00:24:30.660 --> 00:24:31.980
JNT.

357
00:24:31.980 --> 00:24:33.180
Thank you.

358
00:24:33.240 --> 00:24:35.339
He wanted to get rid of the TARDS, yeah.

359
00:24:35.400 --> 00:24:40.259
But I think it was him just doing his normal publicity thing to try and up the stakes.

360
00:24:40.319 --> 00:24:41.220
D dog dog.

361
00:24:41.279 --> 00:24:49.740
Remember that we were watching it at the time at the 1st run when we saw Frontios, we hadn't seen Resurrection of the Daleks.

362
00:24:49.799 --> 00:24:50.279
Yeah, true.

363
00:24:50.279 --> 00:24:52.980
And so we didn't know that it was going to be fair.

364
00:24:53.039 --> 00:24:54.359
So you thought it might actually?

365
00:24:54.359 --> 00:25:07.200
Possibly, it was we're young and maybe, you know, a little bit naive, but I remember being incredibly shocked by that cliffhanger and finding the beginning of episode 2 really bleak.

366
00:25:07.259 --> 00:25:11.700
And I think it is a shame that they don't really follow through on it.

367
00:25:11.759 --> 00:25:24.240
The closest analogue I could think of was the impossible planet where you get that scene between Billy and the doctor talking about having to settle down and get mortgages and carpet and stuff like that because they don't have carpet doesn't it?

368
00:25:24.299 --> 00:25:25.200
It does.

369
00:25:25.259 --> 00:25:26.519
Tenants obsessed with it.

370
00:25:26.579 --> 00:25:28.680
Oh, it really brings on my allergies.

371
00:25:28.740 --> 00:25:31.740
But this doesn't quite do that, does it?

372
00:25:31.799 --> 00:25:35.640
There's one or 2 lines about not having a tartus, but they never really reflect about it.

373
00:25:35.700 --> 00:25:39.539
It does the usual thing of, I'll just put that over there and not think about it.

374
00:25:39.660 --> 00:25:41.579
He's been the busiest doctor.

375
00:25:41.819 --> 00:25:43.859
And he's done that before.

376
00:25:43.920 --> 00:25:45.180
Something horrible has happened.

377
00:25:45.240 --> 00:25:47.519
Adrik, I just won't think about that right now.

378
00:25:47.579 --> 00:25:55.500
It's like that scene in The Simpsons where Ned's got his 2 sons that I can't remember why, but they're talking about women and one of his sons.

379
00:25:55.559 --> 00:26:03.779
Yeah, I think I think Rod, his youngest son says, girls are so lucky, they get to wear dresses, and they just says, one problem at a time, running.

380
00:26:06.839 --> 00:26:09.900
I think there's something in that for most listeners.

381
00:26:10.019 --> 00:26:14.460
I think as a kid, I looked at that.

382
00:26:14.519 --> 00:26:16.019
And with the magician's apprentice.

383
00:26:16.079 --> 00:26:20.759
It's like, I don't care that I know that this cliffhanger will have a solution.

384
00:26:20.819 --> 00:26:22.259
I care about what the solution is.

385
00:26:22.319 --> 00:26:24.240
I don't actually think the lady's been sawn in half.

386
00:26:24.420 --> 00:26:26.759
I care about how the trick works.

387
00:26:26.819 --> 00:26:28.619
That's what Bidmead wants us to do.

388
00:26:28.680 --> 00:26:32.220
He wants us to be right in there with the characters and solve the problem in the moment.

389
00:26:32.279 --> 00:26:35.160
Yeah, but we don't get a resolution until episode four.

390
00:26:35.220 --> 00:26:36.599
I mean we are left with it.

391
00:26:36.660 --> 00:26:38.700
And I think that resolution he does.

392
00:26:38.759 --> 00:26:45.960
And we've talked about this before how Christopher Hamilton Bidmead is a huge fan of using science in the program, real measurable science, but he uses magic as well.

393
00:26:46.019 --> 00:26:46.859
He always does.

394
00:26:46.859 --> 00:26:53.640
And I do think that putting the TARDIS back together, there is a bit of an explanation, but it's a great combination of science and magic.

395
00:26:53.700 --> 00:26:58.980
And I love the, like the doctor says, you know, the internal dimensions have been dispersed.

396
00:26:59.039 --> 00:27:05.160
It's like, actually, yes, that fits everything we know about the title, so that it could just disperse its dimensions around this area.

397
00:27:05.220 --> 00:27:07.440
It is a little bit of a cheat.

398
00:27:07.500 --> 00:27:11.220
It's a little bit of a cheat, but at the same time, it still works within the context.

399
00:27:11.279 --> 00:27:19.200
Like in a way, as much as I enjoy the magician's apprentice, which is familiar, the doctor at the end just saying, oh, it's the hostile action dispersal system.

400
00:27:19.259 --> 00:27:22.079
It's like, um you've never mentioned this before.

401
00:27:22.140 --> 00:27:26.759
It's like that bit at the end of day of the doctor where he says, Clara often asks me if I dream.

402
00:27:26.819 --> 00:27:30.180
It's like, no, she has never asked you that for the last 8 episodes.

403
00:27:30.299 --> 00:27:31.500
Not once.

404
00:27:32.220 --> 00:27:35.339
But they never stop talking about it between episodes.

405
00:27:35.400 --> 00:27:39.059
Yeah, that's all they do, which is why, thankfully, we never get to see that.

406
00:27:39.119 --> 00:27:41.940
It's a shame that camera was off because we were just talking.

407
00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:50.039
I think this is a little bit fairer and once it's explained, you kind of go, oh, you know, I can understand how that works within the rules of the program.

408
00:27:50.039 --> 00:27:56.039
But you don't think the gravis should have realised that we'd have been cut off from his chums once he put the TARDIS back together?

409
00:27:56.099 --> 00:28:00.000
It's Peter Rabbit and the farmer, you know, oh no, you couldn't possibly be strong enough to do that.

410
00:28:00.059 --> 00:28:04.140
I've got friends working on that film right now. getting shot here in Sydney.

411
00:28:04.200 --> 00:28:05.579
Oh, Peter Rabbit.

412
00:28:05.640 --> 00:28:06.900
Not that I've ever done this at work.

413
00:28:06.960 --> 00:28:08.759
I've totally done this.

414
00:28:08.819 --> 00:28:23.220
But I think we have all at some point, there's been something that's actually someone else's job to do, and they try to put it on you, and you just point out how actually they're much better suited to it, and you do it in such a way that they go, oh, yes, you're quite right.

415
00:28:23.279 --> 00:28:25.559
I'm much better. and that's what the doctor does here.

416
00:28:25.619 --> 00:28:32.759
You know, he uses flattery to fool the gravis to the point that gravis doesn't really know he's being fooled until it's too late.

417
00:28:32.819 --> 00:28:33.900
I know you never realised.

418
00:28:33.960 --> 00:28:36.420
He looks so sweet.

419
00:28:36.480 --> 00:28:39.420
But it must be one passive aggressive number.

420
00:28:39.480 --> 00:28:40.920
It's like an inverted Oreo.

421
00:28:40.980 --> 00:28:43.200
All the dark stuff's in the middle.

422
00:28:44.460 --> 00:28:47.339
Lick it out and see listeners.

423
00:28:47.339 --> 00:28:48.539
Oh my.

424
00:28:48.599 --> 00:28:50.339
I was talking about biscuits.

425
00:28:50.400 --> 00:28:52.380
I love Peter's performance in that scene.

426
00:28:52.440 --> 00:28:54.539
I was like, no, no, leave me the TARDIS, please.

427
00:28:54.599 --> 00:28:57.240
Yeah, that he's so good in that scene.

428
00:28:57.240 --> 00:28:58.559
And the sort of Turlo pops up.

429
00:28:58.619 --> 00:28:59.039
What are you doing?

430
00:28:59.099 --> 00:28:59.460
Get down.

431
00:28:59.519 --> 00:29:02.759
I like that they are actually witcherty grubs.

432
00:29:02.819 --> 00:29:05.759
Fibreglass, which is grubs, yeah.

433
00:29:05.819 --> 00:29:08.819
Is the gravis a different species or is it like a rank?

434
00:29:08.880 --> 00:29:10.559
Like, do you get promoted to gravis?

435
00:29:10.619 --> 00:29:13.019
It's like Queen Admiral and all soldier ants.

436
00:29:13.079 --> 00:29:17.039
He's the only one with an intelligence and then the rest of it's the gestalt.

437
00:29:17.099 --> 00:29:29.220
They call it an society's 4th level intelligences, and we still don't understand quite how something with such a simple autonomic nervous system can actually behave, like in a collective intelligence in such very complex ways.

438
00:29:29.279 --> 00:29:30.420
Lots of good stuff in this.

439
00:29:30.480 --> 00:29:36.000
And the zerbie was based on the same thing, as you know, Bill Strutton sitting and watching his tiny farm of Christopher H.

440
00:29:36.000 --> 00:29:41.579
Bidmeads in Adelaide. that he kept all running about being told off by Lala Wards.

441
00:29:41.640 --> 00:29:43.740
It's the TARDIS.

442
00:29:43.859 --> 00:29:45.119
Chris.

443
00:29:45.180 --> 00:29:46.500
What's that?

444
00:29:46.559 --> 00:29:49.079
Is that pure science or is that magic?

445
00:29:49.140 --> 00:29:52.559
You can hear her doing it, can't you, in her missy hat and the umbrella?

446
00:29:52.619 --> 00:29:55.079
10 years before this, there was a great film.

447
00:29:55.140 --> 00:30:06.180
Thank you for reminding me, Richard, called Phase 4, which is about extremely intelligent ants, not giant ants, regular size ants, and these scientists investigating them.

448
00:30:06.240 --> 00:30:08.880
I won't say much more about it at this stage.

449
00:30:08.940 --> 00:30:34.319
Dear listeners, I do suggest tracking it down, because recently they've released it with its original ending, because the studio truncated the ending, because it's a 70s sci-fi film, the ending is not necessarily narrative, I will just say, but it's an excellent film, and it kind of this story explores a little bit the different thought processes from humanoid and insectoid life.

450
00:30:34.440 --> 00:30:37.200
Phase 4 goes even further with that.

451
00:30:37.259 --> 00:30:43.380
And it would not surprise me at all if, if Christopher Hamilton Fibbean had seen phase four.

452
00:30:43.440 --> 00:30:44.279
It seems like the kind of thing.

453
00:30:44.279 --> 00:30:51.599
Or indeed, that John Collins Empire of the Ants, or whatever it was called when similar thing when she played the Lala Ward character in Pearl.

454
00:30:51.660 --> 00:30:52.920
I'm just making this up as I go along.

455
00:30:52.980 --> 00:30:56.099
Well, she is actually in an ant film.

456
00:30:56.160 --> 00:30:57.839
No, no, it's in Lucky Pictures, remember?

457
00:30:57.900 --> 00:30:59.279
That's right.

458
00:30:59.339 --> 00:31:01.680
Or William Shatner's Kingdom of the Spiders.

459
00:31:01.740 --> 00:31:12.420
Yeah, where he played Jenny Lick. that's right So I want to talk about another thing because Christopher Hamilton bit me. is obsessed with Shakespeare.

460
00:31:12.480 --> 00:31:13.079
Yes.

461
00:31:13.140 --> 00:31:15.119
Yeah, there's a lot of Shakespeare.

462
00:31:15.180 --> 00:31:16.680
Just think he likes good stories.

463
00:31:16.740 --> 00:31:18.240
Well, he went to Rada, you know.

464
00:31:18.299 --> 00:31:22.079
We're going to really psych up to him and ask that he listens to this.

465
00:31:22.140 --> 00:31:24.059
There's a stack of Shakespeare.

466
00:31:24.059 --> 00:31:26.700
There always is, yes, Shakespeare in season 18.

467
00:31:26.880 --> 00:31:29.759
And then here he's got a character called Plantagenet.

468
00:31:29.819 --> 00:31:33.240
And there's a huge plot.

469
00:31:33.299 --> 00:31:36.059
Yes, and nothing went wrong with those Henrys.

470
00:31:37.259 --> 00:31:46.079
But it's the idea of the importance of the king to the health of a society. and also about fitness to be king.

471
00:31:46.140 --> 00:31:52.619
And so he's got these sort of really obviously named characters like revere, brazen.

472
00:31:52.799 --> 00:31:57.779
Revere, whom everyone reveres, you know, like he's a father figure to the entire colony.

473
00:31:57.839 --> 00:32:01.559
Like Norna tells in that beautifully acted moment.

474
00:32:01.619 --> 00:32:07.559
Norna tells that story about sitting on his lap and being told that the earth is hungry.

475
00:32:07.799 --> 00:32:13.319
You know, all he has to do is demand that the research room is sealed and it's sealed even after he's died.

476
00:32:13.380 --> 00:32:17.039
You know, in some ways he's kind of the perfect leader.

477
00:32:17.099 --> 00:32:27.480
And then you've got Jeff Rawl, who'll go on to play the Mona Lisa's gay sidekick in the Sarah Jane Adventures, who's physically small and...

478
00:32:27.539 --> 00:32:29.700
Yeah, he did other things as well on television.

479
00:32:29.819 --> 00:32:30.299
No, I know.

480
00:32:30.359 --> 00:32:31.740
But do you know what I mean?

481
00:32:31.799 --> 00:32:33.299
skinny and young looking.

482
00:32:33.359 --> 00:32:34.740
Yeah, he's great in this.

483
00:32:34.799 --> 00:32:37.319
And he's trying to be Shakespearean.

484
00:32:37.380 --> 00:32:39.299
He's trying to be a Shakespearean king.

485
00:32:39.359 --> 00:32:47.640
He even does that thing where, you know, he's injured by the bombardment and he tries not to show it for a long period of time.

486
00:32:47.640 --> 00:32:53.039
And that idiot in worries even deep had done something sort of fairly similar, but here it's done really well.

487
00:32:53.039 --> 00:32:58.019
And it is all about what makes someone fit to be a leader.

488
00:32:58.079 --> 00:33:06.420
And it's a shame that, you know, kind of the overall conclusion is sort of conservative because all of the people who kind of leave the colony and become retrogrades.

489
00:33:06.480 --> 00:33:13.200
They're bad people and they kind of virtually lose their humanity, you know, including the one who looks like he's from the village people.

490
00:33:13.259 --> 00:33:15.539
Yeah, the one with the moustache, the Scottish guy.

491
00:33:15.599 --> 00:33:28.440
Yeah, yeah, yeah. he's amazing That's a part of the story that doesn't quite work because you've got cockerel, the chief orderly who's Brazen's right hand man and then betrays him when Plantagenet goes missing and starts to lead a revolt.

492
00:33:28.500 --> 00:33:34.200
But then all it needs is for Norna to walk in and say, oh, Plantagenet might still be alive, you know.

493
00:33:34.319 --> 00:33:35.400
And that's it.

494
00:33:35.519 --> 00:33:36.180
No, they stop.

495
00:33:36.240 --> 00:33:38.099
It's like, oh, okay, we better stop.

496
00:33:38.160 --> 00:33:39.480
But it is chaos.

497
00:33:39.480 --> 00:33:47.759
And you know the idea as well, that Shakespearean idea where Nate is disrupted when the, you know, pathetic fantasy, I believe it's.

498
00:33:47.819 --> 00:33:48.539
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

499
00:33:48.599 --> 00:33:54.480
So, you know, got Duncan's horses eating each other and the sheet are dead, shrieking and gibbering in the Roman streets.

500
00:33:55.200 --> 00:33:57.000
Brussels sprouts begin to taste delicious.

501
00:33:57.059 --> 00:33:59.400
Cats and dogs living together.

502
00:34:00.000 --> 00:34:03.900
Corey Bernardi becoming a senator in South Australia.

503
00:34:03.960 --> 00:34:05.099
Yeah, yeah, again.

504
00:34:05.519 --> 00:34:07.380
That trick never works.

505
00:34:07.920 --> 00:34:10.079
I also think the other thing.

506
00:34:10.139 --> 00:34:23.219
Can I just say one other thing, which I think is amazingly good and lifts this, you know, above kind of the general quality of the material, is the reveal halfway through that the threat comes from below the ground and not from the sky?

507
00:34:23.280 --> 00:34:24.719
That's gorgeous.

508
00:34:24.780 --> 00:34:25.380
Yeah, clever.

509
00:34:25.440 --> 00:34:30.239
And really gets to base guttural primal fears.

510
00:34:30.599 --> 00:34:34.380
Stephen Moffatt does it very nicely as well, but Bidme did it first.

511
00:34:34.440 --> 00:34:35.400
Yes, yes.

512
00:34:35.460 --> 00:34:46.500
One person we briefly mentioned, but plays a very large role in the story is Mark Strickson, who sort of has that meltdown at the end of the story.

513
00:34:46.559 --> 00:34:47.280
Yes he does.

514
00:34:47.340 --> 00:34:55.440
And I find that so effective, and I find it particularly effective because he's been uneasy, uneasy, uneasy, and then we don't see him for a while, and then he runs in screaming.

515
00:34:55.500 --> 00:35:11.039
I think it's so good that we don't see the moment he breaks because I think for an actor, that would be the toughest moment to portray convincingly, but going straight to the point of breakdown and then slowly coming out of that.

516
00:35:11.099 --> 00:35:14.280
And it's not like in the next scene he's fine and he's lucid.

517
00:35:14.340 --> 00:35:18.420
It takes him time and he has to be coaxed out of it, as would happen in real life.

518
00:35:18.539 --> 00:35:22.440
It's obviously still compressed from what would probably happen in real life.

519
00:35:22.500 --> 00:35:25.920
But Mark plays it so well.

520
00:35:25.980 --> 00:35:35.219
And, you know, in that scene where he's with William Lucas as Mr. Range and Norna's gone missing, he's just staring off and drooling and there's no one there behind the eyes.

521
00:35:35.280 --> 00:35:38.639
He's completely retreated in on himself. is gingers.

522
00:35:38.699 --> 00:35:39.840
Did you?

523
00:35:40.079 --> 00:35:41.039
We haven't mentioned that before.

524
00:35:41.099 --> 00:35:43.320
We may have much.

525
00:35:43.380 --> 00:35:44.880
No souls, you see.

526
00:35:44.940 --> 00:35:48.420
We had Mark Strickson living here in New South Wales.

527
00:35:48.480 --> 00:35:52.559
He was at UND at the University of New England and Armadale.

528
00:35:52.619 --> 00:35:57.599
And he used to come to conventions and we used to have plays.

529
00:35:57.659 --> 00:35:59.639
We used to write plays and act in them.

530
00:35:59.699 --> 00:36:01.920
I was very famous myself.

531
00:36:02.039 --> 00:36:03.360
Yeah, actually, at one point.

532
00:36:03.420 --> 00:36:05.280
But Mark Strickson was in one of them.

533
00:36:05.340 --> 00:36:06.239
Do you remember this, Richard?

534
00:36:06.300 --> 00:36:07.619
Yes, he played Travis, didn't he?

535
00:36:07.980 --> 00:36:13.320
He actually did his line, attractators, I've seen them line.

536
00:36:13.380 --> 00:36:24.840
But he did it like with a beer, a can of beer in one hand, and he took a giant swig of beer and then said track taker that I've seen them and he was going all over the place.

537
00:36:24.840 --> 00:36:28.320
He was spinning it over everyone. that's exactly how you recorded the original.

538
00:36:29.880 --> 00:36:32.219
He gets to redeem himself.

539
00:36:32.280 --> 00:36:38.460
Like he gets to lose it and have some kind of, you know, as of his stick, ancestral memory crisis thing.

540
00:36:38.519 --> 00:36:39.840
But then he gets to be brave.

541
00:36:39.900 --> 00:36:41.760
He goes back down in the Yeah, yeah.

542
00:36:41.820 --> 00:36:42.539
Comodores.

543
00:36:42.599 --> 00:36:52.380
It's like the chemistry between Mark Strickson and Leslie Donlop is lovely and it's it's very rare in the 80s that we get a hint of romance between characters.

544
00:36:52.440 --> 00:36:57.659
We had it between Tegan and Mariner, but that was a bit uncomfortable because of the controlling shit.

545
00:36:57.719 --> 00:36:58.619
Exactly.

546
00:36:58.679 --> 00:37:00.900
It was really...

547
00:37:00.900 --> 00:37:03.000
And him being so incredibly kind of...

548
00:37:03.119 --> 00:37:04.079
Oh, I meant her baby.

549
00:37:05.760 --> 00:37:15.599
But here we have a relationship between equals where they tease each other a bit and they're obviously fond of each other. do each other's own makeup. right.

550
00:37:15.659 --> 00:37:16.559
Tell stories.

551
00:37:16.860 --> 00:37:20.099
But they're beautiful in each other's jumpsuits.

552
00:37:20.159 --> 00:37:21.719
Oh, sorry, I'm back on worries if I do.

553
00:37:21.780 --> 00:37:26.460
Well, back in Worries of Deep, I was talking about how Turlo wants to impress the doctor.

554
00:37:26.519 --> 00:37:29.760
What is something Davison always does when he's deciding where to go?

555
00:37:29.820 --> 00:37:30.659
He flips a coin.

556
00:37:30.719 --> 00:37:32.159
How does Turlow decide what to do?

557
00:37:32.340 --> 00:37:34.260
He uses...

558
00:37:34.320 --> 00:37:35.880
He uses coins.

559
00:37:35.940 --> 00:37:38.340
He puts a coin behind his back and she has to pick.

560
00:37:38.460 --> 00:37:42.599
But it turns out because this is Turlow, he's actually put a coin in both hands.

561
00:37:42.659 --> 00:37:46.679
So he'll always go down, but he's kind of trying to impress her anyway.

562
00:37:46.739 --> 00:37:51.059
Even that 2 Corpira piece dialogue where you blow through it for luck.

563
00:37:51.119 --> 00:37:53.760
Like, that doesn't need to be there or anything.

564
00:37:53.820 --> 00:37:54.900
It's just a bit of detail.

565
00:37:54.960 --> 00:37:56.280
Yeah, which is just good.

566
00:37:56.340 --> 00:37:58.920
It's a bit, yeah, considering they had so little time.

567
00:37:58.980 --> 00:38:00.599
They've done very well on this one.

568
00:38:00.659 --> 00:38:06.960
I remember strictly complaining about the lack of rehearsal time and just how raw and how awful.

569
00:38:07.019 --> 00:38:20.880
There's that scene back in Warriors of the Deep, dear listener, when Tara Ward and Janet were mucking around, believing it was a rehearsal, and they were actually taking the piss out of it, and then they were told, no, that's in the can. what we're going with.

570
00:38:21.000 --> 00:38:22.079
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

571
00:38:22.139 --> 00:38:23.400
And they were horrified.

572
00:38:23.460 --> 00:38:30.300
Well, Mark says the same thing, and he said on this one, he said, I remember him talking about how embarrassed he was by the hyperbole of his performance.

573
00:38:30.420 --> 00:38:31.019
I think it's fine.

574
00:38:31.079 --> 00:38:35.639
But again, he also said this 15 years ago or whatever, he may have a different view now.

575
00:38:35.699 --> 00:38:42.960
Yeah, I think it's the scene where Norna and Range are escorting Turlow back and he stops and gives a bit of an info dump.

576
00:38:42.960 --> 00:38:45.719
And I seem to recall what the story was.

577
00:38:45.780 --> 00:38:51.960
It was the last scene before the lights went out at 10 and the word came down that, okay, we need to get this done in 45 seconds.

578
00:38:52.019 --> 00:38:54.780
And Mark said, it's a 92nd speech.

579
00:38:54.840 --> 00:38:57.239
Oh, darling, just edit it as you go.

580
00:38:57.300 --> 00:38:58.980
So that's the thing.

581
00:38:59.039 --> 00:39:03.780
He's having to give his performance, get all the information in there, but also cut out half the content.

582
00:39:03.840 --> 00:39:06.420
He does an amazing job.

583
00:39:06.480 --> 00:39:10.320
That is not to say that Peter, like Peter's doing an amazing job here.

584
00:39:10.380 --> 00:39:13.980
Janet and Brazen actually have a really good chemistry.

585
00:39:14.039 --> 00:39:16.199
You know, they start antagonistic.

586
00:39:16.260 --> 00:39:19.199
They get friendly, antagonistic friendly, and it keeps going back and forth.

587
00:39:19.260 --> 00:39:38.820
And even that scene with the inquiry where you've got this character who's just brought in for one scene, like, I think she's a chief petty officer or something, and she just plays it, sort of straight down the line, very believable, and she only gets a few reactions and a few lines, but suddenly this world is opened up because this person exists.

588
00:39:38.940 --> 00:39:42.840
I think she's straight from episode one of Blake 7 actually.

589
00:39:43.920 --> 00:39:46.079
Yeah, she's a bit like that.

590
00:39:46.199 --> 00:39:47.519
She's good. really good.

591
00:39:47.579 --> 00:39:49.199
I love the uniforms.

592
00:39:49.260 --> 00:39:51.239
They're so much more convincing than Warriors of the Deep.

593
00:39:51.300 --> 00:39:53.880
I mean, it's still a terrific 80s cast to them.

594
00:39:54.000 --> 00:39:55.500
Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

595
00:39:55.559 --> 00:39:57.780
I would cosplay in one of those.

596
00:39:57.840 --> 00:39:59.820
I wouldn't cosplay in one of the worries of the deep one.

597
00:39:59.940 --> 00:40:01.199
People are pointing staying.

598
00:40:01.260 --> 00:40:02.039
Why are you wearing that?

599
00:40:02.099 --> 00:40:03.780
Well, if I wore it in the street, I'd get comments.

600
00:40:03.900 --> 00:40:08.219
But I mean, you'd end up like a self-sourcing pudding at the end of it, wouldn't you?

601
00:40:08.280 --> 00:40:10.920
There's no natural fibres anywhere.

602
00:40:11.699 --> 00:40:23.099
It'd be like your own personal steam room that you carried around with, which I'm reminded as what Davison said when you know, what, why did Johnny do 3 years?

603
00:40:23.099 --> 00:40:32.760
And you didn't actually say, well, terminus, but, you know, other fans have said we could have had him for 5 if they'd just got some of the key things right.

604
00:40:32.820 --> 00:40:34.800
And one of them was rehearsal and film time.

605
00:40:34.860 --> 00:40:42.900
Even one extra day per story is only 7 days on the schedule for the BBC, 5 days and 2 days.

606
00:40:42.960 --> 00:40:45.960
That would have made an enormous difference to this entire season.

607
00:40:46.019 --> 00:40:48.960
Probably kept the regular cast happy and kept everything tighter.

608
00:40:49.019 --> 00:40:52.920
As much as I love Colin, imagine a season with Peter and Nicola.

609
00:40:52.980 --> 00:40:55.920
That was actually my big fanboy dream.

610
00:40:55.980 --> 00:41:06.300
And when the big finish started bringing out Red Dawn, I think was, which is the story of Dawn French as the leader of the Ice Warriors with Nicola.

611
00:41:06.360 --> 00:41:07.980
And it's a lovely story.

612
00:41:07.980 --> 00:41:10.139
And then they bring in...

613
00:41:10.139 --> 00:41:12.480
And the Church and the Crown is a lovely...

614
00:41:12.539 --> 00:41:14.880
Yeah, the Peter and Nicholas stories are terrific.

615
00:41:15.119 --> 00:41:17.400
But we're getting ahead of ourselves.

616
00:41:17.760 --> 00:41:21.239
I find it very hard to fault this story.

617
00:41:21.300 --> 00:41:24.239
There's the fact that cockerel kind of disappears halfway through.

618
00:41:24.599 --> 00:41:30.599
There is the fact that the earth borrowing machine. is not quite horrific enough.

619
00:41:30.659 --> 00:41:36.599
You kind of get the impression that he's just a torso, but that doesn't really become clear until Brazen's in there.

620
00:41:36.659 --> 00:41:43.619
So it's like when the threat is actually carried out, is when you realise what the threat is and you need a bit of buildup to that.

621
00:41:43.619 --> 00:41:45.659
But those are very minor niggles.

622
00:41:45.719 --> 00:41:51.840
We have Ron Jones knocking out of the park in terms of direction, especially compared with what he's delivered before.

623
00:41:51.900 --> 00:41:56.159
And since. and since Paddy Kingsland being amazing.

624
00:41:56.219 --> 00:41:59.400
Set design by David Buckingham looks excellent.

625
00:41:59.460 --> 00:42:04.500
There is not a poor performance in the show, even the village person retrograde.

626
00:42:04.559 --> 00:42:06.840
He's not part of the officer class.

627
00:42:06.900 --> 00:42:07.980
He is not the Shakespearean.

628
00:42:08.039 --> 00:42:10.380
He's the porter at the door in Macbeth, you know.

629
00:42:10.619 --> 00:42:13.800
Excellent script from Christopher H been made.

630
00:42:13.860 --> 00:42:16.739
Brilliant performances from the regulars.

631
00:42:17.400 --> 00:42:25.980
This is the finest story this season and 2nd finest Davidson story next to Enlightenment for me anyway.

632
00:42:26.039 --> 00:42:29.219
And I'm so glad the randomiser gave me this one because...

633
00:42:29.280 --> 00:42:29.579
Yes.

634
00:42:29.579 --> 00:42:30.059
Yeah.

635
00:42:30.119 --> 00:42:37.800
I did not watch this story between when I 1st watched it when I was 5 and was terrified by it and when it came out on DVD.

636
00:42:37.860 --> 00:42:45.480
And then when I watched it on DVD, I just thought, I can see why I'm scared by this, but this, it's really excellent.

637
00:42:45.539 --> 00:42:52.739
As a boy, the visuals let it down for me at also the frustration that the TARDIS was so easily destroyed because when you're 14, 15.

638
00:42:52.980 --> 00:42:56.820
But it's not technically accurate to the rest of the narrative of the show.

639
00:42:56.880 --> 00:42:59.760
So, of course, you know, now, yeah, I'm with you.

640
00:42:59.820 --> 00:43:06.719
Well, things will be back to normal next week. obviously, when we have a story to really rip into.

641
00:43:07.139 --> 00:43:11.219
But I think that this is probably the high point of the season.

642
00:43:11.280 --> 00:43:11.760
Yes, thank you.

643
00:43:11.820 --> 00:43:13.320
Thank you, Christopher Hamilton Bidmead.

644
00:43:13.380 --> 00:43:13.619
Thank you.

645
00:43:13.679 --> 00:43:14.099
Yes.

646
00:43:36.360 --> 00:43:43.679
We're trapped in a time tunnel as we take off from Frontier, so do come back next week for resurrection of the Daleks.

647
00:43:43.800 --> 00:43:50.820
Until then, you can find us online at FlightthroughEntirety.com, flight through entirety on Facebook and iTunes and at FTE podcast on Twitter.

648
00:43:50.880 --> 00:43:58.980
Over on Bondfinger, we've recently completed the Roger Moore era, so make sure you catch up on those before we move on to the Timothy Dalton in the new year.

649
00:43:59.039 --> 00:44:00.719
You lose your will to live.

650
00:44:01.500 --> 00:44:07.739
You can find that at bondfinger.com, bondfinger on Facebook and iTunes and bondfinger cast on Twitter.

651
00:44:07.800 --> 00:44:08.639
Spoiler alert.

652
00:44:08.699 --> 00:44:10.320
Dalton is my favourite bond.

653
00:44:10.739 --> 00:44:12.840
Until next week.

654
00:44:12.900 --> 00:44:16.139
May none of your wood lice bring down meteors on your home.

655
00:44:16.199 --> 00:44:17.639
Thank you very much for listening and good night.

656
00:44:17.699 --> 00:44:18.360
Good night.

657
00:44:18.480 --> 00:44:19.739
Woody Allen's mine.

658
00:44:19.800 --> 00:44:20.159
Good night.

659
00:44:21.420 --> 00:44:26.400
That was Flight through Entirety, starring Nathan Bottley, Brendan Jones, and Richard Stone.

660
00:44:26.460 --> 00:44:28.860
Theme arrangement by Cameron Lamb.

661
00:44:28.920 --> 00:44:33.900
This episode, not allowed to watch that one, was recorded on 19th of November 2016.

662
00:44:34.079 --> 00:44:37.199
The next episode will be released on the 11th of December.

663
00:44:38.460 --> 00:44:45.239
Are you suffering from an infestation of vile parasitic fibreglass insects with the power to control gravity?

664
00:44:45.300 --> 00:44:46.800
Uh, I know I am.

665
00:44:46.860 --> 00:44:49.500
We really should be ashamed of ourselves.

666
00:44:50.460 --> 00:44:52.019
Okay.

667
00:44:52.019 --> 00:44:54.360
Oh, okay.

668
00:44:54.420 --> 00:45:00.059
Frank, uh, Frank, uh, Frank Frontbottom.

669
00:45:00.119 --> 00:45:02.400
Do we have to say that 3 times?

670
00:45:02.460 --> 00:45:04.559
19th November.

671
00:45:06.780 --> 00:45:09.659
Or just Fronty to his mates.

672
00:45:09.900 --> 00:45:12.119
Who is Frank Frontbottom?

673
00:45:12.179 --> 00:45:13.019
Oh, Frontios.

674
00:45:13.079 --> 00:45:14.639
Yes, Frank's sidebottom.

675
00:45:14.699 --> 00:45:15.420
Frank front bottom.

676
00:45:15.480 --> 00:45:16.559
I'm glad this one's not mine.

677
00:45:17.159 --> 00:45:19.079
No, this is my nurse.

678
00:45:19.139 --> 00:45:19.860
I can't stop it.

679
00:45:20.760 --> 00:45:22.619
Okey-dokey.

680
00:45:22.800 --> 00:45:24.780
Wait for the plane.

681
00:45:26.699 --> 00:45:28.980
Can I rattle my Lego?

682
00:45:29.039 --> 00:45:29.400
No.

683
00:45:29.699 --> 00:45:31.440
That one thing.

684
00:45:34.860 --> 00:45:36.599
You need us?

685
00:45:39.119 --> 00:45:47.460
To be fair, like living living by myself for a month, I was like, I was like, should I go get a magnum?

686
00:45:47.519 --> 00:45:48.059
No, yes.

687
00:45:48.119 --> 00:45:49.079
Oh okay.

688
00:45:52.139 --> 00:45:54.659
You're Tom in episode one of The Deadly Assassin.

689
00:45:54.719 --> 00:45:57.360
Or was Planet of the Spiders.

690
00:45:57.420 --> 00:45:58.920
I even had a hooker.

691
00:46:01.980 --> 00:46:02.940
Here we go.

692
00:46:02.940 --> 00:46:03.840
Here we go.

693
00:46:03.900 --> 00:46:05.039
Don't touch me like that.

694
00:46:08.099 --> 00:46:09.119
And if you have to.