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This transcript was created on 2026-05-04 at 16:30:17

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Hello, dear listeners, and welcome back to Flight Through Entirety

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the only Doctor Who podcast who will make your bones rot for

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enjoying us.

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I'm Brendan.

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I'm Nathan.

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I'm Todd.

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I found zanium on the floor so it's looking serious.

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Are you thinking about you are us?

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the twin dilemma.

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I'm finding both to be a dilemma right now.

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Oh, my.

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Now, look.

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We, we, we, we.

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I would like to open this by saying that recently this year some

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people on Reddit discovered that Romulus and Remus' equations in

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the 1st episode are written in a special kind of computer code.

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Most of it's gibberish, but there are 2 lines which read, mon-nom

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bog off, you twit arse face.

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Doctor Who rules okay, so does Dave's program.

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So that's apparently been done by a BBC graphics employee Dave

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Chapman.

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And it took them.

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It took people 32 years to discover it.

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Discover that because that's how much attention this program has

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been paid.

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Yes.

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So it's the twin dilemma.

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It is the debut proper of Colin Baker.

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Let's start with some background information into this episode.

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It is written by 1st and only time Doctor Who author Anthony

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Stephen, whom John Nathan Turner knew from his time on All

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Creatures great and small.

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Yes, who've done a lot of interesting things for the beep, beep

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seep.

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Yes.

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Now, he had all sorts of problems with the script, and some fan

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legends have emerged, including, apparently one of his excuses for

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late delivery was that his typewriter exploded.

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I wish.

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I don't know how much truth there is in that.

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But he was very ill during the scripting period.

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After right, beginning right.

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Yes, right.

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And there was going to be a lot more playing with notions of time

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travel, which I think presented him with a lot of scripting

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problems, which is why there's not much at all in the finished

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program.

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What there is, is confusing and self-contradictory.

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There's a lot more timey whimey stuff.

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Yeah, exactly.

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Originally, the story was called a stitch in time or a stitch with

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time.

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Stitch in time.

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Yeah.

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JMT's concept in getting an inexperienced writer with the program

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was to get someone coming in with no preconceived notions of what

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the program was going to be about, but he still wanted to choose

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somebody he'd worked with before that he knew to be reliable.

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And he also set down the edict that there should be a central

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monster, the doctor faces, and that twins should somehow be

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involved. but didn't specify the gender of the twins.

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So in the script, the twins are not gendered.

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Well, actually, did you know what Steven said in his original

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vision for the script?

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He was a big fan of Stanley Kubrick, as is this podcast. who was

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in turn a fan of German expressionism.

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In The Shining, have we all seen The Shining, the 1972 film with

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It's extraordinary and it's Kubrick, so it's horribly disturbing.

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Even doing things, it's set in a hotel.

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There's that whole timey, whimey thing of going on.

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Jack Nicholson, Shelley Duval.

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I've seen the Simpsons episode.

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It's the same thing.

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Shelley Duval didn't know the axe was going to come. next to him.

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No, yes.

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She was tortured in the same way that Freak and was torturing the

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crew on the exorcist, and it's very much that same period of high

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concept horror.

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And Jack was totally coked out the whole, there are a lot of

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similarities.

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But the point is that the twins were meant to be little midwitch

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cuckoo girls, just like the twin girls in the shining, who stand

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in the corridors, say almost nothing, and be identical, and very

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disturbing, and playing with the things of, so there was meant to

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be a point of around which time stops working linearly around the

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twins, and their functions and their mathematical functions were

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actually twisting events around them.

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Imagine trying to write that, but imagine how interesting and

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chalky like Windham like that would have been if the closer you

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got to the twins, the more you felt incredibly ill.

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So maybe some things were achieved in the script.

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Yeah, Peter Moffatt actually wanted to cast.

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He actually found a boy and a girl to play the twins who thought

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could act.

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John Nathan Turner said no.

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They must be boys.

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Have you read the rewriting that they must be, they had to be

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preternaturally beautiful and disturbingly seductive.

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Well, that's a note.

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Well, that was in Anthony Stevens original script that they are

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darkly attractive almost sexually so, but he also specifies in

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their description.

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Gary Downey should not be involved in the casting. all went

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horribly wrong.

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As you say, Todd, he also specified in the description that they

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don't have to be identical.

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They don't and they don't have to be the same gender.

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Yeah.

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I'd heard that John Nathan Turner actually vetoes female twins

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that he...

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Yeah, he sent the head...

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Yeah, yeah, amen.

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And chose... and chose the Conrads instead, um, Paul and Gavin

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Conrad.

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Gavin and Andrew.

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Andrew had to change his name to Paul because there was already an

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Andrew Conrad on equity something like that.

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With their blank expressionless faces.

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Their bowl haircuts.

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They're appalling costumes, and friend of the podcast, Peter

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Griffiths. actually interviewed both of them for DWM.

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In a Jacuzzi, yes.

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And he could not use the interview.

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Because when he got back to transcribe the interview, he realised

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he could not tell them apart.

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So as to who was saying what about the production.

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So it's... so yeah.

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And they were wearing this jumpsuit, so you think that would have

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helped?

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I don't know why you cast as Romulus and Remus 2 boys who can't

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actually pronounce the letter R properly.

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Or is it L?

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Lumulus and lemurs.

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They couldn't tell their arses from their elbows.

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No, I am Romulus, I am Wemus.

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But John Nathan Turner.

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First mistake.

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Peter Moffatt in charge of this production.

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He just wants it to be lovey, lovey, lovey at the end of the

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season.

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Now, they've already made this decision to make the doctor

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unlikeable.

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That is the decision that they've made as a reaction against

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Peter's doctor in terms of the casting, which in the long term is

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the wrong decision.

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But now we're going to be giving the show over to this director

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who we all agree, has retired from directing.

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If you're going to do this, you need to ensure that one, you've

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got a brilliant script.

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Two, you've got a director that can direct it sympathetically, none

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of this is happening.

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Yeah.

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Okay, so Colin's being brought in as the doctor.

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They've asked for a four-year contract with him.

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Okay?

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decisions have been made based on what they've delivered in season

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20 in terms of, because that's all they've got to go on, right?

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Peter's performance been too bland.

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This is, you know.

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And so John Nathan Turner is now making decisions based on

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reaction against what has gone before, like literally going, well

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it's all too bland, so we're going to go colour.

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Like, and we're going, and it's all too nice.

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So we're going to go, you know, horrible.

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Now, of course, Colin has come in with an idea that he wanted the

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doctor to be less likeable than his predecessor and much more like

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perhaps Hartnell and that sort of thing, which is not necessarily

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a bad decision.

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Right?

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And he wanted to be dressed all in black.

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Which I would agree would be a wrong decision.

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I mean, if you look at the, again, that 20th anniversary special

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from the BBC and what he's wearing near, that blues pinstripe soup

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and what, and what Nicholas wearing.

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That looks great.

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And a sensible haircut.

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Yeah, looks great.

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They both look really great.

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Okay.

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John Nathan Turner has then decided, well, we're going to now put

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the doctor in at the end of this season.

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Which is a terrible idea.

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That's another thing that compounds it.

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If you're going to make the doctor unlikeable.

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Why leave us at the end of the year with a doctor that we don't

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like, who has openly said, I'm the doctor, whether you like it or

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not.

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Well, that was to Brian Bliss.

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Because he wouldn't shut up that he wanted the part.

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It's inexplicable.

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It's a huge, a huge, huge, huge giant mistake.

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And it comes from the fact that I think that he believes that the

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show is safe.

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Yeah, he believes it's unassailable.

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At the end of the twin dilemma.

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That's the last time in the 20th century that Doctor Who knows it

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has another season at the end of the season.

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Because the following seasons were not commissioned until after

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the broadcast of the last episode in each case.

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Well, I think what the big problem is, Colin Baker, when he

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describes his vision of the doctor was that, you know, he had his

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four-year contract.

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So he thought he'd go on for years.

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I think it was 3 years and an option, which is how they get rid of

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him in the end, spoiler alert.

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But he had this conception that he would start off unlikeable.

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And then as you go through with the character, the character

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gradually softens and you gradually get to the heart of the

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character, he was envisioning that his doctor would actually be

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the most emotional and the most approachable by the time you get

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to the end of his tenure, which that's an incredibly...

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Okay, it's hubristic.

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But at the same time, it is ahead of its time in storytelling.

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But the problem here is he likens him to Mr. Darcy, right?

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Mr. Darcy is a character in one novel, and by the end of that

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novel, By the end of that one story.

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He has his redemptive moment.

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We needed a glimmer of that redemption in this story.

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Instead, we got Mr. RC.

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Increasingly so as the scones kept coming.

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Yes, go on.

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I don't think that that is unprecedented or before its time.

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I think that's the heart and arc.

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He starts off as unlikeable and becomes a cuddly grandfather.

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And I know that's in a good caveman, doesn't he?

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But that was not a conscious decision.

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No.

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And the same thing with pertwi.

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You know, Pertwee starts off unlikeable.

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Joe comes along and he ends up your sort of touchy-theely...

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Well, he ends up your sort of moralising grandma, I think, as we

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said before.

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Margaret Rotherford.

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Yeah, exactly.

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You know, we're seeing it with Capaldi.

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And Tom Baker, you know, as the doctor is arrogant and dismissive

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and conceited.

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Well, exactly.

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So it's not definitely the wrong way to go.

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But they also had a great deal of range in their performances

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didn't they?

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Whereas Colin's not given much time to do all of that.

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And he's also asked to do things that no hero should ever do.

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Yeah, yeah.

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There are some really, really bad moments here.

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And the, there are a whole series of things that come together to

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make Collins performance in this story a problem.

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One is that Eric Saywood has such a teeny ear for dialogue.

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And so, Pete, I think, is able to get round that by just the sheer

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strength of his acting performance.

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But Colin doesn't.

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What Colin, I think, chooses to do is to be theatrical and

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artificial so that the artificial and unrealistic dialogue works

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in that context.

255
00:11:47.340 --> 00:11:51.000
And I think that that makes him become alienating.

256
00:11:51.059 --> 00:11:55.799
And as we do see, like it's, the original vision for the character

257
00:11:55.799 --> 00:11:58.919
if that was the original vision, and I'm by no means convinced

258
00:11:58.919 --> 00:12:02.340
that it is, was that he softens and becomes more likeable.

259
00:12:02.399 --> 00:12:04.320
And in fact, that is what we see on screen.

260
00:12:04.379 --> 00:12:09.059
He is vastly more likeable by the end of the show than he is here

261
00:12:09.059 --> 00:12:11.039
or in Attack of the Cyberman.

262
00:12:11.100 --> 00:12:15.000
And he is actually able to do sweet and silly as well.

263
00:12:15.059 --> 00:12:20.399
But we don't get any of that here because he's so busy wrestling

264
00:12:20.399 --> 00:12:22.919
with the horrific dialogue that he's given.

265
00:12:22.980 --> 00:12:27.059
And then I think it's a giant mistake to give Colin so early on

266
00:12:27.059 --> 00:12:31.799
these fits where the symptoms are overacting horribly.

267
00:12:31.860 --> 00:12:36.360
So that thing where he's cowering in the wardrobe room, doing

268
00:12:36.360 --> 00:12:42.120
maniacal laughter, is perhaps the worst performance from a lead

269
00:12:42.120 --> 00:12:45.720
actor in the role to date, in the history of television, in the

270
00:12:45.720 --> 00:12:46.500
history of television.

271
00:12:46.559 --> 00:12:48.539
It's really, really terrible.

272
00:12:48.600 --> 00:12:52.080
The only way I think that you could possibly play it.

273
00:12:52.139 --> 00:12:53.580
I don't think that's down to Colin.

274
00:12:53.639 --> 00:12:55.740
I think it is down to the decision.

275
00:12:55.799 --> 00:12:59.580
One, let's make him unlikeable in the 1st story.

276
00:12:59.639 --> 00:13:04.620
To, let's have this regeneration, this traumatic regeneration

277
00:13:04.620 --> 00:13:08.100
which makes the doctor behave, you know, like strangle his

278
00:13:08.100 --> 00:13:11.820
companion, be cowardly, want people to die.

279
00:13:11.879 --> 00:13:13.799
All of these awful things.

280
00:13:13.860 --> 00:13:16.320
He's suddenly massively unlikeable.

281
00:13:16.379 --> 00:13:21.179
And that nerd explanation that we have, which is post-regeneration

282
00:13:21.179 --> 00:13:22.620
trauma.

283
00:13:22.679 --> 00:13:23.340
Who cares?

284
00:13:23.399 --> 00:13:28.200
What we see on screen is someone, like we had Pete last week

285
00:13:28.200 --> 00:13:32.700
running and running and striving and sacrificing himself to save

286
00:13:32.700 --> 00:13:33.480
Perry's life.

287
00:13:33.480 --> 00:13:37.139
And now he's just horrible, a horrible person.

288
00:13:37.440 --> 00:13:39.840
Yeah, how can they think it would work?

289
00:13:39.899 --> 00:13:42.899
And it's not where the character ends up.

290
00:13:42.960 --> 00:13:45.779
It isn't where the character ends up and it's not Colin's fault

291
00:13:45.779 --> 00:13:49.019
but it is a massive giant misstamp.

292
00:13:49.080 --> 00:13:50.700
And just unforgivable.

293
00:13:50.759 --> 00:13:55.139
It's as if no one involved in making this program knows why we're

294
00:13:55.139 --> 00:13:57.000
doing Doctor Who are what makes it entertaining.

295
00:13:57.059 --> 00:14:00.360
This is the point at which I think we're now doing Doctor Who just

296
00:14:00.360 --> 00:14:01.259
out of habit.

297
00:14:01.320 --> 00:14:04.679
And we've never really thought about what it is about Doctor Who

298
00:14:04.679 --> 00:14:07.799
that appeals to the audience, what role it has in the televisual

299
00:14:07.799 --> 00:14:08.700
landscape.

300
00:14:08.759 --> 00:14:10.379
We just making it because we've always made it.

301
00:14:13.440 --> 00:14:16.860
That's my 1st of many rants, this kind. hope the next few

302
00:14:16.860 --> 00:14:17.340
podcasts.

303
00:14:20.879 --> 00:14:23.279
Everybody is looking at me.

304
00:14:24.179 --> 00:14:28.379
But you don't really disagree about twin dilemma, do you, I

305
00:14:28.379 --> 00:14:28.559
think?

306
00:14:28.860 --> 00:14:32.879
Originally, when I was asked to do these podcast listeners, I was

307
00:14:32.879 --> 00:14:35.580
going to come in for just a common baker era, and the idea was to

308
00:14:35.580 --> 00:14:35.820
defend.

309
00:14:35.940 --> 00:14:36.600
Yeah.

310
00:14:36.600 --> 00:14:39.659
Of course, I turned up a lot sooner than that.

311
00:14:41.159 --> 00:14:44.039
And I will defend some things in this show.

312
00:14:44.100 --> 00:14:47.279
I'm going to defend Colin Baker's performances, the doctor.

313
00:14:47.340 --> 00:14:49.440
I'm just gonna be completely opposite to you.

314
00:14:49.500 --> 00:14:55.379
He has to deal with some of the worst dialogue and situations in

315
00:14:55.379 --> 00:14:56.159
the history of the show.

316
00:14:56.220 --> 00:15:01.620
He has to turn on a dime, on a dime, from ranting to overacting to

317
00:15:01.620 --> 00:15:04.740
whatever you want to say, but also there is compassion in there.

318
00:15:04.799 --> 00:15:08.039
There is humour. especially in the latter 2 episodes where I

319
00:15:08.039 --> 00:15:09.840
actually think the latter 2 episodes are much better than

320
00:15:09.840 --> 00:15:12.600
certainly the 1st episode, which is a complete train wreck.

321
00:15:12.659 --> 00:15:17.159
And I actually think it's an extraordinary performance from a

322
00:15:17.159 --> 00:15:19.919
leading man and his companion, given this situation.

323
00:15:19.980 --> 00:15:22.860
And the situation really comes down to this.

324
00:15:23.279 --> 00:15:26.580
John Petrie took over the role in 1970.

325
00:15:26.700 --> 00:15:30.059
He's in a bed for an episode or two.

326
00:15:30.179 --> 00:15:33.659
There are 2 other people. 2 new other stars of the show carrying

327
00:15:33.659 --> 00:15:34.500
the show during that time.

328
00:15:34.559 --> 00:15:37.980
He's coming in with a new script, and ultimately a new producer

329
00:15:37.980 --> 00:15:38.700
and they're working together.

330
00:15:38.820 --> 00:15:41.580
Cut to 4 years later, 5 years later.

331
00:15:41.639 --> 00:15:44.940
Okay, Tom Baker is coming in with a new script editor, new

332
00:15:44.940 --> 00:15:48.899
producer, but in that 1st story, It's a Sarah Jane show for the

333
00:15:48.899 --> 00:15:51.539
1st episode and a half, and he is with a team of people.

334
00:15:51.899 --> 00:15:55.620
Cut to Peter Davidson's beginning.

335
00:15:55.620 --> 00:15:58.500
He's in a box for 2 episodes.

336
00:15:58.860 --> 00:16:03.120
And the 2 female companions are leading the show, right?

337
00:16:03.179 --> 00:16:05.460
Yeah, and they've constructed a show for him to come into.

338
00:16:05.519 --> 00:16:06.120
And a box.

339
00:16:06.179 --> 00:16:10.620
He's coming in with a producer that he knows and the script editor

340
00:16:10.620 --> 00:16:11.100
will be new.

341
00:16:11.159 --> 00:16:11.700
Right?

342
00:16:11.759 --> 00:16:13.320
cut to this.

343
00:16:13.500 --> 00:16:16.379
John Nathan Turner has been there for 4 years.

344
00:16:16.440 --> 00:16:17.279
Trust me.

345
00:16:17.340 --> 00:16:18.240
Trust me.

346
00:16:18.299 --> 00:16:19.080
Yeah, right?

347
00:16:19.139 --> 00:16:20.879
Eric Saywood has been there for 2 years.

348
00:16:20.940 --> 00:16:21.720
Trust me.

349
00:16:21.779 --> 00:16:24.899
Colin doesn't know that Eric doesn't like him, right?

350
00:16:24.960 --> 00:16:28.259
And so, okay, yes, trust me.

351
00:16:28.320 --> 00:16:31.620
He's going to lose out on the coat to begin with, right?

352
00:16:31.620 --> 00:16:32.220
In the costume.

353
00:16:32.279 --> 00:16:33.480
He's lost that battle to begin with.

354
00:16:33.539 --> 00:16:34.980
It's now the end of season.

355
00:16:35.039 --> 00:16:37.320
Now let's just examine some of these end of season stuff.

356
00:16:37.379 --> 00:16:37.799
Last year.

357
00:16:37.860 --> 00:16:40.980
I lost entire story because of strikes and budgets.

358
00:16:41.039 --> 00:16:44.639
The previous year, well, is the train wreck that is time flight.

359
00:16:44.700 --> 00:16:48.059
The previous year works because it's the final one of that doctor

360
00:16:48.059 --> 00:16:51.120
and I'll give them that. previous year, what happens?

361
00:16:51.179 --> 00:16:54.539
Charter, gone, because of the strikes, because John Nathan Turner

362
00:16:54.539 --> 00:16:55.740
is the production unit manager.

363
00:16:55.799 --> 00:16:58.559
Previous year, he's still a production unit manager, and Anthony

364
00:16:58.559 --> 00:17:01.500
Reid and him have to try and, well, the Armageddon factor.

365
00:17:01.559 --> 00:17:02.100
Dear God.

366
00:17:02.159 --> 00:17:04.980
And the previous year, John Nathan Turner is the production unit

367
00:17:04.980 --> 00:17:05.579
manager.

368
00:17:05.640 --> 00:17:06.359
And what have we got?

369
00:17:06.420 --> 00:17:09.180
We've got invasion of time, which is all such a problem.

370
00:17:09.240 --> 00:17:12.000
So the end of season is not a big success, right?

371
00:17:12.059 --> 00:17:14.400
Often in the pertu year, it's a bit of a mess as well.

372
00:17:14.460 --> 00:17:16.259
But I'm going with John Nathan.

373
00:17:16.259 --> 00:17:17.220
Not as bad.

374
00:17:17.220 --> 00:17:20.220
And it really is never as bad.

375
00:17:20.279 --> 00:17:21.599
So here is a precedent.

376
00:17:21.660 --> 00:17:23.579
Here is a precedent, right?

377
00:17:23.640 --> 00:17:28.859
The last rate of season is always under budget.

378
00:17:28.859 --> 00:17:30.059
Under budget, out of time.

379
00:17:30.059 --> 00:17:31.500
Exhausted crew.

380
00:17:31.559 --> 00:17:32.579
Exhausted.

381
00:17:32.640 --> 00:17:34.619
And then you've got this script edited.

382
00:17:34.680 --> 00:17:37.680
Now, I don't know what I don't know what Eric Sabre was doing

383
00:17:37.680 --> 00:17:38.940
right?

384
00:17:39.000 --> 00:17:41.759
Because, yes, he had to rewrite The Awakening.

385
00:17:41.819 --> 00:17:44.940
Then he's got his own story, which he has revised from the

386
00:17:44.940 --> 00:17:49.140
previous year, but Grimwade story, and I assume Bob Holmes's stuff

387
00:17:49.140 --> 00:17:49.920
came in pretty good.

388
00:17:50.220 --> 00:17:51.660
What?

389
00:17:51.660 --> 00:17:54.059
And this other script is an absolute shambles.

390
00:17:54.119 --> 00:17:56.460
As you were saying, it's called a stitch in time or whatever it

391
00:17:56.460 --> 00:17:56.819
was called.

392
00:17:56.880 --> 00:17:59.940
And I think the only thing that's left from that is that stupid

393
00:17:59.940 --> 00:18:03.000
teleportation thing at the end of episode two.

394
00:18:03.059 --> 00:18:03.539
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

395
00:18:03.539 --> 00:18:04.859
Which makes no sense whatsoever.

396
00:18:04.920 --> 00:18:07.200
Absolutely don't blame. right?

397
00:18:07.259 --> 00:18:09.359
And I believe in the original stage directions.

398
00:18:09.420 --> 00:18:12.119
Perry's supposed to be screaming at the screen like that the

399
00:18:12.119 --> 00:18:12.779
doctor's dying.

400
00:18:12.839 --> 00:18:16.980
Instead, Nicola has to do this sobbing, which is just so pathetic

401
00:18:16.980 --> 00:18:18.000
but...

402
00:18:18.059 --> 00:18:19.200
Oh, it's just so pathetic.

403
00:18:19.259 --> 00:18:23.160
But the fact is, this script is so undercooked in episode one.

404
00:18:23.220 --> 00:18:26.400
Getting the doctor to attack Perry is just the wrong thing.

405
00:18:26.460 --> 00:18:28.140
I'm extraordinary.

406
00:18:28.200 --> 00:18:30.000
It is just, it's the wrong decision.

407
00:18:30.059 --> 00:18:31.200
And it's say would.

408
00:18:31.319 --> 00:18:32.339
Ive got to think it's say would.

409
00:18:32.400 --> 00:18:37.500
It's like, say would inherits Pete and Pete is good. and now say

410
00:18:37.500 --> 00:18:40.680
would hated the doctor and has been keeping him out of the show

411
00:18:40.680 --> 00:18:44.220
and now he's remaking the doctor in his own cynical image and

412
00:18:44.220 --> 00:18:48.539
you've got Nathan Turner casting his 2nd doctor and the only idea

413
00:18:48.539 --> 00:18:52.200
he has is B different from the previous doctor, which, let's face

414
00:18:52.200 --> 00:18:54.180
it, was his previous idea as well.

415
00:18:54.240 --> 00:18:58.500
And, you know, cast someone reasonably famous from television

416
00:18:58.500 --> 00:18:59.940
which again, he's doing again.

417
00:19:00.000 --> 00:19:04.680
You know, I think that Colin is really the victim of some pretty

418
00:19:04.680 --> 00:19:06.119
bad circumstances.

419
00:19:06.180 --> 00:19:08.579
And I will agree with you on that.

420
00:19:08.640 --> 00:19:12.299
I mean, my my point was trying to say is that, you know, he's

421
00:19:12.299 --> 00:19:16.559
coming into the situation with with a producer and a script editor

422
00:19:16.559 --> 00:19:18.180
wants to make it more gritty and that sort of thing, right?

423
00:19:18.240 --> 00:19:20.759
And the producer wants to make it a contrast to the previous

424
00:19:20.759 --> 00:19:21.299
doctor.

425
00:19:21.359 --> 00:19:25.500
And so he's wanting to do a good job, but, you know, in terms of

426
00:19:25.500 --> 00:19:27.180
you know, you're getting the script, you've got to make the best

427
00:19:27.180 --> 00:19:27.539
of it.

428
00:19:27.599 --> 00:19:30.299
You know, I know I've been in work situations where I've come into

429
00:19:30.299 --> 00:19:31.619
new work situations.

430
00:19:31.680 --> 00:19:34.019
I've had to implement things in classroom, which I have not

431
00:19:34.019 --> 00:19:35.460
believed in, but I've done my best, right?

432
00:19:35.519 --> 00:19:38.039
And then, 3 or 4 months down the track.

433
00:19:38.099 --> 00:19:40.140
Like, I'm questioning what we did, and the people will turn around

434
00:19:40.140 --> 00:19:42.779
who gave me the job and say to me, well, you didn't have to do it

435
00:19:42.779 --> 00:19:43.079
like that.

436
00:19:43.140 --> 00:19:45.180
I'm going, are you kidding me?

437
00:19:45.240 --> 00:19:48.119
And then I will argue my case for change and everything like

438
00:19:48.119 --> 00:19:48.359
that.

439
00:19:48.420 --> 00:19:49.980
Colin's not given that opportunity.

440
00:19:50.039 --> 00:19:51.420
He's just going to come in at the end of the season.

441
00:19:51.480 --> 00:19:54.059
Everybody's tired, and it's like, you've just got to do this

442
00:19:54.180 --> 00:19:54.539
right?

443
00:19:54.660 --> 00:19:58.500
And even if you had objections to that strangling scene.

444
00:19:58.559 --> 00:20:00.539
You know, it's just like we're just going to get on with and do

445
00:20:00.539 --> 00:20:00.720
it.

446
00:20:00.779 --> 00:20:02.279
That 1st episode is so appallingly written.

447
00:20:02.400 --> 00:20:03.720
I just cannot, I cannot.

448
00:20:03.779 --> 00:20:05.099
I cannot get over.

449
00:20:05.160 --> 00:20:08.160
Every single asset on earth.

450
00:20:08.220 --> 00:20:09.660
Can I just have my rant?

451
00:20:09.720 --> 00:20:10.680
I need to do this.

452
00:20:10.740 --> 00:20:11.700
I've got to keep disconnected.

453
00:20:11.759 --> 00:20:14.220
So we've got May my bones rot for a baby.

454
00:20:14.279 --> 00:20:16.740
Her pathetic offsider, Helena, right?

455
00:20:16.799 --> 00:20:17.819
She's really bad.

456
00:20:17.880 --> 00:20:21.180
And you just want to scream at their performance.

457
00:20:21.240 --> 00:20:22.619
The set from acorn antiques.

458
00:20:22.680 --> 00:20:24.119
This is the thing.

459
00:20:24.119 --> 00:20:25.380
In winter smocks.

460
00:20:25.440 --> 00:20:27.480
We talk of the arc and the security kitchen.

461
00:20:27.539 --> 00:20:28.500
Here is her security.

462
00:20:28.559 --> 00:20:29.460
God knows what.

463
00:20:29.460 --> 00:20:31.440
It's as cheap as chips, right?

464
00:20:31.500 --> 00:20:34.559
And there's one point where Hugo actually asked a question of that

465
00:20:34.559 --> 00:20:36.000
may my bones rot for obeying it.

466
00:20:36.059 --> 00:20:38.220
She turns to Elena, asks a question, and what seems like 20

467
00:20:38.220 --> 00:20:38.880
seconds later.

468
00:20:39.000 --> 00:20:42.839
She then says, oh, yes, those fighters have been modified, and I'm

469
00:20:42.839 --> 00:20:45.299
just there going, oh, my goodness, can I just stab myself right

470
00:20:45.299 --> 00:20:45.539
now?

471
00:20:46.200 --> 00:20:48.299
Come back, Jack May, or Liz forgive her.

472
00:20:48.359 --> 00:20:50.220
But then, like the whole decision.

473
00:20:50.279 --> 00:20:51.900
Like there's no world building here.

474
00:20:51.960 --> 00:20:54.839
If these twins are so important, surely they should be with, not

475
00:20:54.839 --> 00:20:56.099
locked away in their house.

476
00:20:56.160 --> 00:20:57.119
Oh my goodness.

477
00:20:57.180 --> 00:20:58.859
We're going to pay equations.

478
00:20:58.920 --> 00:20:59.940
Really?

479
00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:01.859
The father then has apoplexy.

480
00:21:01.920 --> 00:21:03.839
Like, it's just the most pathetic performance.

481
00:21:03.900 --> 00:21:05.339
Okay, his is the most pathetic one.

482
00:21:05.400 --> 00:21:06.240
It was cinary too.

483
00:21:06.299 --> 00:21:08.700
Turns out Davros was right, TLM.

484
00:21:08.759 --> 00:21:11.400
The 1st performance in the history of Doctor Who.

485
00:21:11.460 --> 00:21:12.059
I'm sorry.

486
00:21:12.119 --> 00:21:13.980
Like he has a breakdown over equations.

487
00:21:14.039 --> 00:21:15.839
Alex Saywood, I can do that too.

488
00:21:15.900 --> 00:21:17.759
X plus Y equals seven.

489
00:21:17.819 --> 00:21:19.980
If Y equals 2, what is the value of eggs?

490
00:21:20.039 --> 00:21:23.039
I mean, my God, I'm going to have a breakdown over that, you know

491
00:21:23.039 --> 00:21:25.920
the equations come up on the screen, like, as you've mentioned

492
00:21:25.920 --> 00:21:29.220
Brendan, this stupid frigging space invaders thing.

493
00:21:29.339 --> 00:21:33.599
And then, and then, when they get taken away, and I do like

494
00:21:33.599 --> 00:21:36.180
Edgeworth, whatever his name is, Harry.

495
00:21:36.240 --> 00:21:37.980
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

496
00:21:38.039 --> 00:21:40.200
Then, you know, when they get their little discs put on their

497
00:21:40.200 --> 00:21:40.559
hands.

498
00:21:40.619 --> 00:21:44.400
Like, the efforts of their acting is basically to turn 45 degrees

499
00:21:44.400 --> 00:21:47.339
because that's all they can do because their faces are as plastic

500
00:21:47.339 --> 00:21:49.380
and as emotionless as God knows what.

501
00:21:49.380 --> 00:21:52.140
At this point, you know, I'm just ready to just throttle

502
00:21:52.140 --> 00:21:52.500
somebody.

503
00:21:52.559 --> 00:21:56.220
Like, I could write this crap on the back of a napkin, you know?

504
00:21:56.279 --> 00:21:58.920
And then the father comes in and what was the, what's the stuff he

505
00:21:58.920 --> 00:21:59.519
finds on the floor?

506
00:22:00.660 --> 00:22:04.140
Oh, well, it must be an extraterrestrial kidnapping.

507
00:22:04.200 --> 00:22:06.720
I mean, my god, how pathetic is this?

508
00:22:06.779 --> 00:22:09.359
And then they end up saying, well, we're not going to go after

509
00:22:09.359 --> 00:22:09.660
them.

510
00:22:09.720 --> 00:22:12.359
You know, she's got to report back to the parents and say, well

511
00:22:12.359 --> 00:22:15.359
sorry, your sons have been taken away and they could be, you know

512
00:22:15.359 --> 00:22:19.079
some news for all sorts of horrors on, God knows what, you know

513
00:22:19.079 --> 00:22:21.240
we've had budget cuts this week, so you know, we're not going to

514
00:22:21.240 --> 00:22:21.480
do it.

515
00:22:21.539 --> 00:22:23.759
By slugs played by Gary Downey.

516
00:22:23.819 --> 00:22:25.680
This is and this from Garmin.

517
00:22:25.740 --> 00:22:27.779
This from the guy Rod had the hots for?

518
00:22:27.900 --> 00:22:28.500
Yeah, yeah.

519
00:22:28.559 --> 00:22:30.180
Yeah, I'm sorry this time round.

520
00:22:30.240 --> 00:22:34.440
His performance as the father is the worst thing in his...

521
00:22:34.500 --> 00:22:35.460
What else could he have done?

522
00:22:35.460 --> 00:22:36.720
I do not care about the twins.

523
00:22:36.839 --> 00:22:39.059
I do not care about me, I don't rot for obeying it.

524
00:22:39.119 --> 00:22:43.920
He, Dennis Chenery, you and director Peter Moffatt, I'm going to

525
00:22:43.920 --> 00:22:44.160
kill you.

526
00:22:44.220 --> 00:22:47.880
And Eric, say with this script, anything on Earth is... absolutely

527
00:22:47.880 --> 00:22:49.500
totally, utterly crap.

528
00:22:49.680 --> 00:22:53.039
Todd is now knee deep in bodies in the console.

529
00:22:53.099 --> 00:22:55.859
I'm sorry, bodies fluid.

530
00:22:56.279 --> 00:23:00.180
That combined with the fact that Colin and Nicola have to do this

531
00:23:00.180 --> 00:23:01.440
strangulation sense.

532
00:23:01.500 --> 00:23:05.700
I hope this is as exciting for you, dear listeners, because this

533
00:23:05.700 --> 00:23:06.359
is pretty hot.

534
00:23:06.420 --> 00:23:08.579
In this episode, right?

535
00:23:08.700 --> 00:23:09.960
And it comes out of nowhere.

536
00:23:10.019 --> 00:23:12.599
And I will give Colin credit, like, and her credit for when it

537
00:23:12.599 --> 00:23:15.240
happens, but the moment that happens, it is shocking and I

538
00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:18.480
actually think that whole lead up to it as he turns on a dime and

539
00:23:18.480 --> 00:23:19.440
talks to me about the peri thing.

540
00:23:19.500 --> 00:23:20.579
Yeah, that's great.

541
00:23:20.640 --> 00:23:21.660
I don't have a problem with that.

542
00:23:21.720 --> 00:23:23.940
Like, really what needed to happen, she needed to run cowering

543
00:23:23.940 --> 00:23:28.619
into the corner. and not be attacked and him to realise and go, and

544
00:23:28.619 --> 00:23:29.700
actually apologise.

545
00:23:29.759 --> 00:23:31.019
That's what this needs.

546
00:23:31.079 --> 00:23:33.420
It needs an apology, Perry, I am so sorry.

547
00:23:33.480 --> 00:23:34.740
No point in this script.

548
00:23:34.799 --> 00:23:36.900
Does it actually give that?

549
00:23:36.960 --> 00:23:39.720
In fact, his apology takes the form of, I have to atone on this

550
00:23:39.720 --> 00:23:42.960
craggy rock and you're going to be my disciple and minister to it

551
00:23:42.960 --> 00:23:45.720
my every knee. actually find that absolutely hilarious.

552
00:23:45.839 --> 00:23:49.079
I mean, you know, like he can be funny, but in the context where

553
00:23:49.079 --> 00:23:53.339
he's attacked her violently, and we've already said that she's a

554
00:23:53.339 --> 00:23:58.019
companion that men manhandle, and now the doctor's doing it to

555
00:23:58.019 --> 00:23:58.259
her.

556
00:23:58.319 --> 00:24:00.900
It's just, it's fractals of wrong.

557
00:24:00.960 --> 00:24:02.460
It's wrong.

558
00:24:02.519 --> 00:24:06.180
It's wrong turtles. descending it wrong all the way down.

559
00:24:06.240 --> 00:24:08.759
At the start when he's in the other costume.

560
00:24:08.880 --> 00:24:10.500
He looks great in Pete's costume.

561
00:24:10.559 --> 00:24:12.119
He looks hot in Pete's.

562
00:24:12.180 --> 00:24:13.440
He looks like a rugby linebacker.

563
00:24:13.559 --> 00:24:15.900
Yeah, there was a confidence in his performance.

564
00:24:15.960 --> 00:24:17.579
There's a confidence.

565
00:24:17.640 --> 00:24:19.019
Okay, when I look at this now.

566
00:24:19.259 --> 00:24:19.799
Okay, right.

567
00:24:19.859 --> 00:24:20.519
That a 6 doctor.

568
00:24:20.640 --> 00:24:24.119
That's a 6 doctor on crack, that's like, like, he's taken ice and

569
00:24:24.119 --> 00:24:24.960
God knows what that is.

570
00:24:25.079 --> 00:24:25.799
That's what I see.

571
00:24:25.859 --> 00:24:28.680
I can actually see where the 6 doctor is and where things are.

572
00:24:28.799 --> 00:24:31.500
This is part of the problem with script, is that there's only

573
00:24:31.500 --> 00:24:31.859
Perry.

574
00:24:31.920 --> 00:24:34.680
There's no other there's no other person to break what's going on

575
00:24:34.680 --> 00:24:38.460
in here. 3rd person, like a Turlo to stay on.

576
00:24:38.519 --> 00:24:40.740
And it goes back to what I was saying, like all these other

577
00:24:40.740 --> 00:24:42.900
supporting in the previous regenerations.

578
00:24:42.960 --> 00:24:44.099
There's other people to take the lead.

579
00:24:44.160 --> 00:24:46.380
They are forced into the situation where they have.

580
00:24:46.440 --> 00:24:47.759
It's just the 2 of them, right?

581
00:24:47.819 --> 00:24:50.640
There's no, I'm going to lie down for 2 episodes whilst I sort of

582
00:24:50.640 --> 00:24:51.599
recover and get my balance.

583
00:24:51.660 --> 00:24:52.619
It's like, boom.

584
00:24:52.680 --> 00:24:54.480
Ultimately, it doesn't work, right?

585
00:24:54.539 --> 00:24:58.799
Do you know, Moffatt pulls it off, but Russell is very careful to

586
00:24:58.799 --> 00:25:02.039
do the same thing to surround us with Jackie and Mickey and

587
00:25:02.039 --> 00:25:05.640
Harriet Jones and all of those people that we know from the

588
00:25:05.640 --> 00:25:08.640
previous year in order to buffer it a bit and to give us a chance

589
00:25:08.640 --> 00:25:10.980
for the doctor to emerge properly.

590
00:25:11.460 --> 00:25:15.599
Moffatt is incredibly skilful and super careful in the

591
00:25:15.599 --> 00:25:17.940
introduction of Matt Smith where he doesn't have any of that

592
00:25:17.940 --> 00:25:18.539
staff.

593
00:25:18.599 --> 00:25:22.019
But I remember agreeing with you at the, at the time.

594
00:25:22.079 --> 00:25:25.200
I remember thinking that this is lonely, this regeneration, and

595
00:25:25.200 --> 00:25:28.920
it's kind of sad that it only has one witness, and it really

596
00:25:28.920 --> 00:25:30.779
doesn't work properly.

597
00:25:30.839 --> 00:25:34.680
It just had been some sort of American cop show, for example, and

598
00:25:34.680 --> 00:25:37.259
they the doctor would have been on drugs or whatever and be put

599
00:25:37.259 --> 00:25:39.900
into ER or something and like he would have attacked people around

600
00:25:39.900 --> 00:25:40.140
him.

601
00:25:40.200 --> 00:25:41.099
Like, do you know what I mean?

602
00:25:41.160 --> 00:25:42.900
Like the attendants trying to help him, right?

603
00:25:42.960 --> 00:25:44.579
But here, because it's the companion.

604
00:25:44.640 --> 00:25:47.400
It's just, it's a wrong decision.

605
00:25:47.519 --> 00:25:50.039
It's like the costume ultimately is the wrong decision.

606
00:25:50.099 --> 00:25:55.019
Keeping the same opening titles with the few tweaks is the wrong

607
00:25:55.019 --> 00:25:55.619
decision.

608
00:25:55.680 --> 00:25:58.859
Having this at the end of the year is the wrong decision, having

609
00:25:58.859 --> 00:26:00.839
Eric say would write this is the wrong decision.

610
00:26:00.900 --> 00:26:03.240
They should have said, Bob Holmes, keep on writing.

611
00:26:03.299 --> 00:26:06.059
And having Moffatt directed, Peter Moffatt director is the wrong

612
00:26:06.059 --> 00:26:06.359
decision.

613
00:26:06.420 --> 00:26:08.519
Yeah, it is the wrong decision.

614
00:26:08.579 --> 00:26:11.940
And up to this point, we've had lots of wrong decisions, but

615
00:26:11.940 --> 00:26:13.859
through serendipity or whatever.

616
00:26:13.920 --> 00:26:14.940
It's worked out here.

617
00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:17.819
Everything is just a cataclysm in that 1st episode.

618
00:26:17.880 --> 00:26:21.839
And, you know, I came in here to defend this story, people, you

619
00:26:21.839 --> 00:26:23.880
won't believe this, and I will try and defend the rest of it.

620
00:26:23.940 --> 00:26:24.960
But episode one.

621
00:26:25.500 --> 00:26:29.160
I will defend I will defend Colin Baker's performance in this

622
00:26:29.160 --> 00:26:30.180
story to the art.

623
00:26:30.240 --> 00:26:33.480
I believe what he has to do compared to his predecessors in the

624
00:26:33.480 --> 00:26:36.059
1st story and he gets in it and he does it.

625
00:26:36.119 --> 00:26:39.059
I'll go to that scene where the outside stuff's quite good.

626
00:26:39.119 --> 00:26:41.759
He goes outside and talking about heroes or whatever, and then

627
00:26:41.759 --> 00:26:43.980
they have a little nice little moment before they enter into the

628
00:26:43.980 --> 00:26:45.119
hatch into the tunnels, right?

629
00:26:45.180 --> 00:26:47.519
And then they're talking about heroes and then there's this whole

630
00:26:47.519 --> 00:26:50.940
sequence where he just turns like cowardly before.

631
00:26:51.240 --> 00:26:54.119
I hated that as a kid, but it's the only sequence of these entire

632
00:26:54.119 --> 00:26:57.599
fits that I actually like because I actually see the whole

633
00:26:57.599 --> 00:26:58.140
progression.

634
00:26:58.200 --> 00:27:01.140
But the ending again when he walks back through that door, it's

635
00:27:01.140 --> 00:27:02.279
just dismissive, right?

636
00:27:02.339 --> 00:27:03.960
It's just like, oh, yes, I'm all okay.

637
00:27:04.019 --> 00:27:06.839
No, what needed to happen was the doctor needed to put his arm

638
00:27:06.839 --> 00:27:07.559
around Perry and St.

639
00:27:07.559 --> 00:27:08.460
Perry, I'm so sorry.

640
00:27:08.519 --> 00:27:09.240
Yes, right?

641
00:27:09.299 --> 00:27:11.039
And Colin has said this, right?

642
00:27:11.099 --> 00:27:15.119
But Jane, he did not want to put his arm around the companion and

643
00:27:15.119 --> 00:27:15.660
that sort of thing.

644
00:27:15.720 --> 00:27:18.180
But he does eventually do that in the mysterious planet.

645
00:27:18.240 --> 00:27:19.440
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

646
00:27:19.500 --> 00:27:22.559
But I will also say that in episode four, like the 1st

647
00:27:22.559 --> 00:27:24.059
episodes...

648
00:27:24.119 --> 00:27:27.059
But once you get onto Jakonda, and yes, there's still some fits

649
00:27:27.059 --> 00:27:31.799
and stars and I can cope with them in these, enough in these later

650
00:27:31.799 --> 00:27:33.599
episodes, but there's not as much.

651
00:27:33.660 --> 00:27:37.019
But the weakness of Eric Seybert as a writer.

652
00:27:37.079 --> 00:27:40.980
Shines through when the doctor grabs Perry again in episode four

653
00:27:40.980 --> 00:27:41.279
right?

654
00:27:41.339 --> 00:27:44.099
and says, and this is, oh, promise, I won't, I won't hurt you

655
00:27:44.099 --> 00:27:44.279
right?

656
00:27:44.339 --> 00:27:48.779
That's his, that's his way of trying to do the opposite of what

657
00:27:48.779 --> 00:27:49.980
happened in episode one, right?

658
00:27:50.039 --> 00:27:50.519
Yeah.

659
00:27:51.299 --> 00:27:52.920
Does it work?

660
00:27:52.980 --> 00:27:53.400
I don't know.

661
00:27:53.460 --> 00:27:57.059
Well, you get the, you get his cliffhanger in episode 3 where he

662
00:27:57.059 --> 00:28:01.140
hears that Perry has been caught by Mestor and he calls out

663
00:28:01.140 --> 00:28:05.460
Perry's name in reverse resting cliffhanger face. you know, it's

664
00:28:05.460 --> 00:28:08.160
Colin's 1st proper cliffhanger face and he does it pretty well.

665
00:28:08.220 --> 00:28:12.180
And I think that is meant to be an arc where he starts off

666
00:28:12.180 --> 00:28:14.940
attacking Perry and ends up really concerned for her.

667
00:28:15.000 --> 00:28:18.180
You know, there is some attempt to have some character

668
00:28:18.180 --> 00:28:18.960
progression.

669
00:28:19.019 --> 00:28:22.980
Can I just mention, though, I think that watching this, it is

670
00:28:22.980 --> 00:28:25.920
possible to disentangle the fits from Colin Baker's eventual

671
00:28:25.920 --> 00:28:26.519
performance.

672
00:28:26.579 --> 00:28:31.079
And I have said before, I think Colin's capable of great charm.

673
00:28:31.140 --> 00:28:35.759
I'm not sure that we're going to agree on the quality of Collins

674
00:28:35.759 --> 00:28:39.299
eventual performance, but I think that there is a massive distance

675
00:28:39.299 --> 00:28:42.839
in quality levels of quality between the fits and Collins

676
00:28:42.839 --> 00:28:43.440
performance.

677
00:28:43.440 --> 00:28:47.519
And I think it is really obvious to us watching it now, what is

678
00:28:47.519 --> 00:28:49.680
Collins eventual performance and what's the fits.

679
00:28:49.740 --> 00:28:53.039
The problem is that the audience watching it for the 1st time have

680
00:28:53.039 --> 00:28:55.500
no idea what he's going to end up being live.

681
00:28:55.559 --> 00:28:58.380
Yeah, and it's really hard to keep up with the changes.

682
00:28:58.440 --> 00:29:01.380
And the way Colin seems to approach it.

683
00:29:01.440 --> 00:29:05.700
All of the emotions he shows, I think, show on his face.

684
00:29:05.759 --> 00:29:09.240
And as soon as he turns, you can see in his face that he's

685
00:29:09.240 --> 00:29:09.720
turned.

686
00:29:09.720 --> 00:29:13.859
I'm just speculating here that the kind of the only way for him to

687
00:29:13.859 --> 00:29:16.440
get through this performance is to treat every scene like a

688
00:29:16.440 --> 00:29:20.220
different production because it's, it must be very hard to get

689
00:29:20.220 --> 00:29:24.960
inside the head of someone having these massive mood swings, and

690
00:29:24.960 --> 00:29:30.119
Perry brings up terms like manic depression and bipolar, and that

691
00:29:30.119 --> 00:29:33.059
was the media's view of these conditions at the time that your

692
00:29:33.059 --> 00:29:36.420
moods can swing, you know, 5 times in 20 seconds.

693
00:29:36.839 --> 00:29:41.819
Now, I came to look at Colin's face in this, because of a piece of

694
00:29:41.819 --> 00:29:42.599
advice from Richard.

695
00:29:42.660 --> 00:29:46.440
Richard advised me to watch this program in a special way.

696
00:29:46.500 --> 00:29:47.579
I did.

697
00:29:47.640 --> 00:29:51.599
I haven't seen this since 1984, and Dallas, friend of the podcast

698
00:29:51.599 --> 00:29:54.240
Jones came over to a friend's place when we were all at school, and

699
00:29:54.240 --> 00:29:57.599
we saw Andrazani and Twin Dilemma back to back before it was

700
00:29:57.599 --> 00:30:00.119
broadcast on Australian TV, and Katie Manning was meant to come

701
00:30:00.119 --> 00:30:01.440
over for lunch, but she couldn't come.

702
00:30:01.500 --> 00:30:02.819
So it would have been an amazing day.

703
00:30:02.880 --> 00:30:05.400
But anyway, we were all about 14 or 15.

704
00:30:05.640 --> 00:30:06.599
Well, she knows Colin.

705
00:30:06.660 --> 00:30:07.259
She knows everyone.

706
00:30:08.039 --> 00:30:10.019
Yeah, she's got the range.

707
00:30:10.140 --> 00:30:12.960
But anyway, so we sat there and Andrew's only blew us away in

708
00:30:12.960 --> 00:30:14.339
every direction and at 1415.

709
00:30:14.519 --> 00:30:15.539
We really, we got it.

710
00:30:15.599 --> 00:30:17.160
We got all the subtleties and all the levels.

711
00:30:17.279 --> 00:30:20.819
Sensitive boys of any, you know, it worked perfectly.

712
00:30:20.880 --> 00:30:25.079
Then we saw twin dilemma, and my 1st word, halfway through episode

713
00:30:25.079 --> 00:30:29.700
one was yuck, and then Perry, a 2nd later said, yuck. and

714
00:30:29.700 --> 00:30:30.839
everybody both start laughing.

715
00:30:30.900 --> 00:30:34.799
This time I watched Twin Dilemma before I watched Caves

716
00:30:34.799 --> 00:30:35.640
Avengersani.

717
00:30:35.700 --> 00:30:38.519
I watched it in black and white, and I watched it backwards.

718
00:30:38.700 --> 00:30:42.000
And then and then I watched it frontwards to get Happy Annie.

719
00:30:42.059 --> 00:30:44.099
But no, I agree completely with Todd.

720
00:30:44.160 --> 00:30:47.460
I hadn't, I stopped watching Doctor Who at this and went back to

721
00:30:47.460 --> 00:30:49.079
it in the 80s when Sylvester came on.

722
00:30:49.140 --> 00:30:54.000
But looking at it now, I can see what a glimmer of what Colin

723
00:30:54.000 --> 00:30:55.079
might have been allowed to do.

724
00:30:55.140 --> 00:30:57.480
Yes, he's a very different kind of performer.

725
00:30:57.539 --> 00:30:58.920
He's very theatrical.

726
00:30:58.980 --> 00:31:01.920
He's more of a Henry Gordon Jago type.

727
00:31:01.980 --> 00:31:06.299
But when we stop and consider that the BBC wanted Brian Blessed as

728
00:31:06.299 --> 00:31:09.720
well, and Blessed was very happy to be telling everyone the BBC of

729
00:31:09.720 --> 00:31:11.579
approach for me to play Doctor Who, I have the part.

730
00:31:11.640 --> 00:31:12.779
He thought he did.

731
00:31:12.839 --> 00:31:15.599
Well, at least, you know, Brian Bless, it's cray cray as a bucket

732
00:31:15.599 --> 00:31:16.319
of...

733
00:31:16.319 --> 00:31:18.119
Yeah, and then Cray lived down the sun to go crazy.

734
00:31:18.180 --> 00:31:21.180
And then Colin Hurdy was saying that and called him JNT and said

735
00:31:21.180 --> 00:31:22.140
why have you given away my part?

736
00:31:22.200 --> 00:31:22.920
Exactly.

737
00:31:22.980 --> 00:31:24.839
Because of that because folk higher up?

738
00:31:24.960 --> 00:31:27.359
We're saying that to bless it as the fan law goes.

739
00:31:27.420 --> 00:31:30.240
And then maybe he was taking cues from that as well.

740
00:31:30.299 --> 00:31:33.839
I think Colin has been so misaligned, misjudged, and so

741
00:31:33.839 --> 00:31:34.980
misappropriated for this.

742
00:31:35.039 --> 00:31:37.019
He had no bloody chance.

743
00:31:37.079 --> 00:31:37.980
No, no.

744
00:31:38.039 --> 00:31:41.039
I mean, you know, if they had, and of course, this was a show, as

745
00:31:41.039 --> 00:31:45.059
we discussed with Kays of Andrazani that was pushed back in the

746
00:31:45.059 --> 00:31:45.480
schedule.

747
00:31:45.539 --> 00:31:49.559
The filming work happened between the 2 studio days.

748
00:31:49.619 --> 00:31:51.599
So it was massively disrupted.

749
00:31:51.660 --> 00:31:54.119
Peter Moffatt, being a very old-fashioned director, filmed as much

750
00:31:54.119 --> 00:31:57.119
as possible in story order, rather than getting everything done on

751
00:31:57.119 --> 00:31:58.019
one set and then moving on.

752
00:31:58.319 --> 00:32:02.819
Well, the only difference was the Tardis scenes, which were all

753
00:32:02.819 --> 00:32:04.140
filmed on the final day.

754
00:32:04.200 --> 00:32:07.319
And, you know, that's your important stuff, like the strangulation

755
00:32:07.319 --> 00:32:10.140
scene, and like I'm the doctor, whether you like it or not, they

756
00:32:10.140 --> 00:32:13.740
lost a beautiful line from the last scene where Perry reproaches

757
00:32:13.740 --> 00:32:16.740
the doctor for being so rude to Hugo when they leave, to which the

758
00:32:16.740 --> 00:32:17.519
doctor's response is.

759
00:32:17.640 --> 00:32:21.359
Well, Perry, what is the point in saying goodbye to a man I intend

760
00:32:21.359 --> 00:32:23.519
to visit because he will be a wise and noble leader.

761
00:32:23.579 --> 00:32:25.740
And that would...

762
00:32:25.740 --> 00:32:26.700
We don't get that.

763
00:32:26.759 --> 00:32:29.940
And that would be that would be a moment that shows his different

764
00:32:29.940 --> 00:32:31.740
perspective on the universe.

765
00:32:31.859 --> 00:32:34.259
And it was cut for whatever reason.

766
00:32:34.319 --> 00:32:38.579
Um, you know, this was a, this was an incredibly troubled

767
00:32:38.579 --> 00:32:42.839
production that needed, it needed the time and care put into it

768
00:32:42.839 --> 00:32:44.220
that went into Lagopolis.

769
00:32:44.940 --> 00:32:47.819
Let's talk about David Tennant again.

770
00:32:47.880 --> 00:32:48.660
Do you know what I mean?

771
00:32:48.720 --> 00:32:51.420
It's the 1st time the show has a regeneration.

772
00:32:51.480 --> 00:32:54.480
There's a real danger that the audience are not going to accept

773
00:32:54.480 --> 00:32:58.380
the new doctor because they've never seen a regeneration before.

774
00:32:58.440 --> 00:33:02.940
And yeah, and Russell really goes out of his way to ensure that

775
00:33:02.940 --> 00:33:06.299
the transition is smooth and that we given the chance to recognise

776
00:33:06.299 --> 00:33:08.400
Tenet as the doctor.

777
00:33:08.460 --> 00:33:12.779
And so, you know, very early on we get him, he gets a hero moment

778
00:33:12.839 --> 00:33:15.960
without fully recovering and without stealing the thunder of the

779
00:33:15.960 --> 00:33:17.039
final hero moment.

780
00:33:17.099 --> 00:33:19.319
And then we have to wait a long time for him even to come into

781
00:33:19.319 --> 00:33:19.740
it.

782
00:33:19.799 --> 00:33:22.140
And when he comes in, he solves the problem.

783
00:33:22.200 --> 00:33:25.500
Colin is given nothing comparable to do.

784
00:33:25.559 --> 00:33:30.180
He's given lots of kind of manic behaviour and cowardice and

785
00:33:30.180 --> 00:33:32.460
thoughtlessness and lack of compassion.

786
00:33:32.519 --> 00:33:34.559
What's his big hero moment?

787
00:33:34.619 --> 00:33:39.059
He's going to stride into the villain's lair and throw a vial of

788
00:33:39.059 --> 00:33:40.019
acid at him.

789
00:33:40.079 --> 00:33:41.880
You know, I mean, it's so ill judged.

790
00:33:41.940 --> 00:33:48.960
And it's, it is say would, say would cynicism, his inability to

791
00:33:48.960 --> 00:33:51.480
regard the doctor as a hero.

792
00:33:51.539 --> 00:33:54.900
We saw it in Resurrection of the Daleks, where, you know, Pete

793
00:33:54.900 --> 00:33:59.640
refuses to shoot Davros in the face, uh, and that's regarded as

794
00:33:59.640 --> 00:34:04.619
some kind of weakness, uh, by Seyward, that's regarded as some

795
00:34:04.619 --> 00:34:06.779
kind of weakness in his character.

796
00:34:06.900 --> 00:34:11.159
And so, say it's completely the wrong person to be doing this.

797
00:34:11.219 --> 00:34:13.980
And anything.

798
00:34:14.039 --> 00:34:16.380
Well, no one knows why we're making the show anymore.

799
00:34:16.440 --> 00:34:19.139
And the code tells that story as well.

800
00:34:19.199 --> 00:34:22.860
Yeah, I think the code is actually beautifully designed and I

801
00:34:22.860 --> 00:34:25.440
think it's very much of its time if you look at...

802
00:34:25.500 --> 00:34:26.219
It is very 80s.

803
00:34:26.280 --> 00:34:28.260
If you look at Cindy Lauper or Spender Ballet.

804
00:34:28.320 --> 00:34:30.539
I actually think it's perfectly 80s and I agree with you.

805
00:34:30.599 --> 00:34:32.940
It's beautifully constructed. actually have come to admire the

806
00:34:32.940 --> 00:34:33.179
code.

807
00:34:33.239 --> 00:34:35.099
And I can see...

808
00:34:35.099 --> 00:34:36.239
It's Andrew Lloyd Webber.

809
00:34:36.300 --> 00:34:37.139
It's Joseph's coat.

810
00:34:37.199 --> 00:34:39.360
I can see where it works in the following season.

811
00:34:39.420 --> 00:34:42.179
And I think it could have worked in the season that never was, but

812
00:34:42.179 --> 00:34:42.900
it does not work.

813
00:34:42.960 --> 00:34:45.360
It does not work in Trial Time Lord.

814
00:34:45.420 --> 00:34:47.519
I'm not getting ahead of myself, but it fails to work whenever

815
00:34:47.519 --> 00:34:48.119
it's on Earth.

816
00:34:48.179 --> 00:34:49.619
Yeah, that's the problem.

817
00:34:49.679 --> 00:34:55.440
So the doctor can't ever appear in public on earth, you know, from

818
00:34:55.440 --> 00:34:56.579
now on and he doesn't.

819
00:34:56.699 --> 00:35:01.380
So he can't do something like Pete does in time flight, for

820
00:35:01.380 --> 00:35:03.659
instance, and turn up at Heathrow Airport because he dresses a

821
00:35:03.659 --> 00:35:03.960
clown.

822
00:35:04.019 --> 00:35:04.920
Yeah.

823
00:35:04.920 --> 00:35:08.940
It also has this effect on the design of the program as a whole.

824
00:35:09.059 --> 00:35:15.059
Because the costume is so saturated and colourful in order to not

825
00:35:15.059 --> 00:35:20.880
be drowned out completely buy it, every set from here on in has to

826
00:35:20.880 --> 00:35:22.860
be colourful and giant as well.

827
00:35:22.920 --> 00:35:25.440
Or has to be incredibly drab.

828
00:35:25.500 --> 00:35:28.079
Well, or just be washed out.

829
00:35:28.139 --> 00:35:29.039
But when does that happen?

830
00:35:29.099 --> 00:35:32.099
Everything else is, there's bright colours in every set.

831
00:35:32.159 --> 00:35:35.639
You know, Perry has to suddenly wear this silly outfit as well

832
00:35:35.639 --> 00:35:37.739
which to match what he's wearing.

833
00:35:37.800 --> 00:35:39.719
Otherwise, you're just going to...

834
00:35:39.719 --> 00:35:42.119
Yeah, Hugo, like...

835
00:35:42.179 --> 00:35:43.019
Yeah, awful.

836
00:35:43.079 --> 00:35:47.400
Well, Perry's costume in this was originally a trouser suit, wasn't

837
00:35:47.400 --> 00:35:47.579
it?

838
00:35:47.639 --> 00:35:49.019
Kind of a trouser. yeah.

839
00:35:49.559 --> 00:35:54.300
The way Nicola describes it was I had a polo style shirt with a

840
00:35:54.300 --> 00:35:58.380
polo collar, I had trousers on, Pat Godfrey and I had discussed it

841
00:35:58.380 --> 00:36:00.480
I said, well, look, I'm an American student, as you mentioned

842
00:36:00.480 --> 00:36:04.320
previously, Richard, her partner at the time was American, so she

843
00:36:04.320 --> 00:36:07.380
had an insight into the fashions that were popular in America.

844
00:36:07.440 --> 00:36:09.059
So they had that discussion.

845
00:36:09.119 --> 00:36:10.920
Nicola came on in her costume.

846
00:36:10.980 --> 00:36:15.059
And during the producer's run, John Nathan Turner comes over the

847
00:36:15.059 --> 00:36:17.579
PA and says, could Nicola please get into costume?

848
00:36:17.639 --> 00:36:21.179
The costume we see on screen is the remnants of that costume.

849
00:36:21.239 --> 00:36:24.000
Pat Godfrey apparently ran in with a sewing machine and scissors

850
00:36:24.000 --> 00:36:27.300
and cut it up on the studio floor, which is why it has that weird

851
00:36:27.300 --> 00:36:30.360
ribbon around the collar and why it's got the sash around the

852
00:36:30.360 --> 00:36:34.980
middle to try and join it, and Nicola actually heard John say, we

853
00:36:34.980 --> 00:36:37.380
cannot have the doctor showing more flesh than the companion.

854
00:36:37.920 --> 00:36:42.840
The way Nicola chose to play it and why she comes into the console

855
00:36:42.840 --> 00:36:46.199
and says, ta-da, is she's trying to say, I look horrible.

856
00:36:46.260 --> 00:36:48.119
Can't you see how horrible you look?

857
00:36:48.780 --> 00:36:54.599
My big problem with the coat has always been the yellow lapel and

858
00:36:54.599 --> 00:36:55.980
the green panel on the back.

859
00:36:56.039 --> 00:36:57.599
I find them incredibly distracting.

860
00:36:57.659 --> 00:37:01.079
If they were hues of red instead, the predominant thing of the

861
00:37:01.079 --> 00:37:05.280
coat would be red with flashes of yellow, it would be eccentric

862
00:37:05.280 --> 00:37:06.239
but it would be tasteful.

863
00:37:06.300 --> 00:37:09.119
And that's why, Richard, I eventually took your advice when I was

864
00:37:09.119 --> 00:37:09.539
watching this.

865
00:37:09.599 --> 00:37:14.280
I watched the 1st 2 episodes in colour with commentary and the

866
00:37:14.280 --> 00:37:18.000
commentary is Hugo Nicola and Kevin McNally, and I kind of

867
00:37:18.000 --> 00:37:20.340
switched the commentary off a little bit after the strangulation

868
00:37:20.340 --> 00:37:22.980
scene because they all go, oh, isn't this wonderful and daring and

869
00:37:22.980 --> 00:37:23.280
brave?

870
00:37:23.340 --> 00:37:27.059
And I'm just thinking, no, this is, this, I'm just like, this is

871
00:37:27.059 --> 00:37:29.340
horrible, but they wouldn't have known this.

872
00:37:29.400 --> 00:37:33.059
It's horrible because the last 3 years the TARDIS has become a

873
00:37:33.059 --> 00:37:36.360
domestic environment and this is now domestic violence.

874
00:37:36.480 --> 00:37:40.380
This is a father figure as Nicola viewed the doctor.

875
00:37:40.800 --> 00:37:42.780
This is a father figure.

876
00:37:42.780 --> 00:37:44.820
Beating their child.

877
00:37:44.880 --> 00:37:46.139
It really is.

878
00:37:46.199 --> 00:37:47.880
And it is wrong.

879
00:37:47.940 --> 00:37:49.619
It is completely wrong.

880
00:37:49.679 --> 00:37:52.559
So, at beginning of episode three.

881
00:37:52.619 --> 00:37:54.119
I turn the colour all the way down.

882
00:37:54.179 --> 00:37:55.440
I turn the contrast all the way up.

883
00:37:55.500 --> 00:37:57.840
Suddenly, it's Flash Gordon.

884
00:37:57.900 --> 00:37:58.980
It's Dan Dare.

885
00:37:59.039 --> 00:38:01.500
It's a 1940 serial and it looks amazing.

886
00:38:01.559 --> 00:38:03.840
It works as a 50s show, yeah.

887
00:38:03.840 --> 00:38:05.219
Once they get it to Jakonda.

888
00:38:05.280 --> 00:38:08.039
I actually like all the performances of the Jakondans, and I think

889
00:38:08.039 --> 00:38:11.400
the actual, the makeup is extraordinary.

890
00:38:11.460 --> 00:38:12.420
And I like that.

891
00:38:12.480 --> 00:38:16.679
I like the good guy and the bad one and then the Chamberlain, who

892
00:38:16.679 --> 00:38:18.420
is from Seeds of Doom.

893
00:38:19.440 --> 00:38:20.039
Seymour Green.

894
00:38:20.159 --> 00:38:21.840
That's Emma Green Harrison.

895
00:38:21.900 --> 00:38:23.519
That's Harrison Chase's butler.

896
00:38:23.579 --> 00:38:25.320
He's too violent.

897
00:38:25.380 --> 00:38:29.400
And, you know, I've, I've, is it Maurice, what's his name?

898
00:38:30.480 --> 00:38:33.900
Look, you know that other old fool back in Arc of Infinity who had

899
00:38:33.900 --> 00:38:34.320
lost it?

900
00:38:34.380 --> 00:38:35.519
Leonard Sachs, right?

901
00:38:35.579 --> 00:38:38.159
Here, he's almost losing it, but he's good enough.

902
00:38:38.219 --> 00:38:40.380
I really like, I really think it's a very sympathetic

903
00:38:40.380 --> 00:38:40.920
performance.

904
00:38:41.039 --> 00:38:42.300
Denim is a brilliant actor.

905
00:38:42.360 --> 00:38:45.360
And, you know, when the doctor holds him in his arms where he dies

906
00:38:45.360 --> 00:38:45.960
at the end.

907
00:38:46.019 --> 00:38:47.219
I mean I really love that stuff.

908
00:38:47.280 --> 00:38:50.039
I actually really like episode four, and I know you don't like

909
00:38:50.039 --> 00:38:51.659
whether I'm the doctor or I like it or not.

910
00:38:51.719 --> 00:38:53.219
There, a danger thing there, which I really like.

911
00:38:53.280 --> 00:38:55.739
I really, really think I really do like episode four.

912
00:38:55.860 --> 00:38:59.519
And at the end, I think people forget that she's smiling at him

913
00:38:59.519 --> 00:39:00.300
he's smiling at her.

914
00:39:00.360 --> 00:39:01.380
They keep smiling at each other.

915
00:39:01.440 --> 00:39:03.599
So for me, it's sort of like, well, okay, things haven't been

916
00:39:03.599 --> 00:39:06.960
great, but yeah, we can, we can touch.

917
00:39:07.019 --> 00:39:08.880
That's how I feel.

918
00:39:08.940 --> 00:39:11.579
I know that you've got a face of grimace and you're going to

919
00:39:11.579 --> 00:39:13.800
disagree with me on this. possibly.

920
00:39:13.980 --> 00:39:15.719
No, no, it's Stockholm syndrome.

921
00:39:15.780 --> 00:39:16.260
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

922
00:39:16.380 --> 00:39:16.739
Yeah, yeah.

923
00:39:16.800 --> 00:39:18.119
We haven't earned the smile.

924
00:39:18.239 --> 00:39:19.019
No, that's the thing.

925
00:39:19.079 --> 00:39:21.659
No, you don't get to abuse a woman and then she keeps staying with

926
00:39:21.659 --> 00:39:25.679
you without any recompense without any statement. is appalling.

927
00:39:25.739 --> 00:39:30.239
I do love Nicola's internal explanation because as we've discussed

928
00:39:30.239 --> 00:39:33.179
before, she is a very considerate and thoughtful actress.

929
00:39:33.239 --> 00:39:34.739
She thinks about why she's doing things.

930
00:39:34.800 --> 00:39:37.679
She has this story, she tells about her 1st theatre role.

931
00:39:37.739 --> 00:39:39.599
Although she had one action and one line.

932
00:39:39.659 --> 00:39:41.340
In one scene, she's scrubbing potatoes.

933
00:39:41.639 --> 00:39:43.320
Are you frozen?

934
00:39:43.380 --> 00:39:44.159
No, no.

935
00:39:44.219 --> 00:39:46.920
And she sat down and she wrote down why the potatoes are so

936
00:39:46.920 --> 00:39:47.880
important to this family.

937
00:39:47.940 --> 00:39:50.280
You know, this is a World War one drama, I believe.

938
00:39:50.340 --> 00:39:52.860
And then she has one line in the latest scene.

939
00:39:52.920 --> 00:39:55.199
She has to run in and explain the Russians are coming and she

940
00:39:55.199 --> 00:39:58.199
wrote another 2 pages on why she's so afraid of the Russians.

941
00:39:58.260 --> 00:40:00.840
You know, this is the thought that Nicola puts in to one action

942
00:40:00.840 --> 00:40:01.559
and one scene.

943
00:40:01.800 --> 00:40:04.980
Like, if you directors hated her forever.

944
00:40:05.760 --> 00:40:08.579
After she had to throw out the folder of notes she made on the

945
00:40:08.579 --> 00:40:11.099
fact that the 5th doctor looked like her father, et cetera, et

946
00:40:11.099 --> 00:40:11.460
cetera.

947
00:40:11.519 --> 00:40:14.820
She read the script to the twin dilemma and said to herself, why

948
00:40:14.820 --> 00:40:16.980
would Perry stay with this man?

949
00:40:17.039 --> 00:40:19.440
And her rationale was this?

950
00:40:19.679 --> 00:40:23.280
The doctor saved her life at the cost of his own.

951
00:40:23.579 --> 00:40:27.840
And during the course of the 1st story, she still sees moments

952
00:40:27.840 --> 00:40:32.219
where he is kind and he is sympathetic and she says, I am going to

953
00:40:32.219 --> 00:40:32.880
save his life.

954
00:40:32.940 --> 00:40:34.139
He is losing his life.

955
00:40:34.199 --> 00:40:35.099
He is losing his mind.

956
00:40:35.159 --> 00:40:38.699
I am going to stay with him and repay that debt.

957
00:40:38.760 --> 00:40:41.159
And if only that had come out.

958
00:40:41.219 --> 00:40:43.440
And that last...

959
00:40:43.739 --> 00:40:45.420
That last scene would have been perfect to do it.

960
00:40:45.480 --> 00:40:46.739
And I'm not blaming Nicola.

961
00:40:46.800 --> 00:40:48.119
There was no prep time for this story.

962
00:40:48.119 --> 00:40:51.719
And indeed, we know that the actors were not always listened to

963
00:40:51.719 --> 00:40:53.519
under this regime.

964
00:40:53.519 --> 00:40:56.940
But you know, if the doctor had said, I'm the doctor, whether you

965
00:40:56.940 --> 00:40:59.820
like it or not, she will say, if she could have said, I don't like

966
00:40:59.820 --> 00:41:00.059
it.

967
00:41:00.119 --> 00:41:02.820
But I'm going to make sure that I do.

968
00:41:02.880 --> 00:41:04.320
And then walk off.

969
00:41:04.380 --> 00:41:08.280
And if we could have had the doctor's face off on that, like, what

970
00:41:08.280 --> 00:41:08.940
the hell does that mean?

971
00:41:09.059 --> 00:41:11.400
And that would have been...

972
00:41:11.460 --> 00:41:12.539
It would have been hope?

973
00:41:12.599 --> 00:41:13.619
says Kank St.

974
00:41:13.619 --> 00:41:14.460
Carrie Fisher, yes.

975
00:41:14.579 --> 00:41:15.719
It would have been...

976
00:41:15.719 --> 00:41:15.960
St.

977
00:41:15.960 --> 00:41:16.739
Digital Carrie Fisher.

978
00:41:16.860 --> 00:41:18.360
It would have been hope.

979
00:41:18.420 --> 00:41:21.360
It would have been uncertainty, which we already have.

980
00:41:21.420 --> 00:41:25.440
And it would have been, while it's a slightly negative note, it

981
00:41:25.440 --> 00:41:28.619
also would have been a positive note that Perry's like, I have not

982
00:41:28.619 --> 00:41:31.500
forgotten how you've been acting, and I'm not going to put up with

983
00:41:31.500 --> 00:41:34.199
it, it would have turned it to the doctor saying you're stuck with

984
00:41:34.199 --> 00:41:36.420
me, and she would have said, no, you're stuck with me.

985
00:41:37.260 --> 00:41:41.519
I think in the context, though, there is a 4th wall thing where it

986
00:41:41.519 --> 00:41:43.380
is a challenge to the audience.

987
00:41:43.500 --> 00:41:44.400
Which is a bad idea.

988
00:41:44.460 --> 00:41:46.260
Yeah, which I just think is a bad idea.

989
00:41:46.320 --> 00:41:50.280
And what ends up happening is they tune in next year for an

990
00:41:50.280 --> 00:41:53.460
episode to see how things turn out and then decide, all right

991
00:41:53.460 --> 00:41:57.300
we're not back and the and the viewing figures crater.

992
00:41:57.360 --> 00:42:00.420
And I think that that's a delayed reaction to what goes on here.

993
00:42:01.199 --> 00:42:03.420
Can I say a few things I like?

994
00:42:03.480 --> 00:42:07.260
I think possibly there's a moment of respite?

995
00:42:07.320 --> 00:42:07.920
Ranium.

996
00:42:08.159 --> 00:42:13.079
And especially this comes more from my black and white viewing of

997
00:42:13.079 --> 00:42:16.500
it, because I didn't realise how distracting I found Colin's coat

998
00:42:16.500 --> 00:42:18.539
until I turned the colour down and I could focus on his face.

999
00:42:19.079 --> 00:42:22.800
That bit where they 1st arrive on jacondar and he steps out of the

1000
00:42:22.800 --> 00:42:26.099
Tardis narrating about the giant slugs, the speech is terrible.

1001
00:42:26.159 --> 00:42:27.420
The dialogue is terrible.

1002
00:42:27.539 --> 00:42:29.460
It's a horrific info dump.

1003
00:42:29.639 --> 00:42:33.239
But after a while, I stopped listening to the words and I started

1004
00:42:33.239 --> 00:42:34.079
listening to the voice.

1005
00:42:34.139 --> 00:42:35.639
Oh, he's got a great voice.

1006
00:42:35.699 --> 00:42:39.000
He's got a great voice and his face during that performance, he is

1007
00:42:39.000 --> 00:42:42.659
heartbroken and appalled by what has happened, not only to this

1008
00:42:42.659 --> 00:42:45.480
planet, but to the people, and it's all on his face, and it's all

1009
00:42:45.480 --> 00:42:45.900
in his voice.

1010
00:42:45.960 --> 00:42:49.500
And then he very sensibly goes, I'm going to go back in the TARDIS

1011
00:42:49.500 --> 00:42:50.099
and think about this.

1012
00:42:50.159 --> 00:42:52.860
He doesn't go, we're going to go charging off.

1013
00:42:52.980 --> 00:42:56.039
And his little tantrum in the TARDIS.

1014
00:42:56.099 --> 00:42:58.980
He has this moment of self-awareness where he's like, I am in no

1015
00:42:58.980 --> 00:43:00.119
condition to save a planet.

1016
00:43:00.179 --> 00:43:00.900
Yeah, yeah.

1017
00:43:00.900 --> 00:43:03.539
And unfortunately, it's solved by Eric Saywood's favourite thing

1018
00:43:03.539 --> 00:43:05.639
about someone pointing a gun at his face.

1019
00:43:05.699 --> 00:43:09.000
You know, it would have been better for Perry to say, I'll look

1020
00:43:09.000 --> 00:43:09.420
after you.

1021
00:43:09.480 --> 00:43:11.219
I'll make sure we solve this together.

1022
00:43:11.280 --> 00:43:12.179
That's what we do.

1023
00:43:12.239 --> 00:43:14.400
Because Perry starts to persuade him.

1024
00:43:14.460 --> 00:43:17.099
And then Hugo shoves a gun in his face and it's just like, oh, for

1025
00:43:17.099 --> 00:43:18.420
goodness sake, Eric.

1026
00:43:18.480 --> 00:43:20.699
I almost needed you to bleed me again.

1027
00:43:20.760 --> 00:43:23.280
So, you know, that's a good thing.

1028
00:43:23.940 --> 00:43:29.699
Um, The doctor gives Mestor a chance before he throws the acid in

1029
00:43:29.699 --> 00:43:30.059
his face.

1030
00:43:30.119 --> 00:43:31.980
He says, I don't tolerate this plan.

1031
00:43:32.039 --> 00:43:32.760
It's going to stop.

1032
00:43:33.360 --> 00:43:36.960
If it doesn't, I'm going to have I'm going to have to do

1033
00:43:36.960 --> 00:43:37.260
something.

1034
00:43:37.380 --> 00:43:41.099
But the thing is, as he points out, I didn't threaten him.

1035
00:43:41.159 --> 00:43:43.739
I didn't say I was going to do anything to you, I said, I'm not

1036
00:43:43.739 --> 00:43:44.460
going to put up with this.

1037
00:43:44.940 --> 00:43:49.440
There's the bit where he's cradling Asmail in his arms, as you say

1038
00:43:49.440 --> 00:43:54.179
Todd, that is a beautiful moment, and both Colin and Maurice

1039
00:43:54.179 --> 00:43:56.039
Denham, who Colin respected greatly.

1040
00:43:56.099 --> 00:43:58.320
He couldn't believe they got Morris Denim for his 1st story.

1041
00:43:58.380 --> 00:44:01.079
They both bring it right down low.

1042
00:44:01.139 --> 00:44:02.699
It's a really lovely character moment.

1043
00:44:02.760 --> 00:44:08.280
My problem with that scene is it robs, like the rest of the script

1044
00:44:08.280 --> 00:44:08.880
has been doing.

1045
00:44:08.940 --> 00:44:12.539
It robs the doctor of his redemptive chance in this story.

1046
00:44:12.599 --> 00:44:14.820
Yeah, he doesn't get a proper hero moment and it's a mistake.

1047
00:44:14.940 --> 00:44:20.219
I have one other Colin acting moment that I really like, which is

1048
00:44:20.219 --> 00:44:25.019
when he inadvertently calls Perry Tegan, where he says Braveheart

1049
00:44:25.019 --> 00:44:25.320
Tegan.

1050
00:44:25.380 --> 00:44:28.199
And then you get the music, the leaving music, is it from

1051
00:44:28.199 --> 00:44:28.739
Resurrection?

1052
00:44:28.860 --> 00:44:31.980
The Daleks, the Tegan, leaving music, and the doctor just sort of

1053
00:44:31.980 --> 00:44:33.119
thinks back for a second.

1054
00:44:33.239 --> 00:44:35.340
Like, I think that's really nice.

1055
00:44:35.400 --> 00:44:38.699
It is a moment where he drops the bluster for a 2nd like he does

1056
00:44:38.699 --> 00:44:40.380
in Asmael's death scene.

1057
00:44:40.440 --> 00:44:44.699
There's another moment that I actually like, and it's the worst

1058
00:44:44.699 --> 00:44:46.380
some of the worst dialogue in the history of Doctor Who.

1059
00:44:46.440 --> 00:44:47.699
Thank you, Eric Saywood.

1060
00:44:47.760 --> 00:44:51.420
Well, he actually has to say regenerate yet...

1061
00:44:51.420 --> 00:44:52.139
Ungenerate.

1062
00:44:52.199 --> 00:44:55.019
And my memory cheated.

1063
00:44:55.079 --> 00:44:57.719
And I actually thought it was season 23 common where everything is

1064
00:44:57.719 --> 00:44:59.579
like overemphasised stage acting.

1065
00:45:00.119 --> 00:45:01.980
But he actually drops it completely down.

1066
00:45:02.099 --> 00:45:06.360
And I actually, and it was in that moment when I was watching this

1067
00:45:06.360 --> 00:45:09.539
I said, I'm going to watch this story, not for all the pathetic

1068
00:45:09.539 --> 00:45:11.400
dialogue and things that I don't like.

1069
00:45:11.460 --> 00:45:14.099
I'm going to watch it for your performance because you've just

1070
00:45:14.099 --> 00:45:16.199
done something now that has surprised me that I had forgotten

1071
00:45:16.199 --> 00:45:16.559
about it.

1072
00:45:16.619 --> 00:45:19.559
And I want to see how you navigate yourself with no direction

1073
00:45:19.559 --> 00:45:23.820
through all these twists and turns, and having to not say sorry

1074
00:45:23.820 --> 00:45:25.079
and what can you give to me?

1075
00:45:25.139 --> 00:45:28.079
And Brendan, you've mentioned the whole facial stuff.

1076
00:45:28.079 --> 00:45:30.539
And I can sit through 3 and 4 quite happily.

1077
00:45:30.599 --> 00:45:33.840
I think it actually does come together towards the end more so

1078
00:45:33.840 --> 00:45:36.840
than something like, I'm just going to say time flight, which I

1079
00:45:36.840 --> 00:45:37.739
think just falls apart.

1080
00:45:37.800 --> 00:45:39.000
But it's coming from such a low base.

1081
00:45:39.059 --> 00:45:41.159
Episode one is seriously.

1082
00:45:41.219 --> 00:45:47.099
So, but if I just say to listeners out there, you can Not like the

1083
00:45:47.099 --> 00:45:47.460
character.

1084
00:45:47.519 --> 00:45:49.500
Not like the story.

1085
00:45:49.559 --> 00:45:51.539
Not like the dialogue, not like what happens.

1086
00:45:51.599 --> 00:45:55.440
But if you are ever going to sit down and watch this, just watch

1087
00:45:55.440 --> 00:45:59.280
Collins performance throughout and what he has to navigate as a

1088
00:45:59.280 --> 00:46:01.619
lead actor that I don't think any other lead actor has actually

1089
00:46:01.619 --> 00:46:03.659
had to navigate in history for sure.

1090
00:46:03.719 --> 00:46:07.739
And so when he says those final things with period the TARDIS, I

1091
00:46:07.739 --> 00:46:10.739
felt that I'd earned it as a kid, I had no problems with it

1092
00:46:10.739 --> 00:46:11.280
right?

1093
00:46:11.340 --> 00:46:14.820
I mentioned previously that I could not see the difference between

1094
00:46:14.820 --> 00:46:17.039
the previous story and this as a child.

1095
00:46:17.099 --> 00:46:19.920
Obviously, I can see the difference there.

1096
00:46:20.460 --> 00:46:25.679
But as a child, there was a confident doctor in charge who was

1097
00:46:25.679 --> 00:46:26.579
prepared to take charge.

1098
00:46:26.579 --> 00:46:30.300
And that was, that's what I was used to with Tom and John, not

1099
00:46:30.300 --> 00:46:31.079
used to with Peter.

1100
00:46:31.139 --> 00:46:32.039
Right?

1101
00:46:32.099 --> 00:46:37.559
And so for me, to have 3 years of Peter, that thing around and

1102
00:46:37.559 --> 00:46:41.400
losing, at a time when I was at school, I was getting really

1103
00:46:41.400 --> 00:46:42.480
harassed and picked on.

1104
00:46:46.619 --> 00:46:48.000
And my hero wasn't there for me.

1105
00:46:48.059 --> 00:46:48.960
Yeah, yeah.

1106
00:46:48.960 --> 00:46:51.719
And in this one story, my hero came back.

1107
00:46:51.780 --> 00:46:54.000
He might have been erratic, he might have done some horrible

1108
00:46:54.000 --> 00:46:56.760
things, but by the end of this story, my hero was back.

1109
00:46:56.820 --> 00:46:59.280
He was in charge, and you know, he was going to tell the

1110
00:46:59.280 --> 00:47:02.219
Chamberlain, well, bad luck, baby, you've been a collaborator, you

1111
00:47:02.219 --> 00:47:02.820
deal with it.

1112
00:47:02.880 --> 00:47:04.199
Well, Hugo, I think you're a fool.

1113
00:47:04.260 --> 00:47:04.800
I don't care.

1114
00:47:04.860 --> 00:47:05.940
He's telling them what for.

1115
00:47:06.000 --> 00:47:09.539
He's not going, oh, oh, I'm going to hurt your feelings if I say

1116
00:47:09.539 --> 00:47:10.320
what I really think.

1117
00:47:10.380 --> 00:47:14.820
And so for me, I have such, the guys here, I think, can see that

1118
00:47:14.820 --> 00:47:15.840
I'm getting very emotional.

1119
00:47:15.900 --> 00:47:18.900
And so for me, the doctor was back.

1120
00:47:19.260 --> 00:47:23.880
I think that's what Todd says so beautifully is why Doctor Who is

1121
00:47:23.880 --> 00:47:26.400
so important to us, and hopefully, you know, people who are

1122
00:47:26.400 --> 00:47:30.239
listening to this as well, is because it touches that part of you

1123
00:47:30.239 --> 00:47:32.880
that can't express itself when you're a child.

1124
00:47:32.940 --> 00:47:33.900
He is our voice.

1125
00:47:33.960 --> 00:47:35.699
And for some of us, he was a father figure.

1126
00:47:35.760 --> 00:47:38.340
You know, I didn't grow up with a father, so for me, it was Tom

1127
00:47:38.340 --> 00:47:40.139
Baker and Patrick McNeve.

1128
00:47:40.199 --> 00:47:41.519
It shows.

1129
00:47:41.519 --> 00:47:45.599
But no, that's exactly true, Todd.

1130
00:47:45.659 --> 00:47:50.460
I was thinking that watching not just this one, but the Peter

1131
00:47:50.460 --> 00:47:52.739
Davidson's era and Todd touched on something really beautiful

1132
00:47:52.739 --> 00:47:55.860
there was that Peter, we didn't feel, and I don't think it's

1133
00:47:55.860 --> 00:47:57.119
Peter's fault. scripted today.

1134
00:47:57.179 --> 00:47:58.440
He didn't come up to the part of the doctor.

1135
00:47:58.559 --> 00:48:01.199
Peter never felt confident that he'd be able to pull it off.

1136
00:48:01.260 --> 00:48:06.900
And the production stuff and crew instead of coming to his rescue

1137
00:48:06.900 --> 00:48:11.460
played along with that, and underwrote the part or made him the

1138
00:48:11.460 --> 00:48:12.360
prat falling doctor.

1139
00:48:12.420 --> 00:48:13.800
He really didn't succeed.

1140
00:48:13.860 --> 00:48:18.000
He only has that moment at the end where he does all his prep

1141
00:48:18.000 --> 00:48:19.860
falls because I'm doing this for a purpose.

1142
00:48:19.920 --> 00:48:21.599
I'm doing it for the person who trusted me.

1143
00:48:21.659 --> 00:48:23.460
And more importantly, I don't know her.

1144
00:48:23.519 --> 00:48:25.739
We don't really have a relationship, but that's not the point.

1145
00:48:25.800 --> 00:48:27.480
The point is she's put her trust in me.

1146
00:48:27.539 --> 00:48:31.920
I must therefore come up to that and do the same with her and he's

1147
00:48:31.920 --> 00:48:32.880
thoroughly redeemed.

1148
00:48:32.940 --> 00:48:36.780
And actually, Colin, and it's nothing to do with the script, and

1149
00:48:36.780 --> 00:48:39.539
it's nothing to do with anyone else on the crew, but Colin and

1150
00:48:39.539 --> 00:48:42.960
Nicola, just in their acting, just in their performance, just in

1151
00:48:42.960 --> 00:48:45.659
their presence, after that appalling scene, that I can never

1152
00:48:45.659 --> 00:48:49.380
forgive, because no doctor should ever attack a companion on any

1153
00:48:49.380 --> 00:48:49.679
level.

1154
00:48:49.739 --> 00:48:53.699
But they still have that moment where you sort of think, I think

1155
00:48:53.699 --> 00:48:55.980
these 2 might actually manage to save this.

1156
00:48:56.039 --> 00:49:01.800
Yeah, I do often wonder, because the copy of this I had as a kid

1157
00:49:01.800 --> 00:49:04.380
the strangulation scene was massively cut down.

1158
00:49:04.440 --> 00:49:07.079
What happens is this is from the 93 repeat season?

1159
00:49:07.139 --> 00:49:12.360
The doctor lunges at Perry, we cut straight to the mirror shot and

1160
00:49:12.360 --> 00:49:13.139
he recoils.

1161
00:49:13.199 --> 00:49:16.380
So I knew there was the full strangulation because I'd read the

1162
00:49:16.380 --> 00:49:16.920
novelisation.

1163
00:49:16.980 --> 00:49:18.420
And he really throws her around.

1164
00:49:18.480 --> 00:49:20.880
Yeah, I mean, that is...

1165
00:49:20.940 --> 00:49:24.719
But the thing is, it works just as a lunge.

1166
00:49:24.780 --> 00:49:25.920
Look at yourself in the mirror after.

1167
00:49:25.980 --> 00:49:26.639
Which is all it should have been.

1168
00:49:26.699 --> 00:49:26.880
Yeah.

1169
00:49:26.880 --> 00:49:27.179
Yeah.

1170
00:49:27.239 --> 00:49:32.340
And for that reason, as a kid, when I saw this when I was about 10

1171
00:49:32.340 --> 00:49:36.659
or 11 years old, it bothered me a lot less than it does as an

1172
00:49:36.659 --> 00:49:41.280
adult seeing the full thing because it was a violent moment along

1173
00:49:41.280 --> 00:49:47.579
the lines of the illusory Tom at the end of Stones of Blood.

1174
00:49:47.639 --> 00:49:49.500
You know, it was a flash and it's gone.

1175
00:49:49.559 --> 00:49:53.639
Whereas, as it is in the program, it's horrible and it lingers.

1176
00:49:53.699 --> 00:49:58.440
But I do wonder, if, if we did cut it down to the point that he

1177
00:49:58.440 --> 00:50:02.099
kind of goes for her and then recoils, as we kind of mentioned

1178
00:50:02.099 --> 00:50:07.260
earlier, Could we, as fans and viewers, be able to overlook that

1179
00:50:07.260 --> 00:50:11.400
and look at more, find more positives in the story because it

1180
00:50:11.400 --> 00:50:14.460
doesn't help that the story itself is not that strong anyway.

1181
00:50:14.519 --> 00:50:18.840
It's full of logical inconsistencies and it's got at its heart.

1182
00:50:18.900 --> 00:50:22.320
And literally, at the heart of the narrative, You have these 2

1183
00:50:22.320 --> 00:50:26.159
twins who, through no fault of their own, have been hired for a

1184
00:50:26.159 --> 00:50:27.420
role they're not ready for.

1185
00:50:27.480 --> 00:50:30.480
One of them acting, yeah.

1186
00:50:30.539 --> 00:50:34.139
I mean, for instance, there's the whole thing about the transmat

1187
00:50:34.139 --> 00:50:37.500
you mentioned earlier, Todd, that it'll send you about 10 seconds

1188
00:50:37.500 --> 00:50:37.920
in time.

1189
00:50:37.980 --> 00:50:40.500
In the original script, it was an hour back in time, but still the

1190
00:50:40.500 --> 00:50:43.619
base exploded, and it was actually Eric Saywood, who said, um

1191
00:50:43.619 --> 00:50:45.480
Anthony, this doesn't make any sense.

1192
00:50:45.539 --> 00:50:46.679
Why would it still explode?

1193
00:50:46.739 --> 00:50:47.760
So we made it 10 seconds.

1194
00:50:47.940 --> 00:50:51.960
Whereas finally, when Eric Saywood wrote the novelisation, he just

1195
00:50:51.960 --> 00:50:54.420
wrote it as the doctor turned into a trans mat, which makes

1196
00:50:54.420 --> 00:50:55.079
sense.

1197
00:50:55.079 --> 00:50:57.960
Makes sense, but it doesn't make sense as it airs because it's

1198
00:50:57.960 --> 00:51:00.059
still talking about 10 seconds when it just transmits.

1199
00:51:00.119 --> 00:51:04.139
What's really bizarre, in terms of logical inconsistency, in

1200
00:51:04.139 --> 00:51:09.659
episode three, Asmail says that the 2 outer planets will be

1201
00:51:09.659 --> 00:51:12.119
brought into orbit around Jakonda.

1202
00:51:12.179 --> 00:51:16.619
In episode four, Asmail says that the 2 planets will be brought

1203
00:51:16.619 --> 00:51:20.400
into the same orbiters to Jakonda, but one Jakondan day ahead of

1204
00:51:20.400 --> 00:51:21.780
each other because of time travel.

1205
00:51:21.840 --> 00:51:24.780
But it's like, no, I wouldn't they be one day ahead in terms of

1206
00:51:24.780 --> 00:51:25.260
distance?

1207
00:51:25.320 --> 00:51:29.159
And then, of course, the doctor says, oh, but that close to the

1208
00:51:29.159 --> 00:51:32.760
sun, they'll burn up, but it's like, well, but no, Mercury and

1209
00:51:32.760 --> 00:51:35.940
Venus are smaller than Earth. you know what are you talking

1210
00:51:35.940 --> 00:51:36.300
about?

1211
00:51:36.360 --> 00:51:41.219
And it's, it never would have happened under Christopher Hamilton

1212
00:51:41.219 --> 00:51:43.139
bid me, and I don't mean that as a joke.

1213
00:51:43.199 --> 00:51:44.639
I mean, he would have liked it.

1214
00:51:44.699 --> 00:51:48.480
Because he was scrupulous in his care for, you know, the facts of

1215
00:51:48.480 --> 00:51:49.739
as far as they could go.

1216
00:51:49.800 --> 00:51:51.900
You know, you can easily rewrite that to work.

1217
00:51:51.960 --> 00:51:56.280
You can say, if you bring those into orbit, look at this sum, look

1218
00:51:56.280 --> 00:51:58.920
at that sum, they'll actually crash into the planet and send the

1219
00:51:58.920 --> 00:51:59.519
eggs off anyway.

1220
00:51:59.579 --> 00:52:02.159
I actually don't care at all about that.

1221
00:52:02.219 --> 00:52:03.059
You know what I mean?

1222
00:52:03.119 --> 00:52:03.780
Like whatever.

1223
00:52:03.840 --> 00:52:06.599
You know, there's a whole heap of magic nonsense.

1224
00:52:06.659 --> 00:52:11.159
But what doesn't work is that you've got Mestor, who is a villain

1225
00:52:11.159 --> 00:52:15.539
who can apparently bring down a whole fleet of ships, which we

1226
00:52:15.539 --> 00:52:16.320
don't see happening.

1227
00:52:16.380 --> 00:52:19.860
There's really no action in those 1st 2 episodes at all, and we

1228
00:52:19.860 --> 00:52:23.099
get this sort of word peril description of what happens to the

1229
00:52:23.099 --> 00:52:25.079
spaceships, but we don't see it.

1230
00:52:25.139 --> 00:52:29.699
And he can mind control everyone and he can do embolisms and all

1231
00:52:29.699 --> 00:52:30.420
of that sort of thing.

1232
00:52:30.480 --> 00:52:32.699
And it's kind of like, well, why?

1233
00:52:32.699 --> 00:52:36.659
He's just a sort of stupid high concept villain, we've kind of no

1234
00:52:36.659 --> 00:52:37.260
rationale.

1235
00:52:37.320 --> 00:52:39.480
Do you know who he's cashing on of?

1236
00:52:39.539 --> 00:52:39.960
don't you?

1237
00:52:40.019 --> 00:52:40.980
You know who they were trying to do?

1238
00:52:41.039 --> 00:52:42.179
Jabber the heart.

1239
00:52:42.239 --> 00:52:44.400
Which is why he lost after Perry.

1240
00:52:44.460 --> 00:52:46.139
Oh, and that's what it was going to be.

1241
00:52:46.199 --> 00:52:50.039
Again, let's watch more men lust after Perry.

1242
00:52:50.099 --> 00:52:53.099
But it's, it's, Miss Doors, like jazz hand.

1243
00:52:53.159 --> 00:52:55.079
It's a jazz...

1244
00:52:55.079 --> 00:52:56.159
Oh, as may I?

1245
00:52:56.219 --> 00:52:58.980
this is happening or whatever, but it's like, Eric, haven't you

1246
00:52:58.980 --> 00:53:02.760
already given this to us with the pterodeptils and didn't, didn't

1247
00:53:02.760 --> 00:53:03.659
earlier this season?

1248
00:53:03.719 --> 00:53:05.820
didn't we have like the gravis and them also having the same

1249
00:53:05.820 --> 00:53:08.219
little pathetic little jazz hands?

1250
00:53:08.280 --> 00:53:11.940
It was nice to see John Barram and even in a mask, in a role, you

1251
00:53:11.940 --> 00:53:13.019
know, only in his early 40s.

1252
00:53:13.079 --> 00:53:14.639
But do you know who it really is?

1253
00:53:14.699 --> 00:53:17.460
It's Captain Hart from the Sea Devils.

1254
00:53:17.579 --> 00:53:19.139
It really is.

1255
00:53:19.199 --> 00:53:21.780
It's Professor... the famous five.

1256
00:53:21.840 --> 00:53:22.860
Edwin Richfield.

1257
00:53:22.920 --> 00:53:23.519
Yes, it is.

1258
00:53:24.360 --> 00:53:25.800
Why?

1259
00:53:25.860 --> 00:53:26.880
I know.

1260
00:53:26.940 --> 00:53:29.219
I was so sorry for him the whole time.

1261
00:53:29.280 --> 00:53:31.139
It's great and sea devil.

1262
00:53:31.199 --> 00:53:34.500
And to top and to top it all off, he's massively claustrophobic.

1263
00:53:34.500 --> 00:53:37.199
And they knew when they cast him what the costume was going to be

1264
00:53:37.199 --> 00:53:37.320
like.

1265
00:53:37.380 --> 00:53:40.019
Because they're that bastardy.

1266
00:53:40.079 --> 00:53:42.360
It's a stupid looking costume as well.

1267
00:53:42.420 --> 00:53:46.679
And then you get scenes of a bunch of gastropods or 2 gastropods

1268
00:53:46.679 --> 00:53:51.239
shuffle along the corridor depositing kind of quickset concrete.

1269
00:53:51.239 --> 00:53:52.320
Farty substances.

1270
00:53:52.380 --> 00:53:53.219
Yeah, yeah.

1271
00:53:53.280 --> 00:53:55.440
And they just look ridiculous.

1272
00:53:55.500 --> 00:53:58.199
I mean, they really are a truly terrible monster.

1273
00:53:58.260 --> 00:54:01.980
He's a threat which has no kind of origin, no particular point to

1274
00:54:01.980 --> 00:54:02.219
it.

1275
00:54:02.280 --> 00:54:04.380
He's like the swarm, isn't he?

1276
00:54:04.440 --> 00:54:08.579
is obsessed with breeding and spreading his DNA all over the place

1277
00:54:08.579 --> 00:54:11.039
like a, you know, horny teenager.

1278
00:54:11.099 --> 00:54:18.539
It's really just a truly, truly undercooked, thin, absurd

1279
00:54:18.539 --> 00:54:19.139
premise.

1280
00:54:19.199 --> 00:54:22.800
And when you compare it to the sophistication of last week's story

1281
00:54:22.800 --> 00:54:27.420
it's just inexplicable that they would give Colin as his 1st story

1282
00:54:27.420 --> 00:54:29.579
a story where he doesn't get to be the doctor.

1283
00:54:29.699 --> 00:54:32.820
You know, he doesn't get to solve the problem.

1284
00:54:32.880 --> 00:54:35.579
He doesn't get a hero moment.

1285
00:54:35.639 --> 00:54:39.179
It really, really, fatally flaws the character.

1286
00:54:39.239 --> 00:54:40.079
It's a big problem.

1287
00:54:40.199 --> 00:54:43.980
It's a big problem because the writers of next season will just

1288
00:54:43.980 --> 00:54:48.239
look at this and go, this is what we base things on. and that will

1289
00:54:48.239 --> 00:54:51.599
influence how they write the Dr. Perry relationship.

1290
00:54:51.659 --> 00:54:53.280
Obviously, it's never as bad as this.

1291
00:54:53.340 --> 00:54:54.000
I don't believe.

1292
00:54:54.059 --> 00:54:57.719
Again, but we'll discuss those pros and cons next season.

1293
00:54:57.840 --> 00:55:03.179
But, you know, gives everybody 9 months to cogitate over this, you

1294
00:55:03.179 --> 00:55:03.360
know?

1295
00:55:03.780 --> 00:55:07.500
I feel like you can choose to stay in that moment where he attacks

1296
00:55:07.500 --> 00:55:10.260
her or you can choose to be in the moment at the end where they're

1297
00:55:10.260 --> 00:55:12.300
smiling at each other and there is hope for the future.

1298
00:55:12.360 --> 00:55:14.400
And that's a moment that I choose to stay in.

1299
00:55:14.460 --> 00:55:16.800
If you choose to be in the 1st, you're never going to find

1300
00:55:16.800 --> 00:55:18.360
anything you like over the next 2 years.

1301
00:55:19.739 --> 00:55:22.800
I find it fascinating in science fiction.

1302
00:55:22.860 --> 00:55:24.599
There is this.

1303
00:55:25.500 --> 00:55:29.460
There is this troop that people have to do at least once per

1304
00:55:29.460 --> 00:55:35.940
series. say trope with characters acting wildly out of character.

1305
00:55:36.000 --> 00:55:37.619
They do, don't they?

1306
00:55:37.679 --> 00:55:43.199
And there's a not a good example, I should say, but there is a

1307
00:55:43.199 --> 00:55:46.800
cogent example, a few years later in the 1st season of Star Trek

1308
00:55:46.800 --> 00:55:47.460
the Next Generation.

1309
00:55:47.519 --> 00:55:49.440
The naked now.

1310
00:55:49.440 --> 00:55:50.280
The naked now.

1311
00:55:50.340 --> 00:55:53.820
Now, it was filmed as the 1st regular episode of the series after

1312
00:55:53.820 --> 00:55:54.599
the pilot film.

1313
00:55:54.960 --> 00:56:01.440
And um, the cast members, I believe it's Lavar Burton, who went on

1314
00:56:01.440 --> 00:56:03.360
to become a prolific director of the series.

1315
00:56:03.420 --> 00:56:08.760
LeVar Burton said, I think the problem with the naked now, wasn't

1316
00:56:08.760 --> 00:56:11.579
that it was using an idea borrowed from the original series.

1317
00:56:11.639 --> 00:56:15.119
It was that they were getting us to act out of character before we

1318
00:56:15.119 --> 00:56:16.800
knew who our characters was.

1319
00:56:16.860 --> 00:56:20.460
I think Russell makes the same mistake with David Tennant in whose

1320
00:56:20.460 --> 00:56:23.460
1st regular episode he gets taken over by Cassandra.

1321
00:56:23.519 --> 00:56:26.639
And, you know, like he's terribly funny, but I do think it's too

1322
00:56:26.639 --> 00:56:30.780
early in his run to see him, again, behaving out of character.

1323
00:56:30.840 --> 00:56:32.219
Something's not quite right.

1324
00:56:32.280 --> 00:56:34.019
I know when you watch that, you kind of...

1325
00:56:34.019 --> 00:56:37.500
I mean, he's funny and we know him now and it's all alright, but

1326
00:56:37.500 --> 00:56:43.199
because imagine in this story, if you had Colin, essentially being

1327
00:56:43.199 --> 00:56:47.460
his more bombastic, but more settled self we come to know later

1328
00:56:47.460 --> 00:56:47.760
on.

1329
00:56:47.820 --> 00:56:50.159
And there were just, but there were just a little flashes of

1330
00:56:50.159 --> 00:56:52.380
darkness that he would kind of shake off.

1331
00:56:52.380 --> 00:56:55.739
And then maybe in 2 or 3 stories, we have the story where he runs

1332
00:56:55.739 --> 00:56:58.559
amok and he's worried about unregenerating.

1333
00:56:58.619 --> 00:57:02.880
You know, rather than do that in his very 1st appearance, seed it

1334
00:57:02.880 --> 00:57:05.940
but then do it later when we've gotten to know him and it means

1335
00:57:05.940 --> 00:57:09.840
something, all it means to us at this point is that...

1336
00:57:10.139 --> 00:57:12.239
We don't know who he is.

1337
00:57:12.300 --> 00:57:16.440
And we didn't know who didn't really know who Davison's doctor was

1338
00:57:16.440 --> 00:57:19.920
at the end of his story, but it was an intriguing mystery because

1339
00:57:19.920 --> 00:57:21.840
we weren't given any contradictory information.

1340
00:57:21.900 --> 00:57:23.099
We were just given little snippets.

1341
00:57:23.159 --> 00:57:26.519
I said at the time, actually, with Pete's 1st story, that he

1342
00:57:26.519 --> 00:57:30.179
likewise doesn't get a proper hero moment, you know, that he's up

1343
00:57:30.179 --> 00:57:33.300
against, you know, the master, but it's not really that great.

1344
00:57:33.360 --> 00:57:36.780
Whereas you compare, you know, Tom's 1st story and he's up against

1345
00:57:36.780 --> 00:57:41.219
a giant robot. you know, that's kind of exciting and I just think

1346
00:57:41.219 --> 00:57:42.360
more thought needed to be given.

1347
00:57:42.960 --> 00:57:45.659
Especially since it's the end of the season.

1348
00:57:45.719 --> 00:57:48.599
I doesn't have a whole year. to sort of win people over.

1349
00:57:48.659 --> 00:57:49.679
Yeah, that's right.

1350
00:57:49.739 --> 00:57:52.199
It's not like we can tune in next week and see that he's settled

1351
00:57:52.199 --> 00:57:52.440
down.

1352
00:57:52.500 --> 00:57:54.659
We've got 9 months to wait now.

1353
00:57:54.719 --> 00:57:59.699
Yeah, I do think probably the star performer in this story who

1354
00:57:59.699 --> 00:58:03.420
comes out looking the best, if you like, is Kevin McNally as

1355
00:58:03.420 --> 00:58:03.960
Hugo.

1356
00:58:04.079 --> 00:58:08.940
I think he has a nice clear character from beginning to end.

1357
00:58:09.000 --> 00:58:12.539
His ending is a bit weird when he decides to stay on the planet

1358
00:58:12.539 --> 00:58:15.119
but we don't have anything that contradicts what he says about not

1359
00:58:15.119 --> 00:58:15.900
having anyone back home.

1360
00:58:15.960 --> 00:58:18.300
I do like the doctor's line about that.

1361
00:58:18.360 --> 00:58:19.980
Yeah, that I can believe.

1362
00:58:20.400 --> 00:58:23.880
Again, again, the way it's delivered, I think is perfect.

1363
00:58:24.000 --> 00:58:26.219
He's got good comic timing, colon, I think.

1364
00:58:26.280 --> 00:58:28.079
Yeah, it's it's not a cruelly delivered line.

1365
00:58:28.139 --> 00:58:29.460
It's like this is what I genuinely think.

1366
00:58:29.519 --> 00:58:32.639
And to be fair, Hugo has been pointing a gun at him the whole

1367
00:58:32.639 --> 00:58:32.880
time.

1368
00:58:32.940 --> 00:58:34.079
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1369
00:58:34.139 --> 00:58:37.019
Well, it's Eric Saywood's inability to write characters that are

1370
00:58:37.019 --> 00:58:37.679
not horrible.

1371
00:58:37.739 --> 00:58:41.159
Yeah, that being said, Hugo maintains his character all the way

1372
00:58:41.159 --> 00:58:41.579
through.

1373
00:58:41.699 --> 00:58:49.559
I think Nicola is the person that holds this story together as

1374
00:58:49.559 --> 00:58:52.559
much as it is held together because she's the one having the human

1375
00:58:52.559 --> 00:58:53.699
reaction to things.

1376
00:58:53.699 --> 00:58:58.800
Her human reaction is generally believable and understandable.

1377
00:58:58.800 --> 00:59:05.159
And even though she is manhandled, pushed from place to place, she

1378
00:59:05.159 --> 00:59:09.239
very rarely loses her sense of agency and there's some great

1379
00:59:09.239 --> 00:59:13.380
moments where she gives back to Colin and that bit where they land

1380
00:59:13.380 --> 00:59:16.619
on Titan 3 and he does this bit about, except this weary

1381
00:59:16.619 --> 00:59:17.699
penitent.

1382
00:59:17.760 --> 00:59:19.860
Don't you just says, I think I'm gonna be sick.

1383
00:59:19.920 --> 00:59:22.980
She rolls her eyes at my moment, one of those features, and I just

1384
00:59:22.980 --> 00:59:24.719
burst out laughing every single time.

1385
00:59:24.780 --> 00:59:27.059
Like, I find humour.

1386
00:59:27.119 --> 00:59:29.820
I've got a very dark sense of humour and some of the stuff like we

1387
00:59:29.820 --> 00:59:31.980
he believes that he's doing the right thing by making her his

1388
00:59:31.980 --> 00:59:33.119
hermit and everything like that.

1389
00:59:33.179 --> 00:59:36.239
And I just burst out laughing because like she's done nothing

1390
00:59:36.239 --> 00:59:36.539
wrong.

1391
00:59:36.539 --> 00:59:39.960
And she's just the butt of all these things and now she's going to

1392
00:59:39.960 --> 00:59:42.840
be this hermit because this will be good for you.

1393
00:59:42.900 --> 00:59:44.940
I just I just laugh my head off.

1394
00:59:45.000 --> 00:59:45.840
I mean, I'm sorry.

1395
00:59:45.900 --> 00:59:47.460
I just...

1396
00:59:47.519 --> 00:59:52.260
And what I love about those moments is she's pointing out the

1397
00:59:52.260 --> 00:59:55.019
logical inconsistencies in what he's doing.

1398
00:59:55.320 --> 00:59:59.099
And again, it's not in a mean way. you haven't checked the

1399
00:59:59.099 --> 00:59:59.820
atmosphere.

1400
00:59:59.880 --> 01:00:00.780
You haven't done this.

1401
01:00:00.840 --> 01:00:01.619
You haven't done.

1402
01:00:01.679 --> 01:00:02.400
Are you insane?

1403
01:00:02.460 --> 01:00:06.420
It's what I really liked the other day, dear listeners, we went to

1404
01:00:06.420 --> 01:00:08.280
see the Return of Dr. Mysterio.

1405
01:00:08.340 --> 01:00:14.940
Matt Lucas. much like Perry in this story. is the one when the

1406
01:00:14.940 --> 01:00:16.679
doctor says something that doesn't quite make sense.

1407
01:00:16.739 --> 01:00:17.760
He'll point out what Well, hold on.

1408
01:00:17.820 --> 01:00:18.780
New York's not a capital city.

1409
01:00:18.840 --> 01:00:20.880
Hold on, you haven't thought about this.

1410
01:00:20.940 --> 01:00:25.079
And my favourite line in the whole special when the doctor does

1411
01:00:25.079 --> 01:00:28.380
the unpredictable, like Colin Baker does here, is Matt Lucas being

1412
01:00:28.380 --> 01:00:31.739
strangled, saying, I know you miss her, but couldn't you just

1413
01:00:31.739 --> 01:00:33.000
write a poem?

1414
01:00:33.360 --> 01:00:35.760
You know, that is brilliant.

1415
01:00:35.820 --> 01:00:36.420
That is brilliant.

1416
01:00:36.539 --> 01:00:41.340
Okay, we should get on to our Jenny Laird awards for most puzzling

1417
01:00:41.340 --> 01:00:44.219
creative choice for this season.

1418
01:00:44.280 --> 01:00:46.980
God, who wants to make a start on this?

1419
01:00:50.039 --> 01:00:51.420
I've got several nominations.

1420
01:00:51.480 --> 01:00:52.260
Yes, go on.

1421
01:00:52.320 --> 01:00:56.699
Could we maybe we could recuse the twin dilemma from this from

1422
01:00:56.699 --> 01:00:58.019
this Jenny Ladd Award.

1423
01:00:58.079 --> 01:00:59.219
It is part of it, though.

1424
01:00:59.280 --> 01:01:00.059
I guess so.

1425
01:01:00.119 --> 01:01:02.519
Yeah, I think we need to, I mean, we've got the coat, but I really

1426
01:01:02.519 --> 01:01:03.960
like the coat, so I'm not going to go with that.

1427
01:01:04.019 --> 01:01:05.519
The strangulation is completely wrong.

1428
01:01:05.579 --> 01:01:06.420
It's certainly up there.

1429
01:01:06.480 --> 01:01:10.380
We've got, like, the Merka is something, but I actually think that

1430
01:01:10.380 --> 01:01:12.119
stupid door that falls on Tegan.

1431
01:01:12.179 --> 01:01:13.800
That's worse than the movie.

1432
01:01:13.860 --> 01:01:16.199
We've got the karate kick, which I love to death.

1433
01:01:16.260 --> 01:01:17.159
It is funny.

1434
01:01:17.219 --> 01:01:17.940
I don't know.

1435
01:01:18.000 --> 01:01:19.980
I think I'm going to go with, if you're going to do a flashback

1436
01:01:19.980 --> 01:01:22.619
sequence, you need to include every single companion in it.

1437
01:01:22.679 --> 01:01:25.679
And the fact that in Resurrection, the Daleks, Leila is not in

1438
01:01:25.679 --> 01:01:26.820
that flashback sequence.

1439
01:01:26.820 --> 01:01:30.719
And you've got a so-called advisor to the producer and the script

1440
01:01:30.719 --> 01:01:31.199
editor.

1441
01:01:31.260 --> 01:01:32.940
It's unforgivable Yep.

1442
01:01:33.360 --> 01:01:38.460
Well, I think it has to be introducing Colin at the end of the

1443
01:01:38.460 --> 01:01:40.559
season when everyone's sick of everything.

1444
01:01:40.619 --> 01:01:44.579
We've rehashed that this episode, but I think it's a disastrous

1445
01:01:44.579 --> 01:01:45.059
decision.

1446
01:01:45.119 --> 01:01:45.719
Yes.

1447
01:01:45.719 --> 01:01:49.199
I'm going to avoid the twin dilemma simply because I sometimes

1448
01:01:49.199 --> 01:01:53.639
like to pick my Jenny Leds based on what the hell was happening.

1449
01:01:53.699 --> 01:01:56.340
Like twin dilemma, we can very easily point out what's wrong with

1450
01:01:56.340 --> 01:01:57.119
it.

1451
01:01:57.239 --> 01:02:01.199
But I do not understand how an actor of Tom Adams calibre can give

1452
01:02:01.199 --> 01:02:02.880
that performance in Warriors of the Deep.

1453
01:02:02.940 --> 01:02:03.719
So it's Tom Adams.

1454
01:02:03.780 --> 01:02:05.699
Golly golly gosh.

1455
01:02:05.760 --> 01:02:07.980
I need to actually remember that there was another doctor before

1456
01:02:07.980 --> 01:02:12.960
Colin Bacon. so much time looking at this thing on the end of

1457
01:02:12.960 --> 01:02:13.260
the.

1458
01:02:13.500 --> 01:02:15.000
Yeah.

1459
01:02:15.059 --> 01:02:19.079
I mean, if it was a sheep, you'd go and have a put down rather

1460
01:02:19.079 --> 01:02:20.219
than just shave it off.

1461
01:02:20.280 --> 01:02:24.059
Um, what have we seen this season?

1462
01:02:24.119 --> 01:02:26.280
Sorry, I really need to go...

1463
01:02:26.340 --> 01:02:27.239
The awakening.

1464
01:02:27.239 --> 01:02:28.079
Frontie arse.

1465
01:02:28.139 --> 01:02:29.159
Um...

1466
01:02:29.159 --> 01:02:31.139
Resurrection to Darks, you'd love that.

1467
01:02:31.199 --> 01:02:32.159
Yeah, thank you, Todd.

1468
01:02:32.219 --> 01:02:34.619
Resurrection of the Dikes, my puzzling creative choice would

1469
01:02:34.619 --> 01:02:36.239
simply be Eric's same.

1470
01:02:36.719 --> 01:02:40.980
Beautiful direction and lovely lighting and actually very good

1471
01:02:40.980 --> 01:02:44.340
casting, but yeah, my posting creative choice is what was what was

1472
01:02:44.340 --> 01:02:45.659
Eric thinking, really?

1473
01:02:45.719 --> 01:02:47.460
Guns are great.

1474
01:02:47.519 --> 01:02:49.679
I can't think of anything more fresh to say.

1475
01:02:49.739 --> 01:02:52.559
There was so much that should have almost worked and there was so

1476
01:02:52.559 --> 01:02:58.199
much that almost worked and is, in fact, rescued by the collective

1477
01:02:58.199 --> 01:03:00.719
goodwill of everyone involved.

1478
01:03:00.780 --> 01:03:03.719
And then by the end of the season, it's not just one

1479
01:03:03.719 --> 01:03:04.500
circumstance.

1480
01:03:04.559 --> 01:03:10.800
It's the Christmas tree toppling over because everything that was

1481
01:03:10.800 --> 01:03:12.000
you know, surrounded by goodwill.

1482
01:03:12.059 --> 01:03:13.980
It's Trumpian in its scale.

1483
01:03:14.039 --> 01:03:16.440
It's all kind of, it's like, sorry, that Goodwill is just gone.

1484
01:03:16.500 --> 01:03:17.519
This is what happened.

1485
01:03:17.579 --> 01:03:19.920
I think I said during season 20.

1486
01:03:20.159 --> 01:03:24.239
It's kind of like you can fly by the seat of your pants for one

1487
01:03:24.239 --> 01:03:25.079
story a season.

1488
01:03:25.139 --> 01:03:25.739
Yep.

1489
01:03:25.739 --> 01:03:29.820
But to do it all the time, you're gonna end up with the Christmas

1490
01:03:29.820 --> 01:03:30.780
tree falling over, yeah.

1491
01:03:30.840 --> 01:03:31.559
Yeah, I like that.

1492
01:03:31.920 --> 01:03:34.800
Picks of the week, picks of the season.

1493
01:03:36.420 --> 01:03:40.440
I'm going to jump in with, as we have alluded to before.

1494
01:03:40.559 --> 01:03:46.679
Big Finish have inserted a, um, a great range of audio dramas

1495
01:03:46.679 --> 01:03:49.199
with...

1496
01:03:49.199 --> 01:03:50.699
Intercom Baker's career.

1497
01:03:50.760 --> 01:03:53.519
But before we get there, into Peter Davidson's era.

1498
01:03:53.579 --> 01:03:58.860
So there are 3 audios with the 5th doctor in Turlough between

1499
01:03:58.860 --> 01:04:01.079
Resurrection of Daleks and Planet of Fire.

1500
01:04:01.139 --> 01:04:05.579
There are so few because of Mark Strickson's limited

1501
01:04:05.579 --> 01:04:06.179
availability.

1502
01:04:06.239 --> 01:04:08.519
He's a producer of wildlife documentaries now.

1503
01:04:08.579 --> 01:04:14.219
But I'm going to choose an audio from the range with Nicola Bryant

1504
01:04:14.219 --> 01:04:17.099
and Peter Davidson are given an extended series of adventures

1505
01:04:17.099 --> 01:04:19.619
between Planet of Fire and CaveSpan resigning.

1506
01:04:19.679 --> 01:04:23.099
They work beautifully together with his sort of English

1507
01:04:23.099 --> 01:04:25.619
sensibility and politeness and her bluntness.

1508
01:04:25.980 --> 01:04:30.599
They're also given another companion who is a forgotten pharaoh

1509
01:04:30.659 --> 01:04:32.280
played by Carolyn Morris.

1510
01:04:32.340 --> 01:04:33.239
That's Eramem.

1511
01:04:33.300 --> 01:04:36.420
And I'm actually going to choose, I believe this is available for

1512
01:04:36.420 --> 01:04:37.500
free from Big Finish.

1513
01:04:37.559 --> 01:04:40.260
There's a two-part story called The Veiled Leopard.

1514
01:04:40.320 --> 01:04:41.519
There is indeed.

1515
01:04:41.519 --> 01:04:45.960
In which Perry and Eramm are sent by the doctor to prevent the

1516
01:04:45.960 --> 01:04:50.159
theft of a diamond from a society party.

1517
01:04:50.219 --> 01:04:51.659
So Peter Davidson's not actually in it.

1518
01:04:51.780 --> 01:04:56.219
But little do they know that the thieves of the diamond are

1519
01:04:56.219 --> 01:04:58.679
companions of the 7th doctor, Ace and Hex.

1520
01:04:58.739 --> 01:05:00.719
So it's a two-part story.

1521
01:05:00.780 --> 01:05:03.719
The 1st part is told from Perry and RMM's perspective and the 2nd

1522
01:05:03.719 --> 01:05:05.760
part is told from Ace and Hex's perspective.

1523
01:05:05.820 --> 01:05:09.000
It is a lovely, lovely little two-parter.

1524
01:05:09.059 --> 01:05:12.000
And yeah, we will find a link for it.

1525
01:05:12.059 --> 01:05:14.699
It was free on the cover of Doctor magazine, and all those free

1526
01:05:14.699 --> 01:05:16.860
audios have now been released for free by Big Finish.

1527
01:05:16.920 --> 01:05:20.400
Just in case anyone else is going to recommend any other titles

1528
01:05:20.460 --> 01:05:21.300
from that range.

1529
01:05:21.360 --> 01:05:23.820
I won't mention them, but yeah, the Vale leopard.

1530
01:05:24.420 --> 01:05:28.679
I'm going to give a very self-serving recommendation. something

1531
01:05:28.679 --> 01:05:32.340
that you alluded to, Brendan, in your closing remarks in a recent

1532
01:05:32.340 --> 01:05:32.820
episode.

1533
01:05:32.880 --> 01:05:37.800
And that is, I've spent a little while rewriting the randomiser

1534
01:05:37.800 --> 01:05:42.960
which is a website at the randomiser.net, which I launched, I

1535
01:05:42.960 --> 01:05:47.460
think, in 2014, uh, and it lets you choose a Doctor Who story at

1536
01:05:47.460 --> 01:05:51.119
random, so that you just don't always cycle around your usual

1537
01:05:51.119 --> 01:05:54.000
favourites, and uh, you maybe take yourself out of your comfort

1538
01:05:54.000 --> 01:05:54.480
zone.

1539
01:05:54.539 --> 01:05:57.239
But if you're not keen to be taken out of your comfort zone, you

1540
01:05:57.239 --> 01:06:01.019
can always just pick particular doctors or stories of a certain

1541
01:06:01.019 --> 01:06:04.500
length or stories that don't have missing episodes, and you can

1542
01:06:04.500 --> 01:06:09.300
also set it to record its history, and to not go back and offer

1543
01:06:09.300 --> 01:06:10.860
you a story that you've seen before.

1544
01:06:10.920 --> 01:06:14.820
It's been improved and re-architected and deployed.

1545
01:06:14.880 --> 01:06:19.440
And I'd love you all at home, dear listener, to um, go and have a

1546
01:06:19.440 --> 01:06:21.239
look at it and um, let me know what you think.

1547
01:06:21.300 --> 01:06:22.199
It's lovely.

1548
01:06:22.260 --> 01:06:24.360
It won't clean your teeth but it will tuck you in.

1549
01:06:24.420 --> 01:06:25.860
Yes.

1550
01:06:25.920 --> 01:06:26.940
Nice like that.

1551
01:06:27.719 --> 01:06:30.360
I haven't been around a lot for this season.

1552
01:06:30.420 --> 01:06:32.699
It's only been the last couple of podcasts.

1553
01:06:32.760 --> 01:06:35.639
I haven't really thought about this Warriors of the Deep is one of

1554
01:06:35.639 --> 01:06:38.400
my underrated stories, and I quite like it.

1555
01:06:38.460 --> 01:06:40.920
So I'm going to recommend a prequel.

1556
01:06:40.980 --> 01:06:41.699
To that.

1557
01:06:41.760 --> 01:06:43.559
It's called the Doctor Who in the Sunurians.

1558
01:06:44.280 --> 01:06:46.920
And I'm going to recommend a sequel.

1559
01:06:47.159 --> 01:06:49.199
It's an audio.

1560
01:06:49.260 --> 01:06:51.420
Big finish audio with Colin Baker, maybe stadium.

1561
01:06:52.019 --> 01:06:54.059
And a baby merka.

1562
01:06:54.119 --> 01:06:54.900
It's fantastic.

1563
01:06:54.960 --> 01:06:55.980
It's called blood time.

1564
01:06:56.039 --> 01:06:58.440
I love blood tide. was going to be one of mine.

1565
01:06:58.500 --> 01:06:59.699
Fantastic.

1566
01:06:59.760 --> 01:07:01.139
I've got a copy of it here, yeah.

1567
01:07:01.199 --> 01:07:03.239
Friend of the podcast, Dan Hogarth.

1568
01:07:03.300 --> 01:07:03.780
It does.

1569
01:07:03.840 --> 01:07:07.320
Who gets a rather wonderful line that he uses at Doctor Who

1570
01:07:07.320 --> 01:07:08.760
conventions to get free champagne.

1571
01:07:08.820 --> 01:07:11.699
Just give me a shampoo.

1572
01:07:11.699 --> 01:07:18.360
I was just like, I was a silo reading, but I'm tired.

1573
01:07:18.360 --> 01:07:20.820
Now bring me a bottle of champagne before I have you busted down

1574
01:07:20.820 --> 01:07:21.960
to excrement shovel up.

1575
01:07:22.019 --> 01:07:22.440
That's right.

1576
01:07:22.440 --> 01:07:25.980
He was he was the dawn French all the time in that skirt. going on

1577
01:07:25.980 --> 01:07:26.579
his tea break.

1578
01:07:27.059 --> 01:07:29.880
We're talking Pete, aren't we?

1579
01:07:29.940 --> 01:07:32.340
Because we're doing...

1580
01:07:32.340 --> 01:07:33.599
But something relate.

1581
01:07:33.659 --> 01:07:36.659
I'm not a fan of them. missing adventure novels, any of them.

1582
01:07:36.719 --> 01:07:37.980
Goth opera disappointed me.

1583
01:07:38.039 --> 01:07:38.760
Sorry, Mr. Coon.

1584
01:07:38.820 --> 01:07:41.280
Cornell, when it 1st came out, and I'm not really a fan.

1585
01:07:41.340 --> 01:07:42.179
Cold fusion, though.

1586
01:07:42.239 --> 01:07:42.840
I really like.

1587
01:07:42.960 --> 01:07:44.460
So that's probably my pick.

1588
01:07:44.579 --> 01:07:47.820
That's come out finally as an audio.

1589
01:07:47.880 --> 01:07:50.760
It's a really good missing adventure novel with Pete Anderson

1590
01:07:50.760 --> 01:07:51.780
surprises.

1591
01:07:51.840 --> 01:07:52.920
Todd's nodding as well.

1592
01:07:52.980 --> 01:07:54.300
I'm not going to give any of it away.

1593
01:07:54.360 --> 01:07:56.639
But, um, big finish have just brought it out.

1594
01:07:56.699 --> 01:07:58.199
It's really terrific.

1595
01:07:58.260 --> 01:08:00.000
I really enjoy that one.

1596
01:08:00.059 --> 01:08:01.500
And I love Pete in the audios.

1597
01:08:01.559 --> 01:08:05.639
I love him with, I love Red Dawn and Church and the Crown, which

1598
01:08:05.639 --> 01:08:09.420
are the, I think, the 1st 2 with, but there's another RMM one in

1599
01:08:09.420 --> 01:08:10.800
between them, I think, but...

1600
01:08:10.800 --> 01:08:12.780
I, the Scorpions, the 1st one.

1601
01:08:12.840 --> 01:08:14.159
I have the Scorpions, the 1st one.

1602
01:08:14.219 --> 01:08:14.760
It's so good.

1603
01:08:14.820 --> 01:08:15.659
Those 3 actually.

1604
01:08:15.719 --> 01:08:17.760
Red Dawn Eye, the Scorpion and Church in the Crown.

1605
01:08:17.819 --> 01:08:19.439
I've got them here if anyone wants to come over and listen to

1606
01:08:19.439 --> 01:08:19.680
them.

1607
01:08:19.739 --> 01:08:21.119
You're more than welcome.

1608
01:08:21.180 --> 01:08:22.680
Yeah, that's what I'll be doing this afternoon.

1609
01:08:22.739 --> 01:08:23.819
No, they're really, really lovely.

1610
01:08:23.880 --> 01:08:26.039
I got a bit mucky after that.

1611
01:08:26.100 --> 01:08:28.380
They made a few mistakes in timing and everything else.

1612
01:08:28.439 --> 01:08:31.140
I think there's only one really poor one.

1613
01:08:31.199 --> 01:08:33.779
But...

1614
01:08:33.779 --> 01:08:34.619
Whatever it's called.

1615
01:08:34.680 --> 01:08:35.640
Yeah, necroment, yeah.

1616
01:08:35.699 --> 01:08:36.239
Yeah, awful.

1617
01:08:36.300 --> 01:08:38.819
But I once recorded a 10 minute rant about how long.

1618
01:08:38.880 --> 01:08:39.239
Did you good?

1619
01:08:39.300 --> 01:08:39.840
It's very nice.

1620
01:08:39.899 --> 01:08:40.500
It's dark.

1621
01:08:40.619 --> 01:08:41.579
Well, it's too dark.

1622
01:08:41.640 --> 01:08:44.399
But yeah, yeah, but those 1st 3 are just lovely, just charming.

1623
01:09:00.779 --> 01:09:03.479
We're leaving behind Season 21.

1624
01:09:03.659 --> 01:09:08.760
We're heading into the uncertain future, where slightly mixing up

1625
01:09:08.760 --> 01:09:12.180
the format of flight through entirety for the next few seasons.

1626
01:09:12.300 --> 01:09:15.659
So Todd will join us for the whole of the Column Baker era, with

1627
01:09:15.659 --> 01:09:20.579
Richard occasionally popping in for guest appearances, for then

1628
01:09:20.579 --> 01:09:23.699
the Soulvest McCoy era, Richard will join us for all of that, and

1629
01:09:23.699 --> 01:09:26.880
Todd will pop in for the occasional guest appearance rather than

1630
01:09:26.880 --> 01:09:27.659
loves that era.

1631
01:09:27.720 --> 01:09:28.260
Yes.

1632
01:09:28.260 --> 01:09:28.619
Yes.

1633
01:09:28.680 --> 01:09:31.380
We're going to make him do a commentary on Delta and the

1634
01:09:31.380 --> 01:09:31.979
Bannerman.

1635
01:09:35.460 --> 01:09:37.920
You're going to put it on, aren't you?

1636
01:09:37.920 --> 01:09:38.819
when we do these.

1637
01:09:39.420 --> 01:09:41.100
No, no.

1638
01:09:41.100 --> 01:09:46.619
I've actually watched you enjoying Delta and the Man of Man Todd.

1639
01:09:46.680 --> 01:09:48.420
But we're getting ahead of ourselves.

1640
01:09:48.479 --> 01:09:51.720
Do stay tuned to flight through entirety.sexy, flight through

1641
01:09:51.720 --> 01:09:56.460
entirety on Facebook and iTunes and FTE podcast on Twitter over on

1642
01:09:56.460 --> 01:09:57.600
Bondfinger.com.

1643
01:09:57.659 --> 01:10:01.020
We recently finished the Roger Moore era of James Bond films with

1644
01:10:01.020 --> 01:10:01.739
a view to a kill.

1645
01:10:01.800 --> 01:10:05.520
We also have all preceding official bond films as well as casino

1646
01:10:05.520 --> 01:10:08.819
rail 1967 and never say never again.

1647
01:10:08.880 --> 01:10:11.159
Next month we'll be starting on my personal favourite bond.

1648
01:10:11.220 --> 01:10:13.140
Timothy Wrestleon Dalton.

1649
01:10:13.199 --> 01:10:14.939
What a coincidence.

1650
01:10:15.060 --> 01:10:16.020
That was his middle name.

1651
01:10:16.560 --> 01:10:20.760
That's on Bondfinger.com, Bondfinger on Facebook and iTunes and

1652
01:10:20.760 --> 01:10:22.500
Bondfinger cast on Twitter.

1653
01:10:22.560 --> 01:10:26.039
Until next time, may none of the bubbles in your champagne end up

1654
01:10:26.039 --> 01:10:26.880
in your bloodstream.

1655
01:10:26.939 --> 01:10:28.319
Thank you very much for listening and good night.

1656
01:10:28.380 --> 01:10:29.159
Good night.

1657
01:10:35.220 --> 01:10:36.960
And I'll see you soon.

1658
01:10:37.020 --> 01:10:39.479
Whether you like it or not.

1659
01:10:45.539 --> 01:10:49.140
That was Flightthrough Entirety with Todd Bealby, Nathan Bottomley

1660
01:10:49.140 --> 01:10:51.659
Brendan Jones, Richard Stone and his Kenneth Williams Doll.

1661
01:10:51.720 --> 01:10:53.399
Theme arrangement by Cameron Lamb.

1662
01:10:53.460 --> 01:10:57.300
This episode, Y, was recorded on the 28th of December 2016.

1663
01:10:57.539 --> 01:11:00.539
The next episode will be released on January 29th.

1664
01:11:00.600 --> 01:11:03.720
It's a shame to see Dennis Chinnery in such a thankless role.

1665
01:11:03.779 --> 01:11:06.659
One might almost say his genesis has been abused.

1666
01:11:12.779 --> 01:11:16.680
And it's what I really liked about Matt Smith's character, because

1667
01:11:16.680 --> 01:11:18.300
in the new series...

1668
01:11:18.300 --> 01:11:19.920
I really liked Matt Smith in that as well.

1669
01:11:19.979 --> 01:11:21.000
Yeah, he was great.

1670
01:11:21.060 --> 01:11:26.699
In the new series, most Doctor Who companions have been, oh, Doctor

1671
01:11:26.699 --> 01:11:29.399
you're so wonderful, and you're so clever, and you're so... one of

1672
01:11:29.399 --> 01:11:29.880
ma...

1673
01:11:29.880 --> 01:11:31.380
No, no, let him go.

1674
01:11:32.159 --> 01:11:36.960
I said Matt Smith instead of Matt Lucas didn't...

1675
01:11:37.020 --> 01:11:37.859
You know why, though?

1676
01:11:37.920 --> 01:11:40.020
Because, no, because...

1677
01:11:40.020 --> 01:11:41.399
Matt Smith is really good.

1678
01:11:41.460 --> 01:11:43.859
Yes, it's the same person in the rubber.

1679
01:11:43.920 --> 01:11:44.819
Sorry, can I ask this?

1680
01:11:44.880 --> 01:11:47.939
I We've gone one hour and 6 minutes.

1681
01:11:48.000 --> 01:11:48.600
Okay.

1682
01:11:49.979 --> 01:11:51.359
Okay.

1683
01:11:51.420 --> 01:11:52.619
I'll wrap.

1684
01:11:52.619 --> 01:11:55.619
But you know, they would listen to this if we went 13 hours.

1685
01:11:55.739 --> 01:11:57.899
I'll wait until you're back from the...

1686
01:11:57.960 --> 01:11:58.800
I don't think you should change that.

1687
01:11:58.859 --> 01:12:01.079
No, I think we'll leave it in, but I'll just correct myself.

1688
01:12:01.199 --> 01:12:02.220
I think that's really sweet.

1689
01:12:02.279 --> 01:12:05.039
And we should say, you know, that Matt Smith, Matt Smith

1690
01:12:05.039 --> 01:12:07.500
telescopes beautifully into a Gibbs suit.

1691
01:12:09.119 --> 01:12:14.220
I did the doctor's written, Max Smith would do this much, it's

1692
01:12:14.220 --> 01:12:16.380
much better for a younger doctor. like this whole thing.

1693
01:12:16.439 --> 01:12:18.779
Like this is a Met Smith energy that Peter Capelli.

1694
01:12:18.840 --> 01:12:20.039
That's where I thought you were coming from too.

1695
01:12:20.100 --> 01:12:20.520
Yeah, yeah.

1696
01:12:20.579 --> 01:12:23.100
Well, in terms of colon, and we probably won't use this because

1697
01:12:23.100 --> 01:12:23.699
Nathan's in there.

1698
01:12:23.760 --> 01:12:24.840
Oh, I don't know.

1699
01:12:24.840 --> 01:12:28.680
I think the costume ages him about 10 years because he looks young

1700
01:12:28.680 --> 01:12:33.479
and vital in Peter's costume, and inside his patchwork costume

1701
01:12:33.479 --> 01:12:34.800
it's weird.

1702
01:12:34.859 --> 01:12:39.060
It kind, it reduces his size and his physical presence.

1703
01:12:39.119 --> 01:12:40.739
I think because the costume takes over.

1704
01:12:40.800 --> 01:12:42.600
You can no longer see that he's there.

1705
01:12:42.659 --> 01:12:44.699
It also lampoons his performance.

1706
01:12:44.760 --> 01:12:50.579
Every extremity, every, every, every high note he hits is taken by

1707
01:12:50.579 --> 01:12:50.939
the coat.

1708
01:12:51.000 --> 01:12:51.779
Yeah.

1709
01:12:51.840 --> 01:12:55.199
Okay, that how can you compete with your own costume?

1710
01:12:55.319 --> 01:12:57.359
Whereas put him in a sensible costume.

1711
01:12:57.420 --> 01:12:59.939
And his mood swings suddenly become far more effective because you

1712
01:12:59.939 --> 01:13:00.659
don't expect them to happen.

1713
01:13:00.720 --> 01:13:01.859
Okay.

1714
01:13:01.920 --> 01:13:03.600
I'll resume what I was saying about that.

1715
01:13:03.659 --> 01:13:04.680
You could tie it tag, though.

1716
01:13:04.739 --> 01:13:07.380
Okay, so get my weeber.

1717
01:13:07.439 --> 01:13:09.000
Okay, very definitely.

1718
01:13:09.060 --> 01:13:09.600
Right.

1719
01:13:10.619 --> 01:13:13.199
So, as I meant to say,