Timothy Dalton’s Pyjamas

Hello, dear listeners, and welcome back to Flight Through Entirety the only Doctor Who podcast with a ponchant for television made in the style of early quasar 5 with a touch of Rigour and the merest hint of Second Dynasty Simeon Empire. I'm Brendan. I'm Nathan. I'm a well oiled cog and a Flakati throw for this episode, so you'll be hearing nothing through me. And we've returned to the Planet of the Time, Lords, for the Graham Williams season finale, the invasion of time. So this is my responsibility, this one. And something I have wanted to save the last few weeks is, quite unconsciously, we've actually been building towards this season finale, in a way, Doctor Who really hasn't built towards a season finale since the Damons. In more than half the stories this season, we've found out a little bit more about Time Lord Society. So, an image of the Fendal, we find out they can destroy and time loop a whole planet. In the Sunmakers, of course, we find out that other races are aware of them but don't consider them financially viable. In underworld, of course, we get their policy of non-interference which is a bit weird, considering, in the war games, they time Looper Planet, in image of the Fendal, they time Looper Planet, in terror of the autons, they send a man in a bowler hat to tell the doctor that the master's going to show up. And in Genesis of Daleks, they kick off the whole time war, but they don't interfere. They don't interfere. But I don't actually see a big problem with that because when you look at this story, they're a bunch of bloody hypocrites anyway and it's wonderful. Can I just say, I hate the time loss. I think Gallifrey as well. And I think the whole show goes to hell the moment that it's revealed. A, that the doctor's a time, Lord, and then B, that he comes from the planet Gallifrey and the constellation. No offence to Gary Russell and his and the beautiful big finish series, Gala, which is my pick of the week, as it turns out. Oh, no, there is. And like last year, right, we went to Gallifrey. And it was, it was a huge event. We'd lost Sarah. The whole show's changing its focus. You know, we're heading away from the time lords. We've got the master and he's sort of reimagined as this sort of gothic returning Hinchcliffian villain and all of that. And it was a big event. A big world shanky event. Here we just sort of come back for a bit of running around while we get chased by some tin foil. You know what I mean? And then, you know, every subsequent galafray story will be just appallingly terrible without exception. And just think it's a bad idea. I was so glad when Russell blew it up. Oh, I'm not going to go to the pick of the week yet, but we've seen with Gary and his terrific team that the story is set on Gallifrey, the big finish I think have done for 6 series now, are really interesting and, you know, you get to that cod Shakespeare level of intrigue. It works so well, a closed environment with a lot of complex characters at loggerheads with each other is what Doctor Who does best. So it's a sort of eye, Claudius, political. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And it should be doing that. And the reason in the future, well, not to preempt too much, but there are other reasons that those stories in the future won't be working and I don't think it's necessarily the base concept. What this is not, however, to say that this is not a workable or a functional story, I think, is not necessarily true. I love the time lords in this. I don't think it's not a functional story, but I do... I want a Barousa t-shirt. I want an Arnott, John Arnott t-shirt. You know, Angus McKay was always my barusa. Why are they always just that little bit camp? Yeah, actually, I want a t-shirt. Not a t-shirt. I just want to walk around at work and when people ask me for my advice, I just want to say things like, there is nothing more useless than a lock with a voice imprint. They can't slap you, you've got your personal force field. Haddling medallion on and the batteries are still fine. Yeah. You know, Nathan, when you're talking about Gallifrey being a place for political intrigue, I think of the Gallifrey stories in the classic series, this is the one that gets the right level of political intrigue to lightness of touch. Because when we discussed Deadly Assassin, something we said was you know, it was too nasty. it was too mean. Whereas this, Kelna, Barusa, Andred, they all have a sense of humour, even Chief Surgeon Goma, who doesn't get much lines. They've all got a bit of a sense of humour, but it doesn't mean we laugh at the characters. Their sources of comedy rub, the figures of comedy. And I think that's one of the areas where this story succeeds. We don't need the time lords to be the sources of comedy because we have Derek Deadman. Well, really unfortunate choice for an actor's name to, you know if he was going to change his name to something, Probably not dead. Let's not get ahead of ourselves, however. Going to someone else in this, is there? Going back to the beginning, some people out there may not know this, this was not originally the story for this. Not at all. Anthony Reid had worked with a writer on, I think, The Persuaders called Philip Weir. And so, knew that we could write, well, that he could write interesting stuff. The production team had already been up against it with Underworld. So they thought, no, we need someone who's reliable. We've got a very short lead in for this. And they devised this idea. The central starting idea was, what if not everyone on Gallifree's time are time wards? Yes. You know, because we've got one dominant species on Earth. It doesn't mean that everywhere else in the galaxy you've got only one dominant species. So the idea was that there was going to be a race of cat people living on Galaxy. Presaging the internet. That's right And so the story was provisionally entitled Killers in the Dark, or Killers of the Dark. In the 1980s, Graham Williams couldn't remember what it was called and jokingly referred to it as the killers of Jinseng, which people actually took seriously. It was at a convention. Yeah, and Anthony Reid and David Weir sat down and wrote a storyline, and David Weir went away to writing scripts, and he only had 4 weeks to write 6 scripts, which even for Doctor Who was considered a type turnaround. Optimistic, yes. Now, the 1st 5 scripts arrived exactly on the due date. And for Doctor Who, that was unusual. That's the reason that such a short date was set because they said to him, look, we know you're probably going to take another two. 2 weeks. It's fine. Don't worry about it, but this is the date we put on the paperwork. So the 1st 5 scripts comes in, Anthony Reid goes, oh, this is great. You know, we've already got the director working on it. We've already got our costume designer designing cat people, and those design documents exist, and you can see them on the DVD. I started reading the scripts and realised that the narrative was completely incomprehensible and also David Weir had severely overestimated the Doctor Who budget in that one episode Cliffhanger involved the Doctor and Leila in gladiatorial combat in the middle of something the size of Wembley Stadium filled with cat people. Yeah. So... Or just cats. Yeah. So the situation they were in was this. They had an unworkable script for the season finale. A scene shifters strike meant that half their studio time was given over to the yearly Christmas specials. They were offered to truncate the series and to be able to carry the money over. So when they were offered to truncate underworld, they were told you won't get the money, they were actually told, you can carry the money over till next year. Now, Graham Williams didn't trust that because he knew what the BBC was. And precedents would have been, yes, you'd have just lost that budget next year round. Yeah, and it would have been, well, you know, if you can only make 20 episodes at a time. We'll only give you 20 episodes next year. We'll never see that happening in the future, will we? No. Not only that, but they also had a director who'd already started working on it. They were reliant on it being on Gallifray and reusing sets and pieces from the Deadly Assassin. So were they on in storage? They make the design so great? Because they looked remarkably close to... The walls were the same flat. in storage. thought the flats were yeah. Pretty much the area that's reused is like where the TARDIS lands and the coronation area, that was the president's area, where the president comes down and gets shot from deadly assassin. Yeah, so that just looks more slightly more spacious. Yeah, it does because the Deadly Assassin had that really dark Gothic thing. Like, it didn't matter... It didn't manage to be stone or anything. It was still sort of tacky plastic. Well, you know, it's meant to look like it's made of glass. The whole of Galifre, the Capitol is meant to be carved in and cast in glass, which is why you've got those shiny green disco edges on everything. But until you know that, it just looks like Lulu set from top of the pot. I like it in Deadly Assassin. Yeah, it's it's amazing that in all the galafray stories we get in the classic series, isn't it? half dozen or less, that we never see the capital from the outside. Well, we just can't afford it, can we? Well, they made the city of Mechanus with matchsticks and wax. That looked great. Yeah, exactly. A model would have been very nice, thank you. And finally, they had very little budget for new costume. because half the costume designers' time was already taken up designing killer cats, which they then realised they couldn't afford to make. So... Anthony Reid went home and wrote... and wrote the script, and instead of sending it in episode by episode, he sent it in, scene by scene, to Gerald Blake, the director. And so Gerald Blake would read through them while Gerald Blake was reading through them, Graham Williams was rewriting them and script editing them. So Graham Williams took over a script editor. Graham Williams then went home one Monday night and stayed up 3 days straight until Friday morning giving the final script rewrite. So that is the situation we head into with this story. You know, I think this might be the worst season of the 1970s, but it is a miracle that it got made at all under these circumstances. And there are great moments in this season, aren't there? Absolutely. And you know what? I think this is very comfortably the 2nd or 3rd best of this season. It's actually a terrific story, Doctor Who story. Because of John Arnott and Tom Baker, and bloke who plays Guy Crayford. Oh, Milton John. I just want to call him a guy from everything. Gee, it's got lovely casting. Six parters never really worked. Not since Keys of Mariners, which is cracking. Fantastic. And I think I think this has a good chance of working in some degrees because it does the thing that keys of mariners does. It's 3 stories. Yeah, absolutely. That 1st two-parter does something that we have never, ever seen before. Tom Baker behaving himself on acting? No, Tom Baker acting, yeah. No, it is that thing where the very 1st scene, isn't it? is the doctor, the doctor being furtive and but he's already met the aliens. He's already never phoned out now. So it plunges right in medias rays in a way that we've never, ever seen. par for the course for the new series, isn't it? You know, but it's never happened in the classic series before. We're all standing around the Tartars faffing around and talking about, you know, like our last adventure or whatever and then we turn up or or, you know, we get to meet some other characters and stuff and then the Tartars arise. We've never had this thing where we arrive in the middle of something where the doctor's already met the aliens. He's made some deal with them. We don't know what it is. You know, Leila is being suspicious and we're suspicious of him as well. And it's not resolved until, like, episode three. I mean, essentially, the first two episodes are what the hell is the doctor doing? Then you get 2 episodes of sort of running around, away from the Vardens, and then you've got another 2 episodes of running away from this on tarns. And they're not that successful, but at least the show goes somewhere. Yeah, I think that Graham Williams and Anthony Reed here are co writing together under the BBC approved pseudonym of David Agnew which was a sort of BBC general pseudonym for, if a writer wants to take their name off a script or a writer can't be credited because, let's say, they're the script editor and producer. I think they've been very clever in that, in order to get the plot moving along. They are constantly changing it. But at the same time, they rely on two very specific cliffhanger devices. The cliffhanger endings for episodes one, three, and five are all the doctor being threatened, ending for episode one is the doctor being attacked by the crown, which, according to the script, is meant to imply that the Vardens are accessing the Matrix and have possibly discovered, but they couldn't convey that without spoiling episode 3 where he explains what's going on. The end of episode 3 is Andred about to shoot the doctor. And the end of episode 5 is Kelner attacking the TARDIS. The end of episode 2 is the reveal of the Vardens. The end of episode 4 is the reveal of the Santarans, and the end of episode 6 is the reveal of canine Mark 2. Yeah, it's... It's terrible tombstone teeth. No, this story comes in for some flack, particularly, not even the Sonic screwdriver will get me out of this one. Oh, break that 4th wall straight to camera. And it's 2 story. Yeah, so do I. So do I. And it's 2 stories running where he breaks the 4th wall, because of course, in Underworld. where it all went. Wonder the blurs can be sucked. of his future career. 4 points to Gerald Blake, the director of this. He did Abominable Snowman, which I really love as an audio. And yeah, also the, I think it's the Abbot from the Abominable Snowman is back, who was also Hogg in an unearthly child. His name is Charles Morgan. Gold. Gold. Gold. No, he... He's the Abbott in... In the outrageous hat. Oh, the Abbot, not Padma Sam. Not Pamba Samba. He's the abbot. I had an opportunity to say Padmis Abba. You're very happy so long. And of course, he was Hog way back in an unearthly child. He was hers mother. Sorry, he was her's father, I should say. Quite liked her. couldn't stand here. Yeah, and he's, you know, he's quite good. And we get that intrigue in episode two, you know. And he's got that wonderful fruity voice. He is part of the Matrix. It cannot reject him. There's no one in this I don't like. I've actually warmed to Andrew now. I find him charming and I can see. I thank you, Louise Jamison. Thank you, Chris, for getting those beats that they all just could do in rehearsal so rushed, and sadly, there was no script time, but just trying to build a relationship between these two. Yeah. I think Leela leaves. I'm sorry to jump in because, you know, this is what we do timeywami. Leila leaves on an excuse. She fancies this boy, the character writing for this has received a lot of flack, not least from Louise Jamieson herself. But it makes perfect sense to me. To me, Leila's really no older than 1819. I don't know how the character's age, but she's a young person in the 17. This is her first crush. And you think about how that was for you. This is the entire world when you first fall for someone. Yeah, and also, Tom has been a complete arse. And I didn't say the doctor. Tom has been awful. She really is perfunctory with her to the point of then open dismissal and denigration of her against the Vardens. And instead of sulking as she did in underworld, She says, no, I have my micro values. I know this is a decent man. I will defend him even though I don't understand what's going on. But she must be miffed by it. I think this is actually, you know what? I'm going to sort all of these folk out as well and you. Yeah, you know what? I've never seen her leaving as a huge problem, and I think it's entirely because of Chris Tranchall and Louise Jameson's performances. They've obviously looked at this script and they would have known it was done in a hurry. They would have known the situation at the very least, Louise would have because the producers of Doctor Who always seemed to be very open and honest with their stuff. you know, there are some exceptions like what happened to Maureen O'Brien and Jackie Lane. But by this stage, it seems like people work together in quite a tight-knit team. So yeah, absolutely. They go, you know what? By this point, we have to get to a point where it's kind of believable that we get together and actors love that kind of thing. Some actors much prefer not having a clearly defined character that they can then inject character into themselves. And it's right. That's very modernest theatre way. Well, you know what happened? So just before, because I know there'll probably be a counter opinion to this amongst us, but just to press you that, Gerald Blake deliberately knew what had been going on with Louise and Tom. And that's why he said, Tom, what was working with John Arnott and doing gorgeous things together on their Con Shakespeare Roby Frocky thing over in the corner. And also said to Tom on the 1st day, oh, I remember when you were Patrick Troughton and Charming. you know that? And really put him in his place because it actually, unless you're an older statesman. You couldn't control Tom by this stage. And unfortunately, Williams, as has later come out, was, you know having his own private difficulties and just really not keeping the reins on Tom the way Hinchcliffe did. So I just love I love the scenes with Tom and John Arnott. I love that they're entirely separate from the Leila saints. Go on. So then, see, I think that the Leila Andrew thing, we all desperately would like for it to work, but it just doesn't. And there's one scene early on, which is sort of a rom-com, you know, where they're being antagonists. And I think that in the wardrobe, he keeps calling him madam and then correcting himself. Call me madam, a lovely community. musical of it. 50s, yes. Um, uh, you know, she wants to bring a knife into the doctor's investiture, all of that sort of thing. It's in episode. She don't sit by now. And it's quite a good scene. Do you know what I mean? And the 2 of them weren't quite well together. And I remember watching it this time through and feeling a bit of relief. Or maybe they do properly sell this. But basically, like they hold hands once in the subsequent 5 episodes, maybe they glance at each other. I think there's no way of seeing it other than as the worst companion departure of the 1970s apart from Liz. The 60s was cruel to companions. Do you know what I mean? It would throw them out, you know, and all of that sort of thing. Vicky, I'm still heartbroken about Vicky. The 70s, they've learned to do a better job and both Joe and Sarah got great leaving scenes. Here, it's just utterly perfunctory. And I have to say, much as I love the Williams years. It's something that he's shockingly bad at. Yeah, yeah. Inasmuch as his successor, John Nathan Turner, who comes in for a lot of criticism, some of it justified. John Nathan Turner, always does good companion departures. He's very sensitive to the same thing that Russell is with the, you know, the sitcom way or the soap way of writing in that there's a continuity. I think maybe we're just all seeing this relationship through a heteronormative projection. Who's to say that, really, that's, I think the relationship is perfectly working as a subdom. paradigm. I just think you know who gets to wear the feather boa in that relationship. It's not Lima. Well, consider consider commander Maxwell's hat later on. Yeah, I just think there's just too little to it. Do you know what I mean? Like, it's not given it enough screen time. It is an afterthought. It's like Mel. Remember Mel's departure where she goes off with sablong glitz for no readily apparent reason? And it is that... It shoots down the GMT argument, doesn't it? Because it's the only time who gets lovely dialogue. It's the only time that JNT gets it wrong. And it is these days you would just nip back to earth for a final 32nd scene and say goodbye to them. Do you know what I mean? But we're on Gallifrey, but we've somehow got to get rid of Louise what the hell do we do? Do you know what I mean? We'll marry her off. Now, I think it's Paul. As a boy, I wanted her to be disintegrated by the D-Mat gun and then and the doctor losing his memory over that. Yeah, and that's what Louise Jameson wanted as well. She wanted to see Leila killed off. The whole problem came from the fact that Graham Williams was under so much pressure that when Louis Jameson kept saying, no really, I don't want to do another year. He kept thinking, oh, I'll bring around. She'll come around. It's exactly what will happen next year with Mary Tam. So the problem is at the 11th hour, she's like, no, really, you need to write me a leaving scene. And so he writes that in and I think on the DVD or in an interview I've seen Louise give reaction was just kind of, oh, what? I specifically said, kill me or something. don't marry me off I'm very grateful they didn't kill off Leila. Yeah, I was a child viewer. I would have been, you don't do that to children. No, absolutely. I mean, big finish have sort of spoiler alert killed off Leila. I say sort of. You'll need to listen to it, folks. But in a way, that's okay because that's not children watching it. It's us now. And yeah, again, that's it. for fat 40 something. Thank you. You're all right. I have no problem with it because as again, I then saw it. And even as a young man, I saw it as, no, no, this is Leila's excuse to get away from a really agitating doctor that she's kind of fallen out with. It's just not fun anymore, doctor. Yeah. But I mean, even do that. Do you know what I mean? Like, do something. Oh, he's perfunctory. First crush, though. First crush. No, I believe it works within the confines of the story. And did we say, John Arnott? John Arnott. Oh, he is wonderful. He's our Gelgood. Hermione Gilgood yes. Todd said when we were doing the deadly assassin, that the deadly assassin was never really on his radar as a kid. This was his barusa. And you know what? I have to agree. I think he's... He's the only one I like, actually. It was that weird thing. And we probably talked about it when we did Deadly Assassin. We didn't see Deadly Assassin. No, we didn't. We read the novel before we saw the episode. Yeah, but I think I saw this before I read the novel of Deadly Assassin or saw Deadly Assassin. So this is my 1st introduction to Gallifrey. And it is a sequel you are kind of expected to know what the Matrix is, and all of that sort of thing, and the sash, that hilarious sash that the master tried to hit the doctor with. Yeah, yeah. broken it because if you look at it, the join is terrible where it joins up. But there is actually a little nice piece of dialogue in the 1st episode that attempts to re-explain the Matrix in very simple dialogue that's not just characters telling each other things they already know. It's Peruso kind of saying to doctor, you don't know this because you don't pay attention to anything. So I'm going to tell you once more and any teacher can sympathise with that. It is, it's actually the Matrix for the 1st time that really, I mean, they call, use the word Matrix, I think, in Deadly Assassin but it is the APC net, and so they turn, this is the kind of creation of the Matrix. Yes, that's true. It's also the creation of Rassalon, really. You know, Rastlon gets a mention in deadly assassin, but I think the doctor has to have him explained, doesn't he? Like they, no one really knows who he is. Here now in the investitures scene. you know what I mean? It's the sash of Rassalon and the robe of Rassalon and the breeches of Rassalon. polka dotted pyjamas of wrestle. Yeah, he's got everything. You know what I mean? I'm just thinking of Timothy Dalton's pyjamas now. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I know, right? Are we at the Vardens yet? Yeah, let's get the vans. Yeah. Now I want to say... The Bardens look amazing. They do. How many milk bars did you go in while you were at school that had Myla fringe curtains, fly screen curtains, just like that? It's so realistic. There's a 2nd half to that sentence. On the special edition, new effects of the DVD. Oh, you're kidding. Is there a special issue? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm going home now and watching it. What do they look like? They look like energy beings in Star Trek, the next generation. They look like bipedal features. I think they're done by John Kelly. and he... just look like these things. They look like transporter victims before they melt down. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It looks like the Star Trek Transporter effect. electricity crackling along them. They're actually bipedal figures and John Kelly either filmed himself or filmed someone else and then rotoscope the shape onto them to make them look better. They're nowhere near as good as the original one. It's got to be soon. Yeah, yeah, the original shimmeries. And the cone heads. We think the cone heads in the 1st scene. I love Redship. It works in some scenes and doesn't work in others, the original shimmeriness. You know, as a kid, it worked for me. I was perfectly happy that as a child. It's truly terrible. And then when they arrive, Tom says disappointing, aren't they? Like, actually, lampshades the fact that they're in the worst science fiction outfits. But that's the point. They're dressed as Dan Dare. They've even got the little fin on their helmets that you see in the buck Rogers and the greatest Frank Hampson, science fiction British science fiction of all time, which is the Dan Dare Eagle comic from 51 to... Oh, so they're just guys. No, but they're 50s British Empire SF. Yeah, unfortunately, they've got, what is it, west country accents or Midlands accents? Their voices are not very threatening, which is... What you're saying? Scots aren't threatening. Not sure about that. We've got Tom Kelly back again. In the one story where he doesn't get stuck in a wall. But aside from that, you know, danger, danger. There is danger here. Yeah, he's got awful, but it's just a very odd choice, possibly a puzzling choice. We'll see. But that being said, I don't mind their humanoid form with the uniforms. It is a bit silly. It is a bit Dan dare. But. Actually, you know who they look like? They look like the science force in Ultraman, the original Ultraman with the silly helmets of what have you. We need a silver wetsuit with some tea strainers on the eyes, don't we? Yeah, yes. Again, I don't have too much of a problem with them looking crap because they're not the main threat of the story, which is the great double gambit. So can we talk about the end of part 4 then? Yes, yes. So part four. would be this superb fake out. Okay? Imagine a cliffhanger where we'd had a huge climax we'd fought and defeated the Vardens. They were gone forever. We were hugely excited, and then at the very end, the Santarin's turn up. But what we get instead is canine faffing about, a bit of dialogue and then we're told the Vardens are defeated. And Leila kind of goes, have we defeated the Vardens? All we did was fight a few guards, and Tom says, yeah, you know, it can't always be like the relief of Mafeking. And so it is the most dull and anticlimactic defeat of the bardens. That is just achieved by standing around in a studio talking. And no action at all, nothing that involves the bargains. They're not tricked, you know, they're not outwitted. They just kind of all go away. So it's almost impossible to believe that part 4 would have been a satisfying ending to the story. But in my alternative universe ending version of part four, where something exciting dispatches the bargains, it would have been spectacular. Yeah, yeah. And it would have been a very smug ending, because the doctor would have gone, you see, I was right to treat you all like crap. But some people that the doctor doesn't treat like crap in this story. Of course, we haven't mentioned them yet. The Outlanders. Now, we're not sure if they're Shaboogans or not or Shaboo. No, they're not. They're not. But of course, one of them is Max Faulkner. It's not Terry Walsh. Of course, another one. Our very own... That is correct. Okay, Smith. Then Gay Smith. And you know what? When I was Vince manager for the Doctor Club of Australia, we approached her several times to be a convention guest, and we always got the most polite refusals. No, seriously. She should be up for it. But I still have one of her letters or rather one of the letters from a member of staff. We should add for the overseas. Yeah, yeah, there are a lot. Yes, of course. Gay Waterhouse was, of course, an actress in this time. And a model, I think. Bumming around in London with her mates before she married Mr Waterhouse, and she's now one of the wealthiest women in Australia and a horse race trainer. Yes, trainer race person thing. That's correct. So for any of you out there interested in horse racing, it may not be in Australia for... Don't be because it's horribly cruel. It is horribly cruel. But if you've ever heard of the Melbourne Cup, that is Australia's big horse race every year. It is horrible. Gaywaterhouse sits in an enormous big acrylic martini glass, like Deedavonte's, and puts on one of Leela's leather red outfits and does horrible things to a horse. They shoot them on the track under a green CSO base cloth. But, um, her letter of refusal, which I still have somewhere, says something along the lines of, um, also very fondly remember my acting career and it was so much fun to work on Doctor Who with Tom Baker and Louise Jackson. My current career, working in horse racing, demands so much of my attention that I'm afraid that even if I were to commit, I may have to cancel at a late stage and I would not want to disappoint any of your attendees. But she could pre-record something. Could you suggest that? No, I didn't. In costume. Yeah, yeah, we'll go over. I think regardless of anything else she does, and certainly horse racing is very, very cruel. That is a very nice way to treat something that obviously she has no interest in recreating. I'm too rich. Which is kind of how Diana Rigg reacts when you ask her along to event. Well, at least she's obvious about it. At least she's honest about it. I'm not hanging out with you ming mongs. she says in a quasi northern accent. I've got I've got a sandpaper in me face, whatever it is that diner rigs doing this week. Let's talk about her an invasion of time, though. She is the poshest a dropout you've ever heard of because these people are dropout. They literally drop the side. They use the word. They're just kind of hippies, yeah. Yeah, yeah. She's the poshest hippie ever. What you gonna eat? I've got smarties. Actually, are smarties. Yeah, Rodan Smarties. Oh, we haven't talked about... We have time lady people. We do. There's two ladies. Time ladies, but we know she's actually just Anthony Ainley before it's regenerated. She's fabulously posh. She is like a young woman who has just, she's working in a shop you know, just after she's graduated from her posh private school. Like a member of your staff, really. But she is specifically, and this is both in the script and according to Graham Williams, she's specifically not a timelord. What? No, but hear me out because... Collective groom, listener, what? And Graham Williams and Anthony Reed both had copies of the deadly assassin for reference next to them when they were writing their scripts. They looked at the deadly assassin and noticed that there were no women. Because it's a Hinchcliffe story by Rob Holmes. But they thought, you know what? This plays into our theme of we want to explore the people on this planet who are not time lords. And obviously this is sexist. So it's like, let's highlight that sex with them, and that's why Rodan, when we 1st meet her, says, that barrier's there to keep me apart from me from the time lords from everyone. So they're acknowledging in the script, this gender, imbalance, and inequality. Now, of course, you know, it's 1970s Doctor Who, so they don't really hammer at home. But Rodin does identify that she is not on everyone else's level and then what does she do? She builds the gun that kills the invaders. She rewives the Tartars better than the doctor can. Yeah, and that's a gorgeous scene, isn't it? It's a screwdriver. And she's so good at it. I was hoping as a child. I thought that she was going to be the next companion. And is there anything in the show notes that this was the Ramana? She's clearly a dry run for a moment. Yeah, yeah, but more than... I think they did consider her before going for a completely new character. Certainly, she's definitely the dry run for Romana. I have heard some criticism of her performance that she's sort of too stoical at times, but no, I think she's got a fine line in irony. And when she gets outside the city, well, she sort of has her mini breakdown, which also, I think, is very in character, because until then, she's getting more and more stressed with the idea of having to lead the city. She's very, very brave, but at that point, she is just at the end of her tether, and she's been running. She's, you know, she's a girl friend. We don't have to run from anything. No one will dare invade us. In half an hour. I have a century, it's myself. She's half an hour. Her whole world's falling apart. Yeah, she certainly does more acting in that scene than Mary does for the entire following year. Fighting words, Mr. I reckon. I reckon that's totally fair. I'm very glad we have both Hillary, who is actually very beautiful despite what her hair and costume is doing for her and we have Mary as well. I'm glad that we have both of them. I love it. I agree. Yeah, and she's not named after a Godzilla monster for no reason I'm sure. Yeah, I always thought that was weird. Even the same colour, Rhodano Radon, in the original Japanese, is always this scarlet heliotrope colour. At the end of episode four, of course, we have mentioned that the Santarians are coming in and Todd has a few words, you'd like to say about them. Well, here we are at the invasion of time. you know what? This is my gala frame. My Castellan, my Barusa, my Andred. The last time I watched this, out of context, I gave it zero out of 10. Now, I actually think there are four and a half pretty decent episodes, and it actually has quite an entertaining story, and I actually love most of the performances. Bringing in this on Tarans at the end is a good way to elevate things. Although I don't think it's successful in terms of their performances, I do find some of it quite funny, but the last episode and a half does sort of collapse in upon itself. Does that ruin the entire story? I mean, I certainly think this is no worse than some of the wonderful Barriolettes Robert Sloman finales back in the Pertuy era. The president of the Supreme Council is asked to see me. He's told me to dress in white and come up with some sort of alias. Perhaps Fred will do. Derek Devin's come in for a lot of criticism as well. I actually really quite like his portrayal, 'cause, as Todd says the Santarans here are funny. And this son Toran's quite funny, because the voice makes him very stupid. And, you know, it... Just say, working class London is... Well, the thing is, it's not really, because you've got the working class outlanders as well, who are very resourceful and help the doctor and what happened. But have posh accent. But have, well, Max Faulkner. Yeah, I'm not sure he really has posh accents. I quite like the Santarans in this because they're back to being brute force warriors again. You know, they're not planners and they're not strategists. They're not pole vultures either. if jumping over a bit of poolside furniture is anything to go by. You want to know who was playing that? George Santaran, Stewart, Fowl. Yeah. drink the name. So this is the 1st time we've ever had more than one Santara. Yeah, that's true. Well, more than once on Tara and play by, would play by more than one actor. Yeah, yeah, stand up on the screen. Kevin Lindsay, of course, was sadly no longer with us at this point. Robert Holmes, despite not writing the script, had a big hand in it because he was he was offered to write the script 1st and he said, no, look, I just quit. I really want to move away, but you can use any of my creations. You can use Barusa. You can use, um, and they didn't end up, but you, you know, you can use spandrel, you can use Engen. What happened to Spanish? I know, I miss... Oh, you know what? I think it was just a matter of actor availability. Nothing's going to hold the windows up without a sponge. That's a very funny building reference if any of you get that one. Gosh, that was terrific. Come on. An architectural conference would be rolling in the aisle. Yeah, that probably would just why I never go to them. But yeah, also he gave permission for the Santarans to be used. And I think they're written very, very finely here. They're written better here than Robert Holmes himself will write them later in the 2 doctors, where he tries to put in jokes about the loneliness of command. But here, I think you really capture the fact that Santarans are a bit thick. Oh, well, I mean, it's that thing where people say, oh, you know the Santarans have been ruined forever because Strax is such a comedy character. Do you know what I mean? But we don't need this on Torrance. are terrible. Lynx is a great character. I think Styre is an okay character, but I can't think of a single time apart from that where they've really worked. At all. Do you know what I mean? So we don't need them. Like they've got this sort of, they're in the pantheon of Doctor Who as the 5th most, you know, loved returning monster. I think that's down to Kevin Lindsay's performances. I just don't think there's any need for them, you know? It's actually, it's actually down to um, to Doc Cotton. It's actually down to June Brown. the reason they're so good. It's everyone remembers Alan Roe and June Brown. I like Chrissy and Sarah Jane Adventures getting one in the probing vent with her high heels. I think that's it. And the probic bent has been redesigned here so that it can snugly accommodate Leila's nine. Yes, that's what it was all full of them. I miss Leila. Yeah, I miss her already. We're not even at, you know, we're not even at the point. Well, we talked about where she leaves, but we're not properly there yet. No, I have no problems with the Santarans in this story. This is one I very fondly remember as a child watching it on tape. And it was the omnibus version from the mid 80s, and it had some kind of Eastern European stop motion animation thing on the tape before and about a circus with no dialogue, so I had no idea what's going on. slightly nightmarish, and then that faded into the documentary. funny you say that, because this is not, as we've been talking about Shakespeare and I, Claudius, and it's definitely informed by the success of BBC, like Claudius, the Robert Groves series, just before it, certainly with the scenes with, did I mention John Arnott and Tom Baker? But it's actually more Soviet brusher? It's more Soviet era anyway, even with the names of the Constructive Gallifry. It's very much Cold War. Can we talk about the resolution of this story? But what, but they've found the K1 robots gone and suddenly it's the most destructive weapon in the universe? It's got really terrible. It's making no sense to me. We've had DMac guns many times in Doctor. This one would enable him to take over the galaxy. That's in the dialogue. And how do we resolve this terrible problem of Gallifre being invaded? We make a big gun and shoot someone. I mean, it's terrible. Well, yeah, you know, it is pretty terrible. But also, it seems that what it does is, whoever wields it, whoever actually uses it to destroy, then doesn't remember the destructive act, hello the moment. Hmm. Yeah, it's galifrian technology. And as Barusa says at the end, it's the wisdom of wrestle. And so I was like, you know what? Yes, you can use it to take a life. Yes, you can use it to be a destroyer, but you won't be able to use it forever. So you'd be hard pressed to take over the galaxy if the 1st time you shot someone, you forgot where you were and what had been going on. Is that why it's played by Billy Piper? Because the all the previous career is just forgotten as soon as you move on. Yeah. But just to match things up a bit, we get Derek Deadman a store and he suddenly whips out a grenade that will destroy what the entire galaxy or something. Well, are you standing over the eye of harmony? Oh, maybe that's it. Yeah, yeah. But it could blow up the whole galaxy. And so the stakes are suddenly massively increased for no reason and with no effort at all. We just get told that we could take over the universe with this gun or we could blow up the galaxy with this small bomb. You know, and it's attempt to update. 330 in the morning and they've had a lot of coffee. Clearly. I can just about believe it, though, because they've made a lot of fuss about the key of wrestling and how important it is, how much Barusa doesn't want to give it up, and you know, you would entrust the key to an alien. I mean, you should shoot someone with just a gun gun. You don't need a D-Mat gun that's pan on barbeque. It shouldn't have been a gun. It's just, I think it's it doesn't work. So both the episode 4 and episode 6 climaxes are poor. Which should have been Billy Piper, shouldn't it? Instead of a gardener. She would have been, what, one? No, not a foetus. Do you know what I actually did also think, again, as a boy because, and Nathan had mentioned before. Well, this is one of the ones that was shown pretty much continuously. And even during the Davidson era in the 80s, This was one of the ones you'd get to see as fillers in between. Doctor Who was almost year round. I thought at the time, why are you building a gun when it should be the most precious thing that the doctor could lose or the most precious thing that the person themselves, if you're going to which again presages the moment. But no, as a child, I thought, it should have been Leila. Leila is the weapon. And now I'm thinking maybe Leila is a child. But no, as a boy, I thought, what it gives you is that it actually turns the thing you most, but of course, for Tom, it would have been his own ego. Or a talking cabbage. Yeah, talking cabbage. But how interesting if the weapon of choice would have to have been, and to use it would have been, in this case, it would have been Leela and integrating kind of in the way we might be seeing with Armageddon Factor, because I know that's going to go off well. The idea of the, of the, of that which you most love is actually the weapon you must use to. And instead of just destroying the Sontarin, what I assumed at the time, we're 1st seeing it, is that it actually completely obliterates that whole period of time that's just come before it. So they never actually did invade, they never had a presence on gallifry. The gun actually makes a bubble of time and removes it from the continuum. Yeah, it's a bit weird. It's just the doctor who doesn't remember. I mean, I know I praised that a couple of minutes ago and I still praised that. But yeah, it would have been a lot more interesting if just everyone had forgotten. But I thought that was the price of using the weapon as well, is that you lose your love, that whom you most love, and you also forget you ever knew him or her. I really would have. Did you think anything like that as a boy when you were older? No, it's just watching it this time. I just thought it was really pedestrian and like those suggestions that you come up with a bit more poetic and interesting. There's something that the show doesn't really do that much during the period. But the solutions that they came up with. You know, there's that thing in episode 5 where Calum is pulling some leavers and we're told we're in danger. You know, they are very good. They are very good at creating stakes visually or organically within the plot. We just have to be told that we're in danger or told that we've defeated Vardens. That becomes a meta in itself that Douglas Adams really exploits and that everyone now said, well, you know, writers now see it as what a terrific thing that they did so cleverly and wittily, making something very ordinary. It's an ashtray. No, it's not. the key to the universe. Yeah, yeah, but they're not, well, that's like the key, the restaurant's key in the death drawer. bloody drawing. next to the desk. No one has ever found it in the history of the timeline. It's my hair. No, I think that's so terrible. Tremendous. But what they're not doing is lampshading the kind of the, the there must be a word for this trope. It's like danger that you get told about that you don't see. Tell don't show. Yeah, yeah. It goes back to Lecant's theory mentioning tropes, again, of the dissonance of the ostensible threat before it actually occurs. So you've got the cadaver in the room before the death. No, but I don't think we ever get the death. I want to call it word peril where you're just told we're in peril and everyone goes, oh, goodness, that's terrible. It's standabout on the Faccardi rug and the cog room set and all look worried together. It's a terrible scene. I'll come up with something better the next time it occurs. I did what would that be in Latin? No, nothing very good. You know what I mean? That's gorgeous. I'd buy that if it was a wine. That's very Scottish. I once saw a stage show, which was a drawing room mystery. And at one point, someone has to get killed on the veranda. So all the characters run out and you hear the gunshot and people say, oh, no, he's been shot. And I'm like, really? You're doing this off stage? Oh, you know, it's meant to build suspense. It was like, no, they carry the body on straight away. It's like, what's the point? There's not even any blood on the body. I don't understand. So yeah, word peril is very annoying. Can I talk about some of the things I like about the story? Yeah, I do. I do like it. Yeah, we do. we do, don't we? Yeah, generally. I think we've talked about things we like in the 1st 2 episodes and the 2nd 2 episodes. And really in that last 2 episodes, I love the travelog around the TARDIS. I love using industrial spaces. Did you at the time? Did you as a lad? Yeah, yeah, I really did. It's something Rod picked up on when we watched it through, again in that, yes, if the TARDIS can be anything. Why can't this area look like an industrial swimming pool? Why can't that area look like a hospital? And I love the fact... Because it's depressing? I don't find it. Is the TARDIS in a fug this season? Is it just in a bad mood? I think there's a lot of just, again, playing out the running time. Do you know what I mean? There is that. it's done so stylishly. That's the thing. You know, you get that conversation about deja vu. David, David. Same thing again. I know the starter's like the back of my hand, Doctor. front of your eyes. That's a very Tom and Louise thing, yeah. Well, it is something that they eventually becomes the kind of default mode for the Williams era. We can't afford to not have a lot of time just walking around these brick corridors, so we'll at least be fun about it. I just wish they'd gone to Oxford and film somewhere around actually in some sandstone corridors in September. I just, it just doesn't feel tart. It is an old mental hospital and it feels as miserable as that really was. But I don't find it miserable, but I do find it unsettling. And they've already commented that, you know, Kelner's been interfering with the interior dimensions and the doctor has to take something offline. So, you know, even though it's very interesting, you do kind of go oh, I see. I think something's wrong with the TARDIS and you get that feeling of wrongness. So, yeah, it's taking the word peril of, we'll be thrown into a black star and giving us a subtle visual effect on it. And, you know, yeah, the doctor can't find his way around. Is that because the doctor's being absent-minded or is that because there's something wrong with the TARDIS? And then you get that crappy art gallery with the Venus de Milo with the... We know they're the real ones. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. With the with the plaster join down the side. But yeah, is the button to activate the Venus to Milo? Is it in her backside? I think it is. It's kind of on her flank. In Jabalite. In Jabalite. right. She was actually the excellent city in previous life. She's just been transposed. There is life after death and doctor. And you know, with all the stairs and whatnot, you actually get a feeling of going up and down and in different dimensions as well. Could it have been achieved better? Yes. Visually, I think so. Is it achieved very well? Yes, I think so. And I think it marries very well then with admittedly the padding in the dialogue, but it's padding performed by actors you're really enjoying. The highlight of it is Barusa, having a cocktail with a crazy straw, and reading the report that the Titanic sunk, and the doctor looking really, really guilty. It had nothing to do with that. I love the bathroom. I think it's spectacular. It certainly puts the swimming pool in the sky in Paradise Towers in proper perspective. It's lovely. And the other thing that really gets me about it. I think we may have watched Invasion in Time around the time that Journey to the centre of the Tartars went out. And it's like, you know what? In 1977, we can have this really fun, okay, not perfect trip around the Tartars, achieved by going to these disused buildings and making it look a bit rundown, making it look lived in. In journey to the centre of the Tatus, we get a bunch of corridors that look the same in a few books on a shelf. It looks very Star Trek next gen and the budget difficult years of next gen too. Yeah, no, the journey to the centre of time. It's journey to centre the TARDIS is, again. I mean, that's the thing. This story has great acting, fun dialogue. A plot that works, which we haven't always had this year. Surprisingly. Does it? Or is it just that we love the bits and pieces and forgive the plot overall? Well, the thing is, even when we've had criticisms of the plot like, it has to end with a gun, it's still like, that is a logical conclusion. It's just a bit disappointing. It's not like underworld where we're like, what are these gold rod things and why should we care and why are you a giant gold penis and... Yeah, why are those guys? I mean, yeah, is this a Sean Connery bondfinger.com film gone wrong? I don't know. It's got interesting visuals. It's got a plot that whips along at a fair pace because you're constantly changing up the threat. And for better or for worse, it's got a memorable ending with a companion departure scene, which, even if it's not written very well, is performed very well. And that bit at the end when Leila asks canine, will he be lonely? insufficient data mistress, and they both bow their heads simultaneously. That could have been mawkish, but instead it's very sweet. There's a lot going for this story. You know, it's not a perfect season ender. It's not Planet of the Spiders. It's not the Green Death, certainly. But I think it's better than the Damons and the Time Monster. It gives me as much as it takes away. So in the end, I'm left with a slight surfeit of joy, which is that which are the principal players, as much as I think that Chris Tranchill did his best. He doesn't really win me. Isn't he exactly the same person who turns up in Shada, also playing cruise, or does it just feel as if? Daniel Hill. Yeah, it's just bookending. It's the same blandness in beige corduroy. has been in it before. Yes, he was in the faceless ones where he was possibly admired by Joe Orton. Ah... Weren't we all... Just. So Jenny Laird awards. I might go first. Uh, and my journey later waters for Dick Coles. I don't know who that is Dick Coles was the designer of underworld. And my question for him, as I shouted last week, why brown? Why is everything brown? Was there a sale on brown paint or something, Dick? Well, they did call it Mission Brown in the 70s and yes, everything was dark brown in the 70s. was there. Yeah, the thing is, this story isn't in the 70s. It was also the orange, and it was also a lime green. We didn't get any of those other accent notes, did we? Exactly. Lime green caves. There you go. Nathan, the ice cream. Okay. You know, I want to shrink away from being too obvious, but I'm not going to. I don't think this is a good season, and I think I said before that it's probably the worst season of the 1970s. Things start to go really wrong on the design front and that starts with invisible enemy, but, you know, is really, really obvious in underworld. But I do think that probably the most puzzling creative choice is choosing to give a paycheque to Bob Baker and Dave Martin, who wrote two good per twee stories, and since then have been just turning in absolute rubbish. And I can't think of a single good thing to say about any of their stories for Tom Baker. They're terrible. Get rid of them. It's interesting to hear you talk about design like that. I thought I was the only one that really, you know, took it as my first point of contact with a story, but it is interesting to hear you say that because it's obviously it is that important. certainly in this season. I don't think story wise, it's that bad, and I think Louise does a terrific job as a companion and with Tom, and even the conflict between Dr. and Leila, which is largely driven by, as we've said by Tom. Didn't really notice so much as a child watching this, but I certainly didn't feel great love for it in the way that I did between Sarah Jane and the doctor. So it does have an effect on the viewer watching it and the child viewer watching it. Sarah and the doctor aren't particularly affectionate towards each other, either. But there's a warmth between the 2 actors, especially when you're thinking an Android invasion when they're running about on the base. and there's just that little moment where they just touches her on the shoulder or is that that little closeness of contact. There's a rapport. Yes, it's not a table wine. It's a rapport. And it's lovely. And I just don't get that this time. And you do pick up on that. Yeah, I think my puzzling creative choice, though, in the end isn't actually design based. I've done this to do this kind of thing with, with, you know running projects and time and just having nothing left and having to wing it. And the results that go out, there's something about 11th hour which can produce moments of great genius, such as the barusa doctor dialogue scenes, innovasion of time. On the whole, does it leave a satisfying? I don't know that the eggs quite were beaten well enough and I don't think it's quite risen to purloin MacArthur Park. And it doesn't quite get there. My person and creative choice actually has to go back to Hinchcliffe. I actually don't think it's Williamsport because we get to see later on what Williams does when he gets a whole season to himself. And even though there may be curious choices, which we'll hear about amongst the 3 of you for season 16. I do think it comes back to Hinchcliffe just taking so much of the budget that they were really left, and it's not really William's fault he didn't have enough time to get this together. So maybe the BBC as well. So yeah, my choice is. Inchcliff, you did a lovely job, but look what you left for your successor. There's a couple of things I'm just going to mention briefly. There is big finishes, Dr. and Leila Audio Adventures, which are wonderful. Are they in the same studio? Yes, yeah, they work together. they work together great now. Yeah, it's beautiful. Louise Jensen has said, look, you know, we've discussed everything that happened back then. I told Tom he was a Pratt and he's wearing it. Yeah, pretty much he. Yeah, is. One I'm going to single out in particular because it's quite interesting, given regards to what you just said, Richard. In the 4th Dr. Lost Stories box set, there is the foe from the future. Yes, I just listened to this one too, which, of course, was meant to be Talons of Wing Chang. it's Robert Banks Stewart original script adapted by, I think, John Dorney. And there is also a story called The Valley of Fear by Philip Hinchcliffe, which was in consideration for either the Sunmakers or Underworld slot, and that's been adapted by Jonathan Morris. But what Jonathan Morris has tried to do in that script is write it in such a way that it's a Philip Hinchcliffe idea as produced by Graham Williams. But my actual pick, you know, I was just mentioning those. My actual pick is a new series of novels called Lethbridge Stewart. These are spearheaded by Andy Frankermelon, who is the author of the Doctor Who, the Legacy series, and also the author of the Seeker series, and one of the creators and editors of the Space 1889 series, which is a steampunk sci-fi series. This is a series of 4 novels, which are in the process of being released, and they are set for Lethbridge Stewart between the web of fear and the invasion. So it's about the formation of the unit and what have you. So there is The Forgotten Sun by Andy Frankomallan. There is the schizoid Earth by David A. McKinty, which... I liked his, I liked his virgin. New adventures. yeah Yeah. There is, and this is the reason I mentioning it for season 17 Beast of Fang Rock. Oh, no. By Andy Franko Allen and Terence Dix. Wow. And legend says that the Beast of Fang Rock will return. And Travers is out to discover the truth. And there is a final novel in the series called Mutually Assured Domination by Nick Walters. We're back to Andrew and Leila, aren't we? Yep that's right. You can buy each of those novels online and we will include a link for those. You can buy them individually or in a bundle. Cool. That's excellent. Well, I've scored the bleeding obvious taro card, Miss Taro. Again, I've already prefaced it. It's thank you, Gary Russell. I really, really like the big finish Gallifry series. And I know we keep going back to Big Finish and there's a whole lot of other things going on. So thank you, Brendan, for mentioning those because there's things we probably don't discover. I really didn't want to listen to them. I just happened to have them and I bought them and downloaded them you know, and all the rest of it and thought, oh, you know, I'm as much like Nathan as Gallifree was a one idea thing that didn't really work in the original series, except in a few moments. But no, it really does. And it works because it's got fantastic performers being really well written for by clever people, whom, you know, we're lucky enough, some of them, that we've met and some of them are our friends, and we're fortunate being this age and having grown up with this stuff. But if you're a new listener or you haven't had the, you know, the luck of being able to go to conventions and meet these guys. But Gary does a beautiful job on it as editor. Linda Bellingham is terrific as the inquisitor and she's just awful and venal and fantastic. And Louise, is in them. Lala is superb as Romana. And of course, I won't spoil how, but they have Mary Tam is also returns, but we were lucky enough to get her, and there's also a recasting of Romana that comes up, and I won't say anymore if you haven't heard it, but it's, they really are good fun, and they're darkly done. They do feel very much in the spirit of Chris Boucher. They also feel quite period. There's lots of it that's kind of BBC Shakespeare, I Claudius Blake 7 era writing. Would you agree, Brendan, if you've listened to it. Oh, yeah, I think they're absolutely wonderful. It's a little bit Doctor Who, but it's also a little bit Babylon 5. Yeah, bad B5. Thank you. It's very JMS, isn't it? Really, in his style of writing. Huge arcing. A little bit west wing in terms of the political intrigue. Green wing, yes, a little bit green wing, if you've ever watched that, yes. That would also be my pick of the week. That's got Michelle Gomez, Boys and Girls, as... Playing really the same part, yeah. Have you seen Greenwing? No, I have a friend who keeps telling me, friendly. We put a link on. Yeah, we can. Fred of the podcast. James Farrow keeps telling me to watch Green Wing. I've seen Michelle Gomez quite recently playing Martin Thatcher in Psycho Bitches. Is he available? It's very hard to get. I only seen it with Jones. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's it is really good. And Michelle Gomez is in it a fair amount. Just playing really herself. Well, I've only ever seen her playing the same part. You saw the photo of her with the 2 action figures on her shoulders. She's really cool. I'm a huge fan I have a pick of the week, but it's really unspectacular compared to yours. I've been walking in the morning and listening to Doctor Who novelisations. I recommended this as a part... This great cottage in the park. No, that's not what I'm going to recommend. So it's like, no, it's asking to this. Oh, okay. I'm going to recommend a novel that I never read when I was a kid a novelisation that I never had. I think it was released reasonably late. It's the rescue by Ian Martha, who it's his last novelisation and it's dedicated to him and it's read by Maureen O'Brien. And we said at the time that the rescue was really just a great vehicle to introduce Maureen O'Brien as an actor. It was the 1st time we ever had a new companion since the series began. And so it was a little story crafted by David Whittaker to give her, you know, a chance to really show her Chops as an actor. And Maureen hasn't lost it at all. It's a wonderful reading. She does a great Barbara. She does a great Vicky. It's Ian Marta, so the pros is more sort of interesting and sophisticated than Terrence Dix. And the whole thing was just really, really great fun. I really enjoyed it, so I can recommend it. A lot of these books are on Audible.com, So that's where I get them, but you can get them on iTunes and things as well. Well, dear listener, that is all the time we have for the invasion of time and for season 15 as a whole. Nathan and I will be back next week, along with Todd, to talk about the Grybos operation, or rebos operation, depending on whether you're from the south or the north, and begin the key to time season. Richard will rejoin us for Destiny of the Daleks in six weeks time. I'm knitting a very long white scarf as we spin. My image on the on our who we are things is the scarf I made for myself when I was 14 in my homemade scarf. So I'll do a white one for Destiny of the Darlings. Oh, excellent. You can find us online at flightthroughentirety.com, flight through entirety on Facebook and iTunes and FTE podcast on Twitter over on bondfinger.com. We have variety of Sean Connery commentaries available. You can also find that Bond Finger on Facebook and iTunes and Bond Finger cast on Twitter. Until we see you next time. May all your transduction barriers keep out all alien invaders. Thank you very much and good night. Good night. Thank you, everyone. That was Flight Your Entirety with Nathan Bottomley, Brendan Jones and Richard Stone. This episode, Timothy Dalton's pyjamas, was recorded on October the 11th, 2015. The next episode will be released on December the 6th. We respectfully dedicate this episode to Anthony Reid, script editor of Doctor Who and writer of several stories, including the invasion of time. Oh, that is not staying there. You need to you need to uncleanse. There you go. Tag of the season. Oh please. Okay.